{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":21.48,"endTime":106.47,"body":"For this"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":21.48,"endTime":106.47,"body":"episode, I'm speaking with civil"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":106.47,"endTime":110.4,"body":"servant and portrait artist"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":106.47,"endTime":110.4,"body":"Sally Ward, about policy"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":110.4,"endTime":114.18,"body":"advising oil painting, and why"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":110.4,"endTime":114.18,"body":"you shouldn't enter two art"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":114.18,"endTime":118.98,"body":"competitions at the same time."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":114.18,"endTime":118.98,"body":"Hi, Sally, how are you?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":119.46,"endTime":121.05,"body":"I'm very well. Thank you,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":119.46,"endTime":121.05,"body":"Claire."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":121.59,"endTime":125.85,"body":"Brilliant. Can you start by"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":121.59,"endTime":125.85,"body":"telling me what the creative"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":125.85,"endTime":128.88,"body":"activity you have returned to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":125.85,"endTime":128.88,"body":"is?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":129.57,"endTime":137.28,"body":"I have returned to painting. So"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":129.57,"endTime":137.28,"body":"I am an artist now. But it's not"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":137.28,"endTime":140.82,"body":"what I've always done. So I've"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":137.28,"endTime":140.82,"body":"done different things in my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":140.82,"endTime":141.27,"body":"career."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":141.69,"endTime":145.32,"body":"Fabulous. Right, let's go right"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":141.69,"endTime":145.32,"body":"back to the beginning, then I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":145.32,"endTime":148.92,"body":"know that you were ahead of the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":145.32,"endTime":148.92,"body":"game in your art education at"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":148.92,"endTime":152.7,"body":"secondary school. Can you tell"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":148.92,"endTime":152.7,"body":"me how you came to complete your"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":152.7,"endTime":158.1,"body":"GCSE and A level art studies"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":152.7,"endTime":158.1,"body":"early? And where you think your"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":158.1,"endTime":161.46,"body":"artistic talents and enthusiasm"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":158.1,"endTime":161.46,"body":"came from?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":162.45,"endTime":166.77,"body":"Yeah. Oh, my gosh, that is a big"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":162.45,"endTime":166.77,"body":"a big question. So going back,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":167.07,"endTime":172.26,"body":"in terms of my sort of taking"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":167.07,"endTime":172.26,"body":"exams early, I was very, very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":172.26,"endTime":177.3,"body":"lucky that when I went to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":172.26,"endTime":177.3,"body":"secondary school, they were very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":177.3,"endTime":183.87,"body":"forward thinking. And I was very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":177.3,"endTime":183.87,"body":"prolific in terms of my art by"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":183.87,"endTime":187.05,"body":"that point. So when I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":183.87,"endTime":187.05,"body":"around, sort of 1112, and I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":187.14,"endTime":193.26,"body":"painted and drew all the time."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":187.14,"endTime":193.26,"body":"And the teachers there, they,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":193.59,"endTime":199.2,"body":"they spotted a talent. And I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":193.59,"endTime":199.2,"body":"very keen and driven, really."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":200.52,"endTime":203.61,"body":"I'm not sure whether it would"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":200.52,"endTime":203.61,"body":"happen these days. But I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":203.61,"endTime":207.99,"body":"very lucky that the teachers"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":203.61,"endTime":207.99,"body":"there felt that I could do my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":207.99,"endTime":213.96,"body":"GCSE when I was 12. And I was up"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":207.99,"endTime":213.96,"body":"for that really sort of liked"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":214.05,"endTime":218.64,"body":"the idea of that challenge. So"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":214.05,"endTime":218.64,"body":"that's what I did. And that that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":218.64,"endTime":221.67,"body":"all went very well. And then I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":218.64,"endTime":221.67,"body":"went on to sort of take my other"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":221.79,"endTime":226.26,"body":"art exams early. And when I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":221.79,"endTime":226.26,"body":"started doing my a level, which"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":226.26,"endTime":234.72,"body":"was around the age of 14, the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":226.26,"endTime":234.72,"body":"school, amazingly, decided to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":234.75,"endTime":239.46,"body":"send me off to the local Sixth"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":234.75,"endTime":239.46,"body":"Form College every Thursday,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":239.67,"endTime":246.0,"body":"during the following two years"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":239.67,"endTime":246.0,"body":"to life draw, essentially, which"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":246.0,"endTime":251.16,"body":"is amazing. So I joined all the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":246.0,"endTime":251.16,"body":"sixth formers when I was 14, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":251.16,"endTime":256.08,"body":"it was a it was a formative"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":251.16,"endTime":256.08,"body":"experience. It's something that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":256.44,"endTime":262.62,"body":"I know, very, you know, very few"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":256.44,"endTime":262.62,"body":"people, or children of that age"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":262.62,"endTime":267.18,"body":"would ever get the opportunity"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":262.62,"endTime":267.18,"body":"to do and it was an amazing"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":267.51,"endTime":272.55,"body":"opportunity. And I was lucky to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":267.51,"endTime":272.55,"body":"have some excellent teachers"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":272.61,"endTime":276.09,"body":"through those couple of years"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":272.61,"endTime":276.09,"body":"who were artists themselves. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":276.09,"endTime":281.22,"body":"I think that's was incredibly"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":276.09,"endTime":281.22,"body":"inspiring to suddenly be taught"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":281.25,"endTime":287.88,"body":"by people who were practising"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":281.25,"endTime":287.88,"body":"artists themselves, and we're"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":287.88,"endTime":291.9,"body":"sort of steeped steeped in that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":287.88,"endTime":291.9,"body":"world. That was an amazing"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":291.9,"endTime":296.25,"body":"experience. And then I think"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":291.9,"endTime":296.25,"body":"sort of going back to, you know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":296.25,"endTime":301.32,"body":"where it all came from. I mean,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":296.25,"endTime":301.32,"body":"my parents neither of them are"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":301.41,"endTime":307.47,"body":"artists my dad had in later life"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":301.41,"endTime":307.47,"body":"also became a designer. So there"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":307.47,"endTime":314.16,"body":"is a sort of artistic gene in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":307.47,"endTime":314.16,"body":"there. Somewhere my my mom is"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":315.0,"endTime":319.32,"body":"very good at art, but didn't"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":315.0,"endTime":319.32,"body":"didn't pursue it. She's an art,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":319.32,"endTime":324.03,"body":"sort of appreciator and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":319.32,"endTime":324.03,"body":"enthusiasts. And probably one of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":324.03,"endTime":328.35,"body":"my earliest memories about sort"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":324.03,"endTime":328.35,"body":"of looking at other people's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":328.35,"endTime":332.16,"body":"art, I remember we had a sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":328.35,"endTime":332.16,"body":"a calendar at home. And it was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":332.16,"endTime":336.09,"body":"probably when I was about eight"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":332.16,"endTime":336.09,"body":"or nine. And it was one of the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":336.09,"endTime":342.93,"body":"cassez famous blue nudes. And I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":336.09,"endTime":342.93,"body":"remember my mom's sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":342.93,"endTime":347.76,"body":"saying, that is just beautiful."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":342.93,"endTime":347.76,"body":"I just love that. And we would"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":347.76,"endTime":351.27,"body":"look at it. And I agreed, I just"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":347.76,"endTime":351.27,"body":"thought it was the most"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":351.27,"endTime":356.91,"body":"beautiful thing. And so I think"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":351.27,"endTime":356.91,"body":"there was constantly an"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":356.91,"endTime":361.23,"body":"appreciation of Arts with my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":356.91,"endTime":361.23,"body":"mom. And then when I was a bit"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":361.23,"endTime":367.35,"body":"older, we started going to art"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":361.23,"endTime":367.35,"body":"exhibitions together. And, you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":367.35,"endTime":370.62,"body":"know, I remember some really"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":367.35,"endTime":370.62,"body":"sort of iconic going to some"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":370.62,"endTime":374.34,"body":"really iconic exhibitions when I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":370.62,"endTime":374.34,"body":"look back at it now. So it's a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":374.4,"endTime":379.02,"body":"massive Lucien Freud exhibition"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":374.4,"endTime":379.02,"body":"in the early 90s. That blew my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":379.02,"endTime":383.82,"body":"mind. I was very young at the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":379.02,"endTime":383.82,"body":"time, but very interested in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":383.82,"endTime":388.53,"body":"sort of new to the figure, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":383.82,"endTime":388.53,"body":"portraiture, and probably at"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":388.53,"endTime":392.76,"body":"that, that sort of early point."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":388.53,"endTime":392.76,"body":"And other and other exhibitions,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":392.76,"endTime":396.42,"body":"like monks the freeze of life,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":392.76,"endTime":396.42,"body":"which was another really my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":396.42,"endTime":400.95,"body":"comic che back in, I think it's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":396.42,"endTime":400.95,"body":"the 90s. So I think all in all,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":400.95,"endTime":406.68,"body":"I had very supportive parents"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":400.95,"endTime":406.68,"body":"who appreciated art, and gave me"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":406.68,"endTime":411.39,"body":"opportunities and an amazing"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":406.68,"endTime":411.39,"body":"school. He were were able to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":411.39,"endTime":414.69,"body":"stretch me in a way that I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":411.39,"endTime":414.69,"body":"wanted to be stretched at that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":415.08,"endTime":416.01,"body":"point in my life,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":416.55,"endTime":422.19,"body":"is it's very fortuitous. Do you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":416.55,"endTime":422.19,"body":"think you were quite a mature?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":422.64,"endTime":427.44,"body":"Young lady? How was it to be 14"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":422.64,"endTime":427.44,"body":"and in a Sixth Form College? To"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":427.44,"endTime":431.34,"body":"me, that's quite a big"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":427.44,"endTime":431.34,"body":"difference. Not in in actual"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":431.34,"endTime":435.54,"body":"years. But in growing up years?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":431.34,"endTime":435.54,"body":"How did you find that social"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":435.54,"endTime":436.47,"body":"aspect of it?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":436.95,"endTime":440.37,"body":"Yeah, it was, it was a good"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":436.95,"endTime":440.37,"body":"experience, it was a very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":440.37,"endTime":444.66,"body":"strange thing, it felt"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":440.37,"endTime":444.66,"body":"incredibly comfortable. I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":444.66,"endTime":448.53,"body":"just very into the art that the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":444.66,"endTime":448.53,"body":"people there, you know, welcome"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":448.53,"endTime":451.65,"body":"me. You know, I remember them"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":448.53,"endTime":451.65,"body":"being quite protective of me,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":451.65,"endTime":456.45,"body":"actually, some of the sort of 18"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":451.65,"endTime":456.45,"body":"year olds. So I felt very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":456.45,"endTime":460.08,"body":"comfortable in that environment,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":456.45,"endTime":460.08,"body":"the art teachers there were just"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":460.08,"endTime":464.67,"body":"great. So I sort of slipped into"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":460.08,"endTime":464.67,"body":"that world very easily. And it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":464.67,"endTime":470.43,"body":"felt very, very comfortable."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":464.67,"endTime":470.43,"body":"And, you know, looking back,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":470.43,"endTime":474.03,"body":"maybe, maybe it wasn't the most"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":470.43,"endTime":474.03,"body":"normal childhood thing to be"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":474.03,"endTime":477.15,"body":"looking at Picasso's needs when"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":474.03,"endTime":477.15,"body":"I was eight. But you know, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":477.15,"endTime":482.31,"body":"think because that was the sort"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":477.15,"endTime":482.31,"body":"of context, it felt completely"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":482.85,"endTime":488.04,"body":"normal and right to be in a life"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":482.85,"endTime":488.04,"body":"drawing class at age."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":488.46,"endTime":493.47,"body":"Yeah. Yeah. Presumably, after"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":488.46,"endTime":493.47,"body":"that, though, you still had to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":494.85,"endTime":498.66,"body":"stay in school, and do your"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":494.85,"endTime":498.66,"body":"other A levels and what have"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":498.66,"endTime":502.35,"body":"you. So did you get to continue"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":498.66,"endTime":502.35,"body":"art? Were you planning on going"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":502.35,"endTime":506.4,"body":"to through the usual path of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":502.35,"endTime":506.4,"body":"Foundation Studies? And what"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":506.4,"endTime":506.97,"body":"have you?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":507.51,"endTime":510.48,"body":"Yeah, I did think about it. I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":507.51,"endTime":510.48,"body":"mean, so I think by the time I'd"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":510.48,"endTime":513.93,"body":"got to 16, where I have my a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":510.48,"endTime":513.93,"body":"level or under my belt, and at"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":513.93,"endTime":518.61,"body":"that point, I started my other"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":513.93,"endTime":518.61,"body":"levels, you know, the normal"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":518.7,"endTime":526.08,"body":"timeframe. And I studied English"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":518.7,"endTime":526.08,"body":"and psychology and music. And I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":526.08,"endTime":530.04,"body":"found these three subjects, you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":526.08,"endTime":530.04,"body":"know, pretty full on to be"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":530.04,"endTime":534.12,"body":"honest. And I think after a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":530.04,"endTime":534.12,"body":"while, it became clear that I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":534.12,"endTime":538.26,"body":"needed a bit a bit more time to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":534.12,"endTime":538.26,"body":"fake us on them. Really, it was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":538.26,"endTime":542.22,"body":"at that point that maybe a bit"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":538.26,"endTime":542.22,"body":"sadly, that art started to take"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":542.22,"endTime":546.54,"body":"a bit of a backseat. And I just"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":542.22,"endTime":546.54,"body":"got incredibly interested in the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":546.54,"endTime":551.4,"body":"sort of more academic subjects"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":546.54,"endTime":551.4,"body":"and that that side of things"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":551.43,"endTime":555.99,"body":"that became my focus, and I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":551.43,"endTime":555.99,"body":"think, you know, by the time I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":555.99,"endTime":560.07,"body":"was thinking about universities"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":555.99,"endTime":560.07,"body":"and what to do next, I did, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":560.07,"endTime":563.73,"body":"did think about art college, but"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":560.07,"endTime":563.73,"body":"I think I'd always sort of past"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":563.73,"endTime":566.49,"body":"the point where I suddenly there"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":563.73,"endTime":566.49,"body":"were these lots of other"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":566.49,"endTime":572.04,"body":"exciting, interesting subjects"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":566.49,"endTime":572.04,"body":"to look at. And I was I just"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":572.04,"endTime":578.28,"body":"became very involved with all of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":572.04,"endTime":578.28,"body":"that. And so, in the end, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":578.37,"endTime":581.04,"body":"applied to study music instead."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":583.05,"endTime":587.76,"body":"You must have been very good at"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":583.05,"endTime":587.76,"body":"that because you were accepted"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":587.76,"endTime":592.74,"body":"to Cambridge University to study"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":587.76,"endTime":592.74,"body":"music was that hard work? I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":592.74,"endTime":596.34,"body":"would imagine being in that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":592.74,"endTime":596.34,"body":"establishment is a lot of hard"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":596.34,"endTime":596.88,"body":"work."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":597.78,"endTime":601.62,"body":"Yeah, it was. It was hard work."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":597.78,"endTime":601.62,"body":"It was Don't be hard work to get"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":601.62,"endTime":605.34,"body":"there to get that offer, without"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":601.62,"endTime":605.34,"body":"sort of banging on about it too"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":605.34,"endTime":610.92,"body":"much, I went to a great school"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":605.34,"endTime":610.92,"body":"and a great sick form both state"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":611.25,"endTime":619.05,"body":"schools. And there weren't many"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":611.25,"endTime":619.05,"body":"people from my sort of cohort"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":619.05,"endTime":623.4,"body":"who ended up going to Oxford or"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":619.05,"endTime":623.4,"body":"Cambridge. So it certainly"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":623.4,"endTime":627.42,"body":"wasn't anything that either my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":623.4,"endTime":627.42,"body":"parents had thought of, or I had"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":627.42,"endTime":630.09,"body":"thought of, until, until I got"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":627.42,"endTime":630.09,"body":"to the point where I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":630.09,"endTime":634.44,"body":"thinking about where to apply."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":630.09,"endTime":634.44,"body":"And so I kind of did it rather,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":634.74,"endTime":639.15,"body":"unknowingly, really, I just, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":634.74,"endTime":639.15,"body":"really liked the course. I liked"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":639.15,"endTime":643.95,"body":"this sort of academic nature of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":639.15,"endTime":643.95,"body":"the course, I went to visit and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":643.95,"endTime":649.5,"body":"I thought it was obviously a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":643.95,"endTime":649.5,"body":"lovely place. And something"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":649.5,"endTime":654.12,"body":"really sparked in me, and I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":649.5,"endTime":654.12,"body":"worked incredibly hard. When I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":654.45,"endTime":656.94,"body":"got there. When I finally"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":654.45,"endTime":656.94,"body":"started at Cambridge, it was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":656.94,"endTime":660.48,"body":"quite a shock, because suddenly"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":656.94,"endTime":660.48,"body":"I was with lots of people who"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":660.48,"endTime":666.12,"body":"had been steeped in the music,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":660.48,"endTime":666.12,"body":"education world for many, many"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":666.12,"endTime":668.97,"body":"years, people who've gone to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":666.12,"endTime":668.97,"body":"sort of specialists, music"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":668.97,"endTime":674.58,"body":"colleges, or music schools, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":668.97,"endTime":674.58,"body":"think I felt suddenly that, you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":674.58,"endTime":679.5,"body":"know, I might have thought that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":674.58,"endTime":679.5,"body":"I was quite good at music. But"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":679.5,"endTime":685.5,"body":"actually, after that, I started"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":679.5,"endTime":685.5,"body":"to reassess. But that is a good"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":685.5,"endTime":691.47,"body":"thing. So it gave me a it gave"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":685.5,"endTime":691.47,"body":"me a bit of a sort of shock. But"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":691.5,"endTime":694.89,"body":"it was a wonderful, wonderful"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":691.5,"endTime":694.89,"body":"experience. And I survived and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":697.71,"endTime":705.0,"body":"well done you. Did you know what"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":697.71,"endTime":705.0,"body":"you wanted to do next? What that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":705.0,"endTime":709.35,"body":"was going to lead to in the in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":705.0,"endTime":709.35,"body":"the big wide world? No, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":709.35,"endTime":713.04,"body":"didn't know I'm afraid I wasn't."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":709.35,"endTime":713.04,"body":"I wasn't somebody who had a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":713.04,"endTime":717.54,"body":"clear plan at any point about"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":713.04,"endTime":717.54,"body":"what I wanted to do. I think"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":717.54,"endTime":721.62,"body":"because I was interested in lots"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":717.54,"endTime":721.62,"body":"of things. That has probably"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":721.62,"endTime":724.89,"body":"always been quite a challenge to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":721.62,"endTime":724.89,"body":"know what to know what to focus"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":724.89,"endTime":729.87,"body":"on. I think you know, at first I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":724.89,"endTime":729.87,"body":"I was quite tempted to go down"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":729.96,"endTime":734.22,"body":"an academic route. My degree at"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":729.96,"endTime":734.22,"body":"Cambridge was was three years"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":734.22,"endTime":738.87,"body":"studying music and and then I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":734.22,"endTime":738.87,"body":"decided to stay on and do an"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":738.87,"endTime":743.37,"body":"MPhil at Cambridge as well in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":738.87,"endTime":743.37,"body":"musicology, where I specialised"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":743.37,"endTime":749.61,"body":"in Sebelius, sort of Nordic"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":743.37,"endTime":749.61,"body":"time, parents, which is another"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":749.61,"endTime":754.44,"body":"wild another life. But I think"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":749.61,"endTime":754.44,"body":"by the end of that I again, I've"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":754.5,"endTime":760.74,"body":"had almost exhausted myself with"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":754.5,"endTime":760.74,"body":"with that sort of intense study."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":760.92,"endTime":764.7,"body":"And the thing that I felt very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":760.92,"endTime":764.7,"body":"strongly at that point was that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":764.7,"endTime":769.02,"body":"I really wanted to do something"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":764.7,"endTime":769.02,"body":"back in the real world, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":769.02,"endTime":772.62,"body":"something that had sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":769.02,"endTime":772.62,"body":"meaning in the real world to me."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":772.86,"endTime":779.22,"body":"And so, in a strange sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":772.86,"endTime":779.22,"body":"twist again, I applied to the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":779.22,"endTime":784.35,"body":"civil service and payment policy"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":779.22,"endTime":784.35,"body":"advisor, working for central"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":784.35,"endTime":788.37,"body":"government department, and I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":784.35,"endTime":788.37,"body":"still work there today."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":790.74,"endTime":795.12,"body":"How does one become a policy"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":790.74,"endTime":795.12,"body":"advisor? What is a policy"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":795.12,"endTime":795.96,"body":"advisor?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":797.43,"endTime":803.07,"body":"Ricky Well, it's a really"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":797.43,"endTime":803.07,"body":"fascinating job. It's No, it's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":803.07,"endTime":807.93,"body":"great. Well, I mean, it's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":803.07,"endTime":807.93,"body":"essentially, my job was very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":807.93,"endTime":811.74,"body":"much advising, you know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":807.93,"endTime":811.74,"body":"providing advice for ministers"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":811.77,"endTime":815.55,"body":"on all sorts of current issues,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":811.77,"endTime":815.55,"body":"I've worked across a whole"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":815.55,"endTime":820.56,"body":"breadth of economic issues,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":815.55,"endTime":820.56,"body":"public spending issues, which"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":820.56,"endTime":825.48,"body":"has been incredibly fascinating."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":820.56,"endTime":825.48,"body":"You know, it's something that I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":825.48,"endTime":829.17,"body":"feel incredibly privileged to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":825.48,"endTime":829.17,"body":"have done, because I've seen,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":829.17,"endTime":832.86,"body":"you know, lots of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":829.17,"endTime":832.86,"body":"administrations come and go. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":834.06,"endTime":839.46,"body":"it is a very interesting role."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":834.06,"endTime":839.46,"body":"When I sort of reduced my hours"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":839.46,"endTime":844.89,"body":"to sort of accommodate children"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":839.46,"endTime":844.89,"body":"and then later art, I now work"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":844.92,"endTime":847.86,"body":"in much more of a sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":844.92,"endTime":847.86,"body":"training, capacity and sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":847.89,"endTime":852.06,"body":"professionalism capacity, which"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":847.89,"endTime":852.06,"body":"is very enjoyable."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":853.11,"endTime":859.11,"body":"Yeah, I'm assuming that that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":853.11,"endTime":859.11,"body":"kind of role takes up a lot of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":859.11,"endTime":865.41,"body":"your brain space, as well as"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":859.11,"endTime":865.41,"body":"time and energy and you've"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":865.41,"endTime":870.09,"body":"mentioned family briefly there"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":865.41,"endTime":870.09,"body":"as well. So this point then may"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":870.09,"endTime":873.93,"body":"be paintbrushes and musical"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":870.09,"endTime":873.93,"body":"instruments aren't don't get a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":873.93,"endTime":874.65,"body":"look in?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":875.01,"endTime":879.81,"body":"No, definitely not. It was very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":875.01,"endTime":879.81,"body":"all consuming my job. You know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":879.81,"endTime":885.03,"body":"I was working full time"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":879.81,"endTime":885.03,"body":"sometimes on high profile issues"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":885.03,"endTime":890.28,"body":"that naturally are incredibly"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":885.03,"endTime":890.28,"body":"fast paced. So no art didn't"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":890.28,"endTime":893.28,"body":"feature really at all. There"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":890.28,"endTime":893.28,"body":"were there were a few little"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":893.64,"endTime":899.04,"body":"times that it did come back. I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":893.64,"endTime":899.04,"body":"went on a two week course Slade"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":899.31,"endTime":903.72,"body":"School of Art. I got in my late"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":899.31,"endTime":903.72,"body":"20s. So that's probably 10 years"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":903.72,"endTime":907.95,"body":"after I'd really stopped and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":903.72,"endTime":907.95,"body":"wound down doing art in any sort"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":907.95,"endTime":912.39,"body":"of regular capacity. And it was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":907.95,"endTime":912.39,"body":"a life painting course again,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":912.42,"endTime":916.53,"body":"and it was a wonderful"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":912.42,"endTime":916.53,"body":"experience. It was, it was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":916.53,"endTime":921.18,"body":"absolutely fantastic. Being back"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":916.53,"endTime":921.18,"body":"with other creative people,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":921.18,"endTime":927.45,"body":"other artists was a really"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":921.18,"endTime":927.45,"body":"energising experience and a very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":927.45,"endTime":932.55,"body":"short experience, but actually,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":927.45,"endTime":932.55,"body":"the, the sort of experience of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":932.55,"endTime":940.74,"body":"that, I think percolated away in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":932.55,"endTime":940.74,"body":"my brain for another sort of 510"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":940.74,"endTime":946.35,"body":"years before it all popped out"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":940.74,"endTime":946.35,"body":"in the form of oil painting. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":946.35,"endTime":951.66,"body":"there wasn't time ready for for"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":946.35,"endTime":951.66,"body":"March. But the odd the odd chink"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":951.75,"endTime":956.4,"body":"of art, just to just to sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":951.75,"endTime":956.4,"body":"keep that thread"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":956.61,"endTime":961.65,"body":"going. Yeah. But now it's a it's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":956.61,"endTime":961.65,"body":"a very big part of your life. So"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":961.68,"endTime":965.25,"body":"how has that change come about?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":961.68,"endTime":965.25,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":965.58,"endTime":968.94,"body":"I mean, that's right. It is a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":965.58,"endTime":968.94,"body":"huge part. It's the is the main"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":968.94,"endTime":972.39,"body":"part, I would say. Now,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":968.94,"endTime":972.39,"body":"certainly, if my my working"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":972.39,"endTime":979.05,"body":"life, how did it come about?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":972.39,"endTime":979.05,"body":"Well, this is a long and drawn"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":979.05,"endTime":987.51,"body":"out tale. Well, when I when I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":979.05,"endTime":987.51,"body":"had children, even though"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":987.54,"endTime":990.93,"body":"obviously, I was extremely busy"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":987.54,"endTime":990.93,"body":"looking after a baby at home, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":990.93,"endTime":996.12,"body":"was at home for a year of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":990.93,"endTime":996.12,"body":"maternity leave. And I think it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":996.12,"endTime":1000.8,"body":"was just having a bit more time"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":996.12,"endTime":1000.8,"body":"at home. And I started to just"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1000.8,"endTime":1002.78,"body":"dabble a bit more. And I think,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1000.8,"endTime":1002.78,"body":"you know, the memory of the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1002.78,"endTime":1006.89,"body":"course I'd done was still"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1002.78,"endTime":1006.89,"body":"running around in my head. And I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1006.89,"endTime":1011.36,"body":"thought, well, you know, I do, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1006.89,"endTime":1011.36,"body":"do miss doing that. So I did"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1011.36,"endTime":1016.22,"body":"start to dabble. And I did a few"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1011.36,"endTime":1016.22,"body":"little paintings. And I put some"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1016.22,"endTime":1019.31,"body":"of them on Facebook just for my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1016.22,"endTime":1019.31,"body":"friends to have a look. And they"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1019.31,"endTime":1025.13,"body":"were all very nice as you know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1019.31,"endTime":1025.13,"body":"friends would be. And my husband"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1025.16,"endTime":1029.57,"body":"who is, you know, my biggest"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1025.16,"endTime":1029.57,"body":"supporter, I have to say, he was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1029.57,"endTime":1032.63,"body":"encouraging me, come on, you got"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1029.57,"endTime":1032.63,"body":"to do more of this, because"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1033.2,"endTime":1036.29,"body":"you're really talented. And I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1033.2,"endTime":1036.29,"body":"was like, oh, yeah, but I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1036.29,"endTime":1040.73,"body":"haven't got any time, etc. All"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1036.29,"endTime":1040.73,"body":"of that. But I think you know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1040.73,"endTime":1044.84,"body":"getting a bit of feedback from"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1040.73,"endTime":1044.84,"body":"people on my artwork on on"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1044.84,"endTime":1049.34,"body":"social media reads beasted me."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1044.84,"endTime":1049.34,"body":"So I sort of started doing it a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1049.34,"endTime":1053.06,"body":"little bit more often. And as I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1049.34,"endTime":1053.06,"body":"said, I I think I sort of signed"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1053.06,"endTime":1057.02,"body":"up to some life drawing classes."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1053.06,"endTime":1057.02,"body":"And that was, again, wonderful"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1057.02,"endTime":1062.51,"body":"experience felt totally at home,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1057.02,"endTime":1062.51,"body":"I realised I really missed"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1062.93,"endTime":1068.0,"body":"drawing and painting. And then I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1062.93,"endTime":1068.0,"body":"happen to do a little portrait"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1068.06,"endTime":1074.18,"body":"of my son and put that on"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1068.06,"endTime":1074.18,"body":"Facebook. And one of my friends"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1074.48,"endTime":1077.87,"body":"got in touch and said, Oh, you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1074.48,"endTime":1077.87,"body":"know, I love that. I'd love you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1077.87,"endTime":1082.67,"body":"to do a commission of my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1077.87,"endTime":1082.67,"body":"daughter. And that was the first"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1082.67,"endTime":1085.88,"body":"commission that I got. And that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1082.67,"endTime":1085.88,"body":"was very exciting. You know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1085.88,"endTime":1089.54,"body":"somebody's paying me to do"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1085.88,"endTime":1089.54,"body":"something that I absolutely"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1089.54,"endTime":1094.64,"body":"loved. Yeah. And that was, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1089.54,"endTime":1094.64,"body":"guess, the beginning of it. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1094.64,"endTime":1099.71,"body":"really, since that point, which"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1094.64,"endTime":1099.71,"body":"was about nine years ago, and it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1099.71,"endTime":1103.16,"body":"was a watercolour. Since that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1099.71,"endTime":1103.16,"body":"point, I've never been without a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1103.16,"endTime":1108.59,"body":"commission on the go. So it sort"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1103.16,"endTime":1108.59,"body":"of snowballed. And by this"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1108.59,"endTime":1112.76,"body":"point, I had gone back to work,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1108.59,"endTime":1112.76,"body":"but I was working three days a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1112.76,"endTime":1119.3,"body":"week. But obviously, my second"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1112.76,"endTime":1119.3,"body":"son came along, and I think I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1119.3,"endTime":1124.82,"body":"just had one day where he was in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1119.3,"endTime":1124.82,"body":"nursery, and I wasn't at work."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1125.12,"endTime":1128.63,"body":"And so that was what it was the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1125.12,"endTime":1128.63,"body":"one day that I could focus on"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1128.63,"endTime":1133.67,"body":"painting. So that's what what I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1128.63,"endTime":1133.67,"body":"did. And then when the youngest"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1133.67,"endTime":1138.02,"body":"child went to school, suddenly"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1133.67,"endTime":1138.02,"body":"it freed up the school day. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1138.05,"endTime":1141.41,"body":"at that point I've been doing"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1138.05,"endTime":1141.41,"body":"commissions for for a number of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1141.41,"endTime":1146.81,"body":"years. But something in me"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1141.41,"endTime":1146.81,"body":"thought I could just keep going"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1146.81,"endTime":1151.55,"body":"and doing these watercolour"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1146.81,"endTime":1151.55,"body":"portraits endlessly. But I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1151.55,"endTime":1154.16,"body":"really want to sort of push"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1151.55,"endTime":1154.16,"body":"myself at this point. And I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1154.16,"endTime":1160.19,"body":"really want to get back to how I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1154.16,"endTime":1160.19,"body":"felt as a teenager, when I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1160.58,"endTime":1166.58,"body":"really exploring who I was as an"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1160.58,"endTime":1166.58,"body":"artist, and I wanted to develop"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1166.58,"endTime":1171.14,"body":"my own work and see see where"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1166.58,"endTime":1171.14,"body":"that would take me. So I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1171.14,"endTime":1176.27,"body":"very, very fortunate, because my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1171.14,"endTime":1176.27,"body":"employer was happy to sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1176.27,"endTime":1182.39,"body":"let me reduce my working day to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1176.27,"endTime":1182.39,"body":"two days. And, you know, family"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1182.39,"endTime":1185.66,"body":"wise, my husband, you know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1182.39,"endTime":1185.66,"body":"there's obviously a pay cut"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1185.66,"endTime":1189.95,"body":"doing that. So taking a bit of a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1185.66,"endTime":1189.95,"body":"risk. I was very lucky to be"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1189.95,"endTime":1193.94,"body":"able to do that fully appreciate"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1189.95,"endTime":1193.94,"body":"that, that not everyone is in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1193.94,"endTime":1199.67,"body":"that position. And so suddenly I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1193.94,"endTime":1199.67,"body":"had three days a week where I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1199.67,"endTime":1204.65,"body":"could ain't in the school hours."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1199.67,"endTime":1204.65,"body":"And that is where sort of things"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1204.65,"endTime":1209.72,"body":"started to change for me. And I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1204.65,"endTime":1209.72,"body":"thought, right. I love"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1209.72,"endTime":1215.24,"body":"watercolours. But it's not where"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1209.72,"endTime":1215.24,"body":"I feel, artistically. That's not"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1215.24,"endTime":1222.56,"body":"where I feel quite at home. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1215.24,"endTime":1222.56,"body":"so I got my oil paints out. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1222.59,"endTime":1227.3,"body":"I hadn't painted with oils since"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1222.59,"endTime":1227.3,"body":"I was a student. But it felt"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1227.3,"endTime":1231.02,"body":"right, like a sense of cliche to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1227.3,"endTime":1231.02,"body":"say it felt like coming home."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1231.11,"endTime":1237.77,"body":"And I was interested in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1231.11,"endTime":1237.77,"body":"portraits. And the first"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1238.85,"endTime":1243.23,"body":"portraits I, I did actually were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1238.85,"endTime":1243.23,"body":"were both selected for"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1244.01,"endTime":1247.34,"body":"prestigious competitions. At"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1244.01,"endTime":1247.34,"body":"that point, I think everything"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1247.34,"endTime":1252.02,"body":"started to just come together,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1247.34,"endTime":1252.02,"body":"which was lovely, because these"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1252.02,"endTime":1255.17,"body":"paintings were very different"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1252.02,"endTime":1255.17,"body":"from the ones I've been dabbling"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1255.17,"endTime":1259.4,"body":"with. And they were an"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1255.17,"endTime":1259.4,"body":"expression of me as an artist."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1260.3,"endTime":1265.13,"body":"And so to have those paintings"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1260.3,"endTime":1265.13,"body":"recognised, was a really amazing"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1265.13,"endTime":1265.76,"body":"moment."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1266.27,"endTime":1269.87,"body":"Almost, you've had two rebirths"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1266.27,"endTime":1269.87,"body":"there, and two points at which"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1269.87,"endTime":1275.84,"body":"to be brave, in order to show"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1269.87,"endTime":1275.84,"body":"your work. I talk a lot with my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1275.84,"endTime":1281.93,"body":"guests about that point of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1275.84,"endTime":1281.93,"body":"showing the work. And as you've"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1281.93,"endTime":1284.15,"body":"already said, with that, with"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1281.93,"endTime":1284.15,"body":"the oil paints, you're starting"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1284.15,"endTime":1287.42,"body":"to do stuff that is more"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1284.15,"endTime":1287.42,"body":"personal, and therefore,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1287.54,"endTime":1292.13,"body":"possibly, you need even more"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1287.54,"endTime":1292.13,"body":"courage to show it but you did"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1292.13,"endTime":1295.76,"body":"show it how did that feel?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1292.13,"endTime":1295.76,"body":"Because I'm assuming that what"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1295.76,"endTime":1298.85,"body":"that work was more personal to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1295.76,"endTime":1298.85,"body":"you. So perhaps had more"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1298.85,"endTime":1301.46,"body":"meaning? Is that how you felt?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1301.49,"endTime":1308.51,"body":"Definitely definitely, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1301.49,"endTime":1308.51,"body":"remember feeling very nervous. I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1308.51,"endTime":1311.15,"body":"think particularly sometimes"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1308.51,"endTime":1311.15,"body":"when you're in a slightly sort"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1311.15,"endTime":1315.62,"body":"of commercial situation where"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1311.15,"endTime":1315.62,"body":"you've got Commission's that are"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1316.52,"endTime":1321.77,"body":"popular, or selling, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1316.52,"endTime":1321.77,"body":"completely understandable to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1321.77,"endTime":1324.98,"body":"then think, well, I'm gonna keep"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1321.77,"endTime":1324.98,"body":"doing that same thing, because"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1324.98,"endTime":1330.29,"body":"that is what people what people"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1324.98,"endTime":1330.29,"body":"want, you know, what the people"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1330.29,"endTime":1334.82,"body":"commissioning me want. And say"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1330.29,"endTime":1334.82,"body":"there was a sort of commercial"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1335.09,"endTime":1338.48,"body":"nervousness about it, not that I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1335.09,"endTime":1338.48,"body":"was in any way making a lot of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1338.48,"endTime":1342.23,"body":"money if they will, quite small"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1338.48,"endTime":1342.23,"body":"scale. But there was a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1342.23,"endTime":1346.16,"body":"nervousness that, you know, the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1342.23,"endTime":1346.16,"body":"people who really liked my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1346.4,"endTime":1350.54,"body":"previous work, what were they"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1346.4,"endTime":1350.54,"body":"going to think, oh, suddenly,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1350.54,"endTime":1356.36,"body":"this is transformed in, in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1350.54,"endTime":1356.36,"body":"style. But it was, it was just a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1356.36,"endTime":1362.93,"body":"very strong instinctive pool, to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1356.36,"endTime":1362.93,"body":"be myself as an artist and to to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1363.08,"endTime":1368.27,"body":"paint as as I wanted to paint."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1363.08,"endTime":1368.27,"body":"That was an incredibly strong"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1368.36,"endTime":1373.82,"body":"feeling. I have only recently"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1368.36,"endTime":1373.82,"body":"joined Instagram, I think I had"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1373.82,"endTime":1378.17,"body":"pasted a few of my watercolour"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1373.82,"endTime":1378.17,"body":"portraits, which, you know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1378.2,"endTime":1382.13,"body":"don't get me wrong. I absolutely"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1378.2,"endTime":1382.13,"body":"loved doing them. I'm still"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1382.13,"endTime":1388.37,"body":"proud of them. But I remember"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1382.13,"endTime":1388.37,"body":"holding off a long time posting"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1388.37,"endTime":1392.96,"body":"my new work, because it was so"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1388.37,"endTime":1392.96,"body":"different. And I thought it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1392.96,"endTime":1397.28,"body":"would confuse people. Obviously,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1392.96,"endTime":1397.28,"body":"the Commission's I've been doing"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1397.28,"endTime":1403.49,"body":"have been other people dictated"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1397.28,"endTime":1403.49,"body":"by what, what they wanted. And I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1403.49,"endTime":1408.08,"body":"think the very, very strong"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1403.49,"endTime":1408.08,"body":"elements in my work is that my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1408.08,"endTime":1412.43,"body":"work is, as I'm sure is with"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1408.08,"endTime":1412.43,"body":"most artists, that is a very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1412.43,"endTime":1419.0,"body":"personal, emotionally intimate"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1412.43,"endTime":1419.0,"body":"thing, painting portraits,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1419.0,"endTime":1422.81,"body":"particularly self portraiture,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1419.0,"endTime":1422.81,"body":"but also, I focused, you know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1422.81,"endTime":1426.32,"body":"in those early paintings on"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1422.81,"endTime":1426.32,"body":"portraits of my close family,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1426.95,"endTime":1431.75,"body":"self portraits, and they're"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1426.95,"endTime":1431.75,"body":"incredibly personal, and they"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1431.9,"endTime":1437.48,"body":"chart I'm actually getting quite"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1431.9,"endTime":1437.48,"body":"emotional talking about it. But"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1440.0,"endTime":1444.89,"body":"yeah, they have a lot of meaning"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1440.0,"endTime":1444.89,"body":"for me. And I think putting that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1444.89,"endTime":1448.67,"body":"out there is an incredibly"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1444.89,"endTime":1448.67,"body":"exposing experience because all"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1448.67,"endTime":1452.9,"body":"of a sudden, there's nothing to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1448.67,"endTime":1452.9,"body":"hide behind. This is me as an"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1452.9,"endTime":1458.3,"body":"artist, and I'm showing you my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1452.9,"endTime":1458.3,"body":"innermost sort of feelings"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1458.3,"endTime":1464.93,"body":"through through paint. And it's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1458.3,"endTime":1464.93,"body":"a very strange but exciting and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1464.93,"endTime":1466.28,"body":"scary experience."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1467.36,"endTime":1468.08,"body":"Thank you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1473.27,"endTime":1478.91,"body":"that's, that's lovely and to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1473.27,"endTime":1478.91,"body":"hear that not only in your"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1478.91,"endTime":1484.67,"body":"words, but in your voice that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1478.91,"endTime":1484.67,"body":"definitely comes across."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1485.78,"endTime":1490.31,"body":"Creativity. found.co.uk is the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1485.78,"endTime":1490.31,"body":"place to go to find workshops,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1490.31,"endTime":1494.24,"body":"courses, supplies, kits and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1490.31,"endTime":1494.24,"body":"books to help you get creative."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1495.14,"endTime":1498.41,"body":"So if you're looking for your"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1495.14,"endTime":1498.41,"body":"own creativity found experience,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1498.77,"endTime":1503.03,"body":"go have a browse just See what's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1498.77,"endTime":1503.03,"body":"on offer so far. And if you can"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1503.03,"endTime":1506.48,"body":"help adults to find their new"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1503.03,"endTime":1506.48,"body":"creative passion, please get in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1506.48,"endTime":1509.72,"body":"touch on social media, or"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1506.48,"endTime":1509.72,"body":"through the contact details on"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1509.72,"endTime":1517.46,"body":"the website. So let's move on to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1509.72,"endTime":1517.46,"body":"how you enter two competitions"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1517.49,"endTime":1518.51,"body":"at the same time."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1520.82,"endTime":1528.83,"body":"Yes, demonstrating my complete"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1520.82,"endTime":1528.83,"body":"lack of mouse, in this new world"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1528.83,"endTime":1534.47,"body":"of cinema, portray competitions."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1528.83,"endTime":1534.47,"body":"So the very first oil portrait"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1534.47,"endTime":1541.46,"body":"that I did was, as me as an"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1534.47,"endTime":1541.46,"body":"artist, I entered. I entered it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1541.46,"endTime":1546.02,"body":"into two competitions,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1541.46,"endTime":1546.02,"body":"thoroughly expecting to get to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1546.05,"endTime":1551.66,"body":"nose, I really had no"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1546.05,"endTime":1551.66,"body":"expectation whatsoever. So I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1551.66,"endTime":1555.35,"body":"entered it into the sky portrait"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1551.66,"endTime":1555.35,"body":"artist of the year competition"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1555.35,"endTime":1558.98,"body":"where you have to submit self"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1555.35,"endTime":1558.98,"body":"portraits. And I also submitted"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1558.98,"endTime":1561.98,"body":"it to the Royal Society of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1558.98,"endTime":1561.98,"body":"portrait painters, which is a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1561.98,"endTime":1567.29,"body":"really prestigious competition."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1561.98,"endTime":1567.29,"body":"Looking back, I think, cool I, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1567.29,"endTime":1572.93,"body":"sort of aim to begin with, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1567.29,"endTime":1572.93,"body":"didn't start with something"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1572.93,"endTime":1579.2,"body":"slightly easier, but and then to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1572.93,"endTime":1579.2,"body":"my shock, I was accepted into"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1579.2,"endTime":1582.71,"body":"both those competitions on the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1579.2,"endTime":1582.71,"body":"basis of that first oil"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1582.71,"endTime":1586.94,"body":"portrait, which I honestly"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1582.71,"endTime":1586.94,"body":"couldn't believe that was in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1586.97,"endTime":1594.5,"body":"2019, I think. And as I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1586.97,"endTime":1594.5,"body":"saying, I was totally new to all"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1594.5,"endTime":1601.37,"body":"this sort of competition stuff,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1594.5,"endTime":1601.37,"body":"and made the first cardinal sin"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1601.55,"endTime":1606.35,"body":"or big mistake, which is that I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1601.55,"endTime":1606.35,"body":"couldn't be in both competitions"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1606.35,"endTime":1610.25,"body":"at the same time, because the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1606.35,"endTime":1610.25,"body":"painting needed to be available."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1610.52,"endTime":1614.63,"body":"So unfortunately, well,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1610.52,"endTime":1614.63,"body":"unfortunately, it was very, it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1614.63,"endTime":1619.85,"body":"was a bittersweet situation, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1614.63,"endTime":1619.85,"body":"had to decline the place on Sky"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1619.85,"endTime":1624.2,"body":"portrait Artists of the Year in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1619.85,"endTime":1624.2,"body":"2019. Because my painting was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1624.2,"endTime":1628.13,"body":"already wrapped up in the metal"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1624.2,"endTime":1628.13,"body":"galleries in London, ready to be"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1628.22,"endTime":1633.5,"body":"exhibited with the Royal Society"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1628.22,"endTime":1633.5,"body":"of portrait painters. And so I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1633.5,"endTime":1641.0,"body":"learned from that. New artists"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1633.5,"endTime":1641.0,"body":"take note, yeah, bittersweet."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1641.03,"endTime":1645.5,"body":"But the upshot was that it led"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1641.03,"endTime":1645.5,"body":"to my portrait being exhibited"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1645.59,"endTime":1648.71,"body":"at the male galleries alongside"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1645.59,"endTime":1648.71,"body":"some of the best portrait"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1648.74,"endTime":1652.28,"body":"artists in the country. And, you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1648.74,"endTime":1652.28,"body":"know, beyond it's an"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1652.28,"endTime":1655.91,"body":"international competition. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1652.28,"endTime":1655.91,"body":"you know, there are 1000s of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1655.91,"endTime":1661.1,"body":"entries and say, to get a place"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1655.91,"endTime":1661.1,"body":"on that wall, just blew my mind."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1661.13,"endTime":1665.99,"body":"It was a it was an incredible"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1661.13,"endTime":1665.99,"body":"surprise and shock. It was a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1665.99,"endTime":1669.65,"body":"massive turning point for me,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1665.99,"endTime":1669.65,"body":"where I just, you know, having"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1669.65,"endTime":1674.15,"body":"worked in isolation, but through"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1669.65,"endTime":1674.15,"body":"all those years of doing those"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1674.15,"endTime":1679.67,"body":"commissions, but also, in that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1674.15,"endTime":1679.67,"body":"early time of developing my own"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1680.54,"endTime":1686.42,"body":"approach to portraiture, to have"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1680.54,"endTime":1686.42,"body":"that sort of first external"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1686.42,"endTime":1691.1,"body":"recognition and validation was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1686.42,"endTime":1691.1,"body":"amazing. And it's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1691.1,"endTime":1693.71,"body":"a big one as well. It's a big"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1691.1,"endTime":1693.71,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1695.0,"endTime":1700.04,"body":"I don't I don't think I realised"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1695.0,"endTime":1700.04,"body":"properly, probably, until"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1700.04,"endTime":1706.13,"body":"probably years later. How big"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1700.04,"endTime":1706.13,"body":"that was, for me at the time is"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1706.13,"endTime":1709.82,"body":"an incredible, an incredible"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1706.13,"endTime":1709.82,"body":"thing to get that kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1710.24,"endTime":1710.99,"body":"recognition."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1712.67,"endTime":1720.92,"body":"Yeah, I can imagine. I can only"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1712.67,"endTime":1720.92,"body":"imagine. Sally had to decline"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1720.92,"endTime":1724.19,"body":"her well earned place in skies,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1720.92,"endTime":1724.19,"body":"portrait Artists of the Year"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1724.19,"endTime":1730.01,"body":"competition in 2019. But in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1724.19,"endTime":1730.01,"body":"2020, she entered again, and to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1730.01,"endTime":1734.03,"body":"her utter surprise, made it all"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1730.01,"endTime":1734.03,"body":"the way to the final. I talked"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1734.03,"endTime":1737.0,"body":"with Sally about her time on the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1734.03,"endTime":1737.0,"body":"show in the next episode of the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1737.0,"endTime":1744.53,"body":"podcast. So for now, let's get"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1737.0,"endTime":1744.53,"body":"back to our chat. What does life"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1744.56,"endTime":1750.83,"body":"look like now, you've said you,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1744.56,"endTime":1750.83,"body":"you do still work in the day"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1750.83,"endTime":1756.11,"body":"job, so to speak, and you have"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1750.83,"endTime":1756.11,"body":"the family and you've made a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1756.11,"endTime":1759.95,"body":"name for yourself in the art"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1756.11,"endTime":1759.95,"body":"that you want to do? How is that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1759.95,"endTime":1761.81,"body":"balanced in your life now?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1762.83,"endTime":1767.51,"body":"Well, it's incredibly busy. I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1762.83,"endTime":1767.51,"body":"think that's how I would sum it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1767.51,"endTime":1772.76,"body":"up. I mean, I do work pretty"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1767.51,"endTime":1772.76,"body":"much all the time. And obviously"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1772.76,"endTime":1778.28,"body":"spend time with the children as"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1772.76,"endTime":1778.28,"body":"well. So life life is is very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1778.28,"endTime":1783.68,"body":"full, but it's very good. As I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1778.28,"endTime":1783.68,"body":"said, I work two days a week as"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1783.68,"endTime":1788.75,"body":"a civil servant, which I really"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1783.68,"endTime":1788.75,"body":"enjoy the difference that that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1788.75,"endTime":1793.79,"body":"brings, and the the mental sort"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1788.75,"endTime":1793.79,"body":"of challenges there. You know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1793.79,"endTime":1798.62,"body":"having a set of colleagues is"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1793.79,"endTime":1798.62,"body":"nice, and then I have a sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1798.86,"endTime":1806.03,"body":"more solitary Life at the other"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1798.86,"endTime":1806.03,"body":"end of the week, which is just"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1806.03,"endTime":1809.39,"body":"full to the brim, really, the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1806.03,"endTime":1809.39,"body":"challenge is, is actually to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1809.39,"endTime":1813.35,"body":"paint. I know that sounds odd."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1809.39,"endTime":1813.35,"body":"But that's the constant"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1813.35,"endTime":1817.7,"body":"challenge is to make sure that I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1813.35,"endTime":1817.7,"body":"am actually, you know, not swept"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1817.7,"endTime":1822.05,"body":"up with lots of other related"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1817.7,"endTime":1822.05,"body":"activities, but that I am"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1822.47,"endTime":1829.97,"body":"painting. So when I get focused"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1822.47,"endTime":1829.97,"body":"and working on a project or a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1829.97,"endTime":1834.11,"body":"commission, so that's, you know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1829.97,"endTime":1834.11,"body":"fantastic and I love, I love"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1834.11,"endTime":1840.23,"body":"doing that. I do lots of other"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1834.11,"endTime":1840.23,"body":"things I've been writing this"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1840.23,"endTime":1843.83,"body":"year for a national arts"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1840.23,"endTime":1843.83,"body":"magazine called the artist,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1844.19,"endTime":1847.28,"body":"which has been really enjoyable"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1844.19,"endTime":1847.28,"body":"and perhaps has brought"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1847.28,"endTime":1850.91,"body":"together, you know, I used to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1847.28,"endTime":1850.91,"body":"like writing very much when I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1850.91,"endTime":1854.6,"body":"was going down the sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1850.91,"endTime":1854.6,"body":"academic route. And it's brought"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1854.6,"endTime":1860.63,"body":"that together with thinking"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1854.6,"endTime":1860.63,"body":"about my art process, and you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1860.63,"endTime":1865.28,"body":"know, how I paint. So that's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1860.63,"endTime":1865.28,"body":"been incredibly enjoyable. So,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1866.15,"endTime":1870.68,"body":"yeah, life is incredibly busy."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1866.15,"endTime":1870.68,"body":"And it does make it vulnerable"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1870.8,"endTime":1876.83,"body":"to any sort of external shocks,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1870.8,"endTime":1876.83,"body":"you know, that are part of life."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1876.92,"endTime":1881.24,"body":"And it can get quite stressful"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1876.92,"endTime":1881.24,"body":"at times when that happens."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1881.87,"endTime":1885.86,"body":"Because the balance is very, it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1881.87,"endTime":1885.86,"body":"is very finely balanced. And I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1885.86,"endTime":1889.58,"body":"don't have much wiggle room,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1885.86,"endTime":1889.58,"body":"doing these two very different"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1889.58,"endTime":1894.71,"body":"things, is incredibly"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1889.58,"endTime":1894.71,"body":"fulfilling, actually. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1895.97,"endTime":1900.56,"body":"hopefully, I might be able to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1895.97,"endTime":1900.56,"body":"dispel a few myths that in order"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1900.56,"endTime":1906.38,"body":"to be an artist, you have to be"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1900.56,"endTime":1906.38,"body":"doing it full time, I think lots"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1906.38,"endTime":1911.84,"body":"of artists do you have to work"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1906.38,"endTime":1911.84,"body":"in order to pay the bills. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1911.87,"endTime":1914.96,"body":"that doesn't diminish who you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1911.87,"endTime":1914.96,"body":"are as an artist. And it doesn't"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1914.96,"endTime":1919.67,"body":"mean that you're less committed."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1914.96,"endTime":1919.67,"body":"Both these jobs or careers, to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1919.67,"endTime":1923.57,"body":"me, are important, though,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1919.67,"endTime":1923.57,"body":"hopefully, I can keep that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1923.57,"endTime":1924.35,"body":"balance going."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1925.28,"endTime":1928.88,"body":"Yeah, I appreciate that. And I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1925.28,"endTime":1928.88,"body":"think that's a very helpful"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1928.88,"endTime":1934.55,"body":"thing for you to have said, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1928.88,"endTime":1934.55,"body":"for other people, to hear other"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1934.55,"endTime":1940.94,"body":"people who are balancing their"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1934.55,"endTime":1940.94,"body":"creative passion with getting on"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1940.94,"endTime":1945.86,"body":"with life, and everything else"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1940.94,"endTime":1945.86,"body":"that has to support it. It's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1945.86,"endTime":1950.96,"body":"very rare that even if you're"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1945.86,"endTime":1950.96,"body":"starting a business around your"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1950.96,"endTime":1954.71,"body":"creative passion, you're"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1950.96,"endTime":1954.71,"body":"spending a lot of time not doing"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1954.71,"endTime":1957.77,"body":"the creative thing, which is"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1954.71,"endTime":1957.77,"body":"something that we've talked"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1957.77,"endTime":1962.18,"body":"about a lot with my guests,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1957.77,"endTime":1962.18,"body":"there's always there's always an"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1962.21,"endTime":1965.66,"body":"imbalance, this, I don't think"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1962.21,"endTime":1965.66,"body":"anybody ever gets the perfect"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1965.66,"endTime":1971.39,"body":"balance. But that is good for"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1965.66,"endTime":1971.39,"body":"listeners to hear as well that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1971.42,"endTime":1977.27,"body":"nobody gets the perfect balance."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1971.42,"endTime":1977.27,"body":"Thank you very much for sharing"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1977.27,"endTime":1977.66,"body":"that."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1979.01,"endTime":1982.43,"body":"But definitely, I don't I don't"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1979.01,"endTime":1982.43,"body":"I definitely don't want anyone"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1982.43,"endTime":1985.88,"body":"to think that I have the perfect"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1982.43,"endTime":1985.88,"body":"balance because, you know, it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1985.88,"endTime":1989.72,"body":"comes and goes and there are ups"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1985.88,"endTime":1989.72,"body":"and downs with it. And sometimes"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1989.72,"endTime":1993.47,"body":"it doesn't work very well. It's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1989.72,"endTime":1993.47,"body":"a bit sort of rough with this"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1993.47,"endTime":1994.31,"body":"means really."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1994.43,"endTime":2000.13,"body":"So do you ever have frustrations"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1994.43,"endTime":2000.13,"body":"in the actual process of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2000.16,"endTime":2006.07,"body":"painting, for example, doing a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2000.16,"endTime":2006.07,"body":"commission? And you therefore"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2006.07,"endTime":2008.5,"body":"are working to a brief? Are"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2006.07,"endTime":2008.5,"body":"there ever times where you're"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2008.5,"endTime":2012.58,"body":"like this just isn't working?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2008.5,"endTime":2012.58,"body":"And at times you get frustrated"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2012.58,"endTime":2014.62,"body":"with the actual painting?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2014.98,"endTime":2020.17,"body":"Oh, yeah. Painting is a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2014.98,"endTime":2020.17,"body":"thoroughly torturous activity."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2021.94,"endTime":2027.46,"body":"Oh, yeah. Well, I get completely"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2021.94,"endTime":2027.46,"body":"frustrated endlessly, but I'm, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2027.46,"endTime":2031.48,"body":"think that that's probably what"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2027.46,"endTime":2031.48,"body":"spurs me on. I wouldn't want"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2031.48,"endTime":2034.0,"body":"anyone to think that sort of,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2031.48,"endTime":2034.0,"body":"you know, sit down to paint and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2034.0,"endTime":2037.6,"body":"it all sort of flows out of my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2034.0,"endTime":2037.6,"body":"paint brush, and I happily put"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2037.6,"endTime":2041.71,"body":"it on the wall. And that's it."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2037.6,"endTime":2041.71,"body":"No, not at all. I struggle with"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2041.71,"endTime":2047.14,"body":"every single painting I do. Some"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2041.71,"endTime":2047.14,"body":"more than others. I do remember"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2047.14,"endTime":2051.13,"body":"that when I did the second self"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2047.14,"endTime":2051.13,"body":"portrait for the sky programme."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2051.31,"endTime":2059.23,"body":"That was a hideous X. It nearly"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2051.31,"endTime":2059.23,"body":"ended up in the bin many times"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2059.26,"endTime":2063.91,"body":"you may get so involved in this"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2059.26,"endTime":2063.91,"body":"process, you have some sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2064.45,"endTime":2069.04,"body":"elusive vision in your mind"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2064.45,"endTime":2069.04,"body":"about what you're aiming for."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2069.49,"endTime":2073.66,"body":"And, you know, the frustration"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2069.49,"endTime":2073.66,"body":"of never being able to quite get"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2073.66,"endTime":2078.19,"body":"to that point is I guess what"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2073.66,"endTime":2078.19,"body":"then makes you paint the next."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2080.17,"endTime":2085.09,"body":"So you never you never reached"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2080.17,"endTime":2085.09,"body":"that that point of? Well, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2085.09,"endTime":2087.64,"body":"don't know. I mean, I don't know"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2085.09,"endTime":2087.64,"body":"whether other people do. I'm"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2087.64,"endTime":2092.2,"body":"always there's always something"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2087.64,"endTime":2092.2,"body":"that that niggles or that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2092.2,"endTime":2093.1,"body":"thwarts me."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2094.0,"endTime":2097.81,"body":"And how do you know when you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2094.0,"endTime":2097.81,"body":"finished? How do you know when"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2097.81,"endTime":2098.47,"body":"to stop?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2098.92,"endTime":2106.27,"body":"Lots of people Ask me this, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2098.92,"endTime":2106.27,"body":"think I do know when to stop,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2106.33,"endTime":2110.08,"body":"there is something about I mean"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2106.33,"endTime":2110.08,"body":"painting to me, it's like a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2110.08,"endTime":2115.63,"body":"series of problems that need to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2110.08,"endTime":2115.63,"body":"be resolved. You know, whether"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2115.63,"endTime":2121.72,"body":"that's in terms of the tones,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2115.63,"endTime":2121.72,"body":"the colours, the balance of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2121.72,"endTime":2127.3,"body":"light. And I will think about a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2121.72,"endTime":2127.3,"body":"painting as much as I paint it."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2127.33,"endTime":2133.87,"body":"And so I can be come, as my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2127.33,"endTime":2133.87,"body":"husband will testify, really"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2133.87,"endTime":2143.65,"body":"quite moody. When a painting is"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2133.87,"endTime":2143.65,"body":"going wrong, and my brain will"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2143.65,"endTime":2147.88,"body":"work on it, you know, I'll sleep"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2143.65,"endTime":2147.88,"body":"on it, or leave it for for weeks"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2147.88,"endTime":2154.81,"body":"to say that my subconscious will"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2147.88,"endTime":2154.81,"body":"hopefully work out what needs to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2154.81,"endTime":2158.44,"body":"be resolved in the painting to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2154.81,"endTime":2158.44,"body":"get it to where I want it to be."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2159.13,"endTime":2162.79,"body":"And I often find that I sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2159.13,"endTime":2162.79,"body":"will have an idea in my mind"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2162.79,"endTime":2165.94,"body":"that this process is going to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2162.79,"endTime":2165.94,"body":"take me another six months to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2165.94,"endTime":2170.65,"body":"do. And then I'll sit down,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2165.94,"endTime":2170.65,"body":"having had that space from a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2170.65,"endTime":2175.57,"body":"painting. And I will have a sort"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2170.65,"endTime":2175.57,"body":"of conscious idea of the things"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2175.57,"endTime":2179.92,"body":"that I might want to change, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2175.57,"endTime":2179.92,"body":"D. But I do think there is a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2179.92,"endTime":2187.78,"body":"strange, subconscious thing that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2179.92,"endTime":2187.78,"body":"comes into play, where you sit"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2187.78,"endTime":2193.57,"body":"down, and you do something to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2187.78,"endTime":2193.57,"body":"the painting. And suddenly, it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2193.57,"endTime":2198.49,"body":"has resolved itself to a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2193.57,"endTime":2198.49,"body":"conclusion. And that's how it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2198.49,"endTime":2201.16,"body":"often happens. And so I don't"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2198.49,"endTime":2201.16,"body":"really know that it's coming"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2201.16,"endTime":2207.1,"body":"that point of resignation. But I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2201.16,"endTime":2207.1,"body":"have to have reached that point"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2207.13,"endTime":2211.96,"body":"to then say, right, I'm leaving"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2207.13,"endTime":2211.96,"body":"this alone now. And then it's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2211.96,"endTime":2215.44,"body":"there. And then it's there. But"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2211.96,"endTime":2215.44,"body":"it's not that that means that it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2215.44,"endTime":2221.44,"body":"will be rendered to a polished,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2215.44,"endTime":2221.44,"body":"finish or anything like that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2221.47,"endTime":2225.52,"body":"it's not usually about that is"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2221.47,"endTime":2225.52,"body":"often about, it's often about"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2225.52,"endTime":2230.29,"body":"the expression, and whether the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2225.52,"endTime":2230.29,"body":"painting has captured that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2230.32,"endTime":2235.72,"body":"emotion or that feeling that was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2230.32,"endTime":2235.72,"body":"within me. And it's very, very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2235.72,"endTime":2239.83,"body":"hard to describe that process."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2235.72,"endTime":2239.83,"body":"And I don't really understand it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2239.83,"endTime":2240.73,"body":"myself."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2241.27,"endTime":2246.79,"body":"No, I understand what you mean."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2241.27,"endTime":2246.79,"body":"And I've found it absolutely"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2246.79,"endTime":2249.7,"body":"fascinating. And I could keep"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2246.79,"endTime":2249.7,"body":"grilling you with questions"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2249.7,"endTime":2254.14,"body":"about your process, but I'm not"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2249.7,"endTime":2254.14,"body":"going to, I'm going to say thank"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2254.14,"endTime":2257.5,"body":"you. And I'm going to ask how"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2254.14,"endTime":2257.5,"body":"people can connect with you,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2257.86,"endTime":2262.15,"body":"as well. So the best way to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2257.86,"endTime":2262.15,"body":"connect with me is through"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2262.21,"endTime":2268.81,"body":"Instagram, where my instagram"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2262.21,"endTime":2268.81,"body":"handle is at Sally Ward art. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2268.81,"endTime":2274.75,"body":"I also have a website, the same"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2268.81,"endTime":2274.75,"body":"sort of name, which is www dot"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2274.78,"endTime":2281.35,"body":"Sally Ward, hyphen art.com. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2274.78,"endTime":2281.35,"body":"that's got all my details on and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2281.59,"endTime":2286.18,"body":"all my paintings as well. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2281.59,"endTime":2286.18,"body":"yeah, it'd be great. So people"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2286.18,"endTime":2286.69,"body":"have look"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2287.86,"endTime":2290.65,"body":"brilliant. Thanks again. Thanks"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2287.86,"endTime":2290.65,"body":"so much, Sally."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2290.74,"endTime":2294.19,"body":"Thank you very much, Claire."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2290.74,"endTime":2294.19,"body":"It's been a pleasure. Thank you."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2296.35,"endTime":2299.38,"body":"Thanks so much for listening to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2296.35,"endTime":2299.38,"body":"creativity found. If your"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2299.38,"endTime":2303.31,"body":"podcast app has the facility,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2299.38,"endTime":2303.31,"body":"please leave a rating and review"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2303.34,"endTime":2307.6,"body":"to help other people find us on"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2303.34,"endTime":2307.6,"body":"Instagram and Facebook. Follow"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2307.6,"endTime":2312.16,"body":"us at creativity found podcast"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2307.6,"endTime":2312.16,"body":"and on Pinterest look for at"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2312.16,"endTime":2316.45,"body":"creativity found. And finally,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2312.16,"endTime":2316.45,"body":"don't forget to check out"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2316.48,"endTime":2320.86,"body":"creativity found at CODIT. UK."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2316.48,"endTime":2320.86,"body":"The website connecting adults"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2320.86,"endTime":2323.98,"body":"who wants to find a creative"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2320.86,"endTime":2323.98,"body":"outlet with the artists and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2323.98,"endTime":2327.52,"body":"crafters who can help them tap"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2323.98,"endTime":2327.52,"body":"into their creativity."}]}