Doubles Only Tennis Podcast

JJ Tracy & Robert Cash Interview: The Balance Between Focus & Fun, Partner Dynamics, & Challengers vs ATP Events

• Will Boucek • Episode 245

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0:00 | 42:52

The rising American doubles team of JJ Tracy and Robert Cash share their journey from winning the NCAAs at Ohio State in 2024 to becoming ATP doubles title winners in Los Cabos in 2025. They've climbed to #59 and #62 in the world this year from outside the top 140.

You'll learn what's clicked for them recently, and get to know them as individuals and as a team.

  • Working with new coach Andy Fitzell has helped refine their game and contributed to back-to-back titles
  • Balancing a lighthearted approach and ability to joke during matches while maintaining an intense work ethic
  • The differences between Challenger and ATP Level doubles
  • Both players credit Ohio State coaches Ty Tucker and Justin Kronauge for instilling their strong work ethic
  • How Robert shares "direct feedback" with JJ during matches
  • Their strategy for playing well in tiebreakers
  • Future goals
  • Racquet changes and customization

The more interviews I do like this, the more I realize how much team chemistry and partnership dynamics matter. These two provide a great example of what a strong partnership looks like. Watch JJ and Robert throughout the rest of the 2025 season as they continue their doubles journey.

Learn more about JJ & follow:

Learn more about Robert & follow:

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Speaker 1

You're about to hear a conversation with JJ Tracy and Robert Cash. I spoke with this doubles pair in Dallas earlier this year and they've since increased their rankings by over 30 spots. They are now number 59 and 62 in the world. They are coming off of two titles one in the Newport Challenger and then, most recently, their first ATP title at the 250 tournament in Los Cabos. We talked about what has worked so well the last few weeks. We talked about their recent coaching change.

Back-to-Back Titles and Recent Success

Speaker 1

We also discussed their rise in the doubles rankings and what it's been like going from college back in 2024 to the ATP Tour, playing in some of the biggest events in the world, including Wimbledon, where they won a match and actually had a match point against the eventual finalists. We also discussed their partnership. We talked a lot about team chemistry. We talked about advice that they would give to themselves when they started on tour about 12 to 18 months ago, and then plans for the rest of the year, and at the end, I also asked them a few questions from Twitter and Instagram. So, without further delay, enjoy this conversation with the rising American doubles pair, JJ Tracy and Robert Cash. Hey, everyone, Welcome to the show. Today we have JJ Tracy and Robert Cash on Welcome guys.

Speaker 2

Hi, thanks for having us.

Speaker 1

I'm glad we could set this up coming off your first ATP title together down in Los Cabos, first ATP title together down in Los Cabos, and you have won back-to-back titles, actually winning the Challenger in Newport as well. Talk a little bit about the last few weeks and then we'll step back and look at the year overall, but talk specifically about the last few weeks. What has gone right or what do you feel like was maybe a difference maker the last few weeks to get these two titles?

Speaker 3

yeah, I mean, um, we were, uh, before these last two titles, we were coming off a rough couple weeks. Um, we got, uh, you know, we got bounced early and um, where was, I think, bordeaux and, uh, birmingham? So we took a couple close first round losses and you gave us a lot more time to train and kind of look at the bigger picture. And then, as well, we went and signed in for the Majorca 250. We were there ready to play and first alternate we didn't get in.

Speaker 3

So we had a lot of time to train and tune up some new stuff and, you know, started working with a coach at Wimbledon who started helping us out a lot more and it's easy to tune up when given the guidance like that. So I think that was a big part of our success, just having these extra weeks of training. And you know, sometimes it gets tough being burnt out on the road and you know being so hungry, not getting into these tournaments and losing first round and you know watching the people you lose to go far in the tournament. It's tough. So I think that gave us the motivation and really the hunger and drive to push through these last two weeks and be so dominant.

Speaker 2

Robert anything to add? Yeah, no, I think he covered it, just trusting the process along the way. We had so much time to practice, so trying to stack good days on good days, as we like to say, and make incremental improvements in our games and really hone down our skills and looking at the bigger picture, knowing that the results will come if we just keep putting in the work who, uh, can you share who the new coach is that you started working with at wimbledon?

Speaker 3

uh, yeah, yeah, we uh it's old kind of works through Ohio State as well. But Andy Fitzell out in Germany, he's going to be with us for a while now. But yeah, no, great guy and definitely taught us a lot of things and it's obviously not easy to afford or keep a steady coach out there on the tour, but it's good to have someone on our corner that we know and trust.

Speaker 1

And yeah, yeah, it seems, but it's good to have someone on our corner that we know and trust and yeah, yeah, it seems like it's paying off, though with two titles, right, you've got to invest a little bit to get that improvement for sure. Yeah, I know Andy. Actually I've chatted with him a few times. He's a really good guy and a smart coach who I should probably have on the podcast at some point, actually maybe.

Speaker 2

He'd be, a great guest yeah.

Speaker 1

Maybe we'll do that soon. So I want to step back and look at kind of the year overall and even stepping back to like last year, neil's time at Ohio State. You won the NCAA the doubles title at Ohio State last year. You get a wild card in the US Open. You won a match there, I believe. Is that right open? Uh, you won a match there, I believe. Is that right Um? Did you, you know, going into your first full year, I guess, on tour um, did you expect this sort of or these sorts of results to be inside on both of your almost inside the top 60 at this point, um, this quickly? Or did you have any expectations and talk about how those kind of goal setting and expectations have changed over time as well?

Speaker 2

Yeah, I would say, coming out of college personally, I was very, very confident in my double skills and I wouldn't say cocky, just confident with all the work I put in and the results, you know, speak for themselves. And JJ and I had an unbelievable season our senior year. We didn't even play the full year together, we just played, I mean, a majority of it. We practiced with each other but practiced a lot with other partners as well. So we were still trying to learn each other's games. But I just had confidence and trust in ourselves and what we were taught in school at Ohio State with Ty Tucker and Justin Kornagy, that we would be able to make a splash. You know, on the tour I didn't really think of a timeline I don't know if JJ thought of a timeline of how quickly we could rise through the ranks. You know, obviously, winning the NCAA championship, getting the wild cards into Newport, US Open, Cincinnati, Miami, DC, Like all those opportunities are, were unbelievable and they, they kickstarted our career and we we can't be more thankful and show enough gratitude to all those people who helped us along the way.

Speaker 2

But getting those opportunities as well, you know you have to make a name for yourself. You have to. You're going to play against the best players in the way, but getting those opportunities as well, you know you have to make a name for yourself. You have to. You're going to play against the best players in the world. So being able to compete with them, beat some of the best players in the world, you know, be right there with them.

From College to Pro Tennis Journey

Speaker 2

It's very reassuring and and you know cause you may not you may not have as much confidence when you're playing the guys you grew up watching on TV and the final, final rounds of slams and things like that. But once you get on the court with them and all the extra stuff is gone, then the name, the, you know their persona or whatever it is, and you're just playing tennis and you're hanging with them, you're winning points Like that gives you a lot of confidence and the more we have those experiences and the more confidence we have moving forward at these big events. So we're just trying to get better. Every day gives, give ourselves some the best opportunities, most opportunities to get in these big events and, uh, keep playing and keep playing well and keep having fun what about for you, jj?

Speaker 1

did you have any sort of expectations coming out of uh college? And I know you played a little bit of singles as well, and I don't think you've played much singles recently since we spoke in Dallas, right.

Speaker 3

No, I mean, like he said he covered a lot of it. But I think part of the thing that made us so successful so quickly is that, you know, I don't think either of us really had major expectations or we didn't really have these. You know, you know, first off, nobody close to us or in our circle has really rose through the ranks and doubles or was a current doubles player or anything like that. So we in a way had nobody close to us to look up to. So we didn't know where our ceiling should be. And you know, also, we kind of just take a very lighthearted approach to everything, especially at the start of our career. You know he was, he wasn't sure he was going to play pro tennis.

Speaker 3

I was more singles forward coming out of college and you know I was still playing the odd challenger here and there.

Speaker 3

We were taking three weeks off at a time and every time we stepped on the court it was like all right, this is just like another day in life, let's just go have fun. You know, I mean we get called out all the time for cracking jokes and like laughing on the court and people around us would say like yo, like you guys need to take this a little more serious and we're like, I'm like, okay, I actually think this is part of what makes us so good is that, you know, we can kind of talk crap to each other, we can crack jokes right before a deuce point. I mean, there was even a time last week, right before a deuce point, we did rock paper scissors for who took it, because I mean we were both returning well. So no, I think part of what made us so successful was that we, in a way, had no expectations and, you know, just kind of go out there and have fun and, you know, enjoy every moment we have.

Speaker 1

Did Andy know that you all used rock? Used rock paper?

Speaker 3

scissors for a deuce point. He did not. That might. I'm not sure if that was a match or practice, but sometimes the last two weeks that happened okay okay if it did happen around him, we would probably keep it.

Team Chemistry and Lighthearted Approach

Speaker 1

Uh, keep it to ourselves I was gonna say, say that's kind of a bold move for a match. I would hope for my team to have a little bit of game plan going in in terms of who we should choose from the deuce point, but if that helps you play better, I say, go for it. One question about that, though how do you, I guess, balance that kind of lighthearted nature, but also, obviously, when you're on the practice court, on the match court, you have to be working your butt off and you really have to kind of take it professional? How do you balance those two between each other?

Speaker 2

between each other. Yeah, it's definitely something we're still trying to figure out, but, uh, what was instilled from us all throughout college is, when you step on the court, you, you give 100 percent. Uh, there's no, there's no other way to do it. Uh, like ty ty tucker, justin kornagy, they force us to go 100 every single day. We're when we're on the court, and that's how you get better.

Speaker 2

Because you, you gotta take every minute you're on the practice court. Because you don't, you don't get as much practice time, uh, at the atp events or even the challenger events as you would when you're back home. You've got limited time, sometimes one hour a day, sometimes 30 minutes. You're lucky, you get two hours. So you have to really be focused when you're on the court and make those improvements and and like, just gotta be focused. There's no, there's no other way around it. But uh, at the same time, that that definitely can uh burn you out quickly.

Speaker 2

If you're just so tennis driven, everything's tennis, uh, tennisist tennis, that and I feel like we do a great job, like off the court, when we're in new, new cities, new towns, um, exploring, uh, having fun just off the court with whatever it is, staying competitive if it's a card game, a phone game, just experiencing all the new things. So I think we've done a pretty good job of balancing the fun and the professional side of tennis. Definitely could still do better, probably should stay a little bit more professional. But, like JJ said I, the lightheartedness has really helped us along the way and, um yeah, we're still still working on it, still trying to get better and more used to it jj, were you gonna say something?

Speaker 3

no, no, he, he took it out of my mouth. I was just gonna say it's easy to work hard because that was what was instilled with us with ty and crow for four or five years and you know we don't really know anything else now. So I mean, you know a mediocre practice for us, I feel like might be. You know we're still sweating buckets and you know going crazy for it and you know we that's that's kind of our floor now and that's all because of the coaching at Ohio State and the great job they've done.

Speaker 1

Yeah, that's interesting. I hadn't thought about this before until y'all just said this. But, like, maybe each player has and I'm just kind of thinking out loud like maybe each player has a tendency to like overpush themselves and they need training, or like help being a bit more lighthearted, and then some players might not take it seriously enough. Need help the other direction. Need help with like motivation and putting 100 percent effort in. Maybe because of Ohio State and the way you're trained there don't have issue with working 100% every day, but y'all want to be able to have that kind of lightheartedness to so that you don't kind of have that burnout.

Speaker 2

I guess Is that a fair way to think about it.

Speaker 2

To add to it too. I think our chemistry is so good on and off the court we can really hold each other accountable. So some days maybe I'm not 100, um, a hundred percent focused and being too lighthearted and and JJ will tell me and he'll push me to be better, and vice versa, if he's having a tough day or whatever it is, I'll I'll hold him accountable and I think we both uh, we understand each other where we're coming from really well and we know we just want the best for each other and just trying to get better. So I think being able to hold each other accountable has been huge in our success.

Speaker 1

What is the most surprising thing? As you've gone, started to like qualify for, and now win these ATP events. What's been the most surprising thing about being kind of on the at the top level of the tour? Now you've played Wimbledon, you won a match there. You've been to, obviously, the US Open last year. You won last week in Los Cabos. What's been kind of the most shocking or surprising thing for you?

Speaker 3

Yeah, I mean, for me personally, I think the most surprising thing is that, you know, even in our first year on tour, like at the top, the margins are truly so small. I mean, you look at a team like Rinky and Pell who just had an unbelievable tournament in final Wimbledon and, you know, face match points in their first round against a great team. One of them went on to win the mixed and we had a match point on them in the second round mixed and we had a match point on them in the second round. And then you know, and they've I don't think they've played together before and you know just two great doubles players and it surprised me how small the margins are.

Speaker 3

I mean, we back in last Cincinnati we played Purcell and Thompson and you know we were up in the breaker in the first set and they were just coming off a grand slam. We were like we're this close and this close. And you know, there's, there's guys that we practice with at the challengers. We're like, we're like shocked, we're like this guy's super good if he could get the right partner, if he could, you know, hone in this one more inch easily top 20 player and the same, the same goes. I mean, I think the level from maybe 150 to you know know, even the top is not much. It's very close and everybody's good, Everybody wants to be there. It's just possibly things like the you know, the lighthearted and how to balance your training that could separate that.

Speaker 2

Robert. Yeah, no, that's a good one To give him a little pushbackback. I think Ty back in college he harped on us every single day it's a saying we had. We would say all the time how slim and tiny the margins are. And so I figured the margins were extremely thin because, look, they are in college and it's doubles. You're playing no ads sometimes. Uh, one shot here and there makes a difference. It's literally one point, one or two points every match. You can look back. So that one wasn't as surprising to me, but it's definitely been reassured in these matches how crazy thin the margins are.

Speaker 2

But one thing for me I'd say the hardest is just with everything going on traveling, you got a new, new venue all the time, all the outside stuff that comes along with playing, pro tennis organization and living out of your suitcase, new hotel, all this stuff it's very hard to play your best every single, every match, and when you're playing in these top events you're playing the best players in the world.

Small Margins at the Top Level

Speaker 2

First round, second round, third round, like there is no. With the margins being so slim, there is no time for you to have a bad day because you're going to lose, because everybody's so good. So the biggest challenge for me is just being able to play my best every single match and finding a way to win. And if I'm not playing my best, it's very difficult, because everyone's so good and feel like sometimes tennis, like all the outside stuff, can add some more pressure or, you know, affect your practice, days leading into it, or your timing might be off or whatever. It is just from so many little things it's it's so it's just very difficult playing your best every single match. Being away from home and all that stuff adds up into affecting your ability. So that's probably what surprised me the most.

Speaker 1

Is there any advice? If you could go back a year, year and a half advice you would give yourself before you started to play on the Pro Tour that you feel like would have helped at the time before you started to play on the pro tour that you feel like would have helped at the time.

Speaker 2

Yeah, there's probably a lot of things I would like to tell myself a year ago today, going into my first year on tour, but, to be fair, also, I'm still so inexperienced and have so much to learn. But, just like, staying organized would be the biggest thing, because there's so many new things that you have to uh control and you're, you're, you're you have to do it yourself. Before in college, everybody, uh coaching staff and sports staff would do everything for you. It's really easy. So, staying organized and learning the ins and outs of like scheduling and, um, it's just this, I don't know uh, being able to handle all the new experiences in new countries, like, just prepare yourself and be open-minded for all that and it's not going to be as easy as I thought it was going to be. Uh, it's going to be tough, but just trust the process and and keep looking at the bigger picture. When you when you may be down now lost first round, not playing, playing well, whatever, it is, just a bunch of little things like that would really go a long way.

Speaker 1

JJ. What about you? What advice would you give yourself like 12 to 18 months ago?

Speaker 3

Yeah, I'd probably say you know he covered a lot of great things. The one thing for myself I'd say is kind of, uh, implementing and starting to learn and study the game sooner, which I still don't do as well like um, you know, watching more film on opponents and stuff like that, um, as well as within myself as well like um. You know, practice we couldn't really structure a practice for a while because it was four or five years of tie and crow, having planned out to the t and you know, sure, we run through these drills every day, but it just some of it doesn't translate, some of it we forget. We surely can't feed as well as them. So so, you know, only recently we started to, you know, have a solidified warmup and have drills that we do every day. Or, if one thing's lacking, we have something to lean on there for what we want to do. So I would say paying attention and learning from older players and implementing a more structured practice earlier can benefit in the long run you don't have to go into too much detail.

Speaker 1

but what does that structure look like Like? What does a practice look like for you today? Let's say you're prepping for a match like tomorrow or in two days, before a tournament. What does that look like today versus what it looked like, say, six, 12 months ago?

Speaker 3

Yeah, I mean today. Ideally, if we played tomorrow, I'd say we're going two hours straight. Maybe the first hour we'll do some short court stuff, a lot of quick hands things, for 15, 20 minutes, then kind of go through a match warm-up. You're hitting, cross court down the line a little bit. We've started to hit a little bit in the alley, but that's tough because we're not. We're not great at that yet, but, um, you know, make sure the volleys and serves are warmed up. A lot of returns, grab the basket and fire some balls at each other, make sure our hands are ready to go. And you know, maybe that's 45 minutes in now and if we want something specific before we go into a set, maybe we'll work on that. Otherwise, just, you know it's all about hitting as many balls as you can. It's about having precise things you need to work on and that'll benefit you in that tournament. So usually we'll do that for the first hour and then that second hour.

Advice to Their Younger Selves

Speaker 3

Grab another team, you know, play a set, play 12 games and then a couple, couple tiebreakers and try and focus on set, two or three things to focus on for that set for each of us, and really try and execute that and not focus on the result. And then at the start of last year I'd say it was just a lot of stuff we worked on coming out of college. We would go cross court for an extra five minutes, we'd hit through the middle for an extra five minutes. We'd maybe even play singles points sometimes and like it was more fitness based and like you know how tired and how hard can we work and you know one person's in this corner, the other one's going one cross, one line run until you're gassed out and like that was great and that's obviously helped us because we're, I feel like we're in good shape. But you know, picking up on these little important movements and centralizing the practice has really helped us recently um, jj, what is uh robert's best quality as a doubles partner?

Speaker 3

well, his volleys are obviously good, but I'd say in terms of doubles, overall, I'd say his ability to you know, teach on the go and tell you when you're wrong. You know, for example, if you know I'm adamant about something I'm doing and I'm like I think this is what I should have done, no problem telling me you're wrong. You did this on this volley. You're not going forward today and that helps me a lot in the matches because it takes a little bit of the thinking of it for itself and it gives me something to lean on and I don't have to be so focused on myself and I can focus on more of the match because I know if I'm not moving my feet or I'm not being as aggressive that day he's going to tell me right away.

Speaker 1

Robert, how are you able to deliver that information in like a constructive way? Is that just because you'll have such a close relationship at this point and you've built that trust over time? Or are you careful with kind of your language and how you deliver that sort of feedback or criticism, whatever you want to call it?

Speaker 2

Yeah, well, I definitely have to credit JJ, because I definitely don't deliver it the best. A lot of the time I guess I've looked at what I, when I do it, I don't realize it. And then after the match, or like after say something, I realized like, oh, it was probably a little bit of a like a jerk there, or it definitely came off as rude, but um, just, I think he knows that it's coming from a good place, like I'm not trying to be a jerk, like I just want to win, and he knows, like he might not hear it, but I'm definitely just as hard, if not harder, on myself when I make some mistakes. So I definitely, uh, probably a little too stern at times, but I think it's good because, like I don't know, that's just the type of person I'm. I am on, uh, in the match, like I'm super focused and I realize, like we said, the margins are so slim, so I I hate giving away free points or making errors that are, that are focused, dependent, and it's and it's our fault.

Speaker 2

I want them to beat us. I don't ever want to beat ourselves. I just watch a lot of tennis and I feel like I have a pretty good understanding of doubles. So I see a lot of things on the court. It's harder for me to see myself, but it's easy for me to see JJ during it, from an outsider's perspective, I guess, on the court still outsider perspective, it's not like a coach watching from afar, but I can see all these little tendencies. I we hit with each other every day. So I know all these tendencies. So I know when he's reverting back to some old way or something like a counterintuitive of what we're trying to work on in practice, cause, um no, I just want the best for both of us and, uh, I definitely when I'm, when I'm in that competitive state, probably a little too certain, but I think he understands yeah, um, that's.

Speaker 1

that's such a good example of, like team chemistry and doubles right Like. If maybe you had a different partner who was a bit more I don't know sensitive or something and couldn't handle that sort of feedback. Or if you played with someone new that you didn't know as well, right Like, then it could deteriorate that trust and chemistry and you wouldn't be as good as a team.

Speaker 2

So, that's.

Speaker 1

I really, really love that example. So, Robert, same question for you what is JJ's best quality as a doubles partner?

Speaker 2

This might sound, yeah, it might sound a little dumb, but it's something we like to say in college. It's just winners win. And I think JJ is unbelievable at finding a way, finding a way to win. Like, he's so competitive and wants to win so bad.

Best Partner Qualities and Team Dynamic

Speaker 2

And it might not be the prettiest thing at times, there might not be the smartest thing at times, but he finds a way to exploit some, some players weakness, or find the open court or come up with a shot in the big moments. He's, he's a gamer. So, uh like, on those deuce points sometimes, you know, I, I, I have confidence myself, but I know that this guy's going to come up with the goods every single time on a good point, on a big point. So I, I like, I like to think that he just wants to win so bad. He finds a way to win and he's always in it, no matter what. You can't ever count them out of a point, of a match, of a game. He's so quick and he's so scrappy and there's so many things that go into it, but I just, I just think he's a gamer, so that's probably one of his best attributes, for sure.

Speaker 1

Awesome. Do you have like 10 more minutes? I've got several other questions here. Yeah, do I have like 10 more minutes? I've got several other questions here. Yeah, no problem, that's fine. Any advice for playing well in tiebreakers? You all have played, I think, four in the last two weeks when you've come home with the title. So any advice for playing well in tiebreakers, either during the point or in between points. Is there anything you like to do a little bit differently than the rest of the match?

Speaker 3

Yeah, I'll take it. No, I'm just trying to eliminate all dumb mistakes and just kind of go back to bread and butter. Like he said before, we want to lose, especially those tiebreakers, because they're beating us. You know we're returning to the right spot. They're coming up with an unbelievable volley. We don't want to be going for some crazy angle and then missing that shot and said, oh well, if I would have just been high percentage, they're tight as a rock too. They don't want to hit that volley, you know. So kind of just not beating ourselves and reverting to you know, our notes and what we've worked on and what works against a certain team, we we would run, maybe, you know yeah, I think bread and butter is a good way to describe it and in between points, not getting too down on ourselves and, you know, making sure that every point we play on that tiebreaker we leave nothing on the table.

Speaker 2

Robert. Yeah, to add to that, definitely the biggest thing we don't want to beat ourselves and I mean we obviously want to come up with the goods, but we're playing high percentage stuff all the time. But I think something recently, like just knowing you're never out of it is huge, like you can go down a mini break or you know whatever it is, and it's okay because you're only playing to seven momentum or seven or ten, whatever, and momentum can change on a dime and um, like the margins are so slim they can win three points in a row. Why can't we so just staying with it even if we're down, just sticking to those, those the game plan, high percentage shots and and um, you never know, someone can get tight gag, an easy shot or something like that and you're right back in it. So just always staying together as a team, having good energy and having a good attitude are those are the three things we focus on uh, a couple questions.

Speaker 1

Well, one here from twitter, um tennis pig asks uh, you won several challengers this year. Now your first atp event. Uh, what's the difference between that challenger level and the atp level? Is it talent, strategy and tactics, mental, something else, a combination of all of those? What do you? How do you answer that question?

Speaker 2

I mean, it really depends. But, uh, cause, some of the challengers are unbelievably stacked uh, and some of them are a bit weaker at times, but, like, like we've said so many times so far in this interview, it's like the margins are so razor thin and you're going to have to bring your best every single time because if you don't, you're going to get uh, you're going to get beat. There's no way around it. Um, I just think uh, like towards the top at the atp level, the teams are so polished and there's not really uh holes in their game. Uh, they're very smart tennis players. They, they have a strategy, they're they're able to adapt probably a bit better things not going well that day and they have multiple ways of winning and, uh, I think that's something that's probably I've noticed uh along the way it's how polished they never beat themselves and, yeah, just willing adapt, and they're so strategically sound.

Speaker 1

Yeah, I like that word polished. That's really well said JJ.

Speaker 3

Yeah, I mean I think he covered what I was going to say. I mean just piggybacking off of teams being polished. I mean, you know, maybe we play a team in a first round of the Challenger and you know we go down a mini break in like a tiebreaker and we're, you know, the mindset's a little fresher. We're like, you know, okay, they can make a small mistake because they don't play together as often. Or you know we can come up with a shot here, like and you know we still have a chance here.

Speaker 3

But you know, when you're playing the top teams in the world like we played Cash and Glasspool in Miami and we had a tough 7-6 first set and we were in that breaker and I think one of us made a little tiny mistake positioning-wise in the breaker and that was one mini break and it was gone. And you know they're not going to mess up their spots. They're serving high percentage, they move like a unit. And then same thing with the second set. I think we lost 6-0 or 6-1. And we were in every service game. But maybe it was one point where you know you don't get that extra inch wide on that first volley or you're positioned one centimeter off and they're finding those open gaps and those small mistakes. They punish you so much more at the higher level.

Speaker 1

A couple of questions from Instagram. This one's from Pepino Bambino. Why the switch from the Pure Strike to the Pure Aero 98? I think this was for you, JJ.

Speaker 3

Yeah, I think they stopped making my racket and it was harder to get, so I was looking to switch out of it. Saw a couple people using the Arrow that I thought I had similar game styles to, so I tried it out, tweaked the string a little bit, tweaked the racket weight a little bit and, uh, it felt good. I think it. It added a lot to my serve, which I loved. Um, started serving a lot better with it. Um, yeah, but nothing specific. Just I could have stuck with the strike if I wanted to, but at the same time it's always cool to have a new racket too, so that always helps.

Speaker 1

Do you use any lead tape on your rackets? I think this was for Robert, but I guess either of you can answer it.

Tiebreaker Strategy and Tournament Levels

Speaker 2

Yeah, we both use some lead tape weighted in different areas. We have a guy back in Columbus who works with Ohio State. He helps us, chris Jay, he you know we call him the racket master because he helps us with our racket. So he knows what we like and and we give him feedback for for everything we're feeling, and he still helps us, which is unbelievable and extremely nice of him uh.

Speaker 1

Two more from Instagram. I think this is uh from a former teammate of yours. Describe in detail how much you loved playing tennis with reese yakubov. I don't know if I pronounced that last name right there he is.

Speaker 2

Uh, no, reese was probably one of the best teammates we ever had in college, a great friend of of ours. Uh, tennis was great with him, but I'd say playing golf with him is better, because we like to beat him and he gets a little sad.

Speaker 1

So that was his next question who out of your former teammates was the best at golf?

Speaker 2

I don't know. Can we say Justin Krohn Krohn yeah, krohn, he wasn't a teammate, he was a coach. I think he beat Reese last time. Someone's gonna have to verify that, but awesome, all right.

Speaker 1

Two more questions here Goals for the rest of 2025 and then also 2026 plans.

Speaker 3

Yeah, for me at least, we've kind of always talked about winning one of every single tournament which you know hopefully gets done in 2025, but if not perfect one to carry over into 2026. So I mean we've won a 7500, 125, 175, 250 now. So for me at least, the goal would be to next knock off that 500 and that thousand win and do everything we can to start building that and get our ranking to a spot where we're consistently making the cuts in these 1,000-level tournaments that are so tough to get into.

Speaker 1

Robert, any goals for you?

Speaker 2

Yeah, I mean I don't want to put any specific goals down that are so set in stone, because really we don't know where our ceiling is and we don't know what our floor is, but we just want to keep getting better and worry less about the results and more about the process and things like that. But, like he said, we want to keep improving our ranking to get into those ATP 1000 events that are so tough to get into, the ATP 500 events that are pretty tough to get into as well, depending on the time and the calendar that is. But just so we have all those opportunities to play against the best players in the world and make a name for ourselves and competing at the highest level. So, yeah, we just want to keep getting better. There's no way around it.

Speaker 1

Yeah, yeah, it's so tough on the ATP side to get into those 1,000s and it's. I mean, I feel like everybody I'd speak to outside of the top, like 40 or 50, has that same goal, like we got to get to where we're in those 1,000s, because then we can, you know it, it becomes a bit easier to stay there because you're in there and you have those those points to to attain. Um, so last question for y'all I don't think I asked you this in Dallas Um, how can we make doubles more popular?

Speaker 2

Well, I think there's, there's lots of ways, because doubles really resonates with, like, the average tennis player. Uh, you know, most tennis players play doubles, that's what they're used to and that's how they know the game. So, um, I think, if, if marketed right, I mean, um, a lot of players can, a lot of people can relate to it. It's high, high pay, uh, high intensity, fast pace, kind of like pickleball how that's growing so quick. Um, I think, just marketed in the right way, it definitely can make a jump. I was watching the um DC open uh earlier today and I saw a completely packed crowd with, uh, kyrgios and Monfils. I know they're playing, they're singles guys, but on the double score, like people are wanting to watch the doubles match. So, um, it just marketed kind of more and just more, more, more is more is better.

Speaker 1

So, yeah, just keep, keep trying to do that yeah, yeah, I feel like we can still claim curious as a doubles guy too, though, since he his only grandson title is in doubles, so yeah I don't think, I don't think singles gets to claim him. Uh, for themselves um jj. What about you? Anything to add?

Speaker 3

yeah. No, I mean I don't think there needs to be anything done in terms of format or anything. I think that could kind of taint the image of what doubles is. You know, if you go to a shorter set or you, you know, make up some funky rules. So I do think it also comes straight down to the marketing and I don't know good in what ways to implement that that doesn't hurt the singles guys as well.

Future Goals and Making Doubles Popular

Speaker 3

But you know, what I'd love to see one week is. You know, for example, take the weeks in last los cabos, last week, the doubles didn't get on center court until the last day and the doubles didn't were always before the singles. And I mean, obviously you got to give priority to the singles guys because they're the guys that are selling most of the tickets. But just one week I'd like to see you know how much the crowd were to be there If you maybe take a semi-final match and you play the singles first and then you throw a doubles and then you throw singles and you end with the doubles, and you know you're sandwiching these quote-unquote, more marketable, bigger matches and you throw the doubles in between them. That would draw more fans and, you know, give doubles the primetime spot for one tournament. I just want to see what would happen.

Speaker 1

Yeah, yeah, I think it's one of those momentum things too, and you know, dc had doubles on the stadium today with, I think, venus was playing, and yeah, it's one of those things that there has to. It's a combination of all of it, right. But I definitely agree with you if we can get more doubles on those main stadiums, and some of the people who are buying tickets might be buying tickets for the singles, but maybe they see some of the doubles like before after and they become doubles fans, you know that exposure.

Speaker 1

That exposure is huge, for sure.

Speaker 3

I think another way that could be great, just based off last week, was we were even looking. All of our friends, family fans were looking where to find our doubles matches from last week. They weren't on tennis TV. I think people had to go on DraftKings and watch on a little three-inch screen to be able to watch our matches up until the finals. So I mean some more streaming with you know. I don't know what media outlet would do it, but you know whoever's streaming the singles, just get the doubles at the two fifties and the five hundreds as well.

Speaker 1

Yeah, I think the ATP two fifties is the one that is really hard to find. Yeah, I think five hundreds a little easier, but I'm not positive. I always forget until I try to start watching and then I realize it's not on TV.

Speaker 3

Yeah, I mean our friends always tell us they're like we love the challengers because it's so easy to find you guys and see how to watch you guys. But you know you guys are playing in the bigger events and it gets almost tougher to watch.

Speaker 1

Yeah, it's kind of backwards there. Awesome guys. Well, this was a lot of fun. I'm sure we'll do it again at some point. Uh, good luck the rest of the season and, um, yeah, hopefully I'll see y'all. Uh, definitely in New York, if not, maybe Cincinnati.

Speaker 2

Awesome. Thank you so much for having us.

Speaker 1

Thanks guys.