Reverend Ben Cooper's Podcast
Reverend Ben Coopers podcast, offers an inviting space for listeners to explore Christianity and spiritual growth with wisdom, humor, and a deep commitment to biblical truth. Through Rev. Ben's engaging conversations with guests, the podcast not only explores the timeless wisdom of the Bible but also tackles the pressing issues of life, faith, and hope in a way that is accessible, thought-provoking, and enriching. Whether you’re seeking spiritual nourishment, answers to life’s big questions, or simply a place to reflect on your faith, the Rev Ben podcast is a valuable resource on your journey.
In each episode, Rev. Ben guides listeners through profound theological reflections, personal stories, and practical insights drawn from the Bible and the broader Christian tradition.
Reverend Ben Cooper's Podcast
C3 - Devoted Life: Encouraged in the Struggle: (PBC@014)
Title: Encouraged in the Struggle – Finding Strength Through Faith and Community
Life can feel heavy—and sometimes, faith can feel like a fight. But what if the very act of encouraging one another was the secret to rising above our trials and staying grounded in Christ? In this powerful episode, we uncover the transformative power of encouragement in your spiritual walk and how it connects us more deeply to God and each other.
Through real conversations, personal stories, and biblical insight, we explore the journey of figures like Jacob, who remind us that even wrestling with faith is part of the process. Struggles aren’t a sign of weakness—they’re part of how God shapes, refines, and strengthens us.
We also dive into the importance of community, especially in seasons of discouragement. You’ll hear stories of resilience, raw truth about facing internal battles, and heartfelt reflections that will remind you you’re not alone. When we share our experiences, our faith grows stronger—not just for us, but for those around us.
One of the key themes of this episode is love as action—not just a feeling. We talk about how choosing to love, forgive, and uplift others is a powerful force that multiplies joy, renews hope, and restores perspective. Encouraging others starts with learning how to encourage ourselves in the Lord, just as David did in Scripture.
You’ll be invited to think about your own journey: Where do you need encouragement? How can you become a source of light for someone else? Through every challenge, you are being shaped—not broken. The Word of God offers daily encouragement that can anchor you, uplift you, and remind you of your identity in Christ.
Whether you’re dealing with disappointment, emotional fatigue, or spiritual dryness, this episode creates a space for hope and restoration. Together, we explore how speaking life and standing in faith can transform the hardest moments into turning points.
Listen in, reflect deeply, and be reminded: You are seen. You are valued. And you are never walking this journey alone. Share this episode with someone who needs a lift today, and let’s grow stronger together—one word of encouragement at a time.
Christian encouragement podcast, how to stay strong in faith, biblical story of Jacob struggle, uplifting others in hard times, love as a spiritual action, self-encouragement through Scripture, podcast about resilience and hope, spiritual community support, daily Bible encouragement, faith in difficult seasons, Christian podcast for inspiration, finding strength in God’s Word
https://www.pastorbencooper.co.uk/
https://www.rbchristianradio.net/
Thank you. We thank you so much for joining us. It's Mark and myself as we gather across the mics. Me and Mark have had a few weeks off of the mics, you know from capturing each other. We've been seeing each other about here, there and everywhere, but we are just going to have a good old rumble and a chat again. So, wherever you are tonight, we thank god for your lives. Whatever you are doing, god is with you. Wherever you are, god is in your territory, because every place that the soul of your foot shall tread upon is your territory and god is with you. So all is well.
Speaker 1:We want to bring you some encouragement this evening. Across the mic, our brother has got a great scripture. He's going to read the scripture out in a moment. So the title this evening is encouragement, and we need to encourage one another with strong biblical, foundational words. God is with you and god is shaping every one of us. Welcome everyone. We thank you so much for joining us this evening here on this podcast, as we rest, as we be still, as we wrestle with the scriptures of the living word and we say shine your light, lord. Let your light shine on us tonight, lord. Let your glory shine in us today, wherever we are across this world. We thank you to everyone that is listening in jesus name, amen, mark. Good evening, my friend good evening, ben.
Speaker 2:How are you today good?
Speaker 1:to see you too, my friend yeah, yeah, it's.
Speaker 2:Uh, it's always a pleasure to be in your in the lord's house it's cold outside, but it's uh it's cold it's warm within hallelujah.
Speaker 1:You know the lord is with you, my friend, and it's so good to see you. Thank you for for taking time out of your busy life to come and chat about the Lord and share what God has placed on your heart. This evening, as we just wrestle with the Word of God and I mean wrestle in the most politest and most respectful way and my take on that comes from that great man, that great one that we look at, jacob. You know, when he wrestled with God, he said I'm not gonna go until you bless me. I'm not gonna let you go. I'm not gonna let you go, god. And I believe that's where we are today. God, I can't let you go because I can't come out of this wrestle. I want to hold on to you, I want to hold deep around you, lord, I want to put my arm, I want to hold on, lord, and not let you go, because, lord, if I let go, I don't know what the consequences might be. I don't know what's going to happen to me.
Speaker 1:But do you know what the Bible says? Walk by faith. Wherever you are this evening, walk by faith, be encouraged by the word of God. And you wrestle with the Lord, you wrestle with the scripture, you turn it over and meditate on it day and night. Let the word work in you and around you and within you, and let the Holy Spirit minister to you wherever you are. Remember you are unique, you are blessed. You are not a number. You are not a number like the government recognizes you as a taxpayer, as a commodity. You are a son and you are a daughter. And encourage yourself. If you've got no one around you this evening, encourage yourself the Lord, just as David did.
Speaker 1:At that particular point it says David encouraged himself in the Lord and God said chase your enemy, pursue your enemy, overtake your enemy, take back every piece that is rightfully yours and I I say that to Mark and myself and everyone tonight. Wherever you are, pursue the enemy, take back what the devil has stolen and remind yourself who you are. In Christ Jesus, you are a warrior, you are blessed and you are a son and you are a daughter and you are gifted. So true, mark in it. Sometimes we need to remind ourselves who we are, not in the way of bigging ourselves up and blowing ourselves up to be supermen and women, but literally just go hang a minute. I'm a son and I'm a daughter.
Speaker 2:I'm blessed. Well, a born again believer shouldn't be a proud person. I think. Knowing the Lord, it's a humbling experience, very humbling, and we all go through our own individual trials.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:We're afflicted. But when Job was afflicted he said the Lord has given, the Lord has taken away. He didn't say the devil has taken away.
Speaker 1:The Lord has given.
Speaker 2:And the Lord has taken away.
Speaker 1:That's a big scripture, isn't it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, when you think about it, when you've lost everything.
Speaker 1:The Lord has given me all this and the lord has taken this yeah, not the devil no, the devil has no power.
Speaker 1:That's that's really important. It's just all smoke and mirrors. But why do we? Why do we or not we? But why do people? Why do us me even? Why do we think that he's got all this power and authority? Well, he hasn't even. Why do we think that he's got all this power and authority? Well, he hasn't nothing compared. He's just all all noise and energy and and puffs and smokes and all that sort of stuff. Well, we are blessed, aren't we?
Speaker 2:we are safe in the arms of jesus we are, but sometimes we can be so prone to listening to the devil, who disguises himself as an angel of light and he does and uh, yeah, he, he hasn't got authority over us, but he can certainly try to rob, to try and trigger us to try and trigger something that might lead us to something, a fault that leads to an action.
Speaker 1:That, lord, I need repentance, lord, in the company it comes across, because I had a thought, the thought turned to the action, the deed done. Oh Lord, why did I do that? You know, being a believer and a human being, oh, my Lord, you know it's about enduring and walking with Jesus and trusting, and I do believe, mark, I think we might be right in saying this, that we need to encourage one another. 't we that we need to encourage one another, every christian, we need to encourage one another because we're living at gruesome times yeah, certainly you need fellowship with other believers and you need a prayer life and you need to be getting your spiritual meat yes somehow um, sadly, even in my experience it seems like going to churches and trying to find a message, trying to get fed.
Speaker 2:Almost seems like you're being fed a scrap.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And for me, yeah, I think.
Speaker 1:I want more. I want more Jesus.
Speaker 2:I want more. But you know, you just have, like the Israelites collecting the manna, I think you just have to go and collect the scraps and you just have to gather it in.
Speaker 1:Gather it in and feast on it, and it's so important that we do feast on it. The Bible is really clear, very, very clear. Faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word of God. I wonder, when we look at the church and we talk about encouraging encouraging each other the church encourages us to be almost a super person, doesn't it? Do you understand what I mean? There's this fine line within so many areas of church where it will encourage you, with a motivational educator from the pulpit that is very well learned and very well schooled and a very professional deliverer of a message. But what is it doing? Is it encouraging me as the flesh me, or is it encouraging me as the spiritual me? Is it giving me what my itching ears want to hear? That you are this super champion that you are because you can take all these scriptures and you can manipulate it, can't you?
Speaker 1:yeah you can. You can hear a great, you could almost say a motivational message about the fleshly me, but not dealing with the, the idiosyncrasies, the crucial things, things that need to be dealt with in my life. When I deal with me, I'm actually being encouraged the more I dig in me. Lord, take me to the cross. I want to lean into Jesus. There's a fine line isn't there in church? Because we hear a lot of encouraging stuff. But is it encouraging me as the Christian or is it encouraging me as the human me?
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's right. Yeah, it can certainly be a question of what is being fed, and is it just a knowledge that just goes into your head?
Speaker 1:I mean, I've seen it and puffs us up.
Speaker 2:I've seen it before in churches where, in some quite strict circles, where you know you'll be having communion, the Lord's Supper, and there'll be certain folk who will so reverently, peacefully sit and ponder things. But as soon as you walk out the doors after the service, the claws come out and there's the bitching begins.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the fighting begins.
Speaker 2:The infighting it's yeah there was a text? Where was it where Paul wrote Fightings within and without yeah, 2 Corinthians, I think?
Speaker 1:2 Corinthians. Yeah, yeah, you know we were talking about conflicts on the outside, harassment on the outside. You know attitudes and all that. And then suddenly he says but we've got fears within when he comes into Macedonia. I believe it's sitting in. Is it sitting in 2 Corinthians? 2 Corinthians, chapter 7, verse 5? You'll have to check that. It says we came into macedonia. Harassment on the outside, conflicts on the outside um, and what does it? What else does it say? Might you got it? Turn it.
Speaker 2:Read the scripture out uh, when we were coming to macedonia, a flesh had no rest but, we were troubled on every side. Without were fightings and within were fears. Nevertheless, god that comforts those that are cast down, comforted us by the coming of titus.
Speaker 1:So yeah, that's a great scripture the lord does permit trials and does permit yeah when you look at that great writer yeah the great writer of old, the great writer of the New Testament, is saying our bodies have got no rest, I'm tired, our bodies have no rest, conflicts, fighting on the outside, and then he's so open and honest and he goes and I've got fear within. That is a very encouraging scripture. Purely on the side of if Paul was feeling this, it's right for me to feel this. If Jesus was in the Garden of Gethsemane, I should feel sorrow in the Garden of Gethsemane because we are grafted in and it's encouraging sometimes to have a chat with someone and go do you know what? I am tired, I am worried, I am fearful Because if you walk in certain circles of church and certain areas of church and certain areas of church and you go into a church, people are not completely honest with themselves, as in emotions and feelings.
Speaker 1:Yeah, how are you brother? Yeah, I'm blessed, you have had a great week. The lord has. I've done this, I've done that, but actually we're going to church crying in a different way. But we're so fearful of putting the real me in the church arena because what will they say about me if I, if I say I'm really tired, I'm worried, I'm scared about israel. What's happening? I'm worried about the. What's happening in palestine I'm worried about is there going to be a world war free? What's happening to their cultures? What's happening to our work? I'm actually worried about my job, you know.
Speaker 1:I think church has got a lot to answer for. It encourages, but is it encouraging the flesh or is it encouraging the spiritual? Me, paul is the greatest encourager apart from Christ, because he's very open when he pens and he writes everything that he writes, doesn't he? You know, when you think about the great writings that he's given us, he's very open and very honest. He wasn't frightened of putting his emotions and his fears on the table of the church when he's going to Corinth there, isn't he? He said, if you read that on further, he says I didn't want to bring you this letter but I had to bring. I'm sorry that you're sorry, but I'm not sorry that you're sorry for because it had to be done. So you know, the honesty and the openness of the man, I think is very, very needed and required in all of our lives at this moment to be encouraged. If you're tired, it's okay. If you're tired, mark, it's all right.
Speaker 2:Paul felt tired yeah, well, there's actually a conflict for me with that, with opening up and you know making myself vulnerable, apologizing or, you know, recognizing my own weaknesses, because there's one side of me that thinks, well, if I tell someone too much about myself, it's like giving someone a loaded gun. You don't know what they might do with that sort of information.
Speaker 2:But as believers, we're also supposed to confess our sins to one another. So, yeah, what I wanted to share, the text that I came with in mind, that, if I may share it please, with you, let's, let's have it from galatians 5, 22, just the one verse.
Speaker 2:But the fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace, and I'll stop there because there are further fruit of the Spirit. So it's one fruit of the Spirit, but love, joy and peace, I mean these are things that, for the believer, will enable us to overcome the world. Thinking about love towards the neighbour, our neighbour, our enemies, which is the greatest commandment, and I've often wondered, lord, how can I love my enemy, how can I pray for my enemy?
Speaker 1:Teach me Lord, show me Lord, because in myself this is an impossibility. But all things are possible to those who believe. So, lord, all the ones that have wronged me. And I'm harboring stuff is stopping my progression in moving forward in jesus. It is not giving me these, these fruits that he's mentioned here, lord, it's, it's stifling the joy. I should be more joyous but, lord, I'm a little bit angry with this person. I'm a little bit frustrated with that person. Lord, I'm harbouring historical events, historical words that have been said over me. I'm harbouring stuff, lord. So forgiveness is such a powerful weapon in the face of the devil.
Speaker 2:And you know what, Like yeah, this is one thing I can say to you is, as I heard you saying about the words in your head I find, all day there can come thoughts just coming up and that devil. He disguises himself as an angel of light. And even when we forgive our brother for one sin seven times seventy.
Speaker 1:Over and over and over.
Speaker 2:For just one wrong.
Speaker 1:Just for one wrongdoing.
Speaker 2:We have to keep coming back to the cross.
Speaker 1:Because the multiplication that the scripture tells us about is beyond human understanding. So forgiveness is a doorway, isn't it, to what we're talking about the fruit of the spirit. Forgiveness is the ultimate door opener, because jesus wasn't even on the cross. He said father, forgive them, for they know. Know what they do. So forgiveness is a weapon thrusted in the face of the enemy's territory, because the enemy doesn't want us to forgive. So there's a difference of forgiving, but then I'll go into the area forget. How do I forget some things? We can't forget, no, but it's okay that we don't forget as long as I've forgiven. So the crossing over from harbouring stuff. So when we look at verse 22, mark, it says but the fruit of the Spirit is love, the first word, the great word. What does the Bible say about God? God is love.
Speaker 2:How do we show that to others?
Speaker 1:How do we do that to our neighbour?
Speaker 2:It has to be an unselfishness. We have to stop putting ourself first, which is naturally tough. It's so tough From the moment we're born, we we're nurtured, we're, we're looked after and, yeah, we're so prone to seeing ourselves through perfect eyes that we're single saints. We we'd so deceive ourselves to believe that yes you know, you know that's one of the worst lies, I think.
Speaker 1:Deceiving yourself.
Speaker 2:If I believe that today I've not done too badly, I haven't sinned much, that is a horrible lie of the devil to believe.
Speaker 1:Yes, I've sinned much, lord, admitting Thoughts are. It's frightening, isn't it? The thought pattern of a human being, the inner thoughts of the mind, the power of the mind, and the more you want Jesus, the more unusual and obscure thoughts come in. The more you want to be peaceful, the more you want more of love and the love of God and to be this holy and moving in these areas of righteousness. Suddenly your thoughts and your history and all this stuff is banging around the brain and it's really troubling, isn't it? It can be really troubling the thoughts of a person, because no one can see any thoughts of anyone. It's just so personal to me the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit. But do we forget that God sees our thoughts before our thoughts even come into existence? He says that very clearly in the Psalms I knew what your thinking would be. I knew what your stretch of life would be Before you said a word. I knew what you would say Before you lived the breath. I knew every area of your life you would live in. So there is nothing new under the sun to god. God knows everything. He sees this stuff in my head. But why does it play all this rhythm of of unusual beat going on sometimes.
Speaker 1:Have you ever thought to yourself I'm an oddball? I've thought that so many times. Lord, I'm a bit odd. I can't be wired right, is it? Am I? Am I normal? You're going to church. You see all these people and all that, and you look on the social networks and you. You look at all these bigger churches and everyone's bouncing up and down clapping and praising the lord and you think lord, help me.
Speaker 2:We're strangers and pilgrims in this earth, yes, this world is not our home and and that's the that's part of the battle, I think, the war that is is waged upon us. Um, yeah, the we're, we're looking towards eternity and yeah, I mean, we were created in the image of God.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:And yet, you know, just before recording, we were talking about, about, um, some of our limitations, um things that we might forget. Yeah, like we, we all know about uh forget, uh, forgetfulness, and we all, we all have a memory, and even the beasts of the earth, the birds, they remember where they live, but we don't have any recollection of God. And yet we were created in his image. And then I wonder what is different about us? What does God even see in us? That he delights, inights in what does he see?
Speaker 1:he sees a son and he sees a daughter. He sees that childlike heart. He sees because the world gets us to be very thick-skinned and it, the world, really gets us to be like almost brutal in certain aspects of life. And so you've got this cross-referencing between a christian and a human being and the world and the governments and life and makes you think some strange and awkward things sometimes and you're, you're thinking I'm supposed to be a believer. Why am I thinking all this odd and obscured thoughts? What is going on with me? So you've got a battle within. I think the biggest battle some days is just with me, wrestling me, wrestling my mind, wrestling my thoughts, wrestling my heart, wrestling the decisions that I've done and I've got to do. I tell you, being a believer is the most enduring ever Anyone ever could do, is the most endurance race you'll ever run.
Speaker 2:It's worth it though 100%, without a doubt.
Speaker 1:There's no doubt of not being that believer. But what you do is the more you want him, the more you find how far away you are from him. But you're not that far away from him. So it's an upside down way. The more you want him, the more you hunger for him, the more you realize your body is corrupted, the more you desire him, the more you realize your thoughts are obscured and strange. The more you want of the word, you'll find obstacles from getting you in the word. The more you want to lean into Jesus, the more you'll find that the world will be pulling you back. You know it's a journey. It's a journey of endurance. A journey, a great journey, though.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, the Lord puts it in us and I'm sure that the unbeliever can see that in true believers is that there's a strength that we have and there's an old Puritan called George Swinnock that I've got a text by him in front of me that says, a sanctified person is like a silver bell the harder he is smitten, the better he sounds wow, oh, that's a deep quote yeah, I think we we need to face affliction and the harder it is struck, the greater the sound the better he sounds.
Speaker 1:The better he sounds.
Speaker 2:And the troubling thing, even for me, ben, is, you know, public speaking, I can't, I really struggle with that and you know, when we are saved by Christ, we are saved that we would bear fruit for him and we belong to him. So if you stand in the midst of the crowd or at the front, or you turn away from the crowd and you stand up for Jesus, you know it's almost like because you become strange in a way, like you become separate. The Bible says we're peculiar people, peculiar yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you can feel that if you're with a crowd and you're going in the same direction, you get carried along by the crowd and you don't realise the distance that you can be carried along by a crowd. But when you turn around in that crowd and you try and walk the opposite direction, you are being still carried by that crowd but you're going in the opposite direction. So you're still amongst the crowd of life. But when you walk the opposite way to the crowd, there's resistance, you'll hit the wall of that crowd of life. But when you walk the opposite way to the crowd, there's resistance that you'll hit the wall of that crowd of of people and the volume of them will will naturally carry you back.
Speaker 2:Because it's so, it's so difficult to keep going, you can't come off the gas it seems unnatural, but I think, like the salmon, you can just just naturally find your way. Yeah, yeah, the salmon up the stream.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that is like I'm swimming home, lord. I'm swimming against the tide, I'm swimming against. But I can't go to the left of the bank. I'm going to get caught by a poacher on that side. I can't go to the right, I'm going to get caught on the left. I'm going to get caught by a bear. I've got to keep in the middle. I've got to keep in the river. I've got to keep moving. I can't jump out too much because I could get shot at. I've got to keep in the river. I've got to keep moving and I've got to be progressing. That's what Christianity is moving forward.
Speaker 1:If the salmon stops, how far will you get swept back by the weight of the water? The Bible says doesn't it? Don't conform to the pattern of this world? But when you go against the pattern, you're almost trying to reverse your thinking, isn't it? You've got to think different. But where do these thoughts come from? The power of the brain, the power of the mind. We're just working and living our lives and we might have the most obscured thought popped out of nowhere, but it's in me. You might be in worship, you might be praising the Lord, you might be encouraging someone. You've had the most oddball thought the mind can be the battlefield of strange stuff.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, you're in worship and you think.
Speaker 1:That's odd. Yeah, what am.
Speaker 2:I thinking that, for what?
Speaker 1:have I done? Yeah, what have I worship? And you think that's odd? Yeah, what am I thinking that for? What have I done? Yeah, what have I done? Why have I allowed my? How did that happen? How did that thought get in my mind? When I'm in? I want to be more holy. I want to be more loving, I want to be more caring. I want to be more of a Christian.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And all my thoughts are taking me the opposite way. So could we say that the mind is like the crowd? The mind will take us the way of the world, but when you become a Bible believing believer of John 3.3, you've got to go against yourself.
Speaker 2:You're going against the grain of your flesh yeah, yeah, yeah, I think those things come up. Yeah, as a believer, yeah, yeah, we. It's not an act, it's not an act.
Speaker 1:It's not an act, Mark.
Speaker 2:The walk is a real walk. It's a real walk and in turning away from the world and the old ways, yeah, those things do crop up at unexpected moments.
Speaker 1:Just going back to that quote. You said so the harder it is struck, the better the sound.
Speaker 2:That's right. Oh, a silver bell.
Speaker 1:So should we be welcoming strikes of affliction?
Speaker 2:Why not give the Lord the praise?
Speaker 1:He's given it.
Speaker 2:Why not?
Speaker 1:What does that scripture say? Consider it pure joy, my brothers and sisters, when you are reflected on every side, when you are pressed on every. Consider it pure joy. When we look at the scripture, mark the second word in on verse 22 of chapter 5 of galatians. We just had a quick word about love, but then it says joy. And then that scripture says consider it pure joy when you face trials of many kinds. So I have to get my mind in a place of I am going to face trials of many kinds, so there might be four or five trials in the day, there might be one massive trial in the day, there might be loads of little trials in the day, but what is for sure, sure, trials are coming my way, trials of the world. The crowd is going to try and get hold of me and carry me so far away from my destinational point. So, as that salmon, we we know where we got to go, but my mind and the crowd of my mind takes me far from my destination. But consider it pure joy, brothers and sisters, when you face trials of many kinds, because you know the testing of your faith deliver, uh deliver brings perseverance. Perseverance must finish its work. So you must be mature and not lacking anything.
Speaker 1:The scripture says so I've got to go through the fiery furnace. I've got to go through the refiner's fire to come out like pure gold. I've got to go through the hoop of life. So, all these skirmishes that we have all day, all these battlefields of words and mindsets and situations that are breaking out like like bulldozers coming at me when I don't have the strength to hold back the system, I've got to focus in the Word. I've got to focus in the Scripture. I've got to dig deep in the Word of God. I've got to dig into this Word.
Speaker 1:You know, when it's dark I go to Psalms 119, 105. Your Word is a lamp unto my feet, a light for my path. Sister or brother, as me and Mark are sitting opposite the mics, as we sit opposite each other, we want to encourage you, encourage you in the Word of God, encourage you to open your Bible, encourage you to flip the Word of God open, encourage you to look at the Scripture, encourage you to rest in the Word, encourage you never to give up, encourage you to seek the love of God and and be that braggadocious believer for God. Believe things are going to happen. Believe there is a turnaround. Because belief is so powerful, mark Believe in it. And then, if I can believe this stuff, my mind starts to get refreshed.
Speaker 1:It does yeah, I believe it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and gladness as well. Think refreshment and gladness. There's a deep inner joy and comfort that the Lord brings.
Speaker 1:Sorry.
Speaker 2:I was trying to find another quote from one of the Puritans. I've got a good book here. It says there was one about the apostles. Thomas Watson said they went away rejoicing and counted it worthy to suffer shame for the name of Christ, that they were graced so far as to be disgraced for the name of Christ, oh Lord, and yeah, I think. Well, have you ever been sort of compared with what a Christian ought to be?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I get that a lot, Mark.
Speaker 2:Or labelled as not being a Christian.
Speaker 1:Yeah, a lot of the time, a lot of the time, it can be quite harrowing, it can be quite disheartening, you know, because people always want to pull your history out of the bag and label you what you was.
Speaker 2:Even myself. I think I can sometimes.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I label myself. Yeah, easy.
Speaker 2:I think that's not what we should do. We should be looking forwards, but yeah, we can certainly look back, yeah.
Speaker 1:And we can be our own worst enemy sometimes. But the Bible is very clear that our history is gone. God cannot look at our history.
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 1:Because it's the opposite to what he says. And every moment we are going into history. We are 31 minutes and 22 seconds into this podcast and how I was at the very beginning of this podcast has gone to the cross of Calvary. It's been nailed, everything's been nailed to the cross and every second that ticks over on that timer on this podcast, it is creating a historical event for us and our history. Every second, every moment, every millisecond is now to the cross of calvary. So everything is all well because our history and all we've done, all these we've done these minutes, almost 32 minutes we've done. But that, the thoughts, the doubts, the fears, anything that's been in while you've been listening by you, you've been with us on this podcast it's all gone to the cross. It still goes to the cross, it automatically goes to the cross. How would you mean? Romans 8, verse 1,? There is now no condemnation for those that are in Christ Jesus. No condemnation, mark, nothing.
Speaker 2:Nothing, no condemnation. Nothing, nothing no condemnation, nothing before. Yeah, I, I was. I had just before the the recording. I thought about calling this something like um, uh, our lord knows his sheep yes and I was thinking about how a sheep, a shepherd, knows his sheep and um definitely you know sheep, maybe they don't. I've never shared sheep or had anything to do with with that, but I'm sure that sheep are not probably wanting, not wanting to be shared.
Speaker 2:Not at all, but when? When we're born again believers, we have to keep. When we're born again believers, we have to keep well, those aspects that we'd rather not see. I think we actually have to voluntarily come to him and humble ourselves before him and allow him to shear those overgrown parts of us off.
Speaker 1:That's definitely right. That's definitely right. The more we want Jesus, the more we see that the wall that we got on our skin is corrupt and smelly and we need to be sheared. We need to be cleaned, we need to be washed in the blood of Jesus. We need to go in the sheep dip, we need to go in the crimson tide every moment, all the time, as the shearer. You know the sheep is led to the slaughter. You know, when you look at Christ, we are born again, we are spirit-filled.
Speaker 1:You know I've got to turn this around in my mind. I've got to. The Bible says we serve a God that calls the things that are not as though they are. I've got to realize that this world is the opposite to what the Scripture says. But I can't live in what the world says because then I'll be living in the opposite to what the scripture says. But I can't live in what the world says because I'm living. Then I'll be living in the opposite to what the bible says.
Speaker 1:I've got to live in what the bible says and then suddenly realize I'm going to have these, these moments of hardship facing me on every turn the left, the right, the front, the back, 360 degrees around. There should be areas of hardship, because if there wasn't, where does it put me? Not in the kingdom of God, because the Bible talks about trials and temptations and fears and doubts that, great writer that you spoke from, our bodies have got no rest. We're harassed, we got conflicts, I got fear within if I haven't got all this stuff. All this stuff actually sharpens me and takes me more to jesus. That's what it does. Yeah, it doesn't take me away from him. It actually takes me into him. The trials take me into him, the sin takes me into him, the fears take me into him, the worries, the thoughts take me into him. So if I didn't have all this stuff, where in the world would I be?
Speaker 1:yeah, you probably wouldn't be here, wouldn't even be thinking of him no, because it's the holy spirit that brings the the gentle wording of you're in error.
Speaker 2:Well, that's the glorious thing, how you were in the crowd. You were so far from him and yet God reached his hand in and he pulled you out. But he's not like that shepherd that is forcing, like going to grab you. You come to him because you love him, but you're still. You come to him because you love him, but you're still. You have that old nature in you still that still wants its own way. And that's the glorious thing with this life is that we learn to love him. We just learn that we just have to keep going back to that cross.
Speaker 1:We have to keep praying, and that that is the purpose of the cross. The cross will always be here until when he comes back. What do we mean by the cross? Will always be here, the symbolic gesture of this cross that's there in this studio. We've got crosses all around this church and a cross to me is really important because when I look at the cross, it makes me remember a church without a cross. What's it all about? Our aim is to have a cross in every, every part of this, this holy place, because a cross reminds me of calvary, and that is what redemption is about redemption.
Speaker 1:Why do I need to be redeemed? Because I need to be redeemed in my thoughts. I need to be redeemed of my actions. I need to be redeemed in my thoughts. I need to be redeemed in my actions. I need to be. I'm in a circle, a circle of always being redeemed.
Speaker 1:I know there was one sacrifice, one sacrifice once and for all, but that was for all of my life, from birth to death on this earth, the same for all of us. One sacrifice, once and for all humanity. That's where we know the bulls and the goats and all that didn't do it. The old testament tells us that. So I am in a a circle of being rescued and being redeemed, not because I'm sinning all day long, left, right, right and center, but my thoughts and my mind and me as a human being. As that great writer again says O wretched man am I? Why do I do the things I hate? Why can't I do the things that I should do, that are godly, that are right, that are holy? O wretched man am I? The cross makes me realize that I was a wretch, but I'm saved by grace. So if I didn't have the sin, or if I wasn't aware of the sin, where would I be?
Speaker 1:Yeah, you'd be living in it, you'd be in it so far in it.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So actually we're on the right side of the glory.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean there has to be conviction of our, our sin, and our sin always reminds us of our weaknesses and limitations and yeah, that's why I say you have to be so careful, like when, when the devil comes to you and says, hey, mark, you haven't been hey mark that you haven't been that bad today, have you?
Speaker 1:well, yeah, you've been a good dog today, mate, you've been a good boy yeah, and you go. Thank you, lucifer. I am, and I, the biggest sin of pride and then arrogance and then suddenly that he goes I've got you?
Speaker 1:yeah, it's, I think. Do you know what I think one of the biggest things for all of us maybe to deal with I don't know, I just speak to myself maybe pride, actually admitting that I'm a, not a failure, that that can be a brutal, but I'm a sinner saved by grace and I don't get things right. I make mistakes, more mistakes. Do we make more mistakes than we've ever made? Or is it because it looks at we want this holy walk so much it highlights the mistakes that we could make? The more I want him, the more I'm spiritually aware of the world around me and the world on me and the world so close to me, the touch of the skin of the world.
Speaker 1:It's that bubble, isn't it? It's like you can almost be in it. You could just roll, turn left and you're in it. And you're trying to find the narrow path all the time. You're walking down a narrow, you're walking on a tightrope of faith so thin it can't be seen to that eye level, because the Bible says the just shall live by faith. So the narrow path is non-existent to the human being, but it's existent and it's in existence to the spiritual person, the believer, because the Bible says the just shall live by faith, the opposite to the world. But the more I live by faith, the more I live by holiness, the more I live by Jesus, the more I live by the word, the more the highlighter pen of worldly areas that I have and I walk in Right. You know, sometimes we can be too harsh on ourself when actually it's the Holy Spirit saying oh yeah, it's all right, you're aware of it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know what If you're, if you're flogging yourself with you know if you're, if you're, if you have to put yourself away from society and ostracize yourself that that's not going to. That's not going to liberate you.
Speaker 1:No, no, mark, because we're in the world but we're not part of the world. We have to go to work, we have to study, we have to go to ASDA. I've got to go to Blue Wall, I've got to get on the M25. I've got to do these journeys that all of us are journeying, but I'm not going to let the worldly journey get hold of me.
Speaker 2:No.
Speaker 1:I'm in the world, but not part of the world. I walk on the same stretch and I walk the same tarmac and I shop in the same shop and I journey the same journey, but it's not the same journey.
Speaker 2:But the Lord will give you peace and you've got to keep coming back to him and asking for that peace. And, yeah, he can give you the strength you need to stand in the midst of trial or sit in traffic or go through blue water or whatever. Whatever situation you're in, if you're facing a battle, the Lord can give you the peace to surpass all of that.
Speaker 1:So what's coming up now right in front of us, the calendar of all of us across the world, or the majority of us, is Christmas. So everywhere I go, I'm faced with the pagan way of Christmas. You can't help but deny it. You can't help but see the pagan way of Christmas is done, christmas is commercialized, paganism is exalted.
Speaker 2:It is everywhere and, to be honest with you, even Old Testament Israel, they were lusting for the vegetables back in Egypt. Yeah, they made a molten calf when Moses went up into the mountain.
Speaker 1:When he was getting the tablets.
Speaker 2:So you know there's paganism all throughout history and even in the church, and I know it's right to see these things and discern it, but we shouldn't be troubled by it.
Speaker 1:No, we can't be troubled by it it.
Speaker 2:No, we can't be troubled by it, it's always um. Cs lewis wrote something about how the the flame, though it has so much um impurities in it, it's not the essence of of the flame no and and so yeah, in in this pagan darkened world we see so much that's wrong, even in the church maybe. Maybe, uh bishop, uh home, you know, homosexual exactly all that stuff going on but it, it's, it's not new there's nothing new under the sun.
Speaker 1:The book of ecclesiastes is very clear. There's nothing new under the sun. There's a season for everything, there's a reason for everything and also, when we are talking the way, we are talking openly and candidly and straight out of what we're saying it's really important to understand. There are some great and some beautiful things in this world. Yeah, there's some amazing things nature and life and hope. So, just because we might have highlighted a few things here, hope has never lost.
Speaker 2:The world is beautiful the world is beautiful, yeah the world is beautiful.
Speaker 1:There's some beautiful human beings on the earth. There's some lovely people. There are beautiful people. There are beautiful things to see.
Speaker 2:The world is amazing I'll be honest with you, ben, where, where I've, I've seen a few churches, and there's one I have in mind, where things are so bland it's almost like they want to clip your wings.
Speaker 1:Of course they do.
Speaker 2:They want to take the personality out of you. They don't really want you wearing colours. No, they want women to wear their head coverings. Some are okay, but some can be so legalistic on it.
Speaker 1:You've lost the power of what it's about.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:That's the thing, isn't it? And then you go into legalism.
Speaker 2:The thing is, there's a lot of beauty in this life that we ought to enjoy there's so much beauty, it's a narrow path, because the liberals will be so far from they'll just be doing whatever pagan thing they want to do.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so you've got liberals, and then you've got the legalistic way.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And you're trying to find the in-between ground of the holy ground, because when you walk in the holiness of God, have you ever experienced that colours come alive, that the world actually comes alive when you get the joy of the Lord in your body, when you get the love of God and you realise not get it, but you've got it.
Speaker 2:But when you actually realise all is okay, suddenly color of life is better, is brighter yeah, I'll tell you what sometimes such clouds have been over my head values, what, what I, what I plan for that's right in the coming days, years, but we live day by day and actually I'm not taking anything that I've amassed in this world.
Speaker 1:Nothing With me. No, that's correct.
Speaker 2:So I think with that, that was like a cloud over my head and I think if we're able to let go of some of our relation, to this world, yeah. The Lord will help us. Definitely, mark, and the best way for him to shear that part off of us is just to really submit to the cross and ask him.
Speaker 1:Come to the cross. Yeah, and that's important, mark, you're saying come to the cross and sometimes being encouraging. You know we need to be encouragers because this world you come to the cross, repentance suddenly life is so powerful with Jesus, life is so powerful and refreshing. You know, there is so much for every one of us to do for Jesus, for life, for your neighbor, for your friend, for your brother and sister. Life is so colorful and so joyous being a Christian. When you realize that you are a John 3, 3, and you are saved by grace, and you are a sinner saved by grace, suddenly the world becomes so bright and vibrant.
Speaker 1:But we can't allow the thinking of the world to drive us. Oh, do you know what I mean? Enjoying the glory of God, enjoying nature, enjoying the sights around the world, enjoying people and community, enjoying life. That is the powerful thing to enjoy it but not engage in the sin side of it. There's so much color and joy out there. Look at the stars and look at the sun rays. Look at today's weather that we've had here. It's been freezing, cold, but the frost this morning was so powerfully good to look at the sun when it comes up. There's so much to be happy for happy, for in God, the world is yours.
Speaker 1:And I don't mean that in a motivational go and sin and enjoy. What I'm saying is is every place that your foot shall tread upon is your territory. God is the creator of this world and sometimes, as a Christian, do we let all this joy and everything go by because we're so trapped in our mind of dirty thinking. If you know what I mean, and what I mean by that, is just trashful stuff. It can get us down and rather than looking out the window and go yeah, that's my mind just doing that. But I'm a believer, I'm blood washed and I'm going to enjoy the world. I'm going to see the great things that God has done. Look at the rivers and the seas and the world and the oceans and the stars. I'm going to travel this globe on aircraft. I'm going to see the great things of God.
Speaker 2:There's so much to do in this world, yeah we could certainly, you know, focus our minds on trying to get rich and trying to attain, but actually the Lord's given it.
Speaker 1:It's there, enjoy it. It's there for the taking. Imagine being on an aircraft now in a beautiful, clear summer's day, looking out the window and looking over the circle of the earth, seeing the clouds, looking down and watching this nation and that nation as you fly over and the beauty of God displayed across the heavens. There is so much for Christians to explore that God has done. That is in the good side, and we've got to be careful that we don't get entrenched in political ideology, work ethics. That makes us a robotic, legalistic nothing. Do you understand what I mean by that? Trapped with mortgages? I understand we've got to have a house. I understand we've got to pay rent. I'm not saying that. But what I'm saying is is don't let the trappings of the world get you, because all of us have got rent to pay. We've all got put fuel in cars. We've all got to jump on trains. Jump on. We've all got to commute and get about. But I don't let that get hold of me. I can't be trapped by it.
Speaker 1:The bible says the only debt that we should ever be outstanding is the debt of love. And when you live as that radical, braggadocious Christian and a believer, the world becomes bright and powerful. Yeah, it does Not in the way of the way the world looks at it, but in the way that God says what did he say to Adam? The world is yours, subdue it, enjoy it. Take the way that god says. What did he say? Oh adam, the world is yours, subdue it, enjoy it.
Speaker 2:Take the land, cook from it, eat from it, live from it, increase in numbers, enjoy this globe that I've created yeah, so before um, you know when, when we go to, when you go to bed and have your nighttime devotions, you can at least thank him. There are things to thank him for.
Speaker 1:Mark, the list is long.
Speaker 2:We can go and take things that are burdening us and worrying us, or we might not think of it going at all, but actually just thanking him for this day that that he's given us, that he's given us another you're right, mark, and I think what we've got to do is we've got to flip this around.
Speaker 1:Yes, I've got thoughts and I've got things in my head and my life that are not right and not godly, but I cannot live because the devil wants me to live as you are a dirt bag. He wants me to think that, oh dear me, you're bad. Yeah'm bad, but I'm not bad Because I'm blessed. I'm a son of the living God. I am blessed and highly favoured, and sometimes I actually think now, in this world that we're living in, there's so much doom and gloom and destruction that we can live in this perpetual mode of thinking of its end unfinished, when actually no, the world is for living.
Speaker 1:I'm a Christian, it's my territory, I'm not owned by the government, I'm owned by the king. I'm blessed. I'm not owned by the workplace. No one owns me but Jesus. I can go anywhere and do anything. I'm free, living under the grace and the mercy and the favour of God. I think it's a change. It's a mindset change, but not the. You've got to be careful, haven't we? Because the mindset change could take us to a place of like the prosperity and the motivational, and that place where we think we become untouchable where then?
Speaker 1:we become arrogant and I am a super human being.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a bad part.
Speaker 1:That's a bad part. So there's that fine line again. Isn't there the fine line of enjoying everything God has given us everything, but also realising it's still a narrow path?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think great people that I've met in life live quite modestly and probably quite in their own ways like have been successful, but they still it's still like a daily walk, like great men of God that I know has to be a daily walk keep chipping away, keep moving along. I think these great men that are arrogant. They just seem to it's me take leaps.
Speaker 1:There's something very wrong with arrogant there is Mark keep away from them we've hit the time button, we've almost stretched the hour, and when you look at the scripture that mark, through the grace and through the power of the holy spirit, has brought to the table today, it's galatians, chapter 5, verse 22. But the fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace. There's so much more obviously on the back end of that, but we've just been talking about the first three. We didn't even really get, we just spoke about the words. We didn't really even open up the fabric of each word. We'd, we didn't just dissect it in any way, major shape or form. But the conversation just flows, doesn't it so? When, when I get love, the key thing, the healing thing that I need as a believer is the love, love of god, because that is the springboard to everything, isn't it? The word love starts to open doors to forgiveness, repentance joy peace.
Speaker 2:And we're to seek the greatest gifts and horses about. You know, if I have not charity, yeah. But we really need these fruits. We really need these fruits. It's all you know. If someone wants to, you know, speak in another supernatural language if the clause come out after or even during the service. No, these fruits are a higher priority for the believer.
Speaker 1:They're top of the list.
Speaker 2:They're top of the list. If anyone teaches you about the Holy Spirit, I think they should be making a big point about this about pursuing these gifts.
Speaker 1:And you've mentioned 1 Corinthians 13, verse 13, and it talks about faith and hope, but it says the greatest of these is love. When I love the unlovable, when I want the more of the love of God, when I seek that one word, that one word, that word charity, in a certain translation and in what I've got, the NIV, the word love. The Bible says God is love. So when I seek the love of God and I seek this love, it's God wrapped up in them few letters. And then when I seek that word love and I get into that love, and I get into it and I'm in God, and then God will heal me and he will give me joy, he will give me peace, he will give me forbearance. He will do all that.
Speaker 1:The one requirement I actually believe that we are required to do is to love and to seek love, and that's not this soppy agape, this soppy worldly love that is a far away. This is the, the love of god, the love that sent his son to the cross. This is the love that would save the dirtiest sinner across the world. This love, this love we are talking about, is not of this world. Love is critical. Love changes everything, mark.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, it heals, it binds up hearts, it really.
Speaker 1:Sets the captives free.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it does.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it does, mark, We've hit, it does, mark, we've hit, we've hit the button. We've hit the button, my friend, and it's been great, you know, and uh, god bless. Thank you for your life, mark. Thank you for bringing a scripture to the table today and it's been great just chatting, rambling, speaking, being honest, opening up, speaking to god, allowing the holy spirit in. And we thank you for wherever you are now, wherever you are capturing this podcast, we pray that one day, when we're all in glory, we will just worship the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit.
Speaker 1:You know, wherever you are, love is everything, son, the Holy Spirit. You know, wherever you are, love is everything. Love is absolutely the pinnacle, the crescendo of our faith. Love is the top of that list. I've got to love more. I've got to walk more in love. I've got to do more. I've got to give more. Give that love to this world that doesn't understand what love really means. God bless you wherever you are. We thank you for your life, we thank you for your commitment to jesus christ and we love you from the very bottom of our heart. Have a great day wherever you are today, stay blessed, stay in the word of god and we'll see you soon. Take care.
