How to Stay Present and Confident During Sex with Stephanie Ganowski

In this engaging conversation, Melissa D and Stephanie Ganowski explore the intricacies of men's sexual health and relationships. Stephanie shares her journey from a challenging relationship to becoming a coach for men, emphasizing the importance of understanding and communication. They discuss common issues men face, the role of vulnerability, and the impact of pornography. The conversation also touches on the benefits of masturbation, the dynamics of open relationships, and practical advice for men seeking to improve their sexual experiences.

Takeaways

• Understanding men requires empathy and curiosity.
• Communication is key to resolving relationship issues.
• Masturbation can enhance sexual health and awareness.
• Vulnerability fosters deeper connections in relationships.
• Many men struggle with performance anxiety and communication.
• Sexual experiences should focus on pleasure, not just performance.
• Exploring open relationships can enhance intimacy.
• Pornography can negatively impact real-life sexual experiences.
• Regular check-ins can improve relationship dynamics.
• Humor and lightness can ease sexual tension.

Chapters

• 00:00 Introduction and Background
• 03:58 Journey to Understanding Men
• 06:49 The Shift to Sexual Coaching
• 09:35 Common Issues Men Face
• 12:19 Communication Challenges in Relationships
• 15:14 Frameworks for Healthy Conversations
• 18:06 Addressing Erection Issues
• 20:54 Masturbation and Sexual Health
• 23:47 The Role of Pornography
• 26:35 Controversies in Sexual Practices
• 26:54 The Impact of NoFap on Sexual Health
• 28:59 Exploring Personal Sexual Journeys
• 30:14 Adventures in Swinging: A New Experience
• 35:45 Navigating Open Relationships
• 41:50 Tools for Men: Building Confidence in Sexuality

Keywords

sexual health, men's coaching, relationships, communication, vulnerability, masturbation, pornography, open relationships, sexual psychology, coaching men

Where to find Stephanie Ganowski:

Website

Instagram

YouTube

Podcast — What I Love About Sex

App — Ronan (Sex Meditations for Men)

Transcript

Stephanie (00:00)
men limit themselves especially by obsessing and putting so much pressure on erection when they should come and making sure that she comes, but like not even understanding if she's feeling pleasure, just like wanting her to reach an orgasm so bad so they could prove something to themselves, right? Yeah. And it's more about proving to himself than it is about actually feeling good with her and like enjoying

Melissa D (00:13)
Right, like that, yeah.

Melissa D (00:31)
Welcome to the Body Joy After Office Hours podcast, where I talk with Stephanie Ganowski, who is a sexologist and sex coach for men.

She helps men have more hotter sex

by teaching them how to let go of performance pressure. Stephanie and I met last year in a Leadership Academy program, and it's been super fun to see how our businesses and approaches overlap, and they're also super different. We talk about porn use and as it pertains to men's sexual life. We also did a little deep dive on each of our experiences in the play party scene. I hope you all enjoy.

Melissa D (01:09)
Stephanie Ganowski, thank you so much for being here.

Stephanie (01:13)
Yeah, thanks for having me, Melissa. I'm excited to talk to you.

Melissa D (01:15)
You know,

yay, I love inviting friends and people onto this podcast to kind of geek out about what we're passionate about, what we're really good at, and our different ways of supporting people. you, similar to my work, you support men specifically being better in bed. You just launched a app, which is really exciting. And I want to go back to how we met.

Stephanie (01:43)
Yes, yes, definitely tell him we met.

Melissa D (01:46)
Yeah, so generally speaking, when I go into public spaces, I'm usually the only one that works in and around sex, generally speaking. And so you and I met last January. We were in a leadership academy. And I remember just hearing some of the exercises that we're doing. And I was like, wait a minute. She does similar stuff as I do. This is exciting. And it took us a little bit to kind of, you know.

get together and chat and get to know each other, but that really intrigued me. And the main difference between you and I or our approaches is that, you know, we just come from totally different lenses. And I think that's just the coolest thing. And I remember watching some of your videos and going, I really like you a lot because of how like direct and just very like focused you're not like whimsical, you're just like, boom. And I'm sure...

The story that I'm making up is that men really appreciate that approach, especially when they come to you and they want to work with like an elite coach and they want to like get down to like, all right, just show me what to do and give me the steps and let's go. So.

Stephanie (02:48)
Yes,

yes, that's like the main feedback I get is like you're direct like.

Melissa D (02:52)
Yeah, I

love that. So Stephanie, but you haven't always been in this field. What were you doing, you know, 10, 15 years ago? And what was the impetus of you getting into the work that you're doing now?

Stephanie (03:05)
I was working five jobs at one time when I was 24. And I knew I wanted the freedom, so I would pick up jobs that I could control my schedule around. And I was just like a free bird that was passionate about life and wanting to find my thing. And I didn't know what my thing was until I was in this really, really just horrible relationship.

and I didn't understand it and I was living with this guy for two years and he was much older than me and he didn't show any sense of real connection to me. And here I was just like questioning like, why isn't he loving? Like, don't I deserve that? And like, he never calls me beautiful and I think I'm like really pretty and you know, I'll like say things to him and he'll be like, yeah, well, you could never do that. Like, you're not smart enough for that or...

or, know, you know, you're gonna eat that. And I was like in the best shape of my life. So there was just a lot of like confusion around the way I was being treated in this relationship. And it led me to get really angry at men, like in general, because I had I dated some guys like after this guy, and I was like, I was just like frustrated, right? So I was at this point where I was like, screw men, like, they're all dicks, like they're all pigs, they're assholes.

Melissa D (03:58)
Wow.

Wow.

Stephanie (04:25)
and I had this like really negative view of them, but it didn't last that long because I got to this place where I was, I had been reading a lot and

Melissa D (04:34)
What were some of the books that you were reading that you were drawn to at that time?

Stephanie (04:38)
Honestly, like psychology books, like just teaching me about my mindset and understanding different perspectives and what it can do for you to see things other ways and have empathy for people and compassion. And I was like, you know what? I want to understand men. The problem is I don't understand them. I didn't understand this relationship. I know it's bad. I know it was bad. But let me understand.

men a little bit more so I don't like carry this anger because it's not all guys I know all guys aren't horrible so like I don't want to hold on to this like fuck men like mentality

Melissa D (05:10)
Yeah, was there a certain like,

was there also just like a certain pattern or certain flavor of like archetype that you were kind of dating or was there a pattern in and around that timeframe?

Stephanie (05:23)
Honestly, it was all different types of guys. Like I dated a good variety and a bunch of them just, I did not like how they treated me or how the relationship went, right? So I had to like come from this place of, okay, well, I'm in the relationship too, right? There's obviously something I can learn. There's something I'm not understanding. Maybe I can learn how to communicate better. Maybe I can learn how to see things from a male point of view better so I understand why. And I jumped into this,

highly curious mindset that brought me to Men Are For Mars, Women Are For Venus, that book from the 90s that like was huge. ⁓ I was like, whoa, this is interesting. And like, I knew it was old school, but still it explained so much for me, like so many things clicked. And at the end of the book, it was like, take this program with us and you'll become a relationship coach and we could train you. And, you know, we go through this whole course, it was like a six month experience.

Melissa D (05:56)
Old school. Yeah.

Stephanie (06:19)
And so I did it. And then I was like, my God, this is so cool. And like, I'm learning so much and now I get it. Like I get why guys come from that place because they're insecure about this. And like my best reaction to this could be saying something like this or asking this question or like, and it was just so much came together for me where I just let go of all the resentment. And I got even more curious and excited to like learn about men. So I was like, okay, I'm going to decide to work with only men and I'm going to go in with the mindset of like really wanting to understand them and support them and like,

find a way to help them. And then, yeah, that's what I did. And then two years later, I was getting doing this full time, I was getting so many questions about like, okay, well, can you help me now with my erections? Or what about premature ejaculation? Like, can you help with that? And I don't know how to talk to my woman about sex. Like, can you talk, can you help me? And I was like, I don't know any, don't know this. Like, I like, what do I do? So I like found this course, this online sex course, or sex school. And it was like a 15 month.

Melissa D (07:00)
Wow. Yeah.

Stephanie (07:17)
school and I finished it in like five months because I was so into it. It was the coolest thing I've ever done in my life. It was so fun and so interesting. I was so passionate about it. My teachers were like, Stephanie, slow down. We want you to retain the info. And I was just sending out the reports like the same night. I'm like, I love this. ⁓

Melissa D (07:31)
And you're like.

Awesome, awesome.

were some of the more shocking things that you were learning in that course, going from understanding the psychology of men, generally speaking, into focusing just on sex? Do you remember some of those earlier ah-hahs that you were having?

Stephanie (07:51)
Hmm, that's a great question. I mean, I think the biggest aha was how common psychology creates physical issues for men, like how much anxiety and the thought patterns and yeah, just like having one mindset too around what they believe sex should be and how they define it. And so much about the language.

of like, how are you, when you think of successful sex, what do you think about? You know, and men will immediately, like most men I talked to, will immediately be like, well, I stay hard, I last as long as I want, and you go with orgasm. Yeah, yeah. And I'm like, really? Like, that's it? You know, like that's successful. What about everything else? You know, and it's just, there's so much to it. Like, there's so much that goes into a fulfilling sex life.

Melissa D (08:23)
Forever. Right. Right.

Stephanie (08:37)
And

men limit themselves especially by obsessing and putting so much pressure on erection when they should come and making sure that she comes, but like not even understanding if she's feeling pleasure, just like wanting her to reach an orgasm so bad so they could prove something to themselves, right? Yeah. And it's more about proving to himself than it is about actually feeling good with her and like enjoying

Melissa D (08:50)
Right, like that, yeah.

Stephanie (08:58)
So the whole psychology part of it was really interesting and even like

having physical practices that I could teach men and teach my clients to help them move through these challenges and really starting to believe like, whoa, like there's so many guys struggling with this, but like, look at all these solutions, you know, like they're not stuck in these patterns, like they don't have to be, you know, it's just about finding the solution that works for them. So it was cool. We also had to watch a lot of different porn's in the school.

Melissa D (09:20)
Yeah.

Amazing.

Stephanie (09:26)
to understand different people's fetishes and fantasies. So that was kind of like the shocker for me because I was like, I don't want to watch all these.

Melissa D (09:35)
Yeah, especially in

some of my training too, we did the same thing. just, you know, I went to Swiss in San Francisco, which was, you know, started by nurses in the seventies and part of the curriculum was really understanding, you know, not to yuck at other people's yam and understand like, here's the palette or here's like the variety of things that are people are in. And I caught myself a couple of times going, really? But again, I had to like stay neutral just so I could understand it. Yeah.

Stephanie (10:03)
Yeah,

I was like, that's great for them, but I don't want to watch it.

Melissa D (10:07)
for you and I'm like no

Awesome. Wonderful. yeah, you went from... I love that you did that program. I didn't realize that Metta from Veezus ⁓ did like a... Yeah, Metta from Mars did an action program. I saw like the deck that he had a while back and some other things kind of come across my feed, but that's so cool. And then jumping from that into like supporting people...

Stephanie (10:14)
Thank

Spinner for Mars.

Melissa D (10:37)
sexually. And why do you think that you chose men? were you ever open to working with women? Was there ever, you know, a moment that came up saying that you might want might want to broaden it? Or like, what was your process there?

Stephanie (10:50)
I mean, it was really like to understand them because I was so confused as to why I was so frustrated with them. Like I didn't actually understand why. So I was like, I need, I want to learn about them. So part of it was like experimentation for my own selfish needs. then part of it was also realizing like, wow, at the time, like it was kind of hard to come across a relationship coach for men on social media. Like I saw so many that were either for men and women or just for women.

And I was like, where are the people just helping men with sex? Because there's so many women complaining that men can't find the G-spot, that men don't know how to have great sex. And I saw a lot more complaints than I saw people helping them. So I'm like, who's helping them then? We're all complaining. Who's going to help them? And actually cheer for them, like lift them up, empower them. Yeah.

Melissa D (11:33)
Right? Yeah. Yeah.

Not shame them.

Yeah. Cool. now most of your clients, from what I understand, you see online, right? That's so convenient. So anybody from all over the world can kind of tune in. What are some of the, I would say the top three things that men come to you for right now?

Stephanie (11:49)
Yeah. All of them. Yeah.

having trouble staying hard. It's definitely a top three, delayed ejaculation.

Melissa D (12:08)
Now,

so within the, I might jump around a little bit. So within the men that are reaching out to you for just staying erect, what's the age range would you say?

Stephanie (12:19)
Um, I'd say the age range use it's funny because like two years ago I would get a lot of clients in their 20s with erection issues. But recently it's been more guys in their, um, probably like 30s to

Yeah, 35 to like 60 is the average is the age span.

Melissa D (12:41)
Yeah, I wonder if that's because more older men are getting more information from social media now instead of like this. I mean, that's story again that I'm just kind of making up because yeah, a couple of years ago, I again, I just imagine younger guys were kind of on YouTube or on Facebook or, you know, on the socials and there's just a bigger presence now, at least that I'm noticing in my circles too.

Stephanie (13:06)
Yeah, my clients are much older like today than they were two years ago.

Melissa D (13:10)
Yeah. And so, yeah, delight ejaculation. So being able to hold pleasure in their bodies and having an erection, you know, stick around. And then what would you say would be the third thing?

Stephanie (13:22)
The third thing is just lack of communication skills with their partner. So not knowing how to talk about sex, know, feeling unfulfilled, feeling undesirable and not knowing what to do about it. Like feeling like I am not happy in this relationship or we're both not happy in this situation and like something needs to change. So what do do?

Melissa D (13:42)
Yeah. What do you think is one of the causes for that? Not being fulfilled, being in this relationship, of, yeah, what are you seeing in that?

Stephanie (13:51)
Lack of vulnerability every time. They're just not, they're making decisions emotionally, like reacting to each other just based on emotion, which is frustration and disappointment and insecurity instead of being like, hey, I need information here. Let me ask a question or let me share how I really, what I'm really concerned about and then see what her thoughts are. Like I was just talking to a client of mine yesterday and he was like, what's wrong with me? Like, why can't I?

Melissa D (14:09)
Yeah.

Right.

Stephanie (14:19)
Like, am I not, like, why am I struggling with this thing? And I was like, there's nothing wrong with you. You just never learned the skill of being vulnerable. You know, like he's a very highly intellectual guy. So he tries to make decisions fast. And if there's an emotional decision where he fears hurting her feelings, he would rather break up with her. And like, he's thinking he's leaning more on the side of breaking up than like talking to her and telling her exactly what he's concerned about. And

asking her what she thinks and how they can work on it together to see if they have a shot.

Melissa D (14:51)
Yeah, it's so vital to give clients this, even if it's pretend, even if it's a dress rehearsal script on like, here's how you open up the conversation. And it seems so basic, but it's really profound, giving them a framework to just share what's actually going on. I find that a lot of people, unless you go into like,

self-help and have a really badass therapist and you're actually actively doing it, we're not used to having these kind of conversations. And so everyone's triggered and no one's really sharing and there's no framework. there's like, yeah, it's not getting anywhere. Yeah.

Stephanie (15:25)
And then when they do talk, it just comes out really bad. Yeah.

I said to my client, I was like, let's role play. want you to tell me what you think. You know, if you were coming from a place of security and vulnerability and you were like, you were also wanting her to feel love from you, like what would that sound like? Like you tell me and then we could practice. And what he said to me was just like, oh boy, no, like that would not work. Yeah.

Melissa D (15:50)
Anything but that, I will die. Death.

Stephanie (15:55)
let's do it over. Let me help you like frame it and then I'm going to say it. I want you to pay attention to my tone, the type of words I use and I'll give you a three step framework. So that's what we did. And then he practiced again the way that I taught him and he was like, wow, yeah, that's very different. know, so, so we're actually able to role play and practice. And then he now can go in and have a conversation with her. And I tell my clients all the time too. I'm like, take notes and literally bring it to the conversation. Like me and my boyfriend, like, you know, Andrew, no, seriously, like

Melissa D (16:21)
That's high.

Stephanie (16:24)
If it's like in depth, you're, if you have, if there's a lot of detail, right? And it's really important to you and you have like three points that you want to address that are like really getting in the way of your sex life. Like you don't want to forget anything, right? And you don't want to like just get emotional and then all of a sudden start yelling or like start defending yourself, right? So if you have like a bullet point list on your phone of like three points, like mention this, mention this, mention this.

and you just look at your phone, tell your partner like, I got my phone. I have some notes just so that I don't forget what I wanna say, cause it's really important. And let's just talk about this and brainstorm it together. You make it more casual. Like it doesn't have to be this heavy, weird thing. You could just be like, hey, like this is important. So let's sit and talk. Here are the points I have. What do you think? What should we do about this? I was thinking this. What do you think? What do you think would work?

Melissa D (16:58)
Yeah.

I think it's beautiful.

Some of my favorite, I guess, friends that inspire me the most in their relationships is they actually have a check-in that happens at least once a week, maybe every other week, and it's like time set aside. So it's not so much about bringing something only when shit's not working, but like, hey, let's just look under the hood and let's talk about things. And if we have notes, cool. If we don't, or if one of us does, and it's kind of built in.

to the system and then it's like this sweet maintenance that can happen.

Stephanie (17:41)
Yeah, yeah, because that's the problem. Like, so many couples get in the habit of only talking about sex when something's breaking, like going wrong. And then you start, you connect sex to stress and like tension and bad conversations that you don't want to have, you know, and or things not working. A format that Andrew and I use is for check-ins is number one, the first part of the framework is

Melissa D (17:47)
Right, yeah.

Stephanie (18:06)
What's going well lately? Like, what are we both happy about about our own lives and like our lives with each other? So we're like acknowledging ourselves as individuals and also our relationship. And then number two is, yeah, there are any concerns we want to address to each other that we could help each other out with. And then the third is, what are we, what have we been grateful for? Like what's been working, like what are we most grateful for that's been working well in the relationship? So, so there's two good ones.

Melissa D (18:31)
I love that. You two are so cute.

So

cute. So going back to, you know, the reliable erections is probably one of the most common things that I support people with to arrival, reliable erections, stress, all of that. What are some of your your ways of working with someone around that? And I and I also you work with people like in a six month containers, right? There's like, you know, three months. OK, there's like an arc of

Stephanie (18:58)
three months.

Melissa D (19:01)
of working together. Yeah, what would that look like for somebody, for you to support somebody?

Stephanie (19:06)
So my

process is 12 weeks. We talk like every other week. And in between, on the first session, we create a personalized plan for them with three goals that we set out for what they want to experience throughout the 12 weeks and where they want to be. So every time we talk, we make sure that we rate the goals so that they're moving up. there's a number of...

Melissa D (19:30)
I men

love that. We're going to rate it. Yes. I love it. Yep.

Stephanie (19:33)
Yeah, we rate it. We put a number on it and then we have evidence to back up the number, right? So,

so he can't just say, I went from a four to a six this week and have no reason why like he's need to give me some, some info there. So we share a lot of detail. I always tell my clients like, it's like, as long as you're respectful about it, like I want to know as much as possible, you know, because it only helps us get you to the point where you want to be. So very open communication. We have fun on our calls.

And yeah, and then by the end of the call, I'm going to say, all right, your new focus points will be ready. And I'm going to email them over to you tomorrow. And then you'll do those, you'll work on those things for the next two weeks until we meet again. So he gets action steps, right? He's working on those for two weeks. And then we get back on the call. He tells me how it went. We rerate the goals and then rinse and repeat.

Melissa D (20:24)
What would you say are some of the most common like action steps that you give men?

Stephanie (20:27)
most common one is masturbation training. ⁓ Yeah, very pro masturbation for doing it in a way that like makes your sex life better, right? So I always tell, so most guys, especially guys with ED, I would give them some kind of meditation or exercise. A meditation might look like a guided meditation of me guiding them through keeping their body relaxed.

Melissa D (20:31)
Yeah, huge.

Stephanie (20:54)
keeping their mind relaxed, helping them understand what turns them on mentally and like what type of touch works for them physically. I might encourage them to try a different type of touch. A lot of guys just jerk off the same way all the time and they don't realize there's so many different, yeah, like there's so many different.

Melissa D (21:08)
dry, as dry and as fast as possible. And then they're

like, oh, wait, I'm with a person now. We need to look at this. I'm always shocked. I'm always shocked how many people are like, wait, is, what is, why do we want to look at the way I masturbate? And it's like, this is everything.

Stephanie (21:15)
Why am I not getting started?

Yeah, it's

probably the most important thing. Yeah. And then it's so interesting to me how many guys are like, oh, I don't want to masturbate because I'm in a relationship and I want to save it for her. Yeah, well, they're struggling with issues. And I'm like, I respect that. we need to like in order to work through this stuff, I want to encourage you to masturbate to both and.

Melissa D (21:33)
Yeah.

Really?

Okay.

I wonder,

yeah, I wonder too, and maybe you have some info on this. I've heard from some male clients that, you know, their partner would either catch them or know that they masturbate and get kind of disappointed. Do you find that to be true in some of the people you work with?

Stephanie (22:07)
Yeah, I find that to be true in cases where he is more reliant on p*rn and maybe he's not reaching orgasms with her. ⁓ He's not having sex as much as she wants, but he's jerking off to p*rn. Or some women end up not even wanting to have s*x with him because she'll wake up in bed and see he's watching p*rn and it's just like, feels...

Melissa D (22:18)
Gotcha.

Stephanie (22:34)
It feels like, why didn't you, you you haven't seduced me in a while, but like you're sitting here watching this, you know, so it feels like she's not chosen. She's not desired. And then she gets resentful and then doesn't want to have it. Right. And then he's trying to control these urges and feels bad. And now there's all this guilt and the shame and he's still like addicted to it. So he can't stop. And then she's getting more upset and it's horrible feedback loop.

Melissa D (22:40)
Yeah.

Bye.

Yeah, it's

a little loop there. Yeah, what's your take on pornography in general? Like, where's your... I'm always curious ⁓ how people feel about it.

Stephanie (23:09)
Yeah, I'm

not anti-porn. Like, I'm not someone to say, like, everyone should stop watching porn or, like, all men should stop. I think that most men should probably stop because most men seem to struggle. Or at least most men. Of course, I'm biased because the men who come to me are coming to me for a reason. But I'll say, like, you know, if you're struggling in your sex life and

there's either connection issues with your partner or erection issues. DE especially is due to guys watching a lot of porn. I find that's always a common connection. yeah, like if it's not helping, if it's not adding anything to your sex life and it's taking away, I would slowly stop watching it. You know, I tell guys like cut it and start by cutting it in half and then

Melissa D (23:47)
Yeah.

Stephanie (24:04)
and then start replacing with mindful masturbation practices like Ronin, my sex meditations or like erotica or...

Melissa D (24:15)
And it's so fun to do with your partner. I mean, I'm all for like doing your own thing solo-y, because that could be great. Solo-y, is that even a word? ⁓ But having kind of a shared erotic experience, whether they're masturbating together or maybe they're reading each other erotica, so it feels like more of a collaborative, inclusive thing that they get to do together.

Stephanie (24:23)
You

Yeah

Yeah, I often tell clients that they should try mutual masturbation. And whenever they do it with their partner, it's always this fun new like, we did it. And it was really hot. loved it.

Melissa D (24:45)
Yeah!

Yeah, so many people get stuck in these ruts and sometimes just giving them a little bit of inspo to do things differently can make all the difference. Yeah, what's... Go ahead.

Stephanie (24:55)
Mm-hmm. Plus mutual masturbation,

you can learn so much by being right there. Whether you're masturbating yourself and just next to your partner and you're just observing each other or you're doing it to each other and then you can guide better. Because I always say start by doing it yourself and let your partner observe you and then do each other. And it's just, I think you learn the most that way because you're right there. You're paying attention.

Melissa D (25:25)
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. What's your feelings about the NoFap craze that comes around every No Nut November?

Stephanie (25:34)
I think it's ridiculous. And I have to start making content about this. It's so controversial, but I think it's just so dumb, basically.

Melissa D (25:39)
It's so controversial. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I was

thinking like, so I don't know. My take is like taking a break from things is always nice. You know, like you're not drinking for the month of January or maybe you don't drink at all, but like taking a break and really like resting with anything, food, sex, the way you touch yourself, whatever is great. But I'm surprised at how

big that movement is and what they focus on, think often does a little bit more damage, at least with some of the clients that I've seen. It gets them all worked up and kind of pent up. And then when they do touch themselves, when they do express, then it's almost like they're starting over again. And I talked to a couple men. like, you know, you could actually continue touching yourself and just not not to, or you can extend.

the experience and look at that and say like, okay, instead of masturbating in five minutes, maybe make it 20 or 30 in a more long form experience. Those are the habits that I'm more excited, you know, supporting people in than just resist everything and try not to nut. I'm like, wow.

Stephanie (26:54)
Yeah, I mean, and it's like what you're saying, like, yeah, and it's good to always take breaks from things. And like, if the message of NoFap was, hey, let's take a month break and see how your body does and like beat yourself up if you do it, like just try your best. And if it was supportive and encouraging in that way, but it's not, it's like,

Melissa D (27:06)
Right? Right.

Stephanie (27:14)
masturbate and like masturbation is bad and like you should stop altogether because it's not like it's ruining your life you know and there's like all these messages that are like shaming men when it comes to masturbation and then of course they end up doing it when November is over because you can't sustain that forever and like sex is healthy masturbation healthy you know so why are we yeah pleasure like you're you're saying basically do not pleasure yourself it's bad right so when you meet these connections

Melissa D (27:24)
Right.

Yeah. Right. Pleasure. Yeah.

Yeah.

Stephanie (27:42)
even in a month's time, it's like, yeah, where's your, what's your mindset going into it? Because if you go in believing that about sex and believing that about pleasure and masturbation, how do you think it's gonna impact your sex life with a partner and like after November or, you know, like you can't like live like that forever. It's not a healthy mindset or practice. So.

Melissa D (27:57)
Right?

wondering

where that actually came from. I don't remember if I actually looked into that. Do you know anything about that? I wonder if it's like hooked to a... don't quote me on this, but like I wonder if it came out of like a religious, you know, structure or not. I'm not sure.

Stephanie (28:15)
No.

Yeah, I need to look into that.

Melissa D (28:18)
Yeah, but it's very like, very rigid, very wild.

Stephanie (28:20)
Very rigid, yeah. Like on my videos, on

my YouTube videos, I'll have some no fappers like, no fap forever, no fap team. God. I'm gonna go get a leave, this is not the channel.

Melissa D (28:29)
I'll get the broom out. Get out of here.

Yeah,

this is not for you and that's okay. I'm curious. You know, I like talking to other, you know, people like yourself, other professionals and I get curious, like, sometimes people can put us on this pedestal, like everything's perfect for us and we're just rock stars all the time. And I'm curious within the last year or so, is there something that you personally have been exploring or, you know, just

exploring for yourself in your own sex life? Of course, you don't need to detailed details, but what are some ways that you're expanding or getting curious or learning about yourself and your own eroticism and your own sexuality?

Stephanie (29:11)
Yeah, that's a great question. All these things come to my head, but which one do I want to share?

Melissa D (29:15)
Now then.

Stephanie (29:16)
You that one? Go!

Melissa D (29:17)
The one that you don't want to say out loud, go.

Stephanie (29:21)
I mean, I will say that, that Andrew and my boyfriend and I just went to, Europe. had a long Europe vacation for the holidays and we, so fun. It's so fun. And we, we started listening right before the vacation. started listening to this podcast. we just came across and listened to one episode, but it was so cool and fun to listen to it's called vanilla swingers. And you would love it. It's.

Melissa D (29:28)
I saw that. It looks so fun.

Ooh, I'm Googling

it immediately. Okay.

Stephanie (29:47)
It's this couple, they're

so fun and they tell their stories of how they started swinging like a year ago, but they've already been to like 100 sex clubs around the world. And they share their experiences and they rate each club like out of five stars and explain why and they explain how to get in and what the experience is like. yeah, so we were like, okay, we have to go to this one in Paris, like while we're in Paris, like we gotta do it, you know, we gotta like understand.

Melissa D (30:04)
was fun. Wow.

Is that the first

time that you two have gone to like a sex club?

Stephanie (30:18)
We've been to two in New York when we lived in Manhattan, but they were not ideal. Like we did not enjoy them.

Melissa D (30:27)
I wonder which ones you, which ones should you go to? Did you go to Hacienda? Okay, maybe put that on your list. Okay, continue. you're, I think that's in Brooklyn. Yeah. Okay. All right. Okay. So you're in Europe and you're like, hey.

Stephanie (30:31)
No.

Is that a manhunt?

Okay, we didn't even look in Good to ⁓ know.

Oh yeah. So we

go to this club and it was the nice, it was so nice, it was so classy. Les Chantelles, I think it was, like the candles in French, I think it's Les Chantelles. But yeah, like everyone was super attractive and the DJ was amazing and there were like six different rooms, it was super, it was like chandeliers and red and like sexy pictures on the wall, champagne and like...

Melissa D (30:56)
Okay.

That's huge.

Stephanie (31:15)
food and a full bar. And we were just, yeah, so we had our first like real experience there in terms of like a swapping adventure. So that was like a new thing for us, right? Like in the other clubs, we just kind of did our own thing, like around people. ⁓

Melissa D (31:31)
huh. Wow.

How did you two do with that? I mean, again, sharing whatever makes sense to you, like, you know, swapping is from experience. It's like, there's a lot of things that can come up and there's a lot of things that can be really fun about it.

Stephanie (31:45)
Yeah, yeah, I know. was like, oh, this could go like one of two ways. I feel like it's either going to be really great or really bad. But I was like, we went into it being like, okay, like our rule, we had a word for if someone asked us if they were interested, I would look at him and say the word, like whisper the word. Because even if I said,

Melissa D (32:09)
That was a yes or no. What was your word?

Stephanie (32:14)
What was my word? I think it was pineapple. Yeah, it wasn't something very interesting. But yeah, it was pineapple. And that was basically like, I'm totally down. Let's go. Let's do it. And if I didn't say pineapple and I was just like, yeah, maybe, like he would know, like we should move on and we should try to like get out of there.

Melissa D (32:17)
Classic. That's everyone's word. Bye NASA. Yeah.

Now, was

it mostly women that were approaching you or was it the couple together? Because I know that there's different ways of kind of navigating in those clubs.

Stephanie (32:45)
Yeah, everyone seemed to be, it seemed to be all couples in this club. There were probably like 50 couples. And yeah, I was approached, at first no one was talking to each other for like the longest time. No one was dancing. It was kind of like everyone was just watching and like seeing what was gonna happen first. We went and like took a look around the back rooms and saw a girl giving a guy head like as soon as we got there and we're like, okay, they're starting. Can we go back?

Melissa D (32:59)
Uh-huh.

People warming

up.

Stephanie (33:09)
Yeah, my boyfriend goes, let's like, let's start the dance floor. Let's get it going. So we were the first ones to start and then everybody got like came and joined. So that was fun. then, right? Yeah.

Melissa D (33:18)
Leaders go first, Stephanie.

huh. Awesome.

Stephanie (33:22)
Of course,

of course. And then, and then, yeah, and then for the, for the longest time, probably two and a half hours, I was just so stuck in my work brain. Cause I had been working, we came off a really long, intense work week. I launched my app and like, I just couldn't relax. I was just like, me, me, me, me, me. You know, like when you're just kind of in a tense work mode and you're like, I haven't transitioned yet. And

Melissa D (33:44)
Yeah, yeah.

Stephanie (33:46)
And yeah, but I was getting my period the next day. So we had to go that night. So I'm like, I'm trying to relax. I'm trying to get into it. I'm having a hard time, but I know I can get there. believe I could get there. And Andrew kept going like, babe, we could just go. Let's just go explore Paris. We could just leave. This was fun. Let's just go. And then finally, it wasn't until like 1.30 AM, we started, I was waiting for Andrew sitting by the bathroom and this couple starts talking to me and they're asking me questions. And it just immediately like,

relaxed because I'm like, finally we're engaging and we're just hanging out. It's no stress. And, and they were like, should we go watch people? Like, we'll go with you. Let's go watch people over there. So we're like walking around and we're doing different things. And then, and then after like that girl was like passing, like his girlfriend was falling asleep, like it was so late and she was like, okay, let's go home. So they left. And then, I said to Andrew, was like, why don't we just like, make out over here?

Like, let's just go do our own thing, like make out. And so we found this room with like a bed and we just like, we're hanging out there by ourselves. And then this couple that had been like, eye fucking us, come over and they're like, can we join you? And I was like, that's the couple. But they were like, we were both really attracted to them. So we're like, yeah.

Melissa D (34:53)
Awesome. Wonderful.

Wow, you won the jackpot, because getting four people to all be interested sometimes takes a little time. Yeah, amazing.

Stephanie (35:08)
Yeah, yeah, I mean, was just the

girls doing things, you know, but, but yeah, it was, it was fun. And it was like, it was probably like 10, like 20 minutes, like most 20 minutes max, but it was just like, I was so like fulfilled by it basically. So like, they were like, oh, let's do this now let's go. And I was like, I need to go. Amazing, but I'm I need to go. I'm taking in.

Melissa D (35:29)
Good. Yeah. What's,

what do you think? What do you and have? Yeah. What are you noticing that you get from going to those things like that? How do they feed your relationship or?

Stephanie (35:45)
my god, I mean, we had sex like three times a day for like a week after that. Like the most we've ever had, like it was absurd. It was ridiculous. ⁓

Melissa D (35:52)
Perfect.

than like

go into a sex club and then be like, right.

Stephanie (36:00)
like remember what we did. We just like attack each other. But yeah, so it's like, yeah, it's like not much has to happen to just keep you like really amped about the experience and talking about, next time maybe this could happen. And you know, if this happened, how would we handle that? And it's just fun. I don't know, it's really fun.

Melissa D (36:06)
That's awesome.

Yeah. Yeah.

So for other couples that may be interested in some version rather of like just being witnessed, going witnessing others, maybe doing a swap, you know, there's all kinds of things that are available, right? What are some of the, what are some of the things that you imagine or just from your own experience that make that a more accessible, you know, experience for people?

Stephanie (36:48)
I think to start off, being watched is the easiest way to start. I don't know. I don't know if that's just my preference. But I think if you're just, if you make a rule with your partner to go and be like, hey, how about the boundaries for tonight? Or just, we just do stuff ourselves. And even if there's attractive people and they ask us things, we just stick to our own thing. Like we could get excited about that or like, but let's just stay together this time.

Melissa D (37:13)
Mm-hmm.

Stephanie (37:16)
and then, you know, maybe next time you go in and you say, okay, let's stay together. But if like there's a partner we, we both are ready for, and we both are like, you know, really excited. Maybe we like give each other this look and then we like ask them, you know, to do just this with us and like have some rules. I think the more rules you have, I mean, you don't have too many rules because then that takes away from like the flow of things. But I think too, for, for me, like, I know Andrew and I went in and I had like,

Melissa D (37:40)
Music.

Stephanie (37:44)
three things that I was like, definitely don't want to do this. If this happens, let's do this. And then if this happens, we leave or if this happens, we stay.

Melissa D (37:56)
Yeah, seems like a nice, you know, slowly going into the water a little bit, especially if you're new at all. This can be really grounding and you can always add things later. And, you know, oftentimes I hear horror stories of people jumping in the deep end and being like, shit, it's a little harder to backpedal on something that was disturbing, right? Or something that rattled you a little bit on one end or the other. But just slowly making a plan can make it.

Stephanie (38:15)
Yeah.

Melissa D (38:25)
really juicy and fun, and then you can kind of titrate into the experience versus like, hey, we're just gonna set these really high expectations and crash potentially.

Stephanie (38:33)
Yeah, yeah, and I think even like if you're if you're new and like a little nervous anxious about it or you know excited but like uncertain if you can handle it like just go and look around like plan to just go for an hour and just watch and serve yeah

Melissa D (38:47)
Fun,

fun, fun. And yeah, there's things that are happening in Austin, but I find in other bigger cities, they're generally a lot sexier. As far as the location anyway. Yeah. Hossien is pretty hot. Yeah. Top floor is another one that I've heard really great things about. And of course there's, know, Cancun, which is kind of a neat, neat thing. Very couple-centric. Yeah. Cancun, it's, I'm trying to think.

Stephanie (38:56)
Yeah.

Yeah

Melissa D (39:13)
desire. I went there for my 40th and I loved it because every day there was a new influx of people and it was all couples so it wasn't any single dudes you know like ⁓ some of the other places which again there's nothing wrong with that it's just it's nice to meet other people ⁓ and it feels a little bit more balanced but there was lots of social things and the food was spectacular the rooms were sexy and there was all these activities and yeah you could kind of

Stephanie (39:24)
Hmm.

Yeah.

Melissa D (39:40)
go in and decide at what level you want to play or just be in a sexy space where closing was optional. It was the only space on the beach where you could just be fully nude. It was pretty hot.

Stephanie (39:51)
wow, that's cool.

Melissa D (39:53)
Yeah, I don't

know what it is, you know, what it's like nowadays, but when I went, was pretty, pretty fun.

Stephanie (39:58)
Yeah, yeah, but one of the clubs we went to, I'm trying to think, I forget the name, but one of the clubs in New York was mostly men. was like 90, 95 % men, where it did get a little uncomfortable because if you wanted to like...

Melissa D (40:07)
wow.

Stephanie (40:13)
do something with someone like we were interested in like watching this couple and they invited us like they were like, come downstairs and like, just like watch us or something. So we're like, okay, and we go downstairs and then like 30 guys see us go and then they follow and they're all like trying to sit like crowd in the room and then the couple's like, okay, no, like this is yeah, yeah. And it's also the energy, right? Like it's not, it's not that it's all men, but it's the energy that

Melissa D (40:27)
wow.

Stephanie (40:40)
sometimes single guys, too many single guys can bring, which is this maybe assertiveness or desperation. Yeah, yeah, very desperate energy, which isn't sexy. So it was kind of like, it's like a vibe killer if you're bringing that energy in.

Melissa D (40:45)
hungry. Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Yeah, that's why I like that

some of the other events that teach kind of, you know, they front load the evening with a little bit of like attunement and some really important things if you're at a party or if you're in a relationship, you know, practicing, really reading the room and being aware of your body and other people's bodies and boundaries. And, you know, you just kind of move into a situation like really being invited and using your words and yeah, attunement, it's huge.

Stephanie (41:16)
Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, I had like random guys touching

me and I was like, no, please don't do that. Like, didn't say that.

Melissa D (41:22)
no.

Thank you. Yeah.

So before we wrap up for the night, what would you say is some solid advice that you could give men who may be experiencing some of these things? You know, maybe their erections aren't lasting as long as they want, or maybe they're not as reliable. Maybe they're feeling anxious. What are some tools that you personally use to support men with that?

Stephanie (41:50)
Yeah, I mean, of course Ronan, you know, Ronan is my app that helps helps men get into their bodies, relax their nervous system, but also build arousal from that place from that relaxed place, right? You can't force arousal. You need to get in a habit of understand what relaxes you. And then what gets you aroused in a way that feels really good for you doesn't feel forced. And then, you know, not being attached to the outcome.

like really learn to enjoy the experience of sex. And I think to enjoy that experience means you don't look at successful sex as getting an erection. You look at successful sex as practicing the dirty talk you've been wanting to practice and try out, or trying that role play where you're more dominant and you do this thing to her, or making more sex jokes just regularly with your woman, you know, and getting comfortable just like.

letting sex roll off the tongue and like topics and jokes and conversation. know, when you build this comfortable relationship with it and you see it as more than just an erection, then the pressure on the erection fades and your body actually responds the way you want it to. ⁓ So there's a lot of, yeah.

Melissa D (42:53)
Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah, there's so much focus. There's so much focus

on like, my God, everything's got to revolve around what my cock's doing instead of like, wow, I really love watching and I really love using my words and I really love playing. Yeah, expanding the possibilities and giving ideas to people. I'm wondering about your sex jokes. You were like, you said sex jokes. I want to double tap on that. Tell me a sad...

Stephanie (43:07)
Yeah.

No, it's funny because my clients actually say this to me like I two clients last week that said actually three clients That's funny three clients last week that told me they're making more like jokes regularly about sex like like one guy lighter Yeah, yeah being lighter like one of my clients yesterday told me that like he was with his girlfriend then he was like look, it looks like a pair of balls and like

Melissa D (43:33)
Like just being lighter in general in an erotic moment. Okay.

Stephanie (43:45)
And if you notice and like they were both laughing because like and she's like, stop it, you know, like so he's just like he's more comfortable. He's more you know, my other client was like, I'm actually like talking to my buddy, like one of my best friends about sex now and like, and he's so secure too. So he's like, dude, give me that. Like, how's it going? Like, you know what happened? And so he's like, I finally have like one of my friends who I'm open to about this and it's fun to like talk about it and share about it and laugh about like the things that didn't work. I were like,

Melissa D (43:50)
That's cute.

Stephanie (44:13)
go great, you know, so they're actually able to laugh about, you know, the things that were awkward or the things that were great. And, and, yeah, just let sex be more of a like roll off the tongue, type of topic instead of holding it in and feeling like you shouldn't say it, or I'm not sure if I should say it. And like, should I ask for this or like, what's she going to think if I say this? I shouldn't say it. You know, there's so much overthinking when it comes to sex.

Melissa D (44:31)
Hmm.

There's so much, yeah,

like inner dialogue could just, you could just swirl up and be swallowed there. Like, you know, and it's nice that you're teaching people how to just relax and be more joyful and, you know, have fun. It doesn't have to be serious. It doesn't have to be this really tense thing. Yeah.

Stephanie (44:40)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, exactly. Yeah,

and one tip that helps a lot of guys for like being in the moment if they're in their heads, you know, because usually they're like, what if this happens? Or what if I can't get hard? What if I don't stay hard? Am I still hard? Right? Like that's, those are the thoughts going on while they're having sex, which is supposed to be vulnerable. So to help them get back in the moment, I say, try to replace, like whenever those thoughts come in your head, try to replace it with,

Melissa D (45:11)
Yep, yep, yep.

Stephanie (45:22)
What's like what's the sexiest thing to me right now? Like what feels best right now? You know, like what what do I want to do to her right now and like questions that like put you back in the place of like Where you should be which is pleasure instead of thinking about what could go wrong and And I talked to a client yesterday and he's like he's like well when it goes right I don't have any thoughts in my head like there's just no thoughts and I was like no there there actually are thoughts you just they're going with pleasure like

Melissa D (45:36)
Yeah.

Stephanie (45:47)
you're probably thinking like, oh God, she's so fucking hot. Like, look at this ass, right? Like you have thoughts. It's just they're working for you, you know? So let's go back to those thoughts that have worked for you.

Melissa D (45:53)
Right. Yeah.

Yeah, and bringing people into the moment, I like that of, yeah, it's not just blank, or you don't want to be thinking about like, let's wait until this cock is harder, but really like focusing again on what's happening in real time. Mm-hmm. Beautiful. Beautiful. Well, so Stephanie, how do people find you?

Stephanie (46:08)
Yeah.

Yeah, exactly.

People can find me on my website, StephanieGanowski.com. My podcast is What I Love About Sex. And I'm Stephanie Ganowski on social media. So I have a YouTube, Instagram, all that jazz.

Melissa D (46:30)
Awesome, so we'll put all that in the show notes. Stephanie, it's so good to see you. And yeah, I'm so glad you hopped on here.

Stephanie (46:35)
Are you too, sir?

Me too. I love your questions. really went a little deeper than most people do. Yeah, was great. ⁓ I love it. I love it. So you.

Melissa D (46:41)
Really? And here's me just like flying by the seat of my pants. Being in the moment. Awesome.

Well, I so appreciate you. Let's do pool swim soon. And I'm wishing you all the success with your new app that came out this badass. Bye.

Stephanie (47:03)
Thank you. Thanks so much.