Racism sucks. Aaron and Tamu chat about the painful experience of realizing those they let into their lives wrote a check they couldn’t cash. They also attempt to reconcile their love of a throwback (I Wanna Rock/Doo Doo Brown by Luke) with bad intentions. Come through, y’all! Bring your own plate!
Racism sucks. Aaron and Tamu chat about the painful experience of realizing those they let into their lives wrote a check they couldn’t cash. They also attempt to reconcile their love of a throwback (I Wanna Rock/Doo Doo Brown by Luke) with bad intentions. Come through, y’all! Bring your own plate!
Aaron: [00:00:00] [00:00:00]I put it over there, put it over there.
Tamu: [00:00:47] welcome to another fun filled episode of when the bill comes due.
Aaron: [00:00:52] I really feel like I'm just like this. What do we have that music for? Like, I am the music, you know?
Tamu: [00:00:58] Well, this is [00:01:00] for you to figure out in our journey of exploration in our midlife
Aaron: [00:01:04] Last night, I was really busy.
It was wonderful. Um, it was fine. It was a little hokey. I mean, it'sMariah Carey , obviously if people are tuning into this to think Oh my God, I can't wait to see this Oscar winning performance. No, boo that's not going to happen. That's just not, that's not her speed.
Tamu: [00:01:23] You went from, it was wonderful. It was fine to, it was hokey.
Aaron: [00:01:28] Well, it was wonderful. My overall, it was wonderful. I loved it.
Tamu: [00:01:36] Wait, now, was it a special or what was it?
Aaron: [00:01:39] it's called Mariah. Carey's magical, Merry Christmas or a magical Christmas.
every year, at least in New York, she's I think sells out Madison square garden or something for Christmas shows.
I think this is really the show brought to life a little bit, but I cannot confirm or deny because I've never been, it just didn't work out. The [00:02:00] cards never worked out for me to be able to see her and then. Corona showed her ass.
So it is what it is
well, welcome guys. Welcome to when the bill is due, when the bill comes due.
Tamu: [00:02:13] lately I've been hearing when the bill comes to do a lot on the news, I was listening to Rachel Maddow the other day, and she was talking about, obviously this fucker, who's still trying to kill us.
And she was like, when the bill comes due and I was like, Oh my God, I need to get that clip and put it on our website.
Aaron: [00:02:32] Right
I would like to thank everybody for listening to our podcast. You know, we're organically growing our audience.
neither one of us probably have the time to devote to promoting. so it's always fun to do these episodes, but it's nice to hear the feedback from folks. also I wanted to say hi to our, two listeners in Asia. We have one in Russia. We also have eight in the UK.
[00:03:00] Tamu: [00:03:00] Well probably at least one or two of them was our friend. Jim
Aaron: [00:03:05] yes. And Jason and probably his significant other as well, literally. Do you know, I was thinking about ping pong the other day. God damn I miss that place.
Tamu: [00:03:17] last year, I was in London visiting my friend, Jim and Aaron came out to visit for my birthday weekend and, I introduced him to a place that I found with another one of our friends it's the best. all of these dumplings and all kinds of amazingness.
And it was just so good. We went so many times.
Aaron: [00:03:35] Yeah. I mean, I was only there for like a few days and we went. A lot.
Ping-pong if you're listening, please FedEx us some shit, please. ,
Tamu: [00:03:46] we enjoy ping pong quite a bit.
Aaron: [00:03:50] where international guys just that's legitimate. We are an international podcast. That sounded good. Didn't it?
You know what, people always [00:04:00] grabbing the first ever whatever, so we are an international podcast, probably not the first, but that doesn't matter
mariah Carey's number one fan has gone international much like her career path.
Right? Look at these parallels.
Tamu: [00:04:17] You're on the same trajectory. Well, that's a great way to segue into today's topic, which is what happens when you realize that people, are racist.
Aaron: [00:04:34] yeah, that's a heavy one. what happens when you discover one of your friends are racist, but are there levels of racism? racism is racism obviously, but you know what I'm saying?
Tamu: [00:04:44] I kind of know what you're saying. unfortunately this has become a thing in my world recently, where this has happened. A number of times with individuals, one very close individual and one, work. Colleague for me, you're my friend. If I share outside [00:05:00] my outside business with you, and if we've done things in the social setting outside .
That's kind of a big deal where I'm actually letting you into my inside world, which I don't necessarily share very broadly and I don't share it quickly.
I was having a call with two of my friends at work and we were talking about what was going on with the election and I made a comment that said , he should be in prison for human rights violations. And that's when it first started. Cause she was like, what are you talking about?
And I was like, what do you mean, what am I talking about? He put children in cages and ruined lives of thousands of people just at the border alone. And he should go to prison for that. And not to mention that he's a mass murderer, killing everybody with coronavirus. So. That seemed to be a foreign concept to her.
And I thought, well, that's weird. I mean, I already knew that this person was conservative. They're pro choice and have very strong views on that and [00:06:00] very big into her faith. And I can appreciate that differences are differences. That's okay.
Aaron: [00:06:05] Wait. Pro choice orPro-life.?
Tamu: [00:06:07] Sorry. Pro-life I always get it wrong
very much pro-life and you know why pro-life is so weird to me because I feel like we should all be pro-life cause we're all living, breathing people, but anyway,
Aaron: [00:06:19] It's only, pro-life when it matters. First of all, there's that right.
Tamu: [00:06:23] it matters to you,
Aaron: [00:06:24] save a baby, but kill black people.
Tamu: [00:06:28] don't want to give you the money to take care of that baby that we're forcing you to have, which is fine, that's her choice to have that choice. we were talking about student loans or something, and I had to leave because I had to get on an actual work call. I don't have a problem giving student loan forgiveness, Lord knows I'm what balls deep in it and happy to get her out of my student loans.
So I left and, my other friends stayed on and they had a big conversation and it did not go well. it was then that I figured out that she voted for him. [00:07:00] Probably twice because she was like, the Republican party knows that this has to change. And I was like, but, boo, 73 million people voted for him.
So I don't know what you're talking about. clearly they don't because of that many people voted for him, she's fiscally conservative socially. What is, what's the bullshit socially liberal or whatever, fiscally conservative or yeah, social, whatever it is. Like the bullshit excuse that they use when they, say I'm not racist and I'm not going to vote.
Aaron: [00:07:27] I just care about the money.
Tamu: [00:07:28] apparently it got a little more heated and it was, like, well, these people need to learn how to manage their money.
And stop trying to take my money away from me and all kinds of very interesting.
Aaron: [00:07:40] Oh, my
Tamu: [00:07:40] Oh yeah.
Aaron: [00:07:41] really
Tamu: [00:07:42] Yeah. it was in reference to if we forgive those student loans and these people are never going to learn, and they're
Aaron: [00:07:46] Oh, yeah.
Tamu: [00:07:47] expected to get paid money. Meantime, her husband got laid off and was getting that extra $600 in his paycheck.
also she did believe that Trump is not racist and he's done so much for black [00:08:00] people.
Aaron: [00:08:00] It sounds like a soundbite. So I'm very curious. So how are you reconciling this?
Tamu: [00:08:04] Well, that's a problem. Right? My friend and I, who is still my friend, had the conversation of well, I guess we're not having these check-ins every week because I'm out. And I was like, can we even do that? Because doesn't that then fall in line with cancel culture.
And then that's, I'm assuming what she expects right. Is to, , be like, Oh, of course, , those liberal chicks aren't even going to listen to me because now they think I'm whatever. And yeah, you're a racist. You voted for him. You're a racist. I don't give a shit. No, you could fool me once the first time if he voted for him because whatever, as a Republican Republicans do that, but when you've seen what has gone on in the last four years, and you're going to still sit up here and be like, well, everything is fine.
Fuck you. So, that's the problem I'm having lately is I'm having these weird racist things pop up and it's like, do I cancel you [00:09:00] altogether? And do I figure out understand that when the revolution comes, I can't rock with you because you're going to actually try to kill me.
or you're not going to fight. As hard as you would have fight for a different concept, you might be interested in or more passionate about because you do have a breaking point or a level or a ceiling that you reach when it comes to racist things. it's just very, it's a tough thing to think about.
So when I was talking to my friend about it, I was like, we can't not have these meetings. We can't not still talk to each other because that's exactly what the expectation is. I said, It sucks, but we know what she is now. You know what I mean?
all of these people lately are showing up and coming out, they look quote unquote liberal they might have orange hair or they might, you know, have piercings or whatever, but they're still fucking racists.
In their core. They're blending in like a Wolf in sheep's [00:10:00] clothing. Or as I like to say, a Wolf driving a sheep's minivan in this case, very smart person well-educated. But here we are with basically her literally saying. Oh, well, you can't trust what you read on the news. Anyway, because I had mentioned that Trump, was only paying $750 in federal taxes.
And she was just like,I don't know how you even know how you can find accurate information right now?
Aaron: [00:10:30] Like the woman in, , Michigan though, the star witness, right? Like they just like, where the fuck do you get all this information from? how are you all of a sudden his number one lawyer in the country, you know? so I think about that too there is a relationship that's there.
it's one thing to Casually mess with somebody. And you know, they're racist. Okay. Canceled. Right. But there's an investment here. I feel like it's hard to walk away from that. When I think about me being confronted with this was hard for me [00:11:00] because.
I don't know, I think I just grew up a pie in the sky kind of a kid I just, I never really encountered racist people and maybe, I should probably think a little deeper, like in my childhood. I'm sure I'm absolutely sure. , but I think also my parents did a really good job unfortunately of shielding me from a lot of it,
we are a mixed race, couple Rich is white from Iowa, and I'm black from Texas. it's exactly what you described that, my husband has family members that have. Voted for him. Right. and how do you reconcile that given the fact that you have six black children
I married into a family that, they voted, there are people in the family that have voted for Trump. To me if you're voting for him or if you even more broadly, if you cannot stand up to racism and what's happening right now in this world, and just checking on your black relatives, [00:12:00] to make sure they're okay, are you a racist?
I hear myself saying all this. And I feel like I'm dancing around the issue of them being racist. Right. But it is what it is but that's the reconciliation, , do you walk away? in my opinion, my children are my children, my husband is my husband.
And for me, if you can't categorically deny racism, I have no interest in cultivating that relationship. And so I think that's where I am, but I think also too, it's really tough because. My husband didn't ask for any of this. Right. And I know his heart, I know where he comes from, but, how do you reconcile that?
Because you're literally blowing up family and relationships. so it's a little harder for me to dissect and talk about, but when I think about your relationship with your coworker you're really at this crosswords roads where you're like, , do I try and salvage this [00:13:00] somehow?
is it my role? do I care enough about this person to, bring them back to whatever. Or is it just something that, I let go in that respect, are you kinda canceling her
Tamu: [00:13:13] I have no more feeling towards this person at all. I know where you are. We have reached our level and our plateau. You're still a nice person. we work together, we can talk about surface level things. We'll never go deeper than that. You'll never know anything else about my personal business.
it's just going to be like, Oh, did you see that show on TV? It's perfectly fine. the harder part is when it's someone that's closer to me than that, how do you deal with that?
that's a little bit harder and I will say the same thing in that regard. I don't have many feelings anymore, which is really unfortunate, but. we can be cool. [00:14:00] We can, laugh and
Aaron: [00:14:03] yeah.
Tamu: [00:14:04] yuck it up. And if, once we get released from this hell of COVID, we can go have a cocktail.
It's totally fine. But I know where you stand and that's not where I stand . I've had this discussion with my family and yeah, they're like, you could just use it as a teachable moment. And I was like, fuck that shit. why do we have to fucking teach these people, their moments? I'm fucking learning myself. If you don't understand that that's something that's not right. in the example of my coworker, knowing what has gone on with me at work, knowing what had gone on with me in the summer, this is still how you feel about things. Because money. Give me a fucking break.
Aaron: [00:14:50] to expound a little bit more on my familial, I just remember, I've gone through. I would say many phases of George Floyd. and the first phase was [00:15:00] really quite angry. So here we were, my children, particularly my teenage children were seeing this black man being murdered on national TV daily.
Cause you know, I wasn't turning it off. I, of course I'm worried about my children and how they're processing all this, but what was really unfortunate for me is that, , God, I remember a couple of family members, on my husband's side, reaching out and saying, Hey, love you.
Are you guys okay? But like the ones you expected to call you and be like, Hey, are you guys okay? Like my God, I, when I met my husband rich, I fell in love with Iowa. Just fell in love with the people everybody's so. Kind you know, Iowa, you guys worship the pig.
Like no other bitch. I never knew how to pick out bacon or corn until I met my husband. That's a whole other episode. I know. Do you know that little flap on the back? Do you know what that's for
Tamu: [00:15:59] of [00:16:00] what
Aaron: [00:16:00] of bacon?
Tamu: [00:16:02] flap on the back
Aaron: [00:16:03] You know, like you'd get bacon and there's a little flap or, well, they don't do the flap anymore, but like it's see-through
Tamu: [00:16:09] Yeah.
Aaron: [00:16:10] and you can , see, what does the bacon look like?
do you like look at it or do you just
Tamu: [00:16:14] Yeah, because I don't want that much fat. I want more meat.
Aaron: [00:16:18] Yeah. Yeah, I'm pretty sure. I was maybe 30 something when I discovered that that was the reason why I thought, why the fuck did they have this little flap? Like, it's so cute,
I had no idea. So I just loved going to Iowa. I always had a great time . so it was a little bit of a weird situation with us being gay and getting married and his parents reconciling that, which I'm assuming at some point we'll probably have him on here to share that entire.
beautiful story, but regardless they accepted us. And then we began to have children and they accepted us and we have mixed race children, not only my children, but we have other mixed race children [00:17:00] in the family. so it was just really disheartening, honestly, that we're sitting here going through this.
And not even once, could people just reach out and say, Hey, are you okay? so I kind of blew it up, which you know about, I was, again in the angry stage, I just wrote a note and said, Hey, just so you guys know we're doing okay. I guess I just thought that we were family and, before any of this happened, we cared about each other. We have a beautiful rainbow coalition of a family, and the response was we haven't heard from you in awhile. Are you fucking kidding me? we haven't heard from you in a while, some were honest about the fact that they don't talk about these things, which to me, you got to talk about it.
I don't accept that, because one of them is raising, a Chinese girl. And they're a mixed race children. in the [00:18:00] family and you can't not talk about this. it was infuriating to me because my two nieces, my beautiful nieces, who are mixed race, they're at this alone.
I was checking on like, are you guys okay? Blah, blah, blah. So that was really upsetting to me. I kind of blew up on that. I got different responses from different people, in the end. there's a relationship there, we've had Christmases together and other things, so it's really fucked up now, but, by and large, I would say that I agree that, I have no emotion about it.
I'm not going out of my way. To make that relationship work, and for my kids, we live on the East coast. They live back there and so if we want to see them, we have to go we probably won't be going back Chicago, maybe the closest we get to.
I do that because it's so wellbeing of my children in particular, my teenagers, I don't want to subject them to whatever it is. That's there now. [00:19:00] Right? Because. I believe the line has been drawn in the sand. And they've made it very clear what they believe in and what makes sense to them.
And that it doesn't matter that you have family or someone you claim to love, blah, blah, blah. that's my journey. That's my reconciliation I'm kind of done and I've always been that way to some degree. I have the weak moments
my father is still alive in Texas, but we do not have a relationship and my mother died, Rich's parents have died. the family that's left their cousins, et cetera. But you have this moment of is it worth it at this point?
if you, at a basic level, don't even get that, you don't even acknowledge that, you know what? I don't know it all and I'm sorry, or I don't even need an apology, actually. I really don't need an apology. But the fact that they'd rather not. Try and figure out where is the middle ground?
That's huge. That's a big problem for me. [00:20:00] And what does that say to my children? what am I raising my children to believe? it's really complex when there's, there are feelings and relationships involved and it's not easy and I'm not even saying that what I've done.
Is correct. Who knows what may happen in five to 10 years, they may hear this, and maybe they're hearing my thoughts, they heard me through an angry text, who knows what happens, but for me, it's pretty much a no go, if you can't at a basic level acknowledged that this world is fucked up and that there is racism and that. by some standards, we need to elevate how we treat people in this world and acknowledge then I don't have time for, it
Tamu: [00:20:46] Okay,
Aaron: [00:20:47] was a lot.
Tamu: [00:20:49] well, You had to go through it.
Aaron: [00:20:51] that was really sad for me. when I think back to that whole time and you and I both like emotions and just crying and just everything we went through, , of course that was all [00:21:00] wrapped up in it because there's a sadness there, there's a depth there, there's a relationship that's fractured, broken irreparable that's the reality of what I think a lot of people are going through right now. I am so fucking glad I did not have Thanksgiving with any family I just could not imagine what the dinner table would have been like at all.
we normally have friends come up,
Tamu: [00:21:22] sometimes those are the ones that disappoint you the most. those are the ones you make your family, right? Not the family that you have. It's the familyof that you make. And most of the people that I know are family from work I met you at work. Look at us now. you're my brother. most of my friends who I consider to be my family are people that I've made these connections with in the workplace. I purposefully reduce the amount of connections that I was making at my current workplace, because. I've encountered some nut bags.
Two kind of seeped through and [00:22:00] one is done.
Now I live my life by the motto of everybody is a racist until you show me otherwise. that means that I'm a bad judge of character, but I had not seen otherwise until now.
Aaron: [00:22:13] Yup. I hear you saying I'm kind of done, I have no feelings, there's a grief, there's a loss there too. Would you agree? Or you just weren't invested that much in that person.
Tamu: [00:22:23] if I let you into my personal life, if you know personal things about me, you know, about my family, you know, about things that go on in my insular life, you are considered a friend that means that you've gone through my vetting process. Yes. And we're good. Right?
Unfortunately, sometimes weird ones slipped through the cracks. This ended up being that as well. But I think the problem for me is that it makes me doubt myself and my instincts because I'm very guarded [00:23:00] about all of that. Anyway, I'm very guarded at about letting people into me. Ha ha ha. ,
I digress. I don't let people into my inner world very easily. it takes a lot for me to feel comfortable enough to share those things. And so for me, that's where I'm having my issue is like, fuck again, this was just happening, like back to back, right? I have to keep on thinking about things in a different way and trying to make concessions.
And I think my problem is that because I'm always very accommodating and always trying to put myself in other people's places, I will give you benefits of doubt. And I cannot do that here. there comes a point where it just has to be. No, this is a line drawn. I have to develop boundaries in relation to this, and if that's shutting myself off, which is probably unhealthy, then that's what it is for the moment.
I will say that week was a hard week [00:24:00] because it wasn't more so me mourning the relationship so much as me doubting myself, which is a big deal because I've made a lot of really significant life errors because I have. Made mistakes and let weird people come in in different circumstances and have wrecked into my world.
So I try to really keep that shit on a leash. the thing that I tell myself is it happens. this may be one of those, teachable moments for myself
Aaron: [00:24:33] I hope you're not too hard on yourself too. I believe just like you, , you assume everyone's a racist until they prove otherwise I assume every people are going to disappoint me. That's my biggest flaw I think is that I expect you to disappoint me. and I think. Sometimes you internalize it and I would say this, it's not your fault. whatever her shit was was her shit, you know? And unfortunately it [00:25:00] rips off some band-aid that you've had or some trauma that you've had previously. And then you, again, let up that guard, but, it's definitely not your fault, and I really hope you don't. kick yourself for this because that's her stupid ass, you know?
Tamu: [00:25:15] Yes. However, It was my choice to let this person in. And we've had differences about other big life issues. , but this is just a line. I have to say no.
Aaron: [00:25:28] Right. I have a really good friend that lives here in new England and God, I love her to pieces, but, she says some stuff that's not appropriate sometimes. And I think to some degree it's just. Plain ignorance. Right. and not that I should make excuses for other people, but to me she's worth the investment.
I see her love. I feel her love. it's incredibly genuine and I think she comes from a different place. Definitely. She's [00:26:00] not racist. but, I think that this is a time to learn. And, I think that, the universe brought us together. To teach each other because,quite frankly, it could have gone the way that you and your relationship went.
there was an indication that she was conservative, but. a really good person, an incredible heart, a loving person. she did not vote for Trump.
Tamu: [00:26:26] Now would that have been a line drawn
Aaron: [00:26:28] I believe so. I believe so. Absolutely.
Tamu: [00:26:31] You believe so?
Aaron: [00:26:33] it's hard for me to say yes, because I know her and I know that. she doesn't care for him I just know her heart. So it's hard for me to be hypothetical about it if she voted for Trump. Yes, of course. , I'm dancing around this aren't
Tamu: [00:26:49] you are,
Aaron: [00:26:50] I really am. okay. I'm being a politician right now. Fuck. Fuck you politicians. Oh, I don't mean that. Please.
Don't put that in there. let's see [00:27:00] if she voted for Trump,
Tamu: [00:27:03] what if all of a sudden she was like, you know, what
Aaron: [00:27:05] feel the same way? Is that your question?
Tamu: [00:27:09] is that? The line drawn?
Aaron: [00:27:11] Well, it's a done deal, it's a wrap. Why wouldn't it? I mean, she's not part
Tamu: [00:27:15] You just said that you know her heart and she's a good person.
Aaron: [00:27:20] absolutely. I don't think she would vote for him.
Tamu: [00:27:22] what if she did, what if she said, you know what I did? I just didn't tell you. I lied.
Aaron: [00:27:27] Oh, well, that's, I mean, that's obviously that's trust and that's besides trust. It's Trump. Does that make sense? So that would be a yes. That we would not be friends. That was hard.
It's really so tough. it's really fucked up because God in June, I was avoiding people like the plague, the people I know are ride or die, I didn't want anything that I was feeling to come out sideways, but there was a moment where I was just like, motherfucker, stand [00:28:00] up.
where are you? especially when it comes to family. you know what? You can vote for Trump. I don't care. that doesn't bother me, . But if you are not coming to the defense of the black people that are in your family, the black people that you claim to love that you're close to huge problem, completely canceled. Wow. That was tough. there's no easy answer here.
Tamu: [00:28:23] it doesn't stop the person from being a good hearted person. Doesn't stop them from, liking or loving you. But does that get to the point where it's is it more than just about me? , or is it , Oh, you're that one that's different, you know, kind of a thing.
You're that special Negro in my life.
Aaron: [00:28:43] right. It's like, , there's black people and then there's niggers,
I used to date a guy. actually very serious before rich my serious relationship. And I don't even remember the context of the call. I just remember him saying this to me. He said, you know, there's black [00:29:00] people. And then there's niggers. I clearly fell in love with the racist that didn't work out for me that did not work out for me.
still, it's just, it's very, it's fucked up because we had a real, genuine love. We had a real genuine relationship, but if that had happened today, it would have been done. Right.
Tamu: [00:29:28] What's the
Aaron: [00:29:29] I have been in situations where I said nothing or did nothing and it definitely would have been a different story. had I had this reckoning. I don't know, 15 years ago, and he's, I'm not even gonna make excuses for him because I'm just not gonna go there. But, , I would've handled it differently for sure.
And we probably would not have been together for sure. But then again, that's the struggle for me because. [00:30:00] People are,
Tamu: [00:30:01] what's it about the Dick what's going on? Why was that a struggle? Why is that a struggle?
Aaron: [00:30:07] no, no. I think about that relationship, it was my first serious relationship. I think I've talked about the fact that, it should have never been, he had a bunch of shit going on and I had a bunch of shit going on. Mainly that I made $11 an hour. I was trying to party my ass in Miami.
that was really the big thing. we probably, should've never been. Together. I think I was trying to make that relationship work because, it was the first real thing that I wanted to hold on to and I had blinders on and obviously case in point when, he says that statement, I love him, but I think back to that moment, I think it's really fucked up because I was suppressing. Myself. I was suppressing me as a black person to fit into [00:31:00] his box and to his description of what a good black person was. fast forward to my husband now and to rich and just, uh, woke as fuck whoever the fuck I am right now. And he's still here and he's always gotten it and he's always, supported me, but, I would say.
if I'd had this awakening, then we would have never been anything. I think
Tamu: [00:31:27] But then your life would be different.
Aaron: [00:31:29] moment is a teachable moment, right?
I think we're all sort of deciding what's worth it, who do we help? I have people that are like reached out to me like, Oh my God, I'm with you. And just tell me, where can I go for resources or whatever? And I'm just kinda like we're grown ass people, your whole ass adult go and
Tamu: [00:31:50] with a vast, expanse of Google.
Aaron: [00:31:53] Right in that regard, I'm tired. And I, I'm trying to figure it out for myself. Not [00:32:00] only I'm exhausted because I've pretended to be something or I've only been part of myself for 40 something years of my life. And now I have to go and reprogram the world.
And that's a really hard statement to make, because to some degree we have to educate, but. it's those limits that we need to define for people. I've said it before. I said, I don't believe it's my job to educate anyone. I don't think it's my job. if you're, if you're truly seeking to change yourself and better yourself, there's a whole world out there.
if you're looking for , education, or if you can't take the deep, deep shit, watch Blackish, or whatever. That's where I'm at I can't teach you. you're a whole ass adult. Go for it.
Tamu: [00:32:46] I've had this discussions within my family and they say, this is a time for you to educate a person about. How they're fucked up. I always say I choose not to, because that's [00:33:00] not my place to tell you that. However, I mean, is it, if something is impacting you or making you feel a certain way, should you go out and say, you know what.
What you did, or this action has left me feeling a type of way about things. And I we're still, we're still okay. But we're not cool like we were before. and it's going to take a minute for us if if it's worth it for both of us to do, to do that, you know, there's trust that's been violated or I'm concerned about whether or not you're gonna defend me in a revolution. What if you and I are out and something happens? What, what are you going to do? Walk away? some people were like, bitch, you need to go have that conversation already.
Snatch that wig off and do whatever you need to do. And I was just like, but also, for me need time because when I'm angry in that space, I don't think that people really would appreciate seeing [00:34:00] it because it's not great. So I always need
Aaron: [00:34:03] I would agree.
Tamu: [00:34:04] and process to see where I'm at with it.
also I feel like space sometimes does help. to think about things differently. That's how I got to the place of well clearly we're going to have to meet some people where they are. I also feel like, fuck that you need to get it up to where I'm at and that's not fair, but that's how I feel.
Aaron: [00:34:23] This is heavy.
Tamu: [00:34:25] Yes.
Aaron: [00:34:27] you made me think of a story today on speaking of what I categorize is racism. So I went to go get a Christmas tree yesterday I'm there, I'm picking out my tree. and I was just walking around and this woman. comes to me and says, do you work here? And I said, well, that's quite an assumption, but no, I do not work here. And, and she's like, Oh really? Giggly. You know, I was like, whatever, bitch, I'm moving on. I was looking at my trees and like, she comes out. She's like, I didn't mean anything [00:35:00] by it.
I was like, no, it's fine. It's all good. then I picked my tree out and I was holding it. And you could just feel the nervous sort of like, man, I really fucked up, you know, like you could just feel it. And she would come over and she was like, Oh, that's a good tree.
It's full on the bottom. That's really nice. It's like, yep. Yep. those are the assumptions we have to deal with all the time, all the time. I didn't get like angry. I was really proud of myself because I probably would have just said, Nope, I don't work here and moved on, but I was just like, you know what, bitch, no, I don't work here.
Why would you make that assumption? Because I'm dressed in a, hat , in a hooded, whatever.
Tamu: [00:35:40] mean, you do tend to go out looking like a Vagrant.
Aaron: [00:35:42] you know what it is my chic hip gay dad
Tamu: [00:35:47] chic,
Aaron: [00:35:49] You should have seen in the day was a hot ass mess. I have on gym shorts and how these really tall, like winter rain boots are my favorite. And so I had to go to the grocery store and people
Tamu: [00:35:58] don't you dress like a [00:36:00] five-year old? What is wrong with you?
Aaron: [00:36:03] I just didn't feel like going upstairs. We were lazy today. We were watching movies it's snowing. I have, I have a very cool fashion sense.
Tamu: [00:36:11] for a gay man, it's very sad. Your fashion sense.
Aaron: [00:36:14] You know what that's just stereotypical. It really is. I have evolved. I used to be like this cute little hot thing. Now I'm just, a million pounds and happy fat and sassy, and I'm comfortable. I'll dress stuff when I need to, but I I've never leave the house. So this is my wardrobe.
Tamu: [00:36:37] But we've left the
Aaron: [00:36:37] I can still pull
Tamu: [00:36:38] and me.
Aaron: [00:36:41] I can still pull them just so you know, .
Tamu: [00:36:43] I'm going to give you an example in a day of blackness today. So I went to go pick up food, outside obviously. It was like 37 degrees, five people standing outside. four of us hadn't registered yet. So we each go register and there's two people ahead of me, one lady behind me [00:37:00] and I'm sitting here, going, let me figure out how this is going to work out.
I'm feeling like I'm going to be the last one to get my food. Now they've been going in order of people who came in and of course the bitch behind me got her food first. And they're like, I'm coming with yours too. I was like, ain't this some shit leaving me standing out here last
Aaron: [00:37:29] I would like to say we were similar beforehand, right? we probably wouldn't have given that a second thought. Right.
Tamu: [00:37:34] I usually think about it though. it's something that always comes to my mind, ,
Aaron: [00:37:37] I do. Yes. It's, it's definitely present, but it's more of a consuming thought now. Right? It's more of something we pay attention to.
Like I used, I mean, I think we all do unconsciously, right.
Tamu: [00:37:52] think the difference now is that, before it was kind of like, is this kinda racist. And now we're like, [00:38:00] it's fucking racist. I think that's the difference.
Aaron: [00:38:07] that's very true.
Tamu: [00:38:07] There's no. Could this just be like an accident?
So now I just assume it's all racist ahead of time. More so than
Aaron: [00:38:17] right, right. It's true. this is kind of a heavy show. When you, when you brought up this topic,
Tamu: [00:38:28] happened to me recently, so we should talk about it.
Aaron: [00:38:31] I obviously I've heard your story, but when I thought about it, the only thing I could think of was really the family dynamic and, still very hard even having said all that and here me sitting saying, categorically. We ain't going back to Iowa. , they can come here if they want to. but it's not even worth the investment anymore to me. that's where I'm at. I'm not going to subject myself to people that aren't accepting. The whole part of me, [00:39:00] and supporting what we're going through because that's really, really important.
It's really important for my children to see that whoever is white in their lives is supporting them. That's huge because this world, this year is fucked up, fucked up. And at its core what we've seen on the front page is racism. And if I don't give my children an example of what I believe to be love, acceptance, and unconditional love by the people that I bring around them.
What the fuck are we doing?
Tamu: [00:39:37] amen.
Aaron: [00:39:37] I'm done. I'm sorry. I'm done.
this is a layer, something,
Tamu: [00:39:41] Yeah,
Aaron: [00:39:42] I'm done. I'm good.
shines in me so brightly, they can try, but they can't take that away from me. Mariah Carey, copywritten. Don't copy.
Tamu: [00:39:54] And on that note, we're going to come back with our throwback
[00:40:00]our throwback today is, I want rock doodoo Brown by Luke from the two live crew.
Aaron: [00:40:23] I'm not going to say the rest.
Tamu: [00:40:25] so it came out apparently the day before my birthday in 1992. So November 9th, 1992. I actually have a memory of when I first heard this song and I have a journal it's a trapper keeper. the first time I heard it was in 1994, my dad was throwing parties with his friends and I was finally old enough to go to one of these parties. Cause I was in college at this point and I remember.
There was this guy that I liked and it [00:41:00] was really stupid. I'm sure at some point I'll talk about this dumb ass infatuation of waste slash wasted time, but he was going to this party and I want it to look like a lie. Okay. So I got my hair. Did I had a cute dress? Like I was tone on tone on tone.
Ivory colored dress, ivory colored cause we were tone on tone. On tone the nineties ivory colored stockings, ivory colored shoes. Now. I thought you couldn't tell me shit. So here I am thinking, I looked great. I'm singing flawless in my head before it was a thing.
We were going into the venue and I were in the elevator and I looked down and I realized that, you know how sometimes when you buy shoes, they have the cardboard in the shoe. To kind of make it shape your shoe. I still had them in my shoes. They were showing. [00:42:00] So the universe was like,
Aaron: [00:42:08] My.
Tamu: [00:42:09] think so, boo.
At that time I had, , started a friendship slash maybe talking to the person who was going to be my first boyfriend. And I'm just going to give him his nickname now, Ben, he and his friends were going like me and my girls were going and then This, guy that I had, this weird infatuation with was going as well.
I remember Ben. And I danced the whole night together and I remember that fucker, what am I going to call him? It doesn't matter. Let's call him, "that fucker". That fucker was basically like very sad. And in his feelings, it's sitting in a corner and the whole night being envious of the fact that I was out there, shaking it fast.
this song came on but this song was the. Edited version . So I didn't know the real lyrics I was today [00:43:00] years old and we were just listening to it when I realized that he's saying head, head and more head and not hey, hey and more hey.
Aaron: [00:43:08] I'm very curious to know what happened with Ben?
so , he was butthurt that night.
Tamu: [00:43:13] Ben was the guy who was dancing with the whole night. So he and I were dancing to this song. It's the guy that I'm calling the fucker, who was butt hurt and sitting on his ass.
Aaron: [00:43:22] nothing ever came of that? No drama.
Tamu: [00:43:25] I mean,
Aaron: [00:43:26] sitting there salty
Tamu: [00:43:28] he felt bad because, granted by the time I have seen him, I had taken the cardboard out my shoe and then I was looking flawless, like Beyonce says, and he was like, wow, you look great. And I was like, well, fuck you. I'm going to go shake it fast over here with the next man's. So that's how I remember the song very fondly and I love the song.
And then I realized many of the words of the song are very terrible and misogynistic and awful. Oh my God. But it's a bop. It is one of those shake it fasts.
[00:44:00] Aaron: [00:44:00] it's fun. Yes. 1992, it was a really weird year for me. 1992, I would say it was a white, black kid at that point.
we were more into alternative music, but I do remember we lived in Houston at the time and I do remember. this song on the radio and everybody, my whole school, just, you know, it is a bop andit's a jam, but I like you,I was listening to the words and I was like, Oh my, this is , wow.
Tamu: [00:44:32] All right, kids. I know that we're talking about it. You probably have never heard this song before, the first sentence is don't stop, pop that P me see you Doo Doo Brown. So I'm assuming Doo Doo Brown's a dance.
Aaron: [00:44:47] I guess
Tamu: [00:44:48] Okay.
Aaron: [00:44:48] I just went here due to Brown doodoo Brown. Yes. It's a dance. this is Miami shit. Hey Miami.
Tamu: [00:44:55] it's a Miami thing
Aaron: [00:44:58] what does the edited [00:45:00] version say? Do you know,
Tamu: [00:45:01] I don't know. they blanked out the words, like pop that baby, pop that, shake that shake that. You know what I mean? he mumbled over the big words.
Aaron: [00:45:11] Right, right, right.
Tamu: [00:45:13] show that coochie, let me show you that coochie, which is better than just p- word.
I find that in looking at the lyrics, this song is all about talking about getting vagine until last sentence where it's like, let me hear you say, Hey, we want some D-I-C- K like we can't even just say the word. We have to spell it out, but we're yelling out pussies all over the place.
Aaron: [00:45:42] it's the rhythm, like you can say, Hey, we want some deeeooock I mean, the gays can say that now, right? Hey, we want some deeeooock but back then they had to spell it out too, to make the measure. I would assume I do not want to think for [00:46:00] Dr. Luke at all. I mean, that's not Dr. Luke, Luke
it's an incredibly sexist dong.
Tamu: [00:46:08] it's very terrible.
Aaron: [00:46:09] I'm curious to know your thoughts on this. So like, I am obsessed, obsessed with the WAP.
Tamu: [00:46:20] W a P what ass P word since Aaron is too delicate and can't say it.
Aaron: [00:46:25] I'm not, I'm not gonna say it. I can't. but I'm obsessed with like Megan, the stallion it's a very interesting dynamic because. I think people judge the song, differently than they did Luke.
And women are criticized Meg and Cardi have been criticized for this song. Right. But I also see it as just like what a fucking female empowerment. Statement, like all of Megan's songs are just like, I'm taking the Dick, you know, that's basically what she's saying. I'm taking the Dick and [00:47:00] essentially they're all these women that are coming up now.
They're doing exactly what these, these pigs have done for years and years and years and years. And look at the double standard, you know, look at the double standard.
Tamu: [00:47:14] Well, to be fair, Luke, and to live crew did experience a lot
Aaron: [00:47:17] That's true. That was
Tamu: [00:47:19] issues in terms of their, explicit lyrics and fighting into Supreme court, et cetera. But I do understand what you're saying. Oh my gosh, that was 1992. Here we are in 2020. And these ladies can't talk about the gaping holes who cares.
But we can sit up here and have 7,050 million rap songs about sticking your dicks in things
Aaron: [00:47:43] Right, right. I agree.
even today's music there's not much to be imagined in these songs at all.
Tamu: [00:47:53] very vivid expression of things. And this was like the early entrees into that. T wo Live Crew it was [00:48:00] the most vulgar shit that you could hear.
Aaron: [00:48:02] And that's pretty much G compared to what we hear these days.
Tamu: [00:48:08] Didn't you just tell me, Ariana Grande was literally talking about her vagine
Aaron: [00:48:11] Yes, I love that women are so empowered to express themselves there's many people that have fallen on the sword. I only think of Madonna and maybe other female rappers like, trina, maybe she's probably in that category. Right? she's not mainstream like Megan and Cardi, right? many of following the sword to get Megan and Cardi and all of these girls that are coming
got it. We want some
Tamu: [00:48:41] Oh,
Aaron: [00:48:42] It's an uplifting song. I mean, you can pop in some Kirk Franklin, if you're having a bad day. With the Clark sisters or something a little more tame.
[00:49:00] Tamu: [00:48:59] It's just a bad is a terrible, terrible, terrible song. That's still a good bop.
Aaron: [00:49:06] I'm sure we'll talk about this in another episode, but like it's part of the reconciliation, like, how do you reconcile, all the R Kelly songs and the Michael Jackson songs and the Cosby show , can't even bring myself to watch the Cosby show to date, but I loved it back then
Tamu: [00:49:22] the time where we were growing up and forming more troublesome, this was okay. I mean, it was okay to talk about and degrade the ladies. Cause if I remember correctly, that's what these guys are about specifically.
I mean, to throw a dart at a fucking rap song back in the nineties, two thousands into almost today. And it's the same.
since we're in the throwback segment, I do have to give my props to Mary J Blige. This is the 20th anniversary or 25th anniversary of the, my life album, I remember sitting in [00:50:00] my room, listening to the song, my life, and that lady can still make me depressed to this day with her songs. So she and I were right on par with our melancholy. Love that
Aaron: [00:50:14] Mary album that was like my melancholy, she worked with,Baby Face on a song called missing you. I like those depressing things, but I'm going to let you know what I'm going to listen to my life.
Tamu: [00:50:25] I would listen to the song, my life, on repeat for hours and hours and hours and just be sad and crying and my dark ass room, because that's exactly how I felt all the time.
Aaron: [00:50:37] wasn't that the greatest feeling though?
I mean music is comfort to me even if it's a depressing song and if you're in a depressive state, it's comfort to you to hear that song right.
Tamu: [00:50:49] No, it's not. It, it evokes emotion for me and sometimes can promote harm we can get into that another time, [00:51:00] but there've been many, many songs that I had banned for probably a decade because I couldn't listen to them of what they meant. So for me, it's very serious with deep.
Well, let's wrap it up, kid. Any fun, final thoughts about Luke and his, titties shaking pussy popping song.
Aaron: [00:51:21] it was a great bop, very sexist. I will now feel guilty about shaking my ass to it, but
Tamu: [00:51:27] I know, but you'll still shake it.
Aaron: [00:51:29] a bop, is a bop, a bop is a bop, I'm not ready to reconcile right now.
Tamu: [00:51:37] maybe before you play it, you can say, I recognize that this song is misogynistic as fuck. And when I shake my ass, pop my pussy and shake my titties, I'm shaking them against misogyny.
Aaron: [00:51:56] You're anti. I will just hug my daughter's like [00:52:00] incredibly tight for four minutes. So I'll hug my daughter for four minutes every time I hear it be like, daddy's about to do a very bad thing and his ear. So hug me.
Tamu: [00:52:12] Would you like to do any housekeeping?
Aaron: [00:52:14] Sure. I'd like to take this, you know what? I can give me a chance. Give me a fucking chance. Oh, my poor kid probably is just looking in all this profanity.
Tamu: [00:52:29] a lot of P words and T words flying tonight.
Aaron: [00:52:33] I would just ask folks, follow us on Instagram or check us out wherever you get your podcast, , @whenthebillcomesdue s our handle. , thanks for listening.
Tamu: [00:52:49] subscribe,
Aaron: [00:52:50] Yeah, I'll do that. I did good though. Right?
Tamu: [00:52:52] You did also write a review
Aaron: [00:52:55] share it with your friends.
Tamu: [00:52:57] write a review, even if it's this shit's [00:53:00] great. Or what the hell is a Luther Campbell? That's fine.
Aaron: [00:53:04] You could spell out D I C K D dot I dot C dot K, whatever you feel. We're listening.
Tamu: [00:53:14] Don't stop. Get it. Get it. Don't stop.
Stay safe, everybody.
Aaron: [00:53:19] yes, please stay safe. Stay home. This shit is legit. And real. Thanks for listening.