Interview with Ginny Jablonski.
I'm very pleased and excited to announce an interview with Ginny Jablonski.
Ginny is a renowned animal communicator, healer, author and so much more.
This was one of those "enlightening" interviews, that may take you to places that are hard to go and will certainly make you think in a slightly different way.
It was very interesting (and sometimes deep) but a very informative conversations with a very special lady.
So sit back, relax and I hope you enjoy this episode.
In 2001 Ginny retired from a career in international security to focus on resolving emerging medical issues. In 2012 she suffered a near death experience when Fentanyl, a prescription opioid medication, caused her lungs to stop working. After this event she began to see, sense, and feel energies in very dramatic ways for which she had no intellectual context. She was certain of one thing only: If she wanted to understand what was happening to her she needed to live, and that meant discontinuing all prescription medication. In her desire to regain control over her own health and well-being, she eagerly pursued alternative therapies and began educating herself in esoteric philosophies.
Well into her own journey, Ginny began her intuitive healing career focusing on humans. As time passed, she became spontaneously aware of the animals in her clients' lives as well. They frequently presented themselves in her human sessions with messages and healing requests. This contact piqued her interest and caused her to remember the animals' message from her NDE asking her to return. As a result, she began to shift her educational focus to animal specific healing techniques and animal communication.
Ginny's primary goal is to promote interspecies evolution and the evolution of consciousness awareness on our planet.
Video version (alongside applicable podcasts) can be viewed on facebook and YouTube.
Hi welcome to Equine Voices my name is Ronnie and today's guest is a very special guest and I'm really excited to chat with her. Her name's Ginny Jablonski from Arizona u s a and she's an animal communicator, an author and she's an intuitive guidance and healer. I know she didn't like to say the word healer and I don't use that word but it's bring healing energy into your environment. So, without further ado, I'm going to bring Ginny. It's gonna be a really interesting conversation. Nothing's off the table, and it's whatever comes up in our conversation. So without further ajue I shall introduce Ginny. Hi ronnie. Thank you so much for inviting me. I'm so excited to talk to you again. You're so very welcome. For the people that don't know who you are would you like to just do a brief intro introduction to what your work is and then we'll go where the conversation guides so we'll go back a little bit and see how you've got to where you are today.Ginny:
Sure well, I work with both people and animals as an intuitive, and my current passion project is a podcast called Interspecies Evolution, where I invite people from all walks of life and all different systems of belief who love animals and who are on a journey to really honoring the soul and the sentence of animals to share their journeys, often messy journeys and some of us with, you know, various perspectives and we just have so many touchstones that are similar. So much in common, our reverence for life, for the earth, for plants, for animals, and our desire to be better humans and, and to be of service and to bring messages of hope and healing to the table. So that's my project that I'm just super excited to talk about today.Ronnie:
Fantastic. So just tell us a little more about your podcast.Ginny:
Sure. It's called Interspecies Evolution and the purpose of it is to really highlight human consciousness and self-awareness. These are things we begin to talk about when we go on a journey of awakening we get curious about what spirituality or metaphysics is or might be, or what it means to us, because it certainly has different meaning for almost every person. And the evolution part is within our own selves and our own, evolving our human consciousness, our awareness of ourselves as spirit in a body, but then the partnership with animals and how we begin to perceive our partnership with animals in a very different light as we ourselves heal and evolve, so that's the purpose of the podcast.Ronnie:
And you have some amazing guests and I found them really interesting and fascinating and it's always good to hear how um somebody else became aware of their own intuition and their own knowing and guidance. A lot of it's through animals because we tend to focus on animals and try and help them more than we do ourselves. And that's the start of it. So quite often you'd hear, especially people with horses, you know they'd go without shoes and anything else as long as they had food and what the horses need. But it's very much about, that actually we need to focus on ourselves too, because that's where it starts. That's the core of it. And that's just coming through now. So I'm being prompted to say that okay but can we just go back a little bit in history? I've read a little bit on your website, I don't read everything cuz I like to hear what my guests say and here's some things I'm not aware of but if you explain how, how you started on your intuitive, enlightening path.Ginny:
Well, completely by I wanna say accident, but more by force I was a international security agent. I worked for foreign. Royal families in the Middle East and through a company that was owned by a former president's family here in the us. And I had majored in economics. So I was a very sort of in the world, you know, sciencey math, everything can be explained on a spreadsheet kind of person. And I became very ill because I was doing something I shouldn't do, I was carrying a gun for a living and I was you know, protecting people. And that is really not where my soul wanted me to go in this life. So my soul took me out and I became very ill. Extraordinary pain, unexplained, undiagnosed pain. And the doctors, of course, wanted to give me narcotics right away and I refused narcotics. And after seven or eight years, they handed me a fentanyl lollipop and said, fentanyl is your only hope. So I did that and four years later my brain forgot to tell my lungs to breathe and I had a near death experience. And of course there's a lot that happened in between that I'm leaving out for the sake of a happier conversation today. But when I woke up from that near death experience where horses and donkeys actually brought me back because I was ready to go to the other side and I heard as I was about to walk away into the light, basically I heard a commotion behind me, turned around and saw horses and donkeys from a sanctuary where I used to volunteer prior to that experience and they were just screaming, don't go, don't go. Don't you remember? There's something important you have to do. So I can humbly say that the important thing I had to do was just heal myself so but when I woke up, it was as if I didn't hang up the phone line. I was still connected to what people would call the causal realms or outside of time to my higher self. So I had guidance that I had disconnected myself from in my life due to trauma, physical and emotional trauma. And in my childhood and young and even adult life I experienced repeated abuse and trauma. So I had guidance that was extraordinarily wise, but I didn't come back magically healed. I had to go on a journey to heal myself and find out what that meant. I had never heard the word spirituality or chakra or meridian in my life. So it was a very interesting journey. It took me more than a year to get off of the prescription medication and all that time. I was aware of spirit, multi-dimensional energies, people that had crossed over animals communicating, plants communicating. It was just very spontaneous and overwhelming, and because I had so much input and I could see and perceive and sense, and feel and experience so much more than was explained in science class through Newtonian physics, math, religion, or just cultural belief systems, I had to go on a very extensive journey of seeking answers because what I saw was never really completely explained through different religious philosophies that I studied or healing modalities that I became aware. So I continued to seek, even when people told me, I have all the answers, I know everything, the answer is absolutely X, y, Z, and I would just hear this, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. Keep going, keep going. You're not done yet. You know? So that was pretty much my experience and all the while I just knew things that you shouldn't It took me a while to put boundaries around my abilities to understand what was happening to me. It took many, many years, about eight years, really, to completely integrate the near death experience. I'm still on a journey, but overcoming the trauma of the experience and healing the trauma that kept me, let's say, disconnected from my own heart, not feeling, you know, my own love, utilizing my own discernment. That took me many, many years and I'd never stopped from day one, my feet hit the ground and I just kept going and traveling and learning and listening. And I listened and listened and listened and listened and now I'm asking the questions.Ronnie:
Wow that's quite an overload of senses to experience. I can't imagine what it's like, but it must have been quite mind blowing to experience lots of different senses. So where are you today? You've got your podcast, there's a few websites you have Heart of the Horse website and also Animal Print on My Soul book, you did some stories with that, is that correct?Ginny:
Yes. I contributed to an anthology that was put together by Candace Gish, and it was published by Absolute Love Publishing, and it's the story of how my formerly Wild Horse Beauty came to live with me.Ronnie:
Yeah would you like to go into that little bit more?Ginny:
Absolutely. If I knew I was going to talk about it, I would've gone back and read my journal. unfortunately don't have the best memory because I talk to so many animals and people constantly but I'll give you my best attempt and then know that it's written in better detail on my blog, on my website. Okay? I was just sleeping one day about, almost three years ago, two and a half years ago, and a horse came to me and my dream and said, I'm going to come and live with you. And I said, well, who are you? And she said, I'm your horse I'm going to come and live with you. And I said, well, where are you? And she said, don't worry, I'll find you. And I said, okay, that seems rather strange. Can you give me a hint? And I heard Little Book Cliffs, little Book Cliffs Little Book Cliffs. So the little book Cliffs are mountains in North Central Colorado, just west a part of the Rocky Mountains just on the west side of the Continental Divide. And I knew about the little Book Cliffs because a year prior, almost exactly a year prior, I had been in Colorado working at a, a sanctuary that does equine facilitated healing. And there were some horses there, and I didn't know where they were from. I know they were gathered from various wild herds around the state or the country, but I didn't really know a lot about Colorado's specific herds. And the animals were talking to me and giving me information about the woman and her husband and their, their programs and everything that I was sharing. The messages that I was sharing were bearing out to be true. And one of the horses came to the place where he said, you need to tell your husband to hurry up and finish his book because I want you to write a new series of books. And I said, is your husband writing a book? And she said, yes. And I said, the horses are saying it's about a ministry. And she said, yes, he's a minister. And I said, they're saying, well he needs to hurry and finish because they have a series of books about your program that they want to contribute to, to your writing and will create a fundraiser for your program. And she said, okay. And I closed my eyes and I got this vision of three different stories and the beautiful watercolor art throughout the books. And in the back cover of each of the books was this beautiful watercolor rendering of sheer rock cliffs. And underneath it was just a, a few sentences, but it was very small print and I couldn't read what it said, but I said, on the inside of the back cover of these books are these rock cliffs? Do you have any idea what this means? And she was like, Ginny, these horses are from the little book Cliffs and I said, well, there you go, then you know I'm talking to your horses, right? And it was really adorable. And that was the first time that I ever worked with them or knew of them. And they said, don't worry, you'll be back again next year. And sure enough, I did go back again the next year. And then some months later, my horse, now, her name is Beauty, I know now her name is Beauty. But I didn't then. So she just said Little Book Cliffs, little Book Cliff. So I knew who to call right away, this particular woman in Colorado. And I said, A horse came to me in my dream. She needs to come and live with me. I have no idea where she is, but she's from the Little Book Cliffs. Do you have any connections with people who know about horses from the little book Cliffs? And she said, gimme a couple days and I'll get back to you and. She got back to me, I think it was just maybe a day later, and she said, I know which horse it is. The horse is owned by one of your clients. And one of your clients says, yes, you can have the horse. And I'm like, whoa. Wait, wait, wait. what horse? What? What are you talking about? And she said, I'll give you the email. You guys can talk. The horse needs to be re-homed because it's dangerous. It's explosive under saddle, and there's some unsafe conditions and the horse needs to come to you. And I said, okay, that's fine. And I still didn't know anything about the horse. And that night I had a dream. I was woken up again. And I was dreaming about the little book Cliffs and this herd of horses and beauty came to me and said, black, black, black. I'm Black Beauty and I woke up in the morning to an email with pictures of a black horse saying that her name was Beauty. So that's the story that I share in the book, and then it goes on and on. And in the book, I do say that I'm going to write an actual book about her healing journey because it has been a very rich, very complicated healing journey.Ronnie:
Wow I look forward to hearing about that. Yeah. So if somebody comes to you, if somebody contacts you and asks for your help, how does it work? So I know how it works for me but how does it work for you? What, what's the first things that you do and what comes into your head?Ginny:
Specifically for humans or for animal specific?Ronnie:
Is it the same for both or is it different for humans and animals?Ginny:
It's the same. My way of working is that I come to the table with nothing but love. I know nothing nothing I have learned helps me give messages to a human or an animal or help an animal or a human understand themselves or their journey better. So I listen and I will receive information from the physical body, from the consciousness, from the energy field, or even from the higher self of the person or the oversold of the species of animal that I'm working with. And I will share that most of the messages that do come to me are about healing specific imbalance or specific blocks or limitations that people or animals have not yet been able to see for themselves, which. Was certainly the theme of my healing journey and my healing journey was a series of many, many belief systems or unresolved emotional traumas or memories that I was looking away from or denying. And having had that experience and overcome so much on my own journey, it's very easy for me to help people process these types of messages because I've experienced almost everything the animals and the horses have experienced in one way or another.Ronnie:
So do you find when you you've given a message that that helps the human element to maybe think a slightly different way or start to do what they need to do for themselves too?Ginny:
It's almost always very revelatory, it will connect dots and help them understand why certain behaviors, habits life experiences tend to come up over and over and over. Oftentimes it will help them understand the choices that the soul made in coming here to this life, what the soul intended to experience and why. That's always extremely helpful. It's never not helpful, I can assure you with that and I would say that having the caretaker understand what the animal is going through is often very healing for the caretaker and the relationship to the animal. And it is often exceedingly helpful and very liberating for an animal to be heard at a level where their soul choices are being honored. and where their misunderstanding of human, let's say, experiences or interactions or judgments of human experiences or interactions are preventing them from moving on. They're getting stuck in their body. They're just as a human, would sort of perseverating on some unresolved emotional trauma or wound. And where that is either creating illness, imbalance, lameness 101 other things in the physical body for an animal, or it's just contributing to behavior problems that are being completely misunderstood by most people. And when that is cleared up, it's very freeing, very liberating for both the animal and for the human as well.Ronnie:
That's amazing. From my own perspective, my understanding, my learnings come from being self-taught, if that's the right word. So my experiences come from my mare Toots, who we talked about last time we spoke. And she was the one that got me into animal communication. And for a long time, when I first used to go out and sit in the field with other horses and write whatever come into my head and pass it on to the relevant people. It was very much about just conversation. And there was always something in there for the for the carer to understand that I'd connected to their horse. As you I never asked for anything I just sit there and wherever my eyes were drawn, I would write the color of the horse and whatever came through and there's some funny stories as well sometimes with those. But as times gone by it's changed and it's, it's different. That still happens, but it's, it's not always word form, it's just a feeling. But as I mentioned to you you know, hand on heart, I find it's harder with your own horse because your own emotions and your own baggage get in the way. But I do always look to me first, what am I doing? What am I bringing to this? What am I not seeing? But yeah, it's, it is a constant struggle, I must say it's not the easiest. And then on the other scale, I get communications quite often when I'm starting my car, because for me, that's probably the less busiest head I'm driving. I'm focusing on one thing, so messages can get through and it's not just for horses, it's for people. Usually the person pops in, then the horse if it's just for the person and the person's name sort of pops in and then I pass on the message. I record quite a few of my messages for people, not just in this country, and I pass them on And my key is if I don't pay attention, I'll get the name will pop in or, or the thought will pop in. And that's, so it's one acknowledgement and I'm usually busy doing something and then it will come again and I'll go, okay, that's twice. And then the third time I pay attention. And if I'm driving or I'm busy, I will literally pull over and go, okay. And I never know what the message is. I just know there's something waiting to come through. And as I say the first word or think the first word or type the first word, quite often I put them on my phone, then the rest of it flows and then I pass it on and then I carry on And it never ceased to amaze me how they come and what it means because sometimes I'm intrigued what comes through and I'm like, okay, I'm really intrigued about this message and I always say you know, if it doesn't mean anything, then that's fine, but if it means anything, just let me know that you can acknowledge the message. And so when they do it's nice, it's nice that you know, and you're trusting what you're getting cuz it's, it's about that trusting that you are following through with what you originally said that you're going to do. Does that, does that make sense?Ginny:
Oh yes. And I think that one of the keys to any success in, in this realm is to be open and to not have an expectation of how the message will come or look or feel or what paradigm it might be. Representing, or if it's tied up nice and neat in a little box with a little bow, that that perfectly aligns with exactly what the human thought the issue was gonna be. You know, there have been many times, in fact, almost every day, I say, I have no idea what this means. It sounds even a little odd to me, but I'm gonna go ahead and say it because I'm being guided to say it and the person always says yes you know, there's always some explanation for it. So I think that being willing to, to listen, to sense, to feel, to hear, to experience, and what you talk about, Ronnie, is in the metaphysical realm it's called direct experience. Like you, you have learned and honed and refined your abilities through your own direct experience and direct messages from your own animal. And I will just say I too struggle with my own animals because the last thing we wanna be in working with our own animals is wrong. So if there's a sort of doubt, then we should always ask someone for help. It's, it's really hard. I don't wanna project on anybody that it's a difficult thing to do, but for me, it's difficult to be 100% certain that I know exactly what's going on with my animals. I often ask other animal communicators or intuitives for support and input. It's, it's what helps us to firstly validate the messages and the feelings that we're getting. But it's true that sometimes through our own emotion or through our own personal desire for a specific outcome, we can maybe not get the entire messageRonnie:
And how frustrating is that, that's the one animal that you want to really, really help and it's my reason for doing this. But maybe, yeah maybe there's another story to that.Ginny:
Well therein lies the resistance to receiving the message. Yeah. Because we're not neutral. The only way we can be as accurate as we can be is to be neutral to whatever comes or doesn't come. To have no expectation and to have no judgment. And that's a difficult place to be with your own animals For sure. It's a difficult place for any human being on earth right now to beRonnie:
Absolutely because you, you tend to judge yourself and, and go down that route sometimes. Yeah. I'm gonna share a little story this with you. So this happened quite a few years ago, and have you ever heard of a horse called Desert Orchid? Maybe not he's an English race horse and I used to belong to a group, it was group of ladies we used to meet and it's called a development circle, but we used to just go and meet in the evening and we used to all take cakes and have coffee and tea and cakes, and that was my favorite bit. And then we'd do a meditation and I was always one of these I think, oh, I don't wanna do a meditation you know, I can't do meditations the traditional way. Anyway, I did get into, And what we would do is we'd meet up, we'd have a cup of tea, have a little chit-chat, and then we'd sit down and start doing the meditation and then whatever came afterwards. And on this particular evening I was thinking about that I needed to go off and practice what I wanna do, because where I was, it wasn't gonna happen there because the work there wasn't orientated around horses. It was a development group for anything, but it wasn't horses. And I thought, I'm gonna have to find my own way and just go out and practice. So I sat there thinking about this, and as the ladies were talking, this white flash came across me, this white horse. And I was like, okay but I didn't realize what it was at that point and then this word came and it was orchid. And I thought, oh, okay, orchid. And we happen to be doing a flower reading. That evening there was ladies brought flowers and we were gonna do a reading from flowers that each one had picked. So I was thinking, okay, orchid. And then I was drinking my tea and everybody was chatting. And then it was like, desert. I was gonna get desert. Now my friends will laugh at me cuz they say, you are so scattery, you never get anything unless it's right there. And I was going, desert, desert, maybe they're talking about a flower in the desert. So I carried on drinking my tea and everybody was chatting. And then this word came back again. It was Orchid Desert. Orchid Desert, desert Orchid and then this white flash came past me again and it was a white horse. And I was going oh my God, it's Desert Orchid. And it was a famous racehorse. And I said, I've just seen a horse, Desert Orchid. And the tutor bless her, was say, no, no it's about flowers. It's probably cuz we're doing flowers this evening. And I was going, no, no, no. It was a horse that flashed past me and the name Desert Orchid and I know Desert Orchids White cuz I happened to have met him once and he was a smaller horse, smaller racehorse, so we carried on and we did our meditation. And I was really excited. I thought, no, no it was definitely something in there for me. So when I came home, I Googled and it happened to be, The day that we did this was a famous race and that's when he ran, I don't know if it was the Grand National or a famous race, and he was the winner. So I messaged my tutor, she was a friend and says, look, this is what's come up. And she says, all right, okay. You was right then. And for me, that was universe or whatever you want to call it, saying, look what you are thinking about, you are on the right path. I didn't know how it was gonna happen, where I was gonna go, but I knew what I was thinking was right for me, and it was time to go off on my own. But that story it was just so funny because it does take me a while to get things and it was just like, hello, I'm here. So, I told a few people that story, but then I would think, why would Desert Orchid come and visit me out of everybody? Why would he, why would he come and visit me? But obviously I know now that they can be everywhere, energy can be everywhere, not just one place. And it was my thought, my desire, my heart was, show me where I need to go. And the universe was just saying, there you go. There it is. That's what you meant to be doing. So find a way. Find a path. So that's what I did.Ginny:
and the universe didn't just choose any horse that had the name of a flower It shows a horse that was winning a national race on that day.Ronnie:
That was so cool, it was so funny. It was the way I was, desert orchid, orchid desert and then it just finally dropped and it was like, okay, I've got it, it's like, hello anybody there? Do you have any light stories that you're able to share?Ginny:
Well, probably the lightest one is the, you know, the horses that use foul language and then you sort of look around the barn and say, is there anybody here that says X, Y, Z? A lot And somebody will be like, you know? Most of the people that come to me come because there's some trauma or serious issue. Oftentimes, I mean, today, this morning I worked with a horse who. I think it was the very first time I ever heard a horse say to me this human is a, a wonderful companion I couldn't think of a better companion for myself. And he just showed me twinkle in his eye, twinkle in her eye. And I'd have to go grab my notes, but it was really validating and uplifting. But then of course there's always, my heart is heavy. I need to release something from my heart and Kenya, talk to her about her heart too. you know. But I had a funny name. Something came up maybe three years ago, I forget when I was on Vancouver Island, in Canada, maybe 2018. And I was talking to a woman and I said, I keep having a vision of a Caldera. Does this mean anything to you? No. No. And it just kept getting bigger and brighter. And Calera, Calera and I, and I came into my mind, she doesn't know what a Caldera is, right? And so I said, well, you know, the molten lava underneath a volcano? And she goes, oh yes, I had a horse named Molted Lava I think that for those of us who have sole agreements to do this work, to be messengers from animals, we are specifically given very specific information to validate for even skeptics. I mean I wrote a blog maybe three years ago, about three different stories where I was working with skeptics and I wish I pull it from my memory, but I have such a poor memory for these things, but it, it's on my blog and it, I think it's just entitled, working with Skeptics and everything, everything I do, all the information I get is for the most part healing or validating, right? It has something to do with an opportunity to know and understand oneself better, to heal, to clear, to release, or to have a better understanding, you know, in, in a partnership. And gosh, I, I wish I could remember two of the stories. The only one I remember has to do with trauma, but I was speaking with a man and a woman and we were sitting around stuck in an airport for hours. And so we were all sharing, you know, what we're all passionate about. And of course I shared about horses and my journey and she said, so everything you do is pretty much about trauma. And I said, yeah. and she said, well, you have to read my husband, because he's never been traumatized in his life. He's never had a bad day in his life. He's never had a bad emotion in his life. He's the happiest person I've ever met, the luckiest person I've ever met, and he is lived a charmed life. And I said, okay, well, does he give me permission? You know? Well, he was sitting right there and, yeah, sure. And so I didn't even think about it. I brought my hand up right to my sternum just like this. What happened right there? It would just a split second. As soon as he said yes, what happened right there, right at the sternum, and they both turned white as a sheet. He had been born with a congenital heart defect and had open heart surgery when he was just turned two. They had to wait until he was two years old. So everything that I am about all of the messages it's all about healing. So that we can understand ourself better, so that we can release the trauma from our nervous system so that more of our soul, our own conscious, our own divine essence can come into the body and we can be an embodied animal and embodied human. And that's, you know, the goal for most of us is to, is to learn and to grow and to heal and to be self realized. And that's the whole purpose of the podcast. So that's really why I put the podcast together.Ronnie:
Yeah. And it's excellent podcast. Sometimes people think, when you say trauma, they envision it's got to be like, like a major thing. But as you just described with that couple, he didn't think he had any trauma. You can have trauma to your body, to your cells, and it stores in and needs help releasing And sometimes triggers will bring things up and you know, there's something there to go. You have a trigger and working that, through your system. And it's recognizing that your body, your energy, your soul is always communicating with you. It's always guiding you. And if you feel uncomfortable or you are trying to bury something or deny something about yourself it has a way of erupting. And if you ignore it to the point of really pushing it down it explodes so you have to do something about it. And I suppose the ideal place to be would be as it happens because it's not a case of living in a bubble where nothing happens to us. We're here to experience this life. It's knowing that when something happens, you don't have to keep it. You can help it go through so that it's an easier experience, if that's the right word. Yeah. I'm not sure if I've described that correctly but.Ginny:
No, you're, you're exactly correct. And unfortunately, I'll just use myself in as an example. I wasn't brought up in a family or a society that even discussed thoughts and emotions and where they come from and that we don't have to be driven by them and that we can release them and they don't have to continue to affect our choices and make us sick. Nobody ever said that to me in 46 years of life, you know, so I think that, I always say we get three opportunities to address and heal a trauma before it really settles into the body and becomes some illness or disease. And firstly, it's the thoughts. If you have a negative thought, and I teach classes on this, where do thoughts come from? And self-inquiry. If you have a, an unwanted thought, let's not even use the word negative, some people might not like that. And you can track down through self-inquiry, talk to your body, talk to your consciousness, talk to your energy field. What is the source of the thought? Was it sometime when I was slighted or wronged or harmed or I watched someone else be abused in my life? You know, what is the source of that thought? Unfortunately, most people go to the psychiatrist to get drugs to control their thoughts because they don't like their thoughts. they don't know that they can use meditation, mind body practices. And you know, I'm certainly a proponent of mind, body, spirit practices. So that happens. And then the next warning we get is when the thoughts aren't addressed, and maybe we just take medication for it, they become emotions. So what do we do? Then? Most people go to the therapist, go to the psychiatrist, get medications to manage the emotions, instead of using the hundreds of processes that are available today, including psychotherapy to help us understand our emotions. One of the difficulties with traditional psychotherapy is that emotions aren't logical. So it's really hard to heal based on emotion, right? Or an understanding of emotion. But energetically, consciously, we can heal a tremendous amount BA based on emotion. But again, most of us go get the medication. So we haven't listened to our thoughts, we haven't listened to our emotions, so now it settles into the physical body and we begin to experience pain and that was my story. I had ignored all the thoughts, ignored all the emotions, and ignored the pain because I had to be tough in my job. I didn't listen to my body. I was a competition shooter. I was at the top of my game. I was a well-respected protection agent. I I had to keep up with the men. A five foot, two, 105 pound woman, lifting weights, doing pushups, running stairs in the coliseum, you know, and a master shooter. In competition, I would always be first, second, or third in any competition, it would be 49 men and me, and I would be first, second or third. Mostly second or third if there were that many people to be fair. But I didn't listen and I, my soul finally had to just say, I'm taking you out of the game. You are not listening. I am gonna strip away from you, your pride, your dignity, everything you contribute to the world. And we are gonna see if you'll listen, then. And unfortunately I went with the contemporary standard of care model because I didn't know anything else, so I wasn't able to listen. I was just that wounded. But I think what you're saying is so very true. We can Ronnie get to a place where something happens, somebody says something. Maybe in the past it would've triggered us. Maybe it's a a tad bit of pain. And if we are self-aware enough, and when I say self-aware, I mean spirit in a body, body energy field, grounding the whole nine yards. If we are aware enough, we can immediately release the thoughts, the emotions, the pain, and move on with our day and never be triggered by it again, never be bothered by it again. But that's a level of mastery that most people on earth don't achieve.Ronnie:
So when people don't recognize that or they don't address it, do you find that, they can get sick because we are not dressing things that we need to do. Now I don't know to what degree but it's floating around there. So have you any thoughts on that?Ginny:
Well, there is no one answer to that question. There are no absolutes and there is no way for me to write a manual that says, if your animal gets sick, your animal is definitely taking on your pain. There's no way every animal and every human and every relationship are completely unique. There are six or seven different ways to answer that question. Number one, specifically with respect to an animal that gets sick. It can be the animals predisposition genetically for, for an illness, right? That can be healed through an intuitive awareness. Working with the animal animals can clear and heal their genetic lineage. in their sovereign choice if they are educated or reminded that they have that choice, an animal can be sick, just like a human can be sick because of environmental factors or a suppressed immune system or on and on and on I don't wanna open up that can of worms because those are conversations that can be very charged, right? An animal can get sick because just like humans, it has judged a person or a thing or itself. And I've worked with many animals who have been and in fact, one of the horses I worked with today was an Arab born from a very well known Arabian breeding farm. And he proved to be not breeding stock, and it was projected on him that his confirmation wasn't good enough and he was substandard, and he was just about to be sent to a kill pen apparently, when my client intercepted the animal. So imagine the sense of unworthiness that he held in within his own being because he was told by humans that there was something wrong with him. And I, as a child was told that there was something wrong with me because I was unwanted. So I can resonate with that. I mean, we can all, I think, I don't know that many people who haven't felt a sense of feeling unwanted or unworthy or something wrong with us, whether it be physical confirmation, right? Or our intellect or our ability to be an artist or sing or dance or ride a horse, whatever that is, right? And so there's that. There's an animal just like a human being. Can martyr itself, can sacrifice itself, can take on human emotion. And most of them that do have no idea what to do with it and need help getting rid of it. And that's a huge conversation, Ronnie, that I would love to talk about every day of the week and for the rest of my life because something I think we all need to be reminded of is that none of us can heal. Another being none of us can do. The forgiving that is necessary for another being can release the judgment of ourself or others that is contributing. We can carry the emotional pain. We can say, let me share your burdens. Oh, I feel guilty that you know, I bucked you off and now you have a broken clavicle, and a broken rib, and a broken leg, and now I feel guilty. Right? What the animals need to be reminded most often, and humans as well who are very empathic like myself, who martyred themselves like myself, that we can never actually heal the cause of someone's pain or anguish or wound. We can carry the burden so that we both suffer constantly, but we can never actually heal. That is only done by the person who has the wound. So there's that Then there's a really complicated conversation about mirror neurons and animals. Dogs and horses, cats have more mirror neurons than humans, and we know from neuroscience that if you're a child or you're an adult and you witness a shock or a trauma, someone in a car accident, someone being murdered, someone being abused, someone being. Just vilified, discredited, cut down, cut to the knees. As, as we would say, our body doesn't know the difference between their trauma and our trauma because our mirror neurons bring it into our system. Now, as an educated, self-aware person, I know that that has an opportunity to happen to me all day long. It's something called secondary trauma in my work. So every day I'm constantly clearing any secondary trauma or anywhere within my nervous system that I have taken on someone else's trauma or projections. And animals do that a lot. When you see animals yawning, a lot of times they're saying, Hey, this isn't mine. I'm in your energy field and I'm perceiving your trauma. And if I weren't as self-aware as I am, I would take that on, but I'm not going to, so I'm going to yawn and and release it. Right. Yawning resets the vagus nerve and the entire nervous system actually, you know how to do it. So there are so many reasons. There are souls, there are animals who make a choice to say, you keep getting, you know, like a bacterial or infection, or you keep injuring your ankle because you're not addressing some emotional trauma in your life, and I'm going to hurt myself or become ill to show you that. Well, unfortunately, most humans don't even know that that's a thing. There's no there, there. Like, oh, my animal's sick. I have to take it to the vet. The vet needs to fix it. very few people stop and say, oh, I wonder if my animal is mirroring my illness or I just had a, a bladder infection last month and now my cat has a bladder infection. That's not a common conversation you know, but there can be so many reasons for an animal to develop illness. One is they wanna take themselves out of the game. They don't wanna jump anymore. They don't wanna spin anymore. They don't wanna do dressage anymore. They don't wanna rodeo anymore. They don't wanna be ridden anymore. There's so much of that going on too. Or they're just not being listened to, or they're in pain somewhere. They have a cracked tooth or a necrotic root or a rib out or a ulcers, and people aren't listening. So they're exhibiting behavior that people would say, oh, that's bad behavior. Don't put up with that. You know, but they're just trying to tell you they're in pain. We could talk about this for 13 weeks, six hours a day, and really just scratch the surface of the reasons why animals get sick. So you'll never hear me say it's because of this one thing. It's just not. It's just not.Ronnie:
And that's the big question cuz you think that you can fix things and as you said, it's not our right can't do that to them. They have to give us the permission and they have to want that or be aware of it the same as we do if, if that's the right phrase.Ginny:
I have a girlfriend who has a horse right now, and she keeps asking me to help the horse. And the horse keeps telling me I can suffer if I choose. I can suffer if I choose. I can suffer if I wanna And you know, of course my friend doesn't want that answer. And the horse is taking on my friend suffering. A lot of the cellulitis and inflammation that we see is the animals processing and detoxing through their system, a bunch of human emotion and trauma that humans aren't willing to face or take responsibility for. So it's true that animals are experiencing pain and suffering because they think they're helping us, but when the human has no desire or intention of ever healing anyway, that's when we can talk to the animals and say, your suffering isn't helping anybody. Is this really a sole choice you wanna make? You know, is this how you want to die? It might not be the best choice they get to make that choice.Ronnie:
Yeah. Crikey, I've got like 20 more questions in my head, Ginny and that means we'd be here all night, which is not what you wanna do. what would you like to talk about now? What would you like to share?Ginny:
Well, just so you know, I have time I blocked out 90 minutes, so it's totally up to you how long we go.Ronnie:
Are you comfortable talking about therapy horses and what they've enlightened with you, what they've shared with you? And there's different scenarios, so if you want to, that's fine. If not, we'll go on onto another subject.Ginny:
Well, I'm happy to talk about it with this disclaimer.Ronnie:
You don't have to if you don't want to.Ginny:
This is a very difficult subject, almost any subject with any animal lover you know, especially horses. There are a lot of opinions and a lot of perspectives, and I always say there are no absolutes, but I think in this case, in this conversation, we can at least narrow down the scope of the conversation, so we could talk about whether or not the animals choose to be in service. We can talk about the lack of a standard of care model for horses in those programs. We can talk about the lack of horse experience for people who are running the program. I mean, there's so many different ways to come at the conversation, but I think to really honor your question, your intention is how do horses feel about being placed in service? And again, I say ask 10 horses, get 10 answers. Just like ask 10 horsemen any question about horses and you're gonna get nine or 10 answers, right? Yeah. So again, it's very unique to horses. There are some what I would consider to be unfortunate trends and more horses than not. And this is according to their own research in these programs that are created to train people and certify people in equine assisted psychotherapy, equine guided education, equine facilitated learning, equine coaching, whatever you call it. It's putting a horse in service to a human. And firstly, I myself, question why we need animals at all to help us. We are the more evolved species we should be, the more evolved species we should be, the more self-aware species. But beyond that there are horses who have experienced a shock or trauma and are unable to manage their own energy field. So against their own wishes, they are taking on the, the energy of animals. And I apologize, I started a thought and I didn't finish it through. I was talking about the the burnout rate of horses in these programs. And the burnout rate is anywhere from three to 18 months. And I am personally aware of a few sanctuaries across the world that are dedicated to taking in animals that are completely and totally traumatized from being in these programs. And there are many reasons why that can be. Number one, they didn't belong there in the first place. Number two, there's no standard of care. They were used too many times, too many days a. Number three, they didn't know how to manage their own energy. Number four, people weren't listening to them. They had an injury or they were in pain, or they had their own healing that they needed to do, and the list could just go on and on and on. Mm-hmm. from an esoteric perspective, but I think even from a human intellectual perspective, there are a lot of problems with the way horses are used in these programs. I had a woman call me about a year ago saying that she's highly educated. We met maybe five years ago, 2017. At an animal healing, of course, somewhere across the US And she remembered me and she was working with horses, volunteering at an equine facilitated therapy place. And she said, I have this horse and I know that he doesn't like doing this work. He struggles with too many people in his energy field. And I know, I know this is true. Can you help me with the horse? And I talked to the horse and he couldn't manage his own energy with even two people in his energy field. And he was not well suited to this. And she went to the clinical director of the program and told the clinical director, it's not just me, this other respected animal communicator is saying the same thing. And the woman's response, a woman with a PhD said, well, he's just gonna have to suck it up because that's his job. And unfortunately, I have talked to people who are actively engaged in these programs over and over again. Saying things like, your horse just told me it's taking on the trauma of the participants and it can't, it would like to figure out why and how and it would be happy to do the work if only it weren't taking on the trauma of people, or this horse is not well suited to this work. And I've had people respond and I quote, well, they live with me and that's the work I do. So if they wanna live with me, that's what they have to do. So, you know, there's a lot of human unfortunately in this industry, and not just specifically equine facilitated anything in any animal, whether it be body work, whether it be animal communication, energy healing, what have you, there's a lot of avaris, and that's just a fancy word of saying greed. And, and there is a lot of competition involved. There are a lot of unhealed people who are performing these tasks and unfortunately, the need to make a living is trumping honoring the soul of the animal and the choices of the animal. And again, I can say there is a direct correlation to this conversation and why I started my podcast. Not to bash the equine facilitated world, but to help people understand that there is education available for all of us to know and understand ourselves better, to learn about the human body and the energy constructs, and how to honor ourselves and honor animals before we put out a shingle and start accepting money. Because if we quit our day job or invest in a farm and horses, then we have to keep marketing and putting programs together, even when it's killing our soul, even when we know it's wrong. And there are a lot of people out there doing it. who know it's wrong. And there are many, many people that come to me and say, I had to take my animals out of service. Can you help me? What, what can I do? I want to do this work. I want to help people, but I don't know how to do it. And I have five horses and four of them are burned out. And the one that's not burned out never wanted to do it in the first place. So she never went in the arena. So this is a really, really charged subject and a lot of moving parts and it involves human ego. And when the human ego gets involved, all bets are off. Yeah.Ronnie:
Thank you for sharing that cuz that is a touchy subject. And the reason I brought it forward was as you were talking there, sometimes I get like a collective message, so I see it as like A council of horses, but that's just how they present themselves to me. Mm-hmm. But as you were talking, they very much wanted to say as you touched on that, if we have a choice, then we have the freedom to do that. Then we have the, the energy and the heart in it. And sometimes, you know that if you are told to do something and you say, no, you have to do that. It's like, but I don't wanna do it. Okay. But you've gotta do it. Okay if they have a choice, it's different. as it is with a human. If you don't have a choice you either rebel or you don't want to do it, and you have a different feel with it. But sometimes just taking that, that pressure off and saying, okay, what would you like to do? It's almost like you go, okay, yeah, I can do that. And it's being aware, watching and feeling but sometimes there's so much structure in that sort of work that you have to be there at a certain time, you've got two hours of doing something, and there's expectations afterwards. Even if they say there isn't, there's always some kind of expectation. I suppose it must be difficult to say you can come along and you can experience something, but I've no idea what will happen or how long it'll be. It might be 10 minutes, it might be an hour. They may be speaking, they may not. So framing that, That freedom is something I suppose that people have to work with and think, well how can I do what's good for the animal and the person and honoring both energies, but still be able to do something that's beneficial and it's bringing something different and looking at it in a different way, rather the normal way, you know, that you have to do the training and this is how it works, sort of protocol.Ginny:
And it's based on, you know, it's meant to be an income generating proposition and they're guided to do 30 minute back to back sessions, some of them. And they're guided to use the same horse, you know, six times a day. And it really depends. Again, every situation is unique. There are some programs out there that are really doing phenomenal work and they have horses that truly want to show up and that aren't taking on the energy, but that represents a very small percentage from my perspective and many, many other people who feel the same way I do. And there's many of us that I talked to across the world, and it's something that's going to have to come to the fore sooner than later. And as humans, I think we need to remember why it is that this process started in the first place. And it's because of the, the, that the heart of the horse is larger than the heart of an, of a human being. So the horse generates a larger electromagnetic field than the human being does. And if we, we don't even have to be. Have any respect whatsoever for metaphysics or spirituality? If you are married to science, go look at the research that heart math has done on heart rate variability and heart coherence. And what happens to a human being in the presence of a horse is that their bioelectric field is stronger than our bioelectric field. Therefore, we are shifted into out of a fight and flight and into rest and digest. When that happens, their energy field pushes out, oftentimes concerns looping thoughts anxiety, and we can breathe and we can feel ourself. And a lot of times, healing that takes place during those moments is artificially attributed to the horse when it's actually the horse created a sacred space. the horse created a coherent electromagnetic field, and not all horses can nor do traumatized horses. It has been true proven through scientific experiment, don't have necessarily a coherent heart rhythm. If they, they've measured the heart rate variability of four horses and three horses maintain their coherent heart rhythm when in the presence of a traumatized person and one does not. That horse certainly has trauma, so it's not every single horse. Anyway, I'm just going on and on and I feel at this point not really making a coherent point anymore.Ronnie:
No that's absolutely fine. That's fine. I'm just gonna put on a comment. So Gail says, thank you for this amazing discussion. Oh, thank you very much, Gail thank you for joining us. And she also said earlier about the wonderful story about beauty. Yeah. Thank you for that, Gail. Thank you for your comments and thank you for everybody that's watching. I can still see there's a few people here which is lovely. I knew this conversation was gonna be different, but I didn't know where it was going to go. And Sometimes what I wanna say, it normally flows, but I think it's because it's, it's slightly different and it's deeper. It's not something you can just say in a sentence. And as you said earlier about the different therapists with animals because it's big now, it's big business. Yes. In a lot of areas. But a lot of people deep down started it for a reason and they get a bit lost, I think, and it goes in a different direction. But that can be with a lot of things, you know? Humans are our own worst enemies. We think too much instead of just allowing. If we listened, Paid attention and went with the flow of what's happening on the day in every area of our life, it would be a lot smoother and a lot more gentle in a lot of ways. So we're coming up to an hour Ginny and you've talked quite a lot, but I feel that we've just scratched the surface and I'd love to do another interview with you in the future and maybe just have a few discussions where we can go a little bit deeper that you are happy to talk about. I'll just go with the flow again. Is there anything that you'd like to say before we finish, is there anything you'd like to add to the conversation?Ginny:
Well I wouldn't have created my podcast if I didn't believe that we all wouldn't benefit from a greater level of self-awareness. And as human beings, if we can understand ourselves. And we understand where our thoughts come from, why we get triggered, where our emotions are coming from, how to address struggles in interpersonal relationships, what have you. When we begin to understand ourselves as complex sentient beings of light, but also thought and emotion and physicality, we can then begin to honor the animal's experience as well, because the animals have just as nuanced, just as rich, just as complex lives. Not every single one of them, of course, but many, many. and we tend to get paired with animals who have either similar issues to us or who come into our life for a reason, to spur us on, to encourage us to speak our truth, to be empowered, to heal ourselves. Much like one of the clients I had earlier today, they shared similar heart wounds. But this isn't true obviously for every person that owns a horse right? It's, there's so many different reasons animals come into our lives, but I promise each and every one of us that our relationships with our animals can be better and will be richer if we understand our human experience better. And there are 101 ways to do that, and that's a euphemism. Of course. There are thousands of ways. There are no absolutes. There are many different systems of belief and many different modalities. I mean, if you just wanna raise your frequency and use Turning Forks, then that's great. If you wanna do yoga, that's great. If you wanna embrace mindfulness techniques or breathe or jump in an ice bath, do that you know, I don't know how that helps you connect to your soul any better, but it's certainly an opportunity to get in touch with your body and if we can do that, our relationships with animals will be much the better.Ronnie:
Oh, thank you very much, Ginny that was well said. It's been a pleasure chatting with you and my mind's full of thoughts and questions that I should have asked. So if you'd just like to say goodbye to the listeners.Ginny:
That was lovely, what a lovely lady. I'm start listening. Obviously I do equine communication but I do it the way that my inner be, my inner guidance as guided me, and I never ever say, you know this is the way that it is and that's it. I always explain that this is how I work. I can't speak for anybody else, but this is how I work and I come with integrity and I work from the heart and I do the best of my ability. And as I said earlier, with your own horse, it's more difficult that it's not that you don't communicate, but it's difficult because of the emotion and your own stuff going on. So I do appreciate that when I go see clients, I understand that point of view. And as Ginny said, there is no one way to do something. but we've all got that ability to connect to ourselves and listen and you have to start with your own learning. You can read a textbook, you can go on courses, but you've gotta know what it is for you. What is my voice saying? What is my, my truth? What is my Yeah, I know. That's real feeling and that's what you've got to start working with. And it can be the tiniest thing. Cuz once you start to do that, then that's one you're building on and your animals and the people around you are aware of that because they feel a slight difference in you and I don't why I'm saying that. So maybe somebody's listening to this and looking for a bit of inspiration. We all have the ability. So thank you for stopping on by. I shall speak to you soon and for my lovely guest Ginny I've got lots of more questions, so she'll be back again definitely. Take care and bye for now. Thank you.