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The Storage Investor Show
The Booming Small Bay and Flex Industrial Market with Cody Payne
Links
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https://flexbusinessparks.com/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/codypayne/
Description
Small bay industrial warehouse investing is booming. My special guest, Cody Payne, Senior VP at Colliers in the DFW area, will explain what to look for and how to manage your next small bay or flex industrial deal.
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Hey everybody, welcome to the Storage Investor Show. Guys, we have a great episode for you today on small bay industrial warehouses. My guest today is Cody Payne. He's the senior VP at Colliers in the DFW area. He was just at the Self Storage Association event in Texas and Austin just a couple of weeks ago. We didn't cross paths there, but we connected on LinkedIn. I'm glad we did, because I know a lot of you guys are interested in this product type. It kind of it doesn't fully mirror self-storage, but the buildings kind of look similar. Right, they have a roll-up door and all that. So we tend to think of those being the same, but they're not. Cody, welcome to the show.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I appreciate it. Thanks for having me. Yeah, it was great. Yeah, it was good one.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was packed. It was good information a lot of the uh, the key guys and gals there and you were saying before we started that you made several connections apparently. Obviously you don't do self-storage, you do small bay, but it sounds like some folks are trying from the storage business, are trying to get into small bay. What is that, uh, looking like?
Speaker 2:yeah, yeah, and I'll tell you so that's probably the biggest. When you look at any asset class, that's the biggest asset class that's coming into the small bay flex. You do have part of your multifamily guys that have been coming into it that we've been selling to several office guys, retail guys, but the storage guys are the ones that have really taken, you know, the most. You know I guess you know the horse frame, as you would say, and adding onto their part or building, you know similar to it, because if you build self-storage, building flexes is pretty easy compared to if you've never done it before. You're coming from another asset class, especially the metal construction side. I mean it's a very similar style build. You're right. I mean, well, what you're really doing is you're making the bays larger, you're raising the ceiling high through building a little more infrastructure in there.
Speaker 2:Management's obviously different, but storage guys are very hot and heavy coming into it. That's actually why we went to the Self Storage Association is because there are several people from out of state and they're like hey, we'll be in Austin, can you come out? And after we set a couple of meetings, we're like let's just go to the storage convention and just check it out and we met several more people. There is that we've been talking to that. We're actually helping them find land to build a fallback flight far or two of them have land next to their storage facility and we're evaluating that to see if it works for Flex as well. So, yeah, very popular among the storage guys.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that's critical. I mean, it's a very similar product Metal doors, roll-up doors, metal building. It's going to be kind of a no-brainer for a lot of guys and gals in the self-storage space, but you started to go down the path. Let's define what we're talking about. When it comes to small bay, what are we talking about? How big are the buildings? How many units do you typically have? How many acres is it typically set on? What does it look like? I know there's probably some variants there, a range, but give us a general idea?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and so your average park that's being built right now is around 50,000 square feet. The tenant size range is usually running around, you know, 1,800, 2,000, 2,200 square feet. These are tailored to your, you know your small businesses anywhere from. You know subcontractor base, you know electricians, plumbers, landscapers, and it's not uncommon to have, you know gyms and maybe even small restaurants, even office spaces in some of these, and so the park size obviously can vary depending on how many kids you want to go in there. We just sold one that was a little over 2,000 square feet. It had about 115 tenants in it.
Speaker 2:These sizes can range as well. What makes them flexible is the ability to say you have a 10,000 square foot building and you've got it in 2,000 square foot increments. Right, you can have five tenants there. What makes it flexible is it allows that 2,000 square foot tenant. If they need, they can expand into the next space and have 4,000, 6,000, 8,000, or even downsize if need be. And so, but your average suite size, like your best suite spot right now, about 1,800 square feet across the US at the largest tenant pool and the most active tenant pool in the small day flex side.
Speaker 2:But you're at, and I'll just add on as you were saying, they usually have a roll-up door and a walk-in door. Some of them have maybe some showroom retail glass on the front or whatnot, but that's usually how they look. Sometimes the doors can be put on the back sometimes. Usually how they look. Sometimes the doors can be put on the back, sometimes they're on the front, but they're on grade level similar to storage no dock high because tenants of that side typically aren't getting shipments from ATO wheelers. But yeah, they're popping up everywhere. Very popular in Texas, colorado, carolina, georgia, I mean they're now becoming a very large asset class.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm sure that as you guys are listening to the podcast or watching online, you can probably think of some places you've seen as you drive by, and that's what we're talking about. Right, so they're like maybe what 16-foot roll-up doors or whatever. They're just bigger doors on the front end. The door could be in the back, of course, but then you have an access door like a normal size like door that the tenant can go in and out of, etc. And that big roll-up door they can get their machinery out, they can open it up. For, like you said, you know, maybe there's a crossfit gym or something like that that usually utilizes that space, or you know, whatever landscaper gets their trucks and equipment out or their equipment out of that space. Is there like infrastructure? When I say infrastructure, is there like a bathroom inside, like an office space inside, like the whole thing is 1800 square feet, but you kind of divide that up into maybe like an office space plus, like the warehouse space. Is that how that looks? So a?
Speaker 2:lot of times your standard build is going to be if you have 1800 square feet, it's going to have one office and a restroom and then the rest warehouse. And so now sometimes states will add on more, maybe a few more offices, maybe none, maybe ac the whole space, depending on the location. Sometimes you have the ceilings are high enough. He'll put mezzanine space above to be able to stack a little higher. But for the most part your standard finish out can be well and a rectuary.
Speaker 1:Okay, and then what kind of land typically needs to be zoned for this type of product?
Speaker 2:So I'll tell you, a lot of it's being built in the county, outside the etj, where there's no restrictions. That's where a lot of people are doing it because, uh, the issue that you have and you know this with with storage, is cities aren't not all cities are as fond of metal construction, and so to build this out of tilt wall where you got new tilt wall concrete is substantially more expensive and let the rates are there. But as far as zoning goes, a lot of people look for light industrial zoning, especially in Texas. That's kind of the popular zoning that will allow for it. And then there's other, you know varying ones that, depending on how you build it, you know it can maybe do some type of commercial zoning as well.
Speaker 1:Okay. So do you recommend, when you're looking at land, to do this type of project? Do you recommend do you have to go through rezoning typically like nine times out of 10 because it's ag land or something else and you have to go through that process or can, as far as light industrial or general commercial?
Speaker 2:you know that we see relatively easier to find. But, like I said, we're doing a lot of stuff in the county. A lot of people are finding these new up-and-coming home developments and trying to, you know, put one of these parks next to them, and so there's a lot of county land that is very popular for people getting into the flex side.
Speaker 1:Okay, got it, and so 1,800 square feet office, bathroom, you know, and some sort of light industrial zoned land, typically within the county, because it's kind of hard to go through rezoning or get it approved, you know, in the city, et cetera, which makes a ton of sense. What are the rents? I know this is going to vary, guys, by market, of course, location etc. But just obviously you can speak to your area, your market. What are you seeing for rents where you're at?
Speaker 2:So I think Texas is averaging almost 14 bucks gross, which is going to put you around $12 plus triple met, and that's actually the unique thing about it is compared to storage leather asset classes, you know, besides retail, obviously. But uh, it's not uncommon to have triple met leafs on the small day flex, which means, as a landlord, not only are you getting the base rent but you're allowed to recapture for a portion of the taxes, insurance and common area maintenance. So that's a huge helper, especially, as you know, today with inflation, the rising insurance, rising taxes, and I think that's one of the things that's made us have that class so popular is that lease structure. But now obviously you can have gross leases and whatnot, but real rates have been trending up over the past four years across the US on the quality of life side, and I mean they're doing very well. You got some markets that are still seeing 5% annual increases, so I mean very strong in a lot of areas.
Speaker 1:Interesting and what drives some of that demand that we talked about. You know, obviously we'll talk about the capital market side. We talked about just the product itself. So, like on the user side, what's driving some of that demand? Is it new home construction, population growth? You know how does somebody feel comfortable maybe going from storage into this type of asset class, because obviously that end user is going to be really important? What is driving some of the demand in this space?
Speaker 2:Well, and actually funny thing, I was actually just talking to somebody earlier about it and they were like how do we understand, you know, the demand, how do we grasp? And one thing that I'd say so I've been doing small business flexure. This would be my 20th year next year and when I first got in the business it was literally just your small contractor, your landscapers and plumbers, and that was really it. Well, since COVID and as the e-commerce business continued to increase quite a bit, the small business entrepreneurship, these now lease to a plethora of people.
Speaker 2:So we just sold a park with the Fort Worth. It had a retail tenants in it, it had an office tenants in it, it had your subcontractor base, it had showroom guys in there that you know had nice tile and flooring stores in it. And so your tenant base has now grown exponentially over the past four years and to where it just tailored to this one sector. Now it has, out of any commercial real estate asset, it's got the most diverse tenant pool right. You can't name another asset class that pools not just from wide industrial but showroom, retail, office. And so it's expanded the tenant pool exponentially and that's why you have such high occupancy and such high demand for this asset class and it drives really well off of, you know, new home construction population growth as well. But, like I said, you know we're now filling parks that actually have tenants that came from office buildings to it because they like the drive up ability.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know what? That'd be my dream office. I, when I'm recording this, is in my home office. I have another office elsewhere, but like something like that, where you pull up it's you know, roughly 2000 square feet. You open up the roll-up door on a nice day, you got some workout equipment in there, and then the podcasting space, uh, you know, I think that's's. Uh, that is a pretty cool concept. There's a guy over here who built one, uh, class a. I would consider it class a. It's not full metal, it's concrete walls and all that stuff. It's really nice. Yeah, I don't know what the rents are, but that's the one I always think of. There's that one that's class a and literally across the street is like an older version of that. Like with metal buildings, it's like class c and that thing is always full. Oh yeah, uh, but it's generally you, it's like class C and that thing is always full.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, but it's generally, you know, it's like it's two different competing product types and it's really interesting what are the leases? Like you mentioned triple net lease but like, do they sign a year long? Is it multi-year? Like how does that look for the landlord?
Speaker 2:So typically we like to see one to three year leases. We don't like anything over three years because, especially in some of these markets, the annual increases have been so high you don't want to have somebody on such a long term lease and now they're so far under market. One to three years is a very good term to have your months on. Market is in a lot of markets sitting around maybe two to four, and so it's very easy to get ahead of your vacancies, especially if you start trying to lease it. As you know, maybe a tenant is leaving, but but yeah, they're usually shorter term, you know, not as long term as maybe some office and retail leases are, and larger industrial. Obviously it's rare to have month to month. I'll tell you that.
Speaker 1:Very rare, yeah. Yeah, I wouldn't think so. I mean, I would think if you had decent demand, you can get them in there and keep them in there for a year at least.
Speaker 2:Well, we'll see people. Yeah, we'll see people put them on a month to month after they've been there a while, If maybe they want to resign. But nobody signed an initial lease to the month to month.
Speaker 1:No, no, that wouldn't make sense. Okay, Okay, and then so buyers, like where is capital coming from? Obviously, we talked about folks coming from the self-storage space. Do you see other large groups being formed to purchase this type of property, or is it kind of more like one off, a group here, a group there, like what does that look like?
Speaker 2:So that's been the most exciting thing actually about the Fast Tag class. I got a great team here and for the longest time forever, it was literally just flex buyer and maybe a few storage buyers for a long time, and now you got a lot more storage guys that are coming into it, large storage developers that are coming into it to build it and invest in it. But because of inflation Chris, check this out because of inflation we've had so many office groups, office funds, office REITs looking at it, multifamily as well, and the reason they like it is because when a tenant leaves a flex space and a new tenant comes in, it's a very short amount of time as far as releasing. But also that tenant refinish out cost is next to nothing, which is similar to storage. I think storage probably has the best tenant re-tenanting cost. Right, you go in, you sweep it out and it's ready to go. There is similar to storage. I think storage probably has the best tenant retending costs. Right, you go in, you sweep it out and it's ready to go.
Speaker 2:I don't know, there's nothing to it and so, and so you look at the, if you're looking at it and you go okay, I want to invest in an asset class that inflation doesn't hit as hard. Right, Storage is probably going to be your number one. Flex, I think, is right there at number two, because that's what's hurting is, you know, that's what's hurting the office sector, that's what's hurting the multifamily sector, and we've got guys here that leaf and fell off it and they'll tell you, four or five years ago to refinish out an office space was maybe $10 to $15 per square foot. That's staying today is $40 to $50. But the rental rate hasn't changed, right? No-transcript. Our economy is, I mean, yes, we have inflation much lower than it has been, but I think it would be very hard to see it actually go backwards, if that makes sense. So those guys in the multifamily and in the office side, I mean, they're just repaying those and the rate will just have to catch up at some point.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we have to be getting to a deflationary situation, which I don't know if that's when that could happen or how probably some sort of economic shock.
Speaker 2:You'd have a huge market issue if you had that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you'd have to have something else happen outside of just policy. Okay, so before we go down that rabbit hole, okay, what does the lending space look like? How do I get a loan? Is it local bank, credit union, sba, like what is it? You know, this may not be your wheelhouse, but just generally speaking, what does the financing look like?
Speaker 2:I'll tell you it's significantly friendlier than it used to be right. So 10 years ago banks really didn't like lending on metal buildings. They were very unfriendly with it, required a lot more down payment, maybe higher on the interest rate. Now it's a very friendly asset class. Banks love it. A lot of people use local. We just did a deal with the Minnesota Life Insurance as well on a fairly large project. So as far as lending goes, we're really not having any issues with lenders. Not lacking me after that class, all of them love it. Don't have any issues lending on it. If you're doing a new construction deal and maybe you want to buy land and go get a loan to do new construction, I mean we're still seeing rates on the high side eight and a half, nine, 10% very easily. Some can go higher on certain hard money or bridge lending, but your general loans I mean. So today's, the 13th of November, a couple of recent ones we did. I think one was at six and a half and so not too bad with 30% down.
Speaker 1:Oh, that isn't too bad.
Speaker 2:That's actually not bad at all, but I will tell you unlike storage, though, I don't think you get an SBA loan on Flex because you're not actually running a business, and I know some storage guys have actually asked us that Can you get an SBA loan? And we've never seen that happen because you're not. The difference is they're looking at storage as you're running a business.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they wouldn't qualify. Okay, so what are the generally speaking going in cap rates? Where are they trading at right now?
Speaker 2:So if you're looking at stabilized, they'll be anywhere from 7 to 7.75, depending on the area. Obviously, if you're in a tertiary market, it can continue to go up a little higher. If you're infill, it can continue to go lower. The lowest stabilized that we've done was probably in the low sixes, but it was in very good location with very good annual increases.
Speaker 1:Okay, okay, got it. Yeah, I mean it sounds like a very uh much like a sister property to self storage. You know it doesn't seem like it's too complicated for anybody who's in the storage space. You're used to the month to month. So a year long lease, does you know, kind of makes a little bit more sense. You lease, does you know, kind of makes a little bit more sense. You're dealing with a little different tenant. I'm curious to know on the management side what you mentioned you alluded to earlier on the episode. What does kind of the again, this may not be your complete wheelhouse here, but just generally speaking what does the management of something like this look like? Because in storage, you know, you might be turning five-ish 2% to 5%, maybe 10% of your rent roll every month, whereas in this you have a longer term lease, it's triple net. How does the management look for an owner?
Speaker 2:So, as far as the management side, I'll tell you, I think it's, and I've actually owned storage, I've owned Plex, and I think Plex is a significantly easier management side, just because, A you can only outsource the leasing. So if that outsource you don't even have to mess with that. And as far as, uh, maintaining the property, you know, if the tenants are on triple net leaf is a lot of times they're responsible for their anything in their unit anyways. So no maintenance calls really arrived. Um, that's one thing that we've heard from people that have come from the multifamily side. Uh, they love it as well because they're like we don't ever get any call on it whatsoever and definitely don't get a call after 5 o'clock.
Speaker 2:You know, as far as the average tenant rollover, that's an interesting stat that you had on the storage side and I thought that we should probably. It's a difficult number. We've been trying to figure out what that is on the flex side, but because leases vary so much it's really hard to say. You have an average of 10% or 20% rollover a year. It depends on how you structure your leases. But it's a very good tenant retention at that class and so usually once the tenant goes in, you don't see that tenant leave as often as you do in other asset classes.
Speaker 1:Try to look for tenants because they're businesses. Do you look at their credit history or their? What if it's a newer landscaping business or something like that? How do you judge whether a tenant may be a good person to do business with, a good business to do business?
Speaker 2:with. So that's a good question. And I started my career actually leasing FlexSafe. We've got a great FlexBase leasing team here and they answer that question all the time and it's very simple. You know you do a credit check, background check. If they're a business, they've been in business for a while, you know you can get them company financials. If they have a location previously, you can look into that. If it's a riskier tenant and you don't have a lot to go off of except maybe a background check, and if all that passes, sometimes we'll ask for a significantly higher security deposit, um, to maybe help alleviate any potential issues you could have. And some of that maybe can be paid back over time. So it's not uncommon if somebody's brand new, you know you don't really have much to go off of to say, hey, give us three months security deposit. If you're still good at the end of the 12 month, we'll give you two of those months back. We'll hold one for the rest of the term, and so there's things like that that our guys work out all the time.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's interesting. Okay, so that makes sense as a broker. I'm just curious, doing this business you've been in this business for challenges that you have as a broker in the small bay market Is it might be gotten easier now with new buyers, but are sellers kind of hard? It sounds like a great product. Is it kind of hard to find some sellers who want to part ways with their property it is?
Speaker 2:That's really our biggest issue is not so much selling it but actually getting the product. And I think storage guys will probably say the same thing, because you do have some owners that are your mom and pop guys, that have owned it for a long time. It's great cash flow. It makes no sense or rhyme or reason to sell. Then you have people that are trying to, you know, collect and accumulate a portfolio to sell up to an institution in certain areas and not just in DFW, but even Houston, San Antonio, Colorado, other markets is people can oversaturate an area with new construction very easily, which I think also can happen in storage or boat and RV. That I've seen as well. And so that's one thing to keep in mind, because we've actually seen some areas where rates have gone backwards a little bit because of the oversupply. And then the other thing that we actually have that we that I'll tell you actually this is interesting Our biggest issue that we have when we get a investment is somebody that has a flex industrial part on the same parcel as a self-storage facility and that can't be parceled off.
Speaker 2:And so we always tell people to definitely parcel these, because we're not self-storage brokers. We do have great self-storage contacts, but a lot of self-storage guys, especially your highest paying buyers, as you know, they're not buying Flex right now. Your highest paying Flex buyers are not buying storage. So when you're mixing a hybrid asset, you're now trying to find that potential buyer that understands how to operate both, and that's really probably the biggest challenge that we have. We've sold two of those here recently and they didn't go as high per square foot as one traditionally would, because we had to find that guy that understood the self-storage side as well. So we always say you want to do it in the storage side? Great Love it.
Speaker 1:You should do it, Parcel it off separately yeah, it's going to be important to subdivide that. Uh, you really should. Uh, if you can, I think of one here that traded in south charlotte. That was like that you had. It wasn't even really small bay, it was more like kind of like retail ish, like class c type retail on the front end and storage was in the back, um, so it's kind of interesting. The whole whole thing did trade, but it was just something that you would not normally see and you're right, even if you'd have those three-story deals.
Speaker 1:Nowadays municipalities they want you to put retail on the first floor of those three or four-story self-storage facilities. That retail on that first floor rarely does well. I've never seen it do. Extremely Usually they're like one or two that are dark. There's one that we had up in Mebane it's near Raleigh where the retail actually did well because he had long-term tenants there but he was right next to a Lowe's home improvements and that kind of helped. But otherwise, that the mix of it. It just makes it really tough and sometimes the REITs and the larger buyers they won't even touch it because, like you said, it's two different types of management, it's two different types of leases. It doesn't make sense for them to try and figure it out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we call them the Swiss army. Knife, the swiss army, nice fit everything everybody.
Speaker 1:Yeah, those dang municipalities. They think it's like a great ad deal, I'll put retail down there. It's like that's not, you're gonna see, it's what they want.
Speaker 2:It's usually what that is.
Speaker 1:It's what they want, yeah yeah, yeah, you know, I can't blame them, I understand they do the same thing with flex.
Speaker 2:They say we'd like to have the front facing the road is nice retail, and you kind of gotta weigh it to see if it even works. And you know, flex guys don't want to build retail. And so you know, it's, it's uh yeah. But yeah, you're right, the, the, the fitties are the ones that usually try to dictate that, because it's what they want, yeah.
Speaker 1:They want it to look nice, which I don't want it to look bad. I want it to look nice too, but it's better if you have, like a nice I forget what's called the shielding whatever Nice facade. Yeah, so you can't see the building. Yeah, like a nice facade. Like, keep it like that. Don't add retail, because what am I going to put in there? A vape shop, you know, like a Vape shop and a font shop Exactly like what do I do?
Speaker 1:Yeah, who's going to? I don't want people driving in and out and all well. I mean we're kind of hitting on the next question here. What are some of the risks that you see that maybe newer investors aren't really thinking of as they get into small bay and some things you've seen kind of kind of go south at?
Speaker 2:also, if you're building in a market, that maybe has quite a bit of supply. Understanding the amenities that you need to add on. To now diversify yourself. Flex has a lot of amenities that you can add on it. You can add mezzanine space. You can add a lot of showroom glass. You can add thin storage yards, which we touched on earlier, industrial outdoor storage. That's huge. People will add covered parking, additional storage bays, things of that nature. So there are things that you can do to differentiate yourself from other people, and when people go build, sometimes they'll just build what we call an efficient model. That's very basic and that's the stuff that's the most competitive, that sees the most competition across the US.
Speaker 1:Interesting. So the industrial outdoor storage we've talked about that before in the podcast. We're adding in some other.
Speaker 2:I never really thought about those being amenities, but adding in some amenities, oh people, yeah, we get people to add fenced-in side yards to the back of the building or on the side of the building all the time. That's some of the best amenities that you can put on for tenant retention.
Speaker 1:That's a really good one, man. I appreciate that. Well, what advice as we wrap up here, what advice would you give to a newer investor trying to break into and find their first deal in the small base space?
Speaker 2:I mean, like, if you want to buy land and build new, obviously find somebody that understands that area. Buy a land and build new, obviously find you know somebody that understands that area. Find you a specialist. Get the right team around you. You know, get a good engineer. If you're going to buy existing, you know, get aligned with a good agent that you know can really tell you about the area, what the pros and cons are, how you can take this delay from here to here. Just like anything on the you know commercial real estate investment world, you want to have a good advisor that you know can look out for you and help you understand how to get the building from here to here. Or if it's just stabilized and it's value add. You know you want to find out what what best works for the criteria that you're trying to find.
Speaker 1:Perfect. I want to ask you, before I forget, are there any in storage, where I know we touched on this briefly earlier on. But uh, back to the buyers who want to kind of quantify demand so, like in storage, you might look and say, well, there's this many feet per person, therefore demand is going to be strong. But is it just more qualitative measures like that, versus quantitative, like so many feet per person in an area you know might be oversaturated for small bay? Is there anything like that within the small bay space?
Speaker 2:Yes, no, there is. So there's a few factors that we look at and you're right, our storage guys, they have that metric of per square foot per person in the area. Ours is a little bit different. Ours actually has. We have quite a few demographics that we look at.
Speaker 2:We look at business count. We look at business count this year, last year and over the past five years to see how many businesses have been coming into the area. You want to see a good consistent. If it didn't sell the kind of men maybe have a whole lot of growth to it, but it'll stay consistent. Whole lot of growth to it, but it'll stay consistent. You don't want to see that kind of go down like you can in some market.
Speaker 2:We look at rental rate. We look at rental rate increases over time. If you see the rental rate increases have been doing this and then do this, that means you've kind of hit the peak of the market and so your annual increases are not going to be as high as maybe you think. We look at, obviously, population growth, household income, business income, spending per capita is really big. If you're doing a showroom style field where you maybe have to go to a showroom or retail tenants, it'll be in there. So there's a lot of different metrics that we look at on that to figure out what drives it, what makes it the best. We look at vacancy rates, over time, absorption rates and time on market.
Speaker 1:As far as leasing goes, Okay, perfect, as you're talking about all that stuff, it kind of makes sense. Again, like you said, you look at population growth, you look at what markets are. I was just on the census map earlier today for building permits and they have the multifamily, single-family building permits in little bubbles across the US for different states and it'll show you where there's more building permits and if they're declining or whatever. So it can show you where places are potentially it doesn't mean that they actually are, but potentially growing in population and those may be the markets that you want to target for this type of product, because more people, more dollars get spent, more homes get built, the more they need contractors, et cetera, to help work and fix things. So I think it's great, man. This has been a great discussion. Cody, before we end here, how can people reach out to you if they want to learn more, if they want to do a deal with you? Get on your list, you know, and kind of go from there.
Speaker 2:Absolutely Appreciate it. Obviously, you know I'm on LinkedIn. You can go to our website, flexbusinessparkscom. We also have a great book out, flex Faith Domination. You just go to our site and we can get you hooked up with one of those as well and we can get you on our list.
Speaker 1:We can help you buy, build, do whatever you want to do on the Flex side Perfect.
Speaker 2:What was the website? One more time.
Speaker 1:Flexbusinesscarkscom. Perfect, I'll have that in the description for the episode. As easy as it is to me. That's it, man.