{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":3.61,"endTime":5.249,"body":"You can"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":3.61,"endTime":5.249,"body":"call that the green premium."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":5.309,"endTime":7.229,"body":"You can call that the dirty discount."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":7.709,"endTime":14.38,"body":"But that difference means that it's"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":7.709,"endTime":14.38,"body":"very difficult to have a bankable case"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":14.61,"endTime":20.66,"body":"to invest in a green steel production"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":14.61,"endTime":20.66,"body":"plant or to invest in a green ammonia"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":20.66,"endTime":23.229,"body":"production plant around the world."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":23.51,"endTime":27.94,"body":"And so what we're really going"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":23.51,"endTime":27.94,"body":"after now is how do we improve"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":27.95,"endTime":29.6,"body":"the bankability of those projects."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":29.93,"endTime":32.439,"body":"Because if they're not bankable,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":29.93,"endTime":32.439,"body":"they won't be investable and"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":32.44,"endTime":34.69,"body":"they won't be financed and"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":32.44,"endTime":34.69,"body":"they won't see the light of day"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":35.584,"endTime":37.804,"body":"Good morning, good"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":35.584,"endTime":37.804,"body":"afternoon, or good evening,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":37.804,"endTime":39.154,"body":"wherever you are in the world."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":39.724,"endTime":44.224,"body":"Welcome to episode 214 of the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":39.724,"endTime":44.224,"body":"Climate Confident Podcast, the go-to"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":44.224,"endTime":48.014,"body":"show for best practices in climate"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":44.224,"endTime":48.014,"body":"emission reductions and removals."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":48.949,"endTime":53.089,"body":"I'm your host, Tom Raftery, and if"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":48.949,"endTime":53.089,"body":"you haven't already, be sure to follow"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":53.089,"endTime":57.559,"body":"this podcast in your podcast app of"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":53.089,"endTime":57.559,"body":"choice so you never miss an episode."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":58.669,"endTime":61.699,"body":"Before we dive in, a huge thank"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":58.669,"endTime":61.699,"body":"you to this podcast's, amazing"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":61.699,"endTime":65.539,"body":"supporters your backing, keeps"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":61.699,"endTime":65.539,"body":"this podcast going and I truly"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":65.539,"endTime":67.399,"body":"appreciate each and every one of you."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":68.629,"endTime":71.419,"body":"If you'd like to join our community"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":68.629,"endTime":71.419,"body":"of supporters, you can support the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":71.419,"endTime":75.019,"body":"show for as little as three euros or"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":71.419,"endTime":75.019,"body":"dollars a month, which is less than"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":75.019,"endTime":78.559,"body":"the cost of a cup of coffee, and you"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":75.019,"endTime":78.559,"body":"just need to click the support link in"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":78.559,"endTime":85.279,"body":"the show notes of this or any episode,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":78.559,"endTime":85.279,"body":"or just visit tinyurl.com/climate pod."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":86.369,"endTime":88.889,"body":"Now in today's episode, I'm"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":86.369,"endTime":88.889,"body":"delighted to be talking to Faustine"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":88.889,"endTime":92.199,"body":"Delasalle, and we'll be talking"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":88.889,"endTime":92.199,"body":"industrial decarbonisation."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":92.639,"endTime":96.509,"body":"And in the coming weeks I'm gonna be"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":92.639,"endTime":96.509,"body":"speaking to Alexi Beltyukov, who's"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":96.509,"endTime":98.999,"body":"co-founder of United Fuel Technologies."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":98.999,"endTime":104.459,"body":"We'll be talking about renewable fuels,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":98.999,"endTime":104.459,"body":"Avi Greenstein, CEO of Bamboozle."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":104.669,"endTime":109.329,"body":"We'll be talking about sustainable"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":104.669,"endTime":109.329,"body":"houseware, and Laura Perez, who's the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":109.359,"endTime":112.059,"body":"head of sustainability for Oxford pv."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":112.449,"endTime":114.399,"body":"So some great episodes to look forward to."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":114.849,"endTime":118.449,"body":"In the meantime, back to today's"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":114.849,"endTime":118.449,"body":"episode,  and as I said today,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":118.449,"endTime":120.769,"body":"I'm talking to Faustine Faustine."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":121.029,"endTime":122.259,"body":"Welcome to the podcast."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":122.259,"endTime":123.584,"body":"Would you like to introduce yourself?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":124.398,"endTime":125.428,"body":"thanks for having me, Tom."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":125.438,"endTime":126.396,"body":"I'm Faustine Delasalle."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":126.414,"endTime":130.018,"body":"I'm the CEO of an organisation"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":126.414,"endTime":130.018,"body":"called the Mission Possible"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":130.028,"endTime":132.838,"body":"Partnership, MPP in short."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":133.178,"endTime":138.448,"body":"And MPP is an organisation that focuses"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":133.178,"endTime":138.448,"body":"on decarbonising some of the most"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":138.448,"endTime":142.868,"body":"difficult sectors to decarbonise in"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":138.448,"endTime":142.868,"body":"heavy industry and heavy duty transport."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":143.348,"endTime":145.118,"body":"So that's our mission in life."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":145.428,"endTime":150.018,"body":"I'm French, as you may tell by my"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":145.428,"endTime":150.018,"body":"accent and I'm also the mother of two"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":150.238,"endTime":152.088,"body":"daughters which I like to mention."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":153.035,"endTime":153.545,"body":"Very nice."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":153.545,"endTime":153.935,"body":"Very nice."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":154.355,"endTime":156.815,"body":"And how did you get into this ine?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":156.815,"endTime":160.508,"body":"What was your kind of Pathway to"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":156.815,"endTime":160.508,"body":"being where you are now in the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":160.508,"endTime":161.648,"body":"Mission Possible Partnership."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":161.648,"endTime":161.678,"body":"I."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":162.547,"endTime":164.767,"body":"It's"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":162.547,"endTime":164.767,"body":"an interesting question."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":164.847,"endTime":169.767,"body":"I actually worked in politics in"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":164.847,"endTime":169.767,"body":"France for several years before"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":169.767,"endTime":174.277,"body":"deciding to try and engage with"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":169.767,"endTime":174.277,"body":"the real economy and shifted"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":174.277,"endTime":177.41,"body":"career after six years in politics."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":178.1,"endTime":183.49,"body":"Went to London to change career and"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":178.1,"endTime":183.49,"body":"location at the same time, and was thrown"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":183.54,"endTime":187.213,"body":"a bit by chance in the energy space."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":187.253,"endTime":191.543,"body":"I was looking for a career with a mission,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":187.253,"endTime":191.543,"body":"but didn't know anything about energy."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":191.883,"endTime":197.053,"body":"And had the opportunity to join a very"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":191.883,"endTime":197.053,"body":"young organisation at the time called"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":197.063,"endTime":201.713,"body":"the Energy Transitions Commission which"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":197.063,"endTime":201.713,"body":"is a big coalition of companies working"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":201.713,"endTime":203.183,"body":"together on the energy transition."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":203.583,"endTime":206.803,"body":"And these were the very early days"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":203.583,"endTime":206.803,"body":"of the Energy Transitions Commission,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":206.803,"endTime":209.023,"body":"which is chaired by Lord Adair Turner."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":209.483,"endTime":213.383,"body":"And I was the first director"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":209.483,"endTime":213.383,"body":"of the ETC for several years."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":213.733,"endTime":217.803,"body":"And the Mission Possible Partnership"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":213.733,"endTime":217.803,"body":"is really a daughter organisation"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":217.823,"endTime":221.543,"body":"from the ETC. So we're always"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":217.823,"endTime":221.543,"body":"laughing with Adair saying that I'm"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":221.553,"endTime":225.466,"body":"already a grandmother to some extent."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":225.646,"endTime":229.486,"body":"And what has surprised"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":225.646,"endTime":229.486,"body":"you most in your journey from"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":229.726,"endTime":232.036,"body":"politics to now being in the MPP?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":233.2,"endTime":238.66,"body":"I'd say it's"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":233.2,"endTime":238.66,"body":"the level of commitment and momentum"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":239.26,"endTime":246.5,"body":"for climate, the climate transition"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":239.26,"endTime":246.5,"body":"across all types of organisations."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":246.81,"endTime":251.14,"body":"And I've had the chance of working"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":246.81,"endTime":251.14,"body":"with NGOs, obviously, but also"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":251.15,"endTime":254.08,"body":"with people across different"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":251.15,"endTime":254.08,"body":"types of financial institutions."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":254.58,"endTime":258.9,"body":"people across different types"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":254.58,"endTime":258.9,"body":"of companies, including the bad"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":258.9,"endTime":262.68,"body":"guys the heavy industry players,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":258.9,"endTime":262.68,"body":"the oil and gas companies."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":263.14,"endTime":268.24,"body":"And across all of those organisations,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":263.14,"endTime":268.24,"body":"I found passionate people who"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":268.25,"endTime":271.27,"body":"really wanted to make a difference"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":268.25,"endTime":271.27,"body":"and fight climate change."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":271.62,"endTime":274.89,"body":"And that's what keeps me"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":271.62,"endTime":274.89,"body":"optimistic on the bad days."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":275.21,"endTime":278.973,"body":"There's a lot of energy and"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":275.21,"endTime":278.973,"body":"goodwill going into this challenge."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":279.815,"endTime":283.161,"body":"Nice, industrial"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":279.815,"endTime":283.161,"body":"decarbonisation, it, it, it's hugely"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":283.161,"endTime":288.351,"body":"complex and difficult, but it seems"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":283.161,"endTime":288.351,"body":"to have made some strides in recent"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":288.351,"endTime":290.361,"body":"years, or at least that's my impression."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":290.901,"endTime":292.371,"body":"What do you see?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":292.461,"endTime":293.901,"body":"Well, A, do you agree?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":293.901,"endTime":298.551,"body":"And B, if so, what do you see as"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":293.901,"endTime":298.551,"body":"the biggest milestones we've hit"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":298.551,"endTime":300.291,"body":"so far and and why do they matter?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":301.655,"endTime":304.635,"body":"It's quite"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":301.655,"endTime":304.635,"body":"incredible what has been achieved"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":304.645,"endTime":307.515,"body":"over the past five to six years."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":307.955,"endTime":313.72,"body":"And when we started looking at Is it"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":307.955,"endTime":313.72,"body":"possible to decarbonise heavy industry"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":313.72,"endTime":320.81,"body":"and heavy duty transport back in 2017,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":313.72,"endTime":320.81,"body":"2018, at the ETC at the time, nobody"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":320.81,"endTime":324.19,"body":"really knew the answer to that question,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":320.81,"endTime":324.19,"body":"or everybody assumed that the answer"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":324.19,"endTime":326.32,"body":"was no, it's impossible to decarbonise."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":326.8,"endTime":331.2,"body":"And over the course of the past"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":326.8,"endTime":331.2,"body":"five, six years, first we've proven"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":331.27,"endTime":333.31,"body":"that it is possible to decarbonise."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":333.86,"endTime":338.29,"body":"Then we've managed to convince all of"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":333.86,"endTime":338.29,"body":"the major corporates in those sectors"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":338.4,"endTime":341.16,"body":"that it is technically feasible"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":338.4,"endTime":341.16,"body":"and that they should get there."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":341.71,"endTime":345.69,"body":"Most big companies in those sectors"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":341.71,"endTime":345.69,"body":"have taken climate commitments."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":346.24,"endTime":350.06,"body":"We've put that topic on the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":346.24,"endTime":350.06,"body":"agenda of policymakers as well."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":350.435,"endTime":354.175,"body":"I think every key government G20"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":350.435,"endTime":354.175,"body":"economies all have an industry"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":354.175,"endTime":355.755,"body":"decarbonisation strategy now."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":356.295,"endTime":358.525,"body":"Whether or not it's sufficient"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":356.295,"endTime":358.525,"body":"is a different question, but"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":358.525,"endTime":359.875,"body":"at least it's on the agenda."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":360.425,"endTime":365.625,"body":"And beyond the commitments, we've seen"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":360.425,"endTime":365.625,"body":"pilot projects, demonstration projects,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":365.935,"endTime":370.425,"body":"and even commercial scale projects"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":365.935,"endTime":370.425,"body":"now across almost all of the sectors."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":370.795,"endTime":376.37,"body":"If you think steel, cement, chemicals,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":370.795,"endTime":376.37,"body":"but also things like sustainable aviation"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":376.38,"endTime":378.84,"body":"fuels, sustainable shipping fuels."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":379.3,"endTime":381.3,"body":"So we've gone from."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":381.75,"endTime":382.95,"body":"You're completely crazy."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":382.95,"endTime":387.14,"body":"This is science fiction, which I"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":382.95,"endTime":387.14,"body":"have heard in the first days when"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":387.14,"endTime":392.65,"body":"I was working on those topics to"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":387.14,"endTime":392.65,"body":"actually we have a pipeline of about"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":393.04,"endTime":399.04,"body":"700 projects, commercial scale,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":393.04,"endTime":399.04,"body":"industrial projects across the globe."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":399.56,"endTime":402.16,"body":"Not all of those projects"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":399.56,"endTime":402.16,"body":"will see the light of day."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":402.47,"endTime":403.96,"body":"They're not moving fast enough."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":404.4,"endTime":409.615,"body":"But going from crazy to we have"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":404.4,"endTime":409.615,"body":"projects on the ground over the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":409.615,"endTime":411.095,"body":"course of five to six years."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":411.125,"endTime":412.455,"body":"It's quite an achievement."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":416.211,"endTime":420.081,"body":"a big difference"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":416.211,"endTime":420.081,"body":"between making commitments."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":420.471,"endTime":423.921,"body":"And actually delivering"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":420.471,"endTime":423.921,"body":"on those commitments."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":423.921,"endTime":426.816,"body":"So talk to me a little bit about that."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":428.53,"endTime":431.37,"body":"And I think"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":428.53,"endTime":431.37,"body":"that's what's coming back to bite a"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":431.37,"endTime":437.08,"body":"number of big companies that had made"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":431.37,"endTime":437.08,"body":"very bold commitments I'd say around"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":437.14,"endTime":444.32,"body":"2020, 2021 and who are now in the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":437.14,"endTime":444.32,"body":"tough place because well, companies"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":444.39,"endTime":446.03,"body":"operate based on economics, right?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":446.14,"endTime":449.97,"body":"They still need to get the business"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":446.14,"endTime":449.97,"body":"running and in the sectors that"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":449.97,"endTime":454.36,"body":"we're talking about, those harder"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":449.97,"endTime":454.36,"body":"to abate sectors, the cost of"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":454.38,"endTime":458.48,"body":"producing green is still higher"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":454.38,"endTime":458.48,"body":"than the cost of producing dirty."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":458.98,"endTime":460.62,"body":"You can call that the green premium."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":460.68,"endTime":462.6,"body":"You can call that the dirty discount."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":463.08,"endTime":469.75,"body":"But that difference means that it's"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":463.08,"endTime":469.75,"body":"very difficult to have a bankable case"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":469.98,"endTime":476.03,"body":"to invest in a green steel production"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":469.98,"endTime":476.03,"body":"plant or to invest in a green ammonia"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":476.03,"endTime":478.6,"body":"production plant around the world."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":478.88,"endTime":483.31,"body":"And so what we're really going"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":478.88,"endTime":483.31,"body":"after now is how do we improve"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":483.32,"endTime":484.97,"body":"the bankability of those projects?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":485.3,"endTime":487.81,"body":"Because if they're not bankable,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":485.3,"endTime":487.81,"body":"they won't be investable and"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":487.81,"endTime":490.06,"body":"they won't be financed and they"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":487.81,"endTime":490.06,"body":"won't see the light of day."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":490.09,"endTime":492.19,"body":"So that's really the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":490.09,"endTime":492.19,"body":"challenge we're in right now."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":493.661,"endTime":494.051,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":494.051,"endTime":495.716,"body":"And how do we make them bankable?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":496.291,"endTime":496.981,"body":"Big question."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":497.061,"endTime":500.961,"body":"We've been scratching our brains"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":497.061,"endTime":500.961,"body":"on the subject for for the past"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":501.191,"endTime":505.721,"body":"12, 18 months, speaking to project"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":501.191,"endTime":505.721,"body":"developers big and small across the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":505.721,"endTime":507.411,"body":"globe on what could make a difference."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":508.011,"endTime":511.181,"body":"And what comes back again and"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":508.011,"endTime":511.181,"body":"again and again is one thing."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":511.611,"endTime":512.901,"body":"They need a buyer."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":513.361,"endTime":517.661,"body":"Sounds simple, but you can't quite"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":513.361,"endTime":517.661,"body":"invest in something if nobody is ready"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":517.661,"endTime":521.871,"body":"to buy the product that you'll be"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":517.661,"endTime":521.871,"body":"producing and to buy it at the right"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":521.871,"endTime":523.861,"body":"price, which is really the issue here."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":524.476,"endTime":532.216,"body":"So we need to figure out how to scale"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":524.476,"endTime":532.216,"body":"demand for green commodities at a premium."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":532.766,"endTime":537.246,"body":"There's been a lot of great efforts"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":532.766,"endTime":537.246,"body":"in the past from organisations"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":537.266,"endTime":539.771,"body":"building voluntary demand signals."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":539.801,"endTime":546.401,"body":"So think, buyers, clubs, companies taking"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":539.801,"endTime":546.401,"body":"the commitment to purchase 1, 2, 3, 5"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":546.401,"endTime":552.431,"body":"percent green steel out of their total"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":546.401,"endTime":552.431,"body":"steel consumption, for instance, the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":552.431,"endTime":556.101,"body":"first movers coalition led by the World"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":552.431,"endTime":556.101,"body":"Economic Forum is one of those efforts."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":556.101,"endTime":559.831,"body":"There are other buyers clubs out"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":556.101,"endTime":559.831,"body":"there and they've done a tremendous"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":559.831,"endTime":562.766,"body":"work to do the very first step."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":562.976,"endTime":567.906,"body":"I think a number of projects that are"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":562.976,"endTime":567.906,"body":"now in construction or that have just"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":567.906,"endTime":572.086,"body":"started operating would not have seen"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":567.906,"endTime":572.086,"body":"the light of day without those efforts."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":572.636,"endTime":576.326,"body":"But those voluntary commitments"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":572.636,"endTime":576.326,"body":"are actually limited."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":576.951,"endTime":581.351,"body":"They really struggle to get to the next"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":576.951,"endTime":581.351,"body":"level of scale because companies are"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":581.351,"endTime":588.081,"body":"ready to do it on 2 percent or 3 percent"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":581.351,"endTime":588.081,"body":"of their procurement, not on 40 percent"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":588.091,"endTime":589.611,"body":"or 50 percent of their procurement."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":590.261,"endTime":594.601,"body":"And so to get to a bigger"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":590.261,"endTime":594.601,"body":"scale, our conviction is that"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":594.601,"endTime":596.431,"body":"we need policy to kick in."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":596.431,"endTime":603.223,"body":"We've  published a big report at"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":596.431,"endTime":603.223,"body":"COP29 last year, The Policy Playbook"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":603.583,"endTime":609.31,"body":"on how to stimulate demand for green"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":603.583,"endTime":609.31,"body":"commodities, through policies like"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":609.35,"endTime":615.29,"body":"mandates, through policies like product"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":609.35,"endTime":615.29,"body":"standards, building standards, that"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":615.29,"endTime":622.376,"body":"would force the buyers of steel, cement,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":615.29,"endTime":622.376,"body":"transport fuels to buy at least a share"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":622.906,"endTime":625.286,"body":"of their procurement to buy green."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":625.776,"endTime":630.516,"body":"And that would create greater certainty"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":625.776,"endTime":630.516,"body":"of market for the producers, and"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":630.516,"endTime":633.206,"body":"so it could facilitate investment."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":634.218,"endTime":634.818,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":635.688,"endTime":643.638,"body":"We've seen in the past other examples"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":635.688,"endTime":643.638,"body":"where this kind of carrot and stick"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":643.638,"endTime":646.188,"body":"approach worked, although you just"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":643.638,"endTime":646.188,"body":"seem to be talking about more of"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":646.188,"endTime":647.598,"body":"a stick than the carrot and stick."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":648.138,"endTime":653.328,"body":"As in if if I'm thinking back to"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":648.138,"endTime":653.328,"body":"the renewables around kind of 2008"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":653.388,"endTime":656.401,"body":"to 2016, they got subventions."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":656.791,"endTime":659.624,"body":"And also  there were"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":656.791,"endTime":659.624,"body":"feed in tariffs as well."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":659.734,"endTime":663.669,"body":"There there were particularly in"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":659.734,"endTime":663.669,"body":"Germany, we saw people being given,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":663.789,"endTime":669.219,"body":"I think it was 45 cent per kilowatt"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":663.789,"endTime":669.219,"body":"hour for every kilowatt hour of solar"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":669.429,"endTime":671.319,"body":"generated, which is incredibly generous."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":671.319,"endTime":673.989,"body":"I'm getting 5 cent per"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":671.319,"endTime":673.989,"body":"kilowatt hour for mine today."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":674.499,"endTime":678.999,"body":"So 45 cent back in 2008 from"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":674.499,"endTime":678.999,"body":"the, the German that really"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":678.999,"endTime":681.733,"body":"kickstarted the solar industry."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":682.123,"endTime":687.731,"body":"And if we think as well in terms of"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":682.123,"endTime":687.731,"body":"electric vehicles, we've seen here in"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":687.731,"endTime":695.361,"body":"Europe a twin effort where you as a"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":687.731,"endTime":695.361,"body":"buyer, you get a subvention on a vehicle"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":695.361,"endTime":698.691,"body":"if you're buying it, you get a bigger"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":695.361,"endTime":698.691,"body":"subvention, if you're scrapping an"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":698.691,"endTime":703.998,"body":"internal combustion engine vehicle and"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":698.691,"endTime":703.998,"body":"the manufacturers are being pressured as"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":703.998,"endTime":711.648,"body":"well because there are in 2020 they had"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":703.998,"endTime":711.648,"body":"to have I think it was 120 grams co2 per"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":711.648,"endTime":717.378,"body":"kilometer average across the entire fleet"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":711.648,"endTime":717.378,"body":"that they sold and this year 2025 that"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":717.378,"endTime":722.323,"body":"has dropped to I think it's around 90"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":717.378,"endTime":722.323,"body":"now so this is forcing the manufacturers"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":722.323,"endTime":725.503,"body":"from one side and of course we have the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":722.323,"endTime":725.503,"body":"phase out of internal combustion engine"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":725.503,"endTime":731.533,"body":"vehicle sales in Europe by 2035 so"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":725.503,"endTime":731.533,"body":"It's a combination of carrot and stick."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":731.773,"endTime":734.333,"body":"Do you think that'll work as"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":731.773,"endTime":734.333,"body":"well in the industrial sector?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":735.321,"endTime":737.901,"body":"Yes, I think"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":735.321,"endTime":737.901,"body":"the examples you're taking are"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":737.901,"endTime":739.331,"body":"exactly the right ones, right?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":739.601,"endTime":743.491,"body":"And what's very interesting about those,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":739.601,"endTime":743.491,"body":"especially when you look at the renewables"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":743.511,"endTime":748.351,"body":"story, is that you started with a lot"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":743.511,"endTime":748.351,"body":"of carrots and sticks, and then you got"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":748.391,"endTime":752.161,"body":"to a scale of production that triggered"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":748.391,"endTime":752.161,"body":"cost reduction, cost reduction, cost"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":752.161,"endTime":753.581,"body":"reduction, and more cost reduction."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":754.011,"endTime":757.991,"body":"And now it's cost competitive, almost"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":754.011,"endTime":757.991,"body":"everywhere around the world, right?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":758.401,"endTime":760.261,"body":"And you don't need"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":758.401,"endTime":760.261,"body":"those subsidies anymore."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":760.681,"endTime":766.461,"body":"So, we may not get to cost parity"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":760.681,"endTime":766.461,"body":"that fast in heavy industry but we"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":766.461,"endTime":768.441,"body":"can get the cost down with scale."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":768.896,"endTime":773.146,"body":"And that's what the Holy Grail is,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":768.896,"endTime":773.146,"body":"but to get there, we'll need those"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":773.146,"endTime":775.776,"body":"carrots and sticks in the first years."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":776.146,"endTime":780.206,"body":"And ideally, we need to do it"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":776.146,"endTime":780.206,"body":"way faster than we've done for"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":780.296,"endTime":782.466,"body":"renewables, which is a challenge here."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":783.016,"endTime":787.491,"body":"But, The carrot and stick approach"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":783.016,"endTime":787.491,"body":"is the right approach and the reason"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":787.501,"endTime":791.781,"body":"we insist more on the stick right"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":787.501,"endTime":791.781,"body":"now is that there's actually across"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":791.801,"endTime":795.761,"body":"the big G20 economies, quite a lot"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":791.801,"endTime":795.761,"body":"of carrots already put out there."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":796.261,"endTime":801.501,"body":"If you think about the US and the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":796.261,"endTime":801.501,"body":"Inflation Reduction Act, it was a massive"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":801.791,"endTime":807.496,"body":"carrot thrown to the US industry, and"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":801.791,"endTime":807.496,"body":"we've been working in the US with our"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":807.496,"endTime":809.446,"body":"partners at RMI for several years."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":809.666,"endTime":812.406,"body":"What we've seen is that the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":809.666,"endTime":812.406,"body":"carrot only doesn't work."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":812.906,"endTime":817.626,"body":"You do need the carrot and the stick"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":812.906,"endTime":817.626,"body":"where we're seeing projects progress more."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":817.626,"endTime":819.926,"body":"And we've been working in"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":817.626,"endTime":819.926,"body":"Texas and in California."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":820.286,"endTime":823.596,"body":"We've seen progress much more"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":820.286,"endTime":823.596,"body":"in California than in Texas."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":824.316,"endTime":826.126,"body":"Same amount of IRA subsidy."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":826.571,"endTime":830.521,"body":"But California has state regulations"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":826.571,"endTime":830.521,"body":"that are much more stringent."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":830.941,"endTime":835.161,"body":"And so it's the combination of IRA"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":830.941,"endTime":835.161,"body":"plus state regulations that was"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":835.161,"endTime":836.961,"body":"really the winning combination."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":837.681,"endTime":840.551,"body":"So we need that combination to happen."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":840.931,"endTime":845.778,"body":"Acknowledging also that there are"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":840.931,"endTime":845.778,"body":"opportunities in emerging economies"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":846.413,"endTime":852.373,"body":"to progress without too much carrots"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":846.413,"endTime":852.373,"body":"because those governments may not have"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":852.403,"endTime":855.643,"body":"deep pockets to do an IRA equivalent."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":856.293,"endTime":861.163,"body":"But because they have favorable"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":856.293,"endTime":861.163,"body":"economic conditions to produce renewable"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":861.163,"endTime":866.423,"body":"energy, to produce renewable hydrogen,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":861.163,"endTime":866.423,"body":"they might be able to get away with"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":866.423,"endTime":871.673,"body":"a bit more stick and not that much"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":866.423,"endTime":871.673,"body":"carrots to progress in, in country."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":872.654,"endTime":873.014,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":873.194,"endTime":873.644,"body":"Interesting."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":873.644,"endTime":873.944,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":873.944,"endTime":877.724,"body":"And I've seen some interesting things"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":873.944,"endTime":877.724,"body":"come outta developing countries like"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":878.114,"endTime":883.154,"body":"Ethiopia has banned the import of"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":878.114,"endTime":883.154,"body":"internal combustion engine vehicles"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":883.154,"endTime":889.514,"body":"and Rwanda not so long ago has banned"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":883.154,"endTime":889.514,"body":"the sail of internal combustion engine"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":889.904,"endTime":895.694,"body":"two wheelers, which made up well over"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":889.904,"endTime":895.694,"body":"50% of transport in Rwanda up to now."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":897.273,"endTime":901.903,"body":"And what we"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":897.273,"endTime":901.903,"body":"see protectionist moves like across"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":901.923,"endTime":905.533,"body":"multiple countries around the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":901.923,"endTime":905.533,"body":"world, there are economies where"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":905.553,"endTime":910.583,"body":"those protectionist instincts might"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":905.553,"endTime":910.583,"body":"actually play out positively for the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":910.603,"endTime":915.773,"body":"industry decarbonisation, because, for"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":910.603,"endTime":915.773,"body":"instance, we're very active in Brazil."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":915.953,"endTime":919.053,"body":"Brazil is a big agro producer."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":919.503,"endTime":925.873,"body":"They're importing almost the entirety of"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":919.503,"endTime":925.873,"body":"their fertilisers, which is mind blowing."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":926.823,"endTime":928.273,"body":"And it's extremely costly."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":928.353,"endTime":930.413,"body":"It has a huge impact"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":928.353,"endTime":930.413,"body":"on their trade balance."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":931.033,"endTime":935.223,"body":"But they could produce those same"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":931.033,"endTime":935.223,"body":"fertilisers at home with green"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":935.233,"endTime":939.813,"body":"hydrogen produced from their"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":935.233,"endTime":939.813,"body":"tremendous renewable energy resources."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":940.553,"endTime":946.733,"body":"So there can actually be a, an economic"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":940.553,"endTime":946.733,"body":"case and a sovereignty case to some"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":946.733,"endTime":953.013,"body":"extent to develop green industry locally,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":946.733,"endTime":953.013,"body":"especially in what we've called the new"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":953.013,"endTime":954.873,"body":"green industrial sunbelt of the world."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":954.873,"endTime":959.343,"body":"So all of those places that have a"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":954.873,"endTime":959.343,"body":"lot of sun and a competitive advantage"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":959.613,"endTime":962.503,"body":"to go after green industrialisation."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":963.443,"endTime":963.843,"body":"Nice."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":964.283,"endTime":964.653,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":965.073,"endTime":966.324,"body":"And I'm glad you mentioned the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":965.073,"endTime":966.324,"body":"finance because your  has  identified"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":967.811,"endTime":975.766,"body":"a 1 trillion investment opportunity"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":967.811,"endTime":975.766,"body":"in green industrial projects."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":976.126,"endTime":979.816,"body":"Talk to me a little bit about that,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":976.126,"endTime":979.816,"body":"what's holding it back, if anything,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":980.363,"endTime":982.749,"body":"where can we get this trillion dollars?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":982.749,"endTime":984.039,"body":"'cause I'd like a little bit of that."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":985.573,"endTime":986.133,"body":"Of course."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":986.613,"endTime":991.943,"body":"And, and look, look, what we're doing"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":986.613,"endTime":991.943,"body":"is that we're tracking the green"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":991.943,"endTime":994.023,"body":"industrial projects across the globe."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":994.093,"endTime":996.273,"body":"We have a, if you go on"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":994.093,"endTime":996.273,"body":"our website, you'll have a"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":996.273,"endTime":998.223,"body":"global project tracker there."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":998.723,"endTime":1002.863,"body":"And we're tracking whether those"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":998.723,"endTime":1002.863,"body":"projects have reached final investment"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1002.863,"endTime":1006.023,"body":"decision, which is when they get"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1002.863,"endTime":1006.023,"body":"sanctioned and start construction,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1006.503,"endTime":1011.573,"body":"whether they are past that and"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1006.503,"endTime":1011.573,"body":"whether then they start operating."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1012.898,"endTime":1015.138,"body":"The pipeline of projects right now."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1015.138,"endTime":1019.728,"body":"The last update we've done is was for"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1015.138,"endTime":1019.728,"body":"COP29 last year and the pipeline of"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1019.728,"endTime":1028.088,"body":"projects that was there in November last"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1019.728,"endTime":1028.088,"body":"year, represents about 560 projects that"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1028.168,"endTime":1032.938,"body":"haven't reached that final investment"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1028.168,"endTime":1032.938,"body":"decision stage, haven't been invested yet."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1033.648,"endTime":1037.658,"body":"And those we've assessed represent"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1033.648,"endTime":1037.658,"body":"a 1 trillion investment opportunity."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1038.428,"endTime":1040.908,"body":"So those are projects that exist."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1040.958,"endTime":1042.458,"body":"They've been announced by companies."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1042.458,"endTime":1045.358,"body":"We know where to point to them on the map."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1045.358,"endTime":1048.278,"body":"But they haven't reached the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1045.358,"endTime":1048.278,"body":"right level of bankability yet."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1049.373,"endTime":1053.493,"body":"to be invested and move forward"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1049.373,"endTime":1053.493,"body":"towards construction and operation."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1053.983,"endTime":1055.413,"body":"So that's the opportunity."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1055.453,"endTime":1059.163,"body":"And it's a tremendous, it's a"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1055.453,"endTime":1059.163,"body":"green industrial revolution, right?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1059.163,"endTime":1063.843,"body":"So when you think about why invest"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1059.163,"endTime":1063.843,"body":"in green industry, this is the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1063.843,"endTime":1067.903,"body":"next industrial revolution that can"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1063.843,"endTime":1067.903,"body":"benefit a whole range of countries"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1068.173,"endTime":1072.423,"body":"with a big investment opportunity,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1068.173,"endTime":1072.423,"body":"but to unlock it, you need demand"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1072.433,"endTime":1073.623,"body":"because you need bankability."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1074.464,"endTime":1074.884,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1075.124,"endTime":1076.519,"body":"Okay, back to demand again."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1076.744,"endTime":1077.104,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1077.624,"endTime":1082.034,"body":"Working as you do across the globe,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1077.624,"endTime":1082.034,"body":"are there any regions you see"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1082.034,"endTime":1083.624,"body":"that are doing particularly well?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1083.624,"endTime":1085.784,"body":"And what lessons can we"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1083.624,"endTime":1085.784,"body":"learn from them if so?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1088.193,"endTime":1091.453,"body":"I wouldn't say"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1088.193,"endTime":1091.453,"body":"anyone is doing particularly well"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1119.053,"endTime":1121.5130000000001,"body":"given the urgency we're facing, right?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1121.943,"endTime":1127.163,"body":"The clock is really ticking and we're,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1121.943,"endTime":1127.163,"body":"in terms of transformation of the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1127.163,"endTime":1134.373,"body":"projects into construction and operation"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1127.163,"endTime":1134.373,"body":"phases, we're going way too slow."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1134.873,"endTime":1138.7930000000001,"body":"That's the dark side"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1134.873,"endTime":1138.7930000000001,"body":"of, of where we are now."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1139.343,"endTime":1143.633,"body":"What I think is quite interesting"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1139.343,"endTime":1143.633,"body":"is that there's growing momentum in"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1143.633,"endTime":1145.2530000000002,"body":"emerging and developing economies."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1146.443,"endTime":1149.5130000000001,"body":"Half of the projects that have"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1146.443,"endTime":1149.5130000000001,"body":"been announced over the past six"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1149.5130000000001,"endTime":1152.673,"body":"months have been announced in"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1149.5130000000001,"endTime":1152.673,"body":"emerging and developing economies."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1153.153,"endTime":1159.103,"body":"So it's no longer just a kind"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1153.153,"endTime":1159.103,"body":"of Western plus China story."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1160.0230000000001,"endTime":1166.463,"body":"The US has had a big push, as we said,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1160.0230000000001,"endTime":1166.463,"body":"within Inflation Reduction Act and"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1166.463,"endTime":1169.933,"body":"the subsidies, especially the hydrogen"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1166.463,"endTime":1169.933,"body":"subsidies that were attached to it."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1170.443,"endTime":1176.333,"body":"So there should be some momentum"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1170.443,"endTime":1176.333,"body":"remaining in the US in that context."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1177.553,"endTime":1181.823,"body":"I think Europe is in a tricky place"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1177.553,"endTime":1181.823,"body":"because historically that's where"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1181.823,"endTime":1188.218,"body":"almost all of the very first projects"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1181.823,"endTime":1188.218,"body":"announced in each of the heavy industry"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1188.228,"endTime":1192.098,"body":"sectors that we're looking at have"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1188.228,"endTime":1192.098,"body":"been announced in Europe because there"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1192.098,"endTime":1197.968,"body":"was a real political willingness to"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1192.098,"endTime":1197.968,"body":"go after clean tech and government"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1197.988,"endTime":1201.553,"body":"subsidies lined up to support that move."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1202.103,"endTime":1204.823,"body":"But the European industry"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1202.103,"endTime":1204.823,"body":"is in a tough space."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1205.463,"endTime":1210.5330000000001,"body":"Europe is also not necessarily, if"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1205.463,"endTime":1210.5330000000001,"body":"you accept Spain, Portugal on the one"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1210.5330000000001,"endTime":1216.683,"body":"hand, and the Nordics on the other,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1210.5330000000001,"endTime":1216.683,"body":"not the best place to produce gigantic"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1216.683,"endTime":1219.973,"body":"amount of clean energy cheaply."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1220.5130000000001,"endTime":1227.413,"body":"So there's a real question"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1220.5130000000001,"endTime":1227.413,"body":"around how Europe can maintain an"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1227.413,"endTime":1233.0030000000002,"body":"industrial base that is competitive"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1227.413,"endTime":1233.0030000000002,"body":"in that green industry revolution."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1233.483,"endTime":1237.593,"body":"Really push its technology leadership,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1233.483,"endTime":1237.593,"body":"which it has because they started first."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1238.233,"endTime":1244.0330000000001,"body":"But also find the right trade partnerships"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1238.233,"endTime":1244.0330000000001,"body":"with other countries to get access"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1244.083,"endTime":1249.2730000000001,"body":"to the energy or the energy intensive"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1244.083,"endTime":1249.2730000000001,"body":"commodities that they need in the future."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1250.884,"endTime":1256.134,"body":"Okay, And in terms of policy,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1250.884,"endTime":1256.134,"body":"because you mentioned we're going to"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1256.134,"endTime":1261.654,"body":"need to work from policy to stimulate"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1256.134,"endTime":1261.654,"body":"a lot of this demand, what kind of"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1261.654,"endTime":1266.544,"body":"actions should governments take today to"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1261.654,"endTime":1266.544,"body":"accelerate demand for low carbon products?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1267.5430000000001,"endTime":1270.2630000000001,"body":"So I think we've"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1267.5430000000001,"endTime":1270.2630000000001,"body":"really seen, as we discussed earlier"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1270.343,"endTime":1275.213,"body":"the combination of subsidies and"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1270.343,"endTime":1275.213,"body":"mandates work well to trigger the pump."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1275.7930000000001,"endTime":1281.933,"body":"In sectors like fuels, like sustainable"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1275.7930000000001,"endTime":1281.933,"body":"aviation fuel mandates, like the ones"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1281.963,"endTime":1285.79,"body":"that are now being implemented in"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1281.963,"endTime":1285.79,"body":"the UK and Europe, but also across"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1285.81,"endTime":1288.06,"body":"a number of countries in Asia."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1288.42,"endTime":1290.8500000000001,"body":"There's one being set"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1288.42,"endTime":1290.8500000000001,"body":"up in Brazil as well."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1291.22,"endTime":1297.27,"body":"Those have really facilitated investment"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1291.22,"endTime":1297.27,"body":"in sustainable aviation fuel plants,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1297.8700000000001,"endTime":1304.13,"body":"and for materials like steel or cement,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1297.8700000000001,"endTime":1304.13,"body":"you would have to look at what are the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1304.14,"endTime":1306.29,"body":"big sectors that buy those commodities."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1306.3,"endTime":1311.17,"body":"So obviously the construction sector"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1306.3,"endTime":1311.17,"body":"buildings and building standards are"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1311.17,"endTime":1315.6860000000001,"body":"particularly important to drive demand"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1311.17,"endTime":1315.6860000000001,"body":"for green construction materials."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1316.306,"endTime":1324.9460000000001,"body":"And then some key consumer products like"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1316.306,"endTime":1324.9460000000001,"body":"cars and your white goods in your house."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1325.316,"endTime":1331.226,"body":"Those are the key kind of consumer"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1325.316,"endTime":1331.226,"body":"sectors for heavy industry."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1331.556,"endTime":1333.386,"body":"So those are the ones"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1331.556,"endTime":1333.386,"body":"you need to focus on."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1334.366,"endTime":1339.986,"body":"And what is the role of"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1334.366,"endTime":1339.986,"body":"the private sector versus governments in"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1339.986,"endTime":1341.606,"body":"making these projects bankable, if any?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1343.42,"endTime":1345.3500000000001,"body":"Well,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1343.42,"endTime":1345.3500000000001,"body":"the more voluntary demand we"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1345.3500000000001,"endTime":1346.7,"body":"can have, the better, right?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1347.28,"endTime":1348.5,"body":"That's always the case."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1348.5,"endTime":1353.76,"body":"And we continue to encourage all of"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1348.5,"endTime":1353.76,"body":"those buyer's clubs that exist out there."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1354.46,"endTime":1359.3700000000001,"body":"There's also, I think, a need for"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1354.46,"endTime":1359.3700000000001,"body":"better dialogue between the different"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1359.38,"endTime":1364.22,"body":"steps of the value chain so that"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1359.38,"endTime":1364.22,"body":"they understand what they need from"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1364.28,"endTime":1368.63,"body":"each other to have the right product"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1364.28,"endTime":1368.63,"body":"delivered in the right place, et cetera."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1369.97,"endTime":1374.44,"body":"And more fundamentally, I think, we"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1369.97,"endTime":1374.44,"body":"know that policymakers are influenced"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1374.44,"endTime":1377.1100000000001,"body":"by big companies in their backyard."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1377.3200000000002,"endTime":1381.38,"body":"So it's, it's really important"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1377.3200000000002,"endTime":1381.38,"body":"for companies to, to demonstrate"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1381.39,"endTime":1382.53,"body":"that this is feasible."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1382.79,"endTime":1386.3600000000001,"body":"And I think they have over the past few"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1382.79,"endTime":1386.3600000000001,"body":"years, because we've seen the first few"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1386.4,"endTime":1391.15,"body":"projects, we've seen the first few offtake"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1386.4,"endTime":1391.15,"body":"agreements between suppliers and buyers."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1391.55,"endTime":1397.7250000000001,"body":"So they've demonstrated this can work"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1391.55,"endTime":1397.7250000000001,"body":"to give policymakers the confidence that"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1397.7250000000001,"endTime":1403.175,"body":"they can now deploy at scale, but we"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1397.7250000000001,"endTime":1403.175,"body":"need to continue kind of that back and"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1403.175,"endTime":1408.405,"body":"forth between government and policymakers"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1403.175,"endTime":1408.405,"body":"to boost confidence on both ends."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1409.569,"endTime":1412.114,"body":"You've worked, I mean,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1409.569,"endTime":1412.114,"body":"you're working across sectors like steel,"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1412.294,"endTime":1414.634,"body":"cement, shipping, et cetera, aluminum."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1416.499,"endTime":1419.239,"body":"What sector do you think"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1416.499,"endTime":1419.239,"body":"will hit a decarbonisation"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1419.259,"endTime":1421.479,"body":"tipping point first and why?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1422.333,"endTime":1426.4930000000002,"body":"Our hope"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1422.333,"endTime":1426.4930000000002,"body":"and intent and focus and efforts"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1426.5030000000002,"endTime":1429.403,"body":"is for ammonia to go first."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1429.516,"endTime":1435.546,"body":"Ammonia, your listeners might"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1429.516,"endTime":1435.546,"body":"not know that, but ammonia is"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1435.616,"endTime":1437.576,"body":"used to produce fertilisers."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1438.01,"endTime":1440.651,"body":"And to produce explosives today."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1441.221,"endTime":1445.681,"body":"And it's considered as one of the leading"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1441.221,"endTime":1445.681,"body":"options, if not the leading option, to"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1445.681,"endTime":1448.5810000000001,"body":"be a new sustainable fuel for shipping."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1449.871,"endTime":1454.411,"body":"So there's multiple markets"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1449.871,"endTime":1454.411,"body":"looking at ammonia as their input."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1454.961,"endTime":1460.256,"body":"And ammonia is the most easy"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1454.961,"endTime":1460.256,"body":"transformation of hydrogen,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1460.256,"endTime":1463.556,"body":"if you want, there's only one"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1460.256,"endTime":1463.556,"body":"step from hydrogen to ammonia."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1464.1760000000002,"endTime":1468.846,"body":"And it's already a process that"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1464.1760000000002,"endTime":1468.846,"body":"exists because all ammonia around"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1468.846,"endTime":1472.236,"body":"the world produced today is already"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1468.846,"endTime":1472.236,"body":"transforming hydrogen into ammonia."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1472.876,"endTime":1479.146,"body":"So it's the easiest step to transform,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1472.876,"endTime":1479.146,"body":"to replace the gray hydrogen that they're"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1479.146,"endTime":1484.276,"body":"currently using by green hydrogen or"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1479.146,"endTime":1484.276,"body":"blue hydrogen, but clean hydrogen."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1484.826,"endTime":1489.776,"body":"And if we do that and manage to scale"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1484.826,"endTime":1489.776,"body":"that in the ammonia market, then we'll"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1489.776,"endTime":1492.026,"body":"scale production of clean hydrogen."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1492.366,"endTime":1495.9560000000001,"body":"And if we scale production of"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1492.366,"endTime":1495.9560000000001,"body":"clean hydrogen, we should be"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1495.9560000000001,"endTime":1497.826,"body":"able to achieve cost reductions."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1498.476,"endTime":1504.056,"body":"Economies of scale, and that will then"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1498.476,"endTime":1504.056,"body":"benefit all other sectors, steel, aviation"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1504.386,"endTime":1507.4460000000001,"body":"that will want to use hydrogen as well."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1507.9460000000001,"endTime":1510.836,"body":"But that's kind of, in our"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1507.9460000000001,"endTime":1510.836,"body":"minds, it's the first domino."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1510.866,"endTime":1515.976,"body":"It's ammonia as the first domino to"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1510.866,"endTime":1515.976,"body":"scale hydrogen production, clean hydrogen"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1515.996,"endTime":1520.336,"body":"production and therefore facilitate the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1515.996,"endTime":1520.336,"body":"transition of everyone else in the space."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1521.304,"endTime":1526.704,"body":"And what's the one"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1521.304,"endTime":1526.704,"body":"untapped opportunity in industrial"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1526.704,"endTime":1530.059,"body":"decarbonisation that you think the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1526.704,"endTime":1530.059,"body":"world isn't paying enough attention to?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1531.863,"endTime":1534.123,"body":"Well,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1531.863,"endTime":1534.123,"body":"ammonia is definitely one."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1535.422,"endTime":1535.842,"body":"Any others?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1537.056,"endTime":1541.4460000000001,"body":"And the others"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1537.056,"endTime":1541.4460000000001,"body":"well, I'd say going back to basics"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1541.7160000000001,"endTime":1547.141,"body":"as well, in terms of pursuing"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1541.7160000000001,"endTime":1547.141,"body":"energy efficiency where you can and"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1547.141,"endTime":1549.711,"body":"pursuing systems efficiency as well."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1550.241,"endTime":1554.881,"body":"And we often forget that you"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1550.241,"endTime":1554.881,"body":"can build a building still with"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1554.881,"endTime":1556.271,"body":"cement, but with less cement."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1556.271,"endTime":1558.251,"body":"You can fly less."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1558.751,"endTime":1563.8210000000001,"body":"You can build automotives and lightweight"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1558.751,"endTime":1563.8210000000001,"body":"them so that you have the right"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1563.8410000000001,"endTime":1567.481,"body":"balance between steel and aluminum"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1563.8410000000001,"endTime":1567.481,"body":"and use less steel and aluminum."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1567.934,"endTime":1575.199,"body":"So those design options are also really"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1567.934,"endTime":1575.199,"body":"important to make progress in terms"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1575.199,"endTime":1577.059,"body":"of short term emissions reduction."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1577.6970000000001,"endTime":1584.6570000000002,"body":"If we move out 10 years"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1577.6970000000001,"endTime":1584.6570000000002,"body":"to 2035, how do you think we'll look"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1584.6570000000002,"endTime":1587.747,"body":"back on this moment in industrial"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1584.6570000000002,"endTime":1587.747,"body":"decarbonisation, And what do you think?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1588.347,"endTime":1591.557,"body":"Or what do you hope we'll say"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1588.347,"endTime":1591.557,"body":"about 2025 and the actions we've"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1591.557,"endTime":1592.9370000000001,"body":"taken in the last 10 years?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1594.227,"endTime":1596.567,"body":"It's interesting"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1594.227,"endTime":1596.567,"body":"you ask this question because our"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1596.567,"endTime":1601.387,"body":"whole organisation is right now"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1596.567,"endTime":1601.387,"body":"focused on 2030 as the milestone."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1601.631,"endTime":1606.601,"body":"We have a target for 2030 based on all"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1601.631,"endTime":1606.601,"body":"of the analysis we've done in past years."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1606.991,"endTime":1610.8010000000002,"body":"We know that we need about 700"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1606.991,"endTime":1610.8010000000002,"body":"green industrial plants to be up"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1610.8010000000002,"endTime":1617.3010000000002,"body":"and running in 2030 to be on a"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1610.8010000000002,"endTime":1617.3010000000002,"body":"1.5 degree compatible trajectory."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1617.3010000000002,"endTime":1621.421,"body":"So to help the world limit the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1617.3010000000002,"endTime":1621.421,"body":"rise in global temperatures to as"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1621.451,"endTime":1623.451,"body":"close as possible to 1.5 degree."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1624.8210000000001,"endTime":1630.931,"body":"And I'm not overly optimistic that"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1624.8210000000001,"endTime":1630.931,"body":"we'll meet that 2030 milestone, because"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1630.931,"endTime":1637.951,"body":"if you think about the time we have"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1630.931,"endTime":1637.951,"body":"left to meet it, it's basically 12,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1637.951,"endTime":1642.991,"body":"18, 24 months at best, because you"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1637.951,"endTime":1642.991,"body":"need several years to actually build"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1642.991,"endTime":1645.3410000000001,"body":"the plant once you've approved it."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1645.761,"endTime":1649.656,"body":"So if plants are not approved by"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1645.761,"endTime":1649.656,"body":"end of 2026, There's no way they"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1649.656,"endTime":1651.236,"body":"will be up and running by 2030."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1651.736,"endTime":1654.306,"body":"So that's kind of our immediate challenge."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1654.836,"endTime":1658.6760000000002,"body":"But then if you shift the focus"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1654.836,"endTime":1658.6760000000002,"body":"to 2035, I'm way more optimistic."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1659.256,"endTime":1663.776,"body":"Because although I'm not sure,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1659.256,"endTime":1663.776,"body":"increasingly pessimistic on the fact"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1663.776,"endTime":1668.816,"body":"that we'll hit our targets by 2030, it"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1663.776,"endTime":1668.816,"body":"makes me very optimistic that we have"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1668.816,"endTime":1672.996,"body":"such a huge amount of projects in the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1668.816,"endTime":1672.996,"body":"pipeline announced across the globe."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1673.476,"endTime":1678.506,"body":"And even if they're not up and running in"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1673.476,"endTime":1678.506,"body":"2030, they might be in 2031, 2032, 2033."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1679.116,"endTime":1683.506,"body":"So I'm more optimistic about the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1679.116,"endTime":1683.506,"body":"change that will have happened by 2035."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1686.107,"endTime":1687.607,"body":"is that time enough?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1689.846,"endTime":1695.396,"body":"It's, it's"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1689.846,"endTime":1695.396,"body":"insufficient to limit the rise in global"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1695.406,"endTime":1697.576,"body":"temperatures as much as possible, right?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1697.996,"endTime":1702.1960000000001,"body":"But it's better than if we"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1697.996,"endTime":1702.1960000000001,"body":"do nothing and keep keep"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1702.596,"endTime":1705.361,"body":"temperatures rising more and more."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1705.576,"endTime":1707.406,"body":"Any half degree counts, right?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1707.4460000000001,"endTime":1711.6760000000002,"body":"So,  that's the objective is"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1707.4460000000001,"endTime":1711.6760000000002,"body":"to go as fast as possible with"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1711.7160000000001,"endTime":1713.286,"body":"as many projects as possible."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1714.135,"endTime":1717.795,"body":"And what about"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1714.135,"endTime":1717.795,"body":"some emerging technologies?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1717.795,"endTime":1721.155,"body":"Are there any emerging technologies"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1717.795,"endTime":1721.155,"body":"like AI or blockchain or any of these"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1721.155,"endTime":1725.075,"body":"kind of things that you see have a"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1721.155,"endTime":1725.075,"body":"role in accelerating decarbonisation?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1727.41,"endTime":1729.21,"body":"Well,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1727.41,"endTime":1729.21,"body":"I'd say it's three things."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1729.91,"endTime":1738.18,"body":"One is that, I actually see AI as a"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1729.91,"endTime":1738.18,"body":"threat right now, just because it consumes"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1738.19,"endTime":1744.13,"body":"so much electricity that it will make"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1738.19,"endTime":1744.13,"body":"it more difficult for energy intensive"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1744.13,"endTime":1748.75,"body":"industries like steel or cement to"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1744.13,"endTime":1748.75,"body":"get their hands on cheap electricity."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1749.3,"endTime":1754.53,"body":"So I think the competition"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1749.3,"endTime":1754.53,"body":"for clean electrons is being"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1754.53,"endTime":1756.81,"body":"intensified by the rise of AI."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1757.3600000000001,"endTime":1761.3600000000001,"body":"On the other hand there are"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1757.3600000000001,"endTime":1761.3600000000001,"body":"definitely opportunities for more"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1761.3600000000001,"endTime":1767.5800000000002,"body":"system efficiency for more energy"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1761.3600000000001,"endTime":1767.5800000000002,"body":"efficiency, that new technologies"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1767.6000000000001,"endTime":1769.69,"body":"and AI technologies can bring, right?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1770.1100000000001,"endTime":1773.3600000000001,"body":"So that's an area where I'm hopeful."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1773.91,"endTime":1778.43,"body":"And there's a bunch of technologies and"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1773.91,"endTime":1778.43,"body":"we focus as an organisation more on making"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1778.43,"endTime":1784.075,"body":"technologies that are mature enough, get"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1778.43,"endTime":1784.075,"body":"to commercial scale and deploy at scale."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1784.4550000000002,"endTime":1788.1950000000002,"body":"But there's also very interesting"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1784.4550000000002,"endTime":1788.1950000000002,"body":"technologies across sectors like"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1788.1950000000002,"endTime":1793.645,"body":"cement, for instance, that are not"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1788.1950000000002,"endTime":1793.645,"body":"yet as mature but could be real"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1793.655,"endTime":1798.835,"body":"game changers in the space, new"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1793.655,"endTime":1798.835,"body":"cement chemistries, for instance."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1799.2150000000001,"endTime":1801.4750000000001,"body":"So that's, that's exciting."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1802.3220000000001,"endTime":1803.4070000000002,"body":"Okay, fantastic."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1803.827,"endTime":1806.047,"body":"A left field question for you."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1806.6470000000002,"endTime":1814.857,"body":"If you could have any person or character"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1806.6470000000002,"endTime":1814.857,"body":"alive or dead, real or fictional"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1815.3970000000002,"endTime":1820.082,"body":"as a spokesperson for industrial"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1815.3970000000002,"endTime":1820.082,"body":"decarbonisation, who would it be and why?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1823.515,"endTime":1828.435,"body":"This is the type of"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1823.515,"endTime":1828.435,"body":"question that I really struggle with."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1828.645,"endTime":1835.575,"body":"So, I'm not big on superheroes,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1828.645,"endTime":1835.575,"body":"so, or on big celebrities."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1835.595,"endTime":1838.6950000000002,"body":"Everything we do at MPP is done"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1835.595,"endTime":1838.6950000000002,"body":"in partnership with others."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1838.6950000000002,"endTime":1841.165,"body":"We really believe in the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1838.6950000000002,"endTime":1841.165,"body":"power of collaboration."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1842.075,"endTime":1844.185,"body":"Can I go with a left field answer?"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1844.472,"endTime":1845.012,"body":"Of course."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1845.752,"endTime":1850.8220000000001,"body":"I think I'd say the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1845.752,"endTime":1850.8220000000001,"body":"pioneers who did the opened the first"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1850.8220000000001,"endTime":1856.462,"body":"mountaineering roots in the Himalayas,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1850.8220000000001,"endTime":1856.462,"body":"for instance, are quite a good symbol"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1856.462,"endTime":1862.252,"body":"for what we want to do collectively"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1856.462,"endTime":1862.252,"body":"with other partners because they're."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1862.952,"endTime":1868.0220000000002,"body":"they're climbing step by step, like"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1862.952,"endTime":1868.0220000000002,"body":"every two, three years, we climb another"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1868.0220000000002,"endTime":1869.892,"body":"milestone and then another milestone."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1869.892,"endTime":1873.412,"body":"At some point we'll get to the"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1869.892,"endTime":1873.412,"body":"end of the route and to the peak."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1873.462,"endTime":1875.7720000000002,"body":"We're not there yet, but we keep climbing."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1876.432,"endTime":1880.992,"body":"And by nature, I think the work"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1876.432,"endTime":1880.992,"body":"we do is a collective endeavour,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1881.712,"endTime":1882.632,"body":"like any mountaineering."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1883.962,"endTime":1884.752,"body":"expedition."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1885.535,"endTime":1892.152,"body":"So that's, I would go to the Mulleries"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1885.535,"endTime":1892.152,"body":"and Herzogs of this world who have"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1892.3220000000001,"endTime":1895.172,"body":"pioneered mountaineering in the Himalaya."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1896.048,"endTime":1896.6480000000001,"body":"Oh, Interesting."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1896.738,"endTime":1897.008,"body":"Nice."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1897.008,"endTime":1897.308,"body":"I like it."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1897.488,"endTime":1897.758,"body":"Good."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1898.298,"endTime":1898.598,"body":"Cool."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1898.6280000000002,"endTime":1902.238,"body":"We are coming towards the end"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1898.6280000000002,"endTime":1902.238,"body":"of the podcast now, Faustine."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1902.768,"endTime":1907.928,"body":"Is there any question I haven't asked that"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1902.768,"endTime":1907.928,"body":"you wish I had or any aspect of this we"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1907.928,"endTime":1910.568,"body":"haven't touched on that you think it's"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1907.928,"endTime":1910.568,"body":"important for people to be aware of?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1910.7820000000002,"endTime":1912.0420000000001,"body":"This"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1910.7820000000002,"endTime":1912.0420000000001,"body":"was a fun conversation."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1913.178,"endTime":1913.928,"body":"Okay, great."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1914.1380000000001,"endTime":1915.6680000000001,"body":"Super Fantastic."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1916.008,"endTime":1916.308,"body":"Faustine."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1916.328,"endTime":1917.228,"body":"that's been really interesting."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1917.228,"endTime":1921.038,"body":"If people would like to know more"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1917.228,"endTime":1921.038,"body":"about yourself or any of the things"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1921.038,"endTime":1923.653,"body":"we discussed in the podcast today"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1921.038,"endTime":1923.653,"body":"where would you have me direct them?"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1924.238,"endTime":1925.858,"body":"We're"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1924.238,"endTime":1925.858,"body":"most active on LinkedIn."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1926.038,"endTime":1928.768,"body":"You can find me at my name,"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1926.038,"endTime":1928.768,"body":"Faustine Delasalle, on LinkedIn."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1928.778,"endTime":1934.558,"body":"We have a Mission Possible Partnership"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1928.778,"endTime":1934.558,"body":"page as well with a monthly newsletter"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1934.6280000000002,"endTime":1939.598,"body":"called Signal that people can sign up"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1934.6280000000002,"endTime":1939.598,"body":"to and our Mission Possible Partnership"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1940.308,"endTime":1946.1580000000001,"body":"website is also a good place to go"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1940.308,"endTime":1946.1580000000001,"body":"for all of our analysis of past years."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1946.178,"endTime":1949.1280000000002,"body":"There's a lot accumulated there"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1946.178,"endTime":1949.1280000000002,"body":"and the global project tracker I"},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1949.1280000000002,"endTime":1950.578,"body":"mentioned is also on our website."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1951.525,"endTime":1953.935,"body":"fantastic i'll put those"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1951.525,"endTime":1953.935,"body":"links in the show notes Faustine"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1953.9550000000002,"endTime":1955.4550000000002,"body":"so everyone has access to them."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1955.905,"endTime":1958.4850000000001,"body":"Great Faustine that's been really"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1955.905,"endTime":1958.4850000000001,"body":"really interesting thanks a million"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1958.4850000000001,"endTime":1959.595,"body":"for coming on the podcast today."},{"speaker":"Faustine Delasalle","startTime":1960.3680000000002,"endTime":1961.208,"body":"Thanks for having me."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1961.707,"endTime":1963.577,"body":"Okay, we've"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1961.707,"endTime":1963.577,"body":"come to the end of the show."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1964.297,"endTime":1965.4070000000002,"body":"Thanks everyone for listening."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1966.267,"endTime":1970.4170000000001,"body":"If you'd like to know more about the"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1966.267,"endTime":1970.4170000000001,"body":"Climate Confident podcast, feel free to"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1970.4270000000001,"endTime":1974.337,"body":"drop me an email to tomraftery at outlook."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1974.587,"endTime":1978.067,"body":"com or message me on LinkedIn or Twitter."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1978.637,"endTime":1982.377,"body":"If you like the show, please don't"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1978.637,"endTime":1982.377,"body":"forget to click follow on it in your"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1982.3970000000002,"endTime":1986.877,"body":"podcast application of choice to get new"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1982.3970000000002,"endTime":1986.877,"body":"episodes as soon as they're published."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1987.507,"endTime":1990.467,"body":"Also, please don't forget to"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1987.507,"endTime":1990.467,"body":"rate and review the podcast."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1990.6670000000001,"endTime":1993.1970000000001,"body":"It really does help new"},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1990.6670000000001,"endTime":1993.1970000000001,"body":"people to find the show."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1994.287,"endTime":1994.737,"body":"Thanks."},{"speaker":"Tom Raftery","startTime":1995.4070000000002,"endTime":1996.327,"body":"Catch you all next time."}]}