Only One Mic Podcast
Carl Jerard, Brooklyn Dre, and JRob welcome you to The Only One Mic Podcast. We are joined each week by authors, activists, advocates, community leaders, and professionals from several walks of life who would like to offer their experience, expertise, or commentary on the various topics you will be interested in learning.
Only One Mic Podcast
Edwin Lee Gibson Discusses FX's "The Bear," Acting, Breaking Stereotypes, & Black Representation
Actor Edwin Lee Gibson, renowned for his role on FX's hit series "The Bear," shares his unorthodox yet authentic approach to acting. Edwin recounts his childhood in Houston to his formative years in New York theater. Relive the heartwarming and serendipitous reunions on the set of "The Bear," and hear Edwin's insights into the show's success, marked by multiple Emmy nods. Gain a deeper understanding of his character, Ibrahim, and the multifaceted persona Edwin masterfully brings to the screen.
We also discuss the challenges Black actors face in Hollywood & shed light on the persistence of stereotypes and the importance of maintaining artistic integrity. We highlight his acclaimed portrayals, from Dick Gregory to roles in "Fargo" with Chris Rock, and celebrate the contributions of legendary African-American actresses. This episode is a treasure trove of personal anecdotes, professional wisdom, and crucial conversations on representation and storytelling in Hollywood.
Brothers and sisters, why don't you? It's one mic, it's one mic, it's one mic. Give me a moment with your friend. I've never been up to my thoughts before. Welcome to the only one mic podcast Called Gerard Rodden Solo, but not really solo, because I got somebody here that you guys are really, really, really going to appreciate. If you watch this show the Bear on FX, hulu and Disney Plus, we got Mr Edwin Lee Gibson. How you doing, sir?
Speaker 2:Super duper, super duper. How are you?
Speaker 1:I'm doing well. I'm doing well, brother, been waiting for this conversation for, you know, a little bit of a few days now. Hopefully, you know, get you on and discuss this little project you have called the Bear man. Listen, I'm going to tell you my bear story. Okay, I was home one day Kid you not?
Speaker 1:And I hear everybody talking about the show the Bear, the Bear, the Bear, all right. So I said let me check this out. And so I, you know, pulled it up on one of my little streaming services here and I said, all right, sitting in, watching it, watching it. And then I'm like this started getting kind of interesting. You know what? I being like a bag of chips man, I just kept going to the next episode, next episode, next thing I know I'm in the kitchen cooking man. So I'm like the show really captures, I guess, the the, the essence of working in a restaurant, all the things that go. I'll be honest with you, I couldn't do it. I couldn't do it, you know. I mean, it seems like it's such a tense environment. How did you study for that?
Speaker 2:oh shoot, I mean, I don't do a lot of research. As an actor, my feeling is always whatever's in the script is what I need, but nothing can prepare you for what Christopher created as a show. So I didn't do any research necessarily no-transcript job.
Speaker 2:You never did the whole waiter thing. Well, well, well, I might. It might have been like less than a week, but, uh, because some cat snapped his fingers at me one day and said, uh, six iced teas. I still remember this and I brought him, and I don't know how all six of them fell on his head, I, when he got in my car and I left, left. That's the extent of my arrest.
Speaker 1:Well, listen on this show. We keep it a buck, so I'm going to take it that this gentleman was a white gentleman. Let's be honest, oh yeah, oh yeah because the snapping of the fingers would have did it for anybody like that. You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I mean, it wouldn't have mattered. You know what hue he was, that would you know. That same thing would have happened. But I would have given some. I'd probably given the you know the brother I looked like. Really, are you serious?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, like you're showing out right now, right.
Speaker 2:First yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. He just happened to be yeah, so. So so a hue that that, yeah, that. That that's just what happened. So that's how he found those t's on it I hear you man.
Speaker 1:Hey listen, that's a bold move. It's a bold move, you. You got some grand fashion. That's what a lot of people like to do when he leaves and he got a 78 uh 280z and drove off and that was it for me.
Speaker 1:All, All right, so let's discuss this. Like you know, we talked before the show started. Like I told you, I normally have my research in front of me and I can read the research. I can tell people who you are and what you did and all that, but you're here. You know what I mean. Yeah, and so I know that you're a Houston native, that you grew up in Houston.
Speaker 2:Can you tell the audience what was it like growing up in Houston and also how did that shape you into what you're into now? Yeah, Houston's not someplace I would live again, but it was a wonderful, wonderful place to grow up Group neighborhood called South Park, home of Chopped and Screwed.
Speaker 2:Oh, okay, yeah yeah, no doubt Robert Earl Jenkins rest in peace of. Dj Screwed Went to Sterling High School. My mom was classically trained in voice and so my first memories of a performance were singing with her in church. Dad was a garbage man. Mom worked at the post office in the welfare department. It was cool. You know, my older brother, my younger cousin, lived with us for about 10 years, so I was the youngest but I was the middle so but yeah, yeah, it was, it was, it was cool.
Speaker 2:A great place to grow up. Man, um, uh, houston's nothing. Well, it's very different than, uh, a lot of texas then and I suspect now, uh, so it was really kind of, you know, cosmopolitan place. Um stopped singing when I was. I was one of the top choral singers when I was a kid in the state and I auditioned for the National All-Boards Choir. I made it, but I wasn't 12 yet. Oh wow, I was so upset I stopped singing. My mother was kind of upset about that and so I found acting shortly after. So I took it seriously when I was 14 and started working when I was 16. Started working, uh, when I was 16, and I've been.
Speaker 1:I'd like to say I've received at least one paycheck as an actor since I was 16 years old, okay, and, and I looked at you, know your resume and everything and, of course, like I said, the big thing right now is you know the bear that you're on, but your acting resume is long as train smoke man, you know and not and I'll say this not to insult at all, but you've been acting just about as long as I've been alive it's like over 40 something years, right, 43, 43. Okay. So, yeah, do you cover movies, television and theater? So how many productions, I would say between movies, television and theater have you been?
Speaker 2:in the theater I'm at 104 right now since 1981. And I've done those productions here in the States and in the UK. France, where I lived in Paris for a couple of years, worked for a theater company and so it's even so funny that people can't tell where I'm from. Some people think I have this funny accent. Of course, when I go home to Houston folks are like you're not from here anymore.
Speaker 1:You don't sound like I'm not going to lie to you, when I first saw you in the beer I wouldn't have never thought that you were from Houston. You know what I mean. You played that whole thing so well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's a great thing, I always love to hear that. But yeah, and then I did TV and film work here and there, but then really kind of dove into it. I guess maybe 2003, 2004. You know, and I don't know how many films I've done or TV shows, I'd say cumulative, it may be about 50 total. But yeah, but I come from the theater and it just started to grow. You know, it's an evolution of the artist. I like, I like, I like new challenges and the screen challenges me in a different way right now, most so differently, you know, than the theater.
Speaker 1:So if you had to make a choice, I mean and I probably already know the answer to this but if you had to make a choice between the three, you know what would be the one that you would gravitate towards more.
Speaker 2:Well, it's really the two. It's like screen or theater, all right.
Speaker 1:Cause you have to keep your films.
Speaker 2:I would take the immediacy of the theater with the pay of the screen.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I hear it, because when they say struggling actor, they mean that Like you know, like it's real hard.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, it was never a struggle necessarily in that way. I mean, you know, starving artists for me was like if I'm not able to do it, I'm starving. It's not what I don't have, it's just kind of how it feeds me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you gotta feed what's in you. You gotta nurture that creativity. Okay, I hear you. So what I wanted to also ask you too, in lines to your acting, because, like I said, you did a phenomenal job on the show the bear and you have a phenomenal cast that you're working with that I see you know you can just name them down down the line.
Speaker 1:Um, and I wanted to know, like when you sit back and you watch it might be a scene that you're in a scene that you're not in whether you're watching them or you're participating what did you learn from any of those actors there? If you have one specific, that's good, but if you learn something from all of them, that's even better. I got a two-part question what did you learn from them and what do you think they might have learned from you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I have no idea what they learned from me. That'd be interesting.
Speaker 1:What do you think they?
Speaker 2:might If anything.
Speaker 2:I don't know, it's all subjective, people get different things. But what I learned? I think I learned a lot about the process of a show like this, because I've done other television work and I don't particularly of a show like this, because I've done other television work and I don't particularly. I don't know if I learned much from them, except that it's reinforced the joy that I have for what I do. You know, we all come to work ready and we all we really all dig each other, and so I think I've learned just how to consistently revisit the joy of being an artist and working, not that it ever goes away from me, but around people that are also that joyous and that are doing it just because it's a great project and they look forward to coming to work. It kind of like says yeah, you know what, um, don't get, you know, don't get so, uh in your head about whether things are working. Just stay with the process.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, which is kind of what I'm always trying to do anyway.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's kind of like you. It's like coaching each other perhaps.
Speaker 2:Well, well, you know, yeah, I mean there are times you learn. You learn the game by sitting on the bench Right so I can show up on days I'm not called and I do. I show up on days that I'm not called to set and I just watch. You know, there's always something to learn. I'm a student always. Even after all this time, I'm still learning. I'm still the six year old in my head. And then you know, and sometimes when, when you're in the game and you've been, you know, kgo vet, then hopefully the Amar rookies, the Amar secondary players are learning from you as well. Exactly.
Speaker 1:So, like I know watching this latest season here, that it was an episode that really stood out and it basically was going back and telling the backstory of lisa.
Speaker 1:it was elisa cologne, this character liza liza I'm sorry about that, beckoning your partner liza and um, how she ended up at the bear and all and the scene that she had with, like john bernthal man like bernthal to me is like a presence on the screen, like no matter matter what he's doing, a punisher or he's doing whatever, like he's always doing his thing. So I want to say shout out to him, man, because even though his interview show is off the hook too, I really enjoyed that man Like just sitting down, just like they seem like they put so much effort into that particular episode, not just that scene, like the way that it told the story of how she was struggling and everything and she really put her foot in that particular thing. What was your thoughts on that when you actually saw it?
Speaker 2:Well, we know, liza and I have known each other for 30 years. We worked in the theater in New York together. I don't know if your folks know that I lived in New York for 15 years. Oh okay, and so Liza and I, and you saw the cat that played her husband, yeah, yeah, he's a real husband.
Speaker 1:That's her husband.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's David. So all of us have worked together in the theater. Actually, we're so tight that when I was going through a hard time in my first marriage, um, I stayed at their place. Oh okay, we were all doing a show together. So that's how, that's how cool we I mean eliza and I didn't even know each other was on the show.
Speaker 2:We just showed up the first season. We didn't know that the other was on the show, because I hadn't seen her in about 10 years. Wow, yeah, yeah, yeah, so, so, so she and I pick up where we left off. You know what you see with ibrahim and tina. A lot of that chemistry is just the chemistry lies, and I have had over the decades working together and how we are. I mean, you know we're always sparring anyway, uh, off off screen, so that's but, but yeah, it was a good scene and it was a great episode directed by Io, who plays Sydney. Yeah, so, yeah, really really great time. It was my, that was my first time meeting John, a nice, nice cat, and we had a chance to chop it up about, about acting and things like that, and, yeah, really really good to see.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you know, was that her first directing On our show On our show. Okay, so she's done other things outside of that.
Speaker 2:I'm not sure. I don't see how she hasn't. She's such a, you know, talented kid. Yeah, yeah, I'm sure she's done some other things.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know, talented kid, yeah, yeah, I'm sure she's done some other things, yeah, okay. So what was it like when you got the call for the bear was? Did you, did you know that this was going to be something? That was going to be like a hit or? Was it sad, I just thought it would be another job and we just see what happens. What's your thoughts on that?
Speaker 2:I wasn't going to read for it no wow, um, I have this thing about how we're seen on screen as brown screen folks, right, and so I thought it would be a bit of a trope. But then I had to think about who I am and that tropes only exist. Tropes exist only in as much as the actor allows it. So if I allowed it to be something, it would be that. And so my my manager was like no man. He one of the rare moments he'll call me up and say you need to rethink this.
Speaker 2:Uh, and so, um, I read for it, sent it in as a monologue because I didn't have a a or reader, and so, um, then it turned out that Christopher, the creator of the show, said that he had seen me in the theater in Chicago five years before and said he always wanted to work with me. So, um, and you know, and I got the call, uh, well, we had, we did a zoom, and I had a feeling, over the zoom with him and the casting director, uh, um, jeannie Baccarat, that it was gonna, it was, it was gonna be okay, and, and I was in Tucson, arizona, just chilling because I love Tucson, and that's where I read for it and that's where I got the job and we went to work on it and we didn't anticipate it, we were just all working together. We all got on very, very well, like that, the entire cast, like that, uh, the entire cast, and so we got on very well. And, um, just making you know what I call the little engine, that could you know?
Speaker 1:yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, so how was it when um you won the you know multiple emmy awards? You know um multiple awards, different, different awards in different areas, but I was the Emmy like the biggest thing that you can possibly win for television.
Speaker 2:Yes, the biggest thing individually for me, of course, was the SAG award that our cast won for Best Ensemble. But yeah, nominated for 13 Emmys received 10. That was for our first nominated for 13 Emmys received 10. Nice, and that was for our first season, and our second season received 23 nominations, which is the most any comedy has ever received in one season.
Speaker 1:Wow.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So it's just, you know, kudos to Christopher and to Joanna Carlo, who's the co-showrunner, and the folks at FX and Hulu. And it was really funny because, you know, the people at Hulu and FX said that what they liked most about my audition was that I was the only person that didn't try to make Ibrahim funny and I was like, yeah, I mean, you know, this is some, this is some real serious kind of trauma that this cat's had, you know, and so it's not funny, I mean, but then you can find the comedy, and the way he delivers the alive is funny, but it ain't funny.
Speaker 1:So I'm glad you opened that door up because for those that didn't see, you know, and if you haven't checked out, the bear on FX, um, hulu, disney, even it's on Disney plus, even if you have that package, um, tell them about your character, uh, tell them, give them a little bit of back about your, your character well, you know, oh he's.
Speaker 2:He was described as a mystery that's lived a thousand lives. That's all I had to go on was just that sentence right, which I felt was like so great, so much space there for for what I do. I want to keep him silent, but keep him waited, if that makes any sense. But he's, uh, an immigrant from, uh, east africa a lot of people say somalia, because he told the story of the battle of mogadishu and because he made chicken, uh, sugar, um, uh. But you know there are countless instances of people from other countries migrating to other countries and then fighting in those armies.
Speaker 2:So I think he is from East Africa, tanzania, kenya, somalia, you know whatever that is. But yeah, he's a cat who found his way all the way here to the States and then to Chicago, no less on his own way, all the way here to the states and then to chicago, no less on his own. And um started at the beef and has his own issue about change and where that's rooted, and I think it's really rooted in some trauma for him. Uh, it's trauma that we haven't explored yet on the show, but I think people that are watching are getting a sense of they're getting a sense that there's something there and they want to find out a bit more about Ibrahim.
Speaker 1:It's funny you mention that, because that was going to be one of my questions for you. Do you think that he will have his own episode that kind of explores his background as well?
Speaker 2:I look forward to it. Um, you know it's a half hour piece. Um, this, you know, uh, and you know it's, it's not my show, it's not my character show. Uh, you can just kind of do your job at what one of the things I've tried to do is to.
Speaker 2:One of the things I've tried to do is to pique the audience's curiosity based on the choices I make as an actor, based on this framework that's been created. So I think that's why people are really asking he doesn't want to change, he doesn't want to wear a uniform. Why is that? What is this about? And so, yeah, I'm confident that they've got something in the um uh, the um uh in the machine, if you will. Uh, I hope so, because I, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, um, I love him so much, this character, and so you want to take care of the character and you want him to be known in his fullness, not to lift me as an actor, but to just kind of give some more backstory to this character. And I think in some ways it helps Christopher and Joanna not have to do very much because they know what I do, right, what I'm doing for the character. So, yeah, we'll see. We'll see when people come up to me, I would say well, you know, write to your local congressman.
Speaker 1:So FX and everybody, if you're listening, get this man, just do it. Do you think you see yourself directing any of these particular episodes? I mean, do you direct? A lot of things, or do you not? I direct it in.
Speaker 2:You direct a lot of things or do you not film I direct it in the theater a bit.
Speaker 1:Well, I know you did theater, but like television-wise?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, but on a note. Well, it's actually interesting. You ask that question because later this year I'm going to be co-directing a 35-minute film that I wrote. Oh, okay, yeah, so I'm going to be directing that we're going to be shooting in. Looks like it's going to be in Arizona, arizona, okay, yeah, so I'm. You know, oftentimes people wait I've never been someone that waits Hustler so I've written, I'm a writer, and I was working with the Sony TV writers program, one of the 10 writers that they chose in this writing program, and so I've amassed this work that I've written. And so I said, well, in my off time, let me go and shoot something and show that I can produce something and show that I can direct. And I have a, I have a small part as an actor in it. It's not a huge role, it's a significant role, but it's not a huge role, and and that's on purpose, as a matter of fact, russell is going to be in.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, shout out to Russell, everybody, russell, yeah, talk about something that keeps it real.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, and so, so, yeah. So I'm going to be directing and no, no, better, no better way than to say here's my calling card that show. So I'm going to put my money up under the little that I have and go make something.
Speaker 1:Well, I just want to extend this you know to you that once you do it, you know you are more than welcome to come back on and discuss it you know.
Speaker 2:Oh, thank you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the floor is open, Chris. No, reach out. We can make that happen. So, pivoting away from the beer because we have so many things to talk about. I do have one last question about that, though, Brother what do you do with all those trophies, man?
Speaker 2:What do you do with them? Well, we'll see. The only one I have is the SAG Awards. Because the actors get the SAG Awards, oh, we don't get the Emmy, the SAG Awards. Because the actors get the SAG Awards, oh, we don't get the Emmy, we don't. You know, that's for the producers and writers and the individual actors. But I've got. I think it's been a really interesting year. I think I've amassed like six different awards. I was given a really, really special one from Texas Southern University. I went to school it's the first ever kind of award they've given achievement in acting, and I was very pleased with that. Art Simerson in Boston gave me a career theater achievement award in October. And then there's been a couple of other ones from, you know, the Television Critics Association, which we got as a cast, but we got the individual kind of plaques or whatever. So yeah, it's been interesting. I've got them on my, my messy desk in here you can hold them on your desk.
Speaker 1:I can barely hold pencils on mine, no it holds it.
Speaker 2:It's just all the other crap that's on it that I've I've been told to clean off, but I haven't really gotten around to it.
Speaker 1:You'll get to it. You'll get to it. So listen. You also worked on fargo yes um with chris rock during that particular run there, and how was that? Like working with chris. What was?
Speaker 2:that nice, nice, nice cat. Oh, uh, uh, uh, uh, he gave me a nickname. Uh, he calls me a tough acting connecting uh. Oh yeah, I played the last character, the last villain to come on the show. I don't know if you saw the series or not, but Happy Holloway is his name.
Speaker 2:Lionel Happy Holloway is his name and yeah, that was cool. A lot of people wanted to see the character more and again, that's cool, you come in, you do the job and that's what people. That's cool, you know it's it's. You know you, you come in, you do the job and that's what people are supposed to want. You know. You know this is this is supposed to want more, but it was. It was great working with Chris. We got to talk a lot, you know, talk a lot about Prince, cause he loved him, and so did I have great love for him as well, you know, and they were very good friends. So, yeah, it was cool. That whole time was very dope. I think it was one of the first things I did when I got. Maybe that was the second thing I did. I played Dick Gregory in a solo play when I first got back.
Speaker 1:You played Brother Dick Ha.
Speaker 2:I got back to the States in 2018 at Arena Stage in DC, and then after that, I think that's when I was in Boston doing a play and then got the Fargo gig, and it was during COVID. So things changed and they had to move everything from March all the way to August. So, yeah, we got around to getting it done, but it was a good time. Noah Hawley, the creator of the anthology series for Fargo and working with Chris and Jason Schwartzman and Glenn Terman Mr Terman wasn't there. His character had already been killed off by the time I got there, so I was kind of salty.
Speaker 1:But I got to meet him last year. You got to meet him. So I want to circle back, because you played Dick Gregory man Wow In a one-man show, yeah. And so what was that like? Did you ever get to meet Dick Gregory at all prior?
Speaker 2:to this, never got to meet Baba. Yeah, never got to meet Baba. Found out about him in reverse, though. You know I found out about him when I was a kid because you know there was the Dick Gregory, like you know, diet.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the Bohemian diet yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the Bohemian diet. And so I found out about that and then started learning about him as an activist and then a humorist, an activist and then a humorist. I call him a humorist even more so than a comedian, because he was already doing that and he never stopped doing that. Even his activism, you know, was. You know he was such a great framer of arguments using humor.
Speaker 2:And so, yeah, I got a phone call while I was in, while I was in paris, and um was asked you know where I was in the world, because people never know where I am asked if I knew about this show. And I was like no, I don't know about it. And I got offered the job over the phone. And so, yeah, we came back and we knocked that out in a 500 seat theater and did, like I think I did 48 shows, yeah. So that was that was I turned down six or seven episodes of the second season of the Chi. I was offered, I was offered recurring on the Chi and I was like I got that or I can go play Dick Gregory for a lot less money. And I wanted to play Dick Gregory for a lot less money.
Speaker 1:It was nice money, but it was a lot less it was a lot less what you would get on the shot, of course yeah, but you know it's my art.
Speaker 2:You know I'm an artist, so you know it's so important you gotta make. When am I gonna get to do that again?
Speaker 1:exactly, and I mean we can always discuss that in terms of a biopic that they you know for Dick Gregory. Because when I was watching you know I was looking at doing my research I should say and I did see you, you know the whole suit on the stage and I said, you know, this brother do kind of resemble Dick Gregory, so like maybe that's where they're going with it, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2:So like maybe, who knows, later on down the line, yeah, I think Christian Gregory, who's Dick Gregory's son and was managing the affairs. I think he and Kevin Hart were working on something. I haven't heard much about it, I mean not involving me, but they were working on something maybe a couple of years ago and, um, hopefully it gets.
Speaker 1:It gets done, uh, because you know I just love, uh, you know, baba gregory so much yeah, yeah, you know what edwin is one thing to get it done, but it better be done, right, you know? Yeah, exactly, that's all right that's not.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know what that's what that's. What I mean really is like yeah, well, we, we do things oftentimes, but are we doing them?
Speaker 1:yeah, it's a little. They undercut a lot of these, these biopics, and especially at these like if I could use the term, legendary figures. Um omit so much stuff out of it that it's like you know these guys lives. You can make a series out of it you know it's hard, it's hard to kind of.
Speaker 1:My brother and I were discussing the bob marley movie and I said, you know, I've been trying to get around and watch it. I know it's out now and I said, well, I'm gonna sit down and watch it. But he already did and I said, man, you know, when you're watching these I'm a person I look at and then go to the documentary and see what was left out. And so he was saying, within that particular film there was so much stuff that you know, this man's life was so broad that you probably couldn't capture it in a two-hour movie or something like that, you know.
Speaker 2:And I said, some things just needs to be a series yeah, yeah, yeah, because it doesn't it, it loses, it loses context, sometimes with a, with a movie yeah, yeah, like I give an example like when they did the Griselda thing for Netflix, and I'm like this could have been a whole series.
Speaker 1:It was so much of that woman's life that was omitted. You know what I mean, for the sake of those films and all. So I always look at that when I watch these biopics. I look at it as the rabbit hole, because either I'm going to read it or I'm going to watch the documentary, you know, right after that. So I know you said earlier, in this conversation too, about tropes, ok and so and we had this discussion with Russell and a few other people that might have came through the show that saying you know you're crafting on and the tropes that you see today, today, you know what, do you see? The? Do you see a lot of those tropes within for our people, especially because I know, like you, have the integrity to say I'm going to turn certain things down if it's not beneficial or making my people look a certain way? You know, and do you, do you see that a lot within hollywood that they're more offering you this role than they are that role? That's something that's not going to be beneficial.
Speaker 2:I've been fortunate. You know I've been fortunate to say no to a lot of things, a lot of people. But I was saying no to things in my 20s. You know when people are really just trying to get on and do something. You know like people. You know when people are really just trying to get on and you want to do something. You know like people. I was always known as a a comic actor early in my career and I stopped taking comedic roles because no one would take me seriously as a dramatic actor. Right, of course, other people would say you were a comic act yeah, I know you understand that too.
Speaker 2:You left that part out too. There you go. But nice research. I love that, and so I think again. Tropes exist only in as much as the artist allows them. Someone can bring something to me.
Speaker 2:I have to think about turning things on their ear before I turn them down. Right, I played a prisoner on death row about to be executed in a piece that I wrote Five Till was the name of it, but you can take that, which is not a trope, because there's a lot of people that are on death row in prisons and there are more of other people than there are us, so there are more of them, you know, in jail and well, you know we just let other people filter that kind of crap in our ears that it's us. But I wanted to look at this character's life and how they and a lot of people look at a character's life and say, oh, this informed those choices. But what I did was I had him come from a two-parent household, had him come from a hardworking household, loving parents. He just decided he wanted to do this, you know. So now I'm taking that trope and I'm turning it on its ear. It doesn't mean he did this crime, it just means that he went down the road and my dad used to always say you can do a whole lot of things, you won't get caught, but then you might do that one little thing and all that other stuff you did all them years. You know it'll come back, it'll bite you right. So I use that as part of the catalyst for what some people might see as a trope. You know, brown, brown skin, man in prison, but yeah, so, so.
Speaker 2:So people, I think sometimes people need the money and that's where it comes in. You know you need it. And then you have people that are not telling our stories or not writing, and I think you know, even if we are producing stuff, we're still producing tropes. You know we do it to ourselves and then that kind of becomes what people think, not what other people think of themselves, but what people, but what those people begin to kind of think of themselves.
Speaker 2:So I do a lot of different roles. None of those roles that you've seen was I even wearing makeup, right, right, you know, as an artist, you know what can I do without all that stuff. I played Dick Gregory in these three stages of his life and didn't put any makeup on. You just do it. But I digress. I think when you have to do things for the money, then you'll allow people to put you in positions and I think it goes to us producing the work and being open to letting other people telling different stories about us rise and see that it's not going to undercut you, because we have such a diverse palette as consumers. Why wouldn't people think we have a diverse palette as to what we want to see, how we want to see ourselves?
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I'm glad that you mentioned that, because I mean and you're in the business, so probably know deeper than I would tyler perry right now is going through that particular controversy with his latest movie and it's getting to the point where when we talk about tropes, I mean it's not to, you know, get on here and bash this guy, but it's just more or less like when you I'm using him as an example because he's not the only one that's doing this but it's like when you see these particular films, it's the same film over and over and, over and over again and this is made by someone that's us.
Speaker 1:It's not, if I can understand it, with somebody outside of us making these type of films, but it's like it's coming from inside the living room. Now. So you know when he does, when he, when he does these movies and he gets the criticism that he gets. You know, I, I personally think that it's justified. That's, this is just your people telling you step your game up. If you're making every movie where it seems like the, the black man is the villain from a black man's perspective, you know, I mean like, how do you, how do you justify that? I mean, the story is the same thing, what do you think?
Speaker 1:about that particular situation.
Speaker 2:Oh, I've never seen myself as a victim. I've never seen anyone as superior to me. So the idea of white supremacy is a non-starter for me. No one's superior to me. So you can talk that hot shit all you want, and that includes us. You know we use it for monetary gain a lot. But tropes exist among other people as well. You know the whole goofy frat guy, the um, uh, the um, a blonde with the, the big breasts hanging out, well, you know, I mean. So there are tropes that exist a lot. But we're talking about, about, about fam here. So so, um, um, I think people write formulaic stuff.
Speaker 2:It all, it all, it's in a formula, and people write what people watch. You know, and I'm not an entertainer, this is beyond entertainment for me, way beyond entertainment for me. But if you're in entertainment and you're writing entertainment, then you're writing things. You've got these cutouts of who these people are and where you place them and how. They're still the same kinds of things. I'm a, you know, I'm a. As artists, we all miss the mark. But when you don't have people, other ideas coming in which I think is the criticism that people have about my brother Tyler Perry then you're going to just continue to regurgitate these things and try to say them a different way. Yeah, I watched the last uh, this last joint with them.
Speaker 2:I'm making good yeah yeah, and I think you know there's always a great opportunity to do something that you haven't done before. And, um, you know, people see, people use criticism and, uh, critique kind of of in the same way, but they're two very different things, you know. You know, I think a critique is very objective. You know, criticism can be coming from any place, but a critique is usually just a 30,000 foot view, let's say, of kind of what you see and what the issue is on a broader scale. So I didn't really care for the piece. I can't knock the hustle. Oh, yes, I can knock the hustle, you know, especially when it's especially when we we watch so many different things. You know, we watch all these different movies that don't have us in them, and so why do we think we should produce things that are only this thing? But there are loads of mob movies that don't involve us, but then there are loads of us that want to be mobsters. That looks like that. I mean, you know, scarface was, wasn't he a Peruvian? And he was dark.
Speaker 1:Yeah, something like that yeah.
Speaker 2:Something, but he was dark. I mean, he didn't look like Al Pacino. But you couldn't tell us that because we didn't do the research. But when it's entertainment, the audience is just looking for some respite from reality. I just want to sit back and watch something and laugh at it and then we start laughing at ourselves. The thing about this is that, you know, we start telling jokes and the joke is funny until we step out of it and other people start laughing. It's like whoa, wait a minute. So we might want to rethink how we're doing it so that we can.
Speaker 2:You know, our agenda can be in some instances, the same as other people's, like, you know, scary Movie I really love, and Scary Movie was, you know, this great, great kind of parody of this other genre of films and so, like things like that. You know we do. I mean, we're very, very. You know creative people. I'm going to go to the. You know we, we do. I mean we're very, very. You know creative people. I'm going to go to the. You know director's guild of America function Saturday and it's a tribute to Robert Thompson, right, right, and which a lot of people don't give.
Speaker 1:Robert is his, his just do you know what I?
Speaker 2:mean, yeah, and he was on the bear, you know he played. Yeah, he uh sydney's father and so he's like my job yeah, yeah, you know I'm uh.
Speaker 2:He got the chat and I told him how much I felt like hollywood shuffle was a love letter, uh, to other brown-skinned artists, and he's kind of looked at me and I was like, yeah, man, it was a lot. I mean, it helped me navigate the next 20 years of my life so that I wouldn't get locked in these things. But those dollars, people get that mixed up with being, with being in some way someone, that that that other people can, can, can, can look to you know, oh, but you're only looking to them or you're only feeling like you're able to be looked to because you have this or that, not because of who you are. So I think there's a balance of that that needs to happen.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you said something interesting about not giving other people like that that chance I'm paraphrasing but not giving people that that chance to kind of be creative, and then we get the same. You know movies over and over, again and again. I use I use him as an example. Um, he has this big studio and this is kind of the the, the conversations that I have with a lot of people offline in that regard. I'm like, well, he has this big studio. I'm like you, you can't. You can knock the hustle, but you can't knock the hustle and that's what it is. You can knock it.
Speaker 1:To exist in hollywood and not be in hollywood is a is a big thing, it's a big accomplishment. So when you have these big studios and things like that and I think he said, like he's the only one, he is the writer's room, if I'm quoting this correctly like he's the one that that writes these movies and you have to recognize when your ideas get a little bit stale and when it, when it, when it gets to the point where the critique isn't coming from within, where the people are starting to say now like, hey, listen, we're tired of this. You know, we're tired of this particular thing that you're putting out. I was always of the mind of why would you just be the writer's room when there's so much talent out there that can actually help broaden what you have? You know what you put down and I thought that was the whole purpose of this. It it's like, you know, you help me come up, then you help the next person come up. You know we all have different ideas and stories to tell. What is your thoughts on that?
Speaker 2:Well, I mean, you know on our show on the bear. You know, christopher directs and he writes most of the show, so I don't have any issue with one artist being able to do that. There are, you know, forget the sister's name with a black lady sketch comedy show, issa Ray. No well, issa, I don't know the sister uh who created forget her name. Uh, light-skinned sister, um, I met her at the mb's.
Speaker 1:Really, really, really cool, was it robin mead, is it?
Speaker 2:yes, yes, yes yes, yes, robin mead, you know she, she did all that. You know, um, kinta Brunson may have a writer's room, you know, but she created Abbott Elementary, you know. So it can be done. It's about what it's. I think it's interesting that he didn't amass this studio on his own right. He had, he had, he had a deal that he got and was given some monies and he said I'm going to, I'm going to use this with this money. You did a great thing building the studio. Well, I think sometimes people are given things and the idea is that there's got to be a return on the investment right fastestest return on the investment is the, or at least the perceived, is the regurgitating of these same kinds of things.
Speaker 2:Um, but the things we do see, we can. We can challenge those things, and um wish that if he's alone doing this, that's not the issue. It's what you know. It's not the issue for me. Uh, it's the uh product that comes out of it.
Speaker 1:Exactly Because, like those people that you named, even on your show they're focusing on one particular show. You know what I mean. On your show, they're focusing on one particular show, you know I mean. So it's like they're focusing on these characters that I created and I know how I can maneuver these particular characters for this one particular series.
Speaker 1:But yes you know they're not cranking out different movies. You know it's a difference when, even with a series I mean to his credit when you look at stuff like house of pain and things like that, they follow a certain thing and that's good for the series. I mean it's good for the series but it's like if I, if I'm once I turn on that show, I know what I'm getting. You know I mean right, but with movies I guess we expect more of a variety spike lee, you know, yeah.
Speaker 2:So I mean, you know, there's an example yeah, that's antithetical like he wrote these movies. Um, he had a certain take on life, life in Brooklyn, life in New York, life amongst us. So, yeah, so you can do it. You can do it as a screenwriter. You know, it's just about what you think is going to make you money, or what you want to push, or or or in some, in some instances, of who you hate please touch on that, brother, what you mean about that, who you?
Speaker 2:hate who you mad at, you know. I mean like you know, because I mean you know you write. A lot of people write their life, you know, or they write instances that have happened to them. I'm not saying that's what's happened with Tyler Perry because I don't know him. I mean I haven't seen him since 1984. I met him a long, long time ago, right. But yeah, you know, people do that and so that becomes their choice. And then you know, you, why it's not, why is other stuff not getting produced? But I really think we've got to take the bull by the horns and, uh, produce things and not think everything has got to be a hundred million dollar seller. You know, you know, I think our agenda is brown skin artists of african descent um, we have, you know. You know, I think our agenda is brown skin artists of african descent um, we have, you know, we've got a different thing.
Speaker 1:You know we we got to do here yeah, and I and I totally agree with you because, like these criticisms that we have and and I do call them criticisms because they need to be critiqued and it doesn't necessarily mean just when we're dealing with Hollywood, it's every facet of entertainment. We just, as you know, had the BET Awards and you see how even our sisters are presented in that, which is a choice to some degree. You know what I mean and how it was presented. And this is like every year. It's the same thing, and it seems like it gets worse every year. And a lot of times when I look at things like this and this is just me personally I look at our people and I think to myself, like when are we going to wake up? When are we going to realize that this is not the thing to do? And you know the images that we're putting out. Like you said, you know you don't want to have to say, well, look, I'm trying to please a certain set of people, all right. Well, you know you got white folks or whoever. They do some of the same things, but our thing is always going to be a little bit more out in front, and so it's like the way that you know.
Speaker 1:I look at the sisters how they were carrying themselves and the way that they were doing a thing you never seen. And diane carroll on a red carpet, you know, looking ratchet. You know when we came to events, you know you look at them old Ebony magazines and Jet magazines or even if you see like old footage. Our people always showed up to these events sharp. You know. They always showed up classy and we got away from that, you know. And these kids now are making more money than most of these people made back then that they never even seen. You know, and it kids now are making more money than most of these people made back then that they never even seen. You know, and it's like you don't have to do these things. So when we, when we get on here, we speak about these things, it's only because it's not to say but we, we dislike you know our people, because that's not the case. But we love you enough to say yo, look you got to straighten up, you know I.
Speaker 1:So I'm quite sure you see that type of thing as well, you know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I do, and I see myself as pretty much a classic kind of cat.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I agree, and from the space between my ears to how I dress, which I guess is not any different dress, which I guess is not any different, um, but, but, uh, but, you know it's, uh, it's, it's tough man, because, um, the more kind of latitude that's given, um, the more that no one looks back. It's like you align a segment. You know it starts here and then it goes to, uh, infinity, um, is that the segment? Was this a segment? But, either way, no one's looking back at where we were Right. We're just trying to see it in some ways, trying to get so far away from that as possible or do some kind of version of it that we know is not that. Yeah Well, I'm class.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:Well, that's what you want to call it. Uh, I'll put um uh, jeanette dubois. Ester roll um diane carroll.
Speaker 2:Uh mary alice uh, you know, women just class yeah yeah, I mean debbie morgan, who, who, who, even in that movie that you saw, the um tyler perry flick where we just talked about earlier, she's always amazing, it doesn't matter what she's doing. She played the among right, uh, uh, and so uh, and you know she gets a pass. You know she's done so much, uh, growing up, uh, but uh, um, and well, not that she gets a pass, but she did a great job in the movie. She was the best thing there, uh, so you know it it's like, but folks think you know I'm doing me and y'all just old, okay, okay, you know we can't tell grown folks anything. And you know there's a saying, and Russell and I talk about this it's like the older I get, the smarter my father was. I. Like that, yeah, it's like the older I get, the smarter my father was I like that, yeah, I like that, yeah, because you start to understand now you know what I mean, you start to understand that wisdom started hitting you.
Speaker 1:And that's what it is. Is that, when you look at it, I mean you'd be kind of remiss to you know, we have our platforms, you have Acta and I have this. We'd be remiss not to say anything, you know. I mean we can see it, we can voice like a sign about it. The rest is up to you. So I totally, I totally get that, you know. I mean yeah, yeah, it's all about the presentation, like you said, about yourself, like russell, you guys are, you know, classy elders man.
Speaker 2:If I could say that, you know, I mean yeah and you know and and it kind of feeds in some sort some way, because then others of us will go in certain spaces and people will think, oh, because of this I don't really have to address this older brown skin person because they're brown skin person, so I can just say whatever. And then you know you have to check them.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:You know, which I'm never have any problem doing. I mean, you know, I say I don't take our, so I don't take anybody else's, uh, but, um, but yeah, you know, and so but, but all of that is kind of fed. It's like there's a reason that people react to you the way that they do and, um, if they want to have that, you know you can correct them. But then we've got all these other examples of people that are just saying ah you know this doesn't mean anything anymore.
Speaker 2:You know that's, that's old, that's old stuff. Now we don't, yeah, you know we don't even take care of our older, uh, musical acts and older, older actors, or you know, and when you see other folks that you you still see Carole King being taken care of, janis Joplin being taken care of, but you don't really see, I don't tour. Billy Joel is still touring Massive crowds, but we don't. Young and older, but we won't go and see some of our great, great icons I mean not even stevie wonder in the same way.
Speaker 1:No, yeah, um so I'm assuming they're only pulling stevie out when it's time to. You know, open up something big or whatever, like you know the inauguration or something you only see, steve, yeah yeah, yeah, that's on us to support that and to kind of.
Speaker 2:We can grow as much as we want, but we have to have our finger on the pulse of the past and understand why this thing called entertainment, what it can be used for and why art is so necessary.
Speaker 1:And it's big that you said that, because we all know that everything is visual. You know, and you might have a person from across the country and this is the only view that they have of your people. You know, and they'll treat you. You know, you might have a person from across the country and this is the only view that they have of your people. You know, and they'll treat you, you know, a certain way when they do actually see you in person.
Speaker 2:This is the only visual that they have yeah, that's not by accident, and I think the people that are making these decisions puppet masters. You know that's not by accident no, it's not because if they lose those folks, then they lose it all right yeah, yeah that's deep, man, that's deep.
Speaker 1:So let me ask you um, I know you have your, your, your next project coming up and all that you're working on, your, your movie, and all what else do you have outside of you know that's outside of that particular project that you, that you're working on.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, there's a. There's a movie I may be shooting in Tennessee in November. A young brother that I met at a cafe here in Sherman Oaks last year and I didn't really know who he was, but he didn't know about the bear Turns out he's a really up and coming young filmmaker. And then in May he sends me this note out of the blue I really like you to be in my movie and here's the role for you, and I really hope you accept. And I was just trying to figure out where did I meet? How do I know this? And then I finally asked him. He said remember, last summer at that little cafe across from the car wash. We spoke very, very briefly. You said you liked how I handled something on the phone. I said, oh yeah. He said yeah, that's me.
Speaker 2:And I decided that day this guy's going to be in my movie Nice, and he's a really up and coming writer. And so, and then I have another movie that I shot in January called she Taught Love, and she Taught Love was written by a cat named Daryl Rick story, and I play the father of the female lead, and so that comes out September 27th. And so, yeah, I'm looking forward to that my publicist, jordan Robinson. She said to me today she said, oh, it's on IMDb now they've got everything about it. I was like, oh, that's cool, because I knew it was coming coming out.
Speaker 2:Um, um, then I'm uh little mom and I gonna go take a trip to london for a couple weeks, uh, mid, uh, august. Um, hang out there there, shake the trees. I don't have this thing about English actors being here and taking roles, because I've worked there and when I worked there, english actors were always asking me questions about acting and blah, blah, blah. And when I worked in Paris, I worked with one of the most famous English directors ever. So people find out, when people from there find find out, that I was personally asked by this director to move to Paris and work with him, you know, you know they're like wow, so I don't really get caught up in all that stuff. I mean, you know, the character I play on the bear is sounds nothing like me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, nothing at all.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but you know, but you know we're gonna go there, we're gonna hang out, I'm gonna shake the trees a bit, see what, see what other stuff is happening over there. Uh, for, for me as an artist, and so that's you know, that's the rest of the year and I'm uh doing what I do, a lot of which is uh smoke cigars, smoke cigars yeah, yeah, youars.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, you know. You know I was about to light one here, but I was like I don't know if I should have one while I'm talking to you. That's usually what I have. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, see, I always have one close. Oh okay, all right, I had to just finish door one. I'm about to be at, yeah, and I'm going to end up putting the finishing touches on the next thing. I'm hoping there's some things that might be happening, folks at Sony, and so just keep creating.
Speaker 1:That's good, man, listen before I let you go. I just want to say once again I thank you, and I was even listening to what you're saying there and how you gave that young brother a shot. You know where it's like you could say, hey look, man, I got so many awards or whatever. You know what I mean. Call my agent, something like that, but you gave that young brother a shot and I appreciate you for that.
Speaker 2:But wait, wait, wait. Well, you know, give me a shot. He called me, he sent me in and he's like you know, I don't want you audition for anything, I just want you to play this role because I love your work and you know. And then this young woman, tracy Toms, I think she saw the play I did last year. I played Step and Fetch. I didn't play it last year Los Angeles and did last year.
Speaker 1:I played step and fetch it and played last last year here in los angeles, and I think a lot of people saw that here in la, and so she was a fetch clay man or something like that and uh, and so she's in this movie with this cat, or chas hawkins, I think his name is.
Speaker 2:and then she sent me a message saying I, I can't wait to work with you. And I told Chaz, yeah, you know, you've got to be in this movie. I mean, I want to work with you, and Tracy and I I think we met, maybe briefly after the play, but you never know where the work is coming from, right? So you just do the work and you do it with no other intention than to do it well and do it thoroughly, and stuff happens. So, yeah, so, so. So this young cat gave me, you know, he, he called me up and yeah, and yeah, I would never be. Oh, just call me, yeah, yeah, because some people are man, so this is.
Speaker 2:I know, I know, I book people for the show man.
Speaker 1:You don't even hear responses sometimes, so really, yeah, I'm like.
Speaker 2:I'm like you know come on, yeah.
Speaker 1:So I understand, yeah, like really, really, people get too big. You know how it go, man, people get too big, they don't wanna they don't wanna deal with you no more.
Speaker 2:And they forget that they were where you were at at one point. So that happens, man, yeah, and everybody's still in the same place, which is here.
Speaker 1:Exactly, we're all right here. Yeah, man, To quote Dougie Fresh brother, the only stars I know is in the sky.
Speaker 2:It is. That's what it is man, I appreciate you having brother, the only stars I know is in the sky. That's what it is, man, but you know I appreciate you having me on. And yeah, anytime you want to have me back, I'll be the best, come back.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I will really. We got to get on here too. What's your brother's name?
Speaker 2:Does he owe me some money? That's why he ain't here.
Speaker 1:His name is Brooklyn Trey Trey. That's why he's not here. He's ducking you. Man Made some side deal. I don't know about man, but no, he would have loved to have been here. Man, he was looking for it. We was just sitting here until he had some equipment issues and I want to let you know that.
Speaker 1:you know you are the first guest of the new season, so I just want to applaud, you know I appreciate you, brother, really, because we took a little hiatus and I was getting ready for the next season and then trying to coordinate this with the Chris, amongst a few other things, and yeah, so I said you definitely got to be the first one for thank you on this side too, too, man, I really appreciate you. So, with that being said, we're getting ready to split. So please, if you haven't checked it out, check out the Bear on Fox, fx, hulu, whatever you got that streams the Bear. You check it out, man. This brother is really worth the watch. All right, so I'm going to leave this with y'all.
Speaker 1:The Only One Mike Podcast is available on all platforms you stream your podcasts on. Also, check out our Only One Mike Podcast YouTube channel to catch up on the past and current episodes, and please don't forget to rate the show and subscribe folks. It helps us out. Alright, you can check us out also on Instagram and Twitter at TheOnlyOneMikeP1. Facebook and LinkedIn at TheOnlyOneMikeP1. Facebook and LinkedIn at TheOnlyOneMikePodcast. And you can contact us via email, theonlyonemike00 at gmailcom or call us at 302-367-7219 to have your comments and questions played on the show. We thank you once again for your time, folks. Thank you once again, edwin Lee Gibson for showing up to the spot here, and we encourage you, please, to speak the truth quietly and clearly, and listen to others, even adult and ignorant, because they too have their story to tell. So until next time, please keep in mind that we never have to run from the Ku Klux Klan, so we shouldn't have to run from a black man.
Speaker 2:Peace, let's sit, let's sit, so we shouldn't have to run from a black man. Peace.