Doubles Only Tennis Podcast

David Collins Interview: Volley Drills, 3 Fears at the Net, & Developing Doubles Players

• Will Boucek • Episode 277

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David Collins is the coach of Grand Slam-winning ATP doubles players John Peers and Michael Venus. I spoke with him at Indian Wells to get practical advice about doubles training, from tour-level first-volley reps to simple technique fixes that instantly change your net game. We also dig into why club players fear the net, how to build a better doubles player over a year, and what pro doubles needs to grow. 

  • How John Peers preps the day before a match with scouting, serve-plus-one priorities, and specific volley patterns
  • Michael Venus’s injury update, return plan, and what a long rehab block demands
  • The catch-to-volley drill that keeps the hand in front and stops the shoulder turn that causes late contact
  • A high-speed server's partner drill that trains angle volleys, poaches, split-step timing, and lob awareness
  • A simple development plan for club doubles players that sharpens strengths while raising weak areas
  • The three net fears and concrete fixes for passing lanes, lobs, overheads, and getting jammed
  • Why pro doubles struggles for visibility, and what better streaming and promotion could change
  • How to pair partners at the club level by matching comfort zones and contrasting skills

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Meet Coach David Collins

Match Prep And Scouting Patterns

SPEAKER_00

You're about to hear another conversation with a coach from Indian Wells, this time David Collins. He coaches John Pierce and Michael Venus. Before I get to this podcast episode, though, a couple of quick announcements. A lot of you have been reaching out wanting to attend some of the Devil's camps. I've got two coming up in April. So number one is in the Dallas Fort Worth area. It is going to be April 11th and 12th. It's only about a 30-minute drive from the DFW airport. So it's easy to fly in and out of. Regardless of where you live, you probably have a direct flight to DFW. And then I've got some hotel recommendations on the page, which I'll link to in the show notes. So you can click on that to learn more and get signed up. Right now, I believe last I checked, I had eight spots available in that. So I do expect it to fill up. The deadline is going to be coming up in the next uh week and a half or two weeks, depending on when I release this podcast episode. And then another camp will be the following weekend in Miami. So if you live in the Miami area or want to fly in for that, we're going to have an afternoon and a morning session. The morning session is currently sold out. There is a wait list for that if you want to sign up for it. The afternoon session does have some spots still available, but I expect it to fill up very soon. So again, I'll link to that in the show notes as well so that you can learn more about that and get signed up. So let's dive into this episode today. Coach David Collins coaches John Pierce, who won the Australian Open Mixed Doubles title this year and last year to back-to-back champion. He also won the Olympic gold medal with Matt Ebden back in 2024. David also coaches Michael Venus, who is a rolling Garrett champion in men's doubles. And then he coaches two rising players, Emily Appleton on the WTA side, and then Max Basing on the men's side. In this conversation, we chatted uh at the site uh in uh Indian Wells, so at the uh tennis garden there, and we talked about uh volley drills. He shared how to execute two different volley drills, one of which he actually performed with me in front of our group and sort of embarrassed me because my volley technique wasn't up to uh the ATP standard that he is used to. Uh we also discussed his story, how he got started in tennis, how he got into coaching. Then I asked him about the three fears that he says uh most club level players have at the net. So he described each of these three fears, and you probably have at least one of these. And then he talked about how to overcome each of the fears that players have at the net. After that, we talked about how to develop a club doubles player. Uh, he actually manages a club back in the UK, so he has a lot of experience working with doubles players at obviously every level of the game, but uh club levels specifically is what we kind of dive into. And then at the end, we talk about how to make doubles more popular. So this is a really fun conversation. David does a really good job of explaining the drills in a way that you'll be able to kind of walk away and go and execute them uh on the court with your doubles partner or with your coach back at home. So I think you're gonna get a lot out of this and really enjoy this conversation. So without further delay, uh enjoy this conversation with Coach David Collins. Hey everybody, I'm here back at Indian Wells, this time with Coach David Collins. Coach, welcome.

SPEAKER_01

Nice to see you.

SPEAKER_00

Thanks for coming on. Um, so you coach uh John Pierce here and then Michael Venus as well. Um what did you do today in practice?

SPEAKER_01

So today um we had solo practice. So it was just John, we had uh practice partner, we had Marcelo Mello because uh we played points all this week, and because it's the day before the match, we just did uh a practice session, extended warm-up, some specific things that needed to be worked on ahead of the match tomorrow, um, where he'll play with Alex Diemenar.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. So you're doing, I imagine, specific drills and patterns that you think you need against this team tomorrow because you've scouted them. Is that right?

SPEAKER_01

So yeah, we've scouted the team. So some of it was to do with playing our strengths to their weaknesses and also just making sure that we're doing the best that we can do with our with our job. So the making sure the surf first surf percentage is high, making sure we're making a lot of returns, and then some specific volley patterns. Um but uh yeah, it's it's more like an extended warm-up, but with specific things added on um throughout the session.

Michael Venus Recovery And Return

SPEAKER_00

Okay. And then uh what's the status on Michael Venus? I know he's been out for a little bit. Can you share?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, so Michael had surgery in October um after it getting injured at the US Open. Um, so he hasn't played tournament. He's been off, so he'll use a protective ranking and he'll come back in Miami next week um and play with Yuki Banbury. And he's yeah, he he's done great. Really, really pleased with the work that he's put in and proud of the work that he's put in over the the winter period. It's been a challenging time, but he he's done really well to get to get through that and to be back on the match court in a c in 10 days' time or so. Awesome.

The Catch And Volley Technique Drill

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, it'll be great to see him back as well. Um, so we're here in Indian Wells. Uh, a few days ago, we had a group of club players, and you were nice enough to come spend some time with me and uh chat with them. And like I was saying earlier, if I'd known you were going to embarrass me with this volley drill, uh maybe we wouldn't have brought you in. But um, all jokes aside, describe the uh volley drill that we did the other day, or the I don't even know if you'd call it a drill. We did it in this living room setting in a hotel room.

SPEAKER_01

So yeah, it was um it's trying to emphasize the point that on volleys, especially the forehand volley, to keep your hand as far in front of the body as possible so that you don't turn away from the contact. So what we did, we had you standing facing me with a racket, first of all, and I fed you a ball. And the first reaction for you was to turn your right shoulder. So the racket went back away from the ball impact point that we wanted. So you went back away from the contact point, and you had to turn back to go back to the contact point. So you you wasted time in that situation, and generally you're gonna catch the ball a little bit late, and there's too much movement with the racket, especially if the ball is coming faster. So then we took your hand off the racket, and I asked you just to catch the ball in front of you with your with your right hand, with your with your fingers face facing up, not your fingers facing down. So almost in the same position as you would hit a forehand volley, and you didn't move your shoulder at all, you just kept your hand in front and you reached forward to to catch the ball. So then we put the racket back in your hand and we gave you a couple um so that you could volley with your hand in front with the racket in your hand. And then the final stage, the tough stage of that drill is I will either say volley where you have to volley the ball, or I'll or I'll say catch where you have to catch the ball. So you have to let go of the racket grip and push your hand forward to catch the ball. But you you finished much better than you started.

From Player To Coach In The UK

SPEAKER_00

I struggled with that at the beginning. There was a lot of pressure with everyone uh watching as well. Wasn't expecting to have to perform in front of everyone. Um, but yeah, that that was such a good drill because technique is not something I focus on a whole lot, right? Like I specialize in strategy because it's what I'm more just interested in and love. Yeah, but obviously there's a place for technique, there's no doubt about it. So I love little drills like that to learn, and and now I can go home and kind of take that to some of my own players. Um, so I thought that was really cool and wanted to share that. Uh tell us your story. How did you get started in tennis to kind of where you are now?

SPEAKER_01

So I I played a little bit um as a pro, um, wasn't good enough or didn't play for long enough to be able to get to where you need to be to make a living out of the sport. So then I turned to coaching um, first of all, at a recreational level. Um, and then as time has gone by, I I've combined the two with with pro players um as well as the club players at the club I teach at in the UK, which is called St. George's Hill Lawn Tennis Club, big club. Um, we've got 34 courts. Um, we've got a good program there, both adults and juniors. Um, and I work with four pro players there as well as looking after the coaching team that we've got and managing the coaching program. Um, so the two you mentioned already, John Piers and Mike Venus, and then the other two is uh Emily Appleton, who's around 350 in singles and around 75 or 80 in doubles, and Max Basing, who's primarily playing singles. He graduated from Stanford in the summer and he's now close to close to 300. So have those four players, which which is good. There's a real contrast with all of the the work that I do at the club um with the pro players and also the club members as well. The club members also we get to join in sometimes with the pros, which which they really like. Um, and then again the contrast of having both male and female players and also singles and doubles. So it's across the board, it's quite a broad across the board, it's quite a broad spectrum of of coaching skill with those different players.

Training The Servers Partner First Volley

SPEAKER_00

So I want to move to to practice. Um on Instagram, I have this video that I I post it every six months or so. Uh, and it's you feeding to John on the practice courts here at Indian Wells from a couple of years ago. And John is in the middle of the service box, probably a little closer to the net, and you are feeding from the baseline, and you just rip balls at him. Yeah, and then you shift over a little bit, and then you hit a few more balls, and then you shift it over again, and then you hit a few more balls. So describe the purpose of that drill uh and kind of how it applies to the match cord as well.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, so that yeah, I remember that drill, and I've seen it a few times on your page, and it's good. There's some good comments that come that come underneath it. But that drill primarily is for John or the server's partner. It was John in this case, um being in the service partner position. So with the serve coming from different areas, so either the serve would be wide, so I'd be feeding from outside the alley or close to the outside tram line, or I'd be feeding from the middle of the baseline to replicate a body serve, or I'd feed close to the center mark on the baseline to replicate a serve that's gone down the T. And then John will be covering a specific area. He'll either be covering his side of the court or he'll be making a poach. So in the feed will be determined by the pattern that we've that we've arranged. I'm not just randomly hitting balls and hoping he he's gonna get it because at the speed that the ball's being fed, we could just put the ball past him in a whole double score because it's just him. So it's it's sort of within his range, uh, maybe at the ex to the extent of his range, or right at the right at the end of it on some of the balls. And we also will throw in a lob so he doesn't just get comfortable sitting on top of the net, knocking balls off. But again, it goes back to the the drill that we did with with you and I in the in the lounge of the of the room, keeping his hands in front when the ball is especially coming very fast. Because if as soon as you take the racket away from the impact, you're gonna be in trouble.

SPEAKER_00

So when you're doing that drill, and and this is well, one of my favorite drills um to do with with club players too, because they never work on these angle volleys, right? All the time when they're working on volleys, they're practicing hitting back to their doubles partner. So then they get out to the match court and they poach or make the right move, and then they volley back to the baseline player. Um but when you're doing this, how do you think about the reset for John? I'm always some of the time I feel like I'm not that worried about the movement pattern, but other times I want them to get the movement pattern and the volley. Um, how do you kind of balance that?

SPEAKER_01

So we'll time um each feed will be timed with his split step. So there's two ways we can feed it. Either it'll be just a drop feed, so he'll move forward, split step, and then I'll feed, or he'll wait for me to bounce the ball, then he'll split step, and then I'll feed up to replicate so two different timings because he's got to get used to different timings on the from the returner. If the returner is taking the ball earlier, obviously he's gonna have less time to move at the net. If the returner is standing further back, like some of the singles guys do, he's gonna have more time to make his move and he can't move too early because it then they'll they'll look to to beat him down the line, maybe with the ball. Um, but yeah, it's a good exercise. We we will do it, we'll do that every single session, that that drill, just to try to make sure that there's enough numbers, enough volume on the server's partner so that when they get on the match match court, they're really sharp. Every ball that's come to them, they're either getting the ball off the court, or if they don't get it off the court, they're finding the back end of the player at the baseline.

Building A Better Club Doubles Player

SPEAKER_00

Got it. Um, yeah, I call that the most important volley in tennis. That's one of the I think I have like an Instagram kind of slide thing where I call it that. Um, because it is really like it's it's so important to have that first volley after the return. Um so I want to move on to a question I asked you the other day, and feel free to give the exact same answer. Unfortunately, we weren't recording it. But if I gave you a player, a club player today and said we have to make them as good as possible over the next 12 or 24 months, where would you start?

SPEAKER_01

So the first thing we do, we would have a look at them play to see um, you know, how they play doubles. What game style do they have? Do they stay at the baseline? Do they stay at the baseline and lob? Do they like to return them volley? Do they like to serve them volley? You know, where do they sit in the sort of spectrum of the game? Um, and then once we've got an idea of of where they play and where they're most comfortable, then we will look at how we can improve the areas that they're already good and then make the weaker areas slightly less of a weakness. So we get like a slightly higher base level, and then the good things we'll try to make a little bit better.

SPEAKER_00

So how do you think about each of those? So the there's the weaknesses. So like I don't like hitting backhands from the back of the court. Um, luckily in doubles, I can mostly run around my backhand, especially uh at my level, they're not hitting it quite as hard as these guys out here. Um so uh how do you decide if we're gonna focus more on you know sharpening your strengths or kind of masking your weaknesses?

SPEAKER_01

So I think there has to be um as much work done on both. A lot of the time, some some coaches certainly at club level will focus just on things that the club player or recreational player are not very good at. So, and then if you're not working on the strengths as well as the weaknesses, the strengths stop being so much of a strength. You've got you've got to continue to sharpen the sword, I guess, is quite a good analogy. Because if you leave it alone, it's gonna get blunt, and then when you need to use the sword, it's it's not gonna work for you.

Three Net Fears And How To Beat

SPEAKER_00

Right. That makes a lot of sense. Um so let's go through some of the net play stuff we talked about the other day. You said there were uh three fears, and I I feel like I've heard this from Louis and a lot of the kind of British coaches. So three fears at the net. So can you go over those?

SPEAKER_01

Uh yeah, so the th the three main fears for recreational players, club members, um, would be firstly getting passed down the line. They they feel like they're letting their partner down if they if they get passed down the line, but they don't feel like they're letting their partner down if they get beaten cross-court with the bull because they've got their partner behind them as a backup. But we try to get them as upset with the ball beating them cross-court as they are with the ball beating them down the line. That's one of them. The other one is getting lobbed, because generally the recreational players don't have a great overhead. So we do a lot of work with trying to get the the members hitting a lot of smashes in each session because in recreational play, the lob is a key, a key part. And the final one is getting hit with the ball, with the ball being hit hard straight at them. It doesn't happen a great deal because at recreational level, the ground stroke speed isn't particularly high. So the reaction speed will be relative to the ground stroke speed. It's not like you've got somebody like Mike Venus hitting four hands against a club member. That that's not going to be a great matchup for people up there. But that they would be the the three biggest areas, and I think that's quite common. A lot of the the British players I'm sure that you've spoken to in the past will have gone over those things as well with you.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, for sure. I love um I love hearing it from different people though, because each time I hear something new. And the thing I think I take away from you describing it is being uh just as frustrated getting passed through the middle as down the line. I don't think I've heard it put like that before. And I really like that a lot. Um I think that's one thing the listeners can kind of take away.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, they don't worry so much about it because the partner is standing behind them and they can get the ball. If they get passed down the line, the partner, assuming they haven't moved or signaled or or or planned a poach where the the player at the baseline has moved behind them to get the ball, it's gonna beat them down the line. But if we try to get them to sort of cover their territory, I like to put you know cones down or lines down on the court and tell them now you're you're a football or soccer goalkeeper. So if you can defend your goal and make sure no balls go through your goal, then then you're doing a great job up at the net. And then that we just have to agree on the territory that they have to cover because it will be different for some players to other players based on the physical aspect of the player. If they're young and athletic and they could they can move pretty well, then the space that they're covering can be a little wider. If they're you know an older club member, their space is going to be smaller, but there'll still be consistent guidelines between the way the pros cover the court and the way the members cover the court. It just might be a slightly smaller area for the clubs.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, that's one of the things I feel like a lot of club players maybe don't understand. And even maybe even pros is is that the game and the strategy and the tactics are all very similar. It's just happening so much faster out here. Um I do think the lob is more effective, probably, at the club level, because you like you said, they're a little bit slower to get back, the overheads aren't quite as good, and the lob that Mike Venus hits is the same speed as the lob that a club player hits, right? You can't hit a faster lob. Um so it's uh I think that's the one area that's kind of a a difference.

SPEAKER_01

There's a few basically because the service partners are so close now, so that you're you're trying to get as close as possible so that you can get the volley. It's much easier to get the volley off the court if you're closer to the net. But that does leave you susceptible to a ball that goes up and back behind you. So you've got to make sure you're doing the the work physically so that you are able to get back with, you know, two, three steps max to get to the service line. If you can get to the service line before the ball gets to the service line, you've got a pretty good chance of making the overhead. But if the ball beats you to the to the service line, you're gonna be chasing the ball. And once you start chasing a lobby, you're not in a great position. Right.

Making Pro Doubles More Popular

SPEAKER_00

Um, so I want to shift to uh one final kind of topic here, and that is making pro doubles more popular. What have you seen change since your time on tour? And then what would you like to see going forward to help get more eyeballs on pro doubles? That's a great question.

SPEAKER_01

Um for me, I think that you know the the doubles guys work just as hard as the singles guys. They do spend just as much court time, but the rewards are nowhere near as big because the publicity around what they're doing is nowhere near as big as the publicity for the singles guys. So if you look at viewing figures for a singles match with some of the top guys playing, if you look at a doubles match with the top guys playing, it's not even not being not even comparable. And a lot of the time the doubles guys are stuck out on outside courts with not, you know, it's not well publicized. So if it's not well publicized, people are not gonna come and come and watch. So it's it's like almost a chicken and egg situation. You're not gonna the product's not gonna grow unless you invest in the publicity of the product. Um there's there's especially at this tournament, a lot more singles guys will play. Um but the the main for me the main thing is that the publicity around it, because the doubles guys, you know, they're they're fantastic players. All of the the top guys, you know, they their skill set is unbelievable. It's very different to the to the singles players. Um but the majority of the world tennis at club level play doubles, not singles. So it's strange that the there could be a much better job done of marketing it, promoting it, making the players more visible, giving them more time on show courts, on bigger courts, then the the kickback from that is people know who they are. are the publicity's greater. So I think that that could be one of the the big things is is the publicity side of it.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah it could have kind of a snowball effect but somebody has to get that ball rolling a little bit.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah there has to be a desire to for it for it to happen and at the moment I don't think there is a desire from yeah from the the tour to to to make it grow as much as possible.

SPEAKER_00

Right. Um what uh where would you start and also would you make any rule changes to doubles a lot of people say that they would like the server's partner to start behind the service line or switch to only one serve would you make any rule changes?

SPEAKER_01

I think I I don't think so the yeah I don't rule wise I don't think it's an interesting one having almost I think is it I'm not familiar with pickleball but I believe the service partner can't touch the ball is that right in pickleball? There's a similar rule in pickleball so I don't because how many doubles points end with the serve and server's partner yeah cleaning up at the net how many times do you get an extended rally and when there is an extended rally the crowd of what crowd there are depending on which court they're on go crazy because they love to see an extended rally with you know quick hands there's volley to volley you know quick reactions you know the the crowd really enjoy that so if you could extend the rallies by maybe either having as you said the service partner slightly further back um could you do it with one serve only so that the returner has more advantage it's easier for the returner to get the ball past the service partner so then the rally starts to extend so I guess they're two ideas um but I I I don't think well I don't think it will change yeah but I think the players also adapt when they they they adapt to situations if the serve someone's serving super fast players get better at returning if players are great at returning the service partner has to get better at taking up good spots up at the net and cleaning up right um so whatever changes there's always an answer to the question that that's been asked yeah and it and that's how it continues to evolve I guess.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah I think like without um I mean without the marketing these rule changes won't matter anyways. Yeah right like if if nobody's able to find it on TV or nobody's watching on on the court then it doesn't matter how exciting it gets if there's no eyeballs on it.

SPEAKER_01

Right because for example on a you know at Masters every doubles is is televised or streamed on streamed yeah um at 500 it's streamed or televised but at 250 it is not that at that level of the game they don't the only place you can find it are on gambling websites where the where they stream the match. So there is a camera on the court you know often the guys are playing because the singles guys have played on that court and it's been televised so there is a camera but the the tour for some reason doesn't want to publicize the doubles at 250 level um when I've asked them about it they the answer was because the product the production of the product not the product that they've got on the court that the production would not be a suitable standard for them to just stream it because it would just be a fixed camera.

SPEAKER_00

That seems like a load of crap to me. It's a strange that was the answer I got so well I so I watch a lot of these matches from home because I can't come to all these tournaments and especially Australia some of the outside courts but like often the quality of the video it's like you're looking through a fish bowl and the camera's way above the court yeah and they stream those. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

So like if that and and it is being streamed to a a gambling website so just click press press the button to click the stream on.

Pairing Styles For Stronger Teams

SPEAKER_00

I don't know how difficult or easy that is but the quality at some of the at the Australian Open is what I'm thinking of because it's the most recent major like the quality of those is really poor and they stream that. So like why is the quality the quality is not any worse at some of these other channels that that seems like they just don't want to deal with it. Yeah it's just strange. That's that's frustrating. Okay so last question for you um uh this popped into my mind something we talked about the other day I think it was a question from one of the club players they said you know we we play a lot of leagues uh here in the States and um a lot of times a captain is trying to figure out who to pair together. Yeah and you talked about um some of John's strengths and weaknesses and who's an ideal partner for him as an example can you share how you think about pairing together different double styles to make a great team at a club level?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah at a club level so yeah at club club level um I think the most important thing is firstly players have to play where they're comfortable. If they're not happy being up at the net and they don't volley very well then stay at the baseline. There's no one to say you there's no you have to play at the net or you have to play at the baseline or you must always come to the net as a team together. If you're not great at volleying or you're frightened of getting hit or you're worried about getting lobbed or passed down the line then play with play to your strengths. So play where you are most comfortable firstly. But secondly um it's in a club environment I think it's great to contrast skills. So if you've got one player that loves to be aggressive and loves to come to the net and to intercept a lot and compare them with a player who's very consistent from the baseline. So the person at the baseline can do all the work and the person at the net can take all of the credit rather than have maybe two two net rushers or two players that like to both stay at the baseline. I think the contrast of one and the other is great. And I think on the tour also you know it's great to have that contrast um yeah with a team.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah I feel like you see that on the tour too like you'll see teams make a deep run in a tournament who both have similar styles and like against certain teams it works really well and then they run into a team that it it doesn't work well like if both players are you know we only have one mode and all we do is get to the net. Eventually you'll find a team that's good at lobbying or really good for defending two back or something like that. Right?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I agree yeah.

Final Thoughts And Sign Off

SPEAKER_00

Awesome. All right well this was a ton of fun David um thanks for coming on. Hopefully we can do it again and best of luck this week with John. Thank you so much.