Reverend Ben Cooper's Podcast
Reverend Ben Coopers podcast, offers an inviting space for listeners to explore Christianity and spiritual growth with wisdom, humor, and a deep commitment to biblical truth. Through Rev. Ben's engaging conversations with guests, the podcast not only explores the timeless wisdom of the Bible but also tackles the pressing issues of life, faith, and hope in a way that is accessible, thought-provoking, and enriching. Whether you’re seeking spiritual nourishment, answers to life’s big questions, or simply a place to reflect on your faith, the Rev Ben podcast is a valuable resource on your journey.
In each episode, Rev. Ben guides listeners through profound theological reflections, personal stories, and practical insights drawn from the Bible and the broader Christian tradition.
Reverend Ben Cooper's Podcast
The Lost: Finding Your Way Back to Jesus - (#1053 - CST)
Title: Lost in the Spotlight – When Success and Religion Still Leave You Empty
What happens when everything you thought would fulfill you… doesn't?
In this raw and unfiltered episode, Simon and Ben unpack the deep sense of lostness that’s gripping hearts both outside and inside the Church. Centering the conversation around the tragic true story of “Johnny Football”—a gifted athlete who had fame, fortune, and a following, but whose life plan became “blow $5 million and kill myself”—they illuminate the truth that worldly success can never satisfy the soul’s need for Jesus.
But the most alarming discovery? Many churchgoers feel just as lost. Spiritual routines and religious activity are often substituted for genuine relationship with Christ. “I was happier before I became a Christian” is a heartbreaking admission we explore, highlighting how discipleship has been replaced with performance, and church programs have overshadowed personal transformation.
The anchor for this episode is Luke 19:10: “For the Son of Man came to seek and to save the lost.” That includes those who are not just lost in the world—but lost while sitting in pews.
Simon and Ben reflect on Peter’s walk on water, drawing a striking comparison between staying focused on Jesus versus sinking under the weight of distraction, fear, and unmet expectations. The takeaway? You can still feel lost even while looking religious—because only Jesus satisfies.
This episode cuts through surface-level faith talk and dives into the root of spiritual disconnection. If you’re:
- Achieving more but feeling emptier,
- Attending church but missing intimacy with God,
- Doing “all the right things” but still drowning spiritually—
This conversation is your lifeline.
We explore:
- What happens when identity is built on success or approval
- How religion without relationship breeds disillusionment
- Why authentic connection to Jesus changes everything
No formulas. No perfection required. Just a Savior who says, “Come as you are.” Learn how to reconnect with your true identity in Christ, speak God’s truth over your life, and break free from the illusion that performance, popularity, or possessions will ever complete you.
feeling lost despite success, lost in the church podcast, Johnny Manziel testimony reflection, Luke 19:10 explained, Jesus seeks the lost podcast, Christian identity vs performance, when religion doesn’t fulfill, walking on water Peter lesson, emptiness after success, spiritual disconnection in church, how to find Jesus again, God-shaped hole in the heart
https://www.pastorbencooper.co.uk/
https://www.rbchristianradio.net/
God bless, wherever you are. It's hashtag Christian Straight Talk. It's Simon and myself. We are in. It is Thursday morning. It is the 31st of August. Just gone 11 o'clock. Wow, merry Christmas, we're there already.
Speaker 2:How many sleeps are Christmas.
Speaker 1:How many sleeps? Yeah, yeah, the elf is coming out. The elf is coming out the closet. You're not allowed to say that, are you? I wonder if elves have come out the closet, Whatever, Ben you know.
Speaker 2:I mean, you've kind of Kind of halfway, isn't it?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, we're halfway out. We want to go back in. God bless, wherever you are. This morning, it's Simon and myself. Thank you for downloading all the stuff on Apple. We've just managed to get ourselves on Apple after all. This time Been a bit of a hiccup with some things on there, but now we're on Apple. We thank you so much for everyone that is downloading all this stuff from Spotify and all the other platforms. Now we are on Apple Podcasts, which is absolutely fantastic. The Lord is good. We are in and the title of today is the Lost. Simon, it's great to see you. It's great to be back.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's great to be back, ben, but the end of August is crazy. You know, kids go back to school, don't they? Next week Already? Yeah, we've had the grandkids and they're six and eight and you can imagine, you know absolutely worn out.
Speaker 1:Wallet's empty but absolutely worn out.
Speaker 2:They're like little con artists, you know.
Speaker 1:I know they're amazing, aren't they kids? What is it with the church in August? Does Jesus go on holiday in August?
Speaker 2:I think the devil takes a couple of eggs off, doesn't he? I wonder where.
Speaker 1:Jesus goes in August. I think the devil takes a couple of eggs off doesn't he?
Speaker 2:I wonder where Jesus goes in August. Yeah, because lots of churches are shut up, don't they?
Speaker 1:We've had lots of visitors through August from other churches where they've literally shut a few services down. You think, oh wow, maybe Jesus is away. No wonder me prayers are not being answered. Maybe he's in Ibiza or Tenerife or Benidorm or somewhere.
Speaker 2:Mate, I don't know how to say it, but a lot of them churches. He was never in the building in the first place.
Speaker 1:Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, come on, let's get on that subject.
Speaker 2:Yes, I don't really know how to do it. Replaced by Elvis.
Speaker 1:Elvis has left the building, but we are in and it's a very interesting subject we've got on the table today. And wherever, on whatever platform, you're with us today, we thank God for your life. You know, life is hard, life is really tough. You know, some things look impossible, but all things are possible to those who believe. So, wherever you are, don't give up in your belief. Keep going, it will be worth it in the end. God is with you wherever you are. But the title of today is the Lost Luke, chapter 19, verse 10. Really interesting scripture, simon, verse 10. Really interesting scripture, simon. And the Lord has placed that on your heart.
Speaker 2:I'll tell you why because I've been watching a few sports documentaries recently and it's really interesting. It's a load of stuff about young men who have the last chance in America, you know, last chance in basketball, last chance in American football. But and that's another podcast entirely, because it continues on with the fatherless generation, because our without a stable background at home, you know, causes all sorts of problems. But yeah, no, I saw one this week on something called Netflix, and I don't know if you've heard of that, ben, have you?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I got it. No, yeah, I know it pretty well. Got it on your phone? Yeah, Got it on my phone. Yeah, we know about Netflix.
Speaker 2:It was called Johnny Football and it's about a guy called Johnny Manziel and he's a young lad, a young man, who was absolutely amazingly talented as an American football quarterback he's the guy that runs, all the plays and everything.
Speaker 2:But he had no discipline in his life and he had parents. They were beautiful parents, but they realised that he just had to let Johnny do his thing and the coaches all the way through let Johnny do his thing. And Johnny just did his thing, never, didn't train very hard, but he was so talented and he was making money on the table and by the time he was 18, he was running around all over America. He got money all over the place and he did this little thing. When he scored a touchdown he'd just go like this. So you know, he was getting money because he was getting money from all over the place.
Speaker 2:And when he eventually turned pro and he should have been number one in the draft pick because he was what they called a Heisman Trophy winner, which is the young collegiate guys he was an amazing quarterback. He led this team, the Texas AMA, to the title. He was just incredible. But his off-the-field antics were so horrendous that no one really wanted to pick him up Really and he wasn't picked up until they have a draft over there and he wasn't picked up until I think it was 22nd and he went to somewhere called the Cleveland Browns, but it never worked out for him because he wasn't used to that discipline turning up every day.
Speaker 1:Oh, okay, Right sure. So discipline is a big thing, isn't it? I? Have issues, it's one of the biggest things.
Speaker 2:And you know I'll carry on with the story in a minute. But just on the sidebar of that, I know many successful men in business or whatever, and they're all disciplined.
Speaker 1:Discipline is the key With the time, yeah, disciplined.
Speaker 2:And I know many people who are all over the place who are completely undisciplined. And it's the same ben in the christian, your christian life isn't it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, your time is something you can't buy. You can't get back. So using your time wisely and being really disciplined is such a difficult thing to do. You, when you're busy, when you're flying around doing here and there, you you've got to give 15 minutes to that, half hour to that. You've got to be wise, haven't you? And also, it takes a lot of energy, doesn't it, to be disciplined, because it's so easy to go. I ain't going to do that.
Speaker 2:Well, a lot of guys ain't spiritually disciplined, a lot of people ain't spiritually disciplined and they wonder why their lives are going all over the place. So, this fellow place, but um, so this fella, uh, he signed a contract, eight million dollars, this contract, and uh, but he, uh, he all came to a head where, where he was supposed to be playing on a sunday evening and he went to las vegas on the friday, thought he could get back for the sunday game, uh, missed the flight and and then in the end, they just terminated his contract. But he said he reached the stage. He said I had everything. I had millions of dollars, I had the biggest cars, I had women for and off me. He said I had absolutely everything. He said, but I felt the most empty I'd ever felt in my life I had everything materially.
Speaker 1:I had everything that the world could offer yeah but I had.
Speaker 2:He said his plan at that stage. And his plan at that stage was to blow $5 million and kill himself. That was his plan. Wow, that was his life plan.
Speaker 1:That was his life plan. Yeah, what a way, what a lifestyle. So materially, what the world offers the fame, the fortune, the lifestyle, it doesn't fulfil the vacuum that Jesus Christ, the kingdom of God, has to offer on the table. So we also have. So we see this in the world a lot. You just give us that quick-fire story, that factual story, but also we find this in the church.
Speaker 2:We find this, it's a big place.
Speaker 1:There are people lost, not in the kingdom.
Speaker 2:And you know, before we leave, johnny Mansell, johnny Football, he said also. He said where does it stop? He said I just keep going and going and partying and partying, doing more and more stuff. And where does it stop? Like he said, it would only stop when deaf, where does it stop? Where does it stop? That's said, it would only stop when death, where does it?
Speaker 1:stop. Where does it stop? That's where the devil takes you, doesn't he? That's where he takes you Because it's empty. It's empty fulfillment, it's chemical reaction. It's feeding the body, it's feeding the lust, it's feeding the eyes, it's feeding yourself. You're give me, give me, give me. You're in this zone of I want, I can have, I can do whatever.
Speaker 2:Well, the interesting thing about this young man is that he still had the parents that loved him, and he ended up going back to his parents, which is a parallel to another great.
Speaker 1:I think you might be talking about a prodigal. Yeah, luke 15 is a prodigal, so it's interesting.
Speaker 2:he came back and now he's a motivational speaker and he still plays a bit of football, but not to the extent, and you know. So he's built his life and you see that he's not unusual, is he? He's just because he's got a bit of a name that he stands out, but he's got a bit of a name, then, that he stands out, but he's not unusual in this world.
Speaker 1:So common, isn't it, simon? But actually, you find it in most walks of life, don't you? That people are craving and they're looking for peace, they're looking for fulfillment, they're looking for hope, they're looking for love, they're looking for validation, they're looking for this vacuum within the skin I'm in to be filled with something. The cars will do it, the lifestyles will do it, the money will do it, and you realise that none of that actually does it. It can only be the Holy Spirit, it can only be the power of God.
Speaker 2:Well, you know, you'll have a bit of fun with that for a short time. You know, I've experienced that and you know people are jumping in doing all sorts of sexual things, doing all sorts of stuff, and they'll have a bit of fun for a short time. But there's no permanence, is there? It's empty. And Jesus said this and this is really striking. He said this in Mark 8, 36. He said what would it profit a man if he gained hell worth but lost his soul.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so I've gained everything through sports. I've gained everything through notoriety. I'm famous, I'm across every billboard in America, I've got what I want, but eternity is looming. I can't take it with me. So if you lose your soul to what the devil is doing, you know dancing with the devil is a dangerous thing to do. But the world wraps it up in glitter, doesn't it? The world wraps it up and it's great. You're living the dream. It's wonderful. Look at the lifestyle you've got. Look at him. Look at he's famous, he's on the news, he's on sports, he's all over the world. He must be loving his life and the thing has been while you're doing that.
Speaker 2:You'll always have friends, won't you always have friends? Same as the prodigal son when he had a few quiddians throwing it around like a man with ten arms. He had loads of mates, yeah everyone was around him.
Speaker 1:But as soon as the electric runs out in the cupboard, as soon as the food's off the table, who you're left with? Yeah, who you're left with. It's a really important thing to remember. All the time that you got money, you got fame, you got this, you got that, there'll be people gravitating around you because it's that I want a part of that and I'll. I'll use them for my gain, for my life, you know. But living that dream is not actually a dream at all, you know. So, being a believer, there must be uncountable amount of people that are not fulfilled, I will say in church, because the church isn't really delivering what it should be delivering.
Speaker 2:It's huge ben, you know, if you're not replacing, if you're not filling that gap with jesus, it has to be jesus, it can't be church can't be anything else I'm afraid to say simon.
Speaker 1:I believe that the church over in the UK is really on its way out of the door, and what I mean by that? The kingdom is real. It's about being kingdom, men and women realising that we have an identity through Christ Jesus. We are blessed and highly favoured. God loves us. The church is the vehicle. The church is a place where we gather. But so much emphasis and so much strike has been put on the building and the ministry and all this stuff and suddenly we find there's still an empty vacuum because, as you said, it's got to be Jesus-centered, it's got to be cross-centered. It can't be church. It can't be. Church is not going to fill it.
Speaker 2:You know the church is not going to replace with that.
Speaker 2:It has to be Jesus, and there'll be times in a person's life when Jesus will pass by and they'll have that opportunity, that person will have that opportunity to grab. Or if they don't, I remember, because you know I like sports and I'm into that in a big way, in lots of ways, really, really, and I love to see the parallels between faith and sport. And there was another guy, an amazing boxer. He boxed in Rocky 5, tommy Morrison. He was just an amazing boxer but he went down the wrong road of drugs and he ended up with AIDS and all sorts of stuff.
Speaker 2:He got himself back, yeah, but he got himself back into the world and he started doing some boxing presentations but ended up with a drink and drive thing and then he went down and eventually died. Oh, terrible story but you have other people who have embraced jesus from that world and, and, and and. They've gone on. But so it's not the church, but it's a personal relationship with jesus. Christ has to be, and is the church teaching that? No?
Speaker 1:I would say, if you knocked it out in percentage, I reckon 95 percent of the church isn't teaching Jesus. I reckon it's such a small percentage within the UK that Jesus is being preached. It's a different Jesus. We're hearing about a different Jesus. I want to hear about the Jesus, the Christ that went to the cross. I seriously need to hear about the Saviour of the world to save me, to rescue me, to wrap me up, to help me when I've fallen, when I've made mistakes, when I've sinned and done all that sort of stuff. I want to hear about Jesus. I don't want to go to church and have messy church, because you know that style They've got messy church. You let the dads out, they've got all this stuff going on, they've got all this stuff happening. Messy church is messy. It's not real. You know, church has to be holy. If church is going to be church, it has to be focused completely on Jesus Christ.
Speaker 2:Ben, so you wanted Jesus. That went to the tax collector's house. Remember Zacchaeus? He couldn't see, so he had to climb a tree, didn't he?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Jesus went to his house and they're going. What's he doing going to that?
Speaker 1:guy's house. What's he going to Zacchaeus' house for?
Speaker 2:This is in Luke 19. And Zacchaeus saw it and he recognised what a wretch he was and he ended up saying look, I'll restore it fourfold if I've taken anything wrongly of people. And Jesus said to him. He said to him wonderful words. You know, this is Jesus actually speaking to him. He said, and this is the Jesus that we want. He said today, salvation has come to this house because he is also a son of Abraham, for the son of man has come to seek and save that which was lost.
Speaker 1:Amen.
Speaker 2:And he's still doing it Today, today.
Speaker 1:He's still doing it as we are sitting here doing this recording. Christ is seeking, christ is saving. You know, for the Son of man came to seek and to save the lost. You know, thank God, that Christ saves the lost, that he comes to seek, he comes to save, he comes to set the captives free. And you know what money won't get you into salvation. It's not by work so that no one can boast. It is by the pure grace and the mercy of the father, the son, the holy spirit.
Speaker 1:But when you look at the church in the uk at this moment, what does the church offer me as a man? What does the church offer me? What is it? How many men are in church at this moment in time? And women, how many, uh, young, young men are in church? Young women that are in church at this moment in time? And women, how many, uh, young, young men are in church? Young women that are in church?
Speaker 1:How many of us are in church when the church isn't getting to the grip of what we need? We need jesus, we need the gospel's preach, we need matthew, mark, luke and john. I believe that there is going to be a steering back. I believe there's going to be a turning back. I believe the church is going to be like the prodigal son when it realises all the things that have gone on, the wrong teachings and the false prophecies and all that sort of stuff. I really believe God is going to turn the church and there's going to be a last moment of you could almost use the word revival but a turning back, a coming back.
Speaker 2:The prodigal church has got to come to jesus christ it's got to come to jesus and, and I think you're right, I think there'll be an individual, um revival amongst a remnant. You know, and I love what paul said, ben, in in romans 1, 25. He says this, he says he says um I start at 24. He said therefore, god also gave them up to their uncleanness in the lust of their hearts to dishonour their bodies among themselves. It goes on to say who exchanged the truth of God for the lie and worshipped and served the creature rather than the creator, who was blessed forever. And I honestly think nowadays, ben, that People are worshipping the creation.
Speaker 1:They're worshipping the foreign gods. And this even you can say that this green agenda A hundred percent yeah, the green energy deal, you know, net zero, the ULEZ stuff and all this stuff that's coming in. It is a lie, it's a lie. And all this stuff that's coming in, it is a lie, it's a lie. I do not believe in any way, shape or form that this planet is deteriorating, because God created the perfect earth.
Speaker 2:You know, I think this global warming stuff is a religion. Now, it's a tax, it's a religion isn't it? It's a religion when people just jump on the back of it.
Speaker 1:You know, when you read the Bible and you study creation, if you are a Christian, you'll understand. The earth is doing what God has commanded the earth to do. It is not affected by the gases out of a dirty old transit van or a London bus. The earth is not giving way to the ozone because of all this pollution. The earth is at birth pains because it's the coming of the king. This is why we've got so much stuff happening within the earth. Look at that birth pains. Uh, it's going to be wars, rumors of wars. The fires are breaking out. When you look at what's happening across the world, it is biblical. It is the biblical fact that we are seeing the earth reacting to what the bible tells us in the last days.
Speaker 2:But it's leading people astray, ben, it's leading people away, isn't it?
Speaker 1:It's a false god.
Speaker 2:Exactly and even to the extent of we hear about the tragedy that happened in Hawaii. Right, yes, yeah, yeah, right. Yes, yeah yeah, the crazy fires that went they've realised it was a spark from an overhead cable wasn't global and everyone jumped straight on it. And it's crazy, isn't it our?
Speaker 1:Bill Gates, jeff Bezos.
Speaker 2:Oprah Wimper. All their homes were safe. The fires never went anywhere near them Built out of concrete.
Speaker 1:they All our homes were safe. No, the fires never went anywhere near them. Built out of concrete, they're safe. But isn't it interesting, though? Everything gets blamed on global warming? Yeah, but it won't tell you that there was an accident in a power plant. Or some kid lit a match, someone put a Fagba out and it caught the grass alight and suddenly you've got these wildfires. But the Bible is very clear in the last days, what to expect. It doesn't talk about global warming. It talks about birth pains, of the earth buckling. Why is it buckling? It's buckling under the sin and everything that's going on. But the coming of the king, it's really interesting what's going on.
Speaker 2:This is the I mean, if you go all the way back to the Old Testament the Old Testament, hang on a minute you've got the Old Testament. Is that a thing? No, jeremiah 56, he says this and this just comes back to your point about the church Ben, and we'll spend a bit of time on that because he said my people have been lost sheep. Their shepherds have led them astray, they have turned them away on the mountains. They have gone from the mountain to the hill. They have forgotten their resting place. Wow, that's in jeremiah. So, and so it's true, the church leaders are turning. They, you know, maybe it's, maybe they've they, that's the way they are, that's why they feel, but they're, they're drawing people away from jesus.
Speaker 2:Really they are and pointing them to him.
Speaker 1:It really is. You know it's quite a brutal thing to say that the church, in a massive percentage of it, is pulling people away from Jesus Christ. You know we are living at a time when the church should be literally standing up shouting the name of Jesus Christ. The news has gone out this week from the clergy that England isn't a Christian nation. Anyone could tell you that. But what's really important, brothers and sisters, wherever you are across the world, you know the church might be in decline, but that doesn't reflect the power of the Holy Spirit. That is just reflection of what man's understanding of church is.
Speaker 1:And man has made church up. But the kingdom of god, he god, says through christ jesus. He says I hold the keys to death and to life and he says I will build my church and the gates of hell shall not prevail. So the church, as in the biblical church, the book of acts that's growing, the persecuted church and the church within the uk and whoever's preaching the gospel god bless every one of you and across the world, we are seeing an amazing move of the kingdom of God. People's lives are being saved because of the gospel. Not because of the building, but because of the gospel of Jesus Christ.
Speaker 2:And you know it's crazy, ben, I was talking to a fellow just this week. He's in a massive church I won't name it, but it's a massive church. You know, I won't, I won't name it, but it was, it's a big church. And and he came to faith. Him and his wife came to, came to faith and accepted jesus christ in their hearts on the back of an alpha course which is a christian course. Yeah, yeah, um, but there was no discipleship for this man and and and afterwards. And this guy was addicted to steroids, he liked to drink and he's decided to stop all of it all of a sudden. And it's very difficult when you just stop everything and don't fill it with Jesus, don't fill it with something.
Speaker 2:So he's not been discipled in a way that he should have been. And right now his words to me, and they're very sad was you know I was happier before I was? Was you know I was happier before I was a christian?
Speaker 1:I was happier before I was a christian. That that is really hard hitting. That really hits below, didn't it? When you think so, what is the church doing? What is going on? When he had more, he had more fulfillment in his heart. So we have to look at the word, don't we really clearly and very carefully, of what actually is that is the church doing to bring fulfillment and hope to people's lives? Because if you've come from the world you've come from the gym, you come from drinking, you come from steroids, you've come from all the worldly stuff and you're, you're prepared to say I was actually happier before I came to Christ or came to church. I'm not saying that them people are not saved, but what we are saying is that the structure of church isn't discipling and isn't helping them grow and change from one degree of glory to another.
Speaker 2:They're just like the Israelites. Why don't they go back to Egypt, ben? I just want to go back. I just want to go back. But it hasn't been taught about no condemnation. It hasn't been taught that where the spirit of the Lord is, there's freedom. It hasn't been taught about freedom from all this stuff and how to walk in it. Because he's not been discipled Not been discipled just come to church. And how to walk in it. Because he's not been discipled, not been discipled just come to church. You go to a home group, but in an own group.
Speaker 2:He's probably reluctant to to open up about, about this because, all you've got is these lovely people and you know just, I don't know, not all. They're talking about their problems, I don't know. But this guy is, um, you know, he's struggling badly. I mean, he's even had thoughts of suicide, and so where's the family at a church, ben, you know, where's that family? We don't get it?
Speaker 1:No, no, no. It's like what you hear a lot about when people come out of gangs, isn't it? People come out of gangs and they get Jesus, but they come into the church and suddenly, well, they've come out of a gang and they've come out from a close-knit, tight gang unit and suddenly they're thrusted into the church. And then they look in the church and they see that there's no family unit is there. It's just there's so much looseness, so much falseness within that. Yeah, there's no, there's no. I've got your back, no matter what. Well, yeah, that's another thing. I'll walk with you. Who would actually, who would you go to war with in the church? Who would you literally, if you looked around all the church and ministries and everything you've been involved in, who would you literally go? I know without any shadow of a doubt, if I gave them a call or I gave them a text and said I'm in trouble, will you stand with me? They'd go. I'm with you, simon. Who would stand with you?
Speaker 2:Well, it's very interesting, isn't it, Ben? You know, because I've actually looked in churches and thought, you know, there might be a little old lady at the front who's prayed for you forever and a day, prayed for me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and that's the sad fact of it is it will be. What pastors would literally stand with you through your history of ministry? What pastors would literally go Simon, I'm with you. I don't need to know all the ins and outs of it, but I know you and I believe in you and I'll stand with you. Who are the leaders that would stand with you when the door of trouble's open?
Speaker 2:See, that's the thing, Ben. I've got to be honest with you. I'm very much like yourself. Really. I think I'm a little bit of a rebel, a little bit of working outside the lines, if you like working outside the framework, and so we can reach certain groups of people that other people can't reach this is exactly right yeah, and, and just like jesus just like yeah, so.
Speaker 2:So there's the thing you know, when he, when he says that, when jesus says that, and and you, coming back to jesus, where it's all got to, come back to.
Speaker 1:It's got to come to Jesus.
Speaker 2:When he says that in Luke 19.10, when he says he's come to seek and save those which are lost.
Speaker 1:Luke 19.
Speaker 2:Now he didn't. If you read the Gospels, Jesus didn't go in searching for the lost. He didn't, but the lost came to him.
Speaker 1:Because what was it? They was attracted to him not by his persona, not by his physicality, because the Bible tells us that they was attracted by what he had to say, by what he had to say. So words are powerful.
Speaker 2:The light that shined out of him.
Speaker 1:Let your light shine.
Speaker 2:It is the thing for us, as Christians If you're a Christian out there thinking and light shine. It is the thing for us, as as christians, if you're a christian out there thinking, uh, you know, you've got. You know the church puts a weight on your shoulders. You've got to get out there. And well, you don't. All you've got to do is live your life as a christian and people will be attracted to you follow jesus.
Speaker 2:That is the key and with this guy I was talking about in the church. No one's taught him read the gospel, get into the gospel. No one's talking taught him. Get these scriptures under your belt, get some spiritual discipline in your life.
Speaker 2:No one's taught that, no one's discipled that. All they're doing is putting it down. Oh yeah, the devil's on his case. Well, it's not necessarily the case. Is he's the guy who's come from so far, out of your thinking exactly, yeah, yeah, to a place where he's actually gone. I love what's going on here because and I found this a lot with the Alpha the Alpha course is great and it's a great place to build community, but when you finish it, unless you are fed into a church and a discipleship group, it's like coming off. It is again like coming off a high isn't it Coming off an adrenaline rush?
Speaker 1:because I believe a lot of the church stuff that goes on is very adrenaline driven, very showy, very musically, very showmanship, which is like getting you, yeah, the happy button pressed. But I want more than the happy button pressed. What I need is my troubles and my temptations and my fears and my doubts. I need them dealt with. And the only way we're going to get them dealt with is through the gospel of Jesus Christ and through the blood of the Saviour, through knowing the Word, through knowing the Word, through knowing the word.
Speaker 1:And you said something about discipleship. There are so many discipleship courses out there, but discipleship doesn't get sorted out in a 12-week course. Discipleship is a journey. The greatest discipler is Jesus. It's walking. It's walking with Jesus and having one or two around you that you're not doing a course with. That you're not just meeting for a set hour, quick in and out there. You're actually walking with these people all the time. You're committed to talking to them via text, via emails, via phone call. The greatest discipleship course will make sure that you've got Jesus at the forefront and all of you are saying we're going to talk, we're going to be open and not follow a know and know the word, know where to go to in the Bible when someone's got a particular problem Know the words of Jesus.
Speaker 2:Look, I'm just looking at John. I've got John 15 to 17 open and the whole two pages are full of red like what Jesus is. All about Jesus, all about Jesus. And he said in John 16, 33, he said these things I have spoken to you. So he knows what people are going through. He knows the struggles you're going through, he knows the problems you're going through, but he says that in me you will have peace, because in the world you will have trouble. So he knows that.
Speaker 1:He knows you're going to have trouble.
Speaker 2:No, one knows you better than Jesus.
Speaker 1:No one knows you better than Jesus Christ. Be a good cheer.
Speaker 2:He said be happy because I've overcome the world.
Speaker 1:Amen.
Speaker 2:And if you're in me and I'm in you, then these troubles will come. But I will help you sort them out, I'll help you get over them. But unless you understand this, unless you read this stuff with the revelation of the Holy Spirit, then you're in trouble, aren't you?
Speaker 1:That's right. It has to be revealed. It has to be revealed. It can't be learned, it can't be educated, it can't be quantified, it has to be revealed. So the greatest way and the greatest opening someone will ever have is to be discipled by the living word of God. That is the discipling factor, that is the manual, you know. But to get to know the character of Jesus Christ, get to know the man Jesus, get to know the red letters in the Bible, get to know this Jesus, because that will shape you, that will change you, that will fill this vacuum. And I've got to say it again, you know churches and church leaders. What are we teaching and what are we preaching and what are we talking about on Sundays? Because we are living at end days. There are Christians absolutely buckling in congregations because the religious Sunday isn't getting to what I've got to deal with in my life, god help me. I believe there's a cry coming from congregations and it's a simple cry of God please help, please help.
Speaker 2:Show me the way. What is the way? You know, unless it has to be a discipleship of other men, and you're right just two or three, or ladies, just a couple of people around you, that's all you need, and then you know you'll be able to walk with each other and then maybe invite other people in that need help.
Speaker 1:Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 2:That need a bit of help and you know that is church, that is church when two or three are gathered.
Speaker 1:There. I am amongst the midst. So, wherever you are, remember we have to make sure that we know the definition, the difference between a religious person and a born-again believer, because that's what it's about, simon, isn't it? Being born again, being someone of the kingdom. And being someone of the kingdom doesn't mean to say it's going to be easy. It will get harder because you're being cut away. You're being shaped. But to be a churchgoer, you're going to end up going back to the old stuff. But if you're a kingdom person, the challenge is still going to be there. But God's going to shape you through his word and suddenly breakthrough will come.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it is Matthew 6.33. Seek ye first the kingdom of God and his righteousness and everything else will fall into place. And it is that it's seeking the kingdom. But it's being pointed to that. It's being pointed to put that first in your life. And you know it's like if someone has been on drugs for a number of years. I believe that they can come straight off no problems, but it has to be through the Holy Spirit and it has to be with Jesus. Yes, god-ordained.
Speaker 1:God-timing.
Speaker 2:Now I believe, if you do it in your own strength, it's just not going to work, it's just not going to work.
Speaker 1:No, you're right. I think the word that we're looking for in all this stuff that goes on, that is predestined. There is a set time. There is a set time, there is a set hour. There is a set moment when the temptations will go. There is a set time when the fears will go. There's a set time when the, the addictions, everything will go. But we're journeying this life and what we've got to do is we've got to learn that everything is god's timing and if we do things, there is a consequence to us doing things. And I'm not referring to the sin, I'm referring to reacting, running before jesus. Don't run, step, you know.
Speaker 1:If you're, if you're coming off of alcohol and all this sort of stuff, and you you drug addictions and and pornography and work. People are addicted to work, lifestyles, money. You've got to sit down in front of the word of god and say, lord, can you please, can you extract this from me, because it's there's a root, there's a root, there's a root, and it's like cutting a tree, isn't it? You cut your tree in your garden, but you've still got the stump. But a lot of people cut the stump just underneath the surface of the grass and put the grass over when the root has got to come out, because that tree is going to grow again.
Speaker 2:It's like a weed, isn't it? You've got to pull it out. You've got to pull it out. So, yeah, you can deal with the surface stuff and you're right. And people. I've been in situations where you've got men who cough up pornography and stuff and you can celebrate that and that's fine. But there is a root to all that. Unless you sort the root out, you know, there's a likelihood that those people will go back to doing what they were doing Money, the world is… Gambling.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, when I came to faith in Jesus Christ, he took away three things very quickly. He took away the love of money, the swearing and the love of drink. So three things stopped. But you never fully. You know, you're always left with a few things, aren't you? And one of them was a bit of anger to get over. So Jesus, you know, can just take away stuff, bash. The Holy Spirit can just cut it there and it never comes back. But it has to be him because otherwise stuff just keeps to be Jesus. Stuff just keeps coming back and you know, we see it in people's lives all the time. You know how many times have you seen celebrities, you know, go to rehab and all that sort of thing. But you know, a year or so later they're back on the source.
Speaker 2:They're all over the place, aren't they? So it has to be, and it has to be Jesus in the right way, Ben, doesn't it it?
Speaker 1:has to be. It has to be Jesus in the correct way, in the correct way.
Speaker 1:And I'm fully respectful to the church across the world. I understand that, but it has to be Jesus. It's not the church first, it's Jesus, because he is the head of the church, real church. So if you are lost at this moment in time, we're in Luke, chapter 19, verse 10, you know, for the son of man. It is the son of man that came to seek and to save the lost. The son of man, not religion, because religion can't save us, ministry can't save us. You know there are many people caught in ministry and church life and all this stuff lost. But they're trying, they're grappling, they're fire starters. They start things, but they're trying, they're grappling, they're fire starters. They start things because they're trying to get there. They're trying to think that this is what god wants to lead me to. What jesus wants is he wants your heart. Jesus wants your heart yeah, very much.
Speaker 2:So he wants not your words and and not anything else, but he wants your heart, and once he you, you do that and you utter those words.
Speaker 2:You know not my will, but your will be done for then you get his attention because then he can start to use you and he can protect you from stuff that comes at you. And we had an interesting conversation some time ago and I honestly believe we're in a situation now in a world where you see it all the time, where corruption is absolutely embedded in politics and government and everything, and it's been exposed to a certain extent if you watch it.
Speaker 1:Oh yes.
Speaker 2:I believe that our Heavenly Father has just said to the Holy Spirit just, you know, let's take the brakes off, and you know. So the restrictor, you know, and I think the Queen was a restrictor- Definitely yeah I think the restrictor's been taken away.
Speaker 1:Billy Graham, when Billy Graham went.
Speaker 2:And we are exposed.
Speaker 1:We're out, we're really exposed. Yeah, you're right.
Speaker 2:So the only thing to protect us is the word Jesus and just hanging on hanging in there.
Speaker 1:Get in the full armour of God. You know, Ephesians, chapter 6, put on the full armour of God. If you are feeling lost today, even if you're in church or in ministry or in life, or you're just capturing this podcast, you know, get in the word of God. Get or in ministry or in life, or you're just capturing this podcast. Get in the Word of God, get in the Scripture, get in the Psalms. Get your body, get your mind, get your focus on Jesus Christ. If you are a young man, an old man, any man, whatever woman, whoever you are, look to Christ as the role model, Look to him. Look how many people look to all these young men, even Christian young men, look for an influencer outside of the church, because the church, if the church spoke about the greatest I'll use the word influencer in the world Jesus Christ, if the church talked and spoke about his character, you would just be in awe of what he'd done and accomplished.
Speaker 2:He's the greatest role model I've ever lived.
Speaker 1:Beautiful, you're right.
Speaker 2:You know, young men are growing up, they're seeing stuff that's going on. They look to people like Andrew Tate for an machismo type of role model and really they're just not equipped to be. You know, in that place and really, something that struck me, I was watching a programme and it was about an American collegiate football team and, believe me, you know, if you listen to America, you know what I'm saying. But if you're not, these college games of American football you get crowds of 110,000 people. It's huge, it's massive, it's more bigger than a professional game. Well, there was this young, fresh faced quarterback. His name was Tim Tebow and he played for the Florida University of Florida Gators. But he was brought up a Christian and he was a clean, living, clean cut Christian guy and even they had they had little black marks to stop the glare and even there he had a. Every game he played he had a little scripture, a new scripture underneath there, wow, wow, wow, wow For the Philippines 14-3 or whatever.
Speaker 2:And the rest of the team, a tremendously successful team. The rest of the team were out partying women, drugs, everything, and Tim just stayed, stayed in the way, stayed in the way. So if you're in Christ, there's that protection. There'll be temptation like no other temptation. Of course there will be If I was a young man, 18-year-old testosterone running through your veins and you've got all this attention. You're like a major celebrity. But he went on to have a successful career and now he's a motivational speaker and doing all this sort of stuff. But you know, whereas the others all fell off, the fell off the peg.
Speaker 1:It has to be christ-centered to be christ, and if you have to be and the thing is, even when you're in ministry and you're in church and you're in all the stuff that you're doing in business, you can be doing stuff and you can look at life and think I actually feel lost, when you're not actually lost. You just got to be focused. You got to make sure that you don't confuse the words between focused and being lost. You're not lost. Even if you think it's difficult, it's hard, you keep going. You're not lost. Christ is with you, you know. You just stay focused on the calling. And that is really important Focus on your calling, focus on what God is calling you to, because you're not lost, you're focused.
Speaker 1:And it may see there's a close running parallel between lost and focused, because when we're focused we can become isolated. But we've got to be focused to do what you've got to do. And it can almost sense that the world is passing me by. And, like we mentioned earlier, when jesus was walking by on the, the lake, and the disciples said if that's you don't pass us by, god ain't gonna pass you by.
Speaker 2:but be focused, be focused and there's a lot to be said for that. Because if you're focused on the path that the lord's got you on, then you will see other things. See other things If you're drawn away. You know, like Peter was when he walked on water. His attention was drawn suddenly to fear and he started to sink rather than keeping his eyes on Jesus. And that's what we do, ben. All of a sudden we take our eyes off Jesus and things start to go go sort of wonky. But we you know it's difficult because this world, at this moment in times, it judges people, it raises people up, the ones that have success.
Speaker 2:The amount of money they've made you know the cars they drive, material things. It's all about that and that's a shakedown from the 80s with Thatcher, when Thatcher said you know she was a great leader. But she said you know you can have it and you can have it now and all that sort of stuff.
Speaker 1:That's true. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:And we've lived that. People have been living that life ever since, and I heard a great quote the other day, Ben. It said you know, men and women are like water, that when you water, you pour it into something, it adopts that shape, doesn't it? So here we have people prostituting themselves for money, for position for material gain and they become just whatever they think will give them the satisfaction button, the fulfilment, yeah. And so, all of a sudden, social media is massive.
Speaker 2:People, young, women are destroying their lives through plastic surgery and just to get more enhancement and putting more stuff, crew stuff out there, just to get more and more followers, just to get more and more money, when none of that will ever, ever fill that gap the vacuum.
Speaker 2:They'll always want more. They'll always be another nip or a tuck they'll have to take because, you know, age catches up with them or whatever it might be. Or they think another size, uh, and breast enlargement will will, uh, we'll get them another 10, 20 000 followers. No, it's, it's nonsense you put in you. It's a very microwave society. Where they want it, where we want it, now don't we, we want everything now.
Speaker 1:We want everything now. It has to be now. And it's a short-sighted program really, and the world will tell you, you've got to chase the physique.
Speaker 2:You've got to chase it.
Speaker 1:You've got to have the body that is perfect. You've got to have the money. You've got to chase it. You've got to have the body that is perfect. You've got to have the money. You've got to have the car, you've got to have the house. You've got to have the perfection in everything you do. And it's not real life, is it?
Speaker 2:It's not real. It's not real life, it's not the gospel life. But there's no free lunches with the enemy.
Speaker 1:There's always a price, there's a hand sign hanging at the end of the table. Lift up the carpet and see it underneath what's underneath it.
Speaker 2:What's underneath, yeah?
Speaker 1:How many people are lost. You know, whatever we do, we're at the gym, we're at life, we're doing this, we're doing that, we're in church, we're at a church, we're busy, we're busy, busy, busy. You know, it's things going on, just keeping ourselves busy. I think a lot of us are frightened to stop and to take stock a minute because we might feel lost. And I think people are frightened of that word that if I stop work, I'm going to find I'm going to be lost when I retire I'm going to be lost. When I was at work, I was a CEO. When I was in ministry, I was the pastor. When I was in the gym, I was the biggest guy there. When I was doing this, I was that, you know, Always looking for validation from the world, always looking for validation.
Speaker 1:When actually Jesus just says come as you are, Come as you are. Come as you are, you're not lost. I found you, I seeked you, I looked for you, I brought you in.
Speaker 2:You are mine no matter how much money you've got, no matter how many things you've got, no matter how tough you think you are, no matter how many kilos you can lift, there's always someone who will lift and have more than you and be taller, stronger and more money, better looking than you and younger. There'll always be someone there, but with Jesus Christ he can just come as you are and he says. He says you're perfect in my eyes Because I created you I created you.
Speaker 2:I love you, no matter what you think of yourself. Come to me with all them troubles and share them with me, and I'll give you rest from all that stuff. And people don't realise the power of these words, Ben Words.
Speaker 1:Words are powerful. You know we're coming to the end, you know we've pushed 47 minutes, you know. But words are powerful, you know. Speak over your life the word of God. You are blessed, you are chosen, you are loved. God loves you unconditionally. Don't, if you're unwell, don't speak them words of sickness over your body. Don't speak fear over your life.
Speaker 2:Don't claim that, don't claim that Don't claim the fear, because it's not you.
Speaker 1:No, no, because it defines you, doesn't it?
Speaker 2:Whatever the Lord's got for you, he's got for you, but don't claim it. It defines you. You start living to that, ben. That's the truth.
Speaker 1:When we've got to live to the gospel of Jesus Christ and the Bible says you're a warrior, you're healed, you're blessed, you're the righteousness of god, you're loved unconditionally, you are saved, you are grafted in. There are so many scriptures that we could quote.
Speaker 2:If you speak them into your heart over your life, amazing things happen because it's the power of the word of god wherever you are out there ben is exactly right and wherever you are out there, we just want to leave you with this that our Heavenly Father sees you, he knows you, he loves you and he loves you so much that he wants you to come to him more and more and feel those loving arms around you. So, wherever you are, you are loved and if you feel lost, you're with Christ, following Christ and to the arms of the Father, then you're not lost at all. You're with him and he'll walk with you and you'll never feel lost or lonely again, amen, hallelujah.
Speaker 1:You've been listening to Simon and myself hashtag Christian Straight Talk. You can find the books on Amazon. You can find the podcast in many places Apple and Spotify, you know and on the social networks, wherever you are today. God bless every one of you in the mighty name of Jesus Christ. Thank you for sharing this stuff out. We will see you very, very soon. God bless you. Take care, keep in the living word of God, because Jesus Christ is your way. God bless, thank you.
