Good morning. Good morning, wherever you are this morning, we thank you so much for joining us here at # Christian Straight Talk. As we are live streaming this morning, we just want to say thank you so much for all the downloads and the shares that everything that is going on through the world of podcast. And sometimes we do come live on to the live stream. And we just want to let you know that wherever you are today, never ever give up God is with you. But as we gather around the word of God, as we just see what the Lord has for us today, we are in and you can find us on # Christian straight talk, you can find that all through the social networks. And we're and the reason that we are here this morning is because we're talking about Jesus. Simon, good morning.
Simon Pinchbeck:Morning, Ben. It's great to be back across the mics. And Jesus, Jesus are talking about Jesus, they are talking about the King above all kings. So we're giving Jesus some airtime which Jesus? I don't think, Ben that many churches really do a deep dive on who is Jesus do like,
Reverend Ben Cooper:Nah, that's right, as we record this podcast, and you look at religion, and I got to be really careful, because that subject what the churches are not talking about Jesus, who is Jesus, that
Simon Pinchbeck:is the most important man that ever lived.
Reverend Ben Cooper:And that's important to understand, because the Scripture is very, very clear in one Timothy chapter two, verse five. And it says, For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, there is a lot across this earth at this moment about masculinity and what a met real man looks like and all this and all the A B's and C's and DS, and we get what's happening across the social networks between certain influencers and how they're getting in trouble and all that. But when you look at Christ, he is the role model for whether you're a man or a woman, whoever you are, job done, but follow Jesus.
Simon Pinchbeck:All these people that that waste endless time talking about role models, talking about what it means to be a man what it means to be masculine and toxic masculinity and all that sort of stuff. We have the answer to all of that centers right in the face, right in the Bible. Is the life of Jesus Christ. Who who is he? Who is
Reverend Ben Cooper:a? What an interesting word. Who is Jesus,
Simon Pinchbeck:you know it we have a guy, Ben Jesus see, 33 years I've only lived to 33. His ministry was only three years.
Reverend Ben Cooper:He didn't have internet. He didn't have Twitter. He didn't have the technology. He didn't have any notoriety, no
Simon Pinchbeck:education, but not never traveled over troubled water. 100 Miles
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yeah, kept within the area, the location, when you really look at who is Jesus. And then if anyone wants to quickly turn to one Colossians it clearly tells us who Jesus is. It says, Christ is the image of the invisible God.
Simon Pinchbeck:Well, that's a great scripture that sums it all up Ben, you know, he's, he is the man and here's but here's the deal, right? Is the image of the invisible God, but no one knows what Jesus looked like. Because if, if, if there was, if there was statues and and all of that sort of stuff made and carved out of him, we will be worshiping. worshiping the picture worshiping the statue, we wouldn't be worshipping the man, the man who was fully man, and fully God,
Reverend Ben Cooper:completely, completely in his in his holiness, in His purity. He's the Living Word, He is the great I Am he is Jehovah Jireh, Jehovah Nissi. He is absolutely everything.
Simon Pinchbeck:In fact, the Bible says in one point that he wasn't a man of striking appearance.
Reverend Ben Cooper:In the book of Isaiah, he said there was nothing about his appearance that was attractive. So when you look at every
Simon Pinchbeck:book, people were attracted to him and this is why and this is the point that we kind of need to get over to people who call themselves Christian out there who call themselves born again if you like we need to get So because people were attracted to Jesus and people will be attracted to you if your heart is for Jesus Christ,
Reverend Ben Cooper:it's, it's the internal, it's not the external look, look at the anointing look at the anointing of, of David, when he when he was called as a shepherd boy and every everything that went on his brothers, they had the look they had, they had the size, they had the they had absolutely everything, and that profit went. Now it's got nothing to do with outward appearance. Now, it's nothing to do with them. They might look like warriors, they might look like kings. But it's not what you look like. It's how your heart is. And it funny
Simon Pinchbeck:how the Lord uses that time and time again, people that you wouldn't think, look twice at, and yet because their heart is, your heart is having a heart after God. So is Jesus is fully man, fully God outwardly physically.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Just blends in just blends just blends into the crowd. And that is so powerful, but people are
Simon Pinchbeck:attracted to him because of what he says what he does, and how he does it. The way that
Reverend Ben Cooper:he lives the way they look. When you look at Christ, where is where in the scripture that you find that Christ jumps into the arena, and has as a boxing match. Where do you find him down the gym? Where do you find him? In the pub? Where do you find him all in these places that are labeled Forgive me brothers, and whoever's listening? Where do we when you look at what the world looks at, as in a man, it looks for strength, it looks for all all that sort of stuff. But there was Christ never went to the gym, he there was no watering hole, there was no no platform for him to build himself up on there was nothing. It's a great point. But it's a really it's not taking anything away from from being in the gym and looking after yourself and doing that because that is scripture, it says it talks about a little exercise. Exercise is good when I'm not talking like
Simon Pinchbeck:it really says the wrong Timothy says yeah, a little exercise is good. But better is this is the spiritual, exactly. But that's a good point about Jesus, you know, he never he can't. He confronted every religious aspect of that day, but he didn't do it violently. It did it. How did he do it? It by quoting scripture,
Reverend Ben Cooper:words are powerful. And when you words are used through the powerful influence, I would say that, by that by that the move of the Holy Spirit within, because the Bible says out of your belly shall flow rivers of living water, when you use truth, and you use scripture, and you use the word of God and you speak Christ. Demons flee at the name of Jesus, even the demonic forces. So you've got the natural world that was before Christ, the physical, the religious world that we looked at Nicodemus, but then also, you've got the demonic force. So there's two worlds, you've got the dimension that he's in, and then you've got that spiritual dimension. And even the demons went to the disciples, it makes me laugh. We don't know who you are. But we know who he is.
Simon Pinchbeck:Well, that was and that's a really good point that you bring up because at the time that the the disciples had Jesus with them. They had, yeah, but hadn't got that authority yet, then the authority and the man given to him because Jesus was still with them. So when Jesus left, and the Holy Spirit came, then they had that authorities in those different, there are different men. So that
Reverend Ben Cooper:definitely, that tells you a lot when what you've just said, until you have the power of the living word within you, and the Holy Spirit has anointed you. You have no power. And that's why the church has an religion has no power. Over the dark side, actually, if you look at the church in a general fam, fam, look, and you have to analyze that you will find a big percent in the church is going down in a cultic Road, rather than that going down in the spiritual road, because it doesn't recognize the authority of Jesus Christ. And people will say, Well, how do you how can you say that, that the church doesn't, because the Bible says, And and what Christ says if you hold on to my teachings, you will be my disciples.
Simon Pinchbeck:But a lot of I call it the the lot of the new sort of churches that are out there that they hold on to, they will say, and they will say, Ben that they we have more power than Jesus. That's what they're saying. Because
Reverend Ben Cooper:I know the Scripture that you're you might be thinking are
Simon Pinchbeck:14 So it was that he said to you, we'll do great things and then then these then great things that I'm so they hold on to that and say, but we are but now you're not. No you're not. No you're not. You know what? No, you're not greater than, than the King above all kings? No, not at all. So, so you be careful, very careful when we go around and start to proclaiming this, that and the other. So we have to just look at Jesus's life. And and yeah, I think you're right. Right at the beginning, you mentioned that he is the greatest role model ever live. We don't We are these days, we don't have many great masculine role models out there. There's a real there's a real gray area where where men are now favorite to be men, you know?
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yeah. Because the language of the political, the way that you speak, you can't use certain terminologies you can't mention this. You can't mention that. You can't say this word. You can't say that word. You're not allowed use Word, man. Oh, it's got to be an inspection chamber. The world is crazy. And it's using words,
Simon Pinchbeck:you can't even say you've got a master suite in your bedroom anymore. It's a primary suite. Now, you know, I mean, so. So it's gone. It's the world's gone off the off the cliff. Hmm.
Reverend Ben Cooper:So what what it is telling us is that what there is a controlling element of governments and systems, changing the language and the way that we speak, we talk about freedom of speech. Now, when you look at Christ, he used the authority that the Father gave Him through the living word, he spoke truth, you will know the truth and the truth will set you free.
Simon Pinchbeck:So great scripture and Ben, it's John gyfer, John eighth. And, but he never,
Reverend Ben Cooper:he didn't hold back. He didn't know he wasn't arrogant, but he didn't
Simon Pinchbeck:have a route or an argument or discussion, he just said, is written. Now, you know, look, when when the old enemy came in the desert eat was weak, he was tired, he'd 40 days and 40 Nights, he'd been out there, but he had the spirit of God with him so and when the devil devil tempted him, he just said he is written to the
Reverend Ben Cooper:spoken word, not just the power
Simon Pinchbeck:of the authority of the Word of the Word of God.
Reverend Ben Cooper:It's interesting that the devil came at His weakest hour this week is time Yeah. So we need to make sure that that we're that we are very careful when we're tired. And when we're weary from outside influence. That's why it's so important. As the Scripture says, Put the put the, put the word on the tablet of your heart, you know, feed yourself, what you feed yourself, you become,
Simon Pinchbeck:it's huge. And if he's a word, you'll become one of the one of the things out there if you're listening to this, you may recognize this but it's normally about have our free in the morning, three o'clock, in our free your wake up, and you'll wake up maybe with worries on your mind, make it we've stuffed this, there's been blown out of proportion, you we all go through it, we've all been through it. Yeah.
Reverend Ben Cooper:And we still got tremors, we still are raising with none
Simon Pinchbeck:of us. None of us are protected from that sort of thing because it will come at us. So we need the Scripture and when that happens, we need the scripture to get into and there's some great Psalms is some great scriptures to get into and you know, I'd advise anybody to grab hold on to a couple of scriptures in a month for me It's Psalm 62 One and Two you know rest in the arms or Lord rest in the will give us up early so be the rock you know, so I repeat that and all of a sudden there is a peace come I might get better sleep. But you know I can wake up like everyone else. Oh don't worry don't can't get better sleep. Yeah, things are going on that morning. Yeah, they seem bigger than what they are.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yeah, that's because that's scriptural that that's like the watching our that's the spiritual activity and all that stuff that goes with that. But when you look at who is this word, so you're referring to is when we're weak and we're tired, and we're a bit pressed down, get into the Word, but there are there are many in churches and congregations that don't know who the word is because they've been brought up in this religious drum skin. They've been brought in brought up in this Nicodemus box.
Simon Pinchbeck:We had to have and and also, you know, when you go on to the other side of things, we've have a lot of these churches that progressive churches out there. Jesus has set Jesus assess the home button, I think in in Luke 11. He said, This is an evil generation looking for a sign, you know, and that is this is what leads people aren't. They're looking for a sign, I wonder. Yeah, it's too today as much as what it was back in those days. So we have this, this this man here, who walked the earth. I were too far. 1000 years ago, but no one as ever influenced the world impossible that this man,
Reverend Ben Cooper:no way, no way, it seems like the basename were talking about in persecuting him trying to remove him, push him out in every area of life. So when we say who is this Jesus, that scripture I mentioned earlier, one, one. Colossians is a big theological text, just five verses, and I'm going to read it for those that might want to reference because this can sum Christ up very, very quickly. Because when Christ ology studying Christ, you can spend your life studying Jesus, but I love this scripture. So this is coming from the New Testament, one Colossians Colossians, sorry, chapter one, verse 15. And it says, The Sun is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For in Him, all things were created, things in heaven and things on earth, visible and invisible. Whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities, all things were, have been created through him. And for Him, He is before all things. and in Him all things hold together. He is the head of the body, the church, he is the beginning of the firstborn among the dead, so that in everything he might have supremacy, for God was so pleased to have his fullness well in him, and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things above, by marking peace, through His blood shed on the cross. That's amazing. That is so much wrapped up.
Simon Pinchbeck:I mean, crikey to try and work through that. I think, I think what we need to understand, and that scripture sums it up completely, is that when Jesus was born, it's wasn't the beginning of Jesus.
Reverend Ben Cooper:No, it wasn't because the screen makes it very clear. That makes me very clear. From the beginning, before time before the first stars before the world came into my dusty incarnation
Simon Pinchbeck:of him. Yeah, as man. That's what it was. So it wasn't when he was born. No, it was Jesus was when he was he was,
Reverend Ben Cooper:it was at the was because he's everything you hate. And I love that and how the writer writes, The Sun is the image of the invisible God. If you want to be a peacemaker, if you want to live right, if you want to be that human that affects people's lives for the better not for for our for our benefit, but for their benefit, because quite what's really important as well, is that I understand whether we're male or female, is that Christ says, I've come to serve and not to be served. That is an impact in Scripture.
Simon Pinchbeck:You know, that scripture alone is huge, isn't it? Our so this is this is this is God, this is God. This is Christ fully God in fully man, fully man, but he's come to serve,
Reverend Ben Cooper:it's come to serve. He's not come to take.
Simon Pinchbeck:And Benny don't make it complex. Judas doesn't make things complicated. He makes things very simple. It's it's the church with their physiology that make and men that make things and women that make things very complicated. And he says, you're looking for a sign, he said, I am assuming I am the sign, you're looking for it. I'm here, right right in front of you.
Reverend Ben Cooper:You've only got a look at Thomas, and Philip, both in the arena and a conversation with him in the New Testament. They're saying, show us the Father who is the father, and Christ is going to the Father is before you and you do not recognize you cannot see me you cannot see the Father, open your eyes. That is so religious. That is such the way religion recognizes. Maybe one's one glimmer, but it won't take the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit takes the Father, Son or Mary, or it takes the father or it takes Mary over Christ. When you look at religion, it a true Gospel Church identifies Christ as the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit, a believer. Yeah.
Simon Pinchbeck:And the deal there has been is that our heavenly father doesn't want religion. He wants us to have a relationship with his son that he set out for us. He wants to have a relationship with him to take him into our hearts so that then we can find a way through Jesus back to the father back to the father back to the Father. And that is, is so simple if we crash that it will change your life. If, if if anyone's listened to that, and really, and really hasn't grasped that before this will change your life because the higher our Heavenly Father loved us so much that He sent His Son in human form, in the likeness of himself in the likeness of himself, so that anyone who believes in Him shall not perish but have everlasting life and will find their way back to the Father. Now, the crazy thing is been and we're maybe we're jumping a few steps here, but we'll bring it in anyway is that when I put the nails through his flesh on outcross, Ben, it wasn't the nails that kept him there.
Reverend Ben Cooper:It was the love, it was them nows didn't need to be there them soldiers need didn't need to be there. You know, that is just an act and display of what the crucifixion is, but God's love. Christ's love is so unconditional. You know, you could have took the nails, you could took the rope off on Christ, whatever you could have took the cross, stay and he would have stayed in that mid position. Because the scriptures had to be fulfilled,
Simon Pinchbeck:make no mistake, he could have called on legions of angels right this minute to smash the earth to smithereens, he could have done all of that. But because
Reverend Ben Cooper:of unconditional love, and John 316, he
Simon Pinchbeck:wanted to the will of the Father, who loved the world so much that He said, Father, oh, I'll do this, I'll do this and, and for the for, for this man who never been separated from his father, and the separation through sin from our sin that put him on the cross. That was a killer. That was a killer for him. It wasn't the fact that he was the pain of that was bad enough, but the pain of being separated from his father was
Reverend Ben Cooper:we can't grasp it. As human beings we cannot grasp the pain and what that must have felt like because it says that he took everything upon him. So not just the physical pain, not just the ridicule of having everyone looking at him and staring at him and and calling and beaten and the weapons not just the physical endurance of being beaten to death almost. But then you've got the spiritual the spiritual forces the darkness that everything that was that was there looking looking, you know, we have no clue really, of what was going on in that spiritual world above
Simon Pinchbeck:we can only really imagine that there was rejoicing in hell time devils at the foot across. Yeah. And they're all what's his name's Narnia that really sort of brings you know, where where as lamb was, was killed on and they're all cheering and rejoicing. But you know, he was the next thing is back up and out again. So, so So yeah, I mean that. There we have to there we have the crucifixion of, of Jesus. And really, it's, it's the end of the story and a beginning of a new it's a new
Reverend Ben Cooper:story on it's beyond my understanding of the title of what we're just thrown into the arena of conversation this morning. Who is this Jesus, when you actually start to think about a year we know is the Savior of the world is the King above all kings is the Lion of Judah, He's the great iron, He's worthy of all praise. He's Jehovah. Jireh, Jehovah Nissi is He is everything. And when you start to talk about he's the creator of heaven and earth, because in Colossians, it says in verse 16, For in him all things were created. So in him, everything was created through Him through the spoken word. So is the word he is the power, he is the authority. He is your God, He is your rock. So when when you just say, who is Jesus? It's an it's an ongoing conversation for eternity, isn't it?
Simon Pinchbeck:Man, it's so deep. This is sadly there's so much in it. But it again, is so simple, really, because as Jay Z he gathered this team of world beaters around him dearly, you know, these, these were well worth tackling software, a game where they were they were. For him their audits were already been
Reverend Ben Cooper:and how much power and authority did Christ have over them in this way when he walked on the shoreline and he went up to their boats and their business and he went, come and follow Me. And they just dropped everything. So what was that how much power was in his voice? What? What drew them men to leave everything they'd work for everything that they'd live for. I could what was that?
Simon Pinchbeck:I can come very, very, a very, very small, humble, humble part of, of what happened there happened to me when I was, you know, down the lowest I've ever been in my life. And I saw a man who had his life changed through a relationship with Jesus Christ, and a saw Jesus shine out of them. Whoa, so that attract, I was wrecked and I attracted me to him. And so I went and wanted to know more about it now. And I would say to any believer out there, we have to let the light shine out. Because that is the attraction that is, so what our Jesus was with the disciples, if we're, if Jesus is living in us, so And the Scripture tells us not either live, but Christ who lives in me. If, if well, if we're allowing Christ to live in us, then people will be attracted. Not everyone, but people who, who puts you know who's the law puts it on her head. And it's very interesting, Ben, so he's got this team of world beaters around him. And if we go to Matthew Ben, Matthew 1613 20, he says, when they come to the region of Cesar Rai Philippi, assays disciples saying, who demands say that I am the Son of Man. So they said, Some say John the Baptist, some say lodges and others say Jeremiah, or one of the prophets. They said to them, who do sigh, Ali's, these, these these team around him. So though Simon Peter was straight up, and he answered, Yoda, Christ, the Son of the living God. And then Jesus said to him, this, he said, Blessed are you, Simon bar Jonah, for flesh, and blood has not revealed this to you. But my Father who is in heaven, and also say to you that you are Peter, on this rock, I will build my church and the gates of it shall not prevail against it. And I will give you the keys to the kingdom of heaven. And whatever you bind on earth, we're bound in heaven and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed. Then he commanded his disciples, they should not tell anyone that he was Jesus to Christ.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Whoa, don't tell now. Don't keep it, keep it and keep
Simon Pinchbeck:it on a lot. But the interesting part about it is Peter said, You are a Christ.
Reverend Ben Cooper:So that is revelation or revelation
Simon Pinchbeck:of knowledge. So Jesus was 100%, right? You haven't done that in your own strength. You can't. So for us to think we do anything in our own strength. Is, is ego is edging God out. It's pride. It's all of that stuff. We do nothing in our own strength is all as you quite rightly said. But it's all revelation and knowledge. It's all through Christ who strengthens us. It's all through Jesus. We can do nothing apart from Jesus.
Reverend Ben Cooper:That's right. Even Paul, when he was writing the epistle, very clearly is he said, this is a this is a mystery. But as I write this, the Holy Spirit is giving me revelation or knowledge of what to write. So when you look at religion, and you look at Nicodemus, and you look at what Christ and He says, Who What about you? And that question is to all of us today across the earth. Who am I to you? Who am I?
Simon Pinchbeck:And I was, I mean, I was listening to one of our old podcasts every day, Ben and NFU, please. You know, there's some powerful stuff because it's all revelational stuff. It's all you know. And you mentioned, you mentioned John, when he went on the island of Patmos, and he wrote the little jobs. You mentioned his John, who had been on the on the bejesus out of his arms around him. He was the says he was the one that Jesus loved the most. But he had a revelational like image of vision of Jesus. And he is one of his best friends from the world beating team. He fell down at his feet. It
Reverend Ben Cooper:couldn't he couldn't look at him. He fell as if he was dead. But what this is, this is
Simon Pinchbeck:Mr. Douglas a point and it
Reverend Ben Cooper:is such a deep text like you said, John cloth walk with Christ. Absolutely such a strong relationship. But then he's on that island of Patmos. He's on. He's in that place of prison. He's got nowhere to go. He's got lockdown, he's completely beat and completely lost and then suddenly, suddenly out of nowhere, this Messiah, this, this Holy Christ, this one like the Son of Man, imagine what that was like to see him standing there, his face, his eyes, his hair, the brilliance of him. Now that's how I see revival that when revival, true revival comes to a human being. It makes us fall in reverence. See, not as the worldly church there's that when Jesus shows up, we're going to run to him and give him a cuddle. I honestly believe that through when you study about revival and a relationship with Christ, when the holiness of the holy of holy shows up, you want to you will want to drive yourself through the floor.
Simon Pinchbeck:It's a great point, and that's what he done. You did that in that podcast, you made that point very clearly. And I think it's worse and it's definitely worth saying again, Ben, that, that, that Jesus is not your best mate, you
Reverend Ben Cooper:know, is is the Son of God. He's your savior,
Simon Pinchbeck:your Redeemer. Anyone who thinks that our Heavenly Father's like a friendly grandfather Hmm We have the we have the reverence of preferential fear of our Heavenly Father Our Heavenly Father's therefore, he's he's got his arms wrapped around us but don't think he's gonna wink at some of the stuff you're doing.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Look at his holiness. It can't do that. Look at y'all. John, see the holy Messiah. Chile's fall brilliant, you're
Simon Pinchbeck:bang on you know, Jesus walked through the story through that wall of this pod on the floor not gonna say Oh, Jesus, how your mind and I'm coming up. I know you're really on your face. You cannot look at him because we are so I think Oh, such a wreck anyway. Yeah,
Reverend Ben Cooper:I think what we see through Scriptures, the man Christ Jesus, the Scripture references in the man Christ Jesus, we see the man Christ Jesus, up to the cross. And then when Christ is revealed, on all the different places, if 500 signs of Christ, there we have, this, got to be careful, we present this. So what we have up to the cross, we have the man Christ Jesus, the son doing the will of the Father, in his for humanity. But then when he is gone, and he is taken to the cross, and Jesus says, It is finished, suddenly there is a change that and John is the one that really tells us how it how it is that now because Jesus says, Don't touch me, even when he's in a garden that don't touch me, I haven't gone I haven't ascended, don't, don't touch me yet. So then we see the holiness of Jesus, the power and the real authority of this, this Christ, this Messiah. And as he revealed himself to John on the island of Patmos, John, I honestly believe that's how I would react and so many honest Christians would react. And it's not the honesty and actually the emotional side, it's your body, realizing that you are in a place of purity and holiness, and the Christ, the one like the Son of Man, standing in his brilliance, I cannot see how I, in a revival time, would be able to stand up, I would shake. That's what the Bible says, work out your salvation, with fear and trembling when God is in front of you in the presence of the Holy Christ. Your flesh can't do it, your flesh will want to burn you want to it. It's quite frightening to me, to be honest, I'm open and honest. If Jesus was to step through this wall, I would be I would be a mess, because of the holiness.
Simon Pinchbeck:But then I don't think that's preached enough the holiness of Christ, I don't think it's spoken about. I don't think you know, in in our, in our churches, we go near that stuff.
Reverend Ben Cooper:It's a Holy Jesus. No, it's not actually it's an all loving Jesus yay, is all loving, we get all that. But when you have and you see these revivals and all that, that, that Jesus showed up today is not it's not going to make me laugh. It's actually going to make me cry, and say, Father, I'm not worthy, but thank you, it will drive me to a place of repentance. And John is showing us a clear, a clear born again believer.
Simon Pinchbeck:It's an it's just a clip of it's just a
Reverend Ben Cooper:fraction of a moment. Why is it the angels are singing in heaven? Holy, holy, holy is the law of Moses worthy of all praise, His Holiness, his brilliance is power. This is Jesus.
Simon Pinchbeck:This is this is the one that's coming back. He says it is so clear him right in Revelation bit further on he is CO Whitestone. Alien with a large with a big sword. And he's coming back with fiery red and true, Mike, he ain't coming back to evangelize, he's not coming back to save souls at that particular moment. He's coming back with a judgment. We have that time before he comes back to tell people about Jesus to show people about Jesus and and when he was in the flesh. What did people say that as some people say they said he was a madman, didn't they bend? Yeah, that's some people say he was a liar or revolutionary.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Every night, every name that we know within the world has been presented to Christ, you know, Christ has gone through it he has gone through. So we can go through because he's gone through. But when when you look at the holiness of Christ, you know, the church, the church, the Church, lifts him up at the manger. They lift him up a little bit, I would say a little bit of Easter, you know, they don't talk about the holiness of the eternal God, because Christ is the image of the invisible God, and God is holy. But the disciples rec didn't even just see him as the man Christ Jesus.
Simon Pinchbeck:Because if it was, if it was rebuilt, they couldn't stand I couldn't cut it couldn't cope with it is so it was far too much. You know, and, and that's when you think our when you think that when you know that, you see very clearly just how much the father loved this world because he sent his son confined in that human Yeah, human body. And yes, he was a revolutionary Ben because yeah, what he what he was saying to people, was different gravy you want it? We
Reverend Ben Cooper:no, absolutely completely the opposite to what the authorities were saying Herod wanted him from day one. The system is always after Jesus, the world is always after Christ.
Simon Pinchbeck:Well, look, it turned the wrong thing on it said ventini. So, so before the religion taught people that not to forgive but for an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth, is what he said. He said, Forgive Forgive. And he was approached when he by I think it was Peter who said how many times have I got no give seven times? He said, No more sounds 70 times
Reverend Ben Cooper:seven, keep going. And look about look at when Christ come out of the do we do that? Forgiveness, that's a different subject. That is a tough subject,
Simon Pinchbeck:even little things that you might be a why for years forgiveness, forgive
Reverend Ben Cooper:children, your work colleagues, life, forgive
Simon Pinchbeck:me said, he said, he said, the Bible says do not commit adultery. But I'll tell you, if you had lust in your heart for a woman, you've committed adultery. Yeah.
Reverend Ben Cooper:And what does he say you now we're coming to the the Sermon on the Mount. Blessed are the peacemakers, the opposite. Now, though, a worldly man has got a walk around with, with this almost aggression, to be recognized as a man with his swagger. But Jesus went, Blessed are the peacemakers. So the opposite opposite, so it takes it and we It's often said that it takes a braver man to walk away from a fight than it does to get into war, and as a truth, and when there was a fight, and when they came for Christ in the Garden of Gethsemane, when the disciple took the knife and cut Marcus's ear off, Jesus went, what are you doing? I'm not leading a rebellion of rebels. So Jesus isn't for fighting physical fighting
Simon Pinchbeck:what he came to do, he came to change the hearts of men and women, he can change the hearts spin, and that's you didn't do it by aggression, aggression. He did it by love, love and the word didn't He so loved and one a new way of thinking so
Reverend Ben Cooper:sort of, to who is this? How do you? How do you
Simon Pinchbeck:learn another example? Benny's, you know? He said, he said, Moses said in a tanker mammals do not murder but I tell you if you've got a hatred in your heart, for any, yeah, do you know
Reverend Ben Cooper:forgiveness? So Christ when you look at the image,
Simon Pinchbeck:well, that sermon on that might mount Ben, that's powerful.
Reverend Ben Cooper:That's enormous. So Jesus makes a clear, a clear, cut sound in the Gospel of John. He says, if you are my disciples, hold on to my teachings, hold on to my teachings, and you truly are my disciples. So religion and the church if it holds on to the teachings of Jesus Christ, without deviating left, right. changing anything, you're a disciple. But if you come away from the teachings of Jesus Christ, make In your own gospel app, you are not a disciple. No, you can't be you can't be part of the Kingdom of God. If you are not holding now, it's not about lifestyle and the way that you live, because that's the different different skin or giver. But it's actually realizing that this message from Genesis to Revelation is holy, is pure. I cannot add or take away, I've got to do everything I can as a human being, as a believer in Christ to live according to the Word of God. That is the biggest that is the biggest challenge. Put to humanity, live by the Word of God. Yeah, male or female.
Simon Pinchbeck:And we will go through this sermon on the mount, we'll go through it, and we'll straight talk on it. And it'll be like the 10 commandments, it will be more than Yeah. Because, look, just to pick one out. He said. He was preaching he said, Love. You've already said, You should love your neighbor, which was one of the greatest commandments but he says, and hate your enemy, but I tell you love your enemies and those who curse you. Do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you. So this is
Reverend Ben Cooper:the man the man Christ Jesus. Role model
Simon Pinchbeck:of what that takes. Do you know how much strength that takes a local boy enemy's channel how much strength that takes when
Reverend Ben Cooper:you can't do it in the flesh?
Simon Pinchbeck:It's, it's easy. It's easy to hate and ABCs ain't your enemy easy to get into a fight, but the strength it takes to walk your enemies, pray for them, bless them,
Reverend Ben Cooper:and be a peacemaker, be a peacemaker. And that takes into prior to love to feed
Simon Pinchbeck:water much too much for me, sometimes
Reverend Ben Cooper:it's too much as the fleshly you can't do it in the flesh man. So you can only do this with Christ Jesus can only do it with Jesus giveness in the human skin without Christ is impossible to forgive. But with Christ, all things are possible. So with with this Christ, this man, and who is as Jesus said to His disciples, Who do you say I am? That is the question, I believe God, Christ, the Holy Spirit is asking the church within the UK. Who do you say I am? You say? So many things about me. You say this, you say that. But what does the word say? It's not what the preachers and the teachers and the denomination say, even if you look at denominations at the moment, denominations are coming against each other. But Jesus doesn't talk about denominations. How do we identify as a Christian, he says, You got to be born again.
Simon Pinchbeck:That said, we did that podcast last week. Then we straight talk on being born again. But it needs to be said time and time again. Because that is the way he must be born again. must be born again must have a new heart.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yeah. And the church the religious and a mass percentage of it makes it so complicated. I know churches that that you have to have a do a course before you become a fully member. Well, that is not the church of Jesus Christ. Membership course, a membership course a discipleship course. And a quarter B course and alpha course. A Fred course or a dually course a billy for every course under the sun. But all I want to know is how do I become a believer in Jesus? I just want to help me the image someone helped me.
Simon Pinchbeck:I want to know Jesus. Well. Yeah, well, this is a 12 week course here that will you know, before you can really know him,
Reverend Ben Cooper:okay, Pastor, what happens if I die? On week four? I'll get run over by a bus. And you haven't told me salvation today? What do I do to get in the kingdom of God, sir, help me I'm dying in my sin. I'm scared. I'm worried. Well, we'll finish this course. And by the end of the coasts, then we'll talk about the Holy Spirit, and we're talking about that, but I need Jesus. I need the world is crying out for someone. And his name is Jesus. And the church has everything. But nothing.
Simon Pinchbeck:It was the lady of general forgetting a name now blesses us, but she'd she'd gone and she was evangelizing in Hong Kong, and she'd done an Jackie pullin, Jackie PolyJet, was on a call in and I went, you know, years and years ago, I went to hear her speak at Holy Trinity Brompton, and, you know, tears just got he's just couldn't not. So she said, Yes, they did the Christian course called Alpha. Yeah. But they had to bring The Holy Spirit at the front at the front because of the people that were bringing it to what would have been dead body and that that
Reverend Ben Cooper:is the seriousness that is a very, very important part. You know, the Bible says let your light shine today is the day unto salvation today, I don't know. Or if someone is an atheist or someone is looking for Christ, how can we say, Okay, I know a great Men's Ministry come to the church on Saturday morning, we'll have a breakfast, we'll have a fryer. Even men's ministries, Forgive me, brother, sister women's ministries, I don't believe that we are talking about Jesus Christ enough. in ministry, it shouldn't be about the men and the women that build the ministers. It has to be about Jesus, I don't want another breakfast. I don't want another curry night. What I need to know is, is my name stamped in the nouns book of life?
Simon Pinchbeck:What you're the fact and what you're saying is what I'm experiencing out there in the world, men and women wants a deeper level of understanding, I want Jesus but I want it simple. I don't want another I don't want to complicate. And here's the thing, you know, Jesus, you know, we've said it before, he didn't stand when he was feeding the 5000 are feeding the forefathers and or wherever he was, he didn't say, only feed him over there. Don't just feed him over there with not them not because they're not there. At the moment is so
Reverend Ben Cooper:right Simon, because also the feeding and the 5000. It it gives the numerical number but then also it says, And the women and the children, so it just doesn't leave anybody out. leave
Simon Pinchbeck:anybody out.
Reverend Ben Cooper:We have to be careful of by having a woman's ministry and a Men's Ministry or youth ministry or Sunday school ministry. Because Jesus says Come to me, all of you. I believe in the last days we should be thinking, Is it right to have a set gender ministry? I don't believe it is. Because Jesus has said forever and eternity. Come to me, all of you that are weary and later we got more children broken and saying counselors never before we got more men and women on the suicidal drum than ever before. It's no good me going to a church and saying, I need Jesus. Can you help me? Okay, mate, I'll see you on Tuesday night come down the local carriers and we'll talk to you. I need to know what happens if I die now. Or I walk away from this church and I'll get run over I'll get shot or get stabbed or get killed. Where am I going?
Simon Pinchbeck:And you could you could all them could happen in Swanley. Come open
Reverend Ben Cooper:it low. I'm telling you. Anything can happen. This is the
Simon Pinchbeck:source of truth versus series as well. No, we don't have enough but that is the truth. See, Jesus says for everyone Aiden in the 5000 just for you in that church. Are you east for the whole world? So is this for the whole world and he's for he's Africa and don't forget Ben is full of black is for the white is for anything and it was a black guy that helped him with a cross when it be exactly you know, when
Reverend Ben Cooper:you look at all this Christ is for everyone, there is no
Simon Pinchbeck:why it wouldn't have been why would he you know easily put a whole world is only this only is religion, religion, religions, he smashed a box completely. As this year I am and for everybody come to me all those who are weary and heavy laden encompassed everybody when he was talking to the sermon, the Sermon on the Mount, when he was talking, he
Reverend Ben Cooper:fed everybody, every boat to everybody from the youngest to the oldest, from the weary from the tired to the worry to the Fed. When you look at Jesus's ministry, He didn't leave anybody out. He spoke to culture, he spoke to the old the young, he he moved in areas where religion will only go right. I believe God is calling us to a woman's ministry that is where we're going to stay. God is calling you i understand that to a degree. But I'm afraid the church we have taken it too far. And we got to be careful because there are a lot of ministries that suddenly come away from the teachings of Jesus Christ and go down the occult route and go down the the area of the the sect of the of the gender only that Jesus is only talking to you he's not talking. It has to be
Simon Pinchbeck:and you know, you are special. You're specially chosen. If you can do this, or do that or do do something else. No, it does. It really doesn't matter. So here's a deal. But Did Jesus say to the thief on a cross, can you speak in tongues? He didn't. He didn't.
Reverend Ben Cooper:At that time. You know how long you've been at church? We got a 12 week course Jesus said within now that is a very interesting stretch assignment. Because that tells you there is no membership with Jesus Oh membership there. is no 12 week course, there is no almost soft soap in you to get you into the church. Jesus said, there'll be women with a twinkling of an eye,
Simon Pinchbeck:and much money of your time this way.
Reverend Ben Cooper:When you look at the face, he was the face he was a murderer. We don't know too much about the history that went along with this man. But he was on the cross because he had been murdering, killing. Anything that had been going on this character would have probably done, but Jesus does not reject anybody.
Simon Pinchbeck:This is an interesting scripture. So who is Jesus?
Reverend Ben Cooper:Who is Jesus Christ on the cross? Christ in? In the Garden of Gethsemane, Christ as the living word, Christ as a redeemer, Christ as the rock, Christ as the head of the church? We owe him everything but who is this Jesus, Jesus
Simon Pinchbeck:everything.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Look at that conversation on the cross. Two men, that fully God fully Christ, fully man,
Simon Pinchbeck:so in broken lands in the Bible, a man about to
Reverend Ben Cooper:die that has gone through the most hardened, disgusting pain on Earth. The thief that was next to him, was probably was, I can't imagine what he was feeling pain, and he said, Jesus, Jesus, Jesus, remember me? Remember me? Remember me? Yeah. I tell you this, within a twinkling of an eye. Now think about that. God is God in Christ. Sorry. He's not saying, I've got to forgive you that there was no, there was no time for ministry. This man was at death's door. He was either going to Hades otter heaven, there was no time for chickens.
Simon Pinchbeck:There was no time to go to a curry night.
Reverend Ben Cooper:There was no time to have breakfast to get an ever bright ticket and to get a revival. You know, where am I going? Simon when I die? Where am I going? Jesus? Where am I going? When I die? Lord, help me I've been a thief. I've been a robber. I've been a murderer. I've been all the all the labels. I've been chased down all my life. And I'm hanging on the cross with the eternal God. And the eternal. God says to him, you will be with Me in Paradise with Me in Paradise. This is the Christ.
Simon Pinchbeck:He brings a lump to your throat. This is the eternal Christ, because he knew his heart and the other guy on the other side turned away then he he tells me it was hard and he did so. So Jesus knew his heart. And an interest in Scripture. Ben was in Luke around about 840 was when Jarius it was a it was a synagogue ruler, he said, came to Jesus. And he said his, his daughter was dying. Yeah, its door was dying. And Jesus said, He said, But if you come with me, you know, come, Lord can't come quickly. But rather that time was when the woman really issue a blood issue of blood. So Jerry says he imagined my daughter was dying, can't Jesus, do you need to come with me now? And he turns readers turns around and speaks that woman with the issue of blood. Yeah. And then they come to him and go,
Reverend Ben Cooper:she's dead. She's dead. Don't bother. They say don't bother the teacher. That is religion. Don't bother this Jesus. You're not going to get your miracle. You're not going to get your healing down. That is religion today. That is the system of religion. All these big denominations that are saying that they are the church, you're not the church. Because you would not say to someone that is dying, or someone that needs bread and wine, communion and breaking the bread. You can't take that because you haven't jumped through hoops.
Simon Pinchbeck:Imagine you in the hospice, aren't there? I mean, you see it all the time, everyday life 20 odd hours a week, Kenya
Reverend Ben Cooper:24/7. Life is like this life is fleeting. Life is fleeting, and obviously things you know, you've got
Simon Pinchbeck:someone in there who's gone. Pastor Ben, I know my time short. I've never taken community in my life, but but I really feel I want to take community and fight Jesus. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. You can't you. I'm sorry. But we need to go through certain things before.
Reverend Ben Cooper:And the breath your your your heartbeat is so limited at that time. Your number is coming through the door. It's walking through the corridor, and imagine
Simon Pinchbeck:if you've gone sorry, my I'll come back next week. I'm back next week. And then we go back next week and the beds empty, gone.
Reverend Ben Cooper:And you look in the room and it's empty. And then the question sits with me. The question is six with you, you got blood on your hands. Wow. Because you have you have the answer. that religion has the answer, but it wants to control it.
Simon Pinchbeck:But Jesus, Jesus would have just gone
Reverend Ben Cooper:within a twinkling of an eye. You'll be with me in paradise. Yeah. So when you look at Jairus, when you look at the lady with the issue of blood, and you look, there's two ends of the stick on that story. She was at the lowest end of society, and he was at the highest end of society. And Jesus went to both Jesus deals with both. He doesn't, he doesn't box us in denominations, he doesn't put us to a side, he doesn't segregate us. He doesn't put us in that Pentecostal corner. The Church of England in that corner of the world does that world religion does that Jesus says, you're my disciple. You're my son, you're my daughter. I love you unconditionally. I went to the cross for you. He didn't go to the cross for denomination. It didn't die for a limb. It didn't die for the Church of England. It didn't die for Catholicism. It didn't die for the system. He died for the human being.
Simon Pinchbeck:It's an inside out. Yeah, it's an inside out thing where, where Jesus doesn't look at you from the outside as the world would look at you, he looks at you from the inside out. Yeah. And it doesn't matter what you think about yourself, your listeners out there. It doesn't matter what you think about yourself. Jesus looks at you from the inside, and is made you if you listen to this, he made you and you're perfect in his eyes, because he made you, you're perfect. And my God doesn't make junk. I don't think that you're blessed to work. So you're, you're an amazing human being out there.
Reverend Ben Cooper:And God created you and God is for you and not not against you. And he loves you unconditional. So the question is the it's just an ongoing conversation. As Jesus said to His disciples, that once he called Christ is the same yesterday, today, and for every more ever more. Who do you say I am, and I believe Christ, the Word is talking to denominations at this moment, and saying, Who am I to you, and we will know what and who and how they respect him, as the weeks go by, because they are walking away from his teachings, because he makes it clear, you must be born again. Nothing about denomination, nothing about a limb, nothing about the Church of England, nothing about Catholicism, nothing about world religions. He said, You must be born again. How can I be born again, born again basically means when you break that down to be born from above. So you are really you're born again through the Spirit. And there is an interesting scripture in a scene in one Peter one Peter, I can't remember off the top of my head. And it says that you are of no birth, because of Christ Jesus, and because of the resurrected Christ. So born again, only came into existence when Christ was raised from the dead. And it is a clear teaching that it says that you you are born again, you are rebuffed because of the resurrection and the power of Christ. It is in Christ. It's not about going to get a certificate. It's not about being welcomed into a church door. I want to be well i hope that i And I pray that my name is stamped and that that's all I need to know Jesus.
Simon Pinchbeck:And that's and that's the thing well we're gonna we'd ask you out there if you're listening to this is that you may be going to church you may have been baptized, you might know the words to the songs and you might know the words to some of the press but have you actually entered into that relationship with Jesus Christ? As as the as Galatians 220 Is it is it working in in your heart? Are you are you a born again Are you a new creation like two Corinthians 517 tells us you know it's not either live but Christ who lives in me says Paul regulations two lives in me so you are old man in the flesh? Is that gone? iView embraced a new you a new heart a new relationship man, Jesus Christ? Or is it just LZ just motion on a page? Is it just religion or is it just religion? So I will ask you to, to spend some time with the Lord and
Reverend Ben Cooper:seek Him seeker? Because that way just to let you know, we're going to come to the table in about five minutes, we're going to break bread. We're going to take a cup, because Jesus, Jesus said, do this as often as you come together, nothing to do with religion. This is because of what Christ has told us. And this is his teachings. If you are seeking God is calling God Audio before you're seeking you might have gone through life for many years and many hours bouncing in and out of church and all that. But God doesn't bounce in and out of us. He is always within us. I was listening
Simon Pinchbeck:to Billy Graham as I do a little bit these days. And he was saying that he was approached by he was speaking to this very highly decorated bishop or whatever. And he said this bishop was spending a bit of time in I think, one of the big cities in the States. And he says interesting, he said he was sitting on a bus. He said, going somewhere and this, this black lady banged him on the on the back, and he turned around, he obviously was wearing his collarbone. Yeah. All right. And she said to him, Are you born again? He said, Well, I'm a I'm a bishop, I'm bah, bah. She said, No. Are you born again? He went, well. She said, Are you born again? He said, he said, How I got when I got off the bus. I went straight to my Bible. East. John, free free out. He said, I fell to my knees, he said, and I realized that I had not been what a
Reverend Ben Cooper:beautiful story. What a beautiful story. And that was Christ, tapping him on the shoulder. That was Christ. Three times Jesus says to Nicodemus, you must be born again. And it's not a strapline in the Pentecostal movement is not from the Evangelical Alliance. It's not from these from the wild, crazy preachers that are that are out there, all that mad stuff that's going on. It is a fundamental teaching of Jesus Christ, you must be born again. It's not about the certificate from the church. It's not about going in and out and following certain ministries. It is following Jesus. And it is asking that question, Lord, who are you reveal Yourself to me because I don't have the capacity and the understanding, and the skill set and the academic stretch to understand who you are, because you are an eternal God and I am a human being.
Simon Pinchbeck:Well being we did a podcast last week on being born again. And we we centered around John 303. And it took us 20 minutes just to get past that first. That first little bit of that Nicodemus, so we'd invite you if you're thinking, I'm not sure what I'm born again, we'd just say to you go back to John, go to John, and read that, read that all the way through. And then as the Lord you know, into your heart,
Reverend Ben Cooper:that that that's where we are at the last days. We're at the time when the church within the UK has to be pressing across the pulpit in every conversation. Are you born again? Are you born again,
Simon Pinchbeck:but it's vital, it's vital. We've got to be asking that question that should be asked every church service is are you born again? John, free free? Are you born again?
Reverend Ben Cooper:Now that word are you born again? That certainly has affected me in my life. And the reason that has affected me is because I have been judged and been poked around by religion. And it pushed it made me have a strange thinking of of that because I thought and I never because God reveals at the right time, I thought that that was just a a tagline. And it went along, even being a believer in all what I do. But just recently now this might this I'm being completely honest, I've suddenly realized that it is the teaching of Jesus Christ now people out there are gonna gonna go What's he going on about court? But we read the scriptures. It's like the two on the Emmaus road. Christ was with them. But he did not reveal Himself to them their hearts were beating.
Simon Pinchbeck:I think when I think when you you're 1,000,000% Right. I think what happens is we get into church don't we read it we see and we think we take it for granted. We take it for granted. You may have your parents may have been yet born again Christian so you take it for granted that you automatically but it's not it's an individual thing.
Reverend Ben Cooper:And the times that I've been in churches together the top the years I was in churches together and the time and I can see this person this this Reverend this person saying to me how Yeah, you're one of them. You're born again. And that hurt me? Because I had it upside down. So that affected me because I looked up to the eldership I looked up to them a fault
Simon Pinchbeck:and you Yeah, Ben you you know that question should have bounced straight off for us straight back to him. Yeah, I've gone that. No, my friend. The question is,
Reverend Ben Cooper:Are you are you so God reveals? And I have been on the other side of that bone again message. And it's not until now and recently that I've suddenly had God revealing the scriptures like never before to me. Which it makes me want to cry because, oh Lord help us. But we are living in times when the scripture says you must be born again. And it's not a hashtag. It's not a strapline of religion. It is a command, it is a teaching. It is a clear cut word from God.
Simon Pinchbeck:And you'll find in our pockets as we, you know, Jesus didn't say, it'd be good if you were born again. And yeah, kinda like if you were born again, or maybe you should be born again. He said, What was the slave?
Reverend Ben Cooper:Surely Tony very, you must be you must be there's no question is either you're gonna stay like Nicodemus. Or you're going to be a disciple,
Simon Pinchbeck:and sadly been, you know, I can relate to what you're saying. Because in I've been in I was, I was in the churches together, meeting with 40 different leaders, they're all patting themselves on the back for all these little events who are putting on and all that sort of thing. I asked him the question, I got up, I was given a, I was only given that 10 minutes, I said, you know, I said, What's the most important thing as a Christian? Man, we went around the houses, you know, and the most important thing as a Christian is your relationship with Jesus Christ. And, you know, and to, to have a relationship with Jesus Christ, you have to be born again.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yeah, in 100, because it is more than our life hangs on it literally, it literally we are going to live forever in eternity with the Holy God of Israel, or we're going to hell.
Simon Pinchbeck:And when we do embrace Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior, we confess our sin and turn away from it. And what we Jesus, and He accepts us. And He will lead us to the Father, but you can look at his life in a completely different thing. You go through the Gospels, and see what he did see what he said. And all of a sudden, as you quite rightly said, that revelation or knowledge or Brinks come out to you and go, Well, that's what that meant. That That meant I didn't realize that understand.
Reverend Ben Cooper:And I believe that is like that road experience that in May us rode with the two men that had seen Jesus walk with Jesus been with Jesus heard stories about Jesus, and they were still walking with Jesus, but they didn't recognize him.
Simon Pinchbeck:And the church is the same in this country. In a lot of places.
Reverend Ben Cooper:It speaks Jesus, it talks Jesus, but it doesn't recognize them. Recognizing
Simon Pinchbeck:that slightly old Joker's guy who had been born again, walks into a church, shouts out, hallelujah, I found Jesus and someone nudges him and back said, we didn't find him in this church. It's religious religion, it's religion. And my friends. You know, what we want to do above anything else on these podcasts is smash religion out of the ballpark, and introduce a relationship with Jesus Christ, and an understanding on a level that anyone can understand it because he didn't make it complicated. He made it very, very simple.
Reverend Ben Cooper:The religious language has got to stop. It had the UK is tied in religion, and we're coming to the table now. And we want to invite you, we want to invite you, as a sister and a brother, a born again, believer, someone that is seeking Christ. And you know what, you don't need a certificate to say that you've been drawn into this church because you are loved by Jesus Christ, the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit, and He is the one that enables any human being to be born again, born of the Spirit born of the word, rebirth cannot happen via the flesh. But it happens spiritually. So let's gather around the Passover table, we're going to break bread, I'll pray for the bread. So I'm gonna pray for the grape juice that represents the blood of Christ in a moment, but we invite you in, as fellow believers. We're not worried what denomination you go to. What we want you to do, is to follow Christ. That's what we want to do. We want to follow Jesus, and take and take the word and live by the Word and rest in the world. So Father, we thank You for this bread is symbolic to the body of Christ. And as we break bread now, Lord, the question is across this nation, where am I going? When I die? If I was to die now, Lord, am I sure I'm going to heaven? If I was to die, Lord, in a week's time, am I do I know where I am going, Lord, thank You that this bread symbolizes the body of Christ that was broken for us. Come Holy Spirit. Refresh every one of us today. And as we take this, we do it in the name of Jesus Christ. Amen. have
Simon Pinchbeck:any followers that this wine or grape juice up with? No, it symbolizes the blood of our Lord Jesus Christ, who did die on a cross for us and that blood washes and cleansers as we come to him and say, Lord, I'm a sinner. I am a sinner.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yes fatherhood, I
Simon Pinchbeck:turn away from that sin and let your blood just cleanse me and wash me away and your forgiveness just overwhelming and I accept your Son, Jesus Christ, into my life, whether it's for the first time or or just you're just, you're just re reading at reinforcing your faith, this moment in time, we ask that, that you Jesus be be with us be in our hearts, and the Holy Spirit rises up. In Jesus name. Amen. Amen.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Brother and sister, fellow follower of the Word of God. You know, the Scripture is very clear that we'll be looking at today. And just in closing in Matthew chapter 16, something very interesting in that we probably read 1000 times. And it says in verse 18, it says, I tell you, that you are Peter. And then it says, on this rock, I will build my church and the gates of hell or Hades will not overcome it. Christ is the church builder. We are his instruments. And we are there not to build his church because that's his job. So if you are a minister, if you are a leader, if you are someone in the congregation has been called to ministry, whoever you are, our responsibility is not to build the church. Because if I build the church, I'm building my kingdom. All I've got to do is be a servant. I've got to serve and listen to what he's calling me to do. Because Jesus says, I will build my church. Let's just serve Jesus, let's just walk together. Let's stand in the presence of God together. And that's all from every denomination. Let's put that around our circle of life where we walk and what we do. Are you born again? Are you born again? Ask the Vicar's ask the priests. Ask the law givers. Ask your pastor, talk to your people in your congregations. Ask the church are you born again? Perfect. Simon, we're done.
Simon Pinchbeck:We're done. I think that's a great place to to end. And we would invite you to listen to more of our podcast and where our second book is very close to coming out Ben, that's all on fear and which is just read through it the other day, and there's some amazing stuff in there. So we'd invite you to do all that sort of stuff and keep keep keep with us on these podcasts. And next week, we another one, and we'll probably come back to this subject again, because it is such a broad subject for why it's such an important subject. Because it's a time when we need to know in it Ben.
Reverend Ben Cooper:it is yeah. So God bless every one of you. We'll catch you soon. God bless