Reiki from the Farm™

The Living History of Reiki with Su Mach'ado

• Pamela Allen-LeBlanc/Su Mach'ado, LRMTs • Season 6 • Episode 15

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Is the story of Reiki still unfolding?

In this episode of Reiki from the Farm™, I’m joined by Su Mach'ado — Licensed Reiki Master Teacher with the International Center for Reiki Training, lawyer, historian, and visionary behind a recent international Reiki summit in Brazil that is helping to bring new awareness and connection to the global Reiki community.

Su’s journey into Reiki is as fascinating as her work within it. With a background in law, she brings a unique lens of discernment, structure, and inquiry to the spiritual path — qualities that now serve her deeply in her role as one of Reiki’s modern historians.

Together, we explore what it means to be a “historian” in a living spiritual practice — one that continues to evolve as new research, translations, and discoveries emerge. We discuss recent insights into Reiki’s origins, including contributions from researchers such as Justin Stein, and how these findings are helping us better understand the roots of the system while honoring its spiritual essence.

We also talk about Su’s beautiful work in Brazil — creating a Reiki summit that brings practitioners together across languages, cultures, and traditions, expanding the reach and accessibility of Reiki in profound ways.

This episode is a bridge between past and present…
between tradition and discovery…
and between the roots of Reiki and the future it is still becoming.

If you’ve ever felt called to understand Reiki more deeply — not just as a practice, but as a lineage — this conversation will open something new within you.

______

Pam Allen-LeBlanc is a scientist, businesswoman, and Licensed Reiki Master Teacher (LRMT) with the International Center for Reiki Training.

Get in Touch with Pam:
pam@reikifromthefarm.com
www.reikifromthefarm.com

______

Su Mach'ado is a Brazilian Licensed Reiki Master Teacher (LRMT) and Historian for the International Center for Reiki Training (ICRT), and founder of Centro de Treinamento de Reiki – Felicidade. In Brazil for Portuguese speakers, she introduced Holy Fire® III Reiki in 2020 and ICRT Animal Reiki in 2021 and is known for teaching Reiki with depth, professionalism, and strong historical grounding. Su also translates official ICRT Reiki manuals into Portuguese and helps expand high-quality Reiki training for Portuguese-speaking students.

Get in Touch with Su:

https://www.reikiefelicidade.com

https://www.instagram.com/reiki.centrodetreinamento/   

https://www.youtube.com/@centrodetreinamentodereiki

- Centro de Treinamento de Reiki – Felicidade: https://www.reikiefelicidade.com  

- Reiki Conference: https://www.reikiefelicidade.com/conferencia-reiki

- Updated article on Usui Sensei and Reiki history: https://www.reikiefelicidade.com/post/usui-sensei-historia-atualizada  

Register for our newsletter! 

pam@reikifromthefarm.com

Speaker

Hi, and welcome to the Reiki from the Farm Podcast, brought to you by me, Pam Allen LeBla from Hidden Brook Farm. I am a scientist, a businesswoman, and a licensed Reiki master teacher with the International Center for Reiki training. Each week in this podcast, you'll be entertained as you learn about a wide variety of relevant Reiki topics helping you become a more knowledgeable and effective Reiki practitioner. We caution you though this podcast may also dramatically improve your life. And we are so happy that you're here.

Pam

On this week's podcast, I am so excited to speak with Sue Machado, our one of our licensed teachers from Brazil. Welcome, Sue.

Su

Oh, I'm so glad to be here with you, Pam.

Pam

Thank you. Sue. Sue is a lawyer, or she has been a lawyer. She's also a licensed Reiki master teacher, and she's currently our historian with the ICRT. She also just put together a wonderful conference in Brazil that I was lucky enough to be part of, so we just have lots to talk about today. Before we get too far, I just wanted to let you know what we have coming up at the farm and at the Bay. First off, the month of August, the Bay is gonna be wonderful. We've got a full week of courses in through all three different topics that I normally teach. I have a level one and two in masterclass, a one week the second week of August, the third week of a third week of August I think it is. I have a animal level one and two in masterclass, and following that is animal communication, level one and two and Master teacher. So in between each of those classes, we're going to take a day. So that I can show you the island the Monday after the weekend class and before the master classes begin, I want to take you to Eleanor's Tea. This is the Island of Franklin and Eleanor Roosevelt, so that you can learn a little bit more about them and their life, and we'll tour their 19 bedroom cottage. We're going to go whale watching, although sometimes we all actually see whales, right? I just showed Sue the view here. And sometimes we see whales right from the living room or the porch. We are also going to take a hike and have a meal together. So I'm. I just really wanna show you around this this beautiful island with the highest tides in the world. In September, I'll be speaking the, actually in June, I'll be speaking in at the Omega Institute. If you haven't signed up for the wisdom of Reiki conference, I hope you will. I would love to see you there, meet you there in person, along with some of the top, other, top re not other, but some of the top Reiki masters in the world. It would be lovely to for you to have an opportunity to meet them as well. So check that out In September I'll be speaking about animal communication for Reiki practitioners to the international retreat in Sedona and would love to see you there. And I'll be leaving from there to go to Hong Kong. And I'll be teaching a variety of classes in Hong Kong. So if you are in Asia, I'll be teaching animal Reiki one and two and masters. I will be teaching healthcare Reiki and I'm also going to be doing a special evening event for some of the many of you. Who've studied with me animal communication with me in before. I hope you can join us for that. That's gonna be exciting. I'll be heading from there to Japan and I'm just gonna miss you, Sue. Unfortunately, you're gonna be Japan on my anniversary and I am going to have to fly home the weekend before. We're missing each other by a week. Then in October, I do have a full lineup of classes both online, the Camp Bella classes are both online and in person. And I do have a full lineup of classes again in October, online and in person at the farm. So would love to have you join us there. I think the master classes are only online, but the level one and two classes are over the weekend and they are both. So that's just a super exciting, fun, a fun year this year of 2026. It's the year of the fire horse and I feel like we're on fire so what do you have coming up that you'd like to let people know about?

Su

I feel the same here, Pam. It's this fire horse here. It's impressive. We started the year with the Reiki conference and I felt it was this fire horse that was all around here. Yeah. Now we are going to have, of course, everything is in Portuguese. Because I am Brazil, so this is more for Brazilian people. Portuguese people. We are going to have a r retreat, a Reiki retreat in holiday in June here in, in St. Paul, Brazil. Yes. And it is the second time we are giving this retreat, which is really impressive how the healing and the energies and the are money of the balance and everything works with this retreat and people love it. And this is going to be in a retreat center that is with crystals all around. So it is yes. They have huge crystals also in the rooms, the bedrooms. So it is impressive. And combines with the energy of Kaurna Reiki. Oh. Yeah. So just perfect. And of course, we are with our classes, our current classes Reiki one and two, ICRT, animal Reiki one and two, remaster, Kaurna master, and ICRT, animal Reiki master levels during the whole year some classes are in presence, some classes are online and some classes are hybrid. So we have all these options. And in the end of the year, as you mentioned it, we are going to Japan. So it is we are going to give the recognized class and travel around. It'll be awesome and it, I'm sorry that we are going to miss each other for a week. But maybe, who knows? We see each other soon.

Pam

I hope so soon

Su

online. I'm so happy that we are seeing each other more.

Pam

Me too. You're one of my favorite people. I love hanging out with you, so this is great. Oh, guys, I I asked Sue to come on the podcast because I just found, find that she has so much to share. Sue, I'd like to start with your story. How did you go from being a lawyer, a career in law, into Reiki? What called you onto this path?

Su

Yeah, Pam. As many people of my generation I was teacher since I was young that I had to choose very. Understandable. Strong profession by my parents, specifically my father. In his point of view, I should be, I should study in a law school or to become engineer or a medical doctor.

Okay.

Su

Those professional professions were acceptable. Others? No. And he actually, he wanted me to become a judge. Wow. Wow. Yes. And because I didn't accept his authority, I decided to become a lawyer. So of course I followed his expectations. So I became a lawyer. I decided to go to this area and we had to decide it so early in our age here in Brazil. We decide about it when we are 17 years old. It is so early. We have to decide what we are going to do for the whole life. And law suits me because I, I think I, I did it I did a good job. I like it to learn it and to work with corporate law. So I work with mergers mergers and acquisitions and agreements, international agreements with trademarks, intellectual property, and also with economic law.

Pam

Okay.

Su

So yeah, it, and it was hard because I was just

Pam

going to say that's very serious stuff

Su

that you

Pam

were working with.

Su

Yes, it was. And a very competitive field. And between, among the lawyers and among law firms and all of that. I reached I understood that I was going to be happy if I reached a specific status and in my career. That was to become the leader of international law department.

Pam

Okay.

Su

And I achieve it. It, when I did it, I did. Yes. When I did it, I broke inside. I discovered that it was not what would make me happy and emotionally I was depressed. And in my body started to have many issues. So I had three knees surgeries during this period of time. Yes. Three. Oh my

Pam

gosh. Sue, you're young.

Su

Yes. And I had two pastor three knees surgeries, and I could not walk properly. The problem was not serious, was not complicated, but it became complicated.

Pam

Okay.

Su

And it made me have also problems in my my spine that Oh, no. Yes. And it was increasing the pain was. Each time worse. And I had to do physiotherapy two or three times a week. And I worked in a company that was far from my house, and I had to cross the city every day and work hard. And I had migraines and I had to go to the hospital almost every week to receive medication. Oh gosh,

Pam

Sue, I never knew this about you. Yes.

Su

So I had a burnout.

Pam

Yes.

Su

I had

Pam

no doubt.

Su

Yeah. In that moment. During that time, we didn't talk about burnout. It was like she could not handle it. But the point is it was not the profession. The point was what's going on inside of me. And then I had PP psychological therapy for 15 years. Yes. And I could not do completely what which what was going on inside of me. It was really complicated. Then what happened is that I slept driving my car.

Pam

Oh no,

Su

I did. And. I crash at my car in avenue, big avenue of Sao Paulo, the city of Sao Paulo. It's a big city. And I was lucky that the person in front of me had a strong car, stronger than mine. And he didn't he was not injured. I didn't injure anyone. Only me. And I slept when I wake up with my movement of my head doing like that. Yeah. So the driver of the car in front of me left the car, super nervous what's going on here? What you did with my car when he saw me? He was like, are you okay? It was completely different. And I look at him when I realized that what was going on, I just noticed I could have killed someone because it was a big avenue there with people around. So I could have hurt someone. I could have killed someone.

Pam

Oh my gosh.

Su

Yeah. And what happened is that day I decided that I had to do something. That something was really wrong there in my life, and I had to take a decision about what to do.

Pam

Yeah.

Su

And my first decision was to quit my job, the dream job. So I reached at that spot and, but something side of me was not well, I had to figure out what to do. And so we decided here with my family that I would do a house, not stop.

Pam

A pause. Yep. Yes.

Su

This moment I didn't know anything about Reiki, about holistic therapies in this field. But spirituality here in Brazil can be very strong. So I had passes, had pa I had passed through healing houses, spiritual houses who assisted me during this period of time was really good. And we have some magnetic work also with the hands in spiritual houses and they assisted me with that. So when Reiki came was not something so different. Then I always was connected with animals since I was young. And I had three dogs during this period of time and the dogs were my big part of like the big part of my life. They gave me so much joy. But it was interesting that they had many problems with health. And they were born with many problems. Also, the three dogs I had, the three dogs had hip dysplasia. And I always had problems with immunity system, which I had to. So we were all, almost every time in medical doctors and veterinarians. Wow. Yes. And my dogs, they receive it a comp pore every week because of the pain. And one of the vets told me about animal communication. When this man told me about it, I never doubt, doubt about this existed. How it worked, I wanted to do it. I wanted to talk with my dogs. This was, oh my God, I want to do it. And I took this class the second day of the class. We could take one of our animals. Could they? They took a bird, a cat dogs, but needed to be calm animal. And I. Took my mo the most, the older dog. And he was so calm, but he had hi hip dysplasia. And there one of the students also was a regular practitioner and the dog that his name was Logan. And he had pain. And I was going to give me comment to him to re to heal his pain.

Pam

Yes.

Su

To take off his pain. And this practitioner came to me and said, do you want me to give some Reiki to him? I look at this person and said, oh my God. Okay. I was there. Animal communication, Reiki. I didn't know exactly, but Okay. And in she just was there, she knee and put her hands on his hips, and I saw him melted there. He was belting and I said, oh my God, I have to learn it. So I communication and then Reiki and I started to look for it. And here in Brazil we have a person that is vocabulary that was really famous with animal Reiki here veterinary also. And I decided to take his class and I enrolled for Reiki one because I didn't know if I should do the Reiki two. And I was there and was so good the class like, oh my God, I needed this. It was like something marvelous coming to my life. This first Reiki in class and I asked him to take the Reiki to class. That was the next day, and he had only one manual. For this class the class was full and he had left only one manual, and this manual was mine. So I took this, the ratio class.

Pam

Amazing.

Su

And then it is and then I started to I learned that I had to give me Reiki. It was so important to receive to give myself Reiki. And I started to I see. I was a lawyer, so if there is a procedure, I have to follow it right? Also, I am a taros with Capricorn.

Pam

It must have been hard for you to learn from me. Sue, you studied from me. Yeah. Oh, you could do it this way or that way or the other way.

Su

Now I know it, but that time I didn't, so you should do it this way. I will do it this way. So he said to me, you need to give yourself Reiki during the morning and during the af, during the night before sleep. And I did it. So I

Pam

wake, my first Reiki teacher did too. She wanted us to do an hour, 50 minutes to an hour each time.

Su

Exactly. And I started So every day in hand positions? Hand positions,

Pam

yes. Oh, yes. All of them. Every hand position. Yes.

Su

During the morning, so easy, right? You wake up, you meditate, Gassho, meditation and hand positions. Then the goki was there. I printed the goki and put in my mobile, the picture of the goki.

Pam

So did I.

Su

Yeah. So I could do it every day. It was there. So I, I would remember it. And during the night. Before asleep. I went to bed and started to give me hand positions and what happens that I slept

Pam

Me too every time, and I thought I was doing it wrong.

Su

I thought that I did it wrong. Me too.

Pam

Yeah,

Su

me

Pam

too. Yeah. I know I was gonna get in trouble.

Su

Oh, I have to continue and then sleep again.

Pam

Yeah. I was embarrassed to admit it to my teacher. I was like, I keep falling asleep at night,

Su

so I'm doing it wrong.

Pam

Yeah. But

Su

or, and I remember the first time I was going to give rape to my house, and it was so interesting because I was sitting in the sofa in my living room and I decided to, it was the first time I was going to give rape to my house, and then I was going to give rape to my animals. It would be the first time. And I was like that, sitting in my sofa. Yeah. Eyes closed

Pam

for an hour. For me, it was about 45 minutes.

Su

And I was there. Then my, I had another dog that was bruised, my black lab, and he jumped in front of me and he put his head between my hands like that.

Pam

Aw,

Su

yeah. And my husband was there and he took a picture and it was so I could, I can never forget it in my mind, but we have this, so this picture so beautiful. And it was the first time and I thought, oh my God, I'm doing everything right now. And I was a very nervous people person. I was anxious and I saw problems everywhere. So lawyers, they seek problems to solve and Yes, my, my mind was all focused in problems where could be a problem. So I worried a lot. And when I started Reiki, this worries started to melt. And I start to be calmer and people start to notice I was changing. It was different. And what happened with Reiki with me is that it opened my eyes. And I started to use the distancing to heal my past. So things that I identified with as problems and roots for my problems, health problems psychological problems. I started to send Reiki to it and my knees started to heal and I didn't need more physiotherapy. And my knees, I don't feel pain. I have aosis of course, because they are not so good. But I don't have pain.

Pam

Wow.

Su

And I can kneel. I can do many things with no problems. I can hike, I can do many things that I could not do during this period of time that I was younger. And I, every my migraine games, they disappeared. I sometimes I had a small headache, but it passes. I don't go more to the hospital every time. Actually it's very difficult. And if I had to take a antibiotic is if I, since I got my Rick Attunements, I think twice I had antibiotics. It is, yeah. Yeah.

Pam

It's such, it's so amazing, isn't it, Sue? And we have more in common than I even realized in the sense that I too got to the pinnacle of my career growing a company to be the fastest growing company in Atlantic Canada. And so you arrive and you're like, okay, now I'm supposed to be really happy and fulfilled. And it's but I'm not. So wait a minute. I did everything I was supposed to do. And they, I was told, I bought into that story that if you just do this, you'll be fulfilled, you'll be happy. And I got there and went. The what this is. This is it. And Reiki just had such a beautiful influence. Thank you for sharing all of that and sue you since you, I'm so great. I love meeting you. I was so excited when you decided to become a licensed teacher. You're just, I don't know. I love working with you and but so does William. William Rand, the president of the ICRT. He has played a really big role in bringing forward the accurate history of Reiki. And as our historian, and I know you're working, you're apprenticing with him as part of the ICR T'S succession plan. Can you tell us a little bit about. That about William's role in bringing that accurate history forward, because we all know that when it comes to the history of Reiki there are different versions out there. And so yeah what are your thoughts there? Could you share a little bit about that?

Su

Yeah. So during my journey with Reiki, so I became a teacher after of this and I start, started to study. So I, I used to say what we leave it before Reiki. Now I am a Reiki master teacher. I am a re practitioner. I give sessions, I teach, oh, I mentor all of that. But what organizing of this is also our previous background. So becoming I was a lawyer and I had to study a lot and understand the why of things and cause and consequence and facts. And when I started to study Reiki, I wanted to go deep. And for me I like a lot history. Not only re history, but history is so important to, it makes

Pam

fascinating, isn't it?

Su

Yes, it makes us, in my point of view, it makes us to understand much better the word today. And ha history for me is basically a way to understand better why Reiki is here, how it came to us, and how to understand how it was stitched before. Bring us clarity about Reiki today because there are so many ways of thinking and using Reiki today. And some people think, oh, this way is a wrong way. This way is the right way. And when we go to suis history, we understand so much about Reiki. And during this process of study I was introduced to Swiss Reiki and to Genai Re. And it was so interesting that William Li Rand, that is the person who brought the sweet Batan Reiki and do say that he is the person that's bringing gang Reiki. They are connected.

Pam

Yeah. They're friends.

Su

Exactly.

Pam

Yeah.

Su

And both of them in Japan in 2023, they, both of them together. I took a picture. So

Pam

they speak, yeah, they speak a lot.

Su

And what I was researching about hi Reiki history and I found an interview of William Re with Do Say, and it brought a lot of information about the history of Rei. And most of this actually the full article is here, there are we have two articles and they are here in this book. This book is sold by ICRT. You can find it in the store.

Pam

And for those who are listening, it's the book called An Evidence-Based History of Reiki. And it's a selection of articles from the Reiki News magazine.

Su

Exactly. And during my research, I noticed that William and Do Sensei were bringing this accurate history. So docent say doesn't speak English. And William was bringing his, discoveries to people who speaks English. And because of that I notice how his way of thinking that both way of thinking were aligned actually. And this called a lot my attention because I didn't had study with William, but here in Brazil, sweet Tibetan lineage is very strong. Okay. Yeah. We have many people that, that are sweet Tibetan Reiki here, and I was one of them.

Pam

I was too in, in North America before holy fire came along. Yeah.

Su

Yeah. And here in Brazil, nobody talking about holy fire. Actually, nobody talk, nobody knew I think about holy fire or some people knew but didn't talk about it. But bad was so strong. Yes. And so I had a teacher who used it to say this about William pay attention because he's the Swiss say of our time.

Pam

Wow.

Su

Yeah. So how could I not pay attention?

Pam

Wow. I never heard that before,

Su

but I did.

Pam

But knowing William as well as I do, and even though he's very humble and down to earth, yes. The yasui sensei of our time, I, yeah, I can see that.

Su

Yeah. He said that after, and it was not only once, he said many times. And he is a author here in Brazil Ricker here. And he said it many times and I started to pay attention to seek the website and see the books. And I saw that he also translated this book from doe, also available in English in the ICRT store website.

Pam

And this book is a modern Reiki method for healing revised edition. And it's Hiroshi Doy from the Gandhi, Reiki Ho. So yeah that's also a book. I have those as well. And those are books that we can get from the ICRT?

Su

Yes. And this books they brought to me so much information that we didn't have here in Brazil. And it was brought to us by USI Reiki Heki member.

Pam

Yeah, ROI doi, Which is the original Reiki gci or school that Yasui sensei set up. And that school is it's like a private members, like almost a secret society sort of thing. So it's a, it's not easily, or it hadn't been easily accessible. I'm really grateful that Hiroshi Doy has reached out and ex extended that information to us so that it could be shared in North America.

Su

Exactly. And before do and say William also connected with ar, Java Petter. And ar, Java Petter showed William all Reiki special places in Japan, and he teach within the Japanese Reiki techniques.

Pam

Which we teach now still in our courses

Su

Exactly.

Pam

Techniques. Yeah.

Su

That was something that during that period of time, nobody talked about. And also he had classes with Choku and Au Yamaguchi and Choku Yamaguchi was a student from HIAs say, and they teach without Western inf influence. He had Reiki one, two with them. William. William had, yeah.

Pam

Yeah.

Su

And also with ITO sensei, he ito sensei. And during this, with all this stages, he could bring the evidence base history of re. And he was one of the first teachers that was te telling this to the public. And this was really important. So he had many facts and he had these publications bringing these facts. And these two books were bringing clarity for me. When I had the opportunity to first have this, his class, that was during COVID time, I had that first online re master training with him. I made a lot of questions. So I was that student that came, oh, and this, you know about it. Can you tell me, is it true? And

Pam

so you stood out is what you're saying? You were that student.

Su

Yes. I was that kind of student that make many questions there. And and then he. Explain it, everything. And I think his role here was to bring us clarity. So of course I don't speak Japanese but I speak English. So I could have this. And I think you, you had this opportunity to Pam as I, I remember. So ask questions to a person that studied, understood the roots. And it's very interesting his point of view because he based on what he understood about the roots of Reiki, he also identified that his vision of evolution was correct.

Pam

Yeah.

Su

Yeah. Was not something wrong that many people can understand.

Pam

That Reiki continues to evolve. And I think as he spoke with Doy sensei and got that accurate history he was able to see that it began evolving from the beginning. Exactly. That Hii did not teach the way Yasui taught, that Mrs. Ada did not teach the way that Dr. Hii had and so on and so forth

Su

exactly. And also today, the members of osu, Reiki Heki, they say that they do not teach and practice the same way Uwe did.

Pam

Wow. I did not know that, Sue.

Su

Yeah. And

Pam

I had a feeling you were gonna drop some bombshells on us that we don't, that we didn't know. So it makes sense to me that you that you decided to be the historian. And up until now, William has been the one who's really, championed learning the accurate history, learning as much as possible. And he's constantly searching for more information about Reiki, constantly talking to people and listening to what they have to say and their and so on. And so it makes sense to me. Sue, there've been a number. I remember hearing that when William brought the accurate history out. This was before I knew him. A lot of people weren't happy about it because they wanted, they preferred or wanted to believe the history that they had been taught. And I can remember speaking with William about it, and he's so funny because he doesn't feel a need to try to. Prove anything or bring anybody to his way of thinking. And he just said that's okay. If you prefer to do that and teach that way, that's fine, but I'm going to work with what the accurate history is or what the evidence shows me in there. Therefore, the evidence-based history of Reiki. But that being said, I can remember it caused some big waves back in the day when he first brought that forward. And I can remember William has told me that in his conversations with Hiroshi Doy, which have always been done through a translator, at one point a after many conversations Doy sensei said, told the translator, or the translator told William Doy Sensei said, he's told you everything he knows. He said, that's it, he's done now. But that being said Sue William let us know fairly recently that there's more, we have some other authors who like Justin Stein and you mentioned Ola Bo, who are doing a lot of really academic research and they're finding out some new things. So can you tell us a little bit about that?

Su

Yes. Just Instein I think is a person that is bringing a lot of information to us and he wrote this book, alternate Currents. This book is really important. So alternate currents from just B Stein this you can find easily in Amazon. And this book brings a lot of information how ZUI actually receive it many information from North America. So it is what is why alternate currents because it's the North Pacific current of information during Swiss time because Japan was going, was opening to the west, and they had the intention to learn as much they could with the Western society.

Pam

Okay.

Su

And. With that many books were translated, many information came. They went to United States, to Europe to study, and they, in much, many information they, that you saw usage to create some techniques actually came from translated book from North America. It's impressive.

Pam

I did not know that. And we do have evidence now that Yasui had spent time in North America.

Su

Exactly. One thing, one thing very interesting it was not Justin Stein discovery, but he brought to us the information was a resume from Sui from the time that he worked for the Japanese government in Taiwan. So he had to write his resume and it was most probably wrote by his own hands. And I published an article, organizing in an article for Written News magazine this information because just since time publish it a Facebook post and in ICRT as I'm now working as historian there, and we have. All the history of Reiki so organized it. And William also always wanted to bring it with clarity, with evidence. We felt the need to organize it for article for Reiki News magazine. I that. Yeah, so we have a document talking about it. Official, not a Facebook post, which is very good because Justin Stein brings a lot of good information in his Facebook page, but he also have great articles and books. And, but for this, he did not do it. But the discovery was from a Reiki group in Taiwan. And they publish it in his, in their webpage. And it mentioned that where were the files and the Taiwanese archives. So I went to the Taiwanese archives and I brought my own copy of these archives. And then I worked with that, of course, based it on what Justin Stein also shared with us. So I give all the credit for Justin Stein and for this Taiwanese organization. Okay? It's very important to, to bring that. So what I did was to organize it and put it to to have a document. And this article is going to our Reiki one and to manual to this new edition. So we have this information there.

Pam

Wonderful. I think that's the first change to the level one and two manual in decades or years. So That's wonderful. I read the article and I really felt that it shone a lot of light on things like that UI sensei had worked at a Christian boys school and, there were a number of things. What stood out to you from that,

Su

We learned that Zui was really a teacher. And he studied a lot. He was studying psychology with one of the pioneers of psychology in Japan, and he also studied law some years of law school. And he learned English Chinese, how he knew how to speak at least three languages. It was, it is impressive.

Pam

And he was the head of a Methodist. The boys school, right?

Su

So he went to United States. So this story is true because he wrote that he went to United States studied at work at, and what happens that when he returns, he opens a boys school that he's from, I forgot the name in English now, but for Christian organization.

Pam

I think it's the Methodist. Methodist,

Su

yeah. But the, there is a name that now I'm missing. Okay. It'll come. But he started to teach and he organized the schools and he had this connection with Christianity too. So we know that now because he opened this school Missionary society. So Mission,

Pam

okay. Yes. A method, a Methodist Missionary Society. Yes.

Su

What happens that things that Akata told maybe it was not accurate. He was not the headmaster of the Shisha University, and there is a theory about the Shisha University that he would change his name and other person and no, it was not there. That it he was not, but he had been or organizing and opening. School also he worked as teacher and he worked for the government. And now we know the connection with GoTo shpe. That was he was the leader of this work that was Sui was doing Taiwan. And after we know that go to SHPE was the mayor of Tokyo during the Canto earthquake. And Thatwe helped people in Tokyo during the spirit of time, and he received an amount of money after that and in recognition for his. Work with helping people. Assisting people, and we know that after that he opens more branches for usi, Reiki Kai. And also he gives the to gate for Tony Village where he was born and is in Shinto Shrine there. And what is

Pam

this story? A what gate?

Su

Story gate that gates that we see in Shinto shrine.

Pam

So he donated it or heated? He

Su

donated. And his name is there. I

Pam

didn't know that. I'm going to, I am going to go visit it when we are in Japan, but

Su

yeah. Cool. It's a beautiful place and they have a shrine there and there you also have a Reiki organization and they like to connect with Reiki people there. Okay.

Pam

So

Su

you can con I can give you the contact if you want.

Pam

I would, thank you. I'm looking forward to that.

Su

Yeah. And yeah,

Pam

we learned a lot then from some of these recent. Yeah. Is there anything that surprised you in what you learned?

Su

I was surprised that he had some years of law school

Pam

that stood out

Su

to you. When I saw it. Oh my god. They had this class, but what showed me is that. During this study of his curriculum, of course, some things we know that he, knowing that he was a teacher he I feel when I read his studies that he has a soul of a teacher and that he had so many, jobs and functions.

Pam

It's so many. It, like a lot.

Su

Yes. Different things. And sometimes we look at our lives and we think if we are going to the right way, this, if this is our path or not. Like we said here, oh, I work with business, I work with law. And then I find out that was not this my pet, this was not my pet. As you said, for you the same. And sometimes people look at the life and said, I'm doing the right thing. Could I be doing the right thing? We are, we can think about is this life, this is the thing that I needed to live the way and then maybe we had this problem should

Pam

Because he definitely was a searcher, like a Sei seeking things, wasn't he?

Su

Exactly. So it for me looks like he was doing, he had lots of experience in life as we did. So this is comfortable for me. When I see it, I feel comfortable because we also thought, oh, I'm going to do the right thing. So it's law, it's business what we are going to do and then suddenly it click it.

Pam

Yep. This is what I'm meant to do. So with alternate currents I know that I probably will speak with Justin Stein in the future, but was there anything what are some of the key things that showed up there that were new to the history of Reiki?

Su

I think what we can talk about alternate currents is about hi Takata history.

Pam

I love that picture of Takata on the cover. She looks so young and vibrant.

Su

Exactly. I to learn about his her life was very embarrassing because she was a strong woman. I didn't know so much about how she became a government in the house that she worked for I don't remember exactly the name in English. Governance. Probably this other word. I don't remember now. She took care of all, everything that works in a huge house of a family, very important in Hawaii. And her husband was taking care of the accountant. Part family. So they worked together and they created a very good life for them and for the kids. They had two kids and she had opportunities and she took these opportunities. But the life was complicated afterwards because. Her husband became sick and they went twice to Japan to seek for medical assistance For him before. I didn't

Pam

know

Su

that. Yeah. So this is very interesting. Her relationship with her husband, her relationship with Japan, and after he passed and she was sick, she also went to Japan to seek this medical assistance and how it was she was introduced to Reiki. There is something very interesting because the medical doctor calls. His assistant, that is his sister actually. And she delivers her to Reiki to heal her. So if you think that was inside a clinic of a medical doctor that was not going to give a surgery to make a surgery. Now it's very complicated. If we think about how things are today, like a medical doctor is going to make a surgery. Oh, I don't want to have a surgery. Why? What can I do? And the person goes to receive Reiki in and the medical doctor says, don't have a surgery. Go to the direct sessions.

Pam

It's not as common today.

Su

No. And the relationship that she had with hii also it's very interesting because. She brings Justin actually, he brings a lot of information about the relationship that she had with Hii and ASHA's family and how Hii explained her behavior. Because her behavior was different from a Japanese woman. She was daughter from Japanese people, but she lived in Hawaii with North American influence. And because of that, she question it. And he had to explain her behavior as a bold person.

Pam

She was bold.

Su

Exactly. Very interesting. So the personality for me is very interesting. He shows a personality for me that is different from what I learned, but also his explanation about the connections of sui and h how he created the techniques that we now know and bio and scanning the use of major Emperor. Also during the practice they have a selection and they use it. They sent the poem that was wrote by emperor Maji and also. How he created Regi Hu and the breathing technique also. And even the Go Kai has an inspiration that came from books that were translated. So many information of this connections that how ui, because ui Reiki, so X Reiki is what he created. This is the energy, but he created techniques that we could use this energy For healing and to grow internally. And he received it, the energy, but how to use it. How people learn it, how people can develop the connection and feel. So it was for soy, it was all about perception. So we have Regie Hall and the bio and scanning, and this is per perception, and it was complicated, but was about perception, how you feel the energy. And these

Pam

are Japanese techniques that Sue is talking about Regio and Sho and OSI scanning. These are some of the Japanese techniques that came, come from the more traditional way of doing Reiki.

Su

Exactly.

Pam

And

Su

if we think about how Reiki was teaching here in the west. Hand positions don't change. You have to use it. And symbols rate symbols in a order to use rate symbols. I learned it that we needed to use the symbols in an order and don't use it. The second symbol without the first symbol. It can harm someone.

Pam

Oh, I didn't learn that, but I did learn that to do that in order. And I think we've discovered that UI sensei himself actually only used one symbol, the distance symbol. Isn't that correct?

Su

Wow. Another book is this one.

Pam

And that's the Spanish version a Spanish book called Reiki Tradition by Hiroshi do. Unfortunately it's not available in English. It's available in Spanish and Japanese.

Su

Exactly. When I receive it, this book, when I purchase this book, it tells here but he's the only one telling this. This is important to to say that uswe only presented the distant symbol and the first and the second symbols that we say as first and second, they were supposed to be introduced during the period of the second president of the Kai Oida. He doesn't say that was introduced by Oida, but during the period, during

Pam

that time.

Su

In that time. So it was not Ussu time. And but he doesn't have a document. That can prove it or give evidence to us. So it's very complicated if we talk about with about it, many historians and teachers from Japan docent say, is the only one that speaks it, but he had access to documents and notes that we don't have access. So does this

Pam

Yeah. Roshi Doy, as I understand it, is the, he is part of the original school or G guy that Yasui Sensei started. And he's also do I Sensei is also, I believe they're historian. Is that correct?

Su

I don't think he's a historian, but he plays a role.

Pam

He plays a role and he has access to the information. Yeah. Okay. Okay.

Su

And and what happens is that here he write this, and I took the master level with him in Japan too. And in the manuals, we have this information too.

Pam

Nice.

Su

He brings this information I prefer to deal with that as a possibility, But nothing, some, not something that we have strong evidence, but a possibility. So this is a possibility. And also for the Gaca members and also for the lineage that came from Choko Yamaguchi and say that is the Reiki they teach the practitioners to not attach to the symbols.

Pam

Okay,

Su

so you can, you have the symbols to help you to do some healing that for you could be difficult. So he introduced the distant symbol because okane that is level two practitioners had difficulty to do the distance he healing. So they could not do it, feel what they call the Heki. That is the perception here in the hands of the energy of the spots that you have to heal. So some of the den level practitioners, they had difficulty with doing the distance healing and because of that, he introduced it, the distance symbol.

Pam

Okay.

Su

But he didn't need to use it.

Pam

He didn't. US

Su

didn't and says that for SOI we need to understand that everything is pre pure conscience. So based on that, your mind, your healing, you can reach any time and any place.

Pam

The pure consciousness.

Su

Exactly.

Pam

I love it. So you are working now with William to create his memoir or and how is that going?

Su

So much fun.

Pam

I bet you're learning so much.

Su

Yes. And he has great stories about his life and I think it's very interesting what we are doing. So we are documenting his life and the development of Reiki because since the very beginning he was developing, so he had the Reiki master class with another practice that was Raku key, And he combined it and created Uswe bed and Reiki. Then he created Kauna Reiki, then he receives holy fire, and there is the the peace grids around the world. So he develop it a lot, right? He has so much to share, and holy fire has so many developments. That are so interesting. But everything is based on his background. So he has a impressive background and he had so many experiences with different kinds of people and he learned a lot with of them. But also he's really intelligent and this all he learn it and he keep it what is important. And he could use it also to understand better how the attunements work and to understand the energy and listen. So the conclusion is what we have today, this big organization that is ICRT and. But the most interesting thing about all, that's not only that he created this big organization and he organized all this historian work, and, but I think that all of that happened because he thinks about what's going to be a good thing for people, how to help them. So this is his mindset. How can I help? How can be more organize it, but for them, how can we do it better for them?

Pam

I love that about him, that his first instinct when he receives enlightenment or information is to share it with people and to the point that sometimes he shares it. Too soon, before the office is ready to handle all the questions and, and before we have all of the information, because he just is so eager to yeah, to just share.

Su

Yes I agree. The new the new upgrade so everybody's okay. Upgrade's coming but he's sharing all round and his feeling and he knows it will come, but he's waiting peacefully about that. So I think it is about it. So how people will have the benefits. How people can benefit from it. So this mindset is what makes this a big organization. So many people thinks about him, about a person of business. He wants to make money. This is something that we read in social media. We know about gossips around that. But what people don't see is that he's working in a professional way to make it work for people. Pam, there is a story that I want to share here.

Pam

Okay.

Su

As you are the break, you have the break business book and this business point of view, when I became an LRTA licensed R master teacher here from Brazil. I had to enhance my class prices. I use it to apply the prices of the medium of the teachers. And I had to raise, because we have our numbers here with all the licensed teachers.

Pam

Yeah. All the licensed teachers charge the same. Yeah,

Su

exactly. So this was a problem for me because Brazilian rea, they they are not so valued. So to use the same price, I would not teach. Because nobody will, would pay,

Pam

nobody

Su

would be

Pam

able to pay.

Su

Be able to pay Exactly. 'cause of

Pam

the Yeah, because

Su

of the, or just I, most part of the society. So I would teach for rich people only. And this was not my desire. And I think this is not the ICRT desire.

Pam

No.

Su

And I had to talk with William about that because I felt the, and also you were one of the people that planted the seed for this during our, during the classes I took with you. So what happened was oh I was discussing with him about it. And he talk with me. One thing important because Brazil people, most of people doesn't have much money. They really, some people cannot have money to eat. So it's very complicated. It is our country that's growing, but we have so much poverty here.

Pam

Okay.

Su

And he said to me one thing that changed everything he wrote to me saying, in enough country that people need to have a job. When you teach, you are given a job to disperse to these people. And for these people to leave from Reiki, they need to receive a money that can sustain his work, their work, partial, partially, or full time. So if you charge a small fee. You are not allowing them to charge more and leave by Reiki. So I had the responsibility as a licensed Reiki master teacher to teach people that they can leave based on their Reiki training.

Pam

Yeah.

Su

They can charge amount of money that is something that they can lead for.

Pam

That's so important. And what a wonderful receiving money for doing Reiki is something that I always struggled with. And I actually received a similar message, believe it or not, from a horse. And he, as I was doing animal communication with this horse, he said, look, you need to start charging for this work because the work is important and if you charge for it. You'll be able to do more of this work. You'll be able to spread more of this work if you, right now you're going and working crazy hours to make money so that you can come and give this away for free. But I really love how William told you that you're also setting an example and you're setting a standard. And if you set your standards too low, then that doesn't give your students room to grow. And he doesn't give them an opportunity to then make a living with this. And he's so wise, I love,

Su

he's changed everything. And I saw his message, we agreed, and then I changed my numbers and wow. I have students. So yes, it work, it

Pam

how often we get stuck in that mentality, don't we? And I know that we do, and I know that I don't actually give discounts on classes. I know some people do, but I've always found that if somebody doesn't value themselves enough to invest in themselves, they're not going to value the energy enough. And they're just, and we're just all wasting everybody's time. And I can remember having a student. Once from the Philippines, and she was so delightful. And I, so I break my payments up so that they're manageable so that people can do it that way. And they don't have to pay half or whatever they can. I think for a level one class, they can pay it in, five payments of $110 each or something. And I can remember this student she had said something similar, Sue, that the our money is just not worth very much. And I said I don't give discounts, but you can break it up as much as you want and take as long as you'd like to pay for it. And she said, okay I can't do the a hundred dollars a month. I said, okay, if you can't do a hundred dollars a month or every two weeks, that's okay. What can you do? She was very specific, $86 a month. I said, that's great. So she began making her payments of $86 a month. She'd studied animal Reiki with me. I think she studied before it was paid for. I don't usually worry about that. I just am not able to send the certificate until the, that's finalized. And I said, that's no problem. I'll just hold onto your certificate. And I think she did have to miss one payment just from life circumstances, but that's it. And otherwise she made those payments of $86 a month. And when she sent the last payment I had, I was so happy I had a little party and she was so happy and so proud of herself. And do you know, she has become the animal Reiki person of the Philippines and she is making a wonderful living now doing what she loves. And I really believe that was part of it, that she invested in herself and, so that's my favorite story about that. Sue, do you have anything to you're just doing such a wonderful job in Brazil. I know that you were talking about the conference being in person at some point, and I told you that whether I'm invited or not, I'm coming and because I really wanna come and visit and meet all the beautiful people that I've had the opportunity to meet online a few times now. And but yeah. Do you have anything that you wanna leave people with before we go into a meditation today?

Su

I think the conference was so nice and it was really good to, to receive all of you here in Brazil. I think you, we also were talking about how this Reiki here in Brazil. And I think what I would like to share probably people around doesn't know much, but re's really strong here in Brazil is getting each time stronger. And you know that here in Brazil we have the Reiki in our public hospitals. We have public hospitals in Brazil that people don't need to pay for receiving medical assistance. And the public hospitals now they have Reiki also. It's some hospitals, not all hospitals. And and here in Brazil also is the second country in scientific research about the evidence of Reiki. So yeah, second country. Oh yeah,

Pam

I know that. There's a veterinarian, Claudia, who we know from Brazil who's written. Who's published a paper on the scientific evidence behind Animal Reiki, which I just received recently. I'm delighted to. Yeah. Actually I realized that as she was talking about it in your in your conference, in, in one of the group sessions that I was in. And so I asked her for a copy and she's delighted to have it shared. I did not realize that you had that much scientific research in Brazil around this. That's amazing.

Su

Yeah. We are the second country. The first is United States. And Claudia Barbieri is, colleague, e student and also your student too. And she's doing a very good job now. She's with the CRR too. So yeah the, this the Center

Pam

for Reiki Research Yes.

Su

Is there too. She is working with them for the concert. So yeah, she's doing a great job with that.

Pam

You just gave me an idea. I think I'm going to, I

Su

know,

Pam

Bring maybe her and Angela Coles on to talk about the Center for Reiki Research. And for anybody who's listening, if you really are interested, like Sue and I are about the scientific background around Reiki, just check them out. There's a free membership that will give you access to a lot of the scientific papers around Reiki. They have an annual conference. And this is a sister organization to the ICRT that William had a hand in creating actually. So it's, it, I didn't realize they were connected, but when I was, as a scientist, desperately searching for evidence and science to support what I was vis, experiencing and watching happen the Center for Reiki research was who I came, who I found and there's just so much great information there. Yeah. Thank you, Sue, for bringing that up.

Su

Yeah. I thought you would like to know this, but yes.

Pam

Yeah.

Su

But yeah, I think with this information about, about here I am, I feel complete and I would like to thank you so much, Pam for being here, for inviting me. And you are now in Porto Beo great place. I hope one day I will visit you there. Take one. I hope

Pam

you'll come to Campobello too. Yes, I,

Su

yeah. Yeah. A beautiful place. And yeah, thank you so much for everybody that's listening and I hope this talk could assist you somehow or help you somehow.

Pam

I hope so too. Will you stay and join us for the meditation, Sue?

Su

Of course. I would love to.

Pam

I love that. Everyone, I just want to lead us in a short meditation today that will connect us with our own lineage of Reiki, whatever that might be. I really one of the other things that impresses me about William is how open and excited he is to work with every lineage. And, I just love that about the ICRT, so I just invite everyone to just take a moment to bring your awareness to your breath, maybe place your hands in Gassho activating Reiki and breathe. And as you breathe, just feel yourself here in your body in this moment. And then just placing your hands over your heart. Bringing your awareness to your heart and just imagining or noticing the beautiful light of Reiki in your heart space. This is your connection to Reiki, and as you sit with this awareness of this Reiki energy in your heart, just take a moment to notice that this light is not yours alone. It has been carried through time, through hands, through hearts, through generations of practitioners, through cultures, all the way back to Macau Yasui. Take a moment to just feel into that connection, like a family tree going all the way back. And regardless of how we practice, there are different techniques and tools and beliefs and understandings and interpretations, and just notice that none of that matters. We're all connected and we're all one. And every single person who has ever practiced or taught Reiki has done so with the best of intentions and with a pure heart. And so we take a moment to acknowledge and honor all of the lineages, all of the interpretations, all of the practitioners from the beginning and this connection. They may begin to feel alive, present, flowing, moving, dynamic. You may notice a line of light behind you to your teacher, your practitioner, their teacher, their practitioner. Each of the moments of healing, everything connected, it's all part of the same current. And now that current flows into you through your crown, into your heart, into your hands, and as it flows, just feel into that deep sense of belonging. You are part of this lineage. You're not separate from it. You're within it, living it, breathing it. And as you sit here in Reiki, you may even ask, how does Reiki wish to express through me? And let's just take a few moments to listen. You don't have to come up with an answer. Just allow an answer to flow through. How does Reiki wish to express through me at this moment in time? And just notice what comes up now. Take a deep breath in and as you exhale, just feel that lineage rooted within you, that history. It's alive, and we take a moment to say thank you to the teachers who've come before us, and the descendants who will follow us. We are so blessed to be of this lineage of Reiki, this lineage of light bringers creating wellness on the earth today. You creating wellness within you, within your circle of influence, and when you decide to come back, bring that beautiful connection to that history back with you. That beautiful sense of interconnectedness, of cooperation of. Definiteness of purpose. You take a moment now just to say thank you to each other. Each group that comes together is divinely ordered and everyone listening to this podcast, regardless of when you listen, we are all connected. Take a moment to think of your Reiki teacher. Send blessings and thanks to them, and then go back to their teacher, whether you know who it is or not, and so on and so forth until you come to Mrs. Ada. Dr. Hii Yasui, sensei, sensei, whomever your lineage connects through, whether you know it or not, just send blessings and thanks back through the line until we land it. Macau Yasui, when we say thank you for dedicating your life to the pursuit ofe. This form of enlightenment that we bring into our daily lives, it's not something to escape to, but it's something to bring into the here and now. We are so grateful that through your efforts we get to experience the magic that is Reiki in our everyday lives. Thank you and take a deep breath. When you're ready to come back with that knowledge that li lineage and that connection is always there. You are part of something incredible. We have an opportunity to share with others on the planet, other people who are ready to welcome this into their lives. Namaste. Sue, thank you for being here and for people listening. Thank you so much for the light that you're spreading in the world. We really appreciate you.

Su

Thank you.

Pam

Bye everyone.