Hello and welcome to Elim church swnaley you're joining myself, Reverend Ben Cooper for today's podcast. Bonjour.
Leya:Bonjour, Sava.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Oh, J'mapelle
Leya:J'mapelle Legya Jane Moore
Reverend Ben Cooper:J'mapelle sweat is hot in here. Good afternoon podcasts wherever you are. We've got laya j Moore with us today. And we we we the Royal we, we are in a little cupboard Today we're in a little tiny office with
Leya:in the Jesus cupboard.
Reverend Ben Cooper:So it might sound really echoey. So we're really sorry, where we have some building work done, we will be going back to our original room. So if you can hear our voices bouncing off the room, please bear with us for the next number of weeks. We will get there. We hope you are well.
Leya:It's an intimate gig
Reverend Ben Cooper:its sweaty.
Leya:But no we would just call it an intimate gig. It's like a Rolling Stones or some other great awesome yeah, like stadium band suddenly go into play Ronnie Scott's
Reverend Ben Cooper:that's what we're doing this you brought out a Ronnie Scott's the Jesus podcast where we want to say thank you for joining us all the way through lockdown and many months to come as we continue to record these podcasts. And wherever you are across the world. We just want to thank you to all the listeners on Spotify buzzsprout on all the other platforms that we are using. Thank you so much for the few 1000 downloads we've had now, which is really really great. Over 3000 over these Yeah, it's good stuff. It's good stuff. We thank you so much for listening wherever you are today. And we have an interesting word and the word is
Leya:worthy.
Reverend Ben Cooper:worthy.
Leya:Are you worthy?
Reverend Ben Cooper:Are you worthy?
Leya:Are you worthy?
Reverend Ben Cooper:Are you No,
Leya:No, I'm not.
Reverend Ben Cooper:I'm far from worthy.
Leya:Yeah. So the word is
Reverend Ben Cooper:can I ask you a question? Or you go before you go? Before you start? Yeah. The drop dead rod? Did God drop that word in your thoughts? just
Leya:about to say that? Oh, God did drop that word. It dropped it dropped it like it was hot. So, yeah, yesterday, we came out of church. And on a Sunday, I was like to think I asked God, what's the word? Was we gonna do what we're gonna do on Monday? And it's just been resonating with me for a while. And it was like, Yes, you're gonna do this one. Where they were they were they were the nurse. Because I've been listening to a few podcasts lately.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Okay.
Leya:And there's some really famous, illustrious, successful people whose, yeah, who were being interviewed in Okay, cars, and all of them said, I'm waiting to be found out. I'm waiting for people to realize that I'm a fraud. And I'm not worthy of the fame. The success that I've got. I'm not really an actor. Not really a singer. I'm just pretending.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Wow.
Leya:Yeah. And I was speaking to somebody again today at work. And they said the same thing though. They had been given some. Yeah, they've been given some not praise, God praise but they've been given some good feedback on some work that they did. And they were saying I feel I don't feel like I'm worthy of this
Reverend Ben Cooper:im really interested in what you're saying here because I feel that a lot
Leya:of what I'm saying I feel like a lot of Christians feel that
Reverend Ben Cooper:because the price what has been paid this is how I look at this. The price of Calvary of cross of Christ died on the cross for me. I'm not I actually I actually can't articulate this I actually can't how I feel. I feel as if someone's gonna open the door some days and go, I've got Yeah, yeah. You know what I mean? Because all the wrongs Yeah. On all the mistakes and all the living in life. You're thinking, how can how can this work? How can this invisible God, how can this God of Israel, the God that said let there be that is so holy and so pure? Yeah, decide to send His Son and die upon a cross for all humanity that are so far away from him, even when we are saved, but we are close.
Leya:And it makes you feel like an employee makes me nervous. It makes me feel like an imposter. Yeah, it makes me feel feel like am I really worthy of what the price that was paid for me?
Reverend Ben Cooper:Is this real? You feel like it's a dream someday?
Leya:Yeah.
Reverend Ben Cooper:We've got an insurance policy. And whatever car crash of life accidents im in, im covered. You know what I mean? I'm covered. Yeah, even if I choose to drive my car against a wall make the most stupid mistake in my life. Jesus. ago
Leya:you cant continuously drive that car into the wall. thats what you call her Grace, hyper
Reverend Ben Cooper:hyper Grace?
Leya:so hyper grace isn't gonna cover your that's not an insurance policy that I believe in
Reverend Ben Cooper:no, but it's difficult. How do you explain it? How do you explain this feeling that makes me and I hope many others feel almost edgy. The Bible talks about peace all the time. And no wrestle that I have, is with me most of the time, because I'm thinking, Lord, this, like, I say, the wrong thing. I do the wrong thing. I'm a motor. Malphite I make wrong decisions. I'm a human being. And I make mistake, you know, I treat people well, I treat people bad. I say the right thing I say the wrong or just a human being. And we're on our way to heaven.
Leya:gonna get to the pearly gates. And they get get No. Yeah, yeah, no, no, no.
Reverend Ben Cooper:And it's very difficult. You've really brought an interesting word to the mics today. Because it's very wide. And he helped me out by helping me out and telling me what to say. Because when you really think about it with. Yes, true. When you really think about that word, that word is a very powerful word. worthy. Yeah. All have sinned and fallen short of His glory. There is not one worthy one, but one.
Leya:Now, and yet there's that awesome did the other thing also was you posted a bit of Scripture yesterday, which was from wasn't what was from the Bible, but there's a song based on it,
Reverend Ben Cooper:the blessing of Deuteronomy,
Leya:yeah. And in that song, it sings over and over and over again, you are worthy, you are worthy, you are worthy. And at first, when you hear that you think it's, I thought, first of all, that it was about Jesus, you are worthy of my praise, you are worthy of my praise, you are worthy of my praise. But every now and then when I'm singing it, I turn it round on myself
Reverend Ben Cooper:sure. Okay,
Leya:that I am worthy. I am worthy of being here. I am worthy. And it's almost like God is singing that song to me saying you are worthy. You are loved.
Reverend Ben Cooper:unconditionally.
Leya:Exactly.
Reverend Ben Cooper:I love you unconditionally. Unconditional love that makes us worthy.
Leya:I feel like sometimes I could be walking around for my walk for a week thinking, am I worthy? Am I worthy? Am I worthy of this? Am I worthy of this?
Reverend Ben Cooper:So when you feel like that? Yeah, it makes you discomfort. You've got a bit of discomfort because it makes me
Leya:feel like prayers aren't
Reverend Ben Cooper:being heard. It's almost waiting for the next disaster to happen is you know, what am I
Leya:waiting for the other shoe to drop.
Reverend Ben Cooper:That's it. You're waiting. So you're waiting for something. And when you get to a place of Hang on a minute. This is life real. I'm forgiven, that I've got a peaceful moment at this moment in time. So that word worthy, no one's worthy but by the blood, we're worthy. And by the unconditional love, we're worthy. Yeah. So if we can look, I'm gonna read
Leya:lovely bits of beautiful scripture. And I know
Reverend Ben Cooper:I've just got one romans eight, Romans, verse eight, it is chapter five, Romans, chapter five, verse eight, it says, You have I know you would have but God shows us His love. For all of us while we were still sinners, Christ died for us
Leya:while we were still sinners.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Now you can't work that one out. you unpack that for me. But God show Yeah. So let's break it down. Let's do a bit of expository work. Oh. It's a bit bit heavy,
Leya:expository,
Reverend Ben Cooper:expository. It says there but God showed was
Leya:expository
Reverend Ben Cooper:expository. Sorry, right, john 316, as well because this this comes into this as well. Now I know it has you have to bring that in to this text. So Romans, chapter five, verse eight, but God shows God showed his love. Now we can revert and we can look at john 316. For God so loved the world that He gave His one and only Son that whosoever
Leya:believes in Him
Reverend Ben Cooper:shall not
Leya:shall live forever
Reverend Ben Cooper:no shall not perish but have everlasting life. You're nearly there. Come on. Don't say sorry. You're you're learning
Leya:the words of the song.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yeah. And you're doing really, really well. So look, so we got Romans five, verse eight, and it says that God shows his love. So we see that in john 316, For God so loved the world. For us, in that while we were still sinners, and a word sinner covers every debauchery dirty, rotten skip of a bar of a life of a mess anyone could ever be in Yeah, Christ died for us. Because it's not
Leya:us with any like, it's not asked with any caveats. There's no us if we could
Reverend Ben Cooper:just know this, there's no strings attached.
Leya:But if we believe us if we don't believe that sentence there, says for us, while we were still sinners,
Reverend Ben Cooper:now, isn't it interesting how the Bible, when it speaks, it speaks all the time. But when, when you clearly hear in the text that would look in in wherever you are, and wherever you are, it brings you and all of humanity like larious, and it doesn't put a class layer in any level of the Scripture, All have sinned and fallen short with glory, oh, always saved while you still sinners, Christ died for us, for all all of us. It never makes, or it pinpoints an individual out for salvation. He never makes a distinction never makes a distinction, right? The only time we see that is when Christ is having a clear conversation with someone and that's and there's a dialogue going on, obviously, between the two. But when we look at the majority of the Scripture, I just don't know how it does it. Because the more you read the Bible, the more you study, the more you ask God to go deeper. And the more he reveals. And that text that we've read so many times just keeps exploding. Exactly. It keeps the second I don't even like use the word continuum. Like it just it just catered and not even going to use a word evolve. I can't stand I can't do that work that don't do that. What is the right word? When you think of God's word,
Leya:it appropriates itself to us in whatever.
Reverend Ben Cooper:It's growing
Leya:crisis we're in?
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yeah.
Leya:Because I do feel like we go for emotional crisis is yes, Ace, Ace, Ace, Ace, Ace, Ace, before we week of going, am I worthy of this? Am I worthy of this? Am I worthy of this? And then God will go is a word
Reverend Ben Cooper:Bang.
Leya:Yeah. And then I on a Monday, sit and go through looking at the Bible, what's to do with the word and then I'll find the thing that is going to help me for the next week. And I'm sure that's the way other people, other people, I've got the luxury of sitting opposite. You did a wonderful podcast, oh, well done about you know, I'm sure that that's the way that for people working that they have the need for words to be dropped into them. And they Yeah. And then it answers whatever.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Emotional. It's so interesting, that you've brought a word to the table, and that word has just opened up. So much conversation, and then when you start diving into the Scripture, it just started it just keeps exploding, doesn't it? It just keeps exploding. You know, john 316, Romans five, verse eight.
Leya:I've got this lovely bit in one Corinthians 11, which is an such for some of you, but you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of Lord Jesus Christ. And by the Spirit of God, not you, sitting on that chair doing this u haul of humanity is there's so many beautiful pieces of Scripture, which are all about oh Ephesians 210 Yeah, we are His workmanship created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them. So and he knows the plans he's got for us. I'm going through my list here.
Reverend Ben Cooper:That's good. We got a good list is a good list. But we're not
Leya:able to give you a few and hope so. Our This is one this is my this is my one that I was looking for as I was flicking through 139 13 to 14 Yeah. For you formed my inward parts. You knitted me together in my mother's womb. So that's it. We're we're happy. He can't appreciate you for I'm fearfully and wonderfully made wonderful are your works, and my soul knows it very well. And I am one of those works. So that means I'm wonderful. Which means that I'm worthy because God made me
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yeah, no, but when we say are wonderfully and fearfully made in the world, it's like blowing your own trumpet, isn't it? I'm great. I'm great. I'm great. Yeah, it's the benny Show. I'm lovely. I'm wonderful. I'm all good. I'm all grand perfect.
Leya:I've always used it as a way to remind myself to have patience and be more sort of like what would Jesus do? Do you know I mean,
Reverend Ben Cooper:yeah,
Leya:so sometimes I'll be in a really stressful situation are now just chant tonight not chant a whisper to myself.
Reverend Ben Cooper:I know but if any, if anyone would always biggin themselves out there. A lot to do. They're always
Leya:mum does it to me now
Reverend Ben Cooper:does she
Leya:she said she if she knows that she can see my like patients whining Yeah, if my art of my eye starts twitching, to say, You're wonderful and carefully made, and they will just kill me.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Thanks, mommy. Galatians two Galatians two, Chapter 20 I've been crucified with Christ. It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me and the life. I now live in the flesh. I live by faith in a son of God, whom loved me and gave me himself for me. There's so much depth in that. I've been crucified with Christ, as a bit heavy. But then it says it is no longer I who live but Christ who lives in May born again. Born Again, yeah, filled with the Holy Spirit. Yeah, less than highly favored,
Leya:and then humbled, completely humbled by the fact that he did that for me. And that makes me feel, am I worthy? Am I worthy? Am I worthy? Am I worthy? But then yes, I am. Because he did it for me knowing that I was at center. I
Reverend Ben Cooper:think what I think what it what it comes down to as well as the power of the Holy Spirit brings us under conviction, as well as his grace and His mercy. So when we might be sinning, and we might be living a little bit we the power of the Holy Spirit to slight gently draws us. But try not to laugh a little bit what
Leya:it does, it draws us
Reverend Ben Cooper:that you are worthy, you are worthy, you are worthy of salvation, we're worthy. With that, but you can be shown for your work.
Leya:And you can make that effort to live the life that you need to live and make the decisions that you need to live because you're worthy of making those decisions are worthy of being kind to yourself.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yeah, gotta be careful of arrogance and pride definitely because if we keep going on great and blessed and blessed um, you know, you got there's a line isn't there because you've got to say, right, Lord, keep me humble. I thank you for the blood of Jesus, I thank you that I am saved that I'm a child of the living God. But actually, I'm worthy because of the blood of Jesus. And it's an area I don't like going into because it's a fine you know, the paper line between the name it and claim it and jumping up and down crazy and actually going on maybe a finer am I'm right, I'm great. And that that's the difference, isn't it? So we don't hear many messages, actually many preachers teaching on the, you're worthy simply because of the blood of Jesus. But then the scriptures also say a wretched man, am I
Leya:yeah. But that's the one thing that we discuss quite a lot. On a Sunday, I see you still put your hands up in the air is voisins. up in a while we used to when we were doing the online Bible, a lot of us would constantly discuss the idea of how can we possibly be worthy of the grace of God and of Christ? How can we possibly be worthy of that? Yeah. And I think that's the thing we are I know that I'm worthy. Because Jesus died for me, and God says I'm worthy. And that's why I question it the whole time. Because I got Yeah, being worthy. And being the best thing since sliced bread aren't the same thing.
Reverend Ben Cooper:No, yeah. It's tricky and worthy
Leya:of being saved is very, very different. I've got a nice bit of luke, can I just read it to ya? Yeah, and
Reverend Ben Cooper:then I'll crack on with Ephesians.
Leya:So it's Luke 12, six to seven? are not five sparrows sold for two pennies? And not one of them is forgotten before God? Why, even as the hairs of your head are all numbered, fear not. This is about fear not you will have more value than many sparrows. Wow.
Reverend Ben Cooper:So praise God
Leya:knows all the little sparrows. He knows all the lilies, he knows everything. He knows everything. And he knows every hair on your head,
Reverend Ben Cooper:praise God. He loves us unconditionally. God, He loves us unconditionally. Ephesians chapter two, verse 10. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them too much for maybe a day is too big.
Leya:One Corinthians 620. You were bought with a price. So glorify God in your body. Oh, that's where we're getting all
Reverend Ben Cooper:this. today. We're going above again from
Leya:being worthy. Yeah, to live in a life of worthiness,
Reverend Ben Cooper:then comes into the arena holiness.
Leya:Well, are you working? Are you holy if you're working?
Reverend Ben Cooper:God, I'm not holy. No. But he says Be holy because I am holy.
Leya:I live a holy life. Right.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Let's let's analyze it a little bit. Yeah. So just by saying we're worthy. And we are His children. Yeah, automatically in the arena of conversation, comes all the other major factors of that, which is, he says, Be Christ like,
Leya:yes, that's where we go in now Christ.
Reverend Ben Cooper:So if I'm Christ, like, and I accept that I am worthy, and I'm doing my earthly best to live by him. Right, then I adopt because it's been given holiness, you can't buy holiness, holiness. But then I think I can't do it. Okay, this is too This is too. This is too white and shiny for me. Yes, this white and shiny stuff you're getting in the real holy glory. And then
Leya:that's the thing the difference between religion Yeah, and following Jesus, because we know following Jesus was a man. Yeah. And don't know what journey that's a religious concept, isn't it?
Reverend Ben Cooper:Paul could tell you about sonko white and shot is not name isn't white and shiny in a book of Revelation. When you look at john, so there's a clear understanding of the greatness of the set the one like the Son of man standing in the midst of john on the island of Patmos, when he, when he seen when he was called up on the Lord's Day, and he was called up how enter of the earth in the spirit. And it was taken into that place. And he, he see the one like the Son of Man, and the brightness, his brilliance was so strong, he couldn't, couldn't wait couldn't see because he is God. And Jesus, Yes, hi, ba, ba, ba, ba, Jesus says, Be like me, and be like, you can't be if we be like him,
Leya:I can reflect a little bit of Jesus.
Reverend Ben Cooper:But let's a little bit of him react when he says be wholly, he expects us to what does he mean? Not I'm a B, A, B, A, B. Black? Not the Black Eyed Peas. I'm talking about what is beaming? The when when he says, No, B, B, it means the bit to do exist to do to do so when Jesus says, Be Christ like, Oh, come on scripture to
Leya:tell you.
Reverend Ben Cooper:What about a black IPS?
Leya:Yeah, it's Philip. Patients Philippians, four, eight to nine, says finally brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just whatever is pure, whatever is lovely. Whatever is commendable. If there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things. What you have learned and received and heard and seen in May practice these things. And the God of peace will be with you. The God of Black Eyed Peas, will be revealed. He is the God of Black Eyed Peas. The God of me, is some tool that tells you that gives you It gives you a nice little list of like, just do good things just be good.
Reverend Ben Cooper:But that's hard. This is visitors dates me a day. This is too much. I feel quite mucky. Do you feel better Marquis in your skills? I feel you thinking I'm not worthy. That's what I mean. That's what I'm the more you look at it
Leya:how many christians do you know, the people that are perhaps faith? Curious, but aren't Christians? Yeah. Found? aligned together with Jay? Yeah. And they will look at the church and the way that the church are and the way that yes, we talk about five sometimes I think I'm not worthy. That's really deep. not worthy of that. I'm not worthy of thinking of being holy. I'll go down the pub every week. Yeah. I'm homeless person. I'm armor. This armor that armor Gambler, a drunk gambler? I'm a drinker. I also know he things not all the way read the newspaper, newspaper for politicians. That didn't mean that I didn't
Reverend Ben Cooper:read that. You vote Tory I do know must be really mucky.
Leya:I don't vote labour either. So just so you know, I don't I don't affiliate with any political party on this podcast.
Reverend Ben Cooper:This is what I wouldn't tell you. But Boris, I don't. I know you like, Boris.
Leya:See, this is not worthy. I can't keep my mouth shut about things like that. know that we were sinners at the beginning.
Reverend Ben Cooper:So isn't it interesting that the Scripture is is so pure and so right, that no one can actually get Yeah. All right, it is at the beginning and falling short of His glory. So there is no one on earth that themselves to Holy state. Yeah, exactly. Because we are carnal can what you can't work out your set. You can't buy your because we are continuously flawed. Continually flawed is only by grace, you are saved the gift of grace, the gift of salvation salvation. God didn't say it like this cuz I'm going to say it like my lingo. There are a mucky lot down there. dirty lot down there.
Leya:But some people, there are some people that are in religion that think that about people, yes, they're too mucky for this church. They're too mucky for this faith. They're too mucky. And that's not right.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Them Pentecostals down the road.
Leya:Jesus died for your sins, and God so loved you that he sent his only son for you.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Praise the Lord.
Leya:lets you know that you can say to those people who are judging you,
Reverend Ben Cooper:yeah. What what back give you I may be army say.
Leya:You can say to people that are judging you that they're not worthy either. Because none of us are. And it lets you know that you've got the backbone of Jesus in you with that.
Reverend Ben Cooper:But the more I think this conversation that we're having is, is very relevant to anyone that wants more Jesus, because the more you want him, the more your mind, and your processing and your thinking and your understanding of this natural world pushes you further away in your mind, not not from your heart. But what I'm just trying to work out is the more that you want him, the more you feel that you're not worthy, but you are worthy. And suddenly you realize that even me I can't walk on a pulpit today. I'm so lucky this weekend, I can't even get to holy I'm gonna explode. I said, you know what I mean, I know exactly what it is. It's like an upside down kingdom, isn't it? Yeah, the more you want him, he doesn't make us feel Marquis. It's the mind and the overthinking because He loves us unconditionally. And we were saved by grace. So grace means it's it. When you talk about Grace, Grace is just unconditional grace just simply means that you don't deserve it. But I'm going to give you anyway. And you know, but so all these big words, Grace, sanctification, purification, salvation, of words, big words, because because when you unpack that word, if you if you look at favor, favor, x is an extension of grace, which basically meant party favors that and I was thinking,
Leya:chocolate eggs.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Being spiritual girl, I'm really on late, on Jesus loves you. But when you look at Grace, and the word favor, they run together. favor when you understand what that word means unconditional giving, of salvation that you don't deserve. It will just it's like a waterfall you His grace and his power and his mercy and His salvation is so strong. It's like the Niagara Falls, it will keep running and running, and it will push you over. Yeah, it's too strong. It's too much for the human mind. Just
Leya:when, if he just went, hey, you're saved forever, I love you forever. You wouldn't question it. Right, is the fact that he's suffered so terribly. For me, that makes me feel that I'm not worthy of that.
Reverend Ben Cooper:And another interesting thing is that we work in pretty hard areas, don't we? We do here. So we met with some lovely characters, actually, you know, I mean, in the in the big in an umbrella scheme of things, maybe not in our own departments. Yes. But you know what I mean, in the umbrella, I do see, yeah, you know, I mean, in the umbrella of the world, the workplace, man, and then you have to come back and talk about Jesus and you have to get into church, it can be very difficult Connect because that the atmosphere that we may have been in, or we might have experienced certain days can be quite heavy. And the language can be quite great sometimes. And sometimes they trade into Hebrew language I've heard sometimes
Leya:that language can be as your blue
Reverend Ben Cooper:and, and your loving Christ and you walk with him and but the Bible is so beautiful, it says Go into all the world go into it, but don't be part of it. So Christ knows that we got to go into hard areas of, of workplace issues of skirmishes and then we had to we deal with Brother Chris, look at brother Chris where he works. He does what he does. Yeah, brother Chris
Leya:goes into areas in play music for people to dance to, is all about Christ. Yeah. And he goes into some areas,
Reverend Ben Cooper:dark, dark, dark area. But then we come back And that's why I find it difficult. to that scripture isn't me, Romans five, verse eight, while we were still sinners. So Christ is in that workplace because I was a sinner without Christ once in that workplace, I'm still a sinner, but I've got Christ, because all have sinned and fallen short of glory will never be completely purified until we get to glory, until this earth suit changes. So, as a believer, and I do want to see believe that God is calling a lot of people, a lot masses of people to be more holy, and to be more Christ like not in the sense of wearing socks and sandals, as the church would put you out to be, but to really walk with him. But to walk with him in a nation, for man is hard. And do you think that with feeling the strain of being a believer, I do I know there's people out there? Yeah, I'm a Christian, and everything's great and wonderful. Well, I think you have to question your salvation. Because when you look at the text that we pull up, week after week, and time after time, I know we got a few weeks off a summer, one thing and another. But when you look at these words today, where are they? Where are they? No one is worthy. No one is worthy. The greatest preacher on planet Earth is not worthy. It's super clean and super pure. She's not there is no one worthy. No, no one it no one no one's great. And isn't it interesting that no one is greater than anybody else? The Bible puts it that we are all human beings. Exactly. And we are boys and girls. Yeah, that's it. Yeah. We are all children. Yeah, sons or daughters. That's it. Yeah, there is no hierarchy layer, like religious
Leya:life as well as the way that God the Bible often talks about nature and us in the same sentence. Definitely. So the idea that the hairs on your head are numbered, and also he named the stars in the sky that talks about the birds and talks about us in the same sentence.
Reverend Ben Cooper:And what about what it says where we come from, from the dust of the earth? We were created. Yeah, think of that dust.
Leya:where he is that dust? dust to dust?
Reverend Ben Cooper:Ashes to ashes dust to dust Genesis. Yeah, so that so when people put in one from Genesis Ah, so when all the old Vickers with the one tooth and all that do the funerals,
Leya:dust to dust, dust to dust, Ashes to ashes
Reverend Ben Cooper:that is not a Church of England or Catholicism or a denominational hashtag strapline that comes from Genesis that comes out of that if
Leya:that didn't make you realize what you are
Reverend Ben Cooper:Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Yeah, so that is in Genesis, and the text actually escaped my thinking at the minute.
Leya:Okay, but right. We're gonna go back to dust. Well, we're gonna go to glory. Great big h in the sky. Not action steps, but one man's gonna have just like a really good like art creativity studio. And
Reverend Ben Cooper:yeah, anyway, anyway,
Leya:we were made from dust, we go into dust. bodies or go into dust. We've got this brief moment of time. Yes, you know, the universe is ever expanding the stars that he named are ever expanding. He knows or has in our head. And yet he died for us because we're sinners. That's right. That's, that should make you feel more worthy, and less of an imposter than anything else.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Amen.
Leya:Because that, that's God saying, you've got your place. You've got your place. In my Father's house as a place for me, praise the Lord about that song. And I think that's what I'm trying to get. What was put in me to say in this podcast was you worthy, you are worthy. You're worthy of giving yourself the effort to live a more worthy life. You're worthy of their love. You're worthy. You don't have to know the Bible inside and out. No, you don't have to be somebody that dresses the best. You don't have to be somebody to listen to other people's judgement of you. You just have to believe, just believe, just believe and let Jesus love you.
Reverend Ben Cooper:That's correct. Now.
Leya:You better let Jesus love you.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yeah. Because the more you let him love you, and the more you let him in them, it could have an opposite effect that we're talking about you, you almost feel that you're distant from him because you feel we're not worthy. We feel that we're unclaimed. Yeah, we feel because His Holiness, and if Colin is so pure, and so great,
Leya:and you're examining your own life under that might just flesh under the light that it's refracted from Jesus, from the pure a of Jesus and the love of God. That's how we inspect our lives. You're under that microscope. And that's hard. Yeah, that is a hard. It's impossible. Yeah, it's impossible.
Reverend Ben Cooper:This. I can't I actually can't live up to what this Bible says. I just can't do it.
Leya:But I feel like I can't live up to the sacrifice that Jesus made as well. That's the thing. I can't live up to the fact that he knew he knew. And the moment he was born, yeah. Well see, nothing is born. He moved in a moment was great. It is going to happen. And he was going to do it for us.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Yeah. Right in Ephesians, chapter three, verse 20. It just confirming what we're talking about before we just spoke about what you spoke about. So going back five minutes, Ephesians chapter three, verse 20. It says, all go to the same place. all come from dust, and to the dust I will also return and also in Genesis, it talks about hours, correct. So So we've come to night, Larry was talking about nature. We have been created for him and by him. So if if we have been created for him, and by him, he knew that we were going to be marquee.
Leya:He made it he made inerts the DNA,
Reverend Ben Cooper:the eyeballs that we look at things he made our eyes, he made us give us the ears.
Leya:He knows he knows why he does what? He knew that we were going to be dented. Yeah.
Reverend Ben Cooper:What did he say to the three stooges? In other words, don't betray disciples, in the garden of guests, Emily, I'm going to go over him pray, watch and pray you do not fall into temptations three times he told them, he could have plucked any other word out, watch and pray that you do not fall into temptation. He knows he know everything at the beginning. It just blows my little pee out yet.
Leya:And yet the thing that makes me feel like being worthy is attainable.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Is that even he had his moment of doubt in that garden? Yeah. If possible times if it is possible. Yeah. That's probably the one place we see Christ in His for humanity in his vocabulary, if it is possible.
Leya:So if he can have a moment of doubt, then I can have a moment of doubt. And now I'm trying to be like him. It's not it's not
Reverend Ben Cooper:this impossible. This conversation, isn't it? Yeah. It's a human. And it's Yeah, it's a deep conversation that sprung from a word worthy that we use all day, long day, all day long. But it's quite a showstopper as in it's really making you think, and it really makes you think about holiness, purity, sanctification, justification, and Christ ology studying Christ when you study Christ, you realize how far I am away but are not not far. Because greater is He that is me than he that is in the world. So if I feel far, it's only because I feel far. I'm not far because he's living in a nice part of us. Yeah. And he is
Leya:and makes me feel good. But
Reverend Ben Cooper:then but then the Bible says that listen to this one, then we are grafted in with grafted into sonship. just as we come to land, I'm going to drop this one on our lap this morning. Five minutes about five minutes Come on, the Bible says that we are grafted in. We are grossed out to be grafted in you know, skin graft. Yeah, yeah. Or tradecraft or trait Yeah, whatever. Yeah. Think about that.
Leya:assimilate don't Yeah. So you flow
Reverend Ben Cooper:together you
Leya:What's your sonship thing, but I'm really confused.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Too deep we get we're gonna have egg and chips. Another day, but let's just leave literally is thinking about that. We are grafted in. We are broke, weak, we are not worthy. But because he's not worthy. We're not worthy. But he is grafted as we are grafted in he has. He has brought us in you know, he's, he's he's brought us to a place
Leya:I've gotten as Asians to enjoy, but I just
Reverend Ben Cooper:wanted to tissue such a day come.
Leya:We were saying
Reverend Ben Cooper:the old chair, normally. Yeah,
Leya:we haven't even mentioned maltesers or cake. No.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Where's your lemon drizzle friend. Oh,
Leya:she got baptized yesterday. Well,
Reverend Ben Cooper:hopefully they get my cake wet. Graduation God, cashews lemon drizzle.
Leya:Yes. We love my family. They all got baptized. Two kids and her husband were baptized.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Do they look like cake? No, they look like human beings. I can just imagine a cake being baptized
Leya:god
Reverend Ben Cooper:why do we call it lemon drizzle
Leya:cuz she made the most amazing lemon drizzle cake.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Fair enough.
Leya:But now I'm gluten free forever.
Reverend Ben Cooper:does she do that?
Leya:No, But yes, when I left when I went to leave church, I checked in the back and there's a piece of cake. Gluten Free on lactose free waiting for me
Reverend Ben Cooper:feather free, animal free.
Leya:It was awesome. I mean, I haven't eaten at all yet taste free. Now it wasn't taste free.
Reverend Ben Cooper:what we talked about.
Leya:I wanted to just say this thing of being worthy. And the thing about Jesus avenues little doubt moment in the garden wasn't little it was big, that moment. That lets me know that Jesus went to heaven, Jesus had a doubt a moment of doubt that the plan was, you know, and he went to heaven, He ascended to heaven. That lets me know that if I have a moment of doubt, I can ascend to heaven, which lets me know that I am worthy. And there is not a bit of the Bible that is unintentional. That's right. I believe. Everything that you read in that Bible is
Reverend Ben Cooper:intended. It's it's a tale of load this Jesus Father in heaven, this is this is the tape conversation. Even though we just can't afford who's gonna sit and have a mantra on our sausage and chips as we went through, you know what I think God is really like driving. And the more you want him, the more you feel you're not worthy, but you are worthy. Because we're grafted in, like the wild olive tree when you look at Israel, and as the Bible talks about Israel, Israel is grafted in and, and when you come all the way through, with joint heirs with AI, it just is too much for me
Leya:too much. But let me
Reverend Ben Cooper:bring us the land
Leya:Ephesians one, four, give Leia more cake, no says even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him in love. So he chose us before the word was created, and we will be holy and blameless before him. In love,
Reverend Ben Cooper:he chose us before we were created, yeah, then we were created. Then we was living, living in sin. While we're living in sin, Romans five verse eight. He chose for unconditional love to save us to set us free while we were sinners. So he created brought into being we lived far apart from him. He know that. But he still chose to draw us in why we're still sending or put your date. Put your chips in a gun. We're going we're out of here see too much. And I look we've got two minutes. We've got two minutes. Well, brothers and sisters, ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls, horses and cats and dogs, wherever you are across the world today. It's been a long stretch because that word has really it has really resonated in my heart. I gotta be honest, it's really not not me back. But it's made me really think deep made it really
Leya:basic scripture to go through but like you know,
Reverend Ben Cooper:when you talk about worthiness, you talk about holiness, you talk about salvation, sanctification, Revelation or knowledge that can only be revealed just by him judgment. rough but everyone's worthy of his rough buddies love. rough, rough rough rough. Rough. Roth w. r a. t.
Leya:Heaven, Hutchins guy.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Ah, oh, yeah, sorry. Yeah, my vocabulary absolutely atrocious. Well, we are off to the caf. We are going to have double egg and chips bacon.
Leya:I can have bacon beans, gluten free sausage, no beans for me but less than gluten free fried bread plays and double egg
Reverend Ben Cooper:Bubble them on now. What? bubble and squeak Yeah, I don't know if it's a matte black putting Bubble Bubble bubble on that bubble with a cup of tea cup of tea black coffee a dummy okay we're off to the cafe we're going to go into Jesus bus we're gonna have the windows dancing in the black eyed peas and we're gonna sing it out for the big man upstairs, im a b, im a be, I'm saved and washed in the blood of Jesus absolutely children of the living God. And wherever you are across across across planet Earth. Just remember there is nothing that will stop his love from getting to you. Yeah, it's nothing is there
Leya:no let him love you.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Just let him do it and dont keep running. Let it mean don't be a Jonah. Don't be a Jonah, we thank you wherever you are today. You've been listening to me and my name is leya. And leyas name is
Leya:Reverend Ben
Reverend Ben Cooper:Cooper. We're all mixed up. This is really fresh off the pedal today. Have a great Saturday, wherever you are. whatever your name is. Just remember. You love you. You're worthy. You're worthy. You are worthy of my praise. You can catch us on buzzsprout
Leya:Spotify.
Reverend Ben Cooper:I Heart Radio,
Leya:Facebook,
Reverend Ben Cooper:Insta,
Leya:gram,
Reverend Ben Cooper:gram and the cafe. God bless.
Leya:Yeah, the cafe our price HMV Virgin Records.
Reverend Ben Cooper:Crimewatch
Leya:gramophone at your Nan's? Yeah, crimewatch.
Reverend Ben Cooper:sir. Have a great day. God bless we love you all. Thank you so much for being with us, and staying with this little bit of a ramble. And that word was worthy. God bless.
Close:Thank you for listening to Elim church swanleys latest podcast. You can find us on buzzsprout Spotify, Apple Music iHeartRadio Google Play Alexa, mixcloud, Facebook, Instagram and YouTube.