How Do I Do This: An Environmental Career Podcast
How Do I Do This: An Environmental Career Podcast
S2 E16 Christian Friis - Canadian Wildlife Service, ECCC
Spending much of his childhood outside in nature, Christian Friis grew to realize the beauty and power of nature. While attending Mount Allison University, he volunteered for Long Point Bird Observatory. This experience would solidify where he would focus his career - bird conservation. Christian now works for the Canadian Wildlife Service, Ontario Region as a Wildlife Biologist, where he focusses on shorebird monitoring and conservation.
Websites and Links mentioned:
Elder Dr. Albert Marshall Two Eyed Seeing Talk: https://youtu.be/DTJtAdH9_mk
Two-Eyed Seeing TEDTalk: https://youtu.be/bA9EwcFbVfg
Native Lands Website: https://nativelands.ca/
21 Things You May Not Know About the Indian Act: https://www.ictinc.ca/blog/21-things-you-may-not-have-known-about-the-indian-act-
James Bay Shorebird Project Volunteer: https://www.jamesbayshorebirdproject.com/volunteer
Ontario Shorebird Survey: https://www.canada.ca/en/environment-climate-change/services/bird-surveys/shorebird/ontario.html
Breeding Bird Survey: https://www.canada.ca/en/environment-climate-change/services/bird-surveys/landbird/north-american-breeding/overview.html
Marsh Monitoring Program: https://www.birdscanada.org/bird-science/marsh-monitoring-program/
Canadian Wildlife Services Regional Offices: https://www.canada.ca/en/environment-climate-change/services/species-risk-act-accord-funding/contact-canadian-wildlife-service-regional-offices.html
Christian Friis on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/christian-friis-5b000a1/
A Passion for Wildlife Book: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/3733218-a-passion-for-wildlife
Canadian Wildlife Service Website: https://www.canada.ca/en/services/environment/wildlife-plants-species.html
Thank you so much to Christian for sharing his time and knowledge with us!
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I recorded this episode on the Williams Treaty, signed in 1923 by 7 Anishnaabe First Nations. The closest community to me is the Mississaugas of Scugog Island First Nation. This region is the traditional territory of the Anishnaabe and Haudenosaunee peoples, which they shared peacefully under the Dish with One Spoon Wampum agreement. Today, it is still home to many First Nations, Metis, and Inuit peoples.
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Hello, and welcome to all my fellow may flowers. I'm your host, Meredith Meeker. And this is another episode of how do I do this and environmental career podcast. May is an amazing month. The biting bugs aren't out yet. Everything is green. And it is finally warm enough to leave the jacket at home, but you're not going to wilt from the sun. It is a perfect time to check out a new trail or brush up on some wildlife ID. I know this week's guest is a big fan of spring, probably because of all the wonderful birds that are making their way back to Canada. Christian Friess is a wildlife biologist at the Canadian wildlife service, a branch of the environment and climate change. Canada Christian started off volunteering at long point bird observatory, and now he's built a career in bird conservation, focusing on shorebirds. I hope you all enjoy this conversation as much as I did. So let's get into it. So, speaking of how gorgeous the weather has been and, you know, spring feels like maybe it'll come early this year. Do you have a favorite place to get outside and explore and connect with nature?
Christian Friis:Oh, man, it's really hard to, that's a hard one to nail down because there's just so many places of beauty in the world. I I've been fortunate enough to go to a number of places in Canada overseas, and I guess nailing it down to places that I've worked in specifically in the job that I'm in now. I think down a long point, it's the North shore of Lake Erie. It's just a beautiful place. The, the Lake is magic. The, the landscape is so. Wonderful. I mean, there's a lot of agriculture, but there's remnant patches of curling in forest there. This, the spit itself long point itself is just it's untouched, wilderness, it's remote and difficult to access. And yeah, spent many, many weeks out at the end of the, of belonged point open life. So I think that's the one spot for sure.
Meredith Meeker:That's awesome. And yeah, that's pretty rare to have still in Southern Ontario, a piece of kind of untouched wilderness and definitely a great place. If you like birds.
Christian Friis:Yeah, no question like right now, it's getting pretty, pretty hopping down there. The bays opened up and there's ducks everywhere, so it's pretty sweet.
Meredith Meeker:Awesome. So Christian, you are a wildlife biologist. Can you tell us kind of what you do on an average day maybe? And why does, what you do is so important?
Christian Friis:Right. Okay. Well, I mean, pre COVID times there were things would be a little bit different than they are now. Now spend a bit more time in front of a computer, but typically I would be in, in the field from late April until the end of October. So that would primarily be conducting bird surveys for the programs that I'm involved in with the Canadian wildlife service. And so that takes me to places around the great lakes. It takes me up into the boreal forest. It takes me as far North, as you can go in Ontario up into James Bay. So that's yeah, I guess that's the. The S the field season aspect of my duties. And then I have over the winter time, of course, with all the information that we've collected that needs to get digitized and disseminated and shared and reported on with partners and with appropriate title holders and whatnot. So, yeah, there's a bit more computer administrative stuff in the, off season. But a lot of our time is, or a lot of my time and a lot of my colleagues time in CWS, or we spend out in, out in the field.
Meredith Meeker:That's awesome. I think it's pretty cool when you, when you get a job that has a really large field portion, because I do find a little bit, you know, as you advance in your career in certain areas, you start to lose some of that field aspect and you get more and more behind a computer. So it's really nice to hear. How about positions where there's always a little bit of a balance.
Christian Friis:Yeah. Yeah. I think, I mean, that's one of the keys for me is having that balance. And that's currently out of balance at the moment. So that's been a little bit of a mental hurdle for me for the past little bit, but yeah, I think for, someone in wildlife biology or wildlife science, that the ability to go out and actually practice what you've learned and experienced things out on the land and share that experience with people in whatever way that might be, whether it's through scientific publications or presentations at conferences or visiting communities to share the information with them. I think yeah, that kind of, yeah. The field aspect for me is certainly the, the key driver that gets me up in the morning.
Meredith Meeker:That's awesome. And just curious, these, this information that, you know, obviously in six months of field work, you're collecting a lot of data. Does that go to scientific papers or how is that data used
Christian Friis:in a variety of ways? So at the root of what CWS is responsible for are the status assessments of, of bird populations and conserving those populations. So, we did basically go from a at a minimum of reporting internally and then sharing that with, with partners on our projects, because we can't do this alone. A lot of the work that I'm involved in has multiple partners and partnerships that run pretty deep and a lot of information sharing among all these people and organizations But then there's also more broad dissemination through popular articles. So in things like birdwatch Canada, for example, versus Canada's publication or Ontario field ornithologist through their newsletter or through their quarterly journal or another couple of examples, and then there's more broad science, heavy science related paper writing, where we write up official results, publish in, you know, some novel information or novel techniques that we've applied in the field and I've learned and, and try to share with the rest of the scientific community.
Meredith Meeker:Awesome. Okay. So this is the cell sounds really cool to me. But I'm guessing you didn't start off in this role. Can you walk us through a little bit of your journey and, and how you became a wildlife biologist with CWS?
Christian Friis:Sure. Yeah, that was a. If you asked me 15, 20 years ago where I would be at this would have been so far from what I had in my mind. I've I was, I've been very fortunate to have a lot of time out in nature when I was a kid. My grandparents had a cottage outside of Ottawa that I spent a lot of the summers at. I have family in Norway and so we would go visit family overseas from time to time and spend time in the mountains and in summer and winter time. So getting to experience all of that the seasons and nature and being out in that. So I always had this affinity for wanting to work somehow with animals and out in the wild as it were. And I guess. Where am I, my path ultimately directed me or where I was directed on the path that led me to where I am now, all stems from one small little volunteer gig down at a long point bird observatory. When I was still an undergrad partway through my, through my time there, I had four to five weeks before a position started out in Newfoundland. I was going to work on this whale-watching company tour boat. And that was just to pay the bills for school and whatnot. So I had this period of time where I had nothing really on my plate, and this poster was up in the biology department for volunteering, for what was called the project. And I looked at that and I thought, well, that works out pretty sweet. I got that month. And that's when they need somebody. And let me see if they'll take me on. And so sending my application and Almost right away, found out from the, the fellow who was running the project, David hustle. So yeah, we're definitely keen on taking you in and when can you start kind of thing? So that small little project that I got involved in and spent, you know, four weeks cause it was more than just working with the Teresa Walla project when you're down at the observatory, you get involved in as much or as little as you want, but if you're there volunteering, they might as well soak in as much information as you can, especially as a student part way through undergrad. That was like, I was just a sponge, just taking in as much as it could. And that, that four weeks I got to handle live birds, learn how to trap and tag birds. And it, it really solidified for me what I wanted to do and that was bird conservation. And so. That then I finished off my undergrad and like anyone with a, an undergrad degree you put to practice right away and I pumped gas for six months and I traveled a little bit, but then I came back to reality and volunteered for a couple of seasons that long point bird observatory. And so, again, as in a very fortunate position to be able to do that where I didn't have massive debt looming over top of me. I didn't have to pay rent because when you volunteer at the observatory or all that room and board is covered. So a lot of circumstances, I, I feel very fortunate and privileged to been that have come my way, but then. That eventually led to a job with the, with the observatory. And I worked for them for a number of years before eventually applying to Kenya wildlife service where most of fooled somebody, but I got in and here I am.
Meredith Meeker:That's awesome. It sounds like maybe there's a couple of reasons why long point is one of your favorite places to go then if it's this
Christian Friis:journey. Yeah, totally. I think you're starting to see the image crystallized why that place is near and dear to me,
Meredith Meeker:that's, that's super awesome. And you know, I do think I'm happy to acknowledge that your privilege of being able to take a volunteer. Opportunity. Cause I know from our members, this is something that a lot of people are starting to struggle with. Like rent is super high, but maybe it is a good advice to go find out if you're having trouble getting a job, find a volunteer opportunity that has room and board included or something that maybe makes it a little more
Christian Friis:accessible. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Because I've been asked that question in the past, so, you know, what would you recommend I do, I want to get I want to get into this kind of field and that I always say volunteering, but then over the years of saying that I realized that not everyone can do that. Not everyone has the, the privilege, frankly, to be able to afford to do that. And yeah, I, yeah, very, very fortunate. So,
Meredith Meeker:and you know, there, there are ways to do it and whether you need to pump gas. To pay the bills while, you know, finding these other volunteer opportunities. There, there are ways to, to get it done for sure. And I guess going back to that, that piece of advice, do you, do you have any advice besides volunteer for either you would give yourself when you were first starting or somebody, you know, out of scratch out of school and wants to know how do I become a wildlife biologist?
Christian Friis:Yeah. That's volunteering is certainly a key, I think experience is one of those things that you can't get in a textbook and you can't get it in the lab in a lab setting like an undergraduate programs. And I think that that is a key. So if you can, if you can spend even a little bit of time volunteering And your idea of looking for opportunities where that room and board is included with, with that position is, is a key one. I guess if I was looking back at myself and say, you know, I was trying to give myself advice about how I can get to where I am now. I think I would, I would probably say that take the time to think about what it is that you're doing and what you're finishing. And so what you're getting involved in and how to tackle that in a meaningful way I think is really important because as a young person, I was very quick to answer. I would submit stuff faster with a than I should've. And I hadn't thought through a lot of the not ramifications, but I hadn't thought through the, the objective of what I was trying to accomplish. And so that's another piece. I think that I would say to a younger Christian Friess would be just, just slow down and, and think, think things through a little bit cause yeah, one, one or two little changes in the way you approach something can really affect the quality of your work. For sure. So,
Meredith Meeker:yes, I, I hear you. I feel like, you know, I'm starting out in your career, there almost feels like a lot of pressure to get things done, but you know, sometimes taking a little bit more time and having a better quality product, that's going to make you stand out more than getting things done quickly, I think.
Christian Friis:Yeah. Yeah. I agree. And I think that's PR Meredith probably at the root of what it is is that you, I didn't have anything. Sort of in the hopper, as it were to prove with a piece of paper apart from a university degree to say like, here's some stuff I've worked on or here's some accomplishments. So, I guess quality over quantity in the early stages is certainly is certainly key.
Meredith Meeker:I actually questioned so from other, you know, biologists and ecologists, I've spoken to a lot of them have had to get a master's in order to do research. Is that something that in with Canadian wildlife service, is that required now? Was it required then? Or where does higher education come into that?
Christian Friis:Yeah, really good question Meredith. So to be honest, right now, I wouldn't qualify for my job. There's so many high skilled. Talented people coming out of school now. And part of the reason they're so, so well educated is that there's a dearth of positions available in this field. It's difficult to find long-term gigs that aren't, you know, contract work that you would pick up for six months or so. And until you're still, you're looking, always looking for a job, always trying to find that next next pay day kind of thing. So in today's application process for a CWS, having a master's degree isn't essential, but if you have one, it's an asset to your application. And so. That's where I don't have a master's degree. I had a wealth of experience from my time at long point bird observatory. And I think that's what set me up for success in the wildlife service. I came in on a contract with them and then worked contractor contract with them for quite some time before getting a full-time gig or applying to and winning a position for full-time position. And nowadays I just see the, the quality of people that are coming out that have a master's or a PhD, and they're applying to entry-level positions and not getting them because there are so many people who are applying for them. And so I guess saying that it. Sorta discouraging to, to young applicants and young wildlife biologists out there. But I don't think that has to be the case. Like the there are there are ways to make yourself stand out. And I think that experience aspect is the key, the key one there that would for sure get you going. In addition to having that extra education I mean, again, we talked about privilege and like a lot of people can't afford to go beyond an undergraduate. If they even get an undergraduate degree, they may go for a college diploma. Mr. It's expensive man, to go to school. Like university is crazy. The debt is crushing. I have friends who are still paying off debt and they're in their forties and that's like, that's intense. So I guess, yeah, bringing it back to the actual question about whether having a master's degree or not matters. I think, I think it does matter now. But I wouldn't let that deter you from applying to positions that have been as don't have it as a requirement. Most of the jobs, the entry-level positions don't have a graduate school or graduate diplomas as a, as a requirement, more of an asset.
Meredith Meeker:That's great advice. Thank you. And yeah, I think it's good that it comes back to experience and yeah. I mean, there are a lot of scholarships available as well, even for master's students and the amount of money that isn't claimed every year is like astonishing. My, my partners in the education field. And so I get all the numbers from him and I'm always like, like, I don't understand how that happens, but so hopefully if there's a will, there's a little bit of a way.
Christian Friis:Yeah. I think digging for sure. If you're like, if there are opportunities like that for scholarships digging a little bit with some determination, I think is important. If, if, like you say, if there's a will, there's a way I think you can find solutions that might benefit you overall.
Meredith Meeker:And it probably makes sense if you're going to take on this debt or go into that extra level of work, you really know why you're doing it. And you've got that extra level of commitment in the first place.
Christian Friis:Yeah. As opposed to just picking it up because you can't find a work
Meredith Meeker:for sure. Yeah, and I, and I do think that happens quite often. So I'm really excited for this next question. You've worked all over Ontario. Do you have a favorite project that you've worked
on?
Christian Friis:Oh, man. Yeah, for sure. I think one project that I worked on for, for about a decade James Bay shorebird project, that that project is unreal, the, the location. So we fly in by helicopter to these remote field camps in the moose Creek home moose, Cree first nation homelands. We rent cabins from community members and We're very fortunate to share the land and have, get access and be able to use those pieces of property. And the, the nature and the landscape up there is unbelievable that there are hundreds of thousands of shorebirds. There are tens of thousands of waterfall. And we're up there at a time during the autumn migration. So birds are coming South and staging in James Bay and along the coastline of James Bay and fattening up for their migration. In some of these birds, they travel like 30,000 kilometers round trip. They'll do a single shot flight from James Bay to South America. And, you know, these are like 180 gram animals. And you get to watch these birds fatten up. They show up as like little scrawny boney things. And by the time they're gone, they're these fat turkeys is ready for the oven, but they're off they go. They, they pick up and to see this it's, there was that's something I've I I'd never seen before going up to that part of the world. Birds congregating in flocks of thousands and chirping and calling and flopping and the restlessness within the crowd. And then they all pick up and they fly and they start flying in circles. And this big group kind of like a tornado. And then. Dodd bird will fall off the group and fly back down to the coastline. And you know that bird's not ready to go and all these other birds are going up and you'll see more birds coming off the pack. Cause they're not quite ready. They're not fat enough or something's in the air. And this is what I find most amazing about birds is they just, they know so much more than we do about the natural world. They're way more attuned to things that we would just are oblivious to, you know, changes in pressure changes in the wind direction. All of a sudden little things like that. You can tell there's going to be some kind of a shift in your day that in the coming days, when you see thousands of birds pick up and just book it and they go like kilometers into the atmosphere and then gone and yeah. You know, a couple of days later. Yeah. Onslaught with Arctic winds and rain and all kinds of stuff. And you're like, Oh yeah, I guess that's why they left. But yeah, that James Bay is unbelievable. It's, it's beautiful. And once you're dropped off, their helicopter is gone. You're with your crew four or so people it's just you in the LX. It's pretty sweet.
Meredith Meeker:That, that sounds kind of unreal, to be honest, like maybe you have to go to like Africa or something on a Safari to see that kind of wildlife. So it's a really great reminder of what we still have in Ontario and what we need to protect here in Ontario.
Christian Friis:No question. Yeah. And that is one of the objectives of the project was to provide the, some of that monitoring data towards a broader conservation. Of the land. So we're getting, it seems, it looks like they're steps towards that, which is encouraging for sure. But yeah, the James Bay man, eat this, the only place in Canada, you can see a Pelican and a beluga. Like it's, it's crazy.
Meredith Meeker:I don't think people think of those as like Ontario species.
Christian Friis:No, no, like there's an ocean up there, you know, it's that's cool. Anyhow,
Meredith Meeker:that's very, very cool. I mean, I guess maybe this goes into this, but what's the best part of your job?
Christian Friis:Oh, man. Being on the field. It's no question this like there's days where I have to remind myself that this is a job, you know, I'm just, I'm out birding for all intents and purposes and getting paid for it. So it's. That's unbelievable. That's what I was saying earlier. If you'd asked me 20 years ago, where, where do you think you'd be? I never would have said in this really sweet position right now, counting birds, actually.
Meredith Meeker:That's the question. Before you had that volunteer position at long point, were you already a birder or did long point make you a birder?
Christian Friis:It made me a birder. Yeah. Yeah, totally. Yeah. I, I actually, I was one of, many of my fellow students at Mount Allison university who thought they were going to be a doctor or a veterinarian when they started in biology. And I remember the first week, this frosh week, the Dean of science brought all the frosh into the auditorium to have that conversation about. So who wants to be a doctor, you know, half the auditorium puts their hands up and who wants to be a vet, you know, sprinkling the people here and there. And it's like, well, One of you is going to be a doctor and none of you are going to be veterinarians sort of thing is like, wow, that's harsh. And then he explained why this, the, the academics behind getting into those fields is so competitive. And you have to have such high marks not to say that you don't have to have high marks to get into wildlife biology or other fields, but the competition for those two kinds of roles in our society are very challenging. And that, that kinda woke me up. I thought it's like, Oh yeah, I'll just be a vet. No problem. But
Meredith Meeker:yeah, no problem getting into vet school. I also wonder because that's a very, I don't want to say similar story to me, but growing up, I thought I was going to be a vet. That's what I was going to do, but it was because I loved animals and I wanted to work with animals. I just didn't know about all these other. Really cool options, because I think being a wildlife biologist is kind of cooler being of that. Please, please don't hate me for that. But I think it's pretty cool.
Christian Friis:Yeah. I mean, they each have their cool aspects. Right. But I guess it depends where you're, where you're coming from, but yeah, for sure. The the love of animals I think, was like, I think I can relate to you there Meredith where that's, that was where I was coming from. And didn't, didn't realize exactly what that meant. And it took that experience to crystallize it down at the observatory for me. So
Meredith Meeker:those, those experiences, like, you never know when they're going to happen, but they're pretty cool and very memorable when they do. I think I've mentioned this before my podcast, but I saw Rose breasted. Grosbeak at the Rouge national park and I. It was like, what is that? I had only seen blue Jays and Cardinals and sparrows before, and I was like, well, I'm going to be a birder. And ever since then, it's
Christian Friis:every weekend. They're so gorgeous. They're unbelievable birds. Yeah.
Meredith Meeker:So we've talked a lot about the really cool, really great aspects of your job. But obviously, you know, it's very easy to find your dream job if it was only the good stuff. So what's what, yeah. So what's the most challenging or unexpected part of your job,
Christian Friis:boy? You know, there's irritating stuff like administration and budgeting and things like that. I think he could easily. Tick off the boxes for them as being, you know, unexpected but challenging at times. But I think, and this may just be a recency bias speaking for me, but we're in the process of reconciliation and that we've, I've been taking a lot of courses and doing a fair amount of reading on how we can reconcile the way colonization has treated our indigenous friends. And that I think is for me personally, some of the most challenging thinking that I've had to do in the past decade. And it's, it's certainly a very important topic, but it also makes you realize just how privileged you are and or how privileged I am, I should say. And That there are certain things that are ingrained in our way of thinking and that, you know, it goes from everything to how I conduct a project, how I communicate with colleagues, how I communicate with partner agencies, you know, there's a certain systemic bias that I have until recently not been aware of. And that, I think that has been one of the more challenging things for me to come to terms with is that I have I come from a place of privilege and I, I don't know the experiences that a lot of these community members have have faced across our country and in other lands that had been colonized. And it's, it's a hard thing to face, but it's very important, I think, and for all of us to get to that state of knowing and understanding so that we can. Work together meaningfully and for both of our benefits, not just for one or the other, I think that's one of the key messages that keeps coming back to me from a lot of this reading I've been doing. And a lot of the sessions I've been attending is that it's not, there's not one way or the other it's this thing called two eyed, seeing that I'd been reading a lot about, and you know, that bringing those two views together to see in a way that benefits, everything is, you know, trying to prop with some of that stuff into practice. And it's, it's not easy for sure, but it's very important. So, I guess that, I guess I would say that's one of the more challenging things that I've had to go through.
Meredith Meeker:Well, thank you for, for bringing that up. I'm kind of at the beginning of my own personal education and, and knowledge journey, I just finished reading 21 things you may not know about the Indian act. Right. Really great, really short read. I kind of recommend every Canadian should, should read that because I agree you can't read it and be, and see things the same way. I don't think. But do you have any, you know, resources, if you know, somebody listening was like, well, I kind of want to start that journey. Or maybe something on two eyed seeing, cause that hasn't been something that's come up on the podcast before, but, but I've heard of it in the past.
Christian Friis:Yeah. I'd recommend it. Just simply Googling to, I'd seeing there's some good YouTube webinars that are held by the, the originator of those ideas. There's native lands.ca is another good web resource. Those are two that come to mind off the top of my head you're referenced to the, that book is is very, is very apt. It's a very good, very good read for sure. So that would be another resource that I would recommend.
Meredith Meeker:Awesome. Thank you. We'll provide links to all of those in our show notes. So anybody listening can, can check those out. I guess getting back into more career stuff. Have you been part of the hiring process or what does the hiring process look like with the Canadian wildlife service and yeah. What are you looking forward to new hire?
Christian Friis:Yeah, so I have been involved primarily in sort of a co-op hiring situations. I haven't sat on what they call a, a, like a formal process. But I've been involved in sort of the development of those kinds of things and what I look for. And I've said this a couple of times on the podcast so far, but is, is experience. And that's if, if I'm looking to bring someone in to work with me on a project, a field project, cause there's other, other students that are bringing in as well, that are more computer based, so GIS or database management type of person, but with field, a field hand, as it were, or field technician The people that stand out are those that have even more small amount of experience outside of school, whether it's they're, they've volunteered for a project or they during a course at school, they conducted a couple of days of a couple of days in the field. Those just even those small little things are things that I try to tap into. There's, I mean, some of the quality that I looked for an individual relates to that being out in the field side of things too. So if there's not necessarily experience when it comes to surveying birds, because that's something that you can learn those techniques behind them that is and of course learning bird identification, you can bring that, that can come to you as well. That doesn't have to be. Although, it's certainly a really important for some of the work that we do that it's not necessarily a requirement and it can be, you can learn that over time. And especially if you're coming in as a co-op student or a part-time volunteer with, with the project. And so in addition to that, it's the, the skillset of being able to live out in the Bush. Can you are you able to commute, can you paddle a canoe? Can you drive a boat? Are you able to spend a week in a tent? Can you start a fire on your own? Can you, do you know how to survive in the wilderness without anything more than what you'd gotten your back? Have you prepared for that stuff? So, you know, things like, have you, have you gone to an overnight camp? Have you, are you an active canoeist you love camp? I mean, maybe love is the wrong word, but do you enjoy camping? Do you I've experienced with that kind of thing? Those are, those are things that I look for and I think are inherent in a lot of the qualities of people who are sort of compass towards a wildlife biology type of role that they love being outside. Typically. They are able to do a lot of that camping related stuff because when it comes down to it for field work, we're camping, a lot of the time we don't have, you know, we're not living out of a hotel or we don't have a field base that's close by. So being able to live in that kind of a situation and also then apply some skills that are. Supportive of monitoring birds and that kind of thing, I think are two of the, the keys that I, that I look for, at least when I'm looking over people,
Meredith Meeker:I you've mentioned this maybe a couple of times, are there opportunities to volunteer with CWS?
Christian Friis:Yeah, for sure. So that the James Bay project that I mentioned that it was primarily volunteer based we had, we would have a couple of paid staff who were in charge of the field crews. But aside from that, it was, it was all volunteers. Another project that I coordinate the Ontario shorebird survey is a volunteer based survey. A lot of the, actually a lot of the projects that we run nationally are volunteers. So breeding bird survey, for example, or Marsh monitoring project out of birds, Canada. A lot of those citizen science types type of projects are, are volunteer based, but specifically within CWS, yes, there are, there are certainly opportunities or are waterbird biologists. Folks are keen to bring on volunteers in the summertime for their colonial waterbird monitoring can to goose banding and waterfowl banding. We bring in volunteers to do that kind of work. So yeah, there, there are certainly opportunities, I guess, the hard thing for anyone coming in or who's new to the biology realm, wildlife biology field is knowing who to talk to and who to contact. And so that doesn't have a really easy answer, I guess, because unfortunately our federal directory isn't. The most up-to-date system it's makes it very difficult to find people. But there are generic inboxes that are a good place to start. So if you go onto our website, the environment and climate change, Canada website, and look for. Ontario region or can AOL I service Ontario region. There's a few generic boxes, inboxes that can receive messages that can direct those to the appropriate people. I guess the other thing I would say, and this might set me up for a fair amount of replying, but I'd be happy to put people in touch who are listening right now to the podcast. It'd be happy to put them in touch with individuals within the organization that may have similar interests or may have opportunities for volunteering. Because I think, like I said, a few times now the volunteering side of the thing I think is one of the it's rewarding. It also gives you an opportunity to learn whether or not you want to do what it is you think you want to do. And without any strings attached, because you're just you're. I mean, maybe I shouldn't say just, but you're, you're volunteering, so you may not. Realize that you don't want to be on a boat all the time, or I don't like camping in the middle of black fly season. That sucks. You know, so I think that is another thing for, just for your own self to know what, what you're comfortable with and whether or not that is truly what you're, what you're after. So, yeah.
Meredith Meeker:Okay. That's awesome. And yes, you may regret putting yourself out there, but I really do hope people, you know, take advantage and, and find those, find those opportunities. And I know that applying to federal jobs they're usually a very standardized form. So is there something that people can do to make their application stand out?
Christian Friis:Unfortunately at the very outset, because it's a very automated standardized system, it makes it very difficult to stand out because you're essentially. It's not really like this, but you're essentially trying to check off boxes that are searched for within the application itself. So the poster will have specifics about what the job requires what are assets to the job and any other information about the position. So it's really important that the, that poster is read thoroughly and all of the links are opened within it. So people don't miss one small thing, like saying you speak English, for example, if that isn't in your application, you know, it should be obvious that you're writing it down in application, but that's just some of the silly ways I've seen people get excluded from competitions. They, they missed one or two small little things. Like they didn't write that they had a G license for example, or whatever, just small things like that. But for. So for the, like the co-op student kind of approach that I had been involved in, in this, those applications that stand out to me the most are the ones that are more of a personal side of things. They have a very short resume, very fitted to the position. They don't go off on extraneous things and show like I worked at Danny's and I had a job at penny saver, you know, going back in time, it's very directed to the position you're applying for. And your cover letter is the place where you get to make your first impression on the person. Who's actually reading your application for the job, because you got to remember whoever picks up that paper is the person ultimately deciding whether it goes forward or not. And it could probably could, well be the one individual who makes the decision to hire or not to hire. So having that, that cover letter personalized in a way that it addresses the organization. Some of the projects that, that you're interested in working on within that organization. You know, some maybe a fun fact about yourself that can make you stand out from the crowd, have a memorable thing for the person reading the paper, I think is key. Now that I say all this, but with the online application process for the indeterminate positions and things like that within the federal public service, there's less opportunity for that at the outset. But if you put that stuff into your cover letter, cause I think the text box is, has a lot of space for a number of characters in there. We can put that stuff in the cover letter space you have you still have that opportunity for people who are then picking up all the papers they receive for all the applicants that make it through that first initial HR step. Cause that's what it boils down to is whether you've, like I said, at the beginning, whether you check off all those boxes to get through to the next phase, and then the hiring manager gets to look at at your paperwork and then they make decisions on who to interview and are sorry, who to test and interview and all that stuff. So the, the application process can be very daunting for sure, to the federal public service. And it's once you've been through it once I would recommend people just do it, they find a job that they're interested in D in applying for, and just apply to see what happens. The know that it's going to be a little bit tricky to get through all the different stages, because it's, you're often competing against hundreds of other individuals. And like I said, if you miss a key piece of information, you get bumped by the computer and it's, it's a bummer.
Meredith Meeker:Yeah. Yeah, no kidding. So I guess really, really read that job poster.
Christian Friis:Yeah, the PO for, for a federal public service jobs, the job poster gives you every bit of information you could possibly need to speak to your skill set. So, you know, working in bird monitoring have you had survey experience, you know, how to trap birds? You know, those are asset qualifications, asset qualifications aren't as aren't required, but they put you up in above those that have all the required. So that's what I was saying about a masters. It's often an asset qualification, whereas a sort of a bachelor's degree is a requirement. And so you may have somebody, who's got a bachelor's, they've got Burbank experience. They run a breeding bird survey route, and they've worked on the James Bay shorebird project, but they don't have a masters. Then you have that same line of information. And the differences only difference with the next person is they have a master's well, that puts them ahead. Of that individual in that scenario there are obviously places for experienced trumping credentials. So if you have lots of experience that that's where, and you don't have a master's degree, for example, that's where you're going to want to highlight that in your, in your application form.
Meredith Meeker:Awesome. Thank you. That's a, that's a lot of great advice. We're going to move a little bit more away from careers and I don't know how you're going to top the James Bay story with thousands of ducks, you know, taking flight at once, but do you have a favorite nature moment? We call it nature because nature is so neat. So either while you were at work or, or it could be while you're traveling where, you know, nature took your breath away.
Christian Friis:Yeah. Well, I think you hit the nail on the head talking about James Bay that we, I spent About two months up at a place North of the Albany river called chickeny point. And this, this place was where we are, where the field camp was situated. W happened to be, we didn't know this at the time, but happened to be smack in the middle of a flight path. So birds would come from the North to the South every day. And so you would literally stand at the edge of the the tide line and have hundreds of thousands of birds fly by you, right? Like through your legs, around you, over you. It was crazy the number of birds that were there. Like we had a, you know, close to 90,000, 70 pomade sandpipers in one evening, fly by us. It's just banana lands. We had the, almost the entire population of marbled godwit in a flock up there. The Hudsonia and, or the Hudson Bay population of marble Galway and, you know, stuff like that. Just you stand there. You're on the shoreline of the ocean in Ontario. The sun setting in the distance, a beautiful landscape around you, the boreal forest behind you, the hundreds of thought, literally hundreds of thousands of birds winging by you. And you're getting paid sorta like on top of all that man, like I would pay to go and do that. Yeah. You know what I mean? And So that, that, I guess that's one of the, one of them, like, it's very hard to pick a favorite. My kids asked me, you know, what's your favorite color? You know, who's your favorite Leafs player or whatever. And I was like, Hey man, I'm a top 10 kind of person. And I don't know. It's hard to say because you know, you, when you reflect on things like that, you remember aspects of why that was important, but then that will twinge in your mind. Why another time had something similar and then you realize, Oh, that, that also was really important for me and magical and beautiful. And yeah, I don't see any, I think that that one stands out for me just because of where I was literally on the landscape with this beautiful world happening in front of me.
Meredith Meeker:That, that sounds really incredible. And I do like your, you know, I'm not the favorite kind of guy. I'm like the top 10 and you're right. It is, it is really hard to pick a favorite nature moment. Cause I do find whenever you go outside, you could have a possible nature moment and that's, that's kind of the greatest part.
Christian Friis:Right? I don't know. That's a, that's why I love nature, man. It's just so beautiful.
Meredith Meeker:So if you could wave a magic wand and have everyone adopt a new environmentally friendly habit, what would
it
Christian Friis:be? Oh
man.
Christian Friis:Yeah, that that's that's one heck of a one you got I think like plastics are a real issue. In our society. And I know there's, there's space for plastic and we've come to not need it so much as we just have it around everywhere. But reducing our consumption and reducing our plastics, I think would be the biggest one for me. There's the, the amount of plastic in the ocean. It's, it's gross. It's not right. What we've done to the, to the ocean. There's a giant Island of plastic floating in the ocean, like a bigger than a country. There's plastic line ending up in the stomachs of sea birds. There are you know, Marine animals dying because they ingest plastic and then they don't get the nourishment. They require and end up perishing as a result. And a lot of it is attributed to just wasteful over-consumption. And so I don't know if that's really a good answer for you, but the, I guess, over consumption of plastic and being more aware of what you're buying and how you. Or disposing of what it is that you're getting. So, you know, like bring a coffee mug or traveling. Look, when you go to the coffee shop or instead of going with a plot and taking plastic bags from the store, bring your own reasonable bag. Small things like that or choices when you're purchasing like, Oh, is this wrapped in plastic? Well, I don't need to buy that. Do I really need that much single use plastic? Is there involved in that scenario? So something that I've been trying to teach my kids too. Cause they, you know, any kid, well it's candy and candy is wrapped in plastic. And so, so they're trying to buy that individually wrapped. Candies within a big plastic bag that comes in case to another plastic bag kind of thing. Can we get a box of candies that are all individual with no plastic? And it's just one plastic wrapper around a box that you can recycle? Yeah. Anyhow, it's not an easy one to solve, but if I had a wand Meredith, that would be, it
Meredith Meeker:not be an easy one to solve, but I agree that there's more and more options that seem, you know, more mainstream. I feel like, you know, five years ago you were a hippie. If you went. The grocery store with your reusable bags, but now, you know, they've got really fun colored ones and now it's like, you get to have fun with it. So I think that that's a great one. And last question. If someone wants to get involved with CWS, I mean, I guess touched on it or get involved with you or learn more about what you do, where should they go? What
Christian Friis:yeah. The, to learn about CDWs. I think it's important to understand the history behind the organization. And so there's a really great, great publications called passion for wildlife. It's a Canadian field naturalist publication and documents that history from 1947 to 1997 of CWS, that gives you a really clear picture of where the organization organization came from. Cause you don't know. It's kind of like this reconciliation question, you can't understand where you're going. If you don't understand where you've been. And so that I think is one really key document that I would highly recommend to people. Another would be to simply browse our website. We have a wealth of information on environmental climate change Canada's website on CWS and as well as the other branches within the department. So the science and technology branch is our research affiliate. They're the research side of things. Whereas in CWS, we're more on the monitoring side. And so you get to see a bit more of a broad, broader spectrum of that wildlife biology aspect of the department. You can figure out some of the key players and some of the key locations you might want to visit. I mean, Ottawa obviously got it. No Ottawa, the headquarters where we're all happens, but I work in the region Ontario region and that's where the boots are on the ground, basically doing all the monitoring work. And so trying to understand, and the different aspects of work that CWS does, and this, this speaks to the application process too. Like if you don't know what it is the organization does, you're not going to get anywhere in your application. I see. I don't know how many applications I see come through that have it's clear that it's just a form letter. They've changed the name of the organization, but it's the same letter for everywhere they've applied. And I get that if you're applying to 20 jobs or whatever, it's a lot of work to. Write down a specific thing for that individual organization, but if you really want that job, that there's no other way to do it. You've gotta be, if you're determined and you want that position, you can tell that individual when they've, they've brought that forward to you, that that really, that really comes through.
Meredith Meeker:Awesome. Thank you so much. We'll find that article put a link in the show notes as well. But yeah, that, that's it. Thank you so much, Christian, for sitting down with me, I really, really enjoyed this conversation.
Christian Friis:Oh, Meredith. Thanks so much for inviting me. This was really a really nice time. I appreciate being invited and yeah, just talk a little everyone out there as a, as a good day.
Meredith Meeker:A huge, thank you to Christian for sitting down and chatting about his experience. This conversation really forced me to reflect on my own career choices and get inspired by all of the cool opportunities that are out there. And if you want to hear more stories like Christians, don't forget to like, and subscribe to our podcasts. So you don't miss an episode. And follow us on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram to find out more about job opportunities and cool events. And we find ourselves at the end of another episode. So here we go. I'm good. Hit you with another fun fact. Seabirds are known for flying incredible distances. And if there were to be one gold medalist for measurable long distance flight. We would have to give it to the Arctic tern. This species travels round trip from the Arctic to the Antarctic and back each year, a total distance of over 22,000 miles. However, not measurable is the distance. Traveled by the city turn, which is known to stay in flight for years without touching the ground. Which just boggles my mind. Okay. That's all from me. Talk to you again next week. Happy trails.
