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The Storage Investor Show
From Residential to Self-Storage: Steve Baldwin's Investment Journey
Connect with our guest:
https://sjbaldwin.com/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/sjbaldwin/
Episode description:
Join us on the Storage Investor Show as we sit down with Steve Baldwin, the president of Midwest Self Storage Solutions. He's shifting his focus entirely to storage investment. Discover how Steve strategically targets Class B minus to C properties in the Midwest's rural and tertiary markets, leveraging sourcing techniques like ringless voicemails and cold calling. This episode has insights into Steve's buy box criteria and how he navigates competitive markets.
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Hey everybody. It's Chris here with the Storage Investor Show. My guest today is Steve Baldwin. He is the president of Midwest Self Storage Solutions. He is in residential and commercial, but making the transition to full-time storage investor, trying to divest from some of those other asset classes and jump into storage with all of his cashola, his giant cash pile. Steve, welcome to the show. Hey Chris, thanks for having me. Awesome man, glad to have you on. We're going to cover a lot of ground about what you're looking for. You know management trends, why storage all that kind of stuff? But let's jump right into your buy box. I know you're making the transition now. You did own some storage several years ago. You sold that, I guess I can add in. Maybe sold it regrettably. But the point is, is that you're making the transition back to storage? What are you looking for in a deal right now and why does that kind of appeal to you? That you're the type of deal you're looking for. Why does it appeal to you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely so. Right now we're looking for deals in the Midwest. I feel like that's. I'm in Ohio, so right now, if I can hop in a car and drive within six, eight hours, I feel like that's kind of you know, a win, especially when it comes to meeting boots on the ground and meeting with sellers. It feels like it's been really convenient for me. I've had some really good conversations down in Kentucky and Pennsylvania, so it's a nice location win for me, trying to keep everything under two, three million if possible. I get spread pretty thin with those down payments, but that's just kind of where we're starting right now.
Speaker 1:Okay, got it, and then is it all. So anything under two, roughly two to $3 million. So that's going to be maybe single story, maybe a mix of non-climate or climate control, something like that. That's my guess. Is that right?
Speaker 2:Exactly, exactly. Class B minus to C. I love the rural tertiary markets that no one's really looking at right now, so having a lot of really good conversations with sellers in those areas.
Speaker 1:Okay, so that brings up a good point on the rural tertiary markets. I was talking to somebody else about it the other day and I've always been just to be open here. I've always been of the mindset that maybe it's good to buy deals where areas are growing in population and economics and all that kind of stuff, which is what a lot of people say. But then you get a lot of people fishing in those same holes, whereas in the tertiary type markets there isn't as much competition. But on the flip side maybe the population growth isn't there or whatever. How do you kind of overcome I'm sure you've gotten some questions maybe from investors et cetera, who might bring that up how do you kind of view that you know that sentiment or that thought.
Speaker 2:Well, it really comes down to purchase price right up front when I'm doing my pro forma. I mean, I guess the thing is, is you really you have to buy at the right price and then see what kind of ancillary income streams you can add on top of that to make it worth it? You know, I think like, like I said, not too many people are fishing in those arenas, so there's less noise, there are less competition. Now everyone I talk to says that they have received multiple letters. So that's okay. But you know, know, I'm there shaking their hand and if I can make the numbers work, it comes back to the purchase price.
Speaker 2:A lot of times too, there's some great seller finance options that I'm getting in these tertiary markets versus, you know, in the city, in the B areas, people just want to cash out. They're moving 1031 exchange into a larger asset, which is fair. But the C class, you know, kind of the mom and pop in the rural areas, I don't want to say they're not as sophisticated but they're not really doing that 1031. They're just looking to pay that big tax hit and move to the Bahamas or Florida what have you?
Speaker 1:Yeah, there's nothing, and let me back up for a second. So my question there there's nothing wrong with looking at those deals. It's just sometimes a different perspective on. You know where the best deals are located, et cetera. I think what you said is correct. Like it goes back to the purchase price. There's a lot of people who are you can get a better deal sometimes in those types of markets. It's interesting you mentioned that they have already received you know several letters or whatever. How are you? That brings up sourcing. You know how are you looking for these deals. Is it direct phone calls? Is it brokers, a combination? What does that look like?
Speaker 2:Oh, my gosh combination. So really the one thing that I don't love, just coming from residential market, is texting. But I feel like the more feelers you have out there, the more you know opportunities you're going to look at. So we've done some rounds of mailers. Uh, you know, right now it's uh, the holidays, so sending out holiday cards, but uh, cold calling just to follow up on those cards. At least we have something to relate it to when we're calling it still cold. But and also we're we're doing, um, implementing some ringless voicemails as well.
Speaker 1:Okay, very good, that's. That's interesting. Um with the how. How did you get the list of of um addresses for the owners?
Speaker 2:Uh, we, we sourced our list from data axle.
Speaker 1:Data axle. I've heard of them before. Uh, that's pretty good. Ever looked into Yardi? Uh, matrix.
Speaker 2:I have. I looked at Yardi. I've worked with Yardi. I've worked with a few different companies in the past, more for the residential side. Back when we were doing more flips. That was a lot bigger back then. But I feel now I went to one of the larger investors in storage and just kind of picked his brain and he said he gets pretty good results with Data Axle. So I didn't want to recreate the wheel.
Speaker 1:That makes a ton of sense. So talk to us real quick about Data Axle. How does that work for storage investors as far as accessing the list? And then is there any sorting that needs to happen? What has it been like working with those folks?
Speaker 2:So similar to creating your buy box. It was actually pretty good. It was a very, very good personal experience. It was less than going to a website and filling out your general information and it was more about hey, steve, my name is Jeff, I'm willing to work with you. Here's what we can offer you how can we help? What areas are you looking in? So very similar to the beginning of this conversation. They asked what areas? What's your buy box? And I gave them several states in the Midwest that I'd like to start with Came up with a list about 4,500. And I said I went, I didn't want any class A, so class B and lower, and then we were talking about. We were able to narrow it down based on volume as well, and it's pretty interesting. They had some really good, good results with that.
Speaker 1:Interesting. So you actually tell them what your buy box is. They go and pull the data for you and then give you the data. So you're not looking up I don't know how, like in Reonomy I think it is a couple of years ago, I used that and you kind of just plug in what it is and it shows you all of them and you have to do the sorting and kind of figuring out whether a deal fits your criteria or not. But they will do it for you.
Speaker 2:It sounds like Exactly, it was very manual with them and it was great. It was a good experience. I've worked with prop stream and at Rionomy and where you're sorting through and you're kind of you know you have to sort out their LLC. Like some big corporate names pop up and you're still sorting through it. But this was pretty good. I some big corporate companies could pop through a little bit, but that's okay, they're not getting my Christmas cards.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the data's not always perfect.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they don't fall. They don't. Those guys don't fall for that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, joe, and Joe aren't getting Christmas cards from us this year, so, okay, very good. So let's talk real quick. We talked about the buy box and all that. Are you working with brokers as well?
Speaker 2:So I've been networking with a couple of brokers and in fact I've had my residential real estate license for about 12 years. I did a stint for about a year and a half and had recently hung my license up, and now it's looking like I might be hanging it with SVN. So just had some really good conversations with a broker there, kristen Asman, and I think it'd be beneficial for the direction that we're taking our business.
Speaker 1:Interesting, so are you adding in a brokerage component to your business?
Speaker 2:So similar to what I was doing with residential when I had my residential real estate licenses. It's just going to be for our business. So selling or buying will kind of filter through the brokerage for personal reasons, but probably not taking on clients so much, unless some of the sellers that I talked to would like to go that route. That would kind of be like a plan C, plan D for them. I always like to have a lot of tools in the toolbox, as they say. When I'm having great conversations with sellers I'd hate to just get off the phone and say, hey, the numbers don't work, because it could work for somebody else. And if they're okay with it to list it and see if we can get them closer to that number, then I'm happy to help them.
Speaker 1:Heck yeah. Or you can do a referral fee. I have my real estate license also in North Carolina. Those are some of the easiest deals that I've ever done is just sending them off to somebody else and then collecting the referral fee because of the license and not having to spend a whole lot of time with it. So I think people kind of miss that part. People with broker's licenses kind of miss that part, but that's a whole other topic. So okay, what kind of challenges are you facing as you're looking for deals? I mean, you know, I know that's gets pretty competitive still in those tertiary markets. Have you faced any challenges up to this point?
Speaker 2:You know what does that look like, I think the biggest challenge is kind of being honest with the sellers about you know their purchase, their asking price. I think a lot of times guys are kind of you know, they, they like the number, you know the 3.2, because it sounds good, you know, and I would just say, well, let me let me just. The challenge is to educate them on where, what their income is and what their expenses are and what it would look like if I was to purchase the property. So I'm very transparent. I like to share the principle and interests at the PITI and just talk about what it looks like. Hey, listen, if we buy this at 3.2, it gets real skinny at that point. So the interest rates we're always fighting against the interest rates and that'll always be that way. But you know, hopefully they calm down a little bit. Is there anything we can do on the purchase price? If you're looking to move to Florida right now, then you know this is the number we need to play around with.
Speaker 1:So that's really the challenge. The price is always the challenge, right, that's the biggest thing that can even derail a deal. After you buy, it is what you paid for it, oh yeah, so that's, I think, probably where the seller financing and all that can come into play. But that makes a ton of sense, man. I think everybody listening will obviously keep that in mind that the pricing, that negotiation, is pretty tough. How about, like do you find some of the sellers? I don't know if you've gotten to this point or not, but have you had some of the sellers being willing to share financials and if so, what does it look like when they send them to you? Because I know that from my own experience and others that it can be kind of spotty, you know, with the financials. Is that challenging as well?
Speaker 2:It's been a mixed bag. I guess like one out of every five would have no financials, but they can tell you what they make every month and they can tell you what their expenses are. Everybody else I mean. It's handwritten, you know you get a lot of the handwritten results but you know, most of the time people have. I'm seeing a lot of easy storage solution websites with sellers that I'm talking to, which is great because then they're exporting the financials from there and easy to read, easy to comprehend.
Speaker 1:Yeah, 100%. That makes sense. And then, as you're looking for deals, how do you kind of, when you're writing those cards or sending the letters, how do you kind of tailor the messaging to stand out from some of the competition?
Speaker 2:Well, I'm a family guy, you know. So I don't know if this is the way, but a lot of the letters that I've pulled and seen and courses and are very like you know, hey, this I've got to go with the top professional guy. I'm more um. Hey, my wife and I, you know, we're looking to add to our portfolio for our family, so I try to keep a little bit more of a personal touch to it, which I feel a lot of people could relate to. Um and I. I just I've always gone that route and I feel comfortable with it. And, uh, you know it's, it starts off with a lot of good conversations when you're building rapport. I mean talking about family, their family my family, it's everything when building rapport.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that, that is a good point there. I know some other folks who do something very similar and if that messaging work, it resonates with you, because it has to be you right, you as a person, and if appealing that way works for you and you feel comfortable with it, that makes a ton of sense. You're right, it's kind of hard, right, you don't know what messaging is going to appeal to what person.
Speaker 2:So you kind, of have to go with what works like for you in the end. And I was once told too that you know these are their babies, and especially when the further out you go in rural hey, my grandfather passes down to me in 85 and I've had it for 20 years. It's their baby and they want to make sure that whoever they sell to is not just going to put a U-Haul sign and go completely corporate with it. They, they want to see, they want to stop by. You know some I've had conversations where they would still be involved with managing day to day. They were they're okay with, you know, helping out if possible. So you know, I think that's one of those things where they want to see, they want to feel good about who it's going to as well, like handing off their child.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you mentioned management real quick there. What's your thoughts on the management side? Are you trying to do a remote model, or are you trying to do, maybe, a hybrid, or what does that look like?
Speaker 2:trying to do, maybe a hybrid, or what does that look like? So currently I'm building a kind of like more of a hybrid model with with a VA, a couple of VAs that would help out. I love all the automation that's available out there right now, and I know that it's not a fit for every facility, but a lot of these smaller facilities, you know, under 10,000 to 15,000 square feet, I can go automated all day long, so that's my preference. But you know, if I have a lease up, we've got a couple of projects that we're working on that you know we'll need a lease up and it'll be. It would behoove us to have someone on site during the lease up period. Yeah, that always helps.
Speaker 1:We made that mistake where we didn't have anybody and that's pretty tough, okay. So I'm curious about your story, going back to, obviously, storage years ago and then residential, commercial and maybe divesting from some of those or all of it or whatever. Why storage for you? What appeals to you now that you have some experience and maybe some other asset classes as well?
Speaker 2:Sure, yeah, so I've had. I started with my first. Two rental properties were seller finance and probably the two worst neighborhoods in Columbus, Ohio Hilltop and Linden shout out. So I started there in 2010 and just, it was rough, you know, and I was just really I was just trying to be scrappy. I was in corporate, I was listening to a lot of bigger pockets and learning about the ins and outs of real estate. I got my real estate license to, you know, make sure that if I was, if I was to wholesale that, I was doing it legally and that's how it started.
Speaker 2:So, working in those neighborhoods, I started doing some projects in gentrifying areas as well, near Children's Hospital, and we started working on a lot of projects and I realized I didn't really want to be in the city. So currently I live in Granville, ohio, which is about 25 minutes east of Columbus, and it feels a lot safer out here. So I started investing in more of the rural market out here, which, you know, from 2010 to today, you know, it's not so rural anymore it's, you know, columbus has grown this way. So, but that said, I've had a lot of experience managing tenants myself, managing property managers and managing commercial tenants, and really what it comes down to managing humans and where they live. There's a lot of emotion there's, you know, when people can't pay their rent and we go through the court system and we win, they want to put concrete down the toilets.
Speaker 2:This year I've had, you know, four furnaces go out and two roof repairs, or two like roof. You know four four furnaces go out and two roof repairs, and or two like roof, you know, replacements. So it's been one of those things where it's like, wow, you know, this is really. It's really becoming tiring and I would like to get something into the next asset. Our portfolio got to the place where we're looking for the next big thing Um, you know where we're basically cashing out of it now. So I was looking into mobile home, parks, multifamily or storage and I did my due diligence, education on the other pass and end up with self-storage and I just love everything about it.
Speaker 1:Perfect. That's awesome, man. It helps. I had some of it a couple of years back and all that. Your story makes a ton of sense. You is a rough situation where someone's putting concrete down or just destroying the house in general. I remember when I did foreclosure work, when I first got my real estate license in 07 and was doing foreclosure work in 08, 09 during the great financial crisis. You go into some homes, man, and I'm in my house right now and like there would not be one spot on the wall where drywall was still intact, Like every spot where they could hit between the studs, they had destroyed the walls before being evicted.
Speaker 2:So yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean the plumbing gone. You know, thankfully we don't see as many foreclosures and that issue isn't as prevalent as it was back then. But but to your to your point. When you go through that with somebody, the eviction process can be very taxing emotionally and financially and it's just not very fun. So that makes a ton of sense. Man, are you guys funding everything yourself right now or are you planning on raising equity capital in the future? Like what does that look?
Speaker 2:like yeah, so currently I'm I'm looking at raising equity. Um, we're doing some small syndications. I'm not looking for, you know, a hundred people to get on anything but really small syndications to start taking down some of these properties and, you know, creating a portfolio and getting them managed. Now, smaller properties that make sense closer to home, I could take down myself and probably looking at SBA loans, so working with the same bank that I had an SBA loan with on that facility about five years ago.
Speaker 1:Okay, perfect. And then so on the capital raise, are you trying to obviously podcast and things help? Are you trying to how are you going about that, you know, to let folks know that you exist and is, you know, educational?
Speaker 2:And then from there with the content we're going. We're doing a lot of networking, so I love going to the conferences, have a lot of. You know I'm going to big sky next month for the executive SSA conference, but really just shaking hands and talking with people that are in the same industry too I've. Again, I like to be transparent, be transparent about where we're at in this journey, and kind of my wife and I is when I say we about what we want to do with our family business, and so I like to have that conversations with investors as well. It's like you know, where we're at now is we've got a decent portfolio and we're looking to move, move assets into storage from there, but we're also looking for investors along the way.
Speaker 1:Perfect, and are you guys, is there like a? I don't know if you thought this far yet or not, no problem if you haven't, but is there like a preferred return? Is there? Is there? What's the structure look like and what are you looking for as far as like maybe a whole period, just like general parameters that you're offering to investors? That inquire.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know it's going to be different for every deal, so I haven't really gotten to pencil in a specific what we're offering yet. I think it's pretty average. You know what people are seeing and it comes down to the individual that's investing with us too. I see that a lot with you know my past investors and we've started talking with them what they would like to see and that's a good jumping off point. Most of our projects are about one to two year. I'd like to keep it under one year but with the value add depending on the level of construction that we're adding, management and raising the rents. Not too bad to get it going over a course of year, but better if we can get it over two years. New construction, which we have a couple of new construction projects around Ohio right now that is more of a three-year project. So really going in working with SBA and having them go through the construction process with them and then, year three, go ahead and pay their prepayment penalty of 1% and then cash everyone out.
Speaker 1:Okay, got it. So you're looking at. You know you're trying to move kind of quickly on certain deals, but the point is you're, you're, you're. Obviously the timeline is important for each deal. You're looking at what the investor horizon is, et cetera. So maybe you know three years on average, something like that. So that that makes sense. Okay, very good, let's talk real quick about just what you're seeing. So you're getting back into the industry. You're obviously getting out there shaking hands, uh, meeting folks, et cetera. What are you seeing as far as some of the trends, um, that are happening right now? Uh and I know this is kind of get kind of old because you hear this like in every SSA magazine and every ISS uh thing. You know and post on LinkedIn that the newest whiz bang gizmo out there or whatever. But what you know, what are you seeing in general as, as you're getting back into the industry?
Speaker 2:Well, I don't think you can go anywhere without hearing the two letters AI. Right now there's just AI and they're squeezing AI and everything I mean you know, even for like hey, do you want a brief description? Do you want AI to help you? Hey, do you want you know, ai to chase your tenants for you? And the AI chatbots. So I'm seeing a lot of AI and I honestly have and have completely jumped on that bus. I love it. I've developed a AI chatbot for property management to handle phone calls and text messaging and emails to tenants. So I love it. I think that it's got a long way to go. There's some great AI out there now where it's conversational and it sounds very natural.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I love that and that's really good. We should start a company called Storage AI or AI Storage or something like that, and that would be our thing. If we can get one of those Tesla bots to manage the place for us, that would actually be perfect. At some point in the future.
Speaker 2:I've seen some wild robots, yes, and then if they had an AI component where they can talk to you, it's getting pretty scary there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it is pretty wild, Dude. I use chat GPT for everything. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I know in school, like my kids are in school, and they'll ask me questions about a project or whatever. I'm like just pop it in a Chad's UPT. But I know they can't do that. So you know, at least not yet. But man, it just makes sense. It's do all those things for you and it just it makes sense to continue to use it and obviously, as we see it, grow and integrate into the storage industry.
Speaker 2:That's a great point. I didn't think about that. That's a really good point that you made, I think, and to go along with that like. So my kids are in school and you know it's it's of course it's a no-no to use chat GP to write your papers. However, I feel like it's important that teachers teach our kids the right way to use it to source ideas and to get subject lines and, you know, really to help them with it, because it's not going anywhere and it's not like you know. I think that's just going to be the norm for, you know, book writing, essay writing People are going to start getting a lot of ideas. I mean, you can generate the content and put your truth behind it, but I think that the teachers should really start teaching them the right way.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, I'll do that too, like with posts on LinkedIn. Just out of curiosity, sometimes I'll copy and paste the post and ask it if it was written by AI and it will tell you, like what percentage likely was written by AI. And I use a couple of different ones because I just want to see what people are doing and it's okay, like if my favorite author is using AI to write 50% of his post why would you not?
Speaker 2:you know why would you?
Speaker 1:spend a lot of time thinking about whether this sentence makes sense or not. You know, like it's, it's that that's unnecessary.
Speaker 2:Just as long as you believe it, you know, I think as long as you can back that you know and you're in line with it, then it's okay. You don't want it to sound too AI ish, though that's the problem. Sometimes you see that you're like this is definitely AI.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's the AI buzzwords that you can, that you can kind of tell.
Speaker 2:So yeah, very good man.
Speaker 1:Give us some advice. Okay, so we have some folks who are listening who maybe are new to the business or they're trying to jump in or maybe do their second deal or whatever. Give us some advice. What would you tell your earlier self? You know as you're well, I guess you're kind of early in the business but what would you tell yourself? Some mistakes you made? Or how would you advise yourself to get to this point where you're at right now?
Speaker 2:Well, I think just getting comfortable talking to sellers is so important. You know a lot of people are very uncomfortable with cold calling, but it's not that bad. The sellers, a lot of the sellers, are sitting there waiting for the phone to ring at their facility. So, honestly, if you're driving past even if you're out of town you're driving past a facility and it's like wow, you know, that looks pretty nice and it looks, you know, like it would check off of my buy box. Just pick up the phone and call them and, you know, start asking them about their facility and and introduce yourself and just getting comfortable. The more reps you have with that, the better off you are. You know, closing a deal, building rapport, you know it's all about rapport, rapport, rapport, rapport, rapport and then awesome, yeah, so that's really for me, I think that's the most important thing is just start talking to people.
Speaker 1:Awesome and that's actually very good advice. It's it's tough sometimes to pick up the phone. I know I don't want to do it.
Speaker 2:You know sometimes you just say oh, I don't feel like calling this person.
Speaker 1:Hope they don't answer, please don't answer, please don't answer. And then the answer. Then it turns out being, you know, uh, the best deal ever, if had to happen a couple of times. So very good, man, let's. Let's wrap everything up, steve, with the final four questions brought to you by our sponsors. Check the description for the episode. You'll see all the links there. But give us real quick, steve, a career highlight or high point. And what did you learn through that experience?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I would say a career high point for me was when I officially retired from corporate. I did about 10 years in corporate and worked for some big retailers and advertising agencies around Columbus and was a good experience. However, I just realized that the ceiling was pretty low and so when I was able to have enough we had enough rental income to suffice for my salary I was able to step away from there and focus on real estate investing full-time.
Speaker 1:Perfect man. Talk to us real quick about a career challenge and what'd you learn through that experience?
Speaker 2:So I think really, just you know kind of cutting my teeth and running my own businesses, you know at that, from that challenge, from that transition of corporate into being an entrepreneur, you know hiring, managing, I did a lot of managing, I became a general contractor and managing a lot of trades and just really trying to keep it organized. That was one of the biggest challenges Multiple projects, multiple contractors and keeping everything organized.
Speaker 1:How did you do that? How did you keep things organized?
Speaker 2:Well, I had a software that I used at the time I want to say Buildium, but that's not the right word. I'll have to report back to you on that. It was like a contractor software, where each project was laid out and had what contractors were working on it and which you know, what the budget was and what finishes the client picked out. Um, you know, ultimately did that for about two and a half years, and then from there I was able to just focus on my projects and, um, then it became a lot easier.
Speaker 1:That's amazing man. Yeah, sometimes those project management software things work really well. We've used mondaycom in the past and that's not real estate specific, but it can be tailored to that, so I think that's great. Man, give us a quick recommendation business resource storage, investing resource, whatever it is book, person, conference, podcast could be, whatever. Give us a resource that could help us find our next deal.
Speaker 2:So I've really been nerding out on Google with Google RSS, so with the RSS feed, so I've gone and got the best news sources from the storage industry, added it into my feed and now I have a constant reel of storage industry news. That is super helpful, especially when it comes to creating content and just being in the know and educating myself on the next level. In addition to that LinkedIn. My LinkedIn reads almost the same way and I love it.
Speaker 1:That's awesome man. Yeah, a lot of people are sleeping on LinkedIn. I think Instagram is popular, x is growing more and more popular, but I think LinkedIn is an interesting place. On X, they do make fun of LinkedIn and that's okay, cause we're all like yay for everything, but anyway it is where business does get done. Last question, steve how can people reach out to you, get in contact if they want to invest or just stay on your radar for future deals?
Speaker 2:Yeah, they can reach out to me on LinkedIn or they can go directly to my website. It's sjbaldwincom. Perfect Thanks, Steve, for being on.
Speaker 1:Yeah, thank.