Learnings and Missteps
The Learnings and Missteps Podcast is about unconventional roads to success and the life lessons learned along the way.
You will find a library of interviews packed with actionable take aways that you can apply as you progress on your career path.
Through these interviews you will learn about the buttons you can push to be a better leader, launch a business, and build your influence.
Find yourself in their stories and know that your path is still ahead of you.
Learnings and Missteps
Elevate Your Why: A Conversation with Pansy Romo
What drives someone to rise from mechanical trades to vice president multiple times? For Pansy Romo of InTech Mechanical, the answer lies not in credentials or connections, but in authentic servant leadership and an unwavering commitment to valuing people.
This conversation delves into Pansy's remarkable journey—one that began without a college degree but flourished through intentional relationship-building and genuine appreciation for others. "When you invest in people and value them truly for no other reason than they are people and matter, everything else comes as a byproduct," she shares, revealing the philosophy that's guided her ascent in an industry not always known for prioritizing human connection.
Particularly fascinating is Pansy's perspective on career transitions and setbacks. Rather than viewing career progression as linear, she embraces the zigzags, including moments when "doors closed on purpose"—situations that initially seemed like failures but eventually revealed themselves as redirections toward greater opportunities. Her transition from trade-specific work to broader general contractor responsibilities demonstrates how vulnerability, resourcefulness, and willingness to learn can transform apparent limitations into strengths.
For leaders struggling with talent retention in today's competitive market, Pansy offers a compelling alternative to simply competing on compensation. When organizations demonstrate genuine interest in employees as complete human beings rather than mere contributors to dashboards, they create magnetic cultures where discretionary effort flows naturally. As she puts it, "Titles and authority are needed for business, but that's not how I show up every day—we're all trying to advance the ball together, just with different responsibilities."
Ready to transform your leadership approach? Listen now to discover how being a "light to others" can create both personal fulfillment and organizational success.
Connect with Pansy
https://www.linkedin.com/in/pansy-romo-leed-ap-42b49818/
Make yourself a priority and get more done: https://www.depthbuilder.com/do-the-damn-thing
Download a PDF copy of Becoming the Promise You are Intended to Be
https://www.depthbuilder.com/books
Why do you want to elevate and how are you going to elevate? In your own way, being your authentic self.
Speaker 2:What is going on L&M family? Welcome back for another conversation. I have like a super, super rock star for you today. She is the vice president of InTech Mechanical and it's not the first time. She's been in a VP role a couple of times, maybe even a few, there might be some. I didn't find stalking her on LinkedIn and Intech.
Speaker 2:In case you're wondering, intech Mechanical is a full service contractor serving the North California region, so she's out there in NorCal with all the fancy people, the beautiful weather and all the amenities that most of us wish we had every day. Her name is Ms Pansy Romo and I got to connect with her on LinkedIn. She's a powerhouse, she don't mess around and I'm excited to learn, like the details about how she got to, where she's at and all those beautiful things. But before we get to that point, if this is your first time here, this is the Learnings and Missteps podcast, where you get to see how amazing human beings just like you are sharing their gifts and talents to leave the world better than they found it. I am Jesse, your selfish servant, and let's get to know Ms Pansy. Ms Pansy, how are you?
Speaker 1:Good, I'm doing great in beautiful Northern California, the sun's shining and everything is good.
Speaker 2:It's always perfect up there, oh my goodness. So where exactly is Intay Is in taste like Sacramento, we're just outside of Sacramento.
Speaker 1:We're in Roseville, okay, 30 minutes outside of Sacramento, but still capital city, sacramento region yeah, I was in Sacramento.
Speaker 2:hell, it's probably been six or eight months now. I started in Sacramento and I went all the way down to San Diego and I tried to take the what is it? The highway one or the one, but there was part of it was blocked off so I had to take a reroute and that was boring, like the worst reroute.
Speaker 1:I went through the central Valley, bakersfield and all the eggs yeah.
Speaker 2:Oh, it was like oh, this is so hard, I should have just got a plane. Anyways, it was a good adventure. I think I stayed the night in Anaheim and then I finished, the next morning I drove down to San Diego. I think that was October.
Speaker 1:Southern California in October is still nice, though.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, it was amazing. Okay, so I got a super simple question. Oh yeah, it was amazing.
Speaker 1:Okay. So I got a super simple question how do you water your why? Wow, that's a. That's not a simple question, but it's important, though. I think it's a combination of just being in my own thoughts and reminding myself what is my why and how my why might impact other people and help elevate their life, especially when things get difficult, just remembering that nothing that I do is about me. It's about other people, and that watering process, I think, is a combination of thoughts. That watering process, I think, is a combination of thoughts engagement with people, seeing how their lives start to flourish, learning from other people too I'm a mentor for Placer County here and engaging with those young ladies and giving them some wisdom and then having them feed some wisdom back to me, even at their age and their career stage, helps me water my why.
Speaker 2:Oh, I love it. I stole that off of one of your posts on LinkedIn. So this appreciation for people, where does that come from?
Speaker 1:Probably just because I didn't feel appreciated growing up. So I think it's just a personal life experience. Really, I didn't feel that growing up and then, kind of, as I got more engaged in business and I started to realize how much I love people, all it did was just skyrocket from there. Like I always was engaged with a lot of different groups growing up, had a lot of friends I love spending time with people but then as I got in the business world and I really saw, like you know, what I could help people, it just sparked something that aligned with the core values I already had as a person.
Speaker 2:Oh, I got it Okay. So it was like a need that you have and then the world of business kind of became the venue for you to source and fill that need. And I don't know, am I wrong? Because I'm just like a solo operator here, I don't have a real job, I don't wear pants maybe once a week. But am I wrong that investing in and valuing people is a good business decision?
Speaker 1:Absolutely, I mean. I think the most important piece, though, is when you invest in people and value them truly for no other reason other than they are people and they matter. Everything else that comes as a result of that is a byproduct of investing in valuing people.
Speaker 2:Oh, I love it. I love it. You're talking, my love language.
Speaker 1:Yeah, nothing in return should be expected. Things happen as a natural, as a general rule, but nothing in return should be expected. And then what is returned to you will be more than you ever expected.
Speaker 2:Oh, my goodness. So it's like give without expectation, serve, share, connect, appreciate, because it's the right thing to do.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:And then miracles happen on the backside.
Speaker 1:Absolutely.
Speaker 2:Yes, oh, my God, you know, I've been living that, and now, full disclosure. I've only been living that experience we'll say about eight, maybe nine years, and I'm not 19. So I spent a lot of my years doing it the other way Super transactional, always demanding or expecting something in return, undervaluing relationships and it was hard, like it sucked. It was not fun, it took all the joy and energy out of me, but I finally saw the way now.
Speaker 2:What's interesting, though, is back when I was operating that way, there were a lot of people in at levels in the companies I was at. They operated that way, so I'm like well, if I want to get there, this is how I need to behave. Like it was I'm not blaming them right like I was the one that decided to be a jerk, but the signals around me were saying this is how to get to where you want, and so I'm wondering in your path, did you see the same thing, or did you just have like amazing people that modeled that kind of behavior and made it easy for you to adapt to that?
Speaker 1:No, I saw the same thing that you did Over time. Things have changed. Over time, things have changed, and we've, as a society, even and especially as a business community, we've evolved, I think, on so many levels to figure out that the people are the most important. Even if you never believed that before or never found that valuable, you're looking at people in a different way, because now we have multi-generations in businesses, we all have kids, that some of us have kids that are the same age as people that work for us. For you to maintain a transactional approach today, you're intentionally doing that.
Speaker 1:Yes, in my opinion, and I think I saw leaders. I'm glad I had leaders that didn't model for me what I wanted to be modeling for people, because they taught me what not to do, and legitimately, it is painful as it was back then they taught me how I did not want to be as a leader, and I took those things and I just use them to kind of propel myself not to swing the pendulum all the way. The other way, though, because you still have to hold people accountable, but at the same time, you don't have to be a jerk about it. You could be direct, but you can be respectful.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I feel like you're getting after me for my past.
Speaker 1:No, not at all. I have jerk moments too. Don't get me wrong, I'm not perfect.
Speaker 2:But I got it Okay, so you started. I mean again, like I said, I was stalking on LinkedIn and from my just a quick glance I made at your entry into the workforce after university, you've progressed relatively quickly to VP roles, roles, and it kind of like, wherever you go, you shoot to, you shoot up the ladder yeah, I've been very fortunate that the my style of how I show up has helped me in my career and also people opening doors recognizing that there's talent there.
Speaker 1:But I didn't graduate. I dropped out of college, listed on. There is no degree, but ultimately just kind of the culturally the way I was raised, how I show up as a person. That matters because people sometimes will pay attention and see that you have potential and ethic and give you opportunities that you might not get otherwise. So I had a mix right.
Speaker 1:I had to work really hard back when I first started in construction because it was a good old boys game. Many women and the women that were there were office staff, you know, at a very low level office staff, you know, at a very low level. And so I just I set an ambition way back when and I just kept working to it and connecting with people and I networked a lot and I listened to people. That's what I tried to do for a really long time is what are they saying? Why are they saying it and how does it impact my day-to-day? How can I leverage what they're doing? If there was benefit there of like they're good leaders, they speak well, they say the right things. They don't just talk for no reason. Those are the kind of things that I tried to pay attention to, because there are people that just talk for no reason.
Speaker 2:Yes, the people that I got two favorites and I'm going to talk smack, maybe I'll get canceled. I don't care the two folks. They drive me up the damn wall and it's part of the reason why I don't have a real job, because they would drive me crazy. One is the topper right. No matter what you do, what vacation you've taken, what diet you're trying, they're doing it and they've done it and they're doing a better one.
Speaker 2:You come across people like that and then so those are. I see those out in the wild, not just in the workplace, but the other ones are the bobbleheads. And these they lurk in meetings, especially when there's people with a lot of influence and authority. And when I say bobbleheads, what I mean is when the person with the most authority in the room says something, they go out of their way to repeat it using different words and say I agree, and oh, that's such a great point. And they're just bobbing their head. Yeah, it's probably like all you got to do is nod, your head Shut up. We're here to make progress on a thing, not hear how much you agree with the most popular person in the room. Do they have those in California too?
Speaker 1:Yes. It's everywhere, right In society, everybody's always trying to get to that next level, and we don't all know healthy ways to do it. In my opinion, I agree.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we've been modeled.
Speaker 1:the way that you get advancement is to be a bobblehead, and that's not really valuable is to be a bobblehead and that's not really valuable. You can advance. I've seen it. There's plenty of people pass me by over the years because they were that and it was frustrating. Right, when you're coming up you know you're putting in the effort but at the end of the day it's set all that aside. Why do you want to elevate and how are you want to elevate and how are you going to elevate? In your own way, being your authentic self.
Speaker 2:We got to do the L&M family member shout out, and this one goes to Ms Claudia Garcia. Claudia took the time to send me this awesome message. She says I was so happy to be able to attend this session. The way it was organized and conducted, the lessons learned and also the realization of how much more I still need to learn and improve and, best of all, the humanity behind it all was incredible. Thank you all again. And so Claudia was one of the early victims of the Do the Damn Thing Time Mastery Workshop and clearly I didn't disappoint her or run her off, because she took the time to send me that nice note.
Speaker 2:So, folks out there, if you take the time, or when you take the time to send me a comment, a share, a star, whatever, please do so, because it helps me know that somebody's listening and I get the opportunity to shout you out in the future. Ok, so two things like what you just said why and how are you going to do it? Staying true to you, playing your game, running your plays, super, super powerful. You also said earlier that you set an intention for yourself way back when. So for the youngling that's listening right now, what does that look like. What is the, let's say, the ingredients to setting an intention for whatever future they want to build for themselves?
Speaker 1:I think it comes down to what are you passionate about that? You don't have all the gifts and skills that you're going to need when you set that intention and there's going to be a long it's. You're running a marathon, and so those checkpoints are going to change over time. They're going to be difficult. You're going to need stamina. You're going to need someone in your corner, whether that's your sister, brother, best friend, spouse, whoever, or a mentor, because you need someone to keep you going. You're going to get in the quit zone more times than you can count.
Speaker 1:And also, it's not a straight line, right? We were just talking to these young ladies last night at this mentoring forum and it's like your career will never go on a straight line, and sometimes it's not. It's or all the time. Maybe it's not meant to. All of those different points in time that feel like failures or obstacles or frustrating. They all feed into the journey and you just have to roll with them and then make good decisions. When you see there's a roadblock that clearly is not meant for you, the door's closed on purpose, then you really have to sit back and go. Okay, my intention isn't changing. Maybe the place that I'm at needs to change. So, okay, my intention isn't changing. Maybe the place that I'm at needs to change.
Speaker 2:Or maybe my attitude needs to change. Okay, I want to dig into the doors closed on purpose. What does that mean?
Speaker 1:So I was at another mechanical years ago and we were going down the path of succession planning and I was one of the people that was in the succession plan and ultimately that didn't work out and today I know that was because the door was closed on purpose, not by me Got it.
Speaker 1:Closed on purpose, because I had a different purpose to fulfill and it wasn't there, even though it seemed like it was and I had put in all the work and I was vice president and I was running major parts of the organization. It was just not meant for me long term. Yeah, and you don't know that at the time, right, you don't know that until you get down the path and your journey goes in zigs and zags. And then you look back and you're like, well, clearly that's why things happen.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh yeah, yes. So here's. Here's how I'm trying to make sense of it, cause I'm slow. I think it happened Like in my head. I'm seeing two versions of the door closing on purpose. There's a metaphorical kind of perspective there, and then there's like for real, that people just decide you're not going to have this, and it doesn't matter what you do or how qualified, you are not going to have this. And that happens, so like it's a reality. And so what I think I heard you say is you're helping people understand, be prepared for that. And if it closes at one firm, that doesn't mean it's closed at every firm in the country. Find another one, a better place for you, that nurtures your gifts and talents and can help, or who appreciate talent. That was always my problem, pansy, like why can't they all just see my talent? They just couldn't, they couldn't see it. So now, metaphorically, when I hear the door closes on purpose, is it's not the biggest thing that's available for you? You need to get off the highway for a little bit because there's something bigger.
Speaker 1:I 100% agree, that's a great way to state it, because it ties back to even just how your job opportunities, I think, pop up. Sometimes you could be all the way at the top of an organization, let's say, and another opportunity comes up and maybe it's a step back in title, maybe even financially, but this opportunity that came to you is within a bigger organization and maybe there's more impact. And the going off the highway, like you said, is only for a short period of time, because there's something bigger like you said, is only for a short period of time, because there's something bigger.
Speaker 1:Yes, yes, and so you've experienced that Like I saw you like oh yeah, that's it. I did. Yeah, I took a step back and I'm glad because looking back those points in my journey helped me get to where I am today, and they were so valuable because it allowed me to step outside of what I already had thought my intention was. I didn't derail what my ultimate goal was, but it helped me see it from a different perspective and I feel like today that's one of the biggest gifts is I let my humility come to the surface for a bigger purpose, because to me like titles are needed for business.
Speaker 1:Titles and authority are needed for business, but that is not the way that I show up every day. I don't show up trying to have this big title and authority. It's no, we are all trying to advance the ball in the same way. We just have different responsibilities. Yes, some of them keep you up way late. We just have different responsibilities.
Speaker 2:Yes, some of them keep you up way late, whether you like it or not?
Speaker 1:I know I'm simplifying it a little bit for what I have on my plate, but at the end of the day, from a back to people, we're all people and everybody matters and everybody's valuable and we all have our different roles to play or different plays to make. But if you just keep that frame of reference, for me personally I think that's where I love to live oh, my goodness, okay.
Speaker 2:So you speak so clearly about these things and with like straight up confidence. Did you have a secret cheat sheet when you were at the middle school dances and said this is what I'm going to do. I've got this. I'm going to do this.
Speaker 1:Still in cars in middle school. I was not thinking about people. We'll go into all of that, but no, I know it's just. I mean I have had some really good people in my life that have helped me cultivate who I wanted to be. My character is what it is right. That's a God-given thing, I think. And cultivating that and being true to yourself and really putting yourself to the side not fake humility, but really putting yourself to the side, I think, takes other people to show you how to do that, different perspectives, and I've been pretty fortunate. I've had some really good people mentor me and coach me and help me develop over the years. Yeah, Okay.
Speaker 2:So mentors come up multiple times. You are actively committed to a mentoring group situation. I'll just say it. I've worked with amazing companies. So, similarly, I got lucky in that I worked with some really outstanding companies companies but we all know it don't matter how outstanding the company is, if your boss is a jerk, you're screwed. I got lucky with some outstanding bosses while I was working for those outstanding companies. Now, within those outstanding companies, they both had mentorship programs. It was formal and it was assigned. I'm going to mentor somebody and somebody is going to mentor me. And I'll just say straight up, it was a miserable experience because we had a meeting and they said okay, tell me what you need mentoring. I'm like I don't know. I don't even know you. Bro, Can we talk a little bit? My point in that is you understand, you've experienced the value of having a mentor. You've committed, on top of all your responsibilities and everything you have going on, to mentor others. So the question is how do you build the mentoring skill and what are you looking to contribute as a mentor?
Speaker 1:I think the first order of business is getting an understanding of who they are and where they want to go. And it doesn't have to be just business. It could be in life, right, because I didn't have a mentor in life and I wish I would have, because I wouldn't have made so many crazy, silly decisions, I wouldn't have been running the streets as much. But I think it's just understanding who they are and where they want to go, because asking those inquisitive questions first and foremost, rather than just dumping what you think is wisdom on somebody or your lived experience, is probably the best way to go, get to know them and really get to understand, like what drives them.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And then frame your mentoring engagement that way.
Speaker 2:Oh, I love it. I think I've said this to a bunch of people and everybody rolls their eyes at me because I'm wacko, right, but I've said this multiple times especially in the conditions that our industry is in right now, everybody is offering competitive pay and benefit. So if that's your sell, who cares? Because everybody is offering the same thing. I think, rather, what I'm seeing there's not a bunch of them and something tells me you're one of them the decision makers in organizations that figure out how to show appreciation in the whole human being, not just how they contribute to the dashboards and the KPIs, but like what their interests are as an individual, as a human being. I think those people I see them winning the talent game. They're winning the attraction and retention game and they're not spending money, they're just demonstrating interest and appreciation in the entire human being. And so when I hear you talking about mentoring, that's what I hear you doing, like it's not.
Speaker 2:This programmatic, gendized approach to having one-on-one conversation is let me get to know you. What's your feel, what's your flavor, what's your interest, what are the gaps you have, so that I can adjust and serve you appropriately. Am I smelling what you're cooking?
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're picking up what I'm laying down. Because that's exactly it Legit, it can't be contrived. That's what I like in the beginning. If you put people first with the right intentions, then the byproduct of a good business decision just naturally happens. You're not forcing it, it's not contrived. You're not trying to get a return, you just will. And on top of that you have fulfilled passionate high performers that have an environment that is, it leaves them bound over any, just any old paycheck. And then you carry that on into their family because if they come to a bad environment every day, they're going to take that home. And then it's a cycle that never stops and we all know what that looks like. And that is not. I don't like it ever.
Speaker 2:Yeah Well, so let's think of, let's like, take the human part out of it. That's expensive. If you're running a business, it's extremely expensive because if, let me say it this way, when I was that miserable apprentice or journeyman and pissed off and I'd like, I want, why did I go to work? To get the hell away from the house. Cause it sucked being at the house. Well, depends on which X you ask, but anyways.
Speaker 2:So to come to work and then also be treated like a disposable, consumable thing, my performance, like you, weren't going to get any of my discretionary effort. I was going to do precisely what you wanted, precisely the way you said you wanted it and that's it. But again, I had some amazing bosses along the way that I'm like man I'm going to, you gave me so much. By just demonstrating interest in me, you get everything. Like I'm going to contribute as much as I possibly can and take on more responsibility outside of my job description so that I can grow. But also because, man you're giving, you're pouring into me, so like I got to pay it back, and I think that's one I applaud you for, like you're already there. But that's what we need people to get, or maybe we don't. That way they're great. People can go to the leaders that already know how to do that. What do you think?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, yeah, I don't know that's a tough one, because I think it's a choice. I really believe that it's a choice.
Speaker 2:When you're in a leadership position.
Speaker 1:You're either making a choice to do one thing or the other, agreed, and again, if it's contrived, people will know yeah. But on the flip side of that, it's like people also have a good opportunity, like me and you said, you work hard enough, you put the effort in the right, people will get attracted to you and then they will open up opportunities for you because they have that leadership quality of hey, I want to see this person elevate. And if we could all do that. It's like that whole. What's that analogy of the pond, the rock in the pond and the ripples? It sounds corny but it's not.
Speaker 2:No, it's true, it's 100% true, and it just comes back in waves.
Speaker 1:Again, it took me a while to learn it, but I got it and I'm not stopping.
Speaker 2:Okay, you started your career, your working career with a mechanical contractor. Then you went to the dark side with the GC which I've done also and then you came back. You came back home to the mechanical contractor. So for the folks out there that don't know, let's start with what is a mechanical contractor?
Speaker 1:So in a building we do commercial HVAC, plumbing and piping. So we are the ones responsible for ventilation, indoor air quality, making sure you're comfortable, process piping, specialty gases, all of those fun things that live in every building.
Speaker 2:Oh, I love it, I love it.
Speaker 1:Did you know, that's my background.
Speaker 2:Also, I did not. So I'm a plumber. Oh you are. Oh yeah, I know it's hard to tell because I'm so handsome, but yes, I'm a plumber. Well, I shouldn't say I am, because if you look at my hands, I'm not a plumber anymore. But I came up with TD Industries mechanical contractor here in Texas. I was with them for 17 years and I was on that side of the business for about 20 years and every time I say mechanical contractor, people are like you work on cars? I'm like, no, let me tell you what it is.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I know it comes up all the time. Yeah, so you came up through the trades. I didn't know that.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, four years of apprenticeship got my journeyman license, med gas certification, master license. But again, where I'm at today is only evidence of the amazing leaders that I came across along the way. Right To to have advanced, to have started off as an apprentice, to be doing the things I'm doing and having sitting at the tables that I sit at that's not normal and it was because I had a lot of amazing people. I say a lot more than most. I had a lot of amazing people. I say a lot more than most. I've had a bunch of folks that really poured into me and I'm psychotic and obsessive. So I'm like hell, let me do a good job here. And they said hey man, here's this thing. I think you'll be good for this.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I've had that same thing. I think you'd be great at this. Have you ever thought about it? Let's talk about it. Yeah, when I went to the GC side, I ended up going with a lot of friends DPR was a client of mine, right, so I had a bunch of friends that work there but I had that same concern of, well, I'm mechanical, what about electrical and AV and fire alarm and all these things that I didn't know, even though I was very well established and they wanted me to come there and I knew it was a great move.
Speaker 1:It was that psychological piece of well, I'm not good enough for this and that's not the case, and I loved working there. It was such a great part of my experience and it gave me such a wider view of, but those people that were pouring into me. I had to call them and say I don't know about this, because I don't think I'm capable, and they're like, yes, you are. So then I'm like well, I can't let them down, so I need to figure this out.
Speaker 2:And so what did that look like for you? That and when I say what did it look like? Like it's backstory I had the same, similar transition. I left TD and so I had worked in San Antonio my whole life and so all the responsibility, network, et cetera was San Antonio's business unit based. The job I got was with Turner, general contractor, and all of a sudden I had regional responsibility, so like I didn't even know how to.
Speaker 2:I've been on a plane maybe three times before that. Now that's part of my job. I don't know if I could do this. So anyways, there was a lot going through my head and there was a lot of things that I did when I got there to deal with it. So my question to you is when you made that transition? Because going from a trade, like if you've been in the trade exclusively for most of your career, there's a certain perspective, maybe even opinion, you have about GCs, and it's just different. It's not the same you have about GCs, and it's just different. It's not the same. And so my question is this what did you anticipate that transition to be like?
Speaker 1:And then, what did you do to close the gap quickly? I anticipated it to be overwhelming because the spectrum is so much wider versus mechanical. Right, I'm paying attention to my things, making sure my stuff is accurate, and then you go into everything all the kids in the pool so I felt like, oh, this is going to be overwhelming and it was, but not in a bad way. So to close the gap, I literally just put my head down and dug in and was like I need to learn how to read a single line drawing. I need to anticipate what the Sparkies are going to tell me and be able to call BS, because I have to make sure that my team that I'm supporting hits the schedule, because I have to make sure that my team that I'm supporting hits the schedule and then I need to be able to recognize, like, from a cost perspective, where do they live?
Speaker 1:What's the framework? I literally just I guess. To sum it up, I wanted to be able to call BS and make sure I was the SME for every single trade I was responsible for, as quickly as possible.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and so that took what three or four days.
Speaker 1:It was a lot. It was a lot, a lot of late nights and just phoning a friend. I use my network too. Legit, I had so many friends in the industry. I had built a respect and reputation. I just phoned a friend all the time and I said this is what I'm seeing. Can you confirm that I'm on the right track? And I leveraged that a lot for the first probably six months.
Speaker 2:Oh, nice, okay. So just in case for the L&M family member out there that didn't catch it big leaps are possible and you don't have to. I highly recommend and I know Pansy just said it you best be ready to put your head down and learn your butt off Like it's going to. It's not. If you want to be mediocre, like, just go and do your nine to five, but if you want to excel, you got to put in time and you got to be resourceful, right. So when you say I reached out to my network, I see that as resourcefulness. You have a network. That is a resource that you didn't have. Like, you didn't let pride or shame get in the way of you getting what you needed so that you can be successful and excel in this whole new environment. Because in scale, it's a dramatically different scale of whatever right now. How about the like, the relationship part? I think it might be obvious because you're so people focused, but in terms of building credibility with your new tenured colleagues, what did that look like?
Speaker 1:I feel like I had a little bit of an advantage because in the business unit that I was in I already had long term relationships. So I already had a certain established relationship and respect level both ways me to them and them to me. But they're I mean there's they're national right, so there are, they're international, so there's all a bunch of people I met in different business units. I think that was more just. I tried to connect with them one-on-one and just share with them kind of the foundation that I had and make sure they knew that I was listening and that I understood what. My sure they knew that I was listening and that I understood what my responsibilities were and how I was going to help them. Really, I guess I wanted to just make sure they knew that I was solid and that I could be a trusted advisor for the things that they needed from me.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh, and that takes contact time, not bobbleheading, like actually delivering value and contact time. Oh my goodness. All right, now I know that you've got a path right. You had you sent an intention a long time ago. You were on the swing in third grade and said it's what I'm going to do. I'm going to be BPA at Intec in 2025.
Speaker 1:After I put someone in the face.
Speaker 2:Yes, After you put somebody in the face and popped a lock with the screwdriver. Like I remember the Monte Carlos that didn't have the window frames and the Camaros, so going to DPR in my head, I'm guessing that there was an intention, there was something you wanted to learn and develop, Otherwise you wouldn't have made the move. So what was that? Like you weren't doing it to get a job and work for a GC? I don't think. No, I wasn't Okay.
Speaker 1:And I had no reason to leave At the time. I had no reason to leave in tech. It was the culture that I liked. I respected the leaders here. But the piece of that setting the intention for me was how do I be the best? I want to be the best If I show up at a project, if I'm on a pursuit team, I want to be aware of everything else and have the right care and custody of how I need to be a collaborative team partner, and this opportunity opened that up for me.
Speaker 1:I didn't know that I would come back to the trade side. I really didn't think I would. I thought I was going to stay there because I loved it. It gave me a much wider range. I just enjoyed it a lot and I had a lot of really good people that I worked with and I got to be involved in a lot of different things. But it was really just that opportunity. When it opened up, it was like, man, I think I have so much more to add to our industry. I could do it here with people that I really love, with a culture that I really like. It kind of checked all the boxes for me and so much more. Legit was one of the best experiences that I think I will I got to have.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, amazing. So were there any superpowers or skills that grew exponentially while you were in that environment that maybe you weren't totally aware of until you got there? Oh, I got this thing. Where did that come from?
Speaker 1:I think picking up electrical was a shocker to me.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:It took a minute, yeah, understanding like the basics of electrical and I just didn't think I would catch it as quickly. But I really like it. Actually it's one of the things I miss about coming back on the mechanical side is that electrical piece. I really enjoyed it, maybe just kind of the background that I had and being able to transition into so much more than just M&P and being valuable and adding value to the teams was a little bit of a shocker for me. I just wasn't sure how that was going to go down and I picked up quite a bit of things that I didn't know before really quickly and just ran with them.
Speaker 2:Oh, I love it. Yeah, so I like to pull out and jessify it for the L&M family member out there. That's as slow as I am, and so, summary of there are some opportunities that are so big they're a little scary. Going from a trade to a GC is one of those Unless you're just super, super, ultra confident and a little delusional. But it's what my experience and I think what I heard you say is like going into that space it's a bigger pool that facilitates and wait, let me say this first Not every GC, because there's a lot of dirtbag GCs out there. I said it straight up, I've lived it. There's some great ones out there with great people, and so going into a bigger organization, a bigger opportunity, helps you expand your own awareness about what it is you can contribute and it creates kind of new like oh, wait, a minute, if I had that much more, what else is there? What more do I have? Did you have the same kind of experience? Absolutely.
Speaker 1:It forces you to look inside again and say well, I need to stretch myself even more. And then you just go.
Speaker 2:Go, oh damn.
Speaker 2:I did that I could do that Shoot. What else can I do? Yep, exactly Same happened for me, okay. So then you went. Now we're getting closer to the present. You went back to in-tech. Now, when I hear you speak, it's obvious that you care about people and you're real. I also hear some like serious business acumen, and I know a lot of people in the industry that they're great at managing a project. You probably know this. You were able to see it. Managing a project is like running a business, depending on what level of experience you have in the organization. But something tells me you could see that, and so what was it about running a business? How early did you see? That's what I want to do. That's what I want to learn how to do. That's what I want to do. Was that again? Was that like an early awareness, or did that kind of develop along the way?
Speaker 1:It was early awareness.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 1:What was happening when I first started was I was in a support role no surprise and I was watching these no disrespect, but all these men just run circles around me, career wise, even though I had equally good skill set. So the first intention was just that, well, I could manage these projects, not support behind the scenes. I can manage that project. So that was my first step of I need to get there. And then, as I started doing that and engaging with more people, then it was like I'm watching the leaders at that point now and I'm like picking up things that I think are good and valuable and seeing things that I'm not a fan of. And then I thought, well, number one, I enjoy all aspects of business. I love people. I'm good in terms of managing projects. If I take that to the next level, what kind of impact could I make on people? Because the financial part of it is important but it's not straight up just being real. Anybody who knows me will tell you this. That is not my main goal.
Speaker 1:I could pay my bills anywhere and really my whole thing was running a business gives me an opportunity to create an environment for people that they need. I didn't have or I want to see better.
Speaker 2:Amazing, and the cost was learning how to run a business. But for a greater purpose than making whatever, it is your 10%, 14% growth margin. It's funny when I talk to GCs and they talk about their margins, they're like we got like 3%, Well, you don't work. Why is trade's growth margin so high? Because we work. I don't know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but our risk is a lot higher At the end of the day we don't control all the variables. And so yeah, I mean legitimately too. Man, if that's your main focus in construction, especially as a trade partner, you are out to lunch because the risk reward can be a wild ride.
Speaker 2:Oh my, you know. So I get to hang out with a bunch of different construction companies. They bring me in to I don't know, be the class clown and entertain them, but I like to ask, always with the leaders it's like why are you in construction, and especially at the executive level? What I hear is to make money. We're here to make money. I'm here to make money and I'm like, really, if you wanted to make money, why the hell would you pick construction, like it has the most risk, super volatile, pain in the butt, difficult because of all the stakeholders. It is so damn hard to make the money and it takes so damn long to get the money.
Speaker 2:If you really wanted to make money, you could sell pictures of your feet on the internet. If that's what you're about, come on, let's be for real. I'm being goofy, but it's true. I say it all the time and my point is this it sounds good and it feels good make money. But when I hit them with that, a lot of them are like I never thought of it. Like exactly, and that's the point. You have to love something meaningful, otherwise it's no fun and clearly you're using it as it's a conduit. You see how you like how I threw the electrical thing in there. It's a conduit for you to serve people and create an environment for people to thrive, and all of that is tolerable because it affords or it creates a space for you to do amazing things for amazing people.
Speaker 1:Am I getting that right? It allows me to be a servant leader in a way that's meaningful to me and, of course, others. But, yeah, 100%. Again, everybody has to make money and that's why we do business, but never is it the number one thing. That's on my mind and to your point. It is hard to make it and collect it and it's a lot of brain damage. So I bet you, if you asked everybody and made them think of it differently, they would say the same that no, maybe they love it because people, because no day is the same, because it's a challenge, because all those different things.
Speaker 2:Yes, oh yeah. We just need to think about it and examine yourselves. And that's my point how can I help somebody examine their thinking so that they can improve or enhance their quality of life? Now, just in case, because I know some people are saying like man, where's Intech? I need to go fill out an application. Should I tell everybody, like no, you have all the workforce you need, y'all are full up, you don't need anybody you never turn down a conversation, right, I mean, we have a fantastic team and we're so grateful that we do.
Speaker 1:We're intentional about it. But yeah, I mean anybody who's got character wants to be a part of a good culture, loves to be a high performer and work hard and loves people. Yeah, send them our way people.
Speaker 2:yeah, send them our way. 10, 4 good. And I also want to say this for my, like my trades people out there, because we've all worked with miserable organizations, with miserable people. That's life, right like I, I experienced it when I was working fast food. I experienced it, and you ain't going to love every boss you ever have, but that doesn't mean that they all suck. And what I'm especially excited about is I've been able to capture evidence, your evidence, that there are amazing leaders out there running trade subcontractor organizations that create a culture where people can thrive. There's not enough of us, there's not enough of you, right? But you are living proof that it exists, and so I applaud you. I'm grateful to you for that, because I'm sure you've heard the stories. You experienced it yourself. There are some organizations that again, hell, if I knew I could like back in the 90s, if I could sell pictures of my feet, I would have, but that wasn't a thing back then. Now it is, and now I got a better gig, so it doesn't make sense.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it really does matter, Because when this opportunity came up, if the foundation of the company was not built on the core values and the culture that we have, I wouldn't even have considered taking this leap, and all this risk and becoming an owner and all those things would not even across my mind. Because what's the point?
Speaker 1:And being an owner like you are invested like money, like serious lack of sleep, like like all the things, but it's good. Yeah, challenge anybody out there to think about your people, think about the type of environment that you create, and how would you want your kids or your siblings or someone else to show up every day and deal with? That's where we spend the most of our time.
Speaker 2:Yep, amazing, amazing. Okay, I got the closing question coming up and, given how intentional and I just the best I could say is like, real right, like you remind me of, I got a group of friends that I went to middle school with here in San Antonio, tafoya, since sixth grade and we're still friends and the vibe with them is you're that, you're my kind of people, right, like experience, maybe a little.
Speaker 1:Oh, we, yeah, we got some similarities and definitely some same life experience same friends style yeah yeah.
Speaker 2:And so, because of all of that, I'm like, oh man, this answer is gonna be juicy. So you ready for the question? Oh, what is the promise you are intended to be?
Speaker 1:yes, I'm intended to be. Oh no, that's a tough one. I think, maybe a light to people that need it. Dang, you're going to make me emotional Gangsters. Don't cry, no, I know what's up with that. Why are you going to make me get out of my box? I mean, I think it's that, I think it's, I think it's what I said.
Speaker 2:Based on, on everything that you've shared so far and the way I see you show up, of course, on the internet. So this is super special. It's the second time we got to talk. I know I'm glad, me too but it's like you're already actively being a light to others by purposefully getting into a mentoring, we'll say, relationship. That's not imposed upon you. You chose to do that by intentionally picking the organization that you work with because of the culture that's there, by living to what's true to you. You're already a light sister, and so just keep getting brighter and let me know how I can contribute to that. I won't go any further because I don't want the mascara to run and prep to protect. Did you have fun?
Speaker 1:I did. Thank you so much. This is a good conversation and you just helped me water my why again. Yeah, I love it. I have jerk moments too. Don't get me wrong, I'm not perfect.
Speaker 2:But I got it Okay, so you started. I mean again, like I said, I was stalking on LinkedIn and from my just the quick glance I made at your entry into the workforce after university, you've progressed relatively quickly to VP roles and it kind of like, wherever you go, you shoot to, you shoot up the ladder, yeah.
Speaker 1:I've been very fortunate that my style of how I show up has helped me in my career and also people opening doors recognizing that there's talent there. But I didn't graduate. I dropped out of college, listed on. There is no degree.
Speaker 1:So, but ultimately just kind of the culturally, the way I was raised, how I show up as a person, that matters because people sometimes will pay attention and see that you have potential and ethic and give you opportunities that you might not get otherwise. So I had a mix right. I had to work really hard back when I first started in construction because it was a good old boys game.
Speaker 1:Many women and the women that were there were office staff, you know, at a very low level, and so I just I set an ambition way back when and I just kept working to it and connecting with people and I networked a lot and I listened to people. That's what I tried to do for a really long time is what are they saying, why are they saying it and how does it impact my day to day? How can I leverage what they're doing? If there was, if there was benefit there of like, they're good leaders, they speak well, they say the right things, they don't just talk for no reason. Those are the kind of things right that I tried to pay attention to, because there are people that just talk for no reason.
Speaker 2:Yes, the people that I got two favorites. And I'm going to talk smack, maybe I'll get canceled, I don't care. And I'm going to talk smack, maybe I'll get canceled, I don't care. There's two folks that they drive me up the damn wall and it's part of the reason why I don't have a real job, because they would drive me crazy. One is the topper right, like no matter what you do, what vacation you've taken, what diet you're trying, they're doing it and they've done it and they're doing a better one.
Speaker 2:You know you come across people like that and then so those are. You know, I see those out in the wild, not just in the workplace, right, but the other ones are the bobbleheads, like, and these they, they lurk in meetings, especially when there's people with a lot of influence and authority. And when I say bobbleheads, what I mean is when the person with the most authority in the room says something, they go out of their way to repeat it using different words and say I agree, I agree, and oh, that's such a great point, and they're just bobbing their head yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like, bro, like all you got to do is nod, your head Shut up, like we're here to make progress on a thing not hear how much you agree with the most popular person in the room. Do they have those in California too?
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah, I mean, I think it's. It's everywhere right In society. Everybody's always trying to get to that next level and we don't all know healthy ways to do it. In my opinion, I agree, advancement is to be a bobblehead and and that's not really valuable. You can advance. I've seen it. There are plenty of people pass me by over the years because they were that and it was frustrating. Right when you're coming up you know you're putting in the effort, but at the end of the day it's like set all that aside. Why do you want to elevate and how are you going to elevate in your own way, being your authentic self?
Speaker 2:So two things like what you just said why and how are you going to do it? Staying true to you right, playing your game, running your plays, super, super powerful. You also said earlier that you set an intention for yourself way back when Playing your game, running your plays, super, super powerful. You also said earlier that you set an intention for yourself way back when. So for, like the youngling that's listening right now, what does that look like? What is the, let's say, the ingredients to setting an intention for whatever future they want to build for themselves?
Speaker 1:I think it comes down to like what are you passionate about? Understanding that you don't have all the gifts and skills that you're going to need? When you set that intention and there's going to be a long it's? You're running a marathon, and so those checkpoints are going to change over time. They're going to be difficult. You're going to need stamina. You're going to need someone in your corner, whether that's your, you know, sister, brother, best friend, spouse, whoever or a mentor, because you need someone to keep you going. You're going to get in the quit zone more times than you can count.
Speaker 1:You know, and also it's not a straight line, right? We were just talking to these young ladies last night at this mentoring forum and it's like your career will never go on a straight line and sometimes it's not it's or all the time. Maybe it's not meant to. All of those different points in time that feel like failures or obstacles or frustrating they all feed into the journey and you just have to roll with them and then make good decisions. You see, there's a roadblock that clearly is not meant for you. The doors closed on purpose. Then you really have to sit back and go. Okay, my intention isn't changing. Maybe the place that I'm at needs to change, or maybe my attitude needs to change.
Speaker 2:Okay, I want to dig into the. The doors closed on purpose. What does that mean?
Speaker 1:So I was at another mechanical years ago and we were going down the path of um succession planning, and I was one of the people that was in the succession plan, um, and ultimately that didn't work out and and today I know that that was because the door was closed on purpose, not by me.
Speaker 2:Got it.
Speaker 1:It was closed on purpose because I had a different purpose to fulfill and it wasn't there, even though it seemed like it was and I had put in all the work and I was vice president and I was running major parts of the organization. It was just not meant for me long term.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And you don't know that at the time, right? You don't know that until you get down the path and your journey goes in zigs and zags. And then you look back and you're like, well, clearly, that's why things happen, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh, yeah, yes. So I mean here's how I'm trying to make sense of it, because you know I'm slow. I think it happened Like in my head I'm seeing two versions of the door closing on purpose. There's a metaphorical kind of perspective there, and then there's like for real, that people just decide you're not going to have this, it doesn't matter what you do or how qualified you are, you are not going to have this. And that happens so like it's a reality. And so what I think I heard you say is, like you, you're helping people understand, like be prepared for that.
Speaker 2:And and if it closes at one firm, that doesn't mean it's closed at every firm in the country in the country, find another one, a better place for you, that nurtures your gifts and talents and can help, or who who appreciate talent like that was always my problem, pansy, like why can't they all just see my talent? They just couldn't. They couldn't see it. Um, it's now metaphorically, I think, when I hear the, the door closes on purpose is maybe it's not the, it's not the biggest thing that's available for you. You need to get off the highway for a little bit because there's something bigger.
Speaker 1:I, I a hundred percent agree. That's a great way to state it, cause it, because that ties back to even just how your job opportunities, I think, pop up. Sometimes you could be all the way right, you could be all the way at the top of an organization, let's say, and another opportunity comes up, and maybe it's a step back in title, you know, maybe even financially, but this opportunity that came to you is within a bigger organization and maybe there's more impact and the the going off the highway, like you said, is only for a short period of time, because there's something bigger.
Speaker 2:Oh, and so you've experienced that Like I saw you like oh yeah, that's it.
Speaker 1:I did. Yeah, I took a step back a time before, two times actually and I'm glad because looking back those points in my journey helped me get to where I am today and they were so valuable because it allowed me to step outside of what I already had thought my intention was. I didn't derail what my ultimate goal was, but it helped me see it from a different perspective and and I and I feel like today that's one of the biggest gifts is I let my humility come to the surface for a bigger purpose, because to me, like titles are needed for for business, you know titles and authority are needed for business, but that is not the way that I show up every day. You know I don't show up trying to have this big title and authority. It's like no, we are all trying to advance the ball in the same way.
Speaker 2:We just have different responsibilities yes, yes, yes, yes, and some, like some of them, keep you up way late. Whether you're right, I know it's.
Speaker 1:I'm simplifying it a little bit for you know for what, what I have on my plate, but at the end of the day, from a back to people, we're all people and everybody matters and everybody's valuable, and we all have our different roles to play, our different plays to make. But if you just keep that frame of reference, for me personally I think that's that's where I love to live oh, my goodness, okay.
Speaker 2:So you speak so clearly about these things and with like straight up confidence. Did you like? Did you have have a secret cheat sheet when you were at the middle school dances and said this is what I'm going to do. I've got this. I'm going to do this.
Speaker 1:Filling cars in middle school, I was not thinking about people. Yeah, Okay, We'll go into all of that, but no, it's just uh. I mean I have had some really good people in my life that have helped me kind of cultivate who I wanted to be. You know, you know my character is what it is right, that's a God given thing, I think. And cultivating that and being true to yourself and really like putting yourself to the side not fake humility, but really putting yourself to the side, I think takes other people to show you how to do that from their different perspectives, and I've been pretty fortunate I've had some really good people mentor me and coach me and help me develop over the years. Yeah, Okay.
Speaker 2:So mentors come up multiple times. You are actively in a committed to a mentoring group at situation. I'll just say it, I've worked with amazing companies. So, similarly, I got lucky and that I worked with some really outstanding companies. But we all know it don't matter how outstanding the company is, if your boss is a jerk, you're screwed. I got lucky with some outstanding bosses while I was working for those outstanding companies.
Speaker 2:Now, within those outstanding companies, they both had mentorship programs. It was formal and he was assigned. I'm going to mentor somebody and somebody is going to mentor me. And I'll just say straight up, like it was the. It was a miserable experience because we had a meeting and they said, okay, tell me what you need mentoring. I'm like, uh, like. And they said OK, tell me what you need mentoring. I'm like, like, I don't know. I don't even know you, bro. Like, can we talk a little bit? My point in that is you say you know that you understand, you've experienced the value of having a mentor. You've committed, on top of all your responsibilities and everything you have going on, to mentor others. So the question is this how do you build the mentoring skill?
Speaker 1:And what are you looking to contribute as a mentor? I think the first order of business is getting an understanding of who they are and where they want to go. And it doesn't have to be just business. It could be in life, right Cause I didn't have a mentor in life and I wish I would have, because I wouldn't have made so many crazy silly decisions, you know, I wouldn't have been running the streets as much. But I think it's just understanding who they are and where they want to go. You know like, because asking those inquisitive questions first and foremost, rather than just dumping what you think is wisdom on some somebody or your life lived experience, is probably the best way to go.
Speaker 1:So get to know them Sorry, yeah, a lot of words maybe get to know them and really get to understand, like, what drives them.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And then frame your mentoring engagement that way.
Speaker 2:Oh, I love it. You know, I think I've said this to a bunch of people and everybody rolls their eyes at me because I'm wacko. Right, but I've said this multiple times especially in the conditions that our industry is in right now, everybody is offering competitive pay and benefits. So if that's your sell, who cares? Because everybody is offering the same thing. I think, rather, what I'm seeing.
Speaker 2:There's not a bunch of them, something tells me you're one of them the decision makers in organizations that figure out how to show appreciation in the whole human being, not just how they contribute to the dashboards and the KPIs, but like what their interests are as an individual, as a human being. I think those people I see them winning the talent game. They're winning the attraction and retention game and they're not spending money, they're just demonstrating interest and appreciation in the entire human being. And so when I hear you talking about mentoring, that's what I hear you doing. Like it's not this programmatic, uh agendized approach to having one-on-one conversation. It's like let me get to know you, what's your feel, what's your flavor, what's your interest, what are the gaps you have, so that I can adjust and serve you appropriately. Did I, am I smelling what you're cooking?
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're, you're picking up what I'm laying down, cause that's exactly it Legit, it can't be contrived. That's what I was saying, like in the beginning. Right Is, if you put people first with the right intentions, then the byproduct of a good business decision just naturally happens. You're not forcing it, it's not contrived, you're not trying to get a return, you just will. And on top of that you have fulfilled, passionate high performers that have an environment that is it leaps and bounds over any, just any old paycheck, you know. And then you carry that on into their family because if they come to a bad environment every day, they're going to take that home. And then it's a cycle that never stops and we all know what that looks like. And that is. I don't like it ever.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So let's think of, let's like, take the human part out of it. That's expensive. If you're running a business, it's extremely expensive because if, let me say it this way, when I was that miserable apprentice or journeyman and pissed off and I'd like, I want, why did I go to work? To get the hell away from the house. Cause it sucked being at the house. Ask, well, depends on which X you ask, but anyways, you ask, but anyways.
Speaker 2:So to come to work and then also be treated like a disposable, consumable thing, my performance, like you weren't going to get any of my discretionary effort. I was going to do precisely what you wanted, precisely the way you said you wanted it and that's it. But again, I had some amazing bosses along the way that I'm like man I'm going to. You gave me so much. By just demonstrating interest in me, you get everything. Like I'm going to contribute as much as I possibly can and take on more responsibility outside of my job description so that I can grow. But also because, man you're giving, you're pouring into me, so like I got to pay it back and I think that's one I applaud you for, like you're already there. But that's what we need people to get, or maybe we don't. That way they're great. People can go to the leaders that already know how to do that. What do you think?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, yeah, I don't know, that's a tough. That's a tough one because I think it's a choice. I really believe that it's a choice. When you're in a leadership position, you're either making a choice to do one thing or the other.
Speaker 2:Agreed.
Speaker 1:You know, and again, if it's contrived, people will know. But on the flip side of that, it's like people also have a good opportunity, like me. And you said it's. You know, you work hard enough, you put the effort in the right people will get attracted to you and then they will open up opportunities for you because they have that leadership quality of hey, I want to see this person elevate. Because they have that leadership quality of hey, I want to see this person elevate. And if we could all do that, it's like that whole. What's that analogy of the pond, the rock in the pond and the ripples? It sounds corny but it's not.
Speaker 2:No, it's true, it's 100% true. And it just comes back in waves Again. It took me a while to learn it, but I got it and I'm not stopping. Okay, so you started your working career with a mechanical contractor. Then you went to the dark side with the GC, which I've done also and then you came back home to the mechanical contractor. So for the folks out there that don't know, let's start with what is a mechanical contractor.
Speaker 1:So in a building we do commercial HVAC, plumbing and piping. So we are the ones responsible for ventilation, indoor air quality, making sure you're comfortable, process piping, specialty gases, all of those fun things that live in every building.
Speaker 2:Oh, I love it. I love it. Did you know that? That's my background also? I did not. So I'm a plumber. Oh you are. Oh, yeah, yeah, I know it's hard to tell because I'm so handsome, but yes, I'm a plumber. Well, I shouldn't say I am, because if you look at my hands, I'm not a plumber anymore. But I came up with TD Industries mechanical contractor here in Texas. I was with them for 17 years and I was on that side of the business for about 20 years and every time I say mechanical contractor, people are like you work on cars. I'm like, no, let me tell you what it is.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I know it comes up all the time, so you came up through the trades. I didn't know that.
Speaker 2:Oh, yeah, yeah, Four years of apprenticeship got my journeyman license, medgas certification, master license and la la, la and la la la. But again, where I'm at today is only evidence of the amazing leaders that I came across along the way. Right To have advanced, to have started off as an apprentice and to be doing the things I'm doing and having sitting at the tables that I sit at, that's not normal and it was because I had a lot of amazing people. I say a lot more than most. I've had a bunch of folks that really poured into me and and I'm psychotic and obsessive, so I'm like hell, like let me do a good job here. And they said hey, man, here's this thing. I think you'll be good for this.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I've had that same thing. I think you'd be great at this. Have you ever thought about it? No, but let's talk about it. Yeah, when I went to the GC side, I ended up going with a lot of friends DPR was a client of mine, right, so I had a bunch of friends that work there but I had that same concern of like, well, I'm mechanical, what about electrical and AV and fire alarm and all these things, right, that I didn't know, even though I was very well established and they wanted me to come there and I knew it was a great move.
Speaker 1:It was that psychological piece of, well, I'm not good enough for this and that's not the case, right, and I loved working there. It was such a great part of my experience and it gave me such a wider view of construction. But those people that were pouring into me I had to call them and say I don't know about this, because I don't think I'm capable, and they're like, yes, you are. So then I'm like, well, I can't let them down, so I need to figure this out.
Speaker 2:And so what did that look like for you? That and when I say what did it look like, like it's backstories I had the same, similar transition. I left td and so I had worked in san antonio my whole life, um, and so all the responsibility, network etc. Was san antonio's business unit based. Okay, the job I got was with turner, general contractor, and all of a sudden I had regional responsibility.
Speaker 2:So, like I didn't even know how to like. I've been on a plane maybe three times before that. Now that's part of my job. Like, oh, I don't know if I could do this. So, anyways, there was a lot going through my head and there was some certain. There was a lot of things that I did when I got there to like deal with it. So my question to you is when you made that transition? Because going from a trade, like if you've been in the trade exclusively for most of your career, there's a certain perspective, maybe even opinion, you have about GCs and it's just different, it's not the same, and so it's a pretty big shift. And so my question is this what was, what did you anticipate that transition to be like? And then what did you do to close the gap quickly?
Speaker 1:I anticipated it to be overwhelming and it was to some degree. I mean, both of us had construction experience. You know we knew building in general. I knew a lot of on the design side. You know there's different elements that I was confident in no big deal, but I anticipated it was going to be overwhelming because the spectrum is so much wider. Versus mechanical Right, I'm paying attention to my things, making sure my stuff is accurate, and then you go into everything all the kids in the pool. So I felt like, oh, this is going to be overwhelming and it was, but not in a bad way. So to close the gap, I literally just put my head down and dug in and was like I need to learn how to read a single line drawing. I need to anticipate what the Sparkies are going to tell me and be able to call BS, because I have to make sure that my team that I'm supporting hits the schedule.
Speaker 1:And then I need to be able to recognize, like, from a cost perspective, where do they live? What's the framework? Framework, I literally just I guess. To sum it up, I wanted to be able to call bs and make sure I was the sme for every single trade I was responsible for, as quickly as possible yeah, and so that took what three or four days yeah right, I had a lot. It was a long, a lot of late nights and just you know, phoning a friend, I use my network too Legit.
Speaker 1:I had, you know, so many friends in the industry. I had built a respect and reputation. I just phoned a friend all the time and I said this is what I'm seeing. Can you confirm that I'm on the right track? And I leveraged that a lot for the first probably six months.
Speaker 2:Oh, nice, nice, Okay. So just in case for the L&M family member out there that didn't catch it big leaps are possible. Yes, and you don't have to. I highly recommend and I know Pansy just said it you best be ready to put your head down and learn your butt off Like it's going to. It's not.
Speaker 2:If you know, if you want to be mediocre, like, just go and do your nine to five. But if you want to excel, you got to put in time and you got to be resourceful right. So when you say I reached out to my network, I see that as resourcefulness. You have a network. That is a resource that you didn't have. Like, you didn't let pride or shame get in the way of you getting what you needed so that you can be successful and excel in this whole new environment. Because in scale, it's a dramatically different scale of whatever Right Now. How about the like, the relationship part? I think it might be obvious because, because you're so people focused, but in terms of like, building credibility with the, the tenured credibility with the, the tenured, your new tenured colleagues.
Speaker 1:What did that look like? I mean, I feel like I had a little bit of an advantage because in the business unit that I was in I already had long-term relationships. So you know, I already had a certain established relationship and respect level both ways me to them and them to me. But they're I mean there's. They're national right, so there are, they're international, so there's. There's all bunch of people I met in different business units. I think that was more just. I tried to connect with them one-on-one and just share with them kind of the foundation that I had and make sure they knew that I was listening and that I understood what my responsibilities were and how I was going to help them. Really, I guess I wanted to just make sure they knew that I was solid and that I could be a trusted advisor for the things that they needed from me.
Speaker 2:And that takes contact time right and not bobbleheading like actually delivering value and contact time. Oh my goodness. All right, now I know that you've got a path right. You had you sent an intention a long time ago. You were on the swing in third grade and said this is what I'm going to do. I'm going to be BPA at Intec in 2025.
Speaker 1:After I put someone in the face.
Speaker 2:Yes, After you punched somebody in the face and popped a lock with the screwdriver. Like I remember the Monte Carlos that didn't have the window frames and the Camaros Watch out To get me started, If you know you know out there. No, you know out there.
Speaker 1:No, you know.
Speaker 2:So going to DPR and like clear I mean my head I'm guessing that there was an intention, there was something you wanted to learn and develop, otherwise you wouldn't have made the move. So what was that? Like you weren't doing it to get a job and work for a GC? I don't think. No, I wasn't Okay.
Speaker 1:And I had no reason to leave. You know, at the time I had no reason to leave. In tech, it was the culture that I liked, I, the leaders here, and but the the piece of that setting the intention for me was how do I be the best? I want to be the best. If I show up at a project, if I'm on a pursuit team, I want to be aware of everything else and have the right care and custody of how I need to be a collaborative trip team partner, and this opportunity opened that up for me.
Speaker 1:No, I didn't know that I would come back, you know, to the trade side. I really didn't think I would. I thought I was going to stay there because I loved it. It gave me a much wider range. It I was going to stay there because I loved it. It gave me a much wider range. I just enjoyed it a lot and I had a lot of really good people that I worked with and I got to be involved in a lot of different things. But it was really just that, that opportunity. When it opened up, it was like man, I think. I think I have so much more to add to our industry. I could do it here with people that I really love, with a culture that I really like. You know, I kind of checked all the boxes for me, um, and so much more legit, like it was one of the best experiences that I think I got to have.
Speaker 2:Amazing. So were there any superpowers or skills that grew exponentially while you were in that environment that maybe you weren't totally aware of until you got there Like, oh, I got this, this thing where?
Speaker 1:did that come from? I think picking up electrical was was a shocker to me. Okay, it took a minute, yeah, understanding like the basics of electrical and I just didn't think I would catch it as quickly, but I really like. Actually, it's one of the things I miss about coming back on the mechanical side. Is that electrical piece I really enjoyed it? No, I think I mean maybe just kind of the background that I had and being able to transition into so much more than just M&P and, you know, being valuable and adding value to the teams was a little bit of a shocker for me. I just wasn't sure how that was going to go down and I picked up quite a bit of things that I didn't know before really quickly and like just ran with them and I like to pull out and justify it for the L&M family member out there.
Speaker 2:That's as slow as I am Right. And so, summary, there are some opportunities that are so big they're a little scary. Going from a trade to a GC is one of those, like you know, unless you're just super, super, ultra confident and a little delusional. But it's what my experience and I think what I heard you say is like. Going into that space it's a bigger pool that facilitates and wait, let me say this first, not every GC, because there's a lot of dirtbag GCs out there. I said it straight up, I've lived it. There's some great ones out there with great people, and so going into a big we'll just say it this way going into a bigger organization, a bigger opportunity, helps you expand your own awareness about what it is you can contribute and it creates kind of new like oh, wait, a minute, if I had that much more, what else is there? What more do I have? Did you have the same kind of experience?
Speaker 1:Absolutely. It forces you to look inside again and say well, I could, I need to stretch myself even more. And then you just, you know, go.
Speaker 2:Go. It's like, oh damn, I did that, I could do that. Like, shoot I gotta, what else can I do? Yup, exactly Same. Same happened for me, okay. So then you went. Same same happened for me, um, okay. So then you went. Now we're like we're getting closer to the present. You went back to in tech. Now, when I hear you speak, it's obvious that you care about people and and you're real um, I also hear some like serious business acumen and I know a lot of people in the industry that they're great at managing a project, and you probably know this. You were able to see it. Managing a project is running. It's like running a business, depending on what level of experience you have in the organization. But something tells me you could see that. And so what was it about running a business? How early did you see, like that's what I want to do, that's what I want to learn how to do, that's what I want to do. Was that again, was that like an early awareness, or did that kind of develop along the way?
Speaker 1:It was early awareness. Okay, yeah, I mean it was kind of in my mind. What was happening when I first started was I was in a support role, no surprise, and I was watching you know these no disrespect but all these men, you know, just just run circles around me career-wise, even though I had an equally good skill set. Yep. So the first intention was just that, like well, I could manage these projects, not support behind the scenes, I could manage that project. So that was my first step of like I need to get there. And then, as I started doing that and engaging with more people, then it was like I'm watching the leaders at that point now and I'm like picking up things that I think are good and valuable and seeing one, I enjoy all aspects of business.
Speaker 1:I love people, I'm good in terms of, like, managing projects. If I take that to the next level, what kind of impact could I make on people? Because the financial part of it is important but it's not straight up just being real. Anybody who knows me will tell you this. That is not my main goal. I could pay my bills anywhere.
Speaker 1:I really my whole thing was running a business gives me an opportunity to create an environment for people that they need for people that they need.
Speaker 2:I didn't have or I want to see better period Amazing. And the cost was learning how to run a business, but for a greater purpose than making whatever. It is your 10%, 14% growth margin. It's funny when I talk to GCs and they talk about their margins, they're like we got like 3%.
Speaker 1:Well, you are out to lunch, because the risk reward can be a wild ride.
Speaker 2:Oh my, you know, I, I, so I get to to to hang out with a bunch of different construction companies. They bring me into like to hang out with a bunch of different construction companies. They bring me into, like I don't know, be the class clown and entertain them. But I like to ask, always with the leaders it's like, why are you in construction, and especially at the executive level? What I hear is to make money. We're here to make money. I'm here to make money, money, money.
Speaker 2:And I'm like, really, it's like if you wanted to make money, why the hell would you pick construction? Like it has the most risk, super volatile, pain in the butt, difficult because of all the stakeholders. Like there's just it is so damn hard to make the money and it takes so damn long to get the money. Like if you really wanted to make money, you could sell pictures of your feet on the money and it takes so damn long to get the money. Like if you really wanted to make money, you could sell pictures of your feet on the internet. Like if that's what you're about, like come on. Like let's be for real.
Speaker 2:And I'm kind of I'm being goofy, but it's true, I say it all the time. And my point is this like it sounds good and it feels good money but when I hit them with that, a lot of them are like I never thought of it. Like exactly, and that's the point right. Like you have to love something meaningful, otherwise it's no fun and clearly you're using it as it's a. It's a conduit, you see how you like, how I threw the electrical thing in. It's a conduit for you to serve people and create an environment for people to thrive, and so all that other stuff, like you said, the up and down, earnings and collections, and all of that Is tolerable because it affords or it creates a space for you to do amazing things for amazing people. Am I getting that right?
Speaker 1:It allows me to be a servant leader in a way that's meaningful to me and, of course, others. But like, yeah, 100% Again. Everybody has to make money and that's why we do business, but never is it the number one thing. That's on my mind and to your point.
Speaker 1:it is hard to make it and collect it and it's a lot of brain damage, so I bet you if you asked everybody and made them think of it differently, they would say the same that no, maybe they love it because people, because no day is the same, because it's a challenge, because all those different things.
Speaker 2:Yes, oh yeah. We just need to think about it and examine yourselves. And that's my point how can I help somebody examine their thinking so that they can improve or enhance their quality of life? So that they can improve or enhance their quality of life. Now, just in case, because I know some people are saying, like man, where's Intech? I need to go fill out an application. Should I tell everybody like no, you have all the workforce you need. Y'all are full up.
Speaker 1:You don't need anybody. Well, you never turn down a conversation, right? I mean, we have a, we have a fantastic team and we're I'm so grateful that we do, we're intentional about it. But yeah, I mean anybody who's, you know, got character, you know, wants to be a part of a good culture, loves to be a high performer and work hard and loves people, um yeah, send them our way 10, 4 good.
Speaker 2:And I also want to say this for my, like my trades people out there, because we've all worked with miserable organizations, with miserable people. That's life, right, like I, I experienced it when I was working fast food. I experienced it and, like you, ain't going to love every boss you ever have, but that doesn't mean that they all suck. And what I'm especially excited about is I've been able to capture evidence, your evidence, that there are amazing leaders out there running trade subcontractor organizations that create a culture where people can thrive. There's not enough of us, there's not enough of you, right, but you are living proof that it exists and so I applaud you. I'm grateful to you for that, because you know I'm sure you've heard the stories, you experienced it yourself there are some organizations that like again, hell, if I knew I could like back in the 90s, if I could sell pictures of my feet, I would have. But that wasn't a thing back then. Now it is, and now I got a better gig, so it doesn't make sense.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it really does matter, Because when this opportunity came up, you know, if the foundation of the company was not built on the core values and the culture that we have, I wouldn't even have considered taking this leap right, and all this risk and becoming an owner and all those things would not even across my mind.
Speaker 2:Because what's the point?
Speaker 1:And being an owner like you are invested like money, like serious lack of sleep, like all the things, but it's it's, it's good yeah. And I would challenge anybody out there to like think about your people. Think about the type of environment that you create, and how would you want your kids or your siblings or someone else to show up every day and deal with? That's where we spend the most of our time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yep, amazing, amazing. Okay, I got the closing question coming up and, given how intentional and I just the best I could say is like, real right, like you remind me of, I got a group of friends that I went to middle school with here in San Antonio, tafoya, since sixth grade, and we're still friends and the vibe with them is like you're that, you're my kind of people, like experience, maybe a little.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we, we got some, we got some similarities and definitely some same life experience same friends style yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And so, because of all of that, I'm like, oh man, this answer is going to be juicy. So you're ready for the question? Oh, what is the promise you are intended to be?
Speaker 1:I'm intended to be. I don't know, that's a tough one, I think, maybe a light to people that need it. Dang, you're going to make me emotional Gangsters. Don't cry, no, come on, chai Girl. I know, what's up with that? Why are you going to make me get out of my box? I mean, I think it's that. I think it's what I said.
Speaker 2:Yeah, be a light. I think you already are Like, based on everything that you've shared so far and the way I see you show up, of course, on the internet. So this is super special. It's the second time we got to talk. I know I'm glad, Me too, but it's like you're already actively being a light to others by purposefully getting into a mentoring, we'll say relationship. It's not imposed upon you, you chose to do that by intentionally picking the organization that you work with because of the culture that's there, by living to what's true to you. You're already a light sister, and so just keep getting brighter and let me know how I can contribute to that. I won't go any further because I don't want the mascara to run. You've got a rep to protect. I've got a rep to protect.
Speaker 1:Yes, did you have fun I did. Thank you so much. This was a good conversation and it you just helped me water my why again thank you for sticking it out all the way to the end.
Speaker 2:I know you got a whole lot of stuff going on and, in appreciation for the gift of time that you have given this episode, I want to offer you a free p of my book Becoming the Promise You're Intended to Be. The link for that bad boy is down in the show notes. Hit it. You don't even have to give me your email address. There's a link in there. You just click that and you can download the PDF. And if you share it with somebody that you know who might feel stuck or be caught up in self-destructive behaviors, that would be the ultimate you sharing. That increases the likelihood that it's going to help one more person. And if it does help one more person, then you're contributing to me becoming the promise I am intended to be Be kind to yourself, be cool, and we'll talk at you next time.