American Ancestors on the American Revolution

Genealogists David Allen Lambert and Melanie McComb of American Ancestors talk about how family history reshapes our understanding of the American Revolution. Drawing on the vast collections and scholarship of one of the nation’s oldest genealogical institutions, Lambert and McComb explore how military records, pension files, and local archives reveal stories far beyond famous names—illuminating the lives of women, immigrants, and Patriots of color whose contributions sustained the Revolutionary cause. From the remarkable longevity of Revolutionary War widows to the quiet resilience of families on the home front, the episode highlights how genealogy transforms “names and dates” into vivid human stories. Together, they make a compelling case that uncovering the past isabout rediscovering the ordinary people whose choices shaped a Revolution—and whose descendants still carry that legacy forward. 

Transcript

WEBVTT
 
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 Hello, everyone.
 
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 Welcome to the Revolution two fifty
 
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 podcast.
 
 00:00:03.813 --> 00:00:04.472
 I'm Bob Allison.
 
 00:00:04.552 --> 00:00:06.235
 I chair the Rev two fifty advisory group.
 
 00:00:06.275 --> 00:00:08.756
 We are a consortium of about seventy five
 
 00:00:08.817 --> 00:00:11.038
 organizations in Massachusetts planning
 
 00:00:11.179 --> 00:00:12.881
 commemorations of American independence.
 
 00:00:12.941 --> 00:00:16.044
 Our guests today are David Allen Lambert
 
 00:00:16.083 --> 00:00:17.004
 and Melanie McComb.
 
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 both from American Ancestors,
 
 00:00:19.385 --> 00:00:21.086
 the New England Historic Genealogical
 
 00:00:21.126 --> 00:00:21.606
 Society.
 
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 David Lambert is the chief genealogist.
 
 00:00:24.307 --> 00:00:26.428
 Melanie McComb is the senior genealogist.
 
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 And American Ancestors is a great
 
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 institution and a venerable institution.
 
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 So why don't you tell us a bit
 
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 about
 
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 What American Ancestors is, what you do,
 
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 and how people can get involved if they
 
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 want to find out more.
 
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 Do you want me to?
 
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 Go ahead, by all means.
 
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 So American Ancestors was started in
 
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 Boston in eighteen forty five.
 
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 Our current home is at ninety seven
 
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 Newbury Street,
 
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 where we welcome people interested in
 
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 their family history or scholars that are
 
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 working on books, which we've done now.
 
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 for well over a hundred and eighty years
 
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 uh we now have a new family heritage
 
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 experience uh which you can actually go in
 
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 and get the getting started of genealogy
 
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 if you've always been curious about it to
 
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 the point that we also have you know
 
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 millions of manuscripts over a quarter of
 
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 a million books um so you can essentially
 
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 learn about your family and it doesn't
 
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 matter if they came over on the mayflower
 
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 or came over twenty years ago we try
 
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 to give
 
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 the assistance to anybody,
 
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 whether they're an immigrant or their
 
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 parents or great, great,
 
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 great grandparents were immigrants.
 
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 So that's one of the reasons we kind
 
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 of shifted from New England Historic
 
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 Genealogical Society to American Ancestors
 
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 to serve the greater need of anybody
 
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 researching their ancestors who came to
 
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 America.
 
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 And it really is one of the best
 
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 genealogy libraries,
 
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 as well as one of the best research
 
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 libraries anywhere.
 
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 I mean,
 
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 I've used it a lot for things not
 
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 pertaining to genealogy, town histories,
 
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 local histories, military history.
 
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 You have tremendous resources.
 
 00:02:01.378 --> 00:02:02.978
 And I think that's one of the things,
 
 00:02:03.058 --> 00:02:04.781
 obviously, with Road to the Fifty, I mean,
 
 00:02:04.861 --> 00:02:06.921
 I think early on when I started working
 
 00:02:06.962 --> 00:02:08.163
 for American Ancestors,
 
 00:02:08.223 --> 00:02:09.544
 thirty-three years ago this year,
 
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 There was really nobody focusing on the
 
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 military side of things as a focus.
 
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 And I've always thought that you can have
 
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 a chart that fills out names and dates,
 
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 Bob, and places,
 
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 but the stories and military records offer
 
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 so much.
 
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 I mean,
 
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 it may be a diary or a pension.
 
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 And Melanie,
 
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 being on the staff now for how many
 
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 years now?
 
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 About eight years.
 
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 About eight years.
 
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 I wanted to convey my love and enthusiasm,
 
 00:02:39.513 --> 00:02:40.913
 but it didn't convince her.
 
 00:02:41.193 --> 00:02:42.593
 It didn't take too much to convince her.
 
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 She's a great scholar in her own right,
 
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 and her work on ladies in the American
 
 00:02:49.057 --> 00:02:52.599
 Revolution is tremendous and has been
 
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 getting called for a lot of lectures this
 
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 year.
 
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 That's good.
 
 00:02:56.480 --> 00:02:57.002
 And Melanie,
 
 00:02:57.021 --> 00:02:58.662
 you've been working on a lot of things,
 
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 Women in the Revolution,
 
 00:03:00.582 --> 00:03:01.622
 Patriots of Color,
 
 00:03:01.802 --> 00:03:02.943
 Irish in the Revolution.
 
 00:03:03.584 --> 00:03:04.503
 What are some of the favorite things
 
 00:03:04.524 --> 00:03:06.405
 you've found in just the course of looking
 
 00:03:06.485 --> 00:03:09.105
 into these underexplored stories?
 
 00:03:09.526 --> 00:03:09.605
 Yeah,
 
 00:03:09.626 --> 00:03:10.966
 I think some of the biggest themes I
 
 00:03:10.985 --> 00:03:12.586
 keep coming across is
 
 00:03:13.168 --> 00:03:16.510
 how much ordinary citizens rose to the
 
 00:03:16.531 --> 00:03:19.413
 challenge to fight for a new country,
 
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 for a new way of, you know,
 
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 living in the world without the tyranny
 
 00:03:26.179 --> 00:03:27.560
 that was occurring from England.
 
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 I think that just showing that just little
 
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 ways people could contribute because we
 
 00:03:31.823 --> 00:03:32.743
 always like to, you know,
 
 00:03:33.213 --> 00:03:35.854
 idolize the soldiers and their
 
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 contributions.
 
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 And that's great.
 
 00:03:37.316 --> 00:03:38.735
 But we also don't think about everybody
 
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 else that's doing their part in some other
 
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 way,
 
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 maybe a little quieter as a way to
 
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 just sustain their living,
 
 00:03:45.998 --> 00:03:48.219
 but still show that patriotism.
 
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 Right, right.
 
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 And women are really essential to feeding
 
 00:03:52.961 --> 00:03:54.262
 the army, clothing the army,
 
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 as well as maintaining the home front.
 
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 That's right.
 
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 Yeah.
 
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 And especially when the soldiers went off
 
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 into the battlefield,
 
 00:04:01.938 --> 00:04:04.100
 if they did not become camp followers
 
 00:04:04.140 --> 00:04:06.021
 where they were doing the cooking and the
 
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 cleaning and the nursing,
 
 00:04:07.743 --> 00:04:09.205
 they had to hold out the homestead.
 
 00:04:09.245 --> 00:04:10.866
 And in that case, they were dealing with,
 
 00:04:11.046 --> 00:04:11.306
 well,
 
 00:04:11.347 --> 00:04:13.127
 their main source of income was no longer
 
 00:04:13.168 --> 00:04:13.848
 there with them.
 
 00:04:13.929 --> 00:04:16.370
 So they had to really lean on their
 
 00:04:16.411 --> 00:04:19.112
 family members and others and sometimes
 
 00:04:19.233 --> 00:04:21.915
 even take up the family farm or other
 
 00:04:21.975 --> 00:04:23.677
 means of making income just to be able
 
 00:04:23.697 --> 00:04:25.379
 to keep the family afloat during this
 
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 time.
 
 00:04:26.327 --> 00:04:27.809
 which I think is why we see so
 
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 many women decided to pick up and go
 
 00:04:31.050 --> 00:04:33.732
 with their husbands and travel instead of
 
 00:04:33.851 --> 00:04:36.093
 trying to stay behind and manage it and
 
 00:04:36.874 --> 00:04:39.615
 maybe relegate the responsibilities of the
 
 00:04:39.636 --> 00:04:42.297
 homestead to maybe a brother or some other
 
 00:04:42.336 --> 00:04:43.737
 relative while they did that.
 
 00:04:44.699 --> 00:04:45.978
 And you've been able to tell some of
 
 00:04:45.999 --> 00:04:47.579
 these stories in American Ancestors,
 
 00:04:47.680 --> 00:04:49.161
 one of the magazines that you publish,
 
 00:04:49.180 --> 00:04:51.101
 like Esther Damon's story and Daniel
 
 00:04:51.141 --> 00:04:51.942
 Baikman's story.
 
 00:04:52.661 --> 00:04:54.523
 Where do you find the material and where
 
 00:04:55.144 --> 00:04:57.906
 do you find you've been ferried out this?
 
 00:04:57.946 --> 00:04:58.245
 Sure.
 
 00:04:58.365 --> 00:04:59.827
 I mean, known to history,
 
 00:04:59.887 --> 00:05:02.009
 obviously the last pensioner, Baikman,
 
 00:05:02.649 --> 00:05:03.410
 soldier pension.
 
 00:05:03.430 --> 00:05:05.112
 He of course dies four years after the
 
 00:05:05.132 --> 00:05:06.913
 revolution in eighteen sixty nine.
 
 00:05:07.392 --> 00:05:09.954
 Super centenarian and even lives long
 
 00:05:09.995 --> 00:05:10.915
 enough to be photographed,
 
 00:05:10.956 --> 00:05:11.776
 as many of them were.
 
 00:05:12.958 --> 00:05:15.339
 Esther Sumner, you know, Damon,
 
 00:05:16.060 --> 00:05:18.961
 fascinating and not unusual to have a very
 
 00:05:19.002 --> 00:05:20.783
 young woman marrying an older man.
 
 00:05:21.211 --> 00:05:22.153
 She gathered attention.
 
 00:05:22.213 --> 00:05:25.314
 She probably saw this as someone that
 
 00:05:25.454 --> 00:05:28.257
 could obviously offer her the financial
 
 00:05:28.317 --> 00:05:28.898
 stability.
 
 00:05:29.458 --> 00:05:31.459
 But the interesting thing on his story is
 
 00:05:31.480 --> 00:05:32.319
 that he abandoned her.
 
 00:05:32.339 --> 00:05:35.081
 And she collects the pension after he
 
 00:05:35.122 --> 00:05:35.543
 dies.
 
 00:05:35.783 --> 00:05:39.446
 So almost they were married for such a
 
 00:05:40.005 --> 00:05:40.987
 short amount of time.
 
 00:05:41.716 --> 00:05:43.877
 then she lives right on through until gosh
 
 00:05:43.898 --> 00:05:46.661
 she does in nineteen oh six so here
 
 00:05:46.680 --> 00:05:48.843
 we are you know we're after the spanish
 
 00:05:48.983 --> 00:05:51.666
 american war correction and here you have
 
 00:05:51.687 --> 00:05:54.309
 a living revolutionary war widow and again
 
 00:05:54.610 --> 00:05:57.372
 photographed um yeah so that was one when
 
 00:05:57.432 --> 00:05:58.994
 i worked with maureen taylor in a book
 
 00:05:59.033 --> 00:06:01.177
 that we uh jointly put together on last
 
 00:06:01.197 --> 00:06:02.658
 man of the revolution because i had
 
 00:06:02.718 --> 00:06:03.418
 collected a lot of
 
 00:06:03.499 --> 00:06:06.321
 photography of the older generation
 
 00:06:06.360 --> 00:06:09.983
 collecting cdv's cartoon seats of elderly
 
 00:06:10.023 --> 00:06:11.483
 people thinking they were children of the
 
 00:06:11.504 --> 00:06:13.386
 revolution inadvertently i ended up with
 
 00:06:13.886 --> 00:06:17.208
 soldiers photographs really amazing yeah
 
 00:06:17.228 --> 00:06:19.149
 so i have like um daniel waldo who
 
 00:06:19.168 --> 00:06:21.290
 was the last person of war died in
 
 00:06:21.310 --> 00:06:23.391
 the late he used to send out to
 
 00:06:23.411 --> 00:06:25.533
 his admirers signed photographs and on the
 
 00:06:25.552 --> 00:06:27.394
 back he would sign his name and
 
 00:06:27.935 --> 00:06:29.136
 put his age and the date.
 
 00:06:29.156 --> 00:06:30.255
 Wow.
 
 00:06:30.295 --> 00:06:31.437
 So those, you know,
 
 00:06:31.456 --> 00:06:33.057
 when I came to work with us a
 
 00:06:33.077 --> 00:06:33.939
 number of years ago, I said,
 
 00:06:33.959 --> 00:06:35.300
 this would make a great book.
 
 00:06:35.420 --> 00:06:36.100
 And I said,
 
 00:06:36.120 --> 00:06:38.442
 the last mustering of all of the soldiers.
 
 00:06:38.502 --> 00:06:40.502
 And so that spun off into two books
 
 00:06:40.523 --> 00:06:41.343
 with Kent State.
 
 00:06:41.863 --> 00:06:43.925
 So Esther was one of the ones that
 
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 I didn't know who the last widow was.
 
 00:06:45.605 --> 00:06:47.766
 And I think the DAR magazine had written
 
 00:06:47.786 --> 00:06:48.887
 about her many years ago.
 
 00:06:49.567 --> 00:06:50.928
 And I stumbled across her.
 
 00:06:51.009 --> 00:06:52.389
 And then, of course, the biggest thing,
 
 00:06:52.410 --> 00:06:53.571
 because we were doing a book that was
 
 00:06:54.091 --> 00:06:55.132
 hurling photographs.
 
 00:06:55.552 --> 00:06:57.033
 finding a photograph over now it's
 
 00:06:57.074 --> 00:06:57.413
 everywhere.
 
 00:06:57.434 --> 00:06:59.136
 You can find that Wikipedia finding great.
 
 00:06:59.156 --> 00:06:59.795
 Yeah, yeah.
 
 00:07:00.137 --> 00:07:02.658
 I tracked it down up in Vermont, hometown.
 
 00:07:02.678 --> 00:07:04.461
 This is one photograph that was taken.
 
 00:07:04.500 --> 00:07:05.541
 I think there might be two.
 
 00:07:05.562 --> 00:07:07.324
 Wow.
 
 00:07:07.384 --> 00:07:07.944
 What town?
 
 00:07:07.964 --> 00:07:09.165
 What town was she from David?
 
 00:07:09.887 --> 00:07:11.267
 I'm going to have to look at my
 
 00:07:11.307 --> 00:07:11.927
 notes here.
 
 00:07:12.108 --> 00:07:13.528
 She was up in,
 
 00:07:14.129 --> 00:07:15.689
 I think it was Plymouth Union, Vermont.
 
 00:07:15.790 --> 00:07:16.290
 Okay.
 
 00:07:17.569 --> 00:07:18.550
 How much is the pension?
 
 00:07:18.571 --> 00:07:18.711
 I mean,
 
 00:07:18.730 --> 00:07:22.211
 she marries an elderly veteran for his
 
 00:07:22.252 --> 00:07:22.632
 pension.
 
 00:07:22.672 --> 00:07:24.093
 How much are we talking about?
 
 00:07:24.112 --> 00:07:25.112
 It was eighty dollars.
 
 00:07:26.593 --> 00:07:28.254
 That was originally granted to her in
 
 00:07:28.274 --> 00:07:30.014
 eighteen fifty a year.
 
 00:07:30.074 --> 00:07:30.975
 That's not a lot.
 
 00:07:31.536 --> 00:07:32.836
 And then, of course, you know,
 
 00:07:32.896 --> 00:07:33.916
 he gets a pension.
 
 00:07:34.016 --> 00:07:35.478
 Then she collects it afterwards.
 
 00:07:35.577 --> 00:07:35.817
 And it's.
 
 00:07:36.358 --> 00:07:37.358
 It's rather interesting,
 
 00:07:37.418 --> 00:07:39.019
 the details of the pension, because,
 
 00:07:39.079 --> 00:07:41.199
 you know, details that he left her.
 
 00:07:41.358 --> 00:07:42.279
 You know,
 
 00:07:42.360 --> 00:07:43.980
 you figure he's marrying a younger bride,
 
 00:07:44.000 --> 00:07:45.901
 that he's going to have the care of
 
 00:07:45.920 --> 00:07:48.641
 this younger woman in twilight years.
 
 00:07:49.382 --> 00:07:50.541
 And that wasn't the case at all.
 
 00:07:50.562 --> 00:07:54.083
 So what happens to him after he abandons
 
 00:07:54.103 --> 00:07:54.182
 her?
 
 00:07:55.108 --> 00:07:57.129
 He ended up dying over in New Hampshire,
 
 00:07:57.149 --> 00:07:57.490
 I believe.
 
 00:07:57.630 --> 00:07:57.771
 Really?
 
 00:07:57.810 --> 00:08:00.192
 And then she stays in Vermont.
 
 00:08:00.213 --> 00:08:00.853
 She's, I think,
 
 00:08:00.973 --> 00:08:02.735
 living with her parents for a while.
 
 00:08:03.276 --> 00:08:03.675
 Wow.
 
 00:08:03.875 --> 00:08:05.517
 And then ends up, you know,
 
 00:08:05.978 --> 00:08:07.338
 never remarrying again.
 
 00:08:07.879 --> 00:08:09.321
 And then when she dies in Nineteen Oh
 
 00:08:09.360 --> 00:08:09.581
 six,
 
 00:08:09.600 --> 00:08:10.783
 she is the last recorded
 
 00:08:11.423 --> 00:08:13.403
 widow of a Revolutionary War soldier.
 
 00:08:13.423 --> 00:08:15.144
 I mean, but it's interesting how they,
 
 00:08:15.163 --> 00:08:15.423
 you know,
 
 00:08:15.564 --> 00:08:17.144
 I'm always waiting for that one more
 
 00:08:17.204 --> 00:08:17.483
 story.
 
 00:08:17.504 --> 00:08:18.963
 Well, she is a widow,
 
 00:08:18.983 --> 00:08:20.305
 but never collected a pension.
 
 00:08:20.345 --> 00:08:20.485
 I mean,
 
 00:08:20.504 --> 00:08:22.064
 she would have been an ideal situation
 
 00:08:22.305 --> 00:08:24.245
 because she had her husband leave her.
 
 00:08:24.425 --> 00:08:25.565
 So, you know,
 
 00:08:25.625 --> 00:08:27.545
 obviously it wasn't a legal divorce,
 
 00:08:27.846 --> 00:08:29.146
 which is in the case of Civil War
 
 00:08:29.185 --> 00:08:29.505
 pensions.
 
 00:08:29.526 --> 00:08:31.086
 You see this all the time where the
 
 00:08:31.607 --> 00:08:33.506
 soldier divorced a woman and then the both
 
 00:08:33.527 --> 00:08:35.126
 of them are fighting for the now deceased
 
 00:08:35.167 --> 00:08:36.027
 soldier's pension.
 
 00:08:37.307 --> 00:08:38.048
 They just gave it to her.
 
 00:08:39.668 --> 00:08:41.129
 And I forget what she was getting by
 
 00:08:41.168 --> 00:08:41.870
 the end.
 
 00:08:41.929 --> 00:08:44.171
 I know it was, I think,
 
 00:08:44.211 --> 00:08:45.392
 twelve dollars a month.
 
 00:08:45.892 --> 00:08:47.312
 I think that was the increase that
 
 00:08:48.033 --> 00:08:50.134
 Congress gave to her back in like nineteen
 
 00:08:50.174 --> 00:08:52.115
 or five in October, I think,
 
 00:08:52.135 --> 00:08:52.876
 before she died.
 
 00:08:53.581 --> 00:08:54.041
 That's amazing.
 
 00:08:54.100 --> 00:08:55.981
 So that's like a hundred thirty years
 
 00:08:56.042 --> 00:08:57.363
 after Lexington and Concord.
 
 00:08:57.482 --> 00:08:58.923
 She's like this pension.
 
 00:08:59.102 --> 00:09:00.484
 That's amazing.
 
 00:09:01.183 --> 00:09:02.985
 And Melanie, you've been doing work,
 
 00:09:03.085 --> 00:09:05.086
 as I've said, Women in the Revolution,
 
 00:09:05.145 --> 00:09:07.206
 but also another project on Irish in the
 
 00:09:07.267 --> 00:09:07.807
 Revolution.
 
 00:09:07.846 --> 00:09:09.467
 And yesterday was we just observed
 
 00:09:09.868 --> 00:09:10.988
 Evacuation Day and St.
 
 00:09:11.028 --> 00:09:11.849
 Patrick's Day.
 
 00:09:11.869 --> 00:09:12.849
 So can you tell us a bit about
 
 00:09:12.908 --> 00:09:14.370
 what you're finding in that area?
 
 00:09:14.985 --> 00:09:15.386
 Sure.
 
 00:09:15.506 --> 00:09:15.687
 Yeah,
 
 00:09:15.726 --> 00:09:18.389
 we're finding a lot of stories of Irish
 
 00:09:18.629 --> 00:09:21.253
 immigrants that came into this country and
 
 00:09:21.393 --> 00:09:23.416
 decided to take up for the Patriot cause.
 
 00:09:23.596 --> 00:09:26.778
 So they no longer identified as British
 
 00:09:26.798 --> 00:09:30.322
 citizens and decided to fight for this new
 
 00:09:30.363 --> 00:09:31.424
 country in a lot of cases.
 
 00:09:31.664 --> 00:09:33.506
 So we find a lot of some of
 
 00:09:33.547 --> 00:09:34.248
 the, you know,
 
 00:09:34.668 --> 00:09:37.808
 leading military generals and other like,
 
 00:09:37.970 --> 00:09:40.650
 like Commodores that were making up like
 
 00:09:40.691 --> 00:09:41.211
 the,
 
 00:09:41.250 --> 00:09:43.471
 what was our Navy and other places that
 
 00:09:43.831 --> 00:09:45.673
 really showed, you know,
 
 00:09:45.712 --> 00:09:47.013
 what they wanted to give for this.
 
 00:09:47.094 --> 00:09:48.474
 I think it just really just kind of
 
 00:09:48.494 --> 00:09:50.754
 brings home that message about how a lot
 
 00:09:50.774 --> 00:09:51.534
 of immigrants were,
 
 00:09:52.096 --> 00:09:53.696
 were fighting for this new country as
 
 00:09:53.755 --> 00:09:54.116
 well.
 
 00:09:54.397 --> 00:09:55.096
 So I think that was,
 
 00:09:55.116 --> 00:09:56.217
 it was really interesting just to kind of
 
 00:09:56.238 --> 00:09:59.999
 give insights into why they felt a greater
 
 00:10:00.038 --> 00:10:02.620
 push by the Patriot cause versus for,
 
 00:10:02.700 --> 00:10:03.421
 for England.
 
 00:10:03.480 --> 00:10:03.961
 Mm-hmm.
 
 00:10:05.664 --> 00:10:07.706
 And you said you, I mean,
 
 00:10:08.025 --> 00:10:10.167
 Patriots of Color is another area you've
 
 00:10:10.226 --> 00:10:12.287
 begun exploring and you have an exhibit up
 
 00:10:12.366 --> 00:10:13.467
 on Patriots of Color.
 
 00:10:13.488 --> 00:10:14.748
 Can we talk a little bit about what
 
 00:10:15.028 --> 00:10:16.109
 we'll see in the exhibit?
 
 00:10:16.629 --> 00:10:16.948
 Sure.
 
 00:10:17.028 --> 00:10:17.249
 Yeah.
 
 00:10:17.288 --> 00:10:19.169
 So the Patriots of Color exhibit is going
 
 00:10:19.230 --> 00:10:22.750
 to highlight some material on what we know
 
 00:10:22.831 --> 00:10:25.351
 about different Patriots of Color from
 
 00:10:25.471 --> 00:10:27.432
 each of the different Thirteen Colonies,
 
 00:10:28.173 --> 00:10:30.134
 representing information on their service
 
 00:10:30.173 --> 00:10:32.134
 records and their pension files,
 
 00:10:32.193 --> 00:10:33.615
 which contain a
 
 00:10:34.087 --> 00:10:34.607
 you know,
 
 00:10:34.628 --> 00:10:36.629
 so much material about who they were,
 
 00:10:36.688 --> 00:10:37.870
 what towns they were from,
 
 00:10:38.509 --> 00:10:40.311
 and learned in some cases,
 
 00:10:40.331 --> 00:10:41.510
 I think there was even some previously
 
 00:10:41.551 --> 00:10:43.812
 enslaved that we had also identified as
 
 00:10:43.892 --> 00:10:44.312
 well,
 
 00:10:44.371 --> 00:10:47.253
 which gives that insight into that part of
 
 00:10:47.293 --> 00:10:47.673
 history,
 
 00:10:47.714 --> 00:10:49.033
 especially when we look at places like New
 
 00:10:49.094 --> 00:10:49.394
 England.
 
 00:10:49.433 --> 00:10:51.554
 We don't always associate slavery with New
 
 00:10:51.615 --> 00:10:52.556
 England, but, you know,
 
 00:10:52.576 --> 00:10:54.475
 there was definitely a very rich history
 
 00:10:55.136 --> 00:10:55.976
 that occurred then.
 
 00:10:56.856 --> 00:10:59.018
 And so this is really going to show,
 
 00:10:59.057 --> 00:10:59.278
 like,
 
 00:10:59.317 --> 00:11:02.519
 how a lot of these patriots were able
 
 00:11:02.580 --> 00:11:02.820
 to
 
 00:11:03.884 --> 00:11:04.784
 form, you know,
 
 00:11:05.024 --> 00:11:09.330
 these lasting impact on their communities
 
 00:11:09.409 --> 00:11:10.490
 by serving.
 
 00:11:10.510 --> 00:11:11.351
 I think in a lot of cases,
 
 00:11:11.412 --> 00:11:14.674
 many segregated militias too at some
 
 00:11:14.715 --> 00:11:15.355
 point, right?
 
 00:11:15.596 --> 00:11:17.236
 And you have them actually, you know,
 
 00:11:17.857 --> 00:11:19.379
 one of the muster roles that we actually
 
 00:11:19.539 --> 00:11:20.900
 own in the American Ancestors
 
 00:11:21.570 --> 00:11:22.291
 In our collection,
 
 00:11:22.331 --> 00:11:23.471
 someone was looking at it, and I said,
 
 00:11:23.532 --> 00:11:24.273
 I know that name.
 
 00:11:24.592 --> 00:11:25.953
 It was a Middleborough militia,
 
 00:11:26.174 --> 00:11:27.096
 a return of men.
 
 00:11:27.716 --> 00:11:29.337
 And someone said, is that name Quack?
 
 00:11:29.538 --> 00:11:30.839
 I'm like, no, it's Quark.
 
 00:11:31.399 --> 00:11:32.260
 Quark Motrick.
 
 00:11:32.461 --> 00:11:32.701
 I said,
 
 00:11:32.740 --> 00:11:34.283
 I know him because I know where his
 
 00:11:34.302 --> 00:11:34.923
 cellar hole is.
 
 00:11:35.003 --> 00:11:36.225
 I brought his family out to it.
 
 00:11:36.245 --> 00:11:37.745
 It's out in the woods of East Stoughton
 
 00:11:37.806 --> 00:11:38.326
 and Avon.
 
 00:11:39.187 --> 00:11:41.129
 which was East Houghton, now Avon,
 
 00:11:41.168 --> 00:11:42.330
 in a huge cellar hole.
 
 00:11:42.630 --> 00:11:45.153
 And his descendants have gone out there.
 
 00:11:45.212 --> 00:11:46.995
 There's a small cemetery with unmarked
 
 00:11:47.014 --> 00:11:47.475
 graves.
 
 00:11:48.076 --> 00:11:49.437
 And it's fascinating.
 
 00:11:49.456 --> 00:11:49.937
 And they said, well,
 
 00:11:49.956 --> 00:11:50.857
 we're going to write about him.
 
 00:11:50.998 --> 00:11:51.599
 I said, well,
 
 00:11:51.999 --> 00:11:53.480
 I can give you something from the display.
 
 00:11:54.400 --> 00:11:55.981
 i have an eighteenth century handmade
 
 00:11:56.022 --> 00:11:58.543
 brick that came right out of the fireplace
 
 00:11:58.583 --> 00:12:00.144
 that was down in the cellar hole there
 
 00:12:00.164 --> 00:12:03.388
 they'd been savagely you know ransacked by
 
 00:12:03.427 --> 00:12:05.469
 metal detectors over the past forty years
 
 00:12:05.509 --> 00:12:08.230
 but the brick represents something that's
 
 00:12:08.250 --> 00:12:10.572
 like a touchstone and with quack matrick
 
 00:12:10.592 --> 00:12:12.495
 what's fascinating about his pension
 
 00:12:13.115 --> 00:12:15.355
 He mentions in his own deposition,
 
 00:12:15.416 --> 00:12:16.535
 he was born in Africa.
 
 00:12:16.696 --> 00:12:19.736
 So he's first generation African American
 
 00:12:19.777 --> 00:12:20.976
 Revolutionary Warhead soldier.
 
 00:12:21.017 --> 00:12:22.038
 He did get a pension,
 
 00:12:22.498 --> 00:12:24.278
 but he's just one of many stories that
 
 00:12:24.317 --> 00:12:24.977
 we can highlight.
 
 00:12:25.038 --> 00:12:29.240
 I wish we could do more than we
 
 00:12:29.279 --> 00:12:29.620
 have.
 
 00:12:29.840 --> 00:12:30.019
 Yeah,
 
 00:12:30.080 --> 00:12:32.039
 and maybe we're hopeful over time with
 
 00:12:32.240 --> 00:12:33.600
 also building out trees of these
 
 00:12:33.620 --> 00:12:35.780
 individuals, we can find more descendants,
 
 00:12:35.801 --> 00:12:37.542
 people that don't know that they have
 
 00:12:37.900 --> 00:12:39.881
 these revolutionary roots extending all
 
 00:12:39.902 --> 00:12:42.104
 the way back into the colonies,
 
 00:12:42.163 --> 00:12:44.405
 especially for people of color that may
 
 00:12:44.466 --> 00:12:46.267
 not know that they have that history,
 
 00:12:47.047 --> 00:12:48.509
 which hasn't been widely taught in
 
 00:12:48.548 --> 00:12:48.889
 schools.
 
 00:12:49.383 --> 00:12:49.663
 Well, I mean,
 
 00:12:49.722 --> 00:12:51.024
 I was told as a child, Bob,
 
 00:12:51.043 --> 00:12:53.085
 that my grandmother's last name was Poor
 
 00:12:53.586 --> 00:12:57.207
 and that Salem Poor of Bunker Hill was
 
 00:12:57.427 --> 00:12:58.609
 an enslaved in my family.
 
 00:12:58.649 --> 00:13:00.809
 Well, I mean, indirectly, I mean,
 
 00:13:00.889 --> 00:13:03.572
 my immigrant ancestor's brother's
 
 00:13:04.253 --> 00:13:05.653
 descendant was the enslaver.
 
 00:13:05.734 --> 00:13:07.115
 So, I mean, by distant cousin.
 
 00:13:07.595 --> 00:13:09.535
 But I had always been fascinated with him.
 
 00:13:09.576 --> 00:13:12.097
 What fascinated me more in nineteen
 
 00:13:12.158 --> 00:13:13.619
 seventy five when they issued a stamp for
 
 00:13:13.658 --> 00:13:13.778
 him.
 
 00:13:14.342 --> 00:13:15.562
 There was no death date for him.
 
 00:13:16.063 --> 00:13:17.163
 So I'm like, what happened to him?
 
 00:13:17.583 --> 00:13:19.065
 So I ended up doing some research.
 
 00:13:19.125 --> 00:13:20.504
 I found him in the actually Boston
 
 00:13:20.524 --> 00:13:22.605
 Overseers of the Poor records in a return
 
 00:13:22.645 --> 00:13:25.667
 payable back to the town of Andover for
 
 00:13:25.706 --> 00:13:26.868
 his funeral charges.
 
 00:13:27.067 --> 00:13:28.967
 I also found him in the Boston jail
 
 00:13:29.008 --> 00:13:29.989
 records as a debtor.
 
 00:13:30.068 --> 00:13:31.589
 I found a runaway, no, I'm sorry,
 
 00:13:31.629 --> 00:13:32.110
 not a runaway,
 
 00:13:32.529 --> 00:13:34.570
 a runaway ad for a runaway bride,
 
 00:13:35.010 --> 00:13:37.010
 not trusting anybody to trust his wife
 
 00:13:37.030 --> 00:13:38.072
 when he was living in problems.
 
 00:13:39.172 --> 00:13:40.854
 and it gave his age it gave his
 
 00:13:40.953 --> 00:13:42.796
 height it gave us you know where he
 
 00:13:42.816 --> 00:13:46.019
 was born and uh so it's it's always
 
 00:13:46.099 --> 00:13:48.322
 interested me african-american and native
 
 00:13:48.361 --> 00:13:50.323
 american my connection with massachusetts
 
 00:13:50.364 --> 00:13:52.905
 at punkapog i've always been fascinated
 
 00:13:52.946 --> 00:13:54.447
 with these stories and of course the
 
 00:13:54.508 --> 00:13:56.710
 native indigenous story of the american
 
 00:13:56.750 --> 00:13:58.230
 revolution is just something just
 
 00:13:58.631 --> 00:13:59.732
 scratched the surface on
 
 00:14:00.870 --> 00:14:01.791
 Well,
 
 00:14:01.811 --> 00:14:03.751
 Jonathan tells me that we had descendants
 
 00:14:04.052 --> 00:14:04.211
 of,
 
 00:14:04.351 --> 00:14:05.491
 I don't know if it was Kwak Watrick
 
 00:14:05.532 --> 00:14:06.971
 or one of the other folk people you're
 
 00:14:06.991 --> 00:14:07.412
 telling us,
 
 00:14:07.451 --> 00:14:09.212
 in the processions in Roxbury and
 
 00:14:09.253 --> 00:14:09.773
 Framingham,
 
 00:14:09.812 --> 00:14:13.053
 and actually one of our folks who was
 
 00:14:13.134 --> 00:14:15.494
 both with us at Dorchester Heights as well
 
 00:14:15.553 --> 00:14:18.294
 as in Roxbury came up from Rhode Island,
 
 00:14:18.335 --> 00:14:20.054
 and he's traced his ancestry actually on
 
 00:14:20.095 --> 00:14:21.774
 both sides, white, African American,
 
 00:14:21.835 --> 00:14:24.696
 indigenous, who all were involved in this.
 
 00:14:26.971 --> 00:14:29.014
 I should tell you I came a little
 
 00:14:29.034 --> 00:14:31.219
 bit late to using your resources and
 
 00:14:31.259 --> 00:14:33.042
 taking seriously the work you do just
 
 00:14:33.081 --> 00:14:35.405
 because there is a perception among some
 
 00:14:35.446 --> 00:14:37.129
 that what people do when they're doing
 
 00:14:37.168 --> 00:14:39.211
 genealogy is try to trace ancestry to
 
 00:14:40.048 --> 00:14:40.929
 people like the Queen,
 
 00:14:40.990 --> 00:14:42.149
 but actually what you're doing is
 
 00:14:42.169 --> 00:14:43.471
 something much more interesting,
 
 00:14:43.510 --> 00:14:45.673
 which is trying to figure out these
 
 00:14:45.712 --> 00:14:46.793
 stories of real people,
 
 00:14:48.193 --> 00:14:49.916
 which is really a tremendous thing.
 
 00:14:49.936 --> 00:14:53.398
 I'm sorry if I'm disabusing people of
 
 00:14:53.437 --> 00:14:54.938
 something that they don't actually have,
 
 00:14:55.038 --> 00:14:57.100
 but this idea that what you're doing is
 
 00:14:57.461 --> 00:14:59.601
 very serious scholarship and not simply
 
 00:14:59.642 --> 00:15:02.964
 trying to affirm that you are in the
 
 00:15:03.004 --> 00:15:03.684
 Domesday Book.
 
 00:15:04.414 --> 00:15:04.955
 Right, exactly.
 
 00:15:05.034 --> 00:15:06.375
 I mean, as a historian,
 
 00:15:06.395 --> 00:15:08.356
 my degree is from Northeastern in history,
 
 00:15:08.437 --> 00:15:09.357
 and people said, well,
 
 00:15:09.418 --> 00:15:10.578
 you're going to do genealogy.
 
 00:15:10.599 --> 00:15:11.619
 That's a hobby.
 
 00:15:11.798 --> 00:15:13.080
 And I said, well, it's,
 
 00:15:13.419 --> 00:15:14.160
 you have to be,
 
 00:15:14.341 --> 00:15:16.062
 I don't think you can be a genealogist
 
 00:15:16.101 --> 00:15:18.482
 without becoming interested in the local
 
 00:15:18.523 --> 00:15:19.744
 history and knowing the history of the
 
 00:15:19.764 --> 00:15:21.325
 community your family comes from or where
 
 00:15:21.345 --> 00:15:21.745
 they come from.
 
 00:15:21.965 --> 00:15:23.346
 You can't be a historian.
 
 00:15:23.865 --> 00:15:25.346
 though knowing the story of the people.
 
 00:15:25.586 --> 00:15:27.346
 And you have to do genealogical research
 
 00:15:27.366 --> 00:15:27.626
 for that.
 
 00:15:27.647 --> 00:15:29.227
 So they kind of melded together.
 
 00:15:29.288 --> 00:15:31.908
 I think the two disciplines are working
 
 00:15:32.028 --> 00:15:34.149
 more closely together than they were, say,
 
 00:15:34.568 --> 00:15:35.428
 twenty years ago or so.
 
 00:15:35.649 --> 00:15:36.048
 Definitely.
 
 00:15:36.269 --> 00:15:36.629
 Definitely.
 
 00:15:36.649 --> 00:15:36.870
 I mean,
 
 00:15:37.009 --> 00:15:39.029
 I do a lot of genealogical work whenever
 
 00:15:39.070 --> 00:15:40.490
 I'm doing a project just to figure out
 
 00:15:40.510 --> 00:15:41.350
 who these people are,
 
 00:15:41.410 --> 00:15:43.211
 who they're related to, who they know.
 
 00:15:43.631 --> 00:15:45.432
 And you build this network of that of
 
 00:15:45.491 --> 00:15:45.851
 people.
 
 00:15:45.951 --> 00:15:48.633
 So it really makes it much more rewarding
 
 00:15:48.692 --> 00:15:50.513
 to do scholarly work, knowing,
 
 00:15:50.633 --> 00:15:51.793
 understanding the people.
 
 00:15:53.038 --> 00:15:53.477
 Absolutely.
 
 00:15:53.498 --> 00:15:55.099
 And we're also seeing this with school
 
 00:15:55.119 --> 00:15:56.119
 groups that we work with,
 
 00:15:56.178 --> 00:15:58.500
 that when we help students understand the
 
 00:15:58.519 --> 00:16:00.500
 historical context their families lived
 
 00:16:00.581 --> 00:16:02.461
 in, it makes history come alive.
 
 00:16:02.542 --> 00:16:05.543
 It makes you understand why your family
 
 00:16:05.562 --> 00:16:08.283
 made the decisions they made and what was,
 
 00:16:08.543 --> 00:16:10.164
 what were the push and pull happening
 
 00:16:10.225 --> 00:16:11.725
 around them knowing that, you know,
 
 00:16:11.745 --> 00:16:12.846
 it wasn't just in a vacuum.
 
 00:16:12.966 --> 00:16:14.046
 So even if, you know,
 
 00:16:14.125 --> 00:16:16.988
 I have one student that he was lamenting
 
 00:16:17.008 --> 00:16:18.788
 that he wasn't finding like Revolutionary
 
 00:16:18.807 --> 00:16:21.448
 War soldiers in his family or anybody like
 
 00:16:21.548 --> 00:16:22.809
 royalty, but, you know, I,
 
 00:16:23.216 --> 00:16:24.477
 we basically found that his,
 
 00:16:25.558 --> 00:16:27.419
 one of his ancestors was a surveyor and
 
 00:16:27.580 --> 00:16:28.561
 kind of explained like, oh, well,
 
 00:16:28.581 --> 00:16:32.124
 this is a really important role and how
 
 00:16:32.163 --> 00:16:33.965
 that impacted so many other people so that
 
 00:16:34.004 --> 00:16:35.166
 they could get their land.
 
 00:16:35.245 --> 00:16:37.288
 So I think even making just like small
 
 00:16:37.327 --> 00:16:38.568
 steps to show people,
 
 00:16:39.321 --> 00:16:41.962
 how they're connected with their history
 
 00:16:42.043 --> 00:16:45.346
 and what's going on in the socioeconomic
 
 00:16:45.407 --> 00:16:46.427
 status too.
 
 00:16:46.927 --> 00:16:48.489
 I think it really just helps,
 
 00:16:48.789 --> 00:16:49.110
 like you said,
 
 00:16:49.450 --> 00:16:51.993
 ground people to who their family is and
 
 00:16:52.013 --> 00:16:53.514
 their roots with, like you said,
 
 00:16:53.573 --> 00:16:55.154
 not looking for that, you know,
 
 00:16:55.936 --> 00:16:58.238
 hidden gemstone of like a notable in your
 
 00:16:58.278 --> 00:17:01.139
 family which some people may never have i
 
 00:17:01.159 --> 00:17:03.081
 know in my family i don't really have
 
 00:17:03.100 --> 00:17:05.323
 anybody specifically quote notable in that
 
 00:17:05.343 --> 00:17:07.483
 degree but there are interesting stories
 
 00:17:07.523 --> 00:17:09.526
 there are people that made the newspaper
 
 00:17:09.665 --> 00:17:13.208
 or were parish in ireland or other places
 
 00:17:13.588 --> 00:17:15.509
 but you know and you get stories that
 
 00:17:15.529 --> 00:17:16.810
 come out of it they're just different
 
 00:17:16.830 --> 00:17:18.992
 types of stories and that's why i think
 
 00:17:19.053 --> 00:17:21.253
 by when we research especially even in the
 
 00:17:21.294 --> 00:17:22.075
 colonial era that
 
 00:17:22.559 --> 00:17:24.344
 we do find more of these stories of
 
 00:17:24.364 --> 00:17:27.150
 the average citizen and what is happening
 
 00:17:27.170 --> 00:17:29.795
 and how they contributed towards the
 
 00:17:29.815 --> 00:17:30.415
 Patriot cause.
 
 00:17:31.580 --> 00:17:33.061
 Some average citizens are doing something
 
 00:17:33.122 --> 00:17:34.362
 on Newbury Street right now.
 
 00:17:34.501 --> 00:17:37.403
 Exactly.
 
 00:17:37.442 --> 00:17:39.223
 Future descendants of firefighters and
 
 00:17:39.243 --> 00:17:39.804
 police force.
 
 00:17:41.125 --> 00:17:42.986
 Bob, I think with history with students,
 
 00:17:43.586 --> 00:17:46.527
 it's a wonderful embracement of the
 
 00:17:46.606 --> 00:17:47.768
 student population.
 
 00:17:47.827 --> 00:17:49.067
 And I don't just mean college,
 
 00:17:49.147 --> 00:17:51.328
 it's high school and grade school with the
 
 00:17:51.469 --> 00:17:53.410
 family heritage experience we have now.
 
 00:17:53.430 --> 00:17:55.030
 They can get that getting started.
 
 00:17:55.550 --> 00:17:56.872
 I was a fourteen year old that was
 
 00:17:56.912 --> 00:17:58.271
 not welcome to come into this building
 
 00:17:58.291 --> 00:17:59.512
 because I didn't have my parent or
 
 00:17:59.553 --> 00:18:00.012
 guardian.
 
 00:18:00.472 --> 00:18:01.854
 I guess I got the last laugh now
 
 00:18:01.894 --> 00:18:03.474
 being their chief genealogist and being
 
 00:18:03.494 --> 00:18:04.596
 here for thirty three years.
 
 00:18:05.096 --> 00:18:07.377
 But genealogy for me,
 
 00:18:07.919 --> 00:18:09.799
 it was a way for me to learn
 
 00:18:10.220 --> 00:18:13.182
 how my family fit into local history,
 
 00:18:14.103 --> 00:18:16.204
 United States history and global history.
 
 00:18:16.404 --> 00:18:18.886
 And social studies became more fascinating
 
 00:18:18.926 --> 00:18:19.166
 to me.
 
 00:18:20.126 --> 00:18:21.208
 I would have been like, oh,
 
 00:18:21.228 --> 00:18:22.888
 this is just another dry names and dates.
 
 00:18:22.909 --> 00:18:23.549
 But no, wait a minute.
 
 00:18:23.589 --> 00:18:24.631
 This is how I connect.
 
 00:18:25.131 --> 00:18:26.692
 And so when I talk to educators,
 
 00:18:26.772 --> 00:18:28.653
 I say, if you can make that connect.
 
 00:18:28.814 --> 00:18:30.395
 And now that being said,
 
 00:18:30.955 --> 00:18:32.416
 many of our school groups come in and
 
 00:18:32.436 --> 00:18:34.058
 they're first generation immigrants
 
 00:18:34.078 --> 00:18:34.519
 themselves.
 
 00:18:36.005 --> 00:18:38.007
 We found that some of the communities now
 
 00:18:38.047 --> 00:18:40.008
 are adopting the Revolutionary War
 
 00:18:40.388 --> 00:18:41.849
 soldiers in their community,
 
 00:18:41.869 --> 00:18:43.570
 like we did for a project in Maine.
 
 00:18:44.172 --> 00:18:45.893
 Or we're finding that they want to learn
 
 00:18:45.932 --> 00:18:47.713
 about the local history of their
 
 00:18:47.773 --> 00:18:48.454
 community.
 
 00:18:48.795 --> 00:18:49.476
 And that becomes,
 
 00:18:49.496 --> 00:18:50.997
 and they can own it that way.
 
 00:18:51.217 --> 00:18:53.898
 And that's, I think, has been valuable.
 
 00:18:53.959 --> 00:18:55.140
 How would someone find out?
 
 00:18:55.200 --> 00:18:55.380
 I mean,
 
 00:18:55.760 --> 00:18:57.442
 say there is a teacher out there who
 
 00:18:57.461 --> 00:18:59.083
 would like to get their students to do
 
 00:18:59.103 --> 00:19:00.443
 a project with you.
 
 00:19:00.484 --> 00:19:02.205
 How would they go about connecting?
 
 00:19:03.410 --> 00:19:03.529
 Well,
 
 00:19:03.549 --> 00:19:04.871
 we have a few different ways they can
 
 00:19:04.931 --> 00:19:05.332
 do it.
 
 00:19:05.852 --> 00:19:08.173
 One is we do have our youth education
 
 00:19:08.213 --> 00:19:10.375
 curriculum that we do have on our website.
 
 00:19:10.395 --> 00:19:12.116
 So that has a lot of the resources
 
 00:19:12.416 --> 00:19:14.219
 on how you can learn more about how
 
 00:19:14.239 --> 00:19:15.940
 you can institute it in your classroom.
 
 00:19:16.520 --> 00:19:18.442
 We even have teacher workshops that are
 
 00:19:18.501 --> 00:19:19.883
 held here throughout the year.
 
 00:19:19.903 --> 00:19:22.404
 So we actually just had a group of
 
 00:19:22.726 --> 00:19:24.727
 homeschool educators and we had some other
 
 00:19:25.167 --> 00:19:25.647
 teachers.
 
 00:19:25.972 --> 00:19:28.653
 more public schools last year as well and
 
 00:19:28.773 --> 00:19:29.815
 you know they were able to come in
 
 00:19:29.855 --> 00:19:31.635
 together and share what they were working
 
 00:19:31.695 --> 00:19:33.257
 on what they hope to do we kind
 
 00:19:33.277 --> 00:19:35.258
 of talk about you know potentially things
 
 00:19:35.278 --> 00:19:36.637
 you know that could be you know pitfalls
 
 00:19:36.657 --> 00:19:38.598
 that might impact students so you know
 
 00:19:38.618 --> 00:19:40.380
 those landmines that you might come across
 
 00:19:40.460 --> 00:19:42.721
 like adoption and other maybe upsetting
 
 00:19:42.980 --> 00:19:44.201
 circumstances that might come out on like
 
 00:19:44.261 --> 00:19:47.223
 on death records and other things um and
 
 00:19:47.263 --> 00:19:48.923
 we also have schools that do like field
 
 00:19:48.943 --> 00:19:50.345
 trips here they might come to the family
 
 00:19:50.404 --> 00:19:52.465
 heritage experience and you know get a
 
 00:19:52.486 --> 00:19:54.067
 tour and maybe do a little
 
 00:19:54.227 --> 00:19:56.308
 a quick quick time in the library and
 
 00:19:56.329 --> 00:19:57.671
 we actually have a school group actually
 
 00:19:57.691 --> 00:19:59.212
 coming in um you know this week actually
 
 00:19:59.252 --> 00:20:02.236
 doing some great more so there's lots of
 
 00:20:02.256 --> 00:20:04.258
 ways that uh teachers can get in touch
 
 00:20:04.278 --> 00:20:05.940
 with us and you know even just getting
 
 00:20:05.960 --> 00:20:07.962
 in touch with our youth education uh
 
 00:20:08.022 --> 00:20:10.184
 coordinator is definitely a good start to
 
 00:20:10.365 --> 00:20:12.567
 start those conversations and give them
 
 00:20:12.587 --> 00:20:14.210
 the resources on how you can
 
 00:20:15.329 --> 00:20:16.391
 introduce genealogy,
 
 00:20:16.431 --> 00:20:17.991
 but introduce it in a way that it
 
 00:20:18.011 --> 00:20:19.692
 doesn't put someone off if they have
 
 00:20:19.712 --> 00:20:21.253
 family that just came in, let's say,
 
 00:20:21.273 --> 00:20:21.574
 you know,
 
 00:20:21.594 --> 00:20:23.075
 the last few years or even the last
 
 00:20:23.095 --> 00:20:24.875
 weekend, you know, and just show them,
 
 00:20:24.895 --> 00:20:25.056
 like,
 
 00:20:25.096 --> 00:20:27.396
 here's at least the process and here's how
 
 00:20:27.436 --> 00:20:29.077
 you view historical documents.
 
 00:20:29.097 --> 00:20:30.558
 Yeah.
 
 00:20:30.618 --> 00:20:32.179
 And I think it's really important for
 
 00:20:32.240 --> 00:20:34.381
 students to do something as opposed to
 
 00:20:34.401 --> 00:20:35.401
 being told something.
 
 00:20:35.902 --> 00:20:37.742
 And this really helps engage them.
 
 00:20:37.823 --> 00:20:39.242
 And you have a beautiful new headquarters,
 
 00:20:39.303 --> 00:20:39.482
 too,
 
 00:20:39.502 --> 00:20:42.365
 which I believe you redesigned to make
 
 00:20:42.404 --> 00:20:43.986
 these things more feasible.
 
 00:20:44.328 --> 00:20:44.551
 We did.
 
 00:20:45.699 --> 00:20:48.559
 It was a long vision and I'm grateful
 
 00:20:48.579 --> 00:20:50.700
 that it's finally present because we can
 
 00:20:50.740 --> 00:20:52.160
 do so much more than we could in
 
 00:20:52.180 --> 00:20:53.661
 the space that we had before.
 
 00:20:53.740 --> 00:20:55.721
 Expanding our footprint now with ninety
 
 00:20:55.800 --> 00:20:57.500
 seven through one on one Newbury Street in
 
 00:20:57.520 --> 00:21:00.561
 the entrance is very welcoming.
 
 00:21:00.642 --> 00:21:00.922
 I mean,
 
 00:21:00.961 --> 00:21:03.042
 I think it gives people who are just
 
 00:21:03.103 --> 00:21:06.423
 kind of curious with young families that,
 
 00:21:06.502 --> 00:21:08.084
 you know, tell that story.
 
 00:21:08.104 --> 00:21:10.864
 And this allows them to ask the questions.
 
 00:21:11.284 --> 00:21:13.204
 And we hope that those questions continue
 
 00:21:13.345 --> 00:21:14.065
 after they leave,
 
 00:21:14.164 --> 00:21:15.244
 even if they don't go up into the
 
 00:21:17.290 --> 00:21:20.655
 One solid person who takes that and
 
 00:21:20.695 --> 00:21:22.199
 decides that they're interested in family
 
 00:21:22.219 --> 00:21:22.459
 history,
 
 00:21:22.499 --> 00:21:24.942
 think of the countless records and
 
 00:21:24.982 --> 00:21:26.766
 documents and stories that are being
 
 00:21:26.806 --> 00:21:27.307
 preserved.
 
 00:21:27.346 --> 00:21:29.170
 So I think that I'm really grateful that
 
 00:21:29.190 --> 00:21:29.711
 we've done this.
 
 00:21:31.665 --> 00:21:34.528
 And you've been publishing for a long time
 
 00:21:34.729 --> 00:21:36.771
 and also now you've been digitizing
 
 00:21:36.811 --> 00:21:37.172
 things.
 
 00:21:37.211 --> 00:21:38.252
 So can you tell us a bit about
 
 00:21:38.773 --> 00:21:41.497
 how that has changed the way genealogists
 
 00:21:41.537 --> 00:21:41.817
 work,
 
 00:21:41.836 --> 00:21:43.739
 the fact that so much is now accessible
 
 00:21:43.940 --> 00:21:46.422
 on the internet or through American
 
 00:21:46.501 --> 00:21:48.585
 Ancestors or ancestry.com?
 
 00:21:49.912 --> 00:21:50.271
 Yeah,
 
 00:21:50.291 --> 00:21:51.833
 so we have a few different ways we
 
 00:21:51.853 --> 00:21:52.212
 do that.
 
 00:21:52.272 --> 00:21:53.534
 So we have been publishing,
 
 00:21:53.713 --> 00:21:54.934
 as you mentioned, for a long time,
 
 00:21:55.015 --> 00:21:56.115
 since eighteen forty seven,
 
 00:21:56.255 --> 00:21:57.556
 the New England Historic Geological
 
 00:21:57.596 --> 00:21:58.115
 Register,
 
 00:21:58.375 --> 00:22:01.178
 which is available in print for members.
 
 00:22:01.258 --> 00:22:03.358
 And also it's also on our website as
 
 00:22:03.378 --> 00:22:04.038
 a database,
 
 00:22:04.179 --> 00:22:06.601
 which makes it very easy to find what
 
 00:22:06.621 --> 00:22:08.162
 is the newest scholarship coming out as
 
 00:22:08.182 --> 00:22:09.221
 well as other journals.
 
 00:22:09.662 --> 00:22:12.044
 We've also been digitizing materials for
 
 00:22:12.243 --> 00:22:13.984
 our digital public,
 
 00:22:14.005 --> 00:22:16.105
 the digital library and archives on our
 
 00:22:16.145 --> 00:22:16.625
 website.
 
 00:22:16.865 --> 00:22:17.928
 So through the R.
 
 00:22:17.988 --> 00:22:19.790
 Stanton Avery Special Collections,
 
 00:22:19.830 --> 00:22:21.032
 which is our manuscripts,
 
 00:22:21.153 --> 00:22:23.215
 and even the Weiner Family Jewish Heritage
 
 00:22:23.236 --> 00:22:23.596
 Center,
 
 00:22:23.737 --> 00:22:25.740
 it's one of our most popular places people
 
 00:22:25.900 --> 00:22:26.240
 go,
 
 00:22:26.461 --> 00:22:29.445
 like historians and other researchers
 
 00:22:29.506 --> 00:22:31.689
 working remotely all around the world can
 
 00:22:31.788 --> 00:22:32.130
 access
 
 00:22:32.627 --> 00:22:33.308
 materials,
 
 00:22:33.328 --> 00:22:35.211
 which include things like Revolutionary
 
 00:22:35.250 --> 00:22:38.473
 War manuscripts, Civil War diaries,
 
 00:22:39.515 --> 00:22:41.676
 other things that you may not be able
 
 00:22:41.717 --> 00:22:44.559
 to get access to maybe the original right
 
 00:22:44.579 --> 00:22:44.720
 away,
 
 00:22:44.740 --> 00:22:45.881
 but we can at least give you some
 
 00:22:45.901 --> 00:22:47.481
 kind of facsimile online,
 
 00:22:47.542 --> 00:22:49.785
 making it much more accessible, I think,
 
 00:22:49.845 --> 00:22:51.046
 for more researchers.
 
 00:22:51.165 --> 00:22:53.508
 And we partner a lot with organizations
 
 00:22:53.548 --> 00:22:54.970
 like FamilySearch for some of our
 
 00:22:55.109 --> 00:22:56.852
 international databases, especially.
 
 00:22:57.692 --> 00:22:59.373
 And we're also creating lots of new study
 
 00:22:59.413 --> 00:22:59.913
 projects.
 
 00:22:59.973 --> 00:23:00.894
 I can tell you there are a lot
 
 00:23:00.913 --> 00:23:02.816
 of things coming down the pipe that will
 
 00:23:02.836 --> 00:23:03.256
 be, I think,
 
 00:23:03.276 --> 00:23:05.317
 really exciting to help more and more
 
 00:23:05.336 --> 00:23:05.678
 people.
 
 00:23:05.877 --> 00:23:06.238
 So,
 
 00:23:06.278 --> 00:23:07.538
 and we're doing a lot with our ten
 
 00:23:07.558 --> 00:23:10.060
 million names project to help recover,
 
 00:23:10.201 --> 00:23:10.540
 restore,
 
 00:23:10.560 --> 00:23:12.382
 and remember the names of the ten million
 
 00:23:12.903 --> 00:23:13.222
 men, women,
 
 00:23:13.262 --> 00:23:14.483
 and children who were enslaved in this
 
 00:23:14.523 --> 00:23:15.023
 country.
 
 00:23:15.704 --> 00:23:17.885
 Lots of new study projects coming out with
 
 00:23:17.945 --> 00:23:20.327
 lots of partners uncovering names that
 
 00:23:20.347 --> 00:23:23.529
 people probably have never seen before.
 
 00:23:23.549 --> 00:23:25.351
 We're talking with David Allen Lambert and
 
 00:23:25.371 --> 00:23:26.612
 Melanie McComb from the
 
 00:23:28.039 --> 00:23:29.480
 American ancestors,
 
 00:23:30.181 --> 00:23:31.862
 formerly the New England,
 
 00:23:31.882 --> 00:23:32.903
 I can't keep track of whether it's
 
 00:23:32.942 --> 00:23:34.223
 formerly the New England Historic
 
 00:23:34.243 --> 00:23:36.464
 Genealogical Society or what the... Well,
 
 00:23:36.484 --> 00:23:38.286
 now we just use American ancestors,
 
 00:23:38.326 --> 00:23:40.048
 but people may know us as New England
 
 00:23:40.067 --> 00:23:41.608
 Historic Genealogical Society.
 
 00:23:42.628 --> 00:23:42.890
 Okay.
 
 00:23:43.109 --> 00:23:45.090
 But yeah, it's a great organization.
 
 00:23:45.270 --> 00:23:47.192
 And you've mentioned just some of the
 
 00:23:47.231 --> 00:23:49.273
 different pieces to it.
 
 00:23:49.354 --> 00:23:51.075
 And our focus is the revolution.
 
 00:23:51.394 --> 00:23:51.955
 And Melanie,
 
 00:23:51.976 --> 00:23:54.076
 you were talking earlier about children
 
 00:23:54.176 --> 00:23:55.857
 and what you're finding out about children
 
 00:23:55.958 --> 00:23:57.038
 at the time of the revolutions.
 
 00:23:58.487 --> 00:23:58.767
 Right.
 
 00:23:58.826 --> 00:23:59.027
 Yeah.
 
 00:23:59.047 --> 00:24:00.428
 So I want to look at the different
 
 00:24:00.448 --> 00:24:01.868
 ways that children are impacted.
 
 00:24:01.888 --> 00:24:03.890
 There were cases where I've seen diaries
 
 00:24:03.930 --> 00:24:05.490
 that were written by children,
 
 00:24:05.510 --> 00:24:06.810
 especially like young teens.
 
 00:24:07.311 --> 00:24:08.571
 There's even, there's family,
 
 00:24:08.612 --> 00:24:10.133
 there's a lot of like a family lore
 
 00:24:10.173 --> 00:24:11.794
 stories or ones that were told in local
 
 00:24:11.834 --> 00:24:12.273
 history.
 
 00:24:12.294 --> 00:24:14.174
 I'm thinking of like Sybil Ludington.
 
 00:24:14.234 --> 00:24:15.955
 She was called the female Paul Revere.
 
 00:24:15.976 --> 00:24:17.497
 There's a lot of lore around her that
 
 00:24:17.557 --> 00:24:19.117
 I'm trying to look into and just try
 
 00:24:19.137 --> 00:24:20.919
 to see what is actually in the record
 
 00:24:20.979 --> 00:24:21.598
 about her.
 
 00:24:22.200 --> 00:24:23.460
 But, you know, there were these, you know,
 
 00:24:23.500 --> 00:24:24.480
 things that would talk about
 
 00:24:25.402 --> 00:24:27.983
 We almost dismiss that women that sorry,
 
 00:24:28.023 --> 00:24:30.365
 we also sometimes dismiss that children
 
 00:24:30.405 --> 00:24:31.807
 were impacted by the revolution.
 
 00:24:32.048 --> 00:24:34.589
 You know, what they actually eyewitness,
 
 00:24:34.609 --> 00:24:36.151
 especially if they were living in places
 
 00:24:36.171 --> 00:24:39.134
 like Boston and where they might have seen
 
 00:24:39.213 --> 00:24:41.076
 something during that time and how it was
 
 00:24:41.115 --> 00:24:44.719
 impacting if they felt they needed to flee
 
 00:24:44.759 --> 00:24:45.420
 an area.
 
 00:24:46.099 --> 00:24:46.279
 You know,
 
 00:24:46.299 --> 00:24:47.682
 even thinking about the children impacted
 
 00:24:47.701 --> 00:24:49.782
 that were children of loyalist families.
 
 00:24:49.923 --> 00:24:50.263
 Right.
 
 00:24:50.284 --> 00:24:50.364
 Yeah.
 
 00:24:51.440 --> 00:24:54.362
 where families were harassed,
 
 00:24:54.402 --> 00:24:57.583
 tarred and feathered and basically pushed
 
 00:24:57.603 --> 00:24:58.523
 out of their communities.
 
 00:24:58.564 --> 00:25:00.223
 And that must have been a very terrifying
 
 00:25:00.324 --> 00:25:01.765
 situation for them.
 
 00:25:02.204 --> 00:25:03.726
 And I think it's something that has not
 
 00:25:03.766 --> 00:25:05.666
 got a lot of attention is just thinking
 
 00:25:05.707 --> 00:25:06.366
 about, well,
 
 00:25:06.586 --> 00:25:08.067
 what was going on with the children and
 
 00:25:08.367 --> 00:25:10.269
 what stories do we know about them and
 
 00:25:10.308 --> 00:25:13.250
 how can we learn more through their eyes?
 
 00:25:13.269 --> 00:25:14.211
 So how can we learn more?
 
 00:25:15.767 --> 00:25:18.548
 So looking at those diaries is definitely
 
 00:25:18.567 --> 00:25:20.407
 a big one to see what was actually
 
 00:25:20.428 --> 00:25:23.628
 written in there firsthand and starting to
 
 00:25:23.669 --> 00:25:25.309
 document their other vital records through
 
 00:25:25.329 --> 00:25:28.371
 their parents to find what else is there.
 
 00:25:28.431 --> 00:25:29.290
 So a lot of it is going to
 
 00:25:29.310 --> 00:25:30.931
 be manuscript material, I will say,
 
 00:25:31.090 --> 00:25:34.231
 besides looking into local town history,
 
 00:25:34.751 --> 00:25:36.073
 which might fill in some more of that
 
 00:25:36.113 --> 00:25:36.752
 information.
 
 00:25:36.873 --> 00:25:38.353
 And we find that a lot of children
 
 00:25:38.413 --> 00:25:40.713
 also wrote more things later on in life.
 
 00:25:40.973 --> 00:25:41.233
 Right.
 
 00:25:41.830 --> 00:25:42.893
 that were published later.
 
 00:25:43.433 --> 00:25:43.693
 You know,
 
 00:25:43.734 --> 00:25:45.317
 some of them obviously more fantastical
 
 00:25:45.337 --> 00:25:46.640
 than others, but you know,
 
 00:25:46.840 --> 00:25:48.805
 the idea of what they might've witnessed
 
 00:25:48.845 --> 00:25:51.711
 during a time when everything was
 
 00:25:51.750 --> 00:25:52.112
 happening.
 
 00:25:52.474 --> 00:25:53.756
 I mean, case in point, Bob,
 
 00:25:53.836 --> 00:25:55.897
 my own fourth great-grandfather was at
 
 00:25:55.939 --> 00:25:57.920
 Dorchester Heights just over fifty years
 
 00:25:57.961 --> 00:25:59.122
 ago this week.
 
 00:26:00.143 --> 00:26:01.604
 His son was six years old.
 
 00:26:02.105 --> 00:26:03.546
 And my third great-grandfather would
 
 00:26:03.605 --> 00:26:05.307
 ultimately move to Boston before they
 
 00:26:05.347 --> 00:26:06.328
 lived in Newburyport.
 
 00:26:06.608 --> 00:26:08.451
 And when he was almost forty-two years
 
 00:26:08.570 --> 00:26:08.790
 old,
 
 00:26:09.311 --> 00:26:11.814
 enlisted and became an artificer in the
 
 00:26:11.854 --> 00:26:13.036
 United States artillery.
 
 00:26:13.675 --> 00:26:14.497
 I mean,
 
 00:26:14.517 --> 00:26:15.958
 here he has a father who was very
 
 00:26:16.057 --> 00:26:17.479
 actively involved from the French and
 
 00:26:17.519 --> 00:26:18.078
 Indian War,
 
 00:26:18.299 --> 00:26:20.361
 led a company to Lexington and Concord in
 
 00:26:20.381 --> 00:26:21.201
 the Second Essex.
 
 00:26:21.682 --> 00:26:24.223
 So he had that military training.
 
 00:26:24.263 --> 00:26:25.345
 Who knows, you know,
 
 00:26:25.365 --> 00:26:27.185
 you think during the war, you know,
 
 00:26:27.226 --> 00:26:28.968
 hearing the stories of his father and that
 
 00:26:29.008 --> 00:26:29.488
 excitement.
 
 00:26:29.528 --> 00:26:31.368
 And he ended up being in the artillery
 
 00:26:31.409 --> 00:26:33.691
 company out in Plattsburgh the last time
 
 00:26:33.711 --> 00:26:35.211
 America was in basically attack.
 
 00:26:35.231 --> 00:26:35.372
 Oh, wow.
 
 00:26:35.392 --> 00:26:35.471
 Yeah.
 
 00:26:35.491 --> 00:26:35.571
 Yeah.
 
 00:26:37.753 --> 00:26:37.834
 Yeah,
 
 00:26:37.854 --> 00:26:39.895
 and the Battle of Plattsburgh is probably
 
 00:26:39.955 --> 00:26:42.917
 the most critical naval battle in American
 
 00:26:42.978 --> 00:26:43.397
 history,
 
 00:26:43.438 --> 00:26:45.480
 and it's fought actually between the Green
 
 00:26:45.519 --> 00:26:46.640
 Mountains of Vermont and the White
 
 00:26:46.680 --> 00:26:47.721
 Mountains of New York.
 
 00:26:47.820 --> 00:26:48.422
 That's true.
 
 00:26:49.592 --> 00:26:50.092
 And actually,
 
 00:26:50.771 --> 00:26:52.413
 there's a story that John Becker,
 
 00:26:52.452 --> 00:26:54.692
 who was part of the Knox Trail,
 
 00:26:54.712 --> 00:26:56.874
 he was a boy in New York,
 
 00:26:56.894 --> 00:26:57.814
 and he kept a diary.
 
 00:26:57.834 --> 00:27:00.355
 And then General Thomas's son shows up at
 
 00:27:00.394 --> 00:27:02.194
 Dorchester Heights during the siege of
 
 00:27:02.255 --> 00:27:02.775
 Boston.
 
 00:27:02.795 --> 00:27:06.115
 You have these direct observations by kids
 
 00:27:06.135 --> 00:27:08.195
 who were there and were participating.
 
 00:27:08.236 --> 00:27:10.277
 And it does, as Melody says,
 
 00:27:10.317 --> 00:27:11.596
 makes for great stories.
 
 00:27:11.616 --> 00:27:11.896
 And also,
 
 00:27:11.916 --> 00:27:13.938
 we can think of how particularly younger
 
 00:27:14.258 --> 00:27:14.857
 audiences,
 
 00:27:14.897 --> 00:27:16.999
 younger would be much more interested in
 
 00:27:17.058 --> 00:27:18.558
 that perspective than, say,
 
 00:27:19.917 --> 00:27:22.058
 if the equivalent of David or I were
 
 00:27:22.838 --> 00:27:23.759
 there at the time.
 
 00:27:24.219 --> 00:27:26.619
 I was just thinking,
 
 00:27:27.440 --> 00:27:29.441
 Ray Shepard is an author of children's
 
 00:27:29.480 --> 00:27:31.161
 books, and at our Roxbury event,
 
 00:27:31.181 --> 00:27:35.662
 he read the short story of Abel Boston,
 
 00:27:35.741 --> 00:27:39.042
 who rides, and it's fictional.
 
 00:27:39.123 --> 00:27:40.304
 He just made this story up.
 
 00:27:41.084 --> 00:27:43.664
 But by the end of the afternoon,
 
 00:27:43.785 --> 00:27:45.704
 the mayor was citing this story,
 
 00:27:45.744 --> 00:27:47.205
 and others were citing this story.
 
 00:27:48.965 --> 00:27:50.426
 It raises a question,
 
 00:27:50.446 --> 00:27:52.167
 something you guys are really good at,
 
 00:27:52.188 --> 00:27:54.230
 which is how do you discern what's true
 
 00:27:54.269 --> 00:27:54.910
 and what's not?
 
 00:27:55.410 --> 00:27:57.412
 Well, I mean, it's like, you know,
 
 00:27:58.152 --> 00:28:01.473
 the great story of Revere's Ride by
 
 00:28:01.534 --> 00:28:02.234
 Longfellow.
 
 00:28:02.815 --> 00:28:03.615
 Yeah.
 
 00:28:03.756 --> 00:28:06.096
 How much of the history was lost and
 
 00:28:06.136 --> 00:28:08.798
 it has to be solidly proven that because
 
 00:28:08.858 --> 00:28:09.859
 Longfellow said it.
 
 00:28:10.634 --> 00:28:12.777
 i mean until this day william dawes
 
 00:28:12.836 --> 00:28:15.359
 doesn't even lie in you know king's chapel
 
 00:28:15.400 --> 00:28:17.122
 his tomb says he is he's buried in
 
 00:28:17.142 --> 00:28:20.365
 forest hills it was moved in so people
 
 00:28:20.404 --> 00:28:22.346
 go and pay respects to the second writer
 
 00:28:22.366 --> 00:28:25.089
 who's not even there yeah so if they're
 
 00:28:25.109 --> 00:28:26.770
 at forest hills they can also see joseph
 
 00:28:26.810 --> 00:28:29.213
 warren right exactly exactly
 
 00:28:31.066 --> 00:28:33.127
 We're talking to Melanie McComb and David
 
 00:28:33.167 --> 00:28:34.769
 Allen Lambert from the New England
 
 00:28:34.809 --> 00:28:36.490
 Historic Genealogical Society,
 
 00:28:36.570 --> 00:28:37.791
 American ancestors.
 
 00:28:38.653 --> 00:28:41.575
 And David told us that as a fourteen
 
 00:28:41.595 --> 00:28:41.836
 year old,
 
 00:28:41.855 --> 00:28:44.397
 he was haunting the headquarters on
 
 00:28:44.438 --> 00:28:44.958
 Newbury Street.
 
 00:28:44.998 --> 00:28:46.700
 Melanie, what brought you into genealogy?
 
 00:28:48.038 --> 00:28:51.079
 So I've probably been doing genealogy as a
 
 00:28:51.140 --> 00:28:52.621
 very young age, unofficially, I'll say,
 
 00:28:52.661 --> 00:28:54.922
 because I was always, as a child,
 
 00:28:54.961 --> 00:28:57.083
 the one that would go through the family
 
 00:28:57.124 --> 00:28:58.564
 photographs because a lot of times they
 
 00:28:58.604 --> 00:28:59.664
 were not in albums,
 
 00:28:59.704 --> 00:29:00.846
 they were just in boxes.
 
 00:29:00.945 --> 00:29:02.787
 And I would just be like, who's that?
 
 00:29:02.906 --> 00:29:03.606
 Who's that?
 
 00:29:03.626 --> 00:29:04.028
 You know,
 
 00:29:04.048 --> 00:29:06.028
 that's kind of like my initial interest.
 
 00:29:06.648 --> 00:29:08.329
 I don't think I got into officially
 
 00:29:08.410 --> 00:29:11.471
 genealogy until I was about eighteen in
 
 00:29:11.511 --> 00:29:12.032
 college.
 
 00:29:12.593 --> 00:29:14.814
 I had to do a medical family tree
 
 00:29:14.834 --> 00:29:15.974
 for a genetics course.
 
 00:29:16.901 --> 00:29:19.863
 because they wanted to see how possible if
 
 00:29:19.883 --> 00:29:21.344
 you were carriers of different diseases
 
 00:29:21.364 --> 00:29:24.046
 and other conditions that you had to do.
 
 00:29:24.105 --> 00:29:25.767
 So I had to have very personal interviews
 
 00:29:25.787 --> 00:29:26.646
 with relatives.
 
 00:29:27.307 --> 00:29:29.048
 And so that's when we started talking
 
 00:29:29.068 --> 00:29:29.769
 about family.
 
 00:29:29.808 --> 00:29:32.170
 And I remember just asking different
 
 00:29:32.190 --> 00:29:33.191
 members of my family.
 
 00:29:33.351 --> 00:29:35.372
 And with the exception of my maternal
 
 00:29:35.432 --> 00:29:36.413
 grandmother's line,
 
 00:29:36.613 --> 00:29:37.993
 we didn't know where any of the family
 
 00:29:38.013 --> 00:29:39.035
 was from.
 
 00:29:39.075 --> 00:29:41.276
 So it was like this big question mark.
 
 00:29:41.965 --> 00:29:44.268
 of, well, where are we from?
 
 00:29:44.288 --> 00:29:45.087
 What are we?
 
 00:29:45.548 --> 00:29:46.548
 Especially on my mother's side,
 
 00:29:46.568 --> 00:29:47.609
 which was Eastern European,
 
 00:29:47.650 --> 00:29:50.071
 we had no idea until I really dug
 
 00:29:50.152 --> 00:29:52.153
 into it more.
 
 00:29:52.212 --> 00:29:52.813
 That's interesting.
 
 00:29:52.833 --> 00:29:54.394
 It really helps you to understand.
 
 00:29:54.434 --> 00:29:55.454
 It helps you to tie in.
 
 00:29:55.894 --> 00:29:58.696
 And that must be an area that has
 
 00:29:58.737 --> 00:30:00.218
 renewed an interest in this,
 
 00:30:00.398 --> 00:30:01.960
 particularly needing to know things for
 
 00:30:02.019 --> 00:30:03.019
 genetic reasons.
 
 00:30:05.188 --> 00:30:07.148
 i i'm just thinking too i mean there
 
 00:30:07.169 --> 00:30:08.451
 are a number of really interesting
 
 00:30:08.510 --> 00:30:11.953
 organizations that do this work or want uh
 
 00:30:12.595 --> 00:30:14.016
 heritage organizations i guess they're
 
 00:30:14.036 --> 00:30:16.638
 called like the dar the sar the cincinnati
 
 00:30:17.440 --> 00:30:21.463
 um what's their role in um in this
 
 00:30:21.483 --> 00:30:24.246
 and what role do you see for organizations
 
 00:30:24.266 --> 00:30:27.009
 like the dar the sar the cincinnati in
 
 00:30:27.028 --> 00:30:27.789
 this broader world
 
 00:30:28.501 --> 00:30:28.942
 Well, I mean,
 
 00:30:29.001 --> 00:30:30.462
 I think what's wonderful is that we live
 
 00:30:30.482 --> 00:30:32.244
 in such a digital world now that you
 
 00:30:32.285 --> 00:30:33.424
 can get easy access.
 
 00:30:33.464 --> 00:30:34.566
 You don't have to go to the local
 
 00:30:34.605 --> 00:30:36.186
 public library to get Massachusetts
 
 00:30:36.207 --> 00:30:37.909
 Soldiers and Sailors in the Revolution.
 
 00:30:37.949 --> 00:30:40.250
 You can get it off of free websites.
 
 00:30:40.289 --> 00:30:41.550
 You can get it on archive.org,
 
 00:30:41.590 --> 00:30:42.271
 Cathy Trust.
 
 00:30:42.971 --> 00:30:45.493
 So it's making it accessible for potential
 
 00:30:45.554 --> 00:30:45.973
 members,
 
 00:30:45.993 --> 00:30:47.174
 and I think it makes it easier for
 
 00:30:47.194 --> 00:30:49.457
 the registrars of these organizations
 
 00:30:49.477 --> 00:30:51.278
 because they can easily get to muster
 
 00:30:51.298 --> 00:30:52.719
 rolls that are digitized from the
 
 00:30:52.759 --> 00:30:54.000
 Massachusetts Archives, for instance.
 
 00:30:54.019 --> 00:30:54.160
 Yes.
 
 00:30:54.579 --> 00:30:56.340
 And the directories are so invaluable
 
 00:30:56.381 --> 00:30:59.782
 because they're talking about on both the
 
 00:30:59.803 --> 00:31:01.304
 Daughters of the American Revolution and
 
 00:31:01.324 --> 00:31:02.364
 the Sons of the American Revolution,
 
 00:31:02.403 --> 00:31:04.785
 you can learn more about who their family
 
 00:31:04.825 --> 00:31:06.705
 was, their spouse, their children.
 
 00:31:07.166 --> 00:31:09.127
 It identifies not only military service,
 
 00:31:09.147 --> 00:31:10.488
 but patriotic service,
 
 00:31:10.508 --> 00:31:12.368
 which is so key for researching women,
 
 00:31:12.429 --> 00:31:14.410
 especially because a lot of times when I'm
 
 00:31:14.430 --> 00:31:15.611
 working with our patrons here,
 
 00:31:16.090 --> 00:31:17.471
 Not a lot of people are looking into
 
 00:31:17.571 --> 00:31:19.894
 the women and their roles in the American
 
 00:31:19.913 --> 00:31:20.954
 Revolution during this time.
 
 00:31:20.974 --> 00:31:22.255
 And I always say that's a way you
 
 00:31:22.275 --> 00:31:23.916
 could get into these organizations is
 
 00:31:24.037 --> 00:31:25.877
 pivot to the women and see what they
 
 00:31:25.917 --> 00:31:26.238
 did.
 
 00:31:26.858 --> 00:31:28.400
 One act of patriotic service is all you
 
 00:31:28.420 --> 00:31:31.162
 really need to prove that connection if
 
 00:31:31.182 --> 00:31:32.702
 you can't find a direct soldier,
 
 00:31:32.742 --> 00:31:33.323
 for example.
 
 00:31:33.363 --> 00:31:34.604
 Right, right.
 
 00:31:36.605 --> 00:31:37.964
 Jonathan mentioned the children in
 
 00:31:38.045 --> 00:31:38.605
 Arlington,
 
 00:31:38.625 --> 00:31:40.625
 when their house was set on fire by
 
 00:31:40.665 --> 00:31:42.026
 British soldiers, they put it out.
 
 00:31:42.046 --> 00:31:43.726
 So that's certainly an act of patriotic
 
 00:31:43.766 --> 00:31:44.166
 service.
 
 00:31:44.186 --> 00:31:44.727
 Absolutely.
 
 00:31:44.846 --> 00:31:47.227
 There's always cases like that.
 
 00:31:47.567 --> 00:31:49.367
 Or ways that people almost sabotage the
 
 00:31:49.407 --> 00:31:49.748
 British.
 
 00:31:50.028 --> 00:31:52.128
 We find cases of women that were basically
 
 00:31:52.189 --> 00:31:53.368
 just trying to run them out of their
 
 00:31:53.409 --> 00:31:55.829
 home and take their supplies.
 
 00:31:57.230 --> 00:31:59.570
 Little acts like that, you can prove that.
 
 00:32:00.654 --> 00:32:02.436
 It's just getting the SDR and DAR to
 
 00:32:02.477 --> 00:32:04.339
 approve the patriotic service.
 
 00:32:04.359 --> 00:32:04.460
 Yeah,
 
 00:32:06.462 --> 00:32:08.285
 but they open up so many ways you
 
 00:32:08.305 --> 00:32:09.286
 can prove it, though.
 
 00:32:09.306 --> 00:32:09.567
 I mean,
 
 00:32:09.666 --> 00:32:12.009
 even down to like there's different taxes
 
 00:32:12.029 --> 00:32:12.651
 you could pay.
 
 00:32:12.730 --> 00:32:14.452
 Like if you paid what was called,
 
 00:32:14.573 --> 00:32:15.513
 especially in Massachusetts,
 
 00:32:15.534 --> 00:32:16.756
 was called the beef tax.
 
 00:32:16.816 --> 00:32:17.616
 You basically were.
 
 00:32:18.048 --> 00:32:21.130
 providing actual cattle or money to buy
 
 00:32:21.289 --> 00:32:22.550
 beef for the Continental Army,
 
 00:32:23.211 --> 00:32:24.451
 if you were on a tax roll and
 
 00:32:24.590 --> 00:32:25.912
 they were very clear on what it was
 
 00:32:26.031 --> 00:32:27.432
 used for, that was enough.
 
 00:32:27.652 --> 00:32:28.512
 You could prove that, though.
 
 00:32:28.532 --> 00:32:30.093
 And a lot of women were listed in
 
 00:32:30.153 --> 00:32:31.673
 those records, along with men,
 
 00:32:31.894 --> 00:32:34.315
 that that was one way you could contribute
 
 00:32:34.335 --> 00:32:35.674
 was just giving a little bit of money
 
 00:32:35.775 --> 00:32:36.335
 or a cow.
 
 00:32:36.355 --> 00:32:36.474
 Yeah.
 
 00:32:37.576 --> 00:32:38.375
 In Philadelphia,
 
 00:32:38.415 --> 00:32:39.797
 women were making shirts for the
 
 00:32:39.836 --> 00:32:40.636
 Continental Army.
 
 00:32:42.193 --> 00:32:43.434
 And then also there was also the
 
 00:32:43.494 --> 00:32:45.316
 Philadelphia Ladies Association.
 
 00:32:45.415 --> 00:32:47.135
 They were very much hitting up all the
 
 00:32:47.175 --> 00:32:49.798
 aristocrats around town and trying to
 
 00:32:49.837 --> 00:32:51.518
 collect all kinds of money and all
 
 00:32:51.557 --> 00:32:53.239
 different types of money all across.
 
 00:32:53.278 --> 00:32:55.759
 And they had collected so much that they
 
 00:32:55.799 --> 00:32:58.741
 ended up in the treasurer's report because
 
 00:32:58.761 --> 00:33:01.583
 they just had such a sustained large
 
 00:33:01.603 --> 00:33:02.903
 amount of money towards the Continental
 
 00:33:02.942 --> 00:33:03.723
 Army at that time.
 
 00:33:05.199 --> 00:33:05.640
 And then, of course,
 
 00:33:05.660 --> 00:33:07.760
 there are Spanish soldiers in California
 
 00:33:07.820 --> 00:33:09.461
 who donate money to the Continental
 
 00:33:09.481 --> 00:33:10.041
 Congress.
 
 00:33:10.102 --> 00:33:12.044
 And think about Galvez's expedition to
 
 00:33:12.104 --> 00:33:12.723
 Pensacola.
 
 00:33:12.743 --> 00:33:14.384
 Would these kinds of things also get
 
 00:33:14.424 --> 00:33:15.726
 someone into the DAR or the SAR?
 
 00:33:15.746 --> 00:33:15.986
 Absolutely.
 
 00:33:16.006 --> 00:33:16.086
 Yeah.
 
 00:33:16.125 --> 00:33:18.867
 And anything that was going specifically
 
 00:33:18.928 --> 00:33:21.308
 towards that cause and for either the
 
 00:33:21.328 --> 00:33:22.630
 Continental Congress or for the
 
 00:33:22.670 --> 00:33:23.351
 Continental Army.
 
 00:33:23.931 --> 00:33:26.054
 know anything that was directly directed
 
 00:33:26.253 --> 00:33:28.396
 as a weight of that money was was
 
 00:33:28.457 --> 00:33:30.920
 all very helpful so and pivoting back to
 
 00:33:31.119 --> 00:33:34.243
 digitized digitized records now that i
 
 00:33:34.284 --> 00:33:35.705
 mean vital records have been indexed and
 
 00:33:35.746 --> 00:33:38.209
 transcribed for years town records where
 
 00:33:38.249 --> 00:33:39.611
 this information is
 
 00:33:40.250 --> 00:33:41.893
 is now something that's just being
 
 00:33:42.252 --> 00:33:44.115
 scratched upon because people are actually
 
 00:33:44.796 --> 00:33:46.656
 going to look through the town records
 
 00:33:46.676 --> 00:33:49.500
 because they can look at that item online
 
 00:33:49.539 --> 00:33:50.441
 from FamilySearch,
 
 00:33:50.901 --> 00:33:53.384
 and now they can use full-text AI and
 
 00:33:53.503 --> 00:33:55.045
 search for their ancestor's name.
 
 00:33:55.065 --> 00:33:57.086
 So more and more of these patriotic
 
 00:33:57.126 --> 00:33:58.548
 services, like Melanie alludes to,
 
 00:33:59.068 --> 00:34:00.951
 are going to be available as more and
 
 00:34:00.971 --> 00:34:02.211
 more people make that connect.
 
 00:34:03.836 --> 00:34:06.380
 You've also done some work on the
 
 00:34:06.420 --> 00:34:08.081
 loyalists and what they're up to.
 
 00:34:08.302 --> 00:34:10.625
 And can you tell us a little bit
 
 00:34:10.644 --> 00:34:11.626
 about what you're finding?
 
 00:34:12.666 --> 00:34:12.907
 Yeah.
 
 00:34:12.927 --> 00:34:13.708
 So with the loyalists,
 
 00:34:13.728 --> 00:34:16.391
 we're finding information like claims that
 
 00:34:16.411 --> 00:34:17.012
 were filed.
 
 00:34:17.172 --> 00:34:19.454
 So if there was any damages that was
 
 00:34:19.554 --> 00:34:21.197
 done during the war and they were trying
 
 00:34:21.257 --> 00:34:21.438
 to
 
 00:34:22.722 --> 00:34:24.802
 basically reimbursed by the British.
 
 00:34:25.123 --> 00:34:26.862
 That was something that we see those
 
 00:34:26.902 --> 00:34:29.023
 claims and they're very rich in detail.
 
 00:34:29.224 --> 00:34:31.804
 They tell you about what their home looks
 
 00:34:31.844 --> 00:34:33.505
 like, what livestock they had,
 
 00:34:34.144 --> 00:34:35.224
 what was actually lost,
 
 00:34:35.704 --> 00:34:36.706
 where they went to.
 
 00:34:36.746 --> 00:34:38.425
 A lot of them went to places like
 
 00:34:38.485 --> 00:34:40.626
 Canada or the Caribbean or even back to
 
 00:34:40.706 --> 00:34:41.146
 England.
 
 00:34:41.927 --> 00:34:43.847
 So those claims are really invaluable and
 
 00:34:43.867 --> 00:34:45.927
 those actually are digitized and available
 
 00:34:45.987 --> 00:34:47.648
 on sites of ancestry where you can
 
 00:34:47.708 --> 00:34:49.588
 actually search and find those.
 
 00:34:50.568 --> 00:34:50.748
 You know,
 
 00:34:50.809 --> 00:34:53.331
 also looking at the Crown land petitions
 
 00:34:53.351 --> 00:34:55.733
 that were filed in Canada are also really
 
 00:34:55.793 --> 00:34:58.335
 rich in detail because you find a lot
 
 00:34:58.355 --> 00:34:59.876
 of loyalists were marrying loyalists.
 
 00:34:59.956 --> 00:35:00.315
 You know,
 
 00:35:00.376 --> 00:35:03.297
 you find sons and daughters that showing
 
 00:35:03.338 --> 00:35:04.838
 their connections going back.
 
 00:35:04.938 --> 00:35:05.920
 And in some cases,
 
 00:35:05.960 --> 00:35:08.101
 it tells you what state,
 
 00:35:08.561 --> 00:35:09.942
 what colony they went back to.
 
 00:35:10.021 --> 00:35:10.563
 And, you know,
 
 00:35:10.583 --> 00:35:12.063
 sometimes even down to specific towns,
 
 00:35:12.123 --> 00:35:12.463
 even,
 
 00:35:12.523 --> 00:35:15.385
 which was really invaluable when you're
 
 00:35:15.405 --> 00:35:17.067
 trying to really trace that far back,
 
 00:35:17.126 --> 00:35:18.827
 especially if they stayed in Canada for
 
 00:35:18.867 --> 00:35:19.568
 generations.
 
 00:35:20.048 --> 00:35:22.570
 over that um you know and even we're
 
 00:35:22.590 --> 00:35:24.351
 also just finding other examples of just
 
 00:35:24.431 --> 00:35:26.672
 loyalists and just like what was what was
 
 00:35:26.693 --> 00:35:28.795
 the treatment like in town different towns
 
 00:35:28.894 --> 00:35:30.396
 were very much treated loyalists very
 
 00:35:30.436 --> 00:35:32.998
 differently um while we did run a lot
 
 00:35:33.018 --> 00:35:34.639
 of loyalists out of massachusetts it
 
 00:35:34.679 --> 00:35:36.820
 wasn't like in places in new york where
 
 00:35:37.119 --> 00:35:38.681
 you could be on a bill of attainder
 
 00:35:38.740 --> 00:35:40.503
 basically being like if you return to this
 
 00:35:40.543 --> 00:35:42.244
 state you're gonna lose your life
 
 00:35:42.284 --> 00:35:45.106
 basically yeah we see the treatment
 
 00:35:45.465 --> 00:35:47.547
 varying based on which colony even they
 
 00:35:47.567 --> 00:35:49.768
 were part of and what was their community
 
 00:35:49.849 --> 00:35:49.989
 like
 
 00:35:50.489 --> 00:35:52.050
 In Westchester County, New York,
 
 00:35:52.289 --> 00:35:54.690
 my ancestor, David Mills, was a loyalist.
 
 00:35:54.791 --> 00:35:56.492
 And he went up to Nova Scotia,
 
 00:35:56.532 --> 00:35:57.413
 to Cumberland County.
 
 00:35:57.992 --> 00:35:58.833
 And, you know,
 
 00:35:58.853 --> 00:36:00.213
 you would think that his land would have
 
 00:36:00.233 --> 00:36:00.795
 been seized.
 
 00:36:01.114 --> 00:36:01.275
 No,
 
 00:36:01.355 --> 00:36:03.456
 he's writing a deed in the Westchester
 
 00:36:03.496 --> 00:36:05.237
 County Deeds in about eighteen oh two,
 
 00:36:05.797 --> 00:36:08.559
 selling his land that he just abandoned as
 
 00:36:08.599 --> 00:36:09.219
 a loyalist.
 
 00:36:09.498 --> 00:36:10.480
 Spells it right out there,
 
 00:36:10.500 --> 00:36:12.061
 but they didn't resell it.
 
 00:36:12.101 --> 00:36:14.461
 So it wasn't like he ever he he
 
 00:36:14.481 --> 00:36:16.822
 made a petition to the crown for his
 
 00:36:16.922 --> 00:36:17.923
 personal possessions.
 
 00:36:18.744 --> 00:36:20.204
 wagons, his horses,
 
 00:36:20.264 --> 00:36:21.905
 his cattle that he left behind.
 
 00:36:21.965 --> 00:36:24.027
 And then sometimes you get surprises.
 
 00:36:24.547 --> 00:36:25.246
 In my own family,
 
 00:36:25.286 --> 00:36:27.608
 I thought I was tracing a Loyalist because
 
 00:36:27.628 --> 00:36:28.668
 everybody said they were Loyalists.
 
 00:36:29.108 --> 00:36:30.369
 And then I find that he was with
 
 00:36:30.489 --> 00:36:32.231
 His Majesty's Thirty-Eighth Regiment of
 
 00:36:32.251 --> 00:36:32.451
 Foot.
 
 00:36:32.471 --> 00:36:34.731
 He was a Redcoat that was actually in
 
 00:36:34.751 --> 00:36:37.132
 Boston, was at Bunker Hill, Lexington,
 
 00:36:37.152 --> 00:36:37.632
 and Concord,
 
 00:36:38.153 --> 00:36:39.954
 and then settled in what is now New
 
 00:36:39.974 --> 00:36:42.135
 Brunswick after many of them got out of
 
 00:36:42.155 --> 00:36:43.096
 the service at the end.
 
 00:36:43.155 --> 00:36:45.056
 So sometimes your Loyalists might have a
 
 00:36:45.097 --> 00:36:46.478
 little bit of military connection.
 
 00:36:46.797 --> 00:36:47.818
 or the Queen's Rangers,
 
 00:36:48.057 --> 00:36:49.619
 or even the British forces.
 
 00:36:50.018 --> 00:36:51.239
 And that usually could have been either
 
 00:36:51.278 --> 00:36:52.619
 during the time of the war or even
 
 00:36:52.639 --> 00:36:53.500
 shortly after.
 
 00:36:53.619 --> 00:36:54.639
 It might have just been a means of
 
 00:36:54.699 --> 00:36:56.300
 if you already were in some place like
 
 00:36:56.340 --> 00:36:56.780
 Canada,
 
 00:36:57.161 --> 00:36:59.240
 you would have suddenly felt a need and
 
 00:36:59.260 --> 00:37:00.501
 you'd want to serve in a military
 
 00:37:00.541 --> 00:37:00.981
 regiment.
 
 00:37:01.382 --> 00:37:02.942
 That was really your only option was
 
 00:37:02.981 --> 00:37:03.521
 serving there.
 
 00:37:04.483 --> 00:37:06.503
 But we do see people that do change
 
 00:37:06.543 --> 00:37:08.684
 sides during the time of the war and
 
 00:37:08.724 --> 00:37:10.603
 just find a reason why they just don't
 
 00:37:10.623 --> 00:37:11.784
 want to be part of the conflict and
 
 00:37:11.804 --> 00:37:13.105
 just decide to, you know,
 
 00:37:13.565 --> 00:37:15.646
 be with these regiments that David
 
 00:37:15.666 --> 00:37:18.166
 mentioned and serve, you know,
 
 00:37:18.186 --> 00:37:19.226
 serve England instead.
 
 00:37:19.507 --> 00:37:21.867
 So, I mean, and of course, you know,
 
 00:37:21.887 --> 00:37:22.527
 they're not going to get... Well,
 
 00:37:22.547 --> 00:37:23.449
 they thought they were going to win.
 
 00:37:23.469 --> 00:37:24.369
 Yeah, that's right.
 
 00:37:24.389 --> 00:37:24.829
 That's right.
 
 00:37:24.889 --> 00:37:25.088
 Yeah.
 
 00:37:25.188 --> 00:37:27.289
 And they probably thought that they
 
 00:37:27.309 --> 00:37:28.429
 weren't going to lose their homes.
 
 00:37:28.449 --> 00:37:29.751
 A lot of homes were complicated,
 
 00:37:29.791 --> 00:37:30.110
 of course.
 
 00:37:30.190 --> 00:37:30.490
 Oh, yeah.
 
 00:37:31.351 --> 00:37:31.771
 Yeah.
 
 00:37:31.791 --> 00:37:33.632
 One of the exciting collections, Bob,
 
 00:37:33.672 --> 00:37:35.032
 that we have in our building that we've
 
 00:37:35.052 --> 00:37:35.512
 had since
 
 00:37:36.443 --> 00:37:37.324
 the eighteen forties.
 
 00:37:37.965 --> 00:37:40.628
 It was documents left behind by British
 
 00:37:40.668 --> 00:37:42.851
 military forces in one of the homes in
 
 00:37:42.891 --> 00:37:43.391
 Boston.
 
 00:37:43.592 --> 00:37:46.235
 And we've had these at American Ancestors
 
 00:37:46.797 --> 00:37:49.019
 for a hundred and seventy plus years.
 
 00:37:49.059 --> 00:37:49.860
 And they're fascinating.
 
 00:37:49.900 --> 00:37:50.722
 They're like accounts.
 
 00:37:51.724 --> 00:37:53.903
 wagon wheels from this person or so you
 
 00:37:53.923 --> 00:37:56.125
 can almost see people that may have had
 
 00:37:56.164 --> 00:37:58.625
 a tendency to cooperate with the british
 
 00:37:59.106 --> 00:38:01.106
 versus uh and of course you know it's
 
 00:38:01.306 --> 00:38:03.065
 it's fascinating to think these are how
 
 00:38:03.106 --> 00:38:05.626
 many other things were left behind on
 
 00:38:05.666 --> 00:38:08.847
 march seventeenth and we just happened to
 
 00:38:08.867 --> 00:38:09.967
 have a small fraction of them and i
 
 00:38:09.987 --> 00:38:11.847
 think these have been digitized as part of
 
 00:38:11.867 --> 00:38:15.068
 our dla judy lucia archivist has mentioned
 
 00:38:15.088 --> 00:38:15.409
 about them
 
 00:38:16.664 --> 00:38:18.465
 It's amazing and it makes the stories so
 
 00:38:18.485 --> 00:38:20.728
 much more interesting knowing all of these
 
 00:38:20.768 --> 00:38:23.050
 details and knowing choices people are
 
 00:38:23.090 --> 00:38:25.032
 making that is depending on which side
 
 00:38:25.052 --> 00:38:26.132
 they think is going to win.
 
 00:38:26.172 --> 00:38:28.255
 I know Shirley Green's been our guest.
 
 00:38:28.275 --> 00:38:30.396
 She's an historian and she's researched
 
 00:38:30.416 --> 00:38:32.940
 her family who are African-American and
 
 00:38:32.960 --> 00:38:35.262
 there's one who they knew he fought in
 
 00:38:35.282 --> 00:38:35.922
 the revolution.
 
 00:38:36.302 --> 00:38:37.403
 But then it turns out he fought on
 
 00:38:37.423 --> 00:38:38.025
 the British side,
 
 00:38:38.045 --> 00:38:39.505
 which is why he was in Nova Scotia,
 
 00:38:39.525 --> 00:38:40.947
 but he had started off on the Patriot
 
 00:38:40.987 --> 00:38:41.228
 side.
 
 00:38:42.478 --> 00:38:44.101
 oh yeah absolutely yeah the story of black
 
 00:38:44.161 --> 00:38:46.585
 loyalists is really far interesting
 
 00:38:46.625 --> 00:38:48.047
 because i mean there was this promise
 
 00:38:48.067 --> 00:38:50.010
 basically that if you were enslaved if you
 
 00:38:50.030 --> 00:38:51.492
 you would get your freedom if you fought
 
 00:38:51.512 --> 00:38:52.414
 for the british and
 
 00:38:52.967 --> 00:38:55.007
 you would be able to go and try
 
 00:38:55.027 --> 00:38:56.369
 to apply at these, quote,
 
 00:38:56.389 --> 00:38:58.231
 Birch trials in New York City and try
 
 00:38:58.251 --> 00:38:59.992
 to apply for a certificate of freedom so
 
 00:39:00.032 --> 00:39:01.472
 you could go to places like Canada.
 
 00:39:01.652 --> 00:39:03.114
 And unfortunately,
 
 00:39:03.253 --> 00:39:05.896
 not all the previously enslaved were
 
 00:39:05.916 --> 00:39:06.295
 freed.
 
 00:39:06.315 --> 00:39:07.717
 A lot of them were still going with
 
 00:39:07.737 --> 00:39:10.219
 their enslavers and they were still
 
 00:39:10.498 --> 00:39:13.460
 enslaved for a while before they finally
 
 00:39:13.501 --> 00:39:17.202
 freed them or maybe exited when they were
 
 00:39:17.242 --> 00:39:19.405
 looking at Sierra Leone experiment that
 
 00:39:19.425 --> 00:39:21.025
 would happen when they were trying to have
 
 00:39:21.045 --> 00:39:22.286
 that migration going on there.
 
 00:39:23.047 --> 00:39:23.768
 But yeah,
 
 00:39:23.788 --> 00:39:25.329
 that's one of our collections that we've
 
 00:39:25.369 --> 00:39:27.650
 actually added on our website since is the
 
 00:39:27.710 --> 00:39:28.851
 Black Loyalist Directory,
 
 00:39:28.891 --> 00:39:30.813
 which is based on what was called the
 
 00:39:30.833 --> 00:39:31.554
 Book of Negroes.
 
 00:39:31.693 --> 00:39:33.896
 So of those who were enslaved,
 
 00:39:33.916 --> 00:39:37.918
 and ones that got their freedom to go
 
 00:39:37.978 --> 00:39:39.219
 over to places like Canada.
 
 00:39:39.900 --> 00:39:40.940
 And it includes their name,
 
 00:39:40.960 --> 00:39:42.242
 it includes a description of them,
 
 00:39:42.302 --> 00:39:43.844
 who they were previously enslaved to,
 
 00:39:43.903 --> 00:39:46.226
 so where they were living at the time,
 
 00:39:46.425 --> 00:39:47.427
 and where they were going to.
 
 00:39:47.606 --> 00:39:49.809
 So that gives you a lot of key
 
 00:39:49.829 --> 00:39:51.349
 details to when you're trying to track
 
 00:39:52.481 --> 00:39:54.443
 a very vulnerable community that may not
 
 00:39:54.463 --> 00:39:56.362
 have been the most represented in records.
 
 00:39:56.822 --> 00:39:58.543
 And then you have the poor African
 
 00:39:58.563 --> 00:39:59.684
 Americans from Virginia,
 
 00:39:59.804 --> 00:40:01.523
 where Lord Dunmore is promising them the
 
 00:40:01.563 --> 00:40:03.764
 world, and they're abandoned at Yorktown.
 
 00:40:04.144 --> 00:40:05.766
 And then they were looking to go back,
 
 00:40:05.806 --> 00:40:06.425
 and now, of course,
 
 00:40:06.445 --> 00:40:07.846
 now they're being re-enslaved.
 
 00:40:08.826 --> 00:40:10.226
 And, you know, some of them escaped,
 
 00:40:10.487 --> 00:40:11.407
 but not many.
 
 00:40:12.623 --> 00:40:13.083
 It's amazing.
 
 00:40:13.123 --> 00:40:15.126
 We really have just scratched the surface
 
 00:40:15.266 --> 00:40:16.469
 on this great topic.
 
 00:40:16.528 --> 00:40:18.833
 I'm wondering if someone wants to get
 
 00:40:18.893 --> 00:40:20.956
 started, what would you recommend they do?
 
 00:40:21.016 --> 00:40:21.858
 Where should they go?
 
 00:40:21.898 --> 00:40:23.521
 Someone who wants to get started digging
 
 00:40:23.561 --> 00:40:25.163
 into their family or just the general
 
 00:40:25.222 --> 00:40:26.005
 story of
 
 00:40:26.740 --> 00:40:26.900
 Well,
 
 00:40:26.920 --> 00:40:28.362
 I welcome them to come and visit us
 
 00:40:28.402 --> 00:40:30.403
 at ninety seven Newbury Street Tuesday
 
 00:40:30.423 --> 00:40:32.306
 through Saturday from ten to six.
 
 00:40:33.527 --> 00:40:34.467
 And if not,
 
 00:40:34.507 --> 00:40:36.510
 go to American Ancestors dot org.
 
 00:40:36.570 --> 00:40:38.311
 I mean, we have many things, Bob,
 
 00:40:38.351 --> 00:40:41.534
 on our education link where you can watch
 
 00:40:41.713 --> 00:40:43.476
 some of our pre-recorded webinars that are
 
 00:40:43.496 --> 00:40:43.795
 free.
 
 00:40:45.016 --> 00:40:45.577
 And of course,
 
 00:40:45.637 --> 00:40:48.219
 you can come in and meet our staff
 
 00:40:48.621 --> 00:40:50.262
 on the library desks or you can even
 
 00:40:50.322 --> 00:40:52.244
 do a paid consultation, if you wish,
 
 00:40:52.623 --> 00:40:54.585
 for an in-depth look with Melanie and
 
 00:40:54.606 --> 00:40:55.106
 myself.
 
 00:40:55.987 --> 00:40:57.788
 So we have many, many options.
 
 00:40:57.809 --> 00:40:59.210
 It depends how much time you have to
 
 00:40:59.250 --> 00:40:59.570
 commit.
 
 00:40:59.670 --> 00:41:01.632
 I know summer vacation is coming up on,
 
 00:41:02.072 --> 00:41:03.413
 and what a great way to learn more
 
 00:41:03.452 --> 00:41:04.393
 about Rev.
 
 00:41:04.414 --> 00:41:06.115
 Two-Fifty is to find your own connection
 
 00:41:06.135 --> 00:41:06.456
 to it.
 
 00:41:07.117 --> 00:41:08.438
 And we also have lots of free research
 
 00:41:08.458 --> 00:41:10.018
 guides on our website and even a free
 
 00:41:10.059 --> 00:41:10.739
 chat service.
 
 00:41:10.800 --> 00:41:12.780
 You can even chat with a genealogist and
 
 00:41:12.820 --> 00:41:13.782
 get a quick question,
 
 00:41:13.822 --> 00:41:15.744
 maybe you want a direction of where to
 
 00:41:15.764 --> 00:41:17.065
 go to find a resource.
 
 00:41:18.568 --> 00:41:20.429
 they can give you that advice and that's
 
 00:41:20.469 --> 00:41:21.871
 free between ten a.m.
 
 00:41:22.090 --> 00:41:23.172
 and six p.m.
 
 00:41:23.231 --> 00:41:24.813
 Tuesday to Saturday as well.
 
 00:41:24.893 --> 00:41:26.054
 So you don't need to be a member.
 
 00:41:26.195 --> 00:41:26.856
 So you use the chat.
 
 00:41:26.876 --> 00:41:27.295
 Great.
 
 00:41:27.315 --> 00:41:27.516
 Great.
 
 00:41:28.996 --> 00:41:29.637
 Thank you so much.
 
 00:41:29.677 --> 00:41:32.079
 We've been talking to David Allen Lambert
 
 00:41:32.219 --> 00:41:34.041
 and Melanie McComb from the New England
 
 00:41:34.081 --> 00:41:37.085
 from American Ancestors of the by New
 
 00:41:37.144 --> 00:41:39.186
 England Historic Genealogical Society.
 
 00:41:39.206 --> 00:41:41.588
 And it's American Ancestors dot org is
 
 00:41:41.628 --> 00:41:42.208
 their website.
 
 00:41:42.228 --> 00:41:43.730
 Thank you so much for joining us, Melanie.
 
 00:41:43.750 --> 00:41:44.371
 Thanks for having us.
 
 00:41:44.391 --> 00:41:45.311
 Thanks for having us, Bob.
 
 00:41:46.061 --> 00:41:47.202
 And thank you to Jonathan,
 
 00:41:47.262 --> 00:41:48.443
 our man behind the curtain,
 
 00:41:48.643 --> 00:41:50.864
 as well as to our listeners all around.
 
 00:41:50.925 --> 00:41:51.485
 And every week,
 
 00:41:51.945 --> 00:41:53.867
 we thank folks who are regularly tuning
 
 00:41:53.927 --> 00:41:54.126
 in.
 
 00:41:54.306 --> 00:41:55.467
 And if you're in one of these places
 
 00:41:55.507 --> 00:41:57.809
 and want some of our coveted Revolution
 
 00:41:57.849 --> 00:42:00.210
 Two-Fifty swag, send Jonathan an email,
 
 00:42:00.251 --> 00:42:02.693
 jlane at revolution two five oh dot org.
 
 00:42:03.496 --> 00:42:04.157
 And this week,
 
 00:42:04.297 --> 00:42:06.378
 I thank our listeners in Denver and
 
 00:42:06.498 --> 00:42:09.440
 Orlando and Kansas City, Bangkok,
 
 00:42:09.579 --> 00:42:11.521
 Montreal, Manchester, New Hampshire,
 
 00:42:11.581 --> 00:42:13.422
 Springfield and Hanover here in the
 
 00:42:13.483 --> 00:42:14.903
 Commonwealth of Massachusetts,
 
 00:42:15.304 --> 00:42:16.804
 all places between and beyond.
 
 00:42:16.844 --> 00:42:17.766
 Thanks for joining us.
 
 00:42:17.846 --> 00:42:19.487
 Now we will be piped out on the
 
 00:42:19.527 --> 00:42:20.208
 road to Boston.
 
 00:42:20.307 --> 00:42:20.608
 Thank you.