Welcome back Headliners! This week's Law and Order (Season 4 Episode 3,) Discord tells the story of a young woman's sexual assault by a Rock Star named C-Squared. Nothing says heavy metal like Algebra, am I right folks? After Matt recaps the show, Enn tells us about what inspired it, the story of Desiree Washington. Mike Tyson, who also assaulted his ex-wife Robin Givens, raped Desiree when she was 18 years old and who did the press annihilate over it? Spoiler Alert, it wasn't the boxer...What are your thoughts on how this sensational case played out?
Welcome back Headliners! This week's Law and Order (Season 4 Episode 3,) Discord tells the story of a young woman's sexual assault by a Rock Star named C-Squared. Nothing says heavy metal like Algebra, am I right folks? After Matt recaps the show, Enn tells us about what inspired it, the story of Desiree Washington. Mike Tyson, who also assaulted his ex-wife Robin Givens, raped Desiree when she was 18 years old and who did the press annihilate over it? Spoiler Alert, it wasn't the boxer...What are your thoughts on how this sensational case played out?
Hey listeners. Today's episode deals with the topic of domestic violence and sexual assault. We wanted to notify our listeners who may experience trauma related to those topics ahead of the episode. And to let you know that resources are listed on the website. Thanks for listening.
Voiceover:In this true crime law and order podcast, the episodes are presented by two separate yet equally ridiculous individuals one who researches the actual crime and the other who recaps the episode. These are their stories
Matt Molinaro:here we are another week.
Enn Burke:It's well yawn it's been less than a week because for once we're recording on a different day. And my my like Mojo has been all thrown out of whack Mojo
Matt Molinaro:Jojo the whole universe is isn't a whole different state of flux now.
Enn Burke:It's conspiring against me.
Matt Molinaro:What's happening? No, nothing.
Enn Burke:I mean, oh, yeah. We're it's Friday. It's Friday evening. Well, early afternoon for me.
Matt Molinaro:True. Yeah, I mean, 730 it's still nice out. It's so bright out because of daylight savings. So
Enn Burke:it's on like, doesn't go down until eight o'clock.
Matt Molinaro:It is I'm, I like it. I always like the cheat. Honestly, I'm not like one of those Daylight Savings like complainer complainers. I don't think it's necessary at this point. Like, let's just frickin cut it out. But oh, like, stop doing it. Yeah, like, you know, I get what everyone's saying who hates it, but I always really liked it at the beginning. Because I'm like, Oh, cool. It'll get like, darker earlier. It'll be nice and cozy during like, the cold weather and whatever. And then I'm over it and then it gets nice out. And then I'm like, Oh, my God, it's still bright out. The grass was greener, folks.
Enn Burke:I guess I I like the longer daylight but eight o'clock is a lot. I feel like I actually think I didn't fully read it. But somebody posted an article that Daylight Savings Time, which is what we're on right now is not good for our circadian rhythms as humans like, we should be following the non Daylight Savings Time. Time, whatever
Matt Molinaro:that makes sense. I mean, I was actually just reading, reading, let me be honest, like, I'm like, I was reading something intellectual. I was watching an episode of Shark Tank. Okay. I just realized where it came from. I was watching an episode of Shark Tank about this woman who is old one. So this is probably like, actually a product in the market now. But ah, she made this product and it's like a I guess she lived in a place where her office was. This was before pre COVID. Her office was like completely dark all the time. And she felt like it was totally affecting her mood. Yeah, she created one of those lamps. Oh, the
Enn Burke:sad lamp. Yeah.
Matt Molinaro:It's so cool. Like, it's the winner. The one she made us very attractive looking. Because they exist like already but the one she has like a little bit more. She's had the the reason she made it is because the watch the US had her at her desk. Everyone, like looked at it and was like, Yo, okay, yeah. But I don't know. I'm kind of want one. I mean, TV was like, but you work from home and we have a lot of windows now. And I'm like, room gets kind of dark still. Just let me have what I want.
Enn Burke:I will I mean, it's funny. I remember reading something about how they are good regardless of whether you have a lot of daylight or whatever they're like good for helping you like get the day going and that kind of stuff.
Matt Molinaro:I just want one. I like cool things. I like illuminated things. I like light. I like brightness. I like a vibe. I like a mood.
Enn Burke:Mm hmm. Yes. You're you're big on lighting moods.
Matt Molinaro:I am when you folks had the thank yous. We only had I think a couple at the time. And when you when you guys had to at the in the ceiling and stuff. And we were at your house. I was like oh, this is something this is me. This is the way to
Enn Burke:live. I love it. I really really like being able to really customize your lighting and like turn it on and off and and set timers and things from your phone. It's so handy. I love it.
Matt Molinaro:It really is and it makes it having the bulbs like that just makes it feel a few steps up from like college dorm room. Having like a
Enn Burke:black light. Yeah, just
Matt Molinaro:it's the adult version.
Enn Burke:Well, I have nothing for you this week.
Matt Molinaro:Wow. Wow, I have nothing. Whitney Houston, one of my favorite songs. Oh, this was the other podcast we talked about this and but remember when we talked in last week's episode a cool story about lambs being Yes, Mariah Carey fans
Enn Burke:Yes.
Matt Molinaro:So I had to look it up because I was like very interested in this because I had never heard that before. Of course, you're right. But did you know that she used to call her fans who were lambs? The laemmli.
Enn Burke:Get out of here.
Matt Molinaro:And this is kind of an interesting factoid. In one of her songs, she says like it's 211. So she made February 11. Like lamb Appreciation Day. Jesus, okay, but then, Whitney Houston actually, sadly passed away on February 11. Oh, um, since she was close with her, or at least has she was she canceled? She canceled the event indefinitely. Lame Appreciation Day. Yeah. Never came to be it. Well, it was happening for years. And then it ended when that happened. Wow. Out of respect for for Whitney. So hey, there's integrity.
Enn Burke:Yeah, whatever.
Matt Molinaro:Maybe she was just tired of doing it. She's like, I'm not singing anymore.
Enn Burke:cuse
Matt Molinaro:she was like, get the fuck out.
Enn Burke:I love that video. Still. Yeah,
Matt Molinaro:the only thing I have is a recommendation slash sort of exciting thing. I was able to do an interview sort of guest spot on a podcast this week. Yes, yes. And I don't know when it's gonna come out. I'll let everybody know. But it's a really fun, cool podcast that has a lot of spans a lot of different topics. And I think it would be very relatable, relatable to a lot of people. And the podcast is called Growing up Christian. And it's hosted by two gentlemen who were ex evangelical Christians who are really into the church and they sort of dirt around our age group. And they talk about different top there's they've been out for a while. I think they have like 80 Something episodes now. But they talked about a lot of different topics about or how many shared experiences those of us who grew up in the church have? Yeah, yeah. And I definitely did. I mean, my dad's pastor, for those of you who don't know, and so I've been, I was in Catholic Church at the beginning. And then we were in sort of like a non denominational Christian church. And then we were in a messianic Christian church. And now my dad is in a church that sort of seems to believe in young earth creationism, I don't know. But it was really fun. It was really a great conversation. I can't wait for it to come out. And I've heard a lot of the other episodes, and they talked to a lot of queer people. They're not clear themselves, but they've talked to a lot of different queer people, comedians, podcasters. Just a very wide span of people. And I remember when we first set the date to record, I was like, Oh, is there anything I should know, before I record to prepare myself? I haven't been a solo guest on the podcast before. Yeah. And they were like, well, just be prepared. You know, we do tend to sometimes like interrupt and go off on tangents. And I was like, well, that is just our vibe. Yeah,
Enn Burke:I'm all set. I'm ready for that
Matt Molinaro:to just like, come so just wanted to shout them out. They were really great, great hosts, I highly recommend anyone to go listen to their podcast, you can check out their catalogue. They've got tons of different topics, tons of different guests they've had on so check it out. It's really, really fun. And I had a great time. So thank you so much to them. And yeah,
Enn Burke:that's very cool. Well, shall we get into the episode?
Matt Molinaro:We should? Great. So this is season four of Law and Order episode three. It's called discord. Okay.
Enn Burke:And not not to not relate it to the social media platform me thing? No, not at all. Sweet thing appreciated by like 20 years.
Matt Molinaro:Speaking of which, we have a discord for our other podcast and if you're interested, check it if you want to chat with us. Yeah, let us know. And we'll we'll create like a little channel on our Discord for the for the headland fans, the headliners the headliners out there. Which by the way, anyone who is on our Patreon who has been looking for your name on the website, you are now on the main page of the website. So anyone in the top tier of our Patreon check out ripped headlines pod.com for your name on the on the main page. Thank you so much. To All right. Yeah. Hashtag girl bosses out there.
Enn Burke:Thank you. Yes. We appreciate you.
Matt Molinaro:Yes. All right. Well, and yes, is going to be experiencing this just like you folks, if you haven't been watching along with us.
Enn Burke:Yes. I told Matt that I got home like 20 like 30 minutes ago, and was like okay, um, you know, I have to record in about 15 minutes and suddenly it hit me that I had not watched the episode so I will be experienced seeing this in real
Matt Molinaro:time yet again, it kind of makes it more exciting that way sometimes.
Enn Burke:I wonder Yeah, I will. Yeah. Although yeah, now I won't be able to point out like weird fashions and things that you didn't comment on that I think really should be commented on.
Matt Molinaro:Way to hear this. You're gonna be very gripped. Okay. Well, we open with a small, we're in a small hotel Piano Bar. And there's a guy who is falling, just short of looking like Richard Gere. And he's with his friend and they're at the bar being total animals. And he says, I love hotels. They make me horny. That's his opening line. Yes. That's disgusting, disgusting. Then he sees the girl sitting nearby. And he creeps over to her and tries to put the moves on her. And she interned throws a drink in his face. Good for her good for her standing up for herself. But what happens next is very strange. Okay, so she gets up to walk away because she's like, How dare you like talk to me. She gets up to walk away and like a huff was really frantic. The way she her movements are when she gets up. So much so that she accidentally like knocks over a lamp that's off screen. It's so bizarre because the cameras sort of tight on her and then all of a sudden you see her like moving her arms and now she's walking away, and a lamp from off screen falls in front of her that you didn't even see there. And then within like literally seconds of you hearing the shattering glass. Two men in suits pop up in front of her like they could have. I think they're meant to have come from off camera, but they could have just popped up from down below, like Muppets or something so strange. They're facing her, you just do their backs. They have earpieces, and like they're the Secret Service. And I think it's never explained, but I'm guessing they're like hotel security, okay, for knocking over a lamp very, very dramatic. And then we cut to a scene immediately where she's in a fancy office with a man who tells her to take her business elsewhere. And she's like, What are you talking about? And I guess this is like hotel? Management? Oh, like, yeah, like,
Enn Burke:the lamp. Okay,
Matt Molinaro:but it's a really big, fancy looking office. Anyway, he says, take your business elsewhere. She's like, What are you talking about? And he starts to imply that she's looking for sex work, because no one would be in the hotel bar at this hour. It's like 1am. Okay, I mean, don't people cut apart? The when do people go to bars? 9pm only.
Enn Burke:I mean, if I had my way, the evening would end by
6:30pm.
Matt Molinaro:But So fair enough. So we
Enn Burke:need to collectively decide as a culture that like going out means six o'clock, everybody home by nine. I'm into
Matt Molinaro:that. But I mean, if you asked me that, like nine years ago, I feel like what are you talking about? Who's going someplace before 9pm.
Enn Burke:I still felt like that nine years ago. This is the person who performs in drag. Like the show, quote, unquote, starts at 10, which means showing up at 10. So the show starts at like 1045 11 o'clock.
Matt Molinaro:So she says, You know what, I need to make a call. And he gives her the phone. She calls the police and she says I'm here to report I'm calling to report a rape. So the hotel guy looks shocked. And then the next scene is Logan and Brisco. Talking to a doctor in the hospital. So we're meant to believe that now She's at the hospital doing a rape kit. Okay. The female doctor, I'm pointing out she's female for a reason. The female doctor says that the victim survivor has vaginal bruising. Semen is pregnant. And she has bruises on her legs and her arms. But she doesn't believe it's rape. Want to know why?
Enn Burke:It like is she actually a sex worker? So she's just like discounting the assault?
Matt Molinaro:Well, she says quote her. My mother told me that lady is don't go to a rockstars hotel rooms after midnight. And they're like, huh, and she says, Well, don't you know who the man that she's accusing us? And they say no. And are you ready for the guy's name? Sure. C squared. Stop it. He is evidently a heavy metal rock star. That's what we file right. Okay. Okay, so the opening credits start. And I had some time not as much as usual because they've cut it down. Yes. So I went to the store. I bought myself a chia pet. I spread some seeds. I watered it. By the time the seeds started to sprout and I got like a nice little layer. As the show began,
Enn Burke:did you get like the br 31
Matt Molinaro:I got the Rue McClanahan.
Enn Burke:Did they have all of them I always just only I think I only ever saw the
Matt Molinaro:I or I just said be Arthur. I actually owned the the Estelle Getty one. So I bet you they made. I bet you funny. Okay, so we're back and we find out that c squared real name is Clarence Carmichael. Okay, whoever, but I'm basically going to be referred to him as t squared for the rest of the episodic
Enn Burke:because his name is CC, I get it, which I'd like to see is not C squared, but whatever. Well, he's not
Matt Molinaro:that bright, you'll find out. So c squared is a platinum recording artist. And Lieutenant Van Buren says I happen to have picked up a video cassette of one of his music videos. So she brings it to the station. And she says why don't you watch this to see what you think about c squared. Sky watch it in her office. It is the music video is literally like a dark room. And I think like a metal staircase somewhere in the room that he's on sometimes. Calling this heavy metal I think he's being very generous. It's closer to hair metal, maybe. Okay, and it's him. The whole video is him and a woman making out in like a dark room while the song plays. And the song is like talking about how like women are bitches and stuff like that got hidden. So no one's impressed. I'm certainly not impressed. And the detectives decide to go and question Who not the square Ignasi squared, the survivor, so she's in questioning
Enn Burke:in a bring her into interrogation, Julia
Matt Molinaro:is in the interrogation room, Julius the name of our survivor. And the way she looks in the episode at this point is very demure. Buttoned up, well to do kind of look. So they have her in the room in the interrogation room. And she says that c squared had come to her dorm room. She's 19. And he asked her to go dancing. And he was gonna give her tickets to one of his concerts and her brother's a big fan. And so she said, Okay, like, you know, she just wanted, she got a kick out of it. And she thought it'd be a nice thing to get her brother tickets. So she's like, Sure, I'll go to I'll go out dancing with you. He told her if you want the tickets, just come with me. They're back at my hotel room. So she went with him back to his hotel room. This is when he rapes her. And afterwards, he said if you need to get home, grab some cab fare from my pocket. Wow. And Logan's response. What's the jury doing? What's the jury gonna believe that you were doing up in his room at that hour? Yeah. So she's visibly upset, obviously. Sure. And then Logan and Brisco go to the hotel, where they go to talk to c squared finally, he's in the Presidential Suite. They opened the door way to you see this character. Okay. He is shirtless through almost the whole episode. And pleasing I mean, sure. Okay, sure. He's fit I guess. But he's got Corey Feldman mullet vibes going on. Oh, wow. And like a little bit of like eyeliner because you know, rock and roll, rock and roll.
Enn Burke:Speaking of like, throwback fashion. So I think I told you a few episodes ago about Married at First Sight. I started with the spin off the other way, which is like has been filmed within the last four years. And so when we finished that, we decided to go back to the regular Married at First Sight and start with Season One, which, when I saw it, I was like, Is this the early 2000s? Because there was so much like boyband hair. And for tips, so much denim frosted tips and chunky highlights, and and turns out it was only 2011. If you had asked me to bet I would have said 2003 easily. It's so weird.
Matt Molinaro:It's a time warp. Yes. This whole room of people that he's got in this presidential suite is a total time warp. If they don't have a mullet of some type. They've got all the female characters have super feathered, like really hairspray to rock and roll hair. Tawny Keteyian hair. Yes, exactly. Exactly. They all could be auditioning to be in heart, maybe okay. He's also got some long haired male friends or bandmates or groupies. It's very unclear. And literally all the girls in the room could have been right off the Motley Crue girls girls Girls video shoot right immediately.
Enn Burke:God I forgot about that
Matt Molinaro:song. I had Like to so then they he leads them into the hotel. He's super Cavalier like, oh, the cops eat here big deal. What's the big deal, man, you know, his he really doesn't give a shit. And they're like, We need to talk to you. And he's like, come on in. And then there's a guy with a severe mullet who walks by giving like real side i. And he sits in the room. It turns out, he's the manager. And they ask c squared about Julia. And he's like, Yeah, I slept with her. But it was consensual, age old story in these episodes. Yeah. And then he gets really bent out of shape, because they're like, continuing to question him on it. And he tells the mullet guy, the manager named Teddy, don't have lawyers for this. And then he leaves the room. And then Teddy says, Hey, guys, you should know he's signing a big deal. So this is clearly an extortion effort. And you should check her out instead of him. And then the detectives leave, they have a really gross conversation outside, where they make really false generalizations about how a rape victim should behave, and how they should be acting. And is she really affecting him? And all this nonsense and they decide you know what we should do? We should see if she'd been drinking that night.
Enn Burke:Yeah, okay,
Matt Molinaro:so saying this episode is falling a little short is being really very generous. Yeah. So they go to her college and they talk to Julius friends who are sitting outside who are very what is very fashionable in a way where the look she has has come back. It's like oversized t shirt, with like short shorts under it like she could be Billy Eilish his friends.
Enn Burke:Speaking of things coming back, I went I got coffee this morning, I saw a barista wearing wide leg jeans, overalls, and I was like, fuck, like, it's it's happening. It's really happening.
Matt Molinaro:I'm not mad at it. Have you seen that skit on SNL? Oh, man, it was one of their songs they made and it was around. I think it was around pride of last year. And it's all the queer characters. But there's a part of the song where the two lesbian characters sing a line where they're like, they're at Pride. And then they're like, looking around. And they're like, Hey, have you talked to that girl? And the other one's like, no, she's a straight and the other one is like, what about that one? And she's like, No, she's also straight. And the next line is When did all these straight girls start dressing lesbian? Oh,
Enn Burke:I came across. I don't know if I sent this to you or not. But I came across a meme the other day that said that, like the youth today clearly never had to live through this trauma. And then it's a picture of wide leg Gen Jayco that are like wet at the bottom from like dragging in the mud or in the water.
Matt Molinaro:The nightmare. No, yes. No bigger embarrassment and trying to be really cool. And then walking around with like wet jeans and wet super wet.
Enn Burke:Yes, that's
Matt Molinaro:the cool right out of you. So they talked to Julius friends and one is kind of fashionable. The other one's wearing like a super roughly top. She could have been her mom. And they say, Yes, we were at a restaurant that morning. That's where we met c squared. It was the three of us. And c squared just kind of came over to the table. And they're like, Oh, were you guys drinking? And they're like, we had Cobb salads and club sodas, which totally looks like the type exactly what they were having
Enn Burke:Cobb salads and clubs, sodas. Sounds like a lot of Delray.
Matt Molinaro:Oh my gosh, so accurate. So they say that c squared came over and it was kind of a kick. And that c square had promised Julia tickets to his show because her brother's a fan. So the corroborating her story. Okay. They said that he told her. I'll give you the tickets later. And then he showed up at their dorm room later. They're all roommates, the three girls and it was around midnight when he showed up. And he asked Yulia to come down to his car to get the tickets. So she did because it was C squared. And when she went downstairs, she called her friends from his car fun.
Enn Burke:Oh, wow.
Matt Molinaro:There's a throwback. Yeah. And she said, Hey, we're actually going to go out dancing. And they're like, does she usually go out dancing at midnight? What is the big effing deal about someone going out? a grown woman a woman in college going out at night?
Enn Burke:I mean, it's just it's always here about this is all you shouldn't have put yourself in that situation.
Matt Molinaro:Unbelievable. Unbelievable. And they talk the whole episode. The big fixation is how late she was out. Yeah, so they're like, Well, you know, she she doesn't go out that late normally, but it was C squared. And then they're back at the station. And they're looking at the evidence, and they're looking at the blouse that Julia was wearing on the night in question, and Lieutenant Van Buren notices that there's a torn button on it, and said, Well, this guy must have been eager. And Logan says something very interesting considering the accusations against Chris North lately. He says, I'm trying awfully hard to be politically correct. But I've been eager myself. It's not a crime. Yeah, and then Lieutenant Van Buren says, Well, if you don't take no for an answer, it is. Yeah, seems at this point as if only Lieutenant Van Buren is even giving her the benefit of the doubt at all. The guys are literally just looking for motives for her to be lying. That's literally what they're doing this whole time. So the guys go back to the hotel room or the hotel room, they go back to the hotel, they talk to the concierge who says he saw Giulia and c squared that night, but normally, he was accompanied by the same blonde girl the whole time he was there. He's been there for like, almost a week. And they're like, Okay, give her give us her name and information, which I thought was strange, as though her name and information would be available. She didn't book the room. But anyway, he's like, Well, I can't get that as private. And they're like, Well, we're gonna sue you guys because you guys served Julia liquor and she's under 21. So he prints out the phone records on the room. And this leads them to the apartment of a woman named Sheila Pearson. Now Sheila is going to be meant to be made out to be like a sexual character. So what do you think they have her dressed and when they got to her house?
Enn Burke:Well, is it ish? Okay, I mean, I guess I'm gonna say like a really short love probably leather or something leather. Maybe some lace somewhere.
Matt Molinaro:You're in the right direction. It's okay. Silk. Oh, she's she's like upper crust. She's in a blue silk night 90 when they get out of the house, and she's of course got her like her arm on top of the doorframe, you know? Oh, yeah, come on,
Enn Burke:come up. Every time there is no Dana there is only so
Matt Molinaro:you love that reference.
Enn Burke:Perfect.
Matt Molinaro:So they the same thing they do to every sexually free woman on the show. She's in like a night gown or bed clothes or something when they see her or sometimes just a sheet. Anyway, she tells them that she's an entertainers entertainer, and that she was hired by the Mr. Mullet Teddy character to be a companion for c squared for the week. And on the dining question, she was told she could stay home because he had other plants. So we go back to their station and Lieutenant Van Buren is now interrogating Julia, again, not C squared, who's only been questioned once at this hotel? No, they're talking to Julia again. And the tenant Van Buren is treating her like she's some sort of vicious criminal. And she wants the details because, listen, you made a serious charge. And this is the drill. I mean, I can't imagine why people don't report their sexual assaults. I can't imagine why. So she's traumatized. She's in tears almost every time I talked to her. And she says, I went to the bathroom when I was at their hotel room. And when it came out, c squared was naked, and he took advantage of me. She says that he ripped her clothes off, and she just shut her eyes and she wanted it to be over. And with this account, Lieutenant Van Buren sort of changed his her tone. She says, okay, and she's like, we're gonna get you a ride home. She leaves the room and tells the detectives, this woman was definitely raped. We need to take this more seriously. The detectives are still on the fence, though. Yeah. But anyway, they follow up with c squared x, we find out he has an ex wife. And they she lives in the city. And she forgot her name. But she's only in this one scene. She says that the main reason that they split up was because Clarence c squared, had a really large sexual appetite. And he did come over the night in question of the assault earlier in the day, and he wanted to have sex with her. And she turned him down. And he threw a tantrum. And the only reason he left and didn't like, pursue her more was because she can scream a lot louder than he can. She says, All right, so they asked they do some more follow up work, they find out that c squared had also given his driver the night off that night. So they're wondering, Well, how could he have been planning on going to a club with Julio if he didn't even have a driver to take them all the way across the city? And they go to question him again, and he's at like a video shoot. I think it's like outside on a pier. Okay. There's a craft services table and he's like shoving food in his mouth and like, eating with his mouth open, which is so nasty. I hate that such a pet peeve of mine. Yeah, he's talking with his mouth. And he's talking with his mouth full, I should say, I guess everyone eats a little bit with their mouth open. You know what I mean? And they haven't dressed up to look really punk rock and rock and roll. But it's like it's a leather collar he has around his neck with like a bunch of chains on it. And then chains hanging from the chains. He's got another chain around his neck, and he's got a leather woven vest. And honestly, as punk rock is trying to make him look, it's like very Party City. Sure, go back to Party City where you belong c squared.
Enn Burke:Well, I mean, they probably wasted all their budget on the music video that they showed for 10 seconds.
Matt Molinaro:I, if that was the budget, have a very low budget. So they talked to him, and he says, Listen, the app implication that I had to like, quote, unquote, had to rape a woman is ridiculous, because I can get any woman I want. And I got a different woman in my room every night. And they're like, kind of fed up with him. And he goes, You guys don't get it. Um, c squared. And then he like strums a note on the, on his electric guitar, and everyone kind of like laughs It's very strange.
Enn Burke:Like a cutaway in the middle of like, Nickelodeon, MC squared. There's like yellow triangles and things.
Matt Molinaro:squigglies. Yes, yes. So then they're back at the station, the detectives and Logan honestly, seems more jealous of squish c squared than upset with him.
Enn Burke:And are we surprised? No, no.
Matt Molinaro:So they decide if they're going to follow up with his previous manager that he had before this mullet Teddy guy. And this part is really strange, because his previous manager is now a bartender, I guess. I guess we're okay. Meant to believe that. As a manager of artists, he only worked with c squared. And now that he doesn't he has to change his whole career path. But it's very unlikely I agree. So he's a bartender now and they talked to him. And he says, Well, back in the day when I was managing him, there was a girl from New Jersey who accused him of rape. And I gave him some advice on how to handle it. So I still remember her name. It's Tina McCarthy. So they go follow up with Tina McCarthy. She's rock and roll. So she's got cut off sleeves. Pap edits her hair. Amazing. And she randomly pulls out a beer and a cigarette, and then another conversation to really drive the point home. She is rocking rock and roll. Okay. Yeah. She says that at the time of the assault. She was 18 years old. And she was at a concert in the front row. And one of the managers or someone that worked with c squared came up to her after the show and asked her if she wants to go backstage. And she was like, of course, he's a huge fan. And then she did and he invited her to go have dinner with her, him after the show. And she said, Sure. So she went with him to his hotel room, and they ordered pizza. And then he got handsy with her. And she said no. And she tried to fight him off. And he wouldn't take no for an answer. And he raped her. And she went to the police. And the DA told her that she could report it if she wanted to. And they're like, Well, why didn't you? And he's she's like, well, maybe they were right. Maybe I did lead them on. So, again, not surprising, based on what we've seen. Yeah, with Julia. And she says, Well, you know, anyway, they ended up his manager ended up calling me and giving me$10,000 For my silence and saying it was a misunderstanding. So they go ahead, and they decide they have enough to arrest him. And when they arrest him, he's like shirtless and going through a crowd of women with scrunchies and big hair. And he's ridiculous. He doesn't care. He's like making a big show out of himself being arrested. And in the next scene, very confusing. So they go to arraignment or like, you know, that pretrial hearing, and they he's being held on bail and his defense attorney in the next scene, they just kind of cut to this with no explanation. But stone and the new da Kincaid are in a like room with the judge who's meant to be on the case, who's a woman and the defense attorney for c squared, who's also a woman who were told very briefly used to work for victims and now she's like defending c squared. And we're meant to find out that the reason they're all together is because the defense attorney wants the judge to recuse herself and stolen And in the Kincade think it's because she just doesn't want a woman lawyer because it'd be too sympathetic to the survivor. Okay, but the defense attorneys has nothing to do with that is because it's a conflict of interest. And she brings up this random thing saying that c squared has a partner in LA at some sort of restaurant because that's where c squared lives. He's only here for like a deal. And that partner at that restaurant is like, the judges husband's nephew or something like that. All right. And she's like, that's a conflict of interest. Because, you know, there's an ongoing case unrelated to this. And she's like, and stone and Kincaid thinks it's ridiculous. And the judge does, too. But she's like, No, I'm, I'm going to take myself off the case, because she has a point. It's a stretch, but I don't want to risk it. So they have a mail truck. Now I don't know if it mattered. But that was like a big point. inish and the episode, wasting a lot of time on it. Then the next thing has Julia and her father meeting in the DHS office with Kincaid and stone. And her father is kind of speaking for her and saying, We don't want to pursue this because her name has already been drugged through the mud, they show up like with a newspaper article with her like statement on the front of it, and do people believe her or not? And he says it's gonna solely our name, and we don't want to put it through this. Stone seems to be the only one in this whole situation who is standing up for the victim of the crime? And it's like, why are we treating Julia like a criminal for literally trying to stand up for herself? Right? And why does it matter so much that she would have been out late, we would never do this to the victim of another crime. We would never tell someone who was mugged that they shouldn't have been out late. Why are we doing this to her? And shift says that, you know, think about it like you put candy in a room of the kid and tell him not to eat it. This is the like head DEA shift saying yes. And stone is like that's even more of a reason to pursue this. If that's the way he looks at her like candy as a kid. Terrible. Kincaid interrupts them, she walks into the office. And she says that she's holding a newspaper. And it has an article where Julia had been heard the morning of the crime saying that c squared made too much money for his own good. And he's like, who cares? Who cares about this article? This has nothing to do with what happened to her. And shifts as well the optics of it and he's like, I don't care. We're going to pursue this. And shift says if you want to pursue this, you have to have Julius cooperation. So he's like, Well, I feel like I'm gonna scare her away if I talk to her so they suggest that Kincaid will have a softer touch Woman to woman with her. Okay, so Kincaid meets with Julia, and Julia. Every time she's on screen is getting progressively more and more styled like a sister wife. I honestly was like at the end of the episode, they're just going to replace her with like a butter turn with a bow on it and be like that's Julia is so more and more buttons, ruffles and like, combed back hair. She says, I just want to be left alone. Why can't anybody understand this? Right. Kincaid says, you know, the only way we're gonna get any justice though is if you if you help us, and what about other girls and all that kind of stuff. And Julius hasn't she feels terrible about herself. And everyone has made her feel like a horror. And Kincaid understands but she like relates to her and says like, you're only going to be proving all these like people who are wrong about you, right? If you don't agree to help us, which isn't like the best tactic, but it gets her to agree to testify. Yeah. So the trial begins. And the doctor who examined her at the beginning of the woman doctor, she says that Julia did exhibit physical and psychological signs of being raped. But then the defense attorney gets her to say that it could have been quote, unquote, enthusiastic intercourse. And she says she can't conclusively say it wasn't. So then the next person on the stand is Julia. And she tells her side of the story and says that when she tried to leave, he put he told her she couldn't leave. He ripped her blouse. He laughed at her when she begged him to stop. And she ran into the bathroom and hid until it was quiet. And when it was quiet, she hoped he had passed out because he'd been drinking. But when she came out of the room, he was naked. And that's when the assault happened and you raped her is very emotional. She does a really good job this actress, the defense attorney, then cross examines her and gets her to admit that she didn't call for help and she didn't Scream, and she's like, why didn't you do that? And she says you're being very dramatic. And then she has, she unknowingly gets Julia to perjure herself on the stands, because she asks her if she's seen any lawyers or anything following the assault to try to like, you know, squeeze money out of them or anything. And she said she's not spoken to any lawyers. But in the previous scene, when Julia spoke to Kincaid, she did mention that her father brought her to see a lawyer for a meeting, but that she didn't retain him or anything. She just talked to him. And so as soon as she says, This understands Kincaid, like looks conflicted. And then we cut to a scene where the TAs team is in private chambers, just Kincaid stone and Schiff. And they're telling Schiff, that she perjured herself on the stand, and they did alert the court already and contagious. Like I'm so sorry, I didn't mention it because I didn't think it was relevant. She didn't retain the lawyer. I'd never thought it would even come up. And I never would have expected her to lie on the stand. Yeah, but they're like, well, now we're in a bad spot. So stone and Kincaid leave the room was chef and on their way to the elevator, stone tells Kincaid that he feels like he can't trust her anymore. And she apologizes again and says, you know, it was a mistake. And he says, well, basically too late. And he says ISIS suggest that after he is acquitted that you request a new assignment. Harsh
Enn Burke:for like a simple mistake.
Matt Molinaro:Wow. And she's like, all right. And then they're back in the courtroom. And the defense is talking to Julia again, and they get her to admit that she perjured herself. And then they show her a document that she signed, where she did retain a lawyer. So she lied even to Kincaid. She's very emotional, though. She says, I only signed that because my father told me to, because we were getting hassled by the press. And he thought it was the only way to keep them away from me. And I don't understand why this is such a big deal. It has nothing to do with what he did to me. Right, but it's not looking good for her. And then the defense gets Clarence c squared on the stand. And he's like, honestly, clearly not prepped for court. It's the first time he's wearing a shirt at least. But he literally does not care. He's acting like his complete, chauvinistic, predatory personality on the stand very proud of his quote, unquote, conquests. And he says that girls threw himself threw themselves at him. And Julia was no different. And he acts like a total pig stone, then cross examines him and asks him, did Julie ever ask you or say to you that she wanted to have sex? And he said, Well, she put out a set. And stone asks him, so what did she do to suggest it? And he's like, Well, what she came into my room and everything. And he says, Every woman that goes into your room have open is open, pray to you. And that just means that they're inviting you to sleep with them. And he says, that's what I do. Yeah, and his defense attorney, he kind of looks disgusted, and the jury is clearly swayed by it. And then Stone says the last thing he wants to put into evidence is lyrics to one of squirts songs. And the defense is like I object and that the judges like it's literally a song on the radio that he's made millions of dollars off of. I don't think it's prejudicial. Yeah, so stone has the court clerk read it. And it's like the court clerk reading this filthy lyrics, like very matter of fact, and he reads, I'll just read one thing from the song.
Enn Burke:Like when Andy Cohen reads the rant that Lisa Barlow made about about Meredith marks?
Matt Molinaro:Yes, exactly. Oh, my God, we have not talked about the reunion at all. We haven't talked about housewives on Wednesday. We got to change that next week. Yeah. So the lyrics are I get what I want. It's a one way trip. You ain't my lady. You might pitch what a delight. Yeah. So close. Closing arguments come next. And you know, they both say their peace and stone ends by reading the lyrics himself a little bit. He's like, Julia wasn't his lady. She was his bitch. And that was the closing statement.
Enn Burke:I do not like this.
Matt Molinaro:Then the jury comes back. They find the defendant guilty of raping the first degree which shocked everybody including me okay. And stone and Kincaid are happy even though they're surprised. And then in the closing scene, Kincaid just sort of cleaning up her area at the DHS office and like in a room we've never seen before, and she's preparing for her exit. She's got all the cases that are on her docket and she's giving them just stone and thanks him for the experience. And he says some sort of a anecdote about a mistake he made in the past. And, you know, his mistake was worse. And he says, You know, I got another chance and you're gonna get another chance. And I just think it's because a very wise woman once said, Everybody makes mistakes. Everybody has those days. Nobody's perfect. I got to work at that woman, Hannah Montana. And that is the end of the episode. Wow. Yeah, Yikes. Yikes. Yikes. Job.
Enn Burke:I did plan to go back and watch the first episode that I missed. But I don't know that I will go back and watch that one.
Matt Molinaro:Oh, my gosh, just even if it's on mute, just to see the the styling of c squared. Okay. Okay. And some of the characters just kind of like, fast forward through it just to see. And it's good to see Julia becoming a butter turn slowly over time.
Enn Burke:Okay, great. Well, are you ready to hear the case upon which this episode was based?
Matt Molinaro:I am as ready as I'll ever be.
Enn Burke:This is the story of Mike Tyson. What? Yep. So spoiler alert. I am not very much not a fan of this man. After having done my research on him. Wow.
Matt Molinaro:I don't know anything about Mike Tyson in any sort of relation to this type of Yes. Like I've heard of criminal activity with him, but like not relating to women and assault. So
Enn Burke:well, brace yourself. What's funny is I started researching this. And then I was like, what? Why am I researching about him? Like I was telling his background and all of that kind of stuff. And I was like, I don't want to do this. I want to tell the story of like the survivor instead. And so I spent hours researching a person only to discover it was not the person involved with the case. So I had to go back and re research because I had deleted everything. So I've actually researched this twice.
Matt Molinaro:Hey, you're really well versed then.
Enn Burke:All right. So Mike Tyson was born June 30 1966, in Brooklyn, New York. And he was pretty much raised by his mother, only she was kind of a she had a boyfriend for a while when Mike was young, but by the time he was like two or something like that, that man had left his mother's life. And so it was essentially his mom who raised him and his siblings. Okay, Tyson leader would say that he didn't really get a chance to know his mom very well. And part of that was because he he describes himself as like wild and caught up in the street world as a kid, and he had gotten caught committing a number of petty crimes. The area that they grew up in was a very low income neighborhood. And so there were higher crime rates, and he was kind of part of some of those petty crimes. Okay, like as a youth? Yes. By the time he was 13, he had been arrested 38 times.
Matt Molinaro:Whoa, yeah. Okay. I wonder how many of those times were well? Well, I'll reserve my judgment.
Enn Burke:Yeah. So he also got into fights a lot, because as we know, Mike Tyson has a relatively high pitched voice. And he also speaks with a lisp. And so boys in the neighborhood would tease him for that, and he would get into fights about it. That sucks. Yep. He ended up at kind of a reform school or do some articles describe it as a reform school. Some refer to it as like a juvenile detention facility, but it was called the triune School for Boys and it was in Jonestown in New York. And it was there that Tyson's boxing career kind of began because Muhammad Ali ended up visiting the facility one day, and he really inspired Tyson and that's why he started boxing.
Matt Molinaro:Okay. I think I actually knew that Muhammad Ali had inspired him, but I didn't know it was like that direct.
Enn Burke:Okay, I actually didn't know that at all. So he started boxing, and he was good at it. And so he kind of attracted attention of boxing coaches, and the one that he was introduced to was a man named, I couldn't find a video where his name was pronounced, but his first name is C U S. Like, cuss, okay, I would say sure, cuz dia Moto, and he became Tyson's boxing manager for pretty a pretty good chunk of Tyson's career. So, when Tyson's mother died when he was 16 years old, he was given into cusses custody to become his legal guardian. And when he was a junior in high school, he ended up dropping out and kind of just pursued his athletic career. And as we know, he was really successful at it. He won gold medals for boxing at the 1981 and 1982 Junior Olympics, which I did not know, he knew there. And I actually, I did not know that boxing was an Olympic sport. Yeah, I mean, can I also just say, like, people can box people can love boxing. I'm, I have a hard time rooting for like, wanting to see anything where it's just people being violent to each other. Yeah, like, it's just beating somebody up. It's not I know, like, I get that there's a lot of skill and training and work involved. I just, I'm shocked. I'm surprised that it is still, like so respected of a thing. Yeah.
Matt Molinaro:I mean, I have a lot of respect for the athletes that are training and making this their life's like mission. And I certainly think it's a better outlet than, you know, a lot of other things. I know a lot of people who go into the boxing world or into the like, mixed martial arts world, you always attribute I hear this over and over again, in interviews that it like got them off the streets, or it was a great outlet. So I appreciate it. And it's you know, it's consensual fighting, everyone knows what they're getting into. But for me, it's just not appealing to watch and the repercussions that happen to these folks, especially like with the traumatic head injuries and all of that, right. I mean, I don't know, it's just not for me. But, you know,
Enn Burke:it's funny you say that because I had totally forgotten until now that one of the people I went to graduate school with with his dissertation was specifically about the role that like boxing coaches play in, particularly like lower income communities, where men are men of color are arrested at higher rates. And so boxing coaches become kind of these like paternal figures for a lot of youth. So I had forgotten about his dissertation. Anyway. When Tyson turned 18, he made his professional boxing debut in March of that year. And he ended up boxing and 15 different bouts, and eventually won 26 of his first 28 fights by total knockout, and 16 of those were decided in the first round. So not only was he winning, he was winning really fast and the fights Yeah. So because of this winning streak, Tyson started to kind of be talked about as the next great heavyweight champion, because he was noted not only for his strength, but for his surprising speed, his accuracy, coordination and timing. Were all like top notch.
Matt Molinaro:I mean, he must have been really dedicated.
Enn Burke:Yeah. So his first televised appearance was on February 16 of 1986, which was ruled as a win for Tyson because of disqualification of his opponent. And I didn't dig into like why it was dq, but what I do know is that Tyson's like, team, like lobbied them to change it from a win by his opponent being disqualified to a win of TKO because they didn't want it to sort of like end his winning streak, you know. So he ended up fighting world challenger, Marvis Fraser in July of 1986 on ABC. He beat him in 30 seconds, winning by TKO. And so at age 20, he became the youngest heavyweight boxing champion in history. And it was the next year that Nintendo created the arcade game, Mike Tyson's Punch Out, which sold more than a million copies. And I definitely remember playing as a kid.
Matt Molinaro:Oh, we definitely had that I loved playing that game. I loved the animation is hard, how hard it is hard. I loved that game.
Enn Burke:So now we're in the late 80s. And in addition to his professional career, Tyson's personal life started to get more media attention as well when he married actress Robin Givens. They got married in February of 1988. Three weeks after Givens had become pregnant with their child, so she had gotten pregnant they got married, and she was kind of a rising star at the time she had been in a lot of daytime television she was the lead in a sitcom. She had been one of the like top build actresses in the movie boomerang so she was on her way up in the in Hollywood, essentially. But their relationship was rocky before they even got married. And this was apparent to the public as well. They appeared in a joint interview on 2020 with Barbara Walters and You can find this really easily if you just type in Mike Tyson and 2020 or Robin Givens 2020. In the interview, Walters refers to their relationship as a roller coaster, and asks, given what it's been like. And what's interesting is, I think that what she's what the quote that I'm about to read, I think a lot of people attribute to her describing the relationship between her and him. What? When I watched it, it seems to me that she was answering more about how difficult it is to be in such a public relationship, but I'll let people decide, okay? Because her answer is, quote, that it's been torture, it's been pure hell, it's worse than anything I could possibly imagine. I'm not talking about once a week I'm talking about every day, there has been some kind of battle, some kind of fight. But she is, it sounds to me like she is describing, you know, having to defend their relationship and all this kind of stuff in the media, more than she's describing their interpersonal relationship.
Matt Molinaro:But she she's given the interview with him there, right?
Enn Burke:Yes, yes, they're like cuddling on a couch next to each other, which is not to say that they didn't have a lot of problems, but as I'm about to go into, because that quote, easily could be also just her describing what her relationship was like. Because she said that she and Tyson would often have a lot of fights that made her question, and this is what made me think she was talking about kind of the difficulty of being in a public relationship is she said the fights that she had with him made her question why she was fighting so hard to be with him,
Matt Molinaro:if that makes sense. Okay, yes.
Enn Burke:Barbara Walters asks her if Tyson had a temper, and she says an extremely volatile temper. He's got a side to him that scary. Michael is intimidating to say the least. There's a time where he cannot control his temper, and that's frightening. Oh, boy. Walters asks Tyson if Tyson has ever hit Gibbons, and she pauses before replying, he shakes he pushes he swings in June of 1988, which is only about four months after they got married, Givens miscarried the pregnancy that she had had earlier in the year. And that's when things really started to deteriorate between them. And Givens ended up filing for divorce in October of 1988. The reason she cited for the divorce was spousal abuse, and she said it occurred on many occasions, and she as part of her filing sought a restraining order because she was afraid for her safety. Wow, that's so terrifying. Yeah, especially like the World Heavyweight Champion. Like that's just another level of scary when it comes to domestic violence. Like Yeah. Because the couple had not signed a prenuptial agreement. Givens looked to be entitled to half of his net worth, which at the time was estimated to be over five or over $50 million. Tyson sought an annulment instead of a divorce. And he cited that Givens had committed fraud and said that she had faked the pregnancy to trick him into marriage. And so he was seeking an annulment because unlike a divorce and annulment would mean that Givens was not entitled to any of his money.
Matt Molinaro:Oh my god, disgusting.
Enn Burke:He continued to speak badly of givens and because Tyson was like a golden child like everyone, he was such a huge, huge celebrity at the time, Givens was just dragged through the mud in the press, and people described her as a gold digger. And one headline even described her as, quote, the most hated woman in America. God, yeah, because of this. Givens ended up suing Tyson for defamation. But she said that she later would be asked like, Oh, didn't you get a huge settlement, blah, blah, blah, and she would say that she walked away with not a dime. In the 1989 biography of Mike Tyson titled fire and fear the inside story of Mike Tyson Tyson admitted to hidden Givens stating, quote, that was the best punch I've ever thrown in my entire life.
Matt Molinaro:Oh, my God. When was this inch
Enn Burke:1989. In 2009, he would appear on Oprah. I did this is just an anecdote. I'm gonna go back to the late 80s, early 90s In a minute, but in 2009, he appeared on Oprah and made jokes about quote sucking givens and the audience laughed.
Matt Molinaro:Oh, Mike did Oprah
Enn Burke:Oprah ended up issuing an apology to Givens because of this, by the
Matt Molinaro:way, I hope so because Oprah that is not Oprah. That's not the Oprah I know.
Enn Burke:So Givens after dating Mike Tyson dated Brad Pitt, and in an interview where he was asked about Givens dating Brad Pitt after they had been together, he continues to just be an absolute monster, in my opinion, because he says, quote, I was waiting at the house for a while and heading back to my car to drive away and a car pulled up with Robin and Brad in it. I wasn't interested in beating him up, I was interested in beating my ex wife, if he had said something that would have been different, and I probably would have attacked him. And if he was afraid it was the first sign of him being a great method actor because I didn't see any signs of him being afraid. Yeah, so real, real treat, and it's downhill from here. So his career kind of took a little bit of a tumble in the early 90s, he ended up losing a high profile match to a boxer named Buster Douglas, which ended his streak of wins. And that bout was described as one of the most shocking upsets in modern sports history in it, but however, despite the kind of career tumble, he was still a huge, huge celebrity and still had a really successful career. So he was still doing like press tours and, you know, appearances doing matches. Yeah, all you know, all of that kind of stuff. So, now I am going to tell you about a woman named Deseret Washington. Okay. She was born to Donald and Marybel Silva Washington in 1973. I love the name. Oh, isn't that cute? And had an older brother and an adopted sister and the Washington's were a pretty strict Baptist family. Her father worked as a bookkeeper for the days in in Cranston and her mother was a personnel manager. It didn't ever I couldn't find an article that really talked about where, and actually, I will say, researching Deseret Washington is relatively difficult, particularly because after what happens she like really retreated from the public eye. Yeah. So she attended Coventry high school, and she appears to have been like the person who was good at and succeeded at everything. She was a varsity cheerleader. She played on the softball team. She taught Sunday school, she did volunteer work, and she managed all of this while being on the honor roll at her. Her High School nice. She was voted most friendly at her high school. And the summer between graduation and college, she worked as a cashier at Kmart before she attended Providence College, where she majored in psychology after she graduated from college, which is a few years later, after what is the incident I'm about to tell you about. She graduated with her degree in psychology. And while she was there, she was selected from students across the country to serve as a goodwill ambassador to Moscow. She was the only black student in a group of 34 that were selected. And it was during this time that she said she wanted to be the first black woman president.
Matt Molinaro:Wow, she probably had to work five times as hard as anybody else to even get that. Yeah, good for her for
Enn Burke:sure. So in 1991, while she was a student at Providence College, she also entered and won the Miss Black Rhode Island beauty pageant. Mike Tyson was present at that pageant, and he attended rehearsals. In interviews, many of the contestants of the pageant stated that they were absolutely starstruck by Tyson because he was a huge celebrity at this time. Yeah. And if you look for it, you can find footage of him with the women during rehearsals. And I look at the footage and I see somebody who does not understand physical boundaries, because he is very touchy and aggressive with people who do not seem to ask to be touched. Yeah. So the night after the pageant, July 19 1991, Tyson called Washington's hotel room and asked her to meet up with him. And articles give a couple of different stories, but it seems to be that he invited her to like a party and he was like, I'll pick you up. I'll show you the town. We'll go to a party kind of thing. So he picked her up from her hotel in his limo. And once she was in the limo, Washington says he got kind of like physically aggressive with her, or, or got a little Hanzi initial like right off the bat, and then tells her that he had forgotten something in his hotel room and so they weren't going went back to his hotel room to get whatever that thing was and said like, oh, come up with me and just we'll grab it. Once she was inside of the room, Washington says Tyson raped her. When she returned to her hotel room, Washington told her roommate about the assault and together they called 911. And on the recording of the call, Washington was heard saying that she was afraid to file a report because no one would believe her because it's Mike Tyson. He's a huge celebrity and people would just think she was after his money. The next day, she checked into the emergency room of Methodist Hospital stating that Tyson had raped her. And around this time, Tyson's team seems to have gotten wind of this. And it would later be revealed that his team offered her $1 million to withdraw her claims.
Matt Molinaro:Oh my god. I mean, if that's not an admission of guilt,
Enn Burke:right. In July of 1991, Tyson was arrested for her rape, and he faced one count of rape and two counts of criminal deviant conduct. His trial began on January 26, of 1992. And surprisingly, only went until February 10 of 1992. I'm kind of surprised that didn't go on longer because I feel like celebrity cases seem like they go on for months and months. Yeah, I'm out trial, Tet, Tyson's chauffeur would end up providing evidence against Tyson because he witnessed Washington running out of the front door of the hotel crying and looking disheveled. He stated, quote, she looked all frantic like she might have been in a state of shock. She looked dazed and disoriented. emergency room physicians also provided evidence against Tyson. Because the physical Washington's physical examination was consistent with rate. And the doctor kind of like what happened in the episode that you just said, the doctor said like, or his lawyer was like, couldn't this be just aggressive sex? And the doctor said only twice in my 20 Medical 20 year medical career. Have I ever seen injuries like this that occurred from consensual sex? Washington took the stand at Tyson's trial where she described their encounter in great detail leading up to the assault and during and after, and she stated stated that once she was in the hotel room, Tyson said, quote, you're turning me on. And she had replied, something along the lines of like, I'm not like those other girls like I and she says, I said, I don't know what you think I came up here for. She went to the bathroom. And when she came out, Tyson was in his underwear, just kind of like the episode, and that is when she says he raped her. She says, quote, I tried to punch him, but it was like hitting a wall. And she said that she told him multiple times to get off her. And next thing she knew he slammed her on the bed and assaulted her. She, I have no doubt that this happened personally, because the testimony that she gives is clearly somebody who has experienced something traumatic along these lines, yes, and experience something very traumatic. She has really clear testimony about what she said, how it all went down, et cetera. I won't go into it just because I think it's a lot.
Matt Molinaro:I mean, that is so brave for her to do. Yeah. Also, I mean, knowing what she knows about him, knowing how high profile he is and how strong and dangerous he is. And what people have already like, probably thought of her because of just because she's a woman. Yes, that's so brave of her to even be so transparent.
Enn Burke:100% She did say that after the assault. Tyson had laughed at her while she was sobbing crying. In the trial, Tyson took the stand. And much like the episode, I read an article that was a lawyer who was present for the he was a lawyer and a journalist. And he was there for the whole trial. And so he kind of documented it and also sort of talked about how the case was being handled. And he says like Tyson should not have gotten on the stand. He was not prepared. And he ended up doing a lot of damage to his own case. He claimed that everything was consensual that Washington had wanted to have sex with him. His defense team played up the fact that Washington was so accomplished, so she was obviously very savvy and she knew Tyson was an economic opportunity. And in opening statements, Tyson's attorney described her as mature beyond her 18 years. The media, much as they had done with Robin Givens portrayed Washington as a A vindictive liar and a gold digger after Tyson's money. She was criticized both at trial and in the media for thinking that it was safe to go to Tyson's hotel room. So again, we're blaming her for being in that situation, which is not appropriate. Tyson's lawyers managed to get some footage excluded of Tyson saying about Washington, quote, I should have killed the bench when I had the chance. Wow. I don't know how they managed to get that excluded. But it did get excluded. And Tyson's defense called witness after witness to kind of testify about crude and lewd remarks that Tyson had made when he was among the contestants at the Rhode Island pageant as a way of claiming that it was obvious the kind of guy that Tyson was. And so she knew ahead of time that he was you know, wanting to have sex. That's the kind of guy he
Matt Molinaro:was bla bla bla, and just like the opposite. Well,
Enn Burke:so the lawyer who reviewed the case, or was there said that this was pretty much a really big misstep? Because all it did was make Tyson look like a complete asshole. Okay, good. Yeah. And the lawyer said that the case the defense team for Tyson, like it played out like a first year law school student defending him. And it's interesting, he talks about how the lawyer that Tyson had hired was like an entertainment lawyer, who had like, helped him with other, you know, entertainment related cases. And he has not a criminal defense attorney. And so it seems like it was just a bad bad team that he had put together. On February 10 1992, the jury returned after a 10 hour deliberation with a guilty verdict on all charges. Before sentencing, Tyson gave an 11 minute speech saying I can't see anything good coming from this. I'm here. I'm here prepared to expect the worst. I've been crucified, humiliated worldwide. So he's taking a page out of the Vicki gunvalson playbook
Matt Molinaro:being out to the crops. Yes, boohoo.
Enn Burke:Immediately following the what's the word I'm looking for? verdict. verdict, thank you. Tyson's lawyers appealed. And they tried to bring Washington's previous sexual history into evidence as part of this appeal, which in most states at the time, there was very little evidence that was permitted in cases about survivors previous sexual history. But some states did still allow it, some states still allowed some specific evidence. But in 1994, the Violence Against Women Act was passed, which created what's called referred to as the rape shield law, which prohibits any cross examination or evidence about a survivor of sexual past. Good. His appeal failed. And he was sentenced to 10 years in jail, but was given a suspended sentence, which means that for each of the counts, so he was sentenced to 10 years for the counts, but they were set to occur concurrently. And his prison time was wasn't so okay. He was sentenced to 10 years as part of the sentences being served concurrently because he could have served up to 63 years in prison for the three charges. So it was 10 because it was a concurrent sentence. And it was a suspended sentence, which means that probation time and jail time are considered one. And so he was really only sentenced to six years in jail and four years of probation. He was 25 at the time, and he was sent to an Indiana Youth Center where he served less than three years of his six year sentence before he was released. Oh my god. Tyson would speak about his time in prison and say that he had it pretty easy. And he said he was permitted visits from women and was stated was would state quote, I was having so much sex that I was too tired to even go to the gym and workout. So like, yeah, just the appropriate sentence as a result of
Matt Molinaro:seriously absolutely repugnant? Yes,
Enn Burke:he returned to professional boxing only five months after his release, but his misconduct continued in 1997. You may remember that he bid off a piece of Evander Holyfield's ear during a match. This resulted in a one year suspension of his boxing license. He would later face two counts of Mr. and Miss demeanor assault. This was a result of assaulting other motorists after a tracks traffic accident. So he got in a traffic accident and started attacking the other people as you do. Friends would later say that after the assault, does Ray Washington return to her community, a different person, she was no longer gregarious and outgoing, and she cut herself off from everybody. Yeah, she did, however, give another interview with Barbara Walters on 2020. And there she said, quote, I went from being such an outgoing person to someone who was just so I was voted friendliest in high school to just so secluded. I just sat in my room and in the corner of my bed, and I just couldn't move. For the longest time. I couldn't believe it. I was just such an outgoing person, such a loving person, such a trusting person, and I missed that person. But in a way, it's good that I'm not that person, because now I won't be hurt again, like I was. An article in the Washington independent would state that the event traumatized not only Washington, but also her family, because again, Tyson was a huge celebrity. And so her siblings had a really hard time at school because people bullied and harassed them. As I said, Washington has stayed out of the spotlight since the incident and her private life remains private. And Tyson still refutes all of Washington's claims. In his 2013 autobiography, he said, quote, she knows it, God knows it. And the consequences of her actions are something that she's got to live with for the rest of her life. And that is the story of Mike Tyson and the assault of Delray Washington. Oh
Matt Molinaro:my god. Wow.
Enn Burke:I did not know a lot of that. And it makes sense. I was like eight years old when a lot of or 10 years old when a lot of this was happening. So I was not necessarily watching the news and paying attention to you know, current events. But, man, I gotta tell you real big, not a fan after researching him.
Matt Molinaro:Yeah, I already wasn't really a fan of him. Oh, my gosh, how disgusting. Yeah. Oh, well, well done. I mean, that's a terrible thing to have to research. I mean, it's all terrible. But
Enn Burke:yes, yes. Should we talk about how we rate the episode?
Matt Molinaro:Yes. I kept the episode D. Okay. Because if it wasn't for the acting on the part of Julius character and the defense attorney, actually, digit great. So I have to give it to them. And I think her as a survivor did a really good job holding her own and, and all that. So other than that, D.
Enn Burke:Not having seen it. I guess I can't read it for watchability, but I will say that as you were recounting the episode to me, I was like checking off boxes like yep, that's from the story. Yep. That's from the story. So they did pull a ton of stuff from the story for sure.
Matt Molinaro:Oh, yeah. I'm shocked. I was shocked. He was found guilty of anything. Yeah. Yeah. His sentence was garbage, obviously. But we didn't we don't really see what c squared sentence was. So honestly, for the crime and give it like a, I would give it like a b b plus. Great. Yeah.
Enn Burke:Well,
Matt Molinaro:all right, everybody. If you enjoyed listening to this, and you would like to show your gratitude, we would love love, love it if you would write us a review and subscribe to our podcast.
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Matt Molinaro:and thank you all so much for listening to rip from the headlines where you get the facts and some fiction.
Enn Burke:We will see you next week and until then stay out of the headlines. Bye