Learnings and Missteps
The Learnings and Missteps Podcast is about unconventional roads to success and the life lessons learned along the way.
You will find a library of interviews packed with actionable take aways that you can apply as you progress on your career path.
Through these interviews you will learn about the buttons you can push to be a better leader, launch a business, and build your influence.
Find yourself in their stories and know that your path is still ahead of you.
Learnings and Missteps
Messaging Matters: Fabi Paolini on How to Attract Power Buyers
Are you struggling to connect with your ideal clients and amplify your brand message? Join us as we sit down with Fabi Paolini, a seasoned brand strategist, who uncovers the nuances of effective messaging. In this engaging episode, Fabi shares her journey from Venezuela to becoming a successful branding expert in the U.S. She reveals her unique concept of the "angle of mastery," which emphasizes the importance of crafting a message that genuinely resonates with your audience, rather than amplifying a broken one.
Throughout our discussion, we explore the stark contrast between traditional marketing practices and the need for a more empowering approach that attracts so-called "power buyers"—clients ready to invest in meaningful solutions. Fabi shares actionable strategies to frame your offerings as a "need to have" rather than merely a "nice to have" for your audience. She also emphasizes the significance of building genuine connections, ensuring that each interaction offers value and fosters engagement.
Throughout this episode, you’ll gain insights on navigating the complexities of branding and messaging while learning how to address your own struggles as an entrepreneur. By the end, you’ll be equipped with powerful tools to refine your messaging strategy, making a lasting impact on potential clients. So, if you're ready to master your brand voice and resonate with your audience, tune in and join the conversation. Don’t forget to subscribe, share this episode, and leave us a review!
Connect with Fabi at:
My 20-minute training is at https://www.fabipaolini.com/positioning/
My free 15-min Message Assessment: BRAND ASSESSMENT - Fabi Paolini
Make yourself a priority and get more done: https://www.depthbuilder.com/do-the-damn-thing
Download a PDF copy of Becoming the Promise You are Intended to Be
https://www.depthbuilder.com/books
Most people think that it's marketing, so they're like let me get more leads or let me get more visibility or let me start running ads. But that's not the problem. The problem is that your message is going to speak to the wrong people, no matter what strategy you use. You're just amplifying a broken message.
Speaker 2:The work never stops people. That's what I'm trying to do.
Speaker 1:I was in absolute overwhelm in that moment At the start, like my kid in the swing, and then angle of mastery, like that phrase came in and I was like oh my God, that is it.
Speaker 2:What is going on? Lnm family, if you can't tell. I got a new background. No, I didn't buy a new house. I'm at an Airbnb and, adding to the excitement of being here today, I'm going to spend some time. We're going to spend some time.
Speaker 2:Miss Fabi Paolini I connected with her on LinkedIn and she's got a spectacular message or not just a message a service that she provides in helping people amplify their brand. So she's a brand strategist. She helps experts meaning real experts, not flapping talking heads like me. She helps them attract power buyers with the angle of mastery, which I think is super, super interesting. We're going to dig into that. She's been doing it for nine years. She's helped hundreds of clients enroll high quality leads and clients, and if you're in business at all, you know that leads are important and clients are important, and the fact that these are high quality is phenomenal because that translates into business success. And so, and if this is your first time, this is the learnings and missteps podcast, where you get to see how real people just like you are sharing their gifts and talents to leave this world better than they found it. This world better than they found it. I'm Jesse, your selfish servant, and now you're going to get to know Ms Fabi. Ms Fabi, how are you?
Speaker 1:I'm so excited to be here and to talk to you, and you have this amazing, amazing energy and just this life in you, so I'm definitely excited to talk and share some of my story and just have an awesome conversation, oh my God, I love it because I've been able to see several of your clips.
Speaker 2:Like I said, linkedin is primarily the place I live. I'm like there all the time and I just learned today that you hit 70,000 views on your YouTube channel.
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah, so I'm kind of getting started, sort of started on my YouTube channel since yes, yeah, so I'm kind of getting started, not sort of started on my YouTube channel since the beginning of last year. I have a podcast where I share just weekly content and videos on there on messaging, marketing, all sorts of things, and so I just got this email this morning or yesterday morning. With, like a little, you reached 70,000 views and then 4,000 subscribers. It's small, but also I feel like it's massive.
Speaker 2:So oh my God, okay, so let's, let's stick there. I mean, you said it's small and you're probably like, in comparison to other folks that have like massive, massive views and followings, but it is massive.
Speaker 1:It is yeah.
Speaker 2:But it doesn't start off like that. What was that like for you being a brand strategist and being on the, on the interwebs, on all the socials, and the time horizon between starting and actually hitting these big milestones how did you manage that?
Speaker 1:Well, the truth. I'll tell you the truth, jesse, for me I don't care. I know this is really weird maybe, but I don't care about. I know this is really weird maybe, but I don't care about how many followers I have or how many likes I get or how many views I get. I genuinely don't. I just focus on delivering value, and that's it. And if it's one person, I mean, obviously my business keeps on bringing clients and we keep on growing, which is ultimately what you want, but, but I just focus on delivering value. And for me and it's a lot of what I do, and we'll talk about about this even more later but it's like when you have a message that matters to you and you're sharing something that is important, it's like why would me having a hundred views stop me? I just find that to be silly.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, Applause because I think, rather for the L&M family member out there that's listening and maybe a little the wind has been taken out of your sails because you don't have a million downloads and all the things.
Speaker 2:I think what you said is absolutely fundamental in terms of having impact and staying healthy like mentally healthy is do it to share a message, do it to serve, do it to contribute, because if that's what you're doing, mission accomplished. If you're doing it for likes and followers, that's a little different, because there's a lot of goofy things you could do to get likes and followers. Now, in terms of the value that you're focused on delivering and providing and I'm a beneficiary because I pay attention. I pay attention to some of the pointers you put out there in your clips and like, ooh, I need to. I do that, I do the messaging. That's like the sky is falling down. Let me change that up a little bit and I've made some tweaks and I've noticed an increase in interaction when I changed the message, and so you have this idea of this, this angle of mastery. What is that?
Speaker 1:Yeah, so basically for me, this is a long story, but I'll try to sum it up as much as I can. So, basically for me, when I started my business, I started creating content, like we all are supposed to do, right, and I would bring in clients, but I started to feel like there was something missing in my message. Like I sounded like a lot of different people and there was a lot of things, or there were a lot of things that I was doing in my own expertise that were coming short. When I was trying to explain what I did, I would say things like I'm going to help you build a brand that attracts, for example, for the first few years of my business, and it's like anybody could say that. Anybody could say I'm going to help you build a brand that attracts, and what happens often is that so many people fall into using phrases to describe what they do that are like an eye roll, sort of like okay, thank, you I've heard that a million times.
Speaker 1:I know that I see it and I'm pretty new to LinkedIn. I literally started on LinkedIn in just in October of last year.
Speaker 1:I spent years using Facebook, and that's what I did, and I'll tell you that story later on. But my point is that when I go in through LinkedIn, I feel like 90% of the content sounds the same, and so, for me, this idea of the angle of mastery is about bringing together in one concept or one phrase who you are, what you stand for and what you're truly selling. Like what is it that you're selling? You're not selling a program. You're not selling a podcast. You're not selling a service. You're not selling a session or consultant or whatever. You're selling an idea, and so, for me, your angle of mastery is that idea that sums it all up but also feels different to the millions of things Like I can guarantee that nobody out there is talking about angle of mastery, because I created it, it's like my concept and so, therefore, I become known for that and I get to stand out because of that, and it also encompasses all these different pieces of who I am. So that's what it's about basically.
Speaker 2:Oh, my goodness. Okay, that's pretty. Here's what I love about it it's pretty damn clear, right? And I hear that like all the time get clear, get clear, get clear, it's like. But it's not that easy. It takes some work. So, in that line of thinking, in terms of gaining the clarity, were you clear when you were in sixth grade that you were going to have this trademarked idea and provide the services that you're providing today idea and provide the services that you're providing today?
Speaker 2:Before we get into that, I want to give the L&M family member shout out. This one goes to Ms Tricia Reich. Ms Tricia sent me this message and she says I really loved spending my Saturday with Jesse and everyone else. I learned about managing myself. If you have the opportunity to participate in one of Jesse's seminars, it's worth the time. So there you go. Tricia said so. We got to hang out in the do the damn thing time management workshop and there's going to be several of those coming up here in the near future, so keep an eye out for them, of course not keep an eye out for them?
Speaker 1:Of course not.
Speaker 2:So how'd you get here? So what?
Speaker 1:happened from sixth grade until now? No, of course not. Of course not. But it's the evolution of of my brand, of figuring out how do I serve my clients better. And, honestly, that's where it came up for me, Because one thing that I really genuinely care about is making sure that I have a service and a process that is really good. That is actually something that will serve my clients and that will really change their businesses in a way. And so, for me, in that process of figuring out well, how do I give them a true differentiating factor, something that is genuinely going to help them get better results, is when I came up with the angle of mastery for myself and it was one of those things that is like happen in the most random way how that phrase in particular came to me. Now, obviously, since I created this I'll tell you in a second second but since that phrase came to me, I've developed entire frameworks and methodologies around it.
Speaker 1:But so it was like an unlock, like it was literally I was searching for the phrase and it was like the most, like the craziest circumstances. My dad had a kidney transplant, my mom was the donor and while both of them were recovering from surgery, my I have three kids, my kids. I was alone with my kids. My husband had to well from Venezuela. Originally, my husband had to travel for Venezuela to have his passport renew.
Speaker 1:I was in absolute overwhelm in that moment, like start like my kid in the swing just pushing her, and then angle of mastery, like that phrase came in and I was like, oh my god, that is it. And I literally started recording voice notes to myself and this whole thing, and then off of that I've built an entire framework process. How do you how to help my clients create their own like kind of angle of mastery phrases and stuff like that? So it was like this whole kind of crazy thing.
Speaker 2:Oh my God, that's a beautiful story and I can only imagine the pressure you were under and maybe the takeaway there is, like you got to be open, seeking and ready for those moments, that clarity to hit, would you agree?
Speaker 1:A hundred percent, and I think that that's when they come in, though that's when that clarity comes in. I think that the more that we I mean you have to have a framework and a process, like learning to ride a bike you have to learn. Okay, I have to put my feet here, I have to move my feet, I have to keep my balance, but suddenly you're like, like if you're not thinking about the whole thing, but you have the foundations there, and so when you let go is when that comes through at the same time, like you have the foundation, but then you're also allowing yourself to receive the ideas and the and like that inspiration. I do have a very specific process for that, though, but I do think that oftentimes, when we let go is when the best ideas can come through.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, and I'm with you. I understand, like the process, the mechanics of doing things and then the kind of magical stuff that you got to that I got to leave space for.
Speaker 1:Exactly.
Speaker 2:And, and so the idea, the phrase, the framework of angle of mastery became clear. Where you're at the park and your family was in the hospital or recovering from, like serious surgery, your husband's out of the country, like that's a lot.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:But what I want I want to make sure the folks don't miss is it's not like you were just walking in the park and this great idea happened upon you. There was what years of work and grinding and working it all out before that awakening? Yeah.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah.
Speaker 2:Okay, yes, and so for folks that are like in that space I feel like everybody I know is in that space right now, including me like in the clunky, bumpy, wonky space of like. I know I can deliver value, but I don't know how to say it clearly yet and knowing that you're like a phenomenal brand strategist and your messaging is absolutely clear, what was it like back then? What were the stepping stones that you built upon before you had that moment of clarity?
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay, so this is a kind of a crazy story. Maybe not, but I love it, so I I like I was sharing before. I'm originally from Venezuela and and in 2015, we came to the US. To be completely honest, I wanted my daughter to be an American, so I came. I always clarify that we came legally, though we had.
Speaker 1:I don't know why I feel like the need to be like. I had a work visa. I did not come illegally, it's fine, but just in case everybody ever hears this, that is like let me research anyways. And I was coming to give birth and my plan was to leave. That was it. But so this was September 2015.
Speaker 1:But about like a few months after my daughter was born, my husband and I were like I have, a situation in Venezuela is getting worse and it's getting trickier, and then we just made a decision to stay. Mind you, it's been almost 10 years. I have not gone back to Venezuela since then. I had an apartment with a baby nursery, all my clothes, everything that was kind of there until last year when we finally rented the apartment, but it was like frozen in time and so we made the decision to stay. At the time, my husband he is a singer, but at the time he was working as a singer and he would travel to Venezuela to do shows and concerts there and basically that's kind of how we were making our income. But I had a background in in branding. I've been doing this from since 2007 and I had an MBA and I had all this kind of knowledge.
Speaker 1:But my business in Venezuela was all word of mouth and it was in the local currency. It wasn't in US dollars, so it wasn't something that was like easily translated to dollars. So, anyways, I was like I need to start building my business. As the country, venezuela starts to shut down more and more, our income from my husband's show starts to cut off. Because if you're not aligned with basically I don't want to get into politics but the dictatorship you don't get to perform. So essentially, my husband ended up, you know, not going back, and so we were like, okay, we need to figure out a way to build a business here. So I started investing in coaching programs and marketing to figure out what to do.
Speaker 1:At that time I was doing mostly like web design and yet some messaging. I always knew that messaging was important and the core of things. But what I was being taught back then, which is still being taught today, which is crazy to me is a lot of that pain. Marketing let's agitate people's pain, let's talk about how bad the problem is, we'll get into is a lot of that pain. Marketing let's agitate people's pain, let's talk about how bad the problem is. We'll get into this a lot, cause I can really go into this topic and like how, what type of pressure can you use to get people to buy almost? And like how do I do sales and all of these things?
Speaker 1:And I started implementing and it started working. But I would also attract a lot of people who were broke, who could not work with me, who couldn't afford it, and I was not going to be the type of salesperson that can enroll that type of person, because that's not who I am. It just never felt right. I just couldn't. It was like okay, I know that there's people that could enroll you, but if you have to sell your car to work with me, please don't sell your car.
Speaker 2:Like please don't sell your car Like please.
Speaker 1:You got other things Priorities. Yes, of course, you need branding and messaging, but you need to eat, so please eat. Anyways, I started growing my business and, little by little, it started moving more and more into messaging. And so one day in, I think, like in 2021, I was like I feel that this type of message does not resonate with me. This type of pain marketing strategy everybody's talking about it. It's like the bro marketing way of doing things. It doesn't resonate with me as a buyer. I don't buy when you're talking to me in this condescending poor you way. I'm here to save you, right.
Speaker 1:So I don't buy into that. To save you Right. I don't buy into that. Why would I, my audience, buy into that? So it was like a very bold decision on my end, but I was like I'm going to do things completely different. I had zero evidence of it, but I was just convinced that there was a way of doing right.
Speaker 1:And, mind you, now I call that strategy being the Ursula, which is you're speaking to the poor unfortunate souls, that's it, you got it. There's a new little mermaid movie, so now everybody can get that reference, but but that's what I call it. It's like when you're becoming the Ursula, when you're talking to the poor unfortunate souls and your whole messaging. And so I was like I'm not doing that anymore. I'm going to speak to the people who who are like me, I have a problem. And so I was like I'm not doing that anymore. I'm going to speak to the people who who are like me, I have a problem.
Speaker 1:And I'm like, okay, who do I hire? What do I do? How do I fix it? I'm not like, oh, miserable, falling apart, full of anxiety, can't sleep, my life is falling apart. I'm a smart person, I don't, I don't, I don't need that message. So I shifted that was kind of the first piece of my messaging transformation to really speak against that a lot, and which meant also that a lot of the coaches that I and I never said anything by name, but a lot of those coaches were like blocking me off everywhere and like all the things really pissed at me and I'm like, yeah, go ahead, you're going to say something.
Speaker 2:I've been wondering because you made a dramatic shift from the norm, from conventional thinking, from the wisdom of those amazing coaches out there, and obviously I mean you just started talking about it, right, there was friction.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And you also said that you didn't have any evidence that this was going to work. And you did. Said that you didn't have any evidence that this was going to work and you did it anyway. So, if you could like expand, what did that feel like? How did you reconcile? Okay, all these fools, everything out there is telling me this is the way, but right here within me, this is telling me there's a better way. How did you reconcile and stay resolute in doing what you saw needed to be done?
Speaker 1:It just had to be done, period For me. I am really good at trusting my gut and at following intuition. God, however you want to view it, however you see it, for me it was really clear and it's funny because, coming back to the linkedin, like how I? What happened with linkedin?
Speaker 1:yeah, it was a similar thing. I had been building my business on facebook since 2015. That was it. I had it clear and dominated, and so last year I had this moment where I felt like I'm done with Facebook. It was working for me. I still run ad through Facebook and they work really well, but my organic stuff I can't even explain to you. It was almost like a physical sensation of leave. And same thing with this, like Ursula language. It was like stop. From one day to another, I was like buy Facebook, my gut just told me go to LinkedIn, and that's how stop. From one day to another, I was like by Facebook, my gut just told me go to LinkedIn, and that's how I just moved over to LinkedIn after not doing anything on LinkedIn, basically ever.
Speaker 1:But that's the same thing that happened with the messaging. It was like I don't have any evidence of this necessarily, but it's. It was common sense to me in terms of messaging. If my message says you're powerless and you're full of anxiety and you feel like nothing is going to work, how is it a surprise when I get on a sales call and somebody tells me I don't think that this is going to work, because nothing has ever worked and I'm too afraid to invest, Like I literally called you into my program. That was exactly why am I surprised when that's what I'm getting back? So we have to be so careful with our content and our message and really discern and be like wait, does this make sense? And so it was just common sense for me. It was like I don't have evidence of this, but this is logical. You don't see, I don't know, like Mercedes Benz, I don't know Bentley have commercials that are like your car is falling apart.
Speaker 1:Come find my car for you. You're so sad Transmissions. I don't know anything about cars. They don't do that, so why is it that I have to do that? It doesn't make sense to me.
Speaker 2:Right, right, okay. So I'm going to go a little deeper on this intuition and gut thing, because I'm told, like you and I sister, you don't even know, like everybody knows, like man, you're crazy, like yeah, I know, but it's because I'm compelled. There's something I call it the whispers, but there's something that just makes it super damn clear that this is what I need to do. No evidence, no nothing. And so most people think, like I said, I'm nuts. No evidence, no nothing. And so most people think, like I said, I'm nuts. But in terms of your situation, you, clearly you have embraced your intuition and your gut. How did you, or where does that come from? Where does your confidence in doing that? Or are you all maybe a different way to think about it is were you always so confident about what you felt and thought or sensed in the world, or did that develop over time?
Speaker 1:I feel like it definitely developed over time. I have been always really confident in who I am as a person in general, like in my thoughts as a child, always like, not the type of be, like let me follow this trend, or or I want to be part of this group, or whatever it was like. I'm just am who I am. But I think that there's been a lot, of, a lot of personal development work. That I've done is a lot of coaching and a lot of just exploration let's call it like really looking for connection, and what I have learned is that I can't un-listen to it number one. But the more that I listen to those how you call them whispers, it's like I'm just being led and if I ignore it, things become harder.
Speaker 1:And I'll give you one example. This happened to me last week. This never happens to me, mind you. I was on a call with somebody and she was like a potential client and not quite in the place where she could invest, and my gut, jesse, was like you need to give this person your program. Like never happens, maybe once a year.
Speaker 2:Right right.
Speaker 1:Once every two years, and I was like you know what? I need to enroll you into the program. I can't even explain it, I could feel it in my throat. It was like you need to do this and so I have to trust that I can't move away from it. I can't even explain it, but it's something that I've definitely developed and I'm very in tune with and I follow it, Always in tune with and I follow it always. I always follow it, Even if it doesn't make sense in the moment. I think that for me, just having so much connection with God spirituality that is just makes it stronger and I pray for it too. It's like, just and tell me what to do and I will do it. Like, whatever you tell me to do, I will freaking do it, I will follow your lead. So I try to just build on that like, build on that evidence of that of like. Whenever I do this, look at then what happens and how much abundance shows up.
Speaker 2:Yes, yeah, oh, amazing, and, and so thank you, cause now I'm not the only one. What I think you said that is is key, that I want people to hear like listeners out there. All of us have been in a space where we put in a ton of time and a ton of effort and a ton of energy and we're fighting, running uphill all the time, and it doesn't have to be that way. Like you said, all I have to do is allow myself to be led and it just happens. It's frictionless. It may not make sense in the moment, but on the long term, it's amazing. Like it's clear, it's easy, but we have to create the conditions for us to receive.
Speaker 2:Part of that is like taking care of yourself and maintaining your connections with your people, your spirituality, all of the things, and so I guess the main point is folks out there, if you're experiencing a lot of friction, maybe you're not listening to the whispers enough, or that guiding light, or whatever you need to call it. I call it the whispers. It just makes more sense for me. Okay, so you listened to you, you followed your intuition and your gut. You made the change. No more Ursula, pluto, ariel. That's all we're going to be talking about now. What was the impact in terms of your clientele and operating your business? What was that shift for you? It was really powerful.
Speaker 1:It was powerful in many different ways. So the first thing is that I would get messages from people telling me like, for example, I wrote a post about how my audience was filled with action takers, how my ideal clients were action takers who are not afraid to do the work, and immediately I got a DM from somebody like that is me a hundred percent, you're speaking to me, that is exactly how I am. And she literally enrolled that same week. So I had people who were showing up from just different level of people, people that were much more ready. I felt like I was attracting more experts. It wasn't so much about how much knowledge they had, but it was about the drive within them and, like I'm ready, it was a mindset thing. So that started happening a lot Like the level of people that we were attracting, the amount of people that would come in and pay in full versus doing payment plans and like little things like that. But then that also meant for me and this was the pain in the butt part, though that it was like okay, if I'm attracting a different caliber of person who has these different expectations less handholding, much more resourceful, much more action takers I need to make sure that my program is really tailored for those people, which meant that then I had to rerecord everything, oh everything. I had all these videos, I had all these things and I had all these processes. I had to redo everything because now it's like, okay, if I'm talking to an action taker, I can't give them 20 videos. Sure, they're going to watch them, but I need to make sure that it's much more actionable. And if I'm talking to people that are much smarter, I can't come in here and talk about like, let's do an ideal client avatar exercise. I'm assuming that you already know how to do that, that you've already done that before, because this is what I do is not beginner messaging stuff, it's much more. I have a mind that says like I feel like I just got a master's degree in messaging. It was like super advanced. So all of the stuff that felt to beginner, I just moved it into like a course, like a self-study course that I have for people I want to find uncover the foundations of messaging right.
Speaker 1:I really needed to make sure that all of it sounded like I've never heard of anybody talk about this before. So even my concept of who my audience is changed from. Okay, I'm speaking to, I'm not doing the Ursula. I used to say I'm speaking to the ready to invest clients, and now I'm talking to power buyer. That's who my audience is, and so everything is structured around. How do we speak to power buyers? And so I had to look at everything and look at my funnels and my content and make sure that all of it was like matching, from the words in my ad copy to the landing page, to the webinar, to the email, to the text message, to everything needed to be really aligned. It's a lot of work. It was a lot of work. Yeah, I mean it took, and it still happens to this day. It continues to evolve, but it was really worth it, cause now it's like the, the people. Obviously we still attract people who won't buy, right? I mean, I'm not, I don't have a hundred percent conversion rate?
Speaker 1:That would be insane. It would be nice, it would be insane. But the great majority of people who I attract are like I'm ready, and when they enroll, they get results, they take action. Their business is like oh, I've created this concept, this thing, that is my thing, and people pay attention and so it's like it changes their businesses too.
Speaker 2:Oh, my goodness, oh, I love. Thank you for like sharing that insight. What I want to make sure people don't miss is you got clarity and shifted and it's helped you with your clientele. You're helping them do amazing things, but there was work all the way through from when you first started. There's still work. The work never stops people. That's what I'm trying to tell you. The work never stops because clearly, you've invested in yourself. You sought out, you got coaches, you got I'm sure you probably signed up for different seminars and different things. Some was really valuable, Some was not.
Speaker 2:What kind of advice or pointers except for, of course, sign up with Fabi. What pointers would you give folks in terms of like they're in the market and they're looking to maybe introductory, what should they watch out for? I'll give some little more context. I've signed up for a couple in the past, for a couple calls, coaching calls or whatever and it was horrible, Like yes, it was another human being, but they read their script and that was the end of the call. And I'm like bro, it was another human being, but they read their script and that was the end of the call. And I'm like bro, you could have sent me an email with the video link for that, Like that was just not okay, Using that as the low mark, the low watermark. What are some things that folks need to kind of be thinking about or watch out for when they're seeking to make those early investments in themselves?
Speaker 1:I feel like there's a few things that we can unpack. Oftentimes we get sucked into the picture that people paint for us and we don't really think about in terms of investing. We'll talk about the coaching call, but we'll also talk about investing. We'll talk about the coaching call, but we'll also talk about investing.
Speaker 1:Okay, ooh, this person says that I'm going to get 10 new clients this month or this week. Ooh, this is exciting, let me sign. That's exactly what I want. But you don't really stop to think about does the business model make sense for me? Do I actually see myself following that business model? And so I have invested in things because of that in the past. And then I'm like do I actually want to be DMing people all day? Does that system really resonate with me? I don't think so, and it's really discerning into okay, what am I actually buying into? Do I really want this business model for myself? And then, in terms of, like that sales process, I do think that it's really important for you to build connection. So for me, for example, the way that we structure our sales processes before we do a sales call, I do a 15 minute call that I like to call brand message assessment. I've also call it brand audit and so what I do in that call is that I will look at people's messaging and I will literally rewrite it for them on the call and I'll tell you okay, here's what I would do if I were you. Here's how I would communicate. And I walk them through like here are the gaps, these are the things that you're missing, what you're doing wrong. And so at the end of that call, if that person's a good fit and they're interested, that's when I invite them on a sales call. But and they're interested, that's when I invite them on a sales call. But it's a super precise approach.
Speaker 1:Obviously, there's a lot of strategy behind what I'm doing, but also, in part, for me is to avoid what you were talking about before. I value connection and what I realized as well is that power buyers value connection too. So people that are like oh, I want to sign a C-suite person, like a CEO of a company as a client, or I want to sign an executive leader, or I want to sign a whatever these are people that are not stupid. They're not going to fall for transaction-based marketing where it's like your number, like your cattle, right. What I find is that the more that you give them touch points where they you get to build relationships with the person, the more likely that they are to buy. So in my case, that's why I do the 15 minute call in part. There's again, there's lots of other reasons why there's a lot of strategy behind that. I'm also doing it to show people, like, what the problem is. I'll explain that afterwards. But then also from there, when they move into the sales call, which isn't with me, they've I've already built such a powerful connection. It's easier for them to buy.
Speaker 1:Um, the other thing, so and so we looking at like, when you're going through that process of I'm thinking and investing, does this person actually care about me? Is an important question to answer, right? Or just a number for them. Am I going to be treated like yeah, I don't know, like they just want me to buy and they're pressuring me to buy and they're giving me information. They're not really telling me much, they're just giving me claims and promises Mega red flag.
Speaker 1:The other thing for me is one of the important things that I tell people through the work that I do is that most people have a messaging problem, not a marketing problem. Most people think that it's marketing. So they're like let me get more leads or let me get more visibility, or let me start running ads, or let me do LinkedIn or TikTok or YouTube or whatever, hire appointment setters or whatever. But that's not the problem. The problem is that your message is going to speak to the wrong people. So if you're just focusing on marketing, you're going to keep on attracting the wrong people, no matter what strategy you use. You're just amplifying a broken message.
Speaker 1:If you were in a place where you don't have a solid message, investing in marketing is a way. It's not that it's a waste of money, but you're going to leak so much money. It's going to be really expensive for you to scale. So I always recommend that you invest in messaging, not first, but like whether you're beginning in your business or whether you're like have a million dollar company, I don't know whatever it is like. Have a million dollar company, I don't know whatever it is it's. You really need to take a close look at your message to make sure that when you put gasoline into it and invest in marketing, it's spent on the right people, Like you're bringing the right people in, and so your conversion rates are higher too.
Speaker 2:So oh yeah, oh my God. The phrase you said is you're just amplifying a broken message. Yeah, that is powerful. Because how many of us do that? Some of the work I do is coaching, continuous improvement and deployment of change within organizations, and I'm just telling you right now, I steal that.
Speaker 1:Go for it.
Speaker 2:Because a lot of times when I'm talking with the decision makers or the influencers within the organization, I'm like, hey, I know we're going to do this, but let's get clear, what's the message, what's the story we're going to tell? We're like we want to get better. I'm like, no, no, no, no. Be careful, because if you start that, you're going to be sending a bad message. The way you said it was amplifying a broken message. It's not because we suck, it's because we want to dominate the market. Those are same, maybe, behaviors, but two totally different messages, exactly. So thank you for that. Now you touched on transactional and relational. What you described to me, the one-on-one 15-minute conversation, where you kind of give the assessment and say this is broken, fix this, think about that. I bet you get people saying like, why do you give away so much for free? But you also pointed out like the power buyers, they want contact time, they want actionable insight, and so in this transactional, relational buckets, have you always been a relational person?
Speaker 1:Yeah, but I've also developed it more. In the beginning, a little bit, but then, as I went through the process, more and more I was like I need to build more touch points with people. And so, for me, I was taught don't give your content away because people are going to run with it. And I came up with an analogy last year that I like and it's you can go and watch Taylor Swift's videos for free on YouTube, listen to her on Spotify for free, and yet look at what that world tour did, which was insanity, right.
Speaker 1:It's never going to be the same consuming free content than paid content. The 15 minute calls that I have are extremely valuable, but they're 15 minutes long. Your problem is not going to be solved in 15 minutes. Even if I give you which I give people copy for free, it's not going to be solved. And so the people that think that it will, please take it and use it. I hope it helps you, right? I hope it helps you because if you think that this is enough, you know okay, then you definitely need it, right. But the people that are smarter, they're like okay, help me do that. I want to learn how to do that. How do I implement that? What does that look like?
Speaker 1:For me, it's like a big mindset shift that has to change, versus just changing your copy. The work that I do isn't about just updating your website. It's about fundamentally changing how you view your audience and how you view your value and what you're selling, and so if you don't know how to do that, I can give you your whole website copy if you want whole website copy, if you want. You're still not going to make a difference, because when you go to a podcast interview or when you are creating a video, you have no clue what to do, and so for me it's like a great way of delivering value.
Speaker 1:And people feel like at the end of that call, like, wow, this is. I have a whole page of like testimonials that people have sent me about that call and they feel like, wow, this is amazing. But I again, like I know, you know, it's not enough. I mean, it's a great start but it's not going to fix the problem for you. So I'm all about like let's just give value. I would rather give, because here's one thing that I want to say, one thing that I realize is that money, at the end of the day, is an exchange of value, and so the more value that I give, the more value that I get. And so I would rather just give value for free, because I know, coming back to that spiritual part, I live in an abundance world and I believe in that, and so why am I holding back from sharing the best?
Speaker 1:Now, obviously, there are ways of doing that strategically, so that you don't end up attracting people that are like, great, thank you Bye, which you don't want to do. And I can even tell you the exact number. It's January 14th, so the month is just getting started, and this month I want to tell you the exact number, so you know I'll open it up this month, even though I'm giving away content for free and that call I've had. Where is it? 80% of the people book sales calls regardless. So I'm giving you free content. I'm telling you at the end of the call this is a sales call that you're going to have. They're going to walk you through my process. They're going to walk you through the investment it is. There is an investment involved. Do you want to do a sales call? 80% of the people are like 100%, I want to do that call. What's the next step? How do I enroll? I mean, give away value for free 80% is phenomenal, that's an outstanding result.
Speaker 2:Congratulations. And again, folks, if you didn't catch it, if you didn't hear, it was a result of providing and delivering value for free a human with another human to serve somebody else. And then the 80% happened.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I love how you said that, because that's the problem. Problem is that we all want to automate everything, whether it's through bots or AI, or people in the Philippines that are sending a thousand Ds per day, or whatever. We all want to automate everything, but power buyers are not. I mean, you can automate pieces of the process, of course, like you can like. For example, what happens is that after somebody does the 15 minute call with me, they get a series of text messages from me and a series of emails from me that are nurturing them even more, but they had the call with me already and so, and then they have the call with my team as well, and there's a lot of pieces in there that are really built purposefully, but you can't automate actual connection and real relationships. You can't.
Speaker 2:I'm laughing because, you know, since chat, gppt and all these other things have become more and more popular or more used, I see people using it to fill this connection gap and it's like no, no, no, flip it. Yeah, use it to automate all of the stuff that keeps you from connecting so that you can connect more, right? I?
Speaker 1:mean you can tell. You can tell when posts are written by AI, comments are written by AI. It's like, okay, dude, you're wasting your time, right, it's not going to make a difference.
Speaker 2:Right, right, oh, my God, it's so, so awesome. Okay, so you transitioned the angle of mastery, had to redesign your whole business. You started attracting power buyers. You're now serving people and helping them attract power buyers. What are some? Because everybody thinks they want a power buyer. Until they get a power buyer, what are some of the things that people that want to have that power buyer as their client that they need to have in order, otherwise it ain't going to happen for long-term.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there's one more piece of the equation. I'll tell you what it is after I answer your question. So, basically, it's really recognizing within your content whether that is your program or how your framework, your methods, whatever it's looking at. Well, does everything make sense for this audience or do I have to change something? Or is there something here that it needs to shift within what I'm doing to make sure that it's serving them? The process has to be really clean, meaning that message has to be congruent everywhere, otherwise you can lose people in the process. But it's more about mindset. It's also about, like, really believing that you can serve them.
Speaker 1:One thing that I often tell my clients and it's a phrase that I often use it's this idea that your capacity to make sales comes down to your capacity to receive clients. What that means is that oftentimes we're like I want more clients and I want to make more money. I want, but you don't have either the systems in place or you don't have. Bringing in more clients would be a real nightmare for you, and so for me, for example, I value my time a lot, and so I have three kids and I work from 11 to three. That's it Monday through Thursday.
Speaker 1:On Fridays I schedule out emails but I don't have any meetings or anything else. There are days when I go a little bit over three. For the most part, I work from 11 to three. At three o'clock I go out, I pick up my kids from school and I spend the afternoon with them doing homework and whatever, and that's it Like. That is that's something I really value. If I'm in a place where I say, okay, I want to grow my business, I want to bring in more clients, I need to make sure that my program or the container can fit more people, without meaning that now I'm working until 10 PM or I worked earlier because those times are like that for a reason.
Speaker 1:Like I go to the gym in the morning, it's something that I value, I have like my morning routine and something that I value, and so that's why I start work at 11. And having the space built within your business, the support that you need if that's what matters, or whatever, to make sure that you can receive more is what matters most. So that's kind of what I would say.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love like this, the influx of work or backlog revenue whatever language you like to use that you think you want. As soon as you get it, it's going to surface the problems in your system and that's not a bad thing. But, like when you're working with power buyers, you need to fix it fast. So ready to fix it?
Speaker 1:but it's a good challenge too, because it's like then you have to be like. You know, I had a client that I work with at the end of last year, for example, who was like a badass, like I was like yeah oh my, how did I even attract this person?
Speaker 1:you spoke at the World Economic Forum or World Business Forum, I think it's called in Spain and had multiple PhDs, and she was like I need your help. And I'm like, okay, but then what happens is that when I serve clients that are like that, that are that have a lot of knowledge, a lot of understanding of a lot of different things.
Speaker 1:What that does for me is that it pushes me to be like okay, let me look at my program. How do I make sure that this is going to serve that person? Or for her? In her case, she was a one-on-one client, so I write her messaging for her and all these different things. I need to make sure that this blows her away, that she's like wow, right. So I just worked that much harder, but in that process I create new frameworks and ideas and stuff like that too, which is awesome too. So amazing.
Speaker 2:So there's the added benefit you attract the power buyers and, as a result of supporting them and serving them, you got to get better. So their expectations and their performance drives you to get better, and it's this like virtuous cycle of improvement in service. Okay, what pieces of the equation have we missed?
Speaker 1:Okay. So the first part for me was speaking to the power buyers. That's the first thing that changed, and so once I was like, wait a minute, I can't do the Ursula anymore, I need to speak to the power buyers, and I changed that. The next piece was okay, now that I have a track that I'm speaking more to these people, how do I really catch their attention even more? And that's when the angle of mastery concept was developed.
Speaker 1:But then the third part in this third part is the thing that I came up with last year is something that I like to call the need to have formula, which is turning what you do into a need to have, because it's like I can sell you into this concept. But how do I make sure that it feels like a need to have versus a nice to have, need to have versus a nice to have? And what I find is that most people, the way that they communicate what they do, sounds like a nice to have. It would be nice for me to invest in leadership in whatever coaching, spiritual coaching relationship. A consultant would be nice. Do I need to spend this money? Wow, and so it's. How do you turn what you do into a need to have. One of the things that I tell people is that for a certain audience, a $50,000 Hermes bag is a need to have right.
Speaker 1:Sure All communication everything becomes a need to have if you know how to communicate it and articulate it effectively. So for me, that next part of that equation was okay, we know we're speaking to power buyers, we have this angle of mastery that we're selling, but how do we make sure that what I do really feels like I need that? Not from a place of neediness, because that's Ursula's right, but from a place of like no, no, no, I need to have that, that's what I'm looking for. And so that was the next part of that equation for me. That was what I spent a lot of last year developing that framework around that, and I call it the need to have formula. It's like the whole system for turning what you do into a real need to have in terms of your communication, but then also looking at the program as well and making sure that what you're selling is like kind of coming back to what we were seeing before truly serving that audience and removing the excess so that it feels genuinely like I need that.
Speaker 1:So that was the last part.
Speaker 2:I think that's just like the uppercut right, like that's the knockout punch there. How much do your clients, or people in general, struggle, from a mindset perspective, in messaging their services as a need to have? Do you find that to be like a common sticking point with your clients?
Speaker 1:Sometimes I think that what happens is that when you go through the process, that process overcomes that objection, because when you're speaking to the power buyer versus the Ursula people, then you understand that your work is a need to have for them, and so, therefore, it becomes really easy to show them no, no, no. It is obviously. I think that it comes up more when people are newer, like two, two, new. You're going to feel like what? But but still, even in that case, it there it's. It's always a need to have when you're selling it to the right people. It's not a need to have for you to sell, kind of coming back to what we were talking about before something to somebody that is like I need to sell my car to buy this Unless you're selling them a new car Right right, going to afford it.
Speaker 1:Who have the mindset we're going to take action? Who are those people? And so it doesn't. There's not as much of an issue, mindset wise, unless you're like two, two new is what I would say.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, that makes sense and I could see that the key point, folks, if you didn't catch it is going through the process that you teach to your system. The service that you provide helps people get there. So if you're like me in that you're really good at advocating for the people you know and telling everybody how amazing they are and you stink at helping people know how amazing you are, this system or this process helps you overcome that. Whatever we'll just call it friction, whatever that friction is, which is powerful because it's an uncomfortable thing. A lot of us have hangovers from the way we were brought up, the way we were raised and all these funky things. But if the process fixed that, double, double awesomeness, Okay. So I got one last question for you. But before I ask that question, if there's a power buyer up now, how do they get ahold of you? What's the best way for the power buyers to get ahold of you?
Speaker 1:And for the you know, the curious, the interested people do you have two ways that they can connect with you. So two things that we can do. The first one is the, the brand message assessment that I mentioned, and so you go to brand message sessioncom to be able to book that. It isn't a sales call, it's a 15 minute super value-based call. I will take a look at your messaging myself. So it's not even with somebody else, it's with me and cause people sometimes are like wait, it's you, yeah, it's me, and I will write the messaging for you. So brandmessagesessioncom. And then, if you want to go deeper into the concepts that we talked about today power buyers, angle of mastery, the need to have formula, what that process looks like. More, I have a training at readytoinvestclientscom. I need to upgrade, update that to say powerbuyerscom, but right now it's readytoinvestclicom, ready to investclanscom, and that's where you're going to find that training, where I go a little bit deeper into explaining these concepts and how they show up in your business. And so that's another way to go.
Speaker 2:Awesome, and you can follow you on LinkedIn and. Youtube. I found you on LinkedIn Beautiful, great messages, love the video, and I just discovered that you had a youtube channel, so of course, I got.
Speaker 1:You're gonna have to look at the description and the episode to learn how to type that, but everywhere, basically yes, and we'll make sure, folks, the links are going to be down in the description and all the wonderfulness.
Speaker 2:You're ready for the last softball question.
Speaker 1:Okay, let's see.
Speaker 2:Now you clearly have an understanding of abundance and you follow your intuition and the whispers. You're about service, You're about connection and you've been super gracious with your time and connecting with me on the LinkedIn and then talking now. So I'm like excited about what your answer is going to be. What is the promise you are intended to be?
Speaker 1:That's a great question, very easy, quick question to answer. Well, I think that for me, what immediately comes up and what has come up in the past not with a similar question, because I haven't been asked that but it's about helping people create the message that matters to them, and for me, that's what it's been about. It's about really discovering what truly matters to me what, what do I want to know, be known for? But it's beyond that. It's what matters right, and so that's what I'm here to do and that's what matters to me. It's helping people create the message that matters to them, so that you're uplifting everybody else and you're uplifting yourself in that process, which I think, ultimately, is what we all want to do. It's like let's raise the conversation everywhere, internally first, hello, but then externally as well, through the content that you're creating, through the work that you're putting out there, through the people that you're serving, through everything that you do and who you help and how you impact lives.
Speaker 2:And I think it's really. It comes down to that message that matters part. Oh my God, I knew it Like serving others. As one grows, we all grow. Amazing, did you have fun?
Speaker 1:That was awesome. That was super fun. Did you have fun? I gave it all. Oh, my goodness, that was awesome. Jesse, thank you so much.