{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":3.703,"endTime":7.208,"body":"There is a very strong"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":3.703,"endTime":7.208,"body":"incentive, like economical incentive"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":7.213,"endTime":8.978,"body":"to, to invest in renewables today."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":9.728,"endTime":13.898,"body":"So what we see is the first step of"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":9.728,"endTime":13.898,"body":"the path is to invest in renewables."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":14.078,"endTime":18.788,"body":"What you need then is to start investing"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":14.078,"endTime":18.788,"body":"also into the flexibility because"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":19.328,"endTime":23.018,"body":"the renewables, as we know, they are"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":19.328,"endTime":23.018,"body":"intermittent, so they are variable."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":23.018,"endTime":24.968,"body":"They don't always produce electricity."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":25.208,"endTime":28.658,"body":"So in the moments when you don't have"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":25.208,"endTime":28.658,"body":"the electricity, you need to have the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":28.658,"endTime":32.198,"body":"flexible assets that you can utilize"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":32.274,"endTime":34.374,"body":"Good morning, good"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":32.274,"endTime":34.374,"body":"afternoon, or good evening,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":34.374,"endTime":35.904,"body":"wherever you are in the world."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":36.204,"endTime":38.334,"body":"This is the Climate Confident podcast."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":38.574,"endTime":42.204,"body":"The number one podcast, showcasing"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":38.574,"endTime":42.204,"body":"best practices in climate"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":42.204,"endTime":43.884,"body":"emission, reductions and removals."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":44.274,"endTime":46.164,"body":"And I'm your host, Tom Raftery."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":46.372,"endTime":50.152,"body":"Don't forget to click follow on this"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":46.372,"endTime":50.152,"body":"podcast in your podcast app of choice,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":50.272,"endTime":52.672,"body":"to be sure you don't miss any episodes."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":53.425,"endTime":53.905,"body":"Hi everyone."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":53.905,"endTime":57.535,"body":"Welcome to episode 122 of the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":53.905,"endTime":57.535,"body":"Climate Confident Podcast."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":57.595,"endTime":60.865,"body":"My name is Tom Raftery, and before"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":57.595,"endTime":60.865,"body":"we kick off today's show, I want to"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":60.865,"endTime":64.675,"body":"take a moment to express my gratitude"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":60.865,"endTime":64.675,"body":"to all of our amazing supporters."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":64.945,"endTime":67.915,"body":"Your support has been instrumental"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":64.945,"endTime":67.915,"body":"in keeping this podcast going,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":68.005,"endTime":71.035,"body":"and I am really grateful for"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":68.005,"endTime":71.035,"body":"each and every one of you."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":71.345,"endTime":75.205,"body":"If you're not already a supporter, I'd"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":71.345,"endTime":75.205,"body":"like to encourage you to consider joining"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":75.205,"endTime":78.625,"body":"our community of like-minded individuals"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":75.205,"endTime":78.625,"body":"who are passionate about climate."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":79.525,"endTime":81.865,"body":"Supporting the podcast"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":79.525,"endTime":81.865,"body":"is easy and affordable."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":82.015,"endTime":85.255,"body":"With options starting as low as just"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":82.015,"endTime":85.255,"body":"three euros, that's less than the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":85.255,"endTime":89.095,"body":"cost of a cup of coffee, and your"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":85.255,"endTime":89.095,"body":"support will make a huge difference"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":89.095,"endTime":90.895,"body":"in keeping this show going strong."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":91.405,"endTime":95.305,"body":"To become a supporter, simply click"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":91.405,"endTime":95.305,"body":"on the support link in the show"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":95.305,"endTime":101.035,"body":"notes of this or any episode, or"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":95.305,"endTime":101.035,"body":"visit tiny url.com/climate pod."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":102.025,"endTime":107.035,"body":"Now, without further ado with me on the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":102.025,"endTime":107.035,"body":"show today, I have my special guest, Anja."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":107.425,"endTime":108.97,"body":"Anja, welcome to the podcast."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":108.97,"endTime":110.53,"body":"Would you like to introduce yourself?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":111.976,"endTime":114.226,"body":"Thank you, Tom,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":111.976,"endTime":114.226,"body":"and really happy to be here."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":114.226,"endTime":116.246,"body":"So, yes, my name is Anja Frada."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":116.246,"endTime":120.736,"body":"I'm the COO of Wärtsilä’s Energy"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":116.246,"endTime":120.736,"body":"business and really happy to be here."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":121.666,"endTime":122.026,"body":"Thank you."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":122.026,"endTime":125.266,"body":"And for people who might be"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":122.026,"endTime":125.266,"body":"unaware, Anja, can you give"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":125.266,"endTime":126.796,"body":"us a few words about Wärtsilä?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":127.861,"endTime":128.341,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":128.341,"endTime":128.971,"body":"with pleasure."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":128.971,"endTime":133.614,"body":"So, Wärtsilä is a leading company"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":128.971,"endTime":133.614,"body":"in innovative technologies and"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":133.614,"endTime":137.754,"body":"lifecycle solutions, both in"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":133.614,"endTime":137.754,"body":"the energy and marine sector."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":137.904,"endTime":141.054,"body":"So our mission is really to"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":137.904,"endTime":141.054,"body":"shape the decarbonization of"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":141.054,"endTime":143.574,"body":"both, both marine and energy."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":143.579,"endTime":147.234,"body":"And I represent the energy"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":143.579,"endTime":147.234,"body":"business and our vision is that we."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":147.624,"endTime":151.974,"body":"We envision basically the future"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":147.624,"endTime":151.974,"body":"to be 100% renewable and, and"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":151.974,"endTime":155.844,"body":"with our flexible technologies,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":151.974,"endTime":155.844,"body":"we also support our customers to"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":155.844,"endTime":157.914,"body":"achieve their net zero targets."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":159.114,"endTime":159.504,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":159.954,"endTime":165.331,"body":"I guess the first question is"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":159.954,"endTime":165.331,"body":"why, as in Wärtsilä energy is an"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":165.331,"endTime":169.821,"body":"energy business, ha have you taken"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":165.331,"endTime":169.821,"body":"this as kind of a, a mission to"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":169.881,"endTime":171.531,"body":"help your customers decarbonize?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":171.531,"endTime":175.071,"body":"Is, is that the, the only aim"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":171.531,"endTime":175.071,"body":"or have you other aims as well?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":175.071,"endTime":176.901,"body":"You know, what, what's the strategy here?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":178.131,"endTime":180.771,"body":"Yeah, I think maybe"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":178.131,"endTime":180.771,"body":"before I, I answer the question,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":180.771,"endTime":182.121,"body":"I would take a step back."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":182.121,"endTime":186.741,"body":"So when we look at the energy future,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":182.121,"endTime":186.741,"body":"we are moving towards a renewable energy"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":186.741,"endTime":192.303,"body":"future and, when we look at, the future"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":186.741,"endTime":192.303,"body":"energy systems, we see that, that the base"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":192.393,"endTime":195.003,"body":"load energy will come from renewables."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":195.143,"endTime":199.529,"body":"But to build, sustainable and"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":195.143,"endTime":199.529,"body":"secure energy system, you would,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":199.739,"endTime":201.719,"body":"you will need flexible assets."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":201.809,"endTime":205.909,"body":"And that's really where the core of"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":201.809,"endTime":205.909,"body":"Wärtsilä Energy business comes in."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":205.929,"endTime":210.419,"body":"So we provide the flexibility for,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":205.929,"endTime":210.419,"body":"for the future systems, and in that"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":210.419,"endTime":214.589,"body":"way we can help customers and, and"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":210.419,"endTime":214.589,"body":"our countries also to decarbonize."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":215.864,"endTime":216.154,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":216.154,"endTime":219.524,"body":"And when you say flexible"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":216.154,"endTime":219.524,"body":"assets, what do you mean when"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":219.524,"endTime":220.941,"body":"you refer to flexible assets?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":221.631,"endTime":224.841,"body":"So in our portfolio"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":221.631,"endTime":224.841,"body":"we have flexible engine power"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":224.841,"endTime":227.194,"body":"plants, that currently run on gas."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":227.254,"endTime":232.551,"body":"But we are, putting a lot of effort into"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":227.254,"endTime":232.551,"body":"our R\u0026D development also to, to develop,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":233.351,"endTime":238.824,"body":"solutions which can use sustainable fuels"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":233.351,"endTime":238.824,"body":"like, hydrogen, or ammonia, or methanol."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":239.214,"endTime":240.984,"body":"So that's one part of the portfolio."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":240.984,"endTime":245.148,"body":"And the other part of the portfolio"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":240.984,"endTime":245.148,"body":"is our energy storage, solutions."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":245.568,"endTime":249.881,"body":"And then in, in addition to that, we"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":245.568,"endTime":249.881,"body":"have a digital, platform also, which is"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":249.881,"endTime":254.561,"body":"a power system optimization, platform"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":249.881,"endTime":254.561,"body":"that we can offer to our customers."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":254.561,"endTime":258.665,"body":"And of course then we support our"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":254.561,"endTime":258.665,"body":"customers throughout the life cycle"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":258.665,"endTime":260.985,"body":"of the plants and, technologies."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":261.005,"endTime":263.195,"body":"So for 25 years or so."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":264.335,"endTime":264.965,"body":"Okay, great."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":265.385,"endTime":270.515,"body":"So when you refer to your customers,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":265.385,"endTime":270.515,"body":"who would your customers typically be?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":270.515,"endTime":275.005,"body":"Are we talking it's, it's not residential,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":270.515,"endTime":275.005,"body":"obviously, but it's commercial."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":275.435,"endTime":277.265,"body":"Are we talking large customers?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":277.27,"endTime":277.655,"body":"Small?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":277.655,"endTime":278.555,"body":"What kind of size?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":278.56,"endTime":280.325,"body":"What kind of portfolios"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":278.56,"endTime":280.325,"body":"are we talking about?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":280.855,"endTime":284.525,"body":"Yeah, I think we have a"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":280.855,"endTime":284.525,"body":"super varied, portfolio of customers."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":284.525,"endTime":288.061,"body":"We talk about utilities, we"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":284.525,"endTime":288.061,"body":"talk about industrial customers."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":288.556,"endTime":290.716,"body":"But more like the, let's"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":288.556,"endTime":290.716,"body":"say, grid connected."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":290.926,"endTime":295.836,"body":"So bigger, customers clearly,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":290.926,"endTime":295.836,"body":"and which are connected to, to"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":295.841,"endTime":300.586,"body":"the grid or then the industrial"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":295.841,"endTime":300.586,"body":"customers also, for example, mining."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":300.646,"endTime":304.126,"body":"Mining customers are, are part"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":300.646,"endTime":304.126,"body":"of our customer portfolio."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":305.386,"endTime":305.806,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":305.806,"endTime":311.778,"body":"And for those customers, how"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":305.806,"endTime":311.778,"body":"are you helping them on their"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":311.778,"endTime":313.188,"body":"decarbonization journey?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":313.398,"endTime":316.398,"body":"Is it that you're in helping"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":313.398,"endTime":316.398,"body":"them install renewables?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":316.403,"endTime":320.775,"body":"Is it that you are helping"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":316.403,"endTime":320.775,"body":"them, shape, demand?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":321.545,"endTime":324.905,"body":"You know, what, what, what are kind"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":321.545,"endTime":324.905,"body":"of strategies or does it depend"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":324.905,"endTime":328.595,"body":"from customer to customer, region"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":324.905,"endTime":328.595,"body":"to region, all that kind of thing."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":329.465,"endTime":332.915,"body":"I think what we, where we"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":329.465,"endTime":332.915,"body":"usually start the journey is, we have"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":332.915,"endTime":335.495,"body":"an in-house power system modeling team."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":335.555,"endTime":338.121,"body":"And, where we start is to"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":335.555,"endTime":338.121,"body":"really look at the big picture."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":338.121,"endTime":343.401,"body":"So as I mentioned, we, we model like"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":338.121,"endTime":343.401,"body":"the future power systems, where are"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":343.406,"endTime":344.962,"body":"we today and where do we need to be?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":345.411,"endTime":350.931,"body":"And in that way we can plan, the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":345.411,"endTime":350.931,"body":"future, our customer's future system."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":350.931,"endTime":355.191,"body":"So if they have certain assets today,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":350.931,"endTime":355.191,"body":"they want to be net zero by let's say"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":355.191,"endTime":358.786,"body":"2050, we can plan that path for them."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":358.791,"endTime":361.606,"body":"So which are the assets that"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":358.791,"endTime":361.606,"body":"they would need to invest in?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":361.606,"endTime":364.386,"body":"How, how does their optimal"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":361.606,"endTime":364.386,"body":"portfolio look like?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":365.176,"endTime":368.506,"body":"And then they have, then they"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":365.176,"endTime":368.506,"body":"have the road, they have the path"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":368.506,"endTime":370.096,"body":"towards the targets that they set."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":370.101,"endTime":373.216,"body":"So usually we start, from,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":370.101,"endTime":373.216,"body":"from that discussion."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":373.881,"endTime":377.308,"body":"and when the path is clear,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":373.881,"endTime":377.308,"body":"then it's easier to start"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":377.308,"endTime":379.048,"body":"making the investment decision."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":379.498,"endTime":382.018,"body":"But of course, it depends a"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":379.498,"endTime":382.018,"body":"bit from customer to customer."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":382.018,"endTime":385.771,"body":"Some of some customers already have"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":382.018,"endTime":385.771,"body":"the plan in place others don't."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":385.791,"endTime":390.021,"body":"So, case by case, but I think this"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":385.791,"endTime":390.021,"body":"approach is, is very like long term."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":390.215,"endTime":394.061,"body":"You look at our customers from a long"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":390.215,"endTime":394.061,"body":"term perspective to, to really ensure that"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":394.061,"endTime":399.131,"body":"they build the optimal system for their"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":394.061,"endTime":399.131,"body":"future and optimal portfolio as well."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":400.061,"endTime":400.511,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":400.901,"endTime":403.961,"body":"And do things like battery"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":400.901,"endTime":403.961,"body":"storage come into it as well?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":405.191,"endTime":408.551,"body":"Yeah, usually I think when"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":405.191,"endTime":408.551,"body":"we have modeled the different paths,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":408.581,"endTime":412.541,"body":"is it for a country or a region or,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":408.581,"endTime":412.541,"body":"or a customer, what we see is that"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":412.541,"endTime":414.731,"body":"the path is very similar for everyone."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":414.736,"endTime":419.831,"body":"So what makes most sense is to add a lot"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":414.736,"endTime":419.831,"body":"of renewables because it's the cheapest"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":419.831,"endTime":421.631,"body":"way to produce electricity today."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":421.631,"endTime":426.066,"body":"So there is a very strong incentive,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":421.631,"endTime":426.066,"body":"like economical incentive to,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":426.266,"endTime":427.676,"body":"to invest in renewables today."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":428.426,"endTime":432.596,"body":"So what we see is the first step of"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":428.426,"endTime":432.596,"body":"the path is to invest in renewables."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":432.776,"endTime":437.486,"body":"What you need then is to start investing"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":432.776,"endTime":437.486,"body":"also into the flexibility because"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":438.026,"endTime":441.716,"body":"the renewables, as we know, they are"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":438.026,"endTime":441.716,"body":"intermittent, so they are variable."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":441.716,"endTime":443.666,"body":"They don't always produce electricity."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":443.906,"endTime":447.356,"body":"So in the moments when you don't have"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":443.906,"endTime":447.356,"body":"the electricity, you need to have the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":447.356,"endTime":450.896,"body":"flexible assets that you can utilize."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":450.896,"endTime":456.223,"body":"So is it then energy storage for a"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":450.896,"endTime":456.223,"body":"shorter period of time or then, flexible"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":456.223,"endTime":460.153,"body":"engine power plants that can ramp up"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":456.223,"endTime":460.153,"body":"when there, for example, is no wind or,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":460.236,"endTime":462.796,"body":"or solar, in, in that period of time."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":464.19,"endTime":467.79,"body":"When you have done these two"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":464.19,"endTime":467.79,"body":"steps, so I invested in renewables"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":467.79,"endTime":469.44,"body":"and then into flexible assets."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":469.5,"endTime":473.37,"body":"That's when you can start,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":469.5,"endTime":473.37,"body":"divesting or closing down some"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":473.37,"endTime":477.78,"body":"of the inflexible assets, in the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":473.37,"endTime":477.78,"body":"portfolio, like, for example, coal,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":478.59,"endTime":483.18,"body":"and which are of course also heavy,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":478.59,"endTime":483.18,"body":"heavy in terms of, of emissions."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":483.336,"endTime":485.646,"body":"And then you continue with this cycle."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":485.736,"endTime":489.616,"body":"And then, uh, what we see towards,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":485.736,"endTime":489.616,"body":"let's say end of this decade early"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":490.046,"endTime":494.696,"body":"2030's we see that there will be,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":490.046,"endTime":494.696,"body":"more availability of the future fuels."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":494.696,"endTime":497.936,"body":"So, when the availability of the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":494.696,"endTime":497.936,"body":"future fuels will be enough, you can"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":497.936,"endTime":502.856,"body":"also start converting, gas-based,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":497.936,"endTime":502.856,"body":"plants to use also, sustainable fuels."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":502.946,"endTime":506.697,"body":"And in that way, actually you"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":502.946,"endTime":506.697,"body":"can reach a net zero system, and"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":506.702,"endTime":509.186,"body":"completely decarbonise the portfolio."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":510.161,"endTime":514.135,"body":"So I think, the steps are the same,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":510.161,"endTime":514.135,"body":"whether we talk about Indonesia or,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":514.135,"endTime":518.485,"body":"or the United States, but, but the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":514.135,"endTime":518.485,"body":"pace is different based on, on the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":518.485,"endTime":522.955,"body":"different countries ambitions also"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":518.485,"endTime":522.955,"body":"to reach, reach net zero targets."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":523.75,"endTime":524.2,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":524.65,"endTime":527.35,"body":"And what about things like shaping demand?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":527.38,"endTime":534.49,"body":"Because as you mentioned, renewables"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":527.38,"endTime":534.49,"body":"are, variable in their energy generation"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":534.88,"endTime":538.03,"body":"and some in some times in some places."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":538.45,"endTime":541.6,"body":"And with different kinds of equipment,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":538.45,"endTime":541.6,"body":"it can be possible to shape the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":541.605,"endTime":544.09,"body":"demand to better meet the generation."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":544.36,"endTime":545.86,"body":"Is that something you're"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":544.36,"endTime":545.86,"body":"looking at as well?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":547.33,"endTime":550.66,"body":"Yeah, I think when"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":547.33,"endTime":550.66,"body":"we, when we look at demand side,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":550.66,"endTime":554.08,"body":"so of course we look at the power"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":550.66,"endTime":554.08,"body":"system as a, as a total of course."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":554.29,"endTime":556.75,"body":"So what makes most sense to, to build?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":556.75,"endTime":560.833,"body":"And I think the, the topic is,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":556.75,"endTime":560.833,"body":"very much on the agenda today."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":560.833,"endTime":564.763,"body":"So how to, how to build out the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":560.833,"endTime":564.763,"body":"future power system in such a"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":564.763,"endTime":566.593,"body":"way that it makes most sense."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":566.593,"endTime":567.913,"body":"So we have different."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":568.768,"endTime":569.308,"body":"Differently."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":569.308,"endTime":572.428,"body":"There's different incentives for"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":569.308,"endTime":572.428,"body":"that, but I think the most, most"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":572.428,"endTime":577.138,"body":"important point at the moment is that"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":572.428,"endTime":577.138,"body":"we need to get more renewables built."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":577.236,"endTime":581.101,"body":"And that will drive the demand"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":577.236,"endTime":581.101,"body":"then for flexible assets as well."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":581.106,"endTime":586.025,"body":"So when the renewables can't,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":581.106,"endTime":586.025,"body":"operate only by themselves, we"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":586.03,"endTime":588.305,"body":"cannot have just renewables."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":588.335,"endTime":590.825,"body":"It needs to be coupled"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":588.335,"endTime":590.825,"body":"with the flexibility."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":590.825,"endTime":594.725,"body":"So when, when there's more renewables"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":590.825,"endTime":594.725,"body":"in the system, that will also drive"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":594.725,"endTime":596.165,"body":"the demand for the flexibility."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":597.455,"endTime":597.815,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":598.415,"endTime":600.325,"body":"What about, interconnects?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":600.505,"endTime":604.68,"body":"I, I, I know we didn't discuss this on"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":600.505,"endTime":604.68,"body":"the intro call, but,  it strikes me as,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":604.68,"endTime":608.82,"body":"as we're saying this, that if we're, if"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":604.68,"endTime":608.82,"body":"we're treating nation states as islands,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":608.85,"endTime":611.66,"body":"then yeah, we need a lot more flexibility."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":612.11,"endTime":616.536,"body":"But as we start to build more"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":612.11,"endTime":616.536,"body":"interconnects, then the sun"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":616.536,"endTime":620.271,"body":"is always shining and the wind"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":616.536,"endTime":620.271,"body":"is always blowing somewhere."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":621.108,"endTime":624.168,"body":"There aren't enough interconnects"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":621.108,"endTime":624.168,"body":"right now, but as we tend, as we,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":624.168,"endTime":628.968,"body":"as we interconnect more countries"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":624.168,"endTime":628.968,"body":"and more grids, then it starts"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":628.968,"endTime":630.228,"body":"to become less of an issue."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":630.228,"endTime":630.468,"body":"No?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":632.268,"endTime":633.408,"body":"Yeah, I think, uh, okay."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":633.408,"endTime":637.458,"body":"Here, of course, geographies are large,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":633.408,"endTime":637.458,"body":"so it depends on, on where you are."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":637.458,"endTime":642.573,"body":"But of course, the grid is also an"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":637.458,"endTime":642.573,"body":"area that needs to be modernized."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":642.573,"endTime":647.066,"body":"And, and here, uh, it's very much"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":642.573,"endTime":647.066,"body":"depending on the countries and, we"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":647.066,"endTime":651.026,"body":"can talk about EU as one system,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":647.066,"endTime":651.026,"body":"but then when we move, for example,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":651.026,"endTime":655.316,"body":"to, to the United States, you can"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":651.026,"endTime":655.316,"body":"see that they are very disconnected"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":655.321,"endTime":656.716,"body":"already, the different states as such."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":656.776,"endTime":661.226,"body":"So, I think there is quite a"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":656.776,"endTime":661.226,"body":"lot of work to do, but obviously"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":661.226,"endTime":664.886,"body":"yes, it's, it's one of the areas"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":661.226,"endTime":664.886,"body":"that, that we can also utilize."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":665.056,"endTime":671.283,"body":"But, but I think when the the distances"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":665.056,"endTime":671.283,"body":"gets, very far, far away, then, then it"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":671.283,"endTime":675.87,"body":"can also be some constraints in terms"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":671.283,"endTime":675.87,"body":"of, of how you, transfer the electricity."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":675.87,"endTime":680.13,"body":"So, but I think all in all, yes,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":675.87,"endTime":680.13,"body":"the grid modernization is of course,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":680.13,"endTime":681.93,"body":"one, one piece of the puzzle as well."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":682.605,"endTime":682.965,"body":"Sure."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":682.97,"endTime":684.555,"body":"Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":684.945,"endTime":685.515,"body":"True, true."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":686.028,"endTime":689.838,"body":"I take your point about the, the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":686.028,"endTime":689.838,"body":"distances, but I think, things like"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":689.838,"endTime":692.628,"body":"the large pipelines they've built"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":689.838,"endTime":692.628,"body":"in the United States show that,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":692.628,"endTime":694.368,"body":"uh, distances need not be an issue."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":695.058,"endTime":699.888,"body":"So if they can transport, if they"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":695.058,"endTime":699.888,"body":"can transport oil over thousands of"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":699.893,"endTime":702.548,"body":"miles, we can certainly transport"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":699.893,"endTime":702.548,"body":"electricity a lot more efficiently."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":702.548,"endTime":703.468,"body":"But anyway, sorry."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":703.508,"endTime":704.598,"body":"I, I, I digress."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":705.288,"endTime":705.348,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":705.648,"endTime":705.918,"body":"I think."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":706.193,"endTime":706.913,"body":"So, okay."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":706.913,"endTime":710.783,"body":"One, one example I could take, which"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":706.913,"endTime":710.783,"body":"is, very topical here in Finland"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":710.783,"endTime":714.51,"body":"where I, where I live, but we"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":710.783,"endTime":714.51,"body":"have, really good, wind conditions"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":714.51,"endTime":716.22,"body":"in the north of, of Finland."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":716.22,"endTime":719.49,"body":"But of course, the, the demand for"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":716.22,"endTime":719.49,"body":"electricity is not so high in the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":719.49,"endTime":721.05,"body":"north of Finland, at least Sure yet."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":721.65,"endTime":724.77,"body":"So what what they're also"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":721.65,"endTime":724.77,"body":"looking at is, uh, you know,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":724.77,"endTime":726.72,"body":"how to, how to transport that."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":727.09,"endTime":731.02,"body":"Does it make more sense to, to do"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":727.09,"endTime":731.02,"body":"it, uh, through the grid or do you"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":731.02,"endTime":735.01,"body":"convert the excess electricity into"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":731.02,"endTime":735.01,"body":"hydrogen and then you transport it"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":735.01,"endTime":736.45,"body":"somewhere else where it's needed?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":736.45,"endTime":740.2,"body":"So I think this discussion"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":736.45,"endTime":740.2,"body":"is of course ongoing as well."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":740.205,"endTime":740.27,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":740.89,"endTime":741.13,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":741.13,"endTime":745.11,"body":"I think they've similar issue in Germany"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":741.13,"endTime":745.11,"body":"as well where, uh, there's a lot of wind"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":745.57,"endTime":749.35,"body":"in the north and a lot of consumption"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":745.57,"endTime":749.35,"body":"down in Munich and Bavaria in the South."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":749.35,"endTime":752.38,"body":"So yeah, it, it's gonna be"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":749.35,"endTime":752.38,"body":"a common, a common theme."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":753.453,"endTime":757.113,"body":"But speaking of renewables, then,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":753.453,"endTime":757.113,"body":"for some of your customers, are you"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":757.113,"endTime":761.253,"body":"actually supplying or building out the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":757.113,"endTime":761.253,"body":"renewables for them or just making the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":761.253,"endTime":763.323,"body":"recommendations or somewhere in between?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":764.013,"endTime":767.893,"body":"Yeah, we, we mainly made"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":764.013,"endTime":767.893,"body":"the, the recommendations, towards"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":767.893,"endTime":771.343,"body":"our customers to, to increase"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":767.893,"endTime":771.343,"body":"the, the amount of renewables."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":771.343,"endTime":776.053,"body":"And then as mentioned, what we really"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":771.343,"endTime":776.053,"body":"focus on is, is the flexibility part."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":776.053,"endTime":780.131,"body":"So that's really our core knowledge"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":776.053,"endTime":780.131,"body":"and core technology around how,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":780.221,"endTime":783.765,"body":"the engine power plants work"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":780.221,"endTime":783.765,"body":"and, and also the energy storage."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":784.011,"endTime":788.051,"body":"And then of course, the software"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":784.011,"endTime":788.051,"body":"and, and the lifecycle services."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":788.051,"endTime":790.358,"body":"So, that's where our focus lies."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":791.258,"endTime":791.948,"body":"Okay, sure."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":792.248,"endTime":797.918,"body":"And you have a, a power system"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":792.248,"endTime":797.918,"body":"optimization modeling that, that"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":797.918,"endTime":802.958,"body":"you've done in, in not just companies,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":797.918,"endTime":802.958,"body":"but countries, over 50 countries."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":802.958,"endTime":804.578,"body":"Can you talk a little bit about that?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":804.578,"endTime":810.338,"body":"Because you're, you doing it at a country"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":804.578,"endTime":810.338,"body":"level, seems to be quite a differentiator."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":810.338,"endTime":813.908,"body":"No, I, I can't think of any other"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":810.338,"endTime":813.908,"body":"companies that have come across"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":814.268,"endTime":817.928,"body":"that have gone and modeled power"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":814.268,"endTime":817.928,"body":"systems at the country level for"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":818.168,"endTime":819.368,"body":"as many countries as you have."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":820.038,"endTime":823.523,"body":"Yeah, I think we have actually"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":820.038,"endTime":823.523,"body":"almost modeled every country in the world"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":823.523,"endTime":825.983,"body":"on, on some level of detail or the other."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":825.983,"endTime":830.173,"body":"But, I, I fully agree it's, uh,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":825.983,"endTime":830.173,"body":"it's a differentiator in, in the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":830.173,"endTime":833.978,"body":"industry and I think really one of"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":830.173,"endTime":833.978,"body":"our core, core competencies as well."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":833.978,"endTime":838.141,"body":"And, so what we do, as I"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":833.978,"endTime":838.141,"body":"mentioned, this is really one of"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":838.141,"endTime":840.211,"body":"the sort of door openers as well."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":840.211,"endTime":845.341,"body":"I mean, we, we talk with ministries"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":840.211,"endTime":845.341,"body":"around the world and, really there to"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":845.341,"endTime":852.211,"body":"support, in ensuring that we build the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":845.341,"endTime":852.211,"body":"best future energy systems that we can."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":852.211,"endTime":856.861,"body":"So taking what we have today,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":852.211,"endTime":856.861,"body":"understanding what, where the targets,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":856.901,"endTime":862.451,"body":"need to be, and then building it in a"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":856.901,"endTime":862.451,"body":"cost optimal way so that we ensure that"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":862.451,"endTime":866.471,"body":"we are doing the right investments, in"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":862.451,"endTime":866.471,"body":"the right technology, at the right time"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":866.896,"endTime":870.026,"body":"to, to a, achieve the targets that we set."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":870.566,"endTime":874.796,"body":"But this is really, I mean, as mentioned,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":870.566,"endTime":874.796,"body":"the key, key differentiator I think"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":874.796,"endTime":880.7,"body":"between us and, and many other companies"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":874.796,"endTime":880.7,"body":"and competitors, but very valuable for"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":880.705,"endTime":885.65,"body":"us as a company because we understand,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":880.705,"endTime":885.65,"body":"what the best options look like."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":885.74,"endTime":888.98,"body":"So we also understand where the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":885.74,"endTime":888.98,"body":"business opportunities of course, are."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":889.426,"endTime":895.426,"body":"But then, it's really valuable for our"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":889.426,"endTime":895.426,"body":"customers and, and also for, for countries"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":895.426,"endTime":899.116,"body":"and decision makers to understand how"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":895.426,"endTime":899.116,"body":"to, how to do this in the right way."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":900.406,"endTime":903.796,"body":"And what, what are"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":900.406,"endTime":903.796,"body":"the key kind of findings that you"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":903.796,"endTime":906.886,"body":"have from looking at the power"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":903.796,"endTime":906.886,"body":"systems across all these countries?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":908.731,"endTime":912.001,"body":"Well, I think the key"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":908.731,"endTime":912.001,"body":"learning I, I talked about the steps."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":912.001,"endTime":915.481,"body":"So I think that's really one of the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":912.001,"endTime":915.481,"body":"key learnings is that, it doesn't"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":915.481,"endTime":917.538,"body":"depend, on, on the country in a way."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":917.785,"endTime":920.155,"body":"Like the path is more or less the same."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":920.215,"endTime":924.355,"body":"Everyone needs to go through the same"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":920.215,"endTime":924.355,"body":"steps, but the pace will be different."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":924.615,"endTime":928.165,"body":"And of course then it depends a"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":924.615,"endTime":928.165,"body":"bit also where, what's the starting"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":928.165,"endTime":930.055,"body":"point and where do you want to go?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":930.708,"endTime":934.913,"body":"The conclusions are fairly similar"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":930.708,"endTime":934.913,"body":"actually in, in many of the modelings."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":935.166,"endTime":938.496,"body":"But I think the interesting fact"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":935.166,"endTime":938.496,"body":"is then, you know, when something"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":938.496,"endTime":943.206,"body":"happens, for example, the, the,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":938.496,"endTime":943.206,"body":"crisis we had in in Europe."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":943.386,"endTime":946.906,"body":"We have also modeled, you know, how"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":943.386,"endTime":946.906,"body":"Europe looks without Russian gas."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":947.796,"endTime":951.886,"body":"What makes sense to do for, for"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":947.796,"endTime":951.886,"body":"Europe in this type of scenario?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":951.886,"endTime":956.641,"body":"So, I think the, from like a market"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":951.886,"endTime":956.641,"body":"intelligence point of view, it's also very"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":956.641,"endTime":959.041,"body":"interesting facts that, that we get out."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":959.371,"endTime":962.401,"body":"And I think actually one other point"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":959.371,"endTime":962.401,"body":"I would like to highlight is still,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":962.881,"endTime":967.321,"body":"we talk a lot about like, innovation"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":962.881,"endTime":967.321,"body":"and new technologies also for, for"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":967.321,"endTime":969.271,"body":"the future of, of the energy business."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":969.276,"endTime":973.801,"body":"So if we have the right parameters"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":969.276,"endTime":973.801,"body":"for a, for a new technology, we can"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":973.801,"endTime":978.658,"body":"actually put that into the model as well"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":973.801,"endTime":978.658,"body":"to understand what the potential, sort"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":978.658,"endTime":980.668,"body":"of potential for that technology is."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":981.508,"endTime":983.608,"body":"If it meets certain, certain criteria."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":983.608,"endTime":986.548,"body":"So actually, it's, it's super interesting."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":987.448,"endTime":987.928,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":987.928,"endTime":995.938,"body":"And how hard or easy, I know, I know"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":987.928,"endTime":995.938,"body":"it's impossible to quantify this, but"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":996.238,"endTime":1000.048,"body":"I mean, you hear people say all the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":996.238,"endTime":1000.048,"body":"time that we can never have a grid"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1000.048,"endTime":1001.548,"body":"that's a hundred percent renewable."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1002.588,"endTime":1003.208,"body":"Do you agree?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1005.058,"endTime":1009.648,"body":"Well, I, I think we can"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1005.058,"endTime":1009.648,"body":"have grid that is 100% renewable, but,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1009.721,"endTime":1011.988,"body":"as said, it'll take a bit of time."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1012.018,"endTime":1020.045,"body":"And of course it'll, it'll require us to,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1012.018,"endTime":1020.045,"body":"convert, assets that today, like utilize"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1020.045,"endTime":1022.745,"body":"fossil fuels to utilize sustainable fuels."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1023.285,"endTime":1025.145,"body":"So yes, it's, it is possible."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1025.175,"endTime":1028.955,"body":"I think usually when we talk about"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1025.175,"endTime":1028.955,"body":"fully renewable grids, we talk"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1028.955,"endTime":1032.045,"body":"about just renewables and storage."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1032.075,"endTime":1037.595,"body":"And that, I think is, that's not a"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1032.075,"endTime":1037.595,"body":"very, let's say, cost efficient, uh,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1037.595,"endTime":1042.005,"body":"way of doing it because you need to"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1037.595,"endTime":1042.005,"body":"build out the system in, in a way"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1042.005,"endTime":1044.315,"body":"that doesn't make economical sense."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1044.435,"endTime":1048.875,"body":"But when you, when you add the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1044.435,"endTime":1048.875,"body":"flexibility in terms of, of the gas,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1048.935,"endTime":1052.835,"body":"gas-based plants, which can be converted"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1048.935,"endTime":1052.835,"body":"to future fuels, actually make a much"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1052.835,"endTime":1058.085,"body":"more economical, energy system, which"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1052.835,"endTime":1058.085,"body":"also works in a very reliable way."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1059.975,"endTime":1063.125,"body":"And what are the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1059.975,"endTime":1063.125,"body":"main challenges to actually"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1063.125,"endTime":1065.405,"body":"getting a 100% renewable grid?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1067.505,"endTime":1071.395,"body":"Well, I think, the good"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1067.505,"endTime":1071.395,"body":"thing is that actually most of the pieces"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1098.835,"endTime":1100.755,"body":"of the puzzle are, is already there."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1101.055,"endTime":1101.145,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1101.385,"endTime":1104.115,"body":"So, uh, we have, renewables,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1101.385,"endTime":1104.115,"body":"we have the technologies."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1104.115,"endTime":1108.415,"body":"Basically what we need now is"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1104.115,"endTime":1108.415,"body":"a lot of renewables deployment."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1108.435,"endTime":1113.7450000000001,"body":"So that's of course the constraint is that"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1108.435,"endTime":1113.7450000000001,"body":"we are not doing it at the pace we should."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1114.255,"endTime":1118.155,"body":"Actually, I think permitting is a"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1114.255,"endTime":1118.155,"body":"big issue on the renewable side."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1118.2150000000001,"endTime":1120.795,"body":"We have a lot of projects"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1118.2150000000001,"endTime":1120.795,"body":"stuck in, in permitting."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1120.895,"endTime":1123.565,"body":"So I think that's a really"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1120.895,"endTime":1123.565,"body":"big bottleneck at the moment."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1124.315,"endTime":1128.155,"body":"But then, I think we have many"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1124.315,"endTime":1128.155,"body":"good things there already."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1128.155,"endTime":1129.925,"body":"So I said technology is there."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1130.498,"endTime":1132.538,"body":"We need to get the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1130.498,"endTime":1132.538,"body":"renewables on the ground."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1132.6200000000001,"endTime":1136.575,"body":"We need to, we need to invest"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1132.6200000000001,"endTime":1136.575,"body":"in, in new flexible capacity."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1136.9950000000001,"endTime":1140.025,"body":"And then the further down the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1136.9950000000001,"endTime":1140.025,"body":"line, we, we, of course, need"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1140.025,"endTime":1141.1960000000001,"body":"the renewable fuels as well."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1142.703,"endTime":1143.093,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1143.333,"endTime":1147.803,"body":"In terms of the permitting, is there,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1143.333,"endTime":1147.803,"body":"and the permitting changes that we need"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1147.803,"endTime":1151.583,"body":"to, to roll out, are there any countries"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1147.803,"endTime":1151.583,"body":"that are doing it better than others?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1151.583,"endTime":1155.693,"body":"Any shining examples of places where"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1151.583,"endTime":1155.693,"body":"the, the permitting isn't an issue versus"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1155.903,"endTime":1157.583,"body":"others where there are kind of laggards?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1158.9930000000002,"endTime":1163.463,"body":"I don't have a specific one on"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1158.9930000000002,"endTime":1163.463,"body":"the countries as such, but, but I think,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1163.583,"endTime":1165.353,"body":"uh, we are going in the right direction."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1165.353,"endTime":1169.103,"body":"I think there is a new directive,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1165.353,"endTime":1169.103,"body":"also renewable directive in, in"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1169.323,"endTime":1173.708,"body":"eu, so they are purely trying to"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1169.323,"endTime":1173.708,"body":"decrease the time of, of permitting."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1173.8780000000002,"endTime":1177.1480000000001,"body":"So it's a step in the right direction."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1177.1480000000001,"endTime":1181.228,"body":"But, but still, I think we are quite far"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1177.1480000000001,"endTime":1181.228,"body":"from the targets that where we should be."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1181.318,"endTime":1186.238,"body":"So, um, I think we are sort of"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1181.318,"endTime":1186.238,"body":"half half of the capacity that we"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1186.238,"endTime":1188.295,"body":"should deploy, on a yearly basis."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1188.295,"endTime":1191.265,"body":"So we have a long way to go,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1188.295,"endTime":1191.265,"body":"but, but moving in the right,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1191.385,"endTime":1193.005,"body":"moving in the right direction."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1193.785,"endTime":1194.325,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1195.108,"endTime":1202.1580000000001,"body":"So for countries or organizations"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1195.108,"endTime":1202.1580000000001,"body":"that have existing fossil fuel plants"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1202.1580000000001,"endTime":1207.738,"body":"or fossil fuel infrastructure in"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1202.1580000000001,"endTime":1207.738,"body":"place, what do they do with that?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1207.7430000000002,"endTime":1211.278,"body":"Because you know, there's a risk"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1207.7430000000002,"endTime":1211.278,"body":"of it becoming a stranded asset if"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1211.278,"endTime":1216.528,"body":"someone has built a gas fired power"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1211.278,"endTime":1216.528,"body":"plant or a coalfired power plant, even"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1216.528,"endTime":1218.778,"body":"worse in the last five to 10 years."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1219.078,"endTime":1224.178,"body":"You know, they, they're usually built with"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1219.078,"endTime":1224.178,"body":"an expected lifetime of 30, 40, 50 years."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1224.988,"endTime":1227.6580000000001,"body":"And like I say, if it was built in"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1224.988,"endTime":1227.6580000000001,"body":"the last five to 10 years, are they"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1227.663,"endTime":1228.678,"body":"gonna have to write that off now?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1229.3780000000002,"endTime":1232.6680000000001,"body":"I think it"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1229.3780000000002,"endTime":1232.6680000000001,"body":"depends on, on the plant."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1233.268,"endTime":1238.488,"body":"I think for example, what we try to"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1233.268,"endTime":1238.488,"body":"do now or is that we invest quite"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1238.488,"endTime":1242.838,"body":"heavily into the sustainable fuels,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1238.488,"endTime":1242.838,"body":"developments for our products."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1242.838,"endTime":1247.998,"body":"So we develop currently engines for"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1242.838,"endTime":1247.998,"body":"hydrogen, ammonia, and methanol."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1248.805,"endTime":1252.525,"body":"Just because of course, first of"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1248.805,"endTime":1252.525,"body":"all, we don't want to decarbonize,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1252.698,"endTime":1254.4080000000001,"body":"our customer's operations."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1254.8880000000001,"endTime":1259.088,"body":"But then also ensure that if"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1254.8880000000001,"endTime":1259.088,"body":"our customers invest today,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1259.1480000000001,"endTime":1260.798,"body":"it'll not be a stranded asset."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1260.798,"endTime":1265.4080000000001,"body":"So when the fuels will be available,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1260.798,"endTime":1265.4080000000001,"body":"basically we will also have, an"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1265.858,"endTime":1270.8980000000001,"body":"solution how, how we can convert that"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1265.858,"endTime":1270.8980000000001,"body":"plant to run on sustainable fuels."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1271.3780000000002,"endTime":1274.528,"body":"But to answer the question, I think"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1271.3780000000002,"endTime":1274.528,"body":"it depends a bit on the plant."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1275.068,"endTime":1278.0130000000001,"body":"For a coal plant I see it quite difficult."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1278.803,"endTime":1283.0900000000001,"body":"And, and then I think some of the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1278.803,"endTime":1283.0900000000001,"body":"base load, gas plants as well, but,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1283.74,"endTime":1288.873,"body":"depends a bit on the technology and,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1283.74,"endTime":1288.873,"body":"of course we'll all want to make sure"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1288.873,"endTime":1290.563,"body":"that we reduce emissions going forward."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1290.973,"endTime":1296.2630000000001,"body":"So, uh, it might still be a better"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1290.973,"endTime":1296.2630000000001,"body":"investment actually to have the the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1296.2630000000001,"endTime":1301.153,"body":"renewables coupled with the flexibility"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1296.2630000000001,"endTime":1301.153,"body":"and, and be able to close down some of the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1301.183,"endTime":1304.5030000000002,"body":"inflexible, highly emitting technologies."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1305.818,"endTime":1309.935,"body":"I've seen a few instances"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1305.818,"endTime":1309.935,"body":"in, Australia and one or two other places"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1309.935,"endTime":1315.665,"body":"where when they do shut down coal plants,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1309.935,"endTime":1315.665,"body":"they sell the facilities to renewables,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1316.055,"endTime":1320.7050000000002,"body":"to some renewable generation organization"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1316.055,"endTime":1320.7050000000002,"body":"because you've got all the H V D C,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1320.7050000000002,"endTime":1326.075,"body":"all the transmission infrastructure"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1320.7050000000002,"endTime":1326.075,"body":"that can still be utilized, not for the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1326.075,"endTime":1330.305,"body":"electricity generated from burning coal"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1326.075,"endTime":1330.305,"body":"now, but from having renewables on site."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1330.425,"endTime":1333.3200000000002,"body":"And so it makes a lot, a lot of"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1330.425,"endTime":1333.3200000000002,"body":"sense that you know, you're, you're"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1333.3200000000002,"endTime":1335.96,"body":"not scrapping the entire asset."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1335.96,"endTime":1339.56,"body":"You're just, you know, taking out"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1335.96,"endTime":1339.56,"body":"the furnace and putting in a whole"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1339.56,"endTime":1342.8,"body":"renewable space and then transmitting"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1339.56,"endTime":1342.8,"body":"the energy from there through the,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1342.89,"endTime":1344.77,"body":"through the existing infrastructure."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1344.96,"endTime":1347.72,"body":"So I think that's another,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1344.96,"endTime":1347.72,"body":"another way of doing it as well."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1348.38,"endTime":1348.5900000000001,"body":"Yep."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1348.92,"endTime":1352.74,"body":"So basically repurposing, the,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1348.92,"endTime":1352.74,"body":"the sites that you already have."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1352.89,"endTime":1352.98,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1353.5800000000002,"endTime":1354.15,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1354.24,"endTime":1354.72,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1355.775,"endTime":1358.805,"body":"On the marine side of your business,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1355.775,"endTime":1358.805,"body":"I know you're on the energy side of"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1358.805,"endTime":1361.055,"body":"the business, but on the marine side"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1358.805,"endTime":1361.055,"body":"of the business, you probably know"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1361.055,"endTime":1362.285,"body":"a little bit about that as well."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1363.435,"endTime":1368.56,"body":"Is there much movement there towards,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1363.435,"endTime":1368.56,"body":"well, I know decarbonization is"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1368.56,"endTime":1373.1200000000001,"body":"an aim, but let's say the likes of"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1368.56,"endTime":1373.1200000000001,"body":"electrification of marine transport"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1373.125,"endTime":1376.42,"body":"versus shifting to more sustainable fuels."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1377.0800000000002,"endTime":1381.03,"body":"And I, I know you, you know, you're,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1377.0800000000002,"endTime":1381.03,"body":"you're, you're based in Finland, but"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1381.25,"endTime":1386.05,"body":"I've, I've been to Norway and Finland,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1381.25,"endTime":1386.05,"body":"but they have a lot of ferries in Norway."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1387.13,"endTime":1391.27,"body":"And they're moving a lot of the ferries,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1387.13,"endTime":1391.27,"body":"cuz that's, an ideal kind of scenario."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1391.27,"endTime":1394.21,"body":"A ferry just going from shore to shore,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1391.27,"endTime":1394.21,"body":"they're moving a lot of those to electric."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1394.21,"endTime":1396.88,"body":"So we're starting to see a rise"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1394.21,"endTime":1396.88,"body":"in the electrification of at"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1396.885,"endTime":1398.92,"body":"least short term marine traffic."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1398.925,"endTime":1400.18,"body":"Is that something you guys are seeing"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1400.185,"endTime":1400.63,"body":"there as well?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1402.22,"endTime":1404.13,"body":"On the marine"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1402.22,"endTime":1404.13,"body":"side, we see a lot of different"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1404.13,"endTime":1408.68,"body":"alternatives, as you mentioned,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1404.13,"endTime":1408.68,"body":"like for short like, ferry traffic."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1408.71,"endTime":1411.23,"body":"Then electrification is"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1408.71,"endTime":1411.23,"body":"an, is an opportunity."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1411.98,"endTime":1418.336,"body":"I think when we look at the longer routes,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1411.98,"endTime":1418.336,"body":"then it's clearly more towards methanol."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1418.9360000000001,"endTime":1422.4160000000002,"body":"Also in Norway, I think there is a lot"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1418.9360000000001,"endTime":1422.4160000000002,"body":"of different projects with ammonia."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1422.4160000000002,"endTime":1425.536,"body":"So I think actually there is"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1422.4160000000002,"endTime":1425.536,"body":"quite a lot of movement on the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1425.536,"endTime":1427.0900000000001,"body":"marine side, on, on this topic."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1427.27,"endTime":1433.0700000000002,"body":"And I think also because, you know, if"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1427.27,"endTime":1433.0700000000002,"body":"you buy a vessel today that vessel you"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1433.0700000000002,"endTime":1436.6100000000001,"body":"will operate for the next 20 to 25 years."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1436.7,"endTime":1443.876,"body":"So it's already within sort of the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1436.7,"endTime":1443.876,"body":"legislative term also of,  decarbonizing."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1443.881,"endTime":1448.406,"body":"So it's a very topical thing"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1443.881,"endTime":1448.406,"body":"for, for our customers on the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1448.486,"endTime":1449.906,"body":"marine side to think about."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1450.056,"endTime":1452.9360000000001,"body":"Now when they make decisions"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1450.056,"endTime":1452.9360000000001,"body":"for their future investments."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1454.016,"endTime":1454.4660000000001,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1454.586,"endTime":1454.886,"body":"Cool."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1455.036,"endTime":1455.276,"body":"Cool."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1456.096,"endTime":1458.256,"body":"Where to from here for you guys?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1458.256,"endTime":1463.1860000000001,"body":"I mean, what's kind of next for"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1458.256,"endTime":1463.1860000000001,"body":"Wärtsilä for the next Wärtsilä Energy"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1463.1860000000001,"endTime":1466.1860000000001,"body":"for the next 5, 10, 15, 20, 30 years?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1467.656,"endTime":1471.826,"body":"Well, I think we see e extreme"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1467.656,"endTime":1471.826,"body":"growth opportunities, of course, in, in"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1471.826,"endTime":1476.806,"body":"both the energy storage side and, and"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1471.826,"endTime":1476.806,"body":"also on, on the engine power plant side."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1476.806,"endTime":1481.805,"body":"So, I think we, we are gonna, clearly,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1476.806,"endTime":1481.805,"body":"we have a solid strategy and we are gonna"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1481.805,"endTime":1486.425,"body":"clearly continue on, on that strategy and"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1481.805,"endTime":1486.425,"body":"of course continue with, with the work we"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1486.425,"endTime":1491.045,"body":"are doing, together with our customers,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1486.425,"endTime":1491.045,"body":"but also with, with countries to ensure"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1491.045,"endTime":1492.9450000000002,"body":"that we can reach a net zero future."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1494.615,"endTime":1494.9450000000002,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1494.9450000000002,"endTime":1495.2150000000001,"body":"Cool."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1496.2350000000001,"endTime":1499.565,"body":"We're coming towards the end of"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1496.2350000000001,"endTime":1499.565,"body":"the podcast now, Anja, is there any"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1499.565,"endTime":1503.885,"body":"question that I haven't asked that you"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1499.565,"endTime":1503.885,"body":"wish I had or, Any aspect of this we"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1503.885,"endTime":1506.585,"body":"haven't touched on that you think it's"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1503.885,"endTime":1506.585,"body":"important for people to think about?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1508.115,"endTime":1511.711,"body":"Well, I think one maybe"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1508.115,"endTime":1511.711,"body":"area, which has also been a lot on the"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1511.711,"endTime":1518.486,"body":"news is the energy market reform in EU"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1511.711,"endTime":1518.486,"body":"especially, which is really looking at,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1518.6660000000002,"endTime":1520.326,"body":"at how the electricity market works."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1520.7060000000001,"endTime":1525.713,"body":"And, maybe on that one I would, I"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1520.7060000000001,"endTime":1525.713,"body":"would say, I think it's very important"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1525.713,"endTime":1529.823,"body":"that we look like holistically at"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1525.713,"endTime":1529.823,"body":"the energy system to understand, you"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1529.823,"endTime":1534.7050000000002,"body":"know,  how should we build it out and"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1529.823,"endTime":1534.7050000000002,"body":"what type of investments should we do?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1534.765,"endTime":1539.688,"body":"And then build also market that,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1534.765,"endTime":1539.688,"body":"ensures those investments will happen."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1539.688,"endTime":1544.848,"body":"So now when we look for example, at"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1539.688,"endTime":1544.848,"body":"the flexibility part, I think there"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1544.853,"endTime":1550.121,"body":"clearly is areas where we need to have,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1544.853,"endTime":1550.121,"body":"better incentives also to, to invest"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1550.141,"endTime":1555.101,"body":"in the in the flexibility part, which"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1550.141,"endTime":1555.101,"body":"will be a really important and crucial,"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1555.191,"endTime":1557.021,"body":"area of the whole energy system."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1557.021,"endTime":1562.121,"body":"So, as mentioned previously, we don't"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1557.021,"endTime":1562.121,"body":"only talk about renewables, we need"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1562.121,"endTime":1565.961,"body":"to look at the renewables coupled with"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1562.121,"endTime":1565.961,"body":"the flexibility, but we also need to"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1565.961,"endTime":1570.9750000000001,"body":"ensure that there is the right, right"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1565.961,"endTime":1570.9750000000001,"body":"incentives to do those investments."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1570.9750000000001,"endTime":1574.545,"body":"So that's an area which, which is"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1570.9750000000001,"endTime":1574.545,"body":"important for us and, and which we"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1574.545,"endTime":1576.345,"body":"are also driving, driving forward."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1577.681,"endTime":1577.921,"body":"Cool."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1577.921,"endTime":1578.221,"body":"Great."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1578.931,"endTime":1582.281,"body":"Anja, if people would like to know"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1578.931,"endTime":1582.281,"body":"more about yourself or Wärtsilä"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1582.3010000000002,"endTime":1585.271,"body":"Energy or any of the things we"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1582.3010000000002,"endTime":1585.271,"body":"discussed in the podcast today,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1585.721,"endTime":1586.8310000000001,"body":"where would you have me direct them?"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1588.181,"endTime":1591.8210000000001,"body":"Uh, well our"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1588.181,"endTime":1591.8210000000001,"body":"website, of course, Wartsila.com."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1591.8210000000001,"endTime":1594.481,"body":"There is a lot of information"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1591.8210000000001,"endTime":1594.481,"body":"and then you can of course"},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1594.481,"endTime":1596.221,"body":"find all of us on, on LinkedIn."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1596.971,"endTime":1598.441,"body":"Super, super great."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1598.771,"endTime":1599.881,"body":"Anja, that's been fantastic."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1599.881,"endTime":1600.601,"body":"Really interesting."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1600.601,"endTime":1602.3410000000001,"body":"Thanks a million for coming"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1600.601,"endTime":1602.3410000000001,"body":"on the podcast today."},{"speaker":"Anja Frada","startTime":1603.151,"endTime":1603.661,"body":"Thank you."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1604.248,"endTime":1606.1380000000001,"body":"Okay, we've"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1604.248,"endTime":1606.1380000000001,"body":"come to the end of the show."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1606.828,"endTime":1607.968,"body":"Thanks everyone for listening."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1608.808,"endTime":1611.718,"body":"If you'd like to know more about"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1608.808,"endTime":1611.718,"body":"the Climate Confident podcast,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1611.8980000000001,"endTime":1617.6280000000002,"body":"feel free to drop me an email"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1611.8980000000001,"endTime":1617.6280000000002,"body":"to Tom raftery@outlook.com."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1618.198,"endTime":1620.6280000000002,"body":"Or message me on LinkedIn or Twitter."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1621.192,"endTime":1624.912,"body":"If you like the show, please, don't"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1621.192,"endTime":1624.912,"body":"forget to click follow on it in your"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1624.912,"endTime":1629.442,"body":"podcast application of choice to get new"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1624.912,"endTime":1629.442,"body":"episodes as soon as they're published."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1630.0720000000001,"endTime":1633.012,"body":"Also, please don't forget to"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1630.0720000000001,"endTime":1633.012,"body":"rate and review the podcast."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1633.222,"endTime":1635.922,"body":"It really does help new"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1633.222,"endTime":1635.922,"body":"people to find the show."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1636.8220000000001,"endTime":1638.862,"body":"Thanks, catch you all next time."}]}