{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":79.35,"endTime":81.48,"body":"For this"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":79.35,"endTime":81.48,"body":"episode, I'm speaking with Lou"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":81.48,"endTime":85.53,"body":"Hamilton, who was forging an"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":81.48,"endTime":85.53,"body":"artistic life in Scotland when"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":85.53,"endTime":90.54,"body":"she witnessed a dreadful event."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":85.53,"endTime":90.54,"body":"Years later, Lou realised that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":90.54,"endTime":93.9,"body":"she needed to address the trauma"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":90.54,"endTime":93.9,"body":"that was still within her. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":93.9,"endTime":97.83,"body":"after regaining her courage and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":93.9,"endTime":97.83,"body":"confidence, she felt compelled"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":97.92,"endTime":104.01,"body":"to once again pick up a pencil,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":97.92,"endTime":104.01,"body":"and then a paintbrush. Hi, lo."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":104.25,"endTime":110.07,"body":"Hi, how are you? Very good."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":104.25,"endTime":110.07,"body":"Thank you. You had a creative"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":110.07,"endTime":115.29,"body":"and a personal reawakening as"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":110.07,"endTime":115.29,"body":"you approached your 50s Can you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":115.29,"endTime":117.96,"body":"tell me what it is? You do?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":118.35,"endTime":123.09,"body":"Yes. So I'm a bit of a mixed"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":118.35,"endTime":123.09,"body":"bag. I'm a painter. I'm a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":123.09,"endTime":129.33,"body":"writer, author, Illustrator,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":123.09,"endTime":129.33,"body":"have my podcast, and I have a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":129.33,"endTime":133.14,"body":"business helping people to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":129.33,"endTime":133.14,"body":"become podcast guests. So it's a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":133.2,"endTime":136.92,"body":"it's a ripe old mixed bag. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":133.2,"endTime":136.92,"body":"really sort of how it came about"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":136.92,"endTime":142.35,"body":"was when I turned 50. I, I don't"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":136.92,"endTime":142.35,"body":"know whether it was a bit of a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":142.35,"endTime":144.87,"body":"sort of midlife crisis, or, you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":142.35,"endTime":144.87,"body":"know, I was going through the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":144.87,"endTime":149.82,"body":"menopause. My grandmother had"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":144.87,"endTime":149.82,"body":"died that year, I was turning, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":149.82,"endTime":155.25,"body":"turned 50. And my children were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":149.82,"endTime":155.25,"body":"flying the nest. And I sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":155.25,"endTime":157.47,"body":"thought, Well, you know, what,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":155.25,"endTime":157.47,"body":"what's next? For me? Obviously,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":157.47,"endTime":160.17,"body":"it's kind of a whole new start"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":157.47,"endTime":160.17,"body":"for my children. But is it a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":160.17,"endTime":162.96,"body":"whole new start for me to I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":160.17,"endTime":162.96,"body":"guess this was sort of playing"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":162.96,"endTime":167.22,"body":"out in my mind. And I just"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":162.96,"endTime":167.22,"body":"suddenly had the urge to start"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":167.22,"endTime":171.57,"body":"drawing again. And I hadn't"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":167.22,"endTime":171.57,"body":"picked up a pencil in years, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":171.57,"endTime":174.96,"body":"I started drawing out popped"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":171.57,"endTime":174.96,"body":"this little character who later"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":174.96,"endTime":179.28,"body":"became known as brave new girl."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":174.96,"endTime":179.28,"body":"And at the time, I'd been"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":179.73,"endTime":183.87,"body":"posting on social media, with"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":179.73,"endTime":183.87,"body":"photographs that I've taken with"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":183.87,"endTime":186.45,"body":"sort of inspirational sayings."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":183.87,"endTime":186.45,"body":"And, but it was beginning to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":186.45,"endTime":189.45,"body":"become a bit like everyone was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":186.45,"endTime":189.45,"body":"doing it. I thought I wanted to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":189.45,"endTime":191.67,"body":"do something a bit more"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":189.45,"endTime":191.67,"body":"original. And so I thought I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":191.67,"endTime":195.63,"body":"could I could post Brave New"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":191.67,"endTime":195.63,"body":"Girl with some inspirational"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":195.63,"endTime":198.12,"body":"sayings. So I started doing"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":195.63,"endTime":198.12,"body":"that. And the response was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":198.15,"endTime":202.08,"body":"immediate, I guess, because it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":198.15,"endTime":202.08,"body":"was so different. And very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":202.08,"endTime":204.87,"body":"personal. So I kept posting, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":202.08,"endTime":204.87,"body":"people kept saying, well, more,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":204.87,"endTime":207.48,"body":"more, more, please. And then"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":204.87,"endTime":207.48,"body":"someone said, Oh, you should"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":207.48,"endTime":212.16,"body":"really try and get her"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":207.48,"endTime":212.16,"body":"published. So I did. And it all"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":212.16,"endTime":214.98,"body":"happened very, very quickly."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":212.16,"endTime":214.98,"body":"I've got an agent. And then we"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":214.98,"endTime":219.33,"body":"got publishers. And so the book"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":214.98,"endTime":219.33,"body":"was born. And really with that,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":219.36,"endTime":223.86,"body":"my, I don't know, my creativity"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":219.36,"endTime":223.86,"body":"just started sort of spilling"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":223.86,"endTime":228.27,"body":"out in in every direction. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":223.86,"endTime":228.27,"body":"these drawings were tiny little"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":228.6,"endTime":231.99,"body":"stick drawings, mean black and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":228.6,"endTime":231.99,"body":"white. And I suddenly had this"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":231.99,"endTime":237.33,"body":"urge to go to paint big and in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":231.99,"endTime":237.33,"body":"colour. So I started painting"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":237.33,"endTime":243.27,"body":"these six foot paintings. In my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":237.33,"endTime":243.27,"body":"flat. It just felt like the the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":243.27,"endTime":248.07,"body":"dam broke and unleashed this"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":243.27,"endTime":248.07,"body":"sort of torrent of creativity,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":248.07,"endTime":250.41,"body":"which I still feel seven years"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":248.07,"endTime":250.41,"body":"on."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":251.04,"endTime":256.92,"body":"Brilliant. Yes, this breaking"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":251.04,"endTime":256.92,"body":"open, just trying to wondering"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":256.92,"endTime":260.79,"body":"whether that was a brand new"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":256.92,"endTime":260.79,"body":"thing or refound things and what"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":260.79,"endTime":263.91,"body":"was your experience of the arts"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":260.79,"endTime":263.91,"body":"like as a child?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":264.18,"endTime":266.52,"body":"Well, I was always very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":264.18,"endTime":266.52,"body":"creative, but then I think"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":266.61,"endTime":270.78,"body":"children are until maybe they"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":266.61,"endTime":270.78,"body":"reach secondary school, you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":270.78,"endTime":276.93,"body":"know, we explore and play and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":270.78,"endTime":276.93,"body":"colour and paint and draw and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":276.93,"endTime":280.74,"body":"read and it's sort of coming out"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":276.93,"endTime":280.74,"body":"of every orifice when we're kids"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":280.74,"endTime":283.53,"body":"here. That's just what we do."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":280.74,"endTime":283.53,"body":"And in primary school, we are"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":283.53,"endTime":287.43,"body":"encouraged to do that. And it is"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":283.53,"endTime":287.43,"body":"how we learn. We're really"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":287.43,"endTime":292.59,"body":"nurtured in our creativity and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":287.43,"endTime":292.59,"body":"our curiosity. And then I guess"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":292.59,"endTime":296.61,"body":"in secondary school, you're sort"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":292.59,"endTime":296.61,"body":"of timetabled out of the arts"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":296.61,"endTime":301.77,"body":"and into academia and with the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":296.61,"endTime":301.77,"body":"goal of exams And getting you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":301.77,"endTime":305.97,"body":"through through all that. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":301.77,"endTime":305.97,"body":"for the first couple of years, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":305.97,"endTime":308.94,"body":"was doing art. And then when it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":305.97,"endTime":308.94,"body":"came to our levels, I had to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":308.97,"endTime":313.26,"body":"make a choice because of this"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":308.97,"endTime":313.26,"body":"timetable, thing I couldn't do."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":314.01,"endTime":319.2,"body":"I wanted to do Latin, music and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":314.01,"endTime":319.2,"body":"art. And I couldn't do all"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":319.2,"endTime":323.76,"body":"three. So I had to choose two."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":319.2,"endTime":323.76,"body":"So I thought, well, I can't do"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":323.82,"endTime":328.86,"body":"the other two on my own. So I'll"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":323.82,"endTime":328.86,"body":"take music and Latin as school"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":328.86,"endTime":332.4,"body":"subjects, and then I'll find a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":328.86,"endTime":332.4,"body":"way to do art outside. So I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":332.4,"endTime":337.59,"body":"found a local gallery, who"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":332.4,"endTime":337.59,"body":"agreed to teach me and go to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":337.59,"endTime":343.44,"body":"classes every lunchtime, I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":337.59,"endTime":343.44,"body":"able to take that on my own. So"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":343.47,"endTime":346.83,"body":"I guess I was pretty determined"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":343.47,"endTime":346.83,"body":"that it was something that I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":346.83,"endTime":351.93,"body":"wanted or maybe needed to do it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":346.83,"endTime":351.93,"body":"needed to be in my life. But the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":351.93,"endTime":355.53,"body":"thing with art education"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":351.93,"endTime":355.53,"body":"schools, then I think it's very,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":355.53,"endTime":360.39,"body":"very different now was that it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":355.53,"endTime":360.39,"body":"was not very imaginative, you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":360.39,"endTime":365.37,"body":"know, you we were encouraged to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":360.39,"endTime":365.37,"body":"cut out pictures from the Sunday"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":365.37,"endTime":369.51,"body":"coast supplements, and basically"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":365.37,"endTime":369.51,"body":"square those up and then paint"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":369.57,"endTime":374.1,"body":"what we'd cut out. So you know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":369.57,"endTime":374.1,"body":"with powdered paints, yeah, so I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":374.1,"endTime":377.67,"body":"was doing powder paints,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":374.1,"endTime":377.67,"body":"squaring up pictures from"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":378.18,"endTime":382.32,"body":"supplements. And I wasn't very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":378.18,"endTime":382.32,"body":"good at that, really, I sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":382.32,"endTime":389.16,"body":"lost the, the kind of that sort"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":382.32,"endTime":389.16,"body":"of playfulness. But I still knew"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":389.16,"endTime":393.6,"body":"that I wanted to go to art"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":389.16,"endTime":393.6,"body":"school, I was going to try for"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":393.81,"endTime":398.13,"body":"reading English at Oxford or"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":393.81,"endTime":398.13,"body":"Cambridge. And, and then it was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":398.13,"endTime":402.57,"body":"a sort of funny time, it was, it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":398.13,"endTime":402.57,"body":"was a sort of really tough time,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":402.57,"endTime":406.83,"body":"there was a mass unemployment,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":402.57,"endTime":406.83,"body":"there was a lot of strikes, you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":406.83,"endTime":412.11,"body":"know, it was really, really hard"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":406.83,"endTime":412.11,"body":"time. And, and we, we had this"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":412.29,"endTime":416.25,"body":"class called general studies"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":412.29,"endTime":416.25,"body":"where either visiting lecturers"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":416.25,"endTime":419.4,"body":"would come in, or a teacher"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":416.25,"endTime":419.4,"body":"would come in and talk about a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":419.4,"endTime":423.39,"body":"specific subject one time they"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":419.4,"endTime":423.39,"body":"showed us the the film about the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":423.39,"endTime":426.93,"body":"nuclear, because it Yeah, we"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":423.39,"endTime":426.93,"body":"really thought we were under a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":426.93,"endTime":431.43,"body":"nuclear threat then. And, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":426.93,"endTime":431.43,"body":"this film was about what to do"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":431.43,"endTime":434.79,"body":"if a nuclear bomb did go off."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":431.43,"endTime":434.79,"body":"And you know, we had to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":434.79,"endTime":440.07,"body":"basically hide under the table."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":434.79,"endTime":440.07,"body":"Not sure that was going to do"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":440.07,"endTime":442.35,"body":"very much. But anyway, we said"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":440.07,"endTime":442.35,"body":"they've kind of put the fear of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":442.35,"endTime":445.05,"body":"godliness. And, and then there"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":442.35,"endTime":445.05,"body":"was this other one where we were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":445.05,"endTime":447.69,"body":"told, well, you know, there's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":445.05,"endTime":447.69,"body":"going to be no jobs when you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":447.69,"endTime":452.19,"body":"leave. So you better know how to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":447.69,"endTime":452.19,"body":"spend your leisure time. As it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":452.19,"endTime":454.98,"body":"turned out, quite prophetic. 30"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":452.19,"endTime":454.98,"body":"odd years later, there's a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":454.98,"endTime":458.52,"body":"global pandemic when everybody's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":454.98,"endTime":458.52,"body":"at home. And they did kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":458.91,"endTime":463.23,"body":"find their creativity many"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":458.91,"endTime":463.23,"body":"people did, as a way of sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":463.41,"endTime":468.09,"body":"coping with that weird weirdness"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":463.41,"endTime":468.09,"body":"of being at home. But anyway, I,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":468.69,"endTime":472.53,"body":"on the back of that may be the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":468.69,"endTime":472.53,"body":"only person in our class that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":472.53,"endTime":475.68,"body":"took this kind of other"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":472.53,"endTime":475.68,"body":"decision. But I thought, Okay,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":475.68,"endTime":478.71,"body":"well, I'll I'll go off to art"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":475.68,"endTime":478.71,"body":"school. And and because I could"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":478.71,"endTime":481.65,"body":"imagine spending my life"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":478.71,"endTime":481.65,"body":"painting would be a really"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":481.65,"endTime":486.12,"body":"amazing way to live. So if I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":481.65,"endTime":486.12,"body":"went, yeah, I moved to London"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":486.15,"endTime":488.04,"body":"and went to art school. They're"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":488.73,"endTime":491.64,"body":"brilliant, you obviously took"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":488.73,"endTime":491.64,"body":"something from that lesson, I'm"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":491.64,"endTime":496.65,"body":"not sure if everybody else took"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":491.64,"endTime":496.65,"body":"that point for that lesson and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":496.65,"endTime":501.42,"body":"made it such a big part of you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":496.65,"endTime":501.42,"body":"going forward. Interesting, ya"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":501.42,"endTime":501.69,"body":"know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":501.69,"endTime":505.2,"body":"lots of people went often and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":501.69,"endTime":505.2,"body":"went to the city and made lots"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":505.2,"endTime":505.83,"body":"of money."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":508.83,"endTime":515.67,"body":"You have to spend your leisure"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":508.83,"endTime":515.67,"body":"time. So you went to art school?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":515.7,"endTime":519.06,"body":"And I know that after our"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":515.7,"endTime":519.06,"body":"college, you went to Scotland."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":519.72,"endTime":523.98,"body":"During that time, was there a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":519.72,"endTime":523.98,"body":"plan? What was the plan?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":524.94,"endTime":530.82,"body":"Well, at that time art school,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":524.94,"endTime":530.82,"body":"there was something about going"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":530.82,"endTime":534.51,"body":"for the fine art rather than"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":530.82,"endTime":534.51,"body":"graphics or something kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":534.51,"endTime":538.53,"body":"useful that you could actually"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":534.51,"endTime":538.53,"body":"get a job fine art was then kind"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":538.53,"endTime":541.26,"body":"of assuring you that you weren't"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":538.53,"endTime":541.26,"body":"going to get a job you weren't"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":541.26,"endTime":544.29,"body":"really taught about those things"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":541.26,"endTime":544.29,"body":"in in art school, it was all"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":544.29,"endTime":549.24,"body":"about the art it was all about"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":544.29,"endTime":549.24,"body":"critical thinking and really,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":549.24,"endTime":552.24,"body":"really going deep on pushing"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":549.24,"endTime":552.24,"body":"yourself and pushing the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":552.24,"endTime":556.26,"body":"envelope and really exploring"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":552.24,"endTime":556.26,"body":"and I guess kind of back to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":556.26,"endTime":560.22,"body":"childhood but you know, at times"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":556.26,"endTime":560.22,"body":"it was really brutal but it did"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":560.28,"endTime":563.85,"body":"really make you think and it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":560.28,"endTime":563.85,"body":"really did develop your critical"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":563.85,"endTime":567.24,"body":"mind and I I heard once someone"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":563.85,"endTime":567.24,"body":"say someone famous say that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":567.24,"endTime":569.82,"body":"everybody should go to art"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":567.24,"endTime":569.82,"body":"school at some point in their"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":569.82,"endTime":573.33,"body":"life and, and I can see see that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":569.82,"endTime":573.33,"body":"you know, it wasn't that we were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":573.33,"endTime":577.23,"body":"taught how to paint or mix"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":573.33,"endTime":577.23,"body":"colours or composition it was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":577.26,"endTime":582.69,"body":"that we learn to think and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":577.26,"endTime":582.69,"body":"analyse and really question"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":582.72,"endTime":585.96,"body":"everything and observe"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":582.72,"endTime":585.96,"body":"everything. And and I think"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":585.96,"endTime":589.23,"body":"that's a really that is a really"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":585.96,"endTime":589.23,"body":"good good tool, but not"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":589.23,"endTime":594.3,"body":"obviously one for finding a job"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":589.23,"endTime":594.3,"body":"immediately afterwards. Although"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":594.33,"endTime":597.6,"body":"a few years later, it wasn't"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":594.33,"endTime":597.6,"body":"that much long, longer after I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":597.6,"endTime":602.97,"body":"left out college, that the likes"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":597.6,"endTime":602.97,"body":"Damien Hirst and Tracy, MN, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":602.97,"endTime":607.32,"body":"that whole kind of Goldsmith's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":602.97,"endTime":607.32,"body":"gang, they actually did think"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":607.32,"endTime":611.19,"body":"differently. They did think that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":607.32,"endTime":611.19,"body":"they could make art in ways that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":611.19,"endTime":614.79,"body":"they could also earn money. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":611.19,"endTime":614.79,"body":"they, they didn't kind of push"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":614.79,"endTime":618.96,"body":"the two apart. Damien Hirst, in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":614.79,"endTime":618.96,"body":"particular took a lot of flack"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":618.96,"endTime":622.68,"body":"for Oh, well, he's really"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":618.96,"endTime":622.68,"body":"commercial. But it's that sort"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":622.68,"endTime":625.11,"body":"of old fashioned thing of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":622.68,"endTime":625.11,"body":"thinking, well, if you're"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":625.11,"endTime":628.41,"body":"creative, you can't earn money."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":625.11,"endTime":628.41,"body":"And, you know, we did come out"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":628.41,"endTime":631.83,"body":"thinking that. And so I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":628.41,"endTime":631.83,"body":"really glad that, you know, it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":631.83,"endTime":635.85,"body":"was only a few years later that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":631.83,"endTime":635.85,"body":"that group of artists did say to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":635.85,"endTime":641.64,"body":"themselves, well, why is that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":635.85,"endTime":641.64,"body":"true? But for myself, I left art"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":641.64,"endTime":646.83,"body":"school, it had been quite sort"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":641.64,"endTime":646.83,"body":"of hairy, being a young woman in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":646.86,"endTime":649.98,"body":"London at that time, you know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":646.86,"endTime":649.98,"body":"you just have to be looking over"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":649.98,"endTime":653.67,"body":"your shoulder every second of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":649.98,"endTime":653.67,"body":"the day. And it's not that you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":653.67,"endTime":658.62,"body":"learned to get used to it, but"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":653.67,"endTime":658.62,"body":"you just kind of got on with it."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":658.89,"endTime":663.06,"body":"But it was very wearing and very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":658.89,"endTime":663.06,"body":"exhausting. And so by the time"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":663.09,"endTime":666.45,"body":"I'd finished art school, I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":663.09,"endTime":666.45,"body":"really ready to get out of out"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":666.45,"endTime":671.79,"body":"of London and, and so we kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":666.45,"endTime":671.79,"body":"ran away to Scotland and group"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":671.79,"endTime":674.85,"body":"of us had done the Edinburgh"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":671.79,"endTime":674.85,"body":"Fringe Festival a couple of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":674.85,"endTime":679.05,"body":"times, and this time when I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":674.85,"endTime":679.05,"body":"finished art school just decided"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":679.05,"endTime":685.02,"body":"to stay up there. And eventually"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":679.05,"endTime":685.02,"body":"bought a church in Lockerbie for"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":685.32,"endTime":688.65,"body":"7000 pounds, which just happened"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":685.32,"endTime":688.65,"body":"to be the money that we'd got"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":688.65,"endTime":692.94,"body":"for for a public art commission."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":688.65,"endTime":692.94,"body":"By that point I had learned to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":693.09,"endTime":698.37,"body":"make money from from my art. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":693.09,"endTime":698.37,"body":"so yeah, so we just said, Well,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":698.43,"endTime":702.03,"body":"we've got 7000 pounds, this"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":698.43,"endTime":702.03,"body":"church is 7000 pounds, let's buy"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":702.03,"endTime":705.09,"body":"it not thinking you know, it's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":702.03,"endTime":705.09,"body":"got 100 foot spire it's got a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":705.09,"endTime":711.03,"body":"massive listed building roof."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":705.09,"endTime":711.03,"body":"Keep in tact, but it was a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":711.03,"endTime":714.15,"body":"massive space. It wasn't the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":711.03,"endTime":714.15,"body":"most incredible space and so you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":714.15,"endTime":717.84,"body":"know, we were able to make huge"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":714.15,"endTime":717.84,"body":"sculptures and do sculpture"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":717.84,"endTime":723.0,"body":"Commission's and for a while it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":717.84,"endTime":723.0,"body":"was it was really great. It was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":723.0,"endTime":727.86,"body":"really idyllic. It felt really"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":723.0,"endTime":727.86,"body":"calm and peaceful. And you know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":727.86,"endTime":731.01,"body":"you didn't need very much money."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":727.86,"endTime":731.01,"body":"I had a part time job working in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":731.01,"endTime":735.96,"body":"a gallery. It was quite quiet so"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":731.01,"endTime":735.96,"body":"I could draw paint while I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":735.96,"endTime":738.93,"body":"waiting for customers come in."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":735.96,"endTime":738.93,"body":"It was quite a sort of bohemian"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":738.93,"endTime":743.67,"body":"area. There were other artistic"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":738.93,"endTime":743.67,"body":"people. Yeah, so so it was all"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":743.67,"endTime":744.72,"body":"going very well."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":745.92,"endTime":750.27,"body":"You were feeling safe and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":745.92,"endTime":750.27,"body":"creative and calm. As you've"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":750.27,"endTime":753.99,"body":"mentioned, you were living very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":750.27,"endTime":753.99,"body":"close to Lockerbie. And you were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":753.99,"endTime":758.58,"body":"there when the Pan Am Flight 103"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":753.99,"endTime":758.58,"body":"was destroyed by a bomb over the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":758.58,"endTime":763.47,"body":"town. Can you tell me what you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":758.58,"endTime":763.47,"body":"witnessed and how that affected"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":763.47,"endTime":768.24,"body":"your sense of safety and perhaps"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":763.47,"endTime":768.24,"body":"your life decisions afterwards?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":768.72,"endTime":773.55,"body":"Yeah, so we we'd bought the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":768.72,"endTime":773.55,"body":"church in Lockerbie itself. But"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":773.61,"endTime":776.4,"body":"we were trying to sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":773.61,"endTime":776.4,"body":"convert it so that we could live"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":776.4,"endTime":779.37,"body":"there. But at that time, we were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":776.4,"endTime":779.37,"body":"living in a little cottage,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":779.52,"endTime":784.23,"body":"literally just outside. And it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":779.52,"endTime":784.23,"body":"was just one night, I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":784.23,"endTime":787.95,"body":"watching the television and I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":784.23,"endTime":787.95,"body":"heard what I thought was thunder"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":787.95,"endTime":791.58,"body":"and I went to the to the window"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":787.95,"endTime":791.58,"body":"and it didn't seem to be"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":791.58,"endTime":796.53,"body":"thundery out there. And and then"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":791.58,"endTime":796.53,"body":"the phone rang and it was my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":796.56,"endTime":802.17,"body":"landlady. And she was saying,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":796.56,"endTime":802.17,"body":"Are you okay? Yes, fine, why,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":802.17,"endTime":805.74,"body":"and she said on a plane as being"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":802.17,"endTime":805.74,"body":"blown up out of the sky by view."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":805.74,"endTime":808.95,"body":"And so we just turned on the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":805.74,"endTime":808.95,"body":"television and kind of watched"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":808.95,"endTime":815.16,"body":"it play out on TV like everybody"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":808.95,"endTime":815.16,"body":"else was, except that out of the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":815.16,"endTime":821.04,"body":"window, you could see the sky"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":815.16,"endTime":821.04,"body":"was orange, and, and just"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":821.07,"endTime":824.49,"body":"mayhem. We were just up a little"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":821.07,"endTime":824.49,"body":"hill and down at the bottom was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":824.49,"endTime":827.82,"body":"the sort of main road going up"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":824.49,"endTime":827.82,"body":"through Scotland. And that was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":827.82,"endTime":830.1,"body":"kind of read gridlocked. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":827.82,"endTime":830.1,"body":"then journalists were sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":830.1,"endTime":832.17,"body":"coming in banging on the door"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":830.1,"endTime":832.17,"body":"because they were trying to,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":832.44,"endTime":834.72,"body":"they wanted to use the phone,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":832.44,"endTime":834.72,"body":"there was no mobiles or"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":834.72,"endTime":838.8,"body":"anything, then my parents"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":834.72,"endTime":838.8,"body":"couldn't get hold of me all"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":838.8,"endTime":841.86,"body":"night, because the lines were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":838.8,"endTime":841.86,"body":"sort of taken up by the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":841.86,"endTime":845.61,"body":"emergency services, but and, you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":841.86,"endTime":845.61,"body":"know, and the ambulances and the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":845.61,"endTime":849.06,"body":"police and everybody kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":845.61,"endTime":849.06,"body":"rushed to the scene, but, but"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":849.06,"endTime":853.74,"body":"nothing would could be done"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":849.06,"endTime":853.74,"body":"because everybody was dead. And,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":854.13,"endTime":864.06,"body":"you know, I'm sorry, I didn't"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":854.13,"endTime":864.06,"body":"expect that. All these decades"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":864.06,"endTime":870.3,"body":"later. Yeah. So we we didn't"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":864.06,"endTime":870.3,"body":"really know what to expect when,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":870.99,"endTime":874.71,"body":"when light came up the next day,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":870.99,"endTime":874.71,"body":"and we didn't know what we were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":874.71,"endTime":876.48,"body":"going to open our door to."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":883.71,"endTime":889.89,"body":"We we walked into town and you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":883.71,"endTime":889.89,"body":"just saw bits of plain in the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":889.89,"endTime":895.47,"body":"front, sort of gardens. And, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":889.89,"endTime":895.47,"body":"we just didn't look up because"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":895.59,"endTime":898.26,"body":"we didn't know what we were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":895.59,"endTime":898.26,"body":"going to see and actually people"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":900.15,"endTime":904.26,"body":"People did see the most"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":900.15,"endTime":904.26,"body":"horrendous things in the trees"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":904.32,"endTime":908.58,"body":"and, and in their gardens. And,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":904.32,"endTime":908.58,"body":"you know, people were really,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":908.58,"endTime":914.01,"body":"really devastated. He never,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":908.58,"endTime":914.01,"body":"ever would want anyone to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":914.04,"endTime":920.31,"body":"witness what, what those people"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":914.04,"endTime":920.31,"body":"saw. And so here was, it was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":920.31,"endTime":924.81,"body":"really devastating for the whole"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":920.31,"endTime":924.81,"body":"town. And for the families, and,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":925.38,"endTime":929.4,"body":"you know, the, the town was kind"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":925.38,"endTime":929.4,"body":"of overtaken by journalists and,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":930.24,"endTime":937.41,"body":"and, and it was sort of this"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":930.24,"endTime":937.41,"body":"media kind of storm. And I just"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":937.41,"endTime":941.46,"body":"remember going into, we just"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":937.41,"endTime":941.46,"body":"didn't want to do just kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":942.66,"endTime":945.36,"body":"walked into, we just went to the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":942.66,"endTime":945.36,"body":"pub, and everyone was just kind"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":945.36,"endTime":947.61,"body":"of sitting there. And this was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":945.36,"endTime":947.61,"body":"like, 11 in the morning and just"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":947.61,"endTime":950.34,"body":"threw a cup of coffee and, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":947.61,"endTime":950.34,"body":"there were loads of journalists"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":950.34,"endTime":955.65,"body":"in there. And then we just heard"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":950.34,"endTime":955.65,"body":"one guy say, there was because"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":955.65,"endTime":960.15,"body":"obviously everyone died in in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":955.65,"endTime":960.15,"body":"the plane, but also 11 people"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":960.15,"endTime":963.75,"body":"have died on the ground, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":960.15,"endTime":963.75,"body":"some of the houses has been"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":963.75,"endTime":968.43,"body":"completely destroyed. And I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":963.75,"endTime":968.43,"body":"heard this guy say, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":968.43,"endTime":973.2,"body":"there's a there's a child that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":968.43,"endTime":973.2,"body":"he'd done, he'd gone to the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":973.23,"endTime":978.51,"body":"telephone box to make a call."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":973.23,"endTime":978.51,"body":"And, and when he came out of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":978.51,"endTime":985.59,"body":"his, his whole family had been"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":978.51,"endTime":985.59,"body":"destroyed. And, you know, it, it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":985.59,"endTime":991.29,"body":"was just, it was it kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":985.59,"endTime":991.29,"body":"almost like went into shock, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":991.29,"endTime":996.63,"body":"think. And, you know, I'm quite"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":991.29,"endTime":996.63,"body":"resilient in many ways. And, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":996.78,"endTime":999.87,"body":"although I've always been very,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":996.78,"endTime":999.87,"body":"very fearful, when things"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":999.87,"endTime":1003.5,"body":"actually happen, you kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":999.87,"endTime":1003.5,"body":"just have to get on with it."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1003.5,"endTime":1007.37,"body":"And, you know, we were alive, we"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1003.5,"endTime":1007.37,"body":"hadn't lost anyone. And there"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1007.37,"endTime":1008.96,"body":"was a sort of real sense of,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1010.31,"endTime":1015.74,"body":"in my head that there was a kind"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1010.31,"endTime":1015.74,"body":"of hierarchy of, of grief. I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1015.74,"endTime":1020.06,"body":"hadn't asked anyone, I wasn't"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1015.74,"endTime":1020.06,"body":"injured, I still have my home."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1020.33,"endTime":1024.86,"body":"And therefore, you know, I had"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1020.33,"endTime":1024.86,"body":"no right to kind of feel the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1024.86,"endTime":1028.52,"body":"pain that other people were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1024.86,"endTime":1028.52,"body":"feeling. And I went into the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1028.52,"endTime":1033.14,"body":"church and there was a church"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1028.52,"endTime":1033.14,"body":"hall next door. And I just sort"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1033.14,"endTime":1036.77,"body":"of something in me just went"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1033.14,"endTime":1036.77,"body":"through the the door to the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1036.77,"endTime":1040.04,"body":"other space, and it was just"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1036.77,"endTime":1040.04,"body":"filled with coffins. This was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1040.04,"endTime":1044.3,"body":"like maybe a couple of days"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1040.04,"endTime":1044.3,"body":"later floor to ceiling, you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1044.3,"endTime":1048.71,"body":"know, you know what to do with"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1044.3,"endTime":1048.71,"body":"that men mount bodies, though,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1048.71,"endTime":1053.99,"body":"it was all it was all very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1048.71,"endTime":1053.99,"body":"shocking. And but I think what I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1053.99,"endTime":1058.88,"body":"did was just kind of bury it."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1053.99,"endTime":1058.88,"body":"And a couple of years later, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1058.88,"endTime":1065.36,"body":"left Lockerbie and went back"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1058.88,"endTime":1065.36,"body":"down south and sort of started"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1065.36,"endTime":1070.49,"body":"getting really went and did a an"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1065.36,"endTime":1070.49,"body":"MA in public art and continued"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1070.49,"endTime":1074.33,"body":"doing sculpture and but then"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1070.49,"endTime":1074.33,"body":"through the AMA started to kind"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1074.33,"endTime":1079.73,"body":"of explore other materials,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1074.33,"endTime":1079.73,"body":"things like video recorders had"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1079.73,"endTime":1082.25,"body":"come down in price that we were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1079.73,"endTime":1082.25,"body":"able to kind of start playing"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1082.25,"endTime":1087.95,"body":"with those and exploring sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1082.25,"endTime":1087.95,"body":"multimedia it was all very new"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1088.01,"endTime":1092.45,"body":"and and very exciting. It felt"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1088.01,"endTime":1092.45,"body":"very sort of cutting edge and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1092.45,"endTime":1096.32,"body":"pioneering and, and kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1092.45,"endTime":1096.32,"body":"sculpture and painting or seemed"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1096.32,"endTime":1100.4,"body":"a bit fuddy duddy, you know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1096.32,"endTime":1100.4,"body":"fashion. And it's interesting"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1100.4,"endTime":1105.11,"body":"because I heard recently both"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1100.4,"endTime":1105.11,"body":"Tracey Emin and Damien Hirst,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1105.14,"endTime":1108.38,"body":"who've both come back to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1105.14,"endTime":1108.38,"body":"painting. I've heard both of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1108.38,"endTime":1112.88,"body":"them say, separately, that they"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1108.38,"endTime":1112.88,"body":"really regretted not coming back"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1112.88,"endTime":1117.5,"body":"to painting sooner, that they"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1112.88,"endTime":1117.5,"body":"wish they kept that art because"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1118.01,"endTime":1122.15,"body":"it's mastery, isn't it? We all"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1118.01,"endTime":1122.15,"body":"kind of ducked out of painting,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1122.18,"endTime":1126.59,"body":"because there was kind of new"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1122.18,"endTime":1126.59,"body":"toys to play with, and kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1126.59,"endTime":1131.69,"body":"missed, you know, maybe 1020"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1126.59,"endTime":1131.69,"body":"years of, of practice, and you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1131.69,"endTime":1134.75,"body":"get better with practice. But at"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1131.69,"endTime":1134.75,"body":"the time, it was like, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1134.75,"endTime":1138.83,"body":"that was painting was really"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1134.75,"endTime":1138.83,"body":"uncool. And, and multimedia was,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1139.01,"endTime":1142.22,"body":"you know, as just like the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1139.01,"endTime":1142.22,"body":"beginning. So it was all really,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1142.22,"endTime":1146.6,"body":"really exciting, and kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1142.22,"endTime":1146.6,"body":"opening our minds up about what"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1146.6,"endTime":1150.65,"body":"was possible. And, and I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1146.6,"endTime":1150.65,"body":"working with this woman. At the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1150.65,"endTime":1154.1,"body":"end of the degree, we did this"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1150.65,"endTime":1154.1,"body":"performance piece called silent"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1154.1,"endTime":1157.43,"body":"voices. And it really was about"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1154.1,"endTime":1157.43,"body":"kind of reclaiming the streets"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1157.43,"endTime":1160.61,"body":"and giving women a voice and a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1157.43,"endTime":1160.61,"body":"platform. But of course, we"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1160.61,"endTime":1164.18,"body":"didn't have all the stuff that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1160.61,"endTime":1164.18,"body":"we have now. So we did it in the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1164.18,"endTime":1168.38,"body":"way that we could do which was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1164.18,"endTime":1168.38,"body":"we sent out postcards to 400"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1168.38,"endTime":1172.4,"body":"women and women's groups and got"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1168.38,"endTime":1172.4,"body":"their answers on the postcard"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1172.4,"endTime":1176.15,"body":"which was around the idea of you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1172.4,"endTime":1176.15,"body":"know, what would you say, but"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1176.18,"endTime":1181.19,"body":"never felt able to. And then we"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1176.18,"endTime":1181.19,"body":"projected these giant mouth into"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1181.19,"endTime":1184.46,"body":"the union chapel and had their"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1181.19,"endTime":1184.46,"body":"their words coming out of the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1184.46,"endTime":1188.18,"body":"mouth as part of a big"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1184.46,"endTime":1188.18,"body":"performance piece. An"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1188.18,"endTime":1191.36,"body":"interesting because, you know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1188.18,"endTime":1191.36,"body":"when I started the the podcast"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1191.36,"endTime":1195.62,"body":"guest agency and on my own"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1191.36,"endTime":1195.62,"body":"podcast, Brave New Girl, which"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1195.62,"endTime":1198.86,"body":"is all about kind of championing"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1195.62,"endTime":1198.86,"body":"women and giving women a voice"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1198.86,"endTime":1203.27,"body":"and a platform. I realised that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1198.86,"endTime":1203.27,"body":"oh my god, the seeds were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1203.27,"endTime":1209.66,"body":"planted back then. And so I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1203.27,"endTime":1209.66,"body":"really interested in exploring"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1210.11,"endTime":1214.73,"body":"art as a sort of way of looking"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1210.11,"endTime":1214.73,"body":"at social issues. And, and I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1214.73,"endTime":1219.8,"body":"didn't feel that I had had this"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1214.73,"endTime":1219.8,"body":"last big sculpture commission,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1220.31,"endTime":1225.14,"body":"which was these three giant dogs"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1220.31,"endTime":1225.14,"body":"on stilts, 20 foot up into the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1225.14,"endTime":1229.46,"body":"sky, by the end for an outside"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1225.14,"endTime":1229.46,"body":"vendor. And you know, while it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1229.46,"endTime":1232.73,"body":"was really exciting, learn to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1229.46,"endTime":1232.73,"body":"weld, and I worked with"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1232.73,"endTime":1237.53,"body":"communities making poetry around"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1232.73,"endTime":1237.53,"body":"it, and we had a massive kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1237.53,"endTime":1242.03,"body":"lanten procession. So it was all"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1237.53,"endTime":1242.03,"body":"kind of very exciting. But I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1242.03,"endTime":1248.45,"body":"found that what interested me"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1242.03,"endTime":1248.45,"body":"most was actually explaining the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1248.45,"endTime":1251.69,"body":"whole story behind the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1248.45,"endTime":1251.69,"body":"sculpture, the whole mythology"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1251.69,"endTime":1253.67,"body":"behind the scope of sculpture,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1251.69,"endTime":1253.67,"body":"which was then put onto a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1253.67,"endTime":1257.03,"body":"plaque. And I was thinking,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1253.67,"endTime":1257.03,"body":"that's interesting that, that's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1257.06,"endTime":1260.69,"body":"what's interesting to me. And so"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1257.06,"endTime":1260.69,"body":"that's how I then sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1260.69,"endTime":1266.72,"body":"started getting into video art."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1260.69,"endTime":1266.72,"body":"And we got grants from the Arts"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1266.72,"endTime":1271.34,"body":"Council for five years making"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1266.72,"endTime":1271.34,"body":"these these artists films. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1271.34,"endTime":1274.37,"body":"then the last one, they were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1271.34,"endTime":1274.37,"body":"saying, they said to us, I think"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1274.37,"endTime":1278.45,"body":"you need to give them a bit more"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1274.37,"endTime":1278.45,"body":"narrative. And I was I didn't"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1278.45,"endTime":1279.68,"body":"know what narrative meant."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1281.39,"endTime":1283.67,"body":"Although obviously, you know, we"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1281.39,"endTime":1283.67,"body":"all have a sense of story. We"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1283.67,"endTime":1286.16,"body":"know what beginning, middle and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1283.67,"endTime":1286.16,"body":"an end is. But I didn't know how"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1286.16,"endTime":1290.48,"body":"to kind of work that into these"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1286.16,"endTime":1290.48,"body":"artists films. And so then,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1291.02,"endTime":1296.15,"body":"chance, I didn't know good luck."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1291.02,"endTime":1296.15,"body":"I'd sent the film to somebody"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1296.15,"endTime":1299.3,"body":"who, because it was dead at a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1296.15,"endTime":1299.3,"body":"screening in a cinema and she"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1299.3,"endTime":1303.62,"body":"wasn't able to come. So I sent"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1299.3,"endTime":1303.62,"body":"her the then VHS, but she just"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1303.71,"endTime":1309.08,"body":"got her commission to do a three"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1303.71,"endTime":1309.08,"body":"part series for Channel Four on"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1309.08,"endTime":1314.66,"body":"terminal illness, which became"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1309.08,"endTime":1314.66,"body":"called death, the series. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1314.66,"endTime":1317.3,"body":"she asked me whether I would be"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1314.66,"endTime":1317.3,"body":"interested in coming on and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1317.3,"endTime":1322.73,"body":"being one of the director,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1317.3,"endTime":1322.73,"body":"producer writers. And I said,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1322.79,"endTime":1325.76,"body":"Yes, because I always had a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1322.79,"endTime":1325.76,"body":"habit of saying yes, and then"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1325.76,"endTime":1329.69,"body":"finding out how how you do after"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1325.76,"endTime":1329.69,"body":"that. So that's how I kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1329.69,"endTime":1331.22,"body":"got into documentary filmmaking."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1332.33,"endTime":1338.51,"body":"Yeah, and I know that the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1332.33,"endTime":1338.51,"body":"filmmaking also led you to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1339.14,"endTime":1343.52,"body":"possibly revisiting what we've"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1339.14,"endTime":1343.52,"body":"been talking about, and helping"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1343.52,"endTime":1347.0,"body":"yourself to feel happier and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1343.52,"endTime":1347.0,"body":"less fearful. So can you tell me"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1347.0,"endTime":1348.32,"body":"about that?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1348.44,"endTime":1351.41,"body":"Yeah. So Channel Four, at that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1348.44,"endTime":1351.41,"body":"time, were really good. And they"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1351.41,"endTime":1355.82,"body":"were really on it in terms of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1351.41,"endTime":1355.82,"body":"looking after the, the teams who"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1355.82,"endTime":1358.01,"body":"were making these films, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1355.82,"endTime":1358.01,"body":"particularly this film, which"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1358.01,"endTime":1362.6,"body":"was potentially psychologically"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1358.01,"endTime":1362.6,"body":"quite challenging, you know, we"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1362.6,"endTime":1367.67,"body":"were following 12 people who"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1362.6,"endTime":1367.67,"body":"were dying, and being with their"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1367.67,"endTime":1371.75,"body":"families who ultimately"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1367.67,"endTime":1371.75,"body":"grieving, and it was an amazing"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1371.75,"endTime":1376.46,"body":"experience, it really was the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1371.75,"endTime":1376.46,"body":"most incredible privilege to be"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1376.46,"endTime":1380.45,"body":"with these people, and have"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1376.46,"endTime":1380.45,"body":"their trust. And it was very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1380.45,"endTime":1385.55,"body":"sensitive, it was very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1380.45,"endTime":1385.55,"body":"challenging. But what made it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1385.55,"endTime":1388.91,"body":"easier was that the people who"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1385.55,"endTime":1388.91,"body":"were being filmed to the ones"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1388.91,"endTime":1394.13,"body":"that were actually dying, were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1388.91,"endTime":1394.13,"body":"really all of them were really"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1394.13,"endTime":1397.25,"body":"strong in the sense that the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1394.13,"endTime":1397.25,"body":"reason that they were doing it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1397.25,"endTime":1401.75,"body":"was that it gave a point to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1397.25,"endTime":1401.75,"body":"their life that they were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1401.75,"endTime":1406.88,"body":"sharing all of the things about"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1401.75,"endTime":1406.88,"body":"dying. It was still a taboo,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1407.0,"endTime":1409.4,"body":"talking about death, talking"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1407.0,"endTime":1409.4,"body":"about cancer, called You know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1409.4,"endTime":1413.48,"body":"it was, it wasn't like now where"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1409.4,"endTime":1413.48,"body":"people have a platform on"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1413.48,"endTime":1415.7,"body":"Instagram to kind of talk about"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1413.48,"endTime":1415.7,"body":"their journeys and their"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1415.7,"endTime":1419.93,"body":"experience. So this was really"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1415.7,"endTime":1419.93,"body":"something for them. But for us,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1420.35,"endTime":1424.4,"body":"China for paid for us all to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1420.35,"endTime":1424.4,"body":"have a psychotherapist. And what"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1424.4,"endTime":1429.56,"body":"we all found was that it wasn't"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1424.4,"endTime":1429.56,"body":"so much about the film that we"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1429.8,"endTime":1434.39,"body":"we needed to talk about it was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1429.8,"endTime":1434.39,"body":"kind of past baggage. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1434.39,"endTime":1438.41,"body":"obviously, all the stuff with"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1434.39,"endTime":1438.41,"body":"what had happened in Lockerbie"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1438.41,"endTime":1443.39,"body":"started to to come up. I'd also"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1438.41,"endTime":1443.39,"body":"lost my cousin, we were the same"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1443.42,"endTime":1447.77,"body":"age. She died when we were 26."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1443.42,"endTime":1447.77,"body":"We were very, very close. We"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1447.77,"endTime":1451.88,"body":"were like sisters. And and I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1447.77,"endTime":1451.88,"body":"think these things sort of still"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1451.91,"endTime":1456.47,"body":"tend to kind of pile up on on"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1451.91,"endTime":1456.47,"body":"themselves. And so I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1456.47,"endTime":1460.97,"body":"beginning to feel these things"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1456.47,"endTime":1460.97,"body":"sort of emerging. And then after"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1460.97,"endTime":1466.49,"body":"the death series, I did a made"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1460.97,"endTime":1466.49,"body":"of film on PTSD in soldiers hold"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1466.49,"endTime":1471.83,"body":"a brutal piece. And I think that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1466.49,"endTime":1471.83,"body":"was the sort of final straw I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1471.83,"endTime":1476.81,"body":"was interviewing a psychiatrist"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1471.83,"endTime":1476.81,"body":"at the Priory who specialised in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1476.81,"endTime":1480.86,"body":"this process called EMDR. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1476.81,"endTime":1480.86,"body":"what it does is it it sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1481.31,"endTime":1487.85,"body":"winds down the trauma that keeps"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1481.31,"endTime":1487.85,"body":"raising its head. And so as he"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1487.85,"endTime":1491.99,"body":"was talking, I was thinking God"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1487.85,"endTime":1491.99,"body":"this the symptoms of PTSD, some"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1491.99,"endTime":1496.43,"body":"really, really familiar things"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1491.99,"endTime":1496.43,"body":"like being hyper vigilant, being"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1496.64,"endTime":1500.3,"body":"very scared, being very anxious"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1496.64,"endTime":1500.3,"body":"all the time. Terrible. Terrible"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1500.3,"endTime":1506.0,"body":"nightmares, all of the things"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1500.3,"endTime":1506.0,"body":"that I just thought was me. I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1506.0,"endTime":1510.29,"body":"had no idea that it was as a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1506.0,"endTime":1510.29,"body":"consequence of the experiences"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1510.29,"endTime":1515.36,"body":"that I'd might had. And so then"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1510.29,"endTime":1515.36,"body":"I started to sort of go and get"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1515.36,"endTime":1520.01,"body":"help specifically for that. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1515.36,"endTime":1520.01,"body":"trained as a coach myself,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1520.01,"endTime":1523.67,"body":"because I thought, I liked the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1520.01,"endTime":1523.67,"body":"idea of coaching, because it was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1523.7,"endTime":1528.44,"body":"about, well, you know, things"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1523.7,"endTime":1528.44,"body":"have happened to you. But what"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1528.44,"endTime":1531.8,"body":"can you do from this standing"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1528.44,"endTime":1531.8,"body":"point where you are right now?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1531.92,"endTime":1534.71,"body":"What do you do moving forward,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1531.92,"endTime":1534.71,"body":"and I really liked that concept."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1534.71,"endTime":1538.16,"body":"And it was quite new in the UK"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1534.71,"endTime":1538.16,"body":"at that time. So I trained as a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1538.16,"endTime":1542.51,"body":"coach in order to understand"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1538.16,"endTime":1542.51,"body":"coaching, and to be able to use"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1542.51,"endTime":1545.84,"body":"the techniques for myself and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1542.51,"endTime":1545.84,"body":"also to help other people. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1545.84,"endTime":1549.74,"body":"so yeah, so that was kind of the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1545.84,"endTime":1549.74,"body":"beginning of me kind of dealing"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1549.74,"endTime":1551.87,"body":"with all of these things that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1549.74,"endTime":1551.87,"body":"hurt"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1552.38,"endTime":1558.23,"body":"her come up, amazing. You"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1552.38,"endTime":1558.23,"body":"enjoyed making films, and you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1558.23,"endTime":1564.95,"body":"are moving on with yourself and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1558.23,"endTime":1564.95,"body":"helping others. But during that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1564.95,"endTime":1568.7,"body":"time, you weren't painting or"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1564.95,"endTime":1568.7,"body":"drawing. So perhaps we're"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1569.3,"endTime":1573.71,"body":"creatively starved a little bit."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1569.3,"endTime":1573.71,"body":"And you started to tell us at"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1573.71,"endTime":1577.85,"body":"the beginning about the catalyst"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1573.71,"endTime":1577.85,"body":"for the change. So can you bring"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1577.85,"endTime":1583.76,"body":"us up to date with how you got"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1577.85,"endTime":1583.76,"body":"to Brave New Girl, the painting"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1583.82,"endTime":1585.74,"body":"and all the things you're doing"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1583.82,"endTime":1585.74,"body":"now?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1586.1,"endTime":1590.78,"body":"Yeah, so filming is, is an"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1586.1,"endTime":1590.78,"body":"amazing experience. And it's a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1590.78,"endTime":1595.97,"body":"real team effort. And as a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1590.78,"endTime":1595.97,"body":"director, you're helping other"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1595.97,"endTime":1599.93,"body":"creative people to be as"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1595.97,"endTime":1599.93,"body":"creative as they possibly can be"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1600.2,"endTime":1604.7,"body":"under your kind of vision. But"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1600.2,"endTime":1604.7,"body":"you're also kind of dealing with"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1604.79,"endTime":1609.35,"body":"your production side and raising"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1604.79,"endTime":1609.35,"body":"money, and the less creative"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1609.35,"endTime":1613.4,"body":"side of things and, and, you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1609.35,"endTime":1613.4,"body":"know, making independent films"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1613.4,"endTime":1616.82,"body":"was, you know, hard work, it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1613.4,"endTime":1616.82,"body":"would take a long time to get"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1616.82,"endTime":1620.15,"body":"them off the ground and get them"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1616.82,"endTime":1620.15,"body":"funded. And, you know, whether"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1620.15,"endTime":1624.23,"body":"they then ever get seen, and I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1620.15,"endTime":1624.23,"body":"went to lots of film festivals,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1624.23,"endTime":1627.2,"body":"and the films got awards, but"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1624.23,"endTime":1627.2,"body":"that doesn't pay the bills, you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1627.2,"endTime":1633.2,"body":"know, on one hand, it was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1627.2,"endTime":1633.2,"body":"incredibly exciting, and very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1633.2,"endTime":1636.14,"body":"creative. And on the other hand,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1633.2,"endTime":1636.14,"body":"it was really not creative at"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1636.14,"endTime":1642.05,"body":"all, that began to feel sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1636.14,"endTime":1642.05,"body":"very frustrating. And so I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1642.05,"endTime":1645.26,"body":"started taking photographs,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1642.05,"endTime":1645.26,"body":"again, that was a really great"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1645.29,"endTime":1648.89,"body":"outlet for for my creativity,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1645.29,"endTime":1648.89,"body":"because it didn't require anyone"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1648.89,"endTime":1652.82,"body":"giving me permission to do it,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1648.89,"endTime":1652.82,"body":"it didn't require any funding to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1652.82,"endTime":1658.22,"body":"do it. And I sort of just kind"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1652.82,"endTime":1658.22,"body":"of immersed myself in that in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1658.22,"endTime":1661.49,"body":"between trying to get films off"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1658.22,"endTime":1661.49,"body":"the ground. And, and that was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1661.52,"endTime":1665.0,"body":"really exciting. And it kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1661.52,"endTime":1665.0,"body":"gave me the sort of that sense"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1665.0,"endTime":1669.32,"body":"of autonomy, creative autonomy,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1665.0,"endTime":1669.32,"body":"and you know, we have to do is"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1669.32,"endTime":1672.89,"body":"get up, take your camera, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1669.32,"endTime":1672.89,"body":"off you go. But then what I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1672.89,"endTime":1676.46,"body":"finding was that what I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1672.89,"endTime":1676.46,"body":"trying to make with the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1676.46,"endTime":1683.6,"body":"photographs were sort of these"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1676.46,"endTime":1683.6,"body":"abstract images, I was trying to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1683.6,"endTime":1688.37,"body":"make them like paintings. And at"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1683.6,"endTime":1688.37,"body":"some point, I just thought, you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1688.37,"endTime":1692.03,"body":"know, what's happening here, you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1688.37,"endTime":1692.03,"body":"know, your, your fear, which,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1692.09,"endTime":1695.09,"body":"you know, was still there,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1692.09,"endTime":1695.09,"body":"despite all the therapy and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1695.09,"endTime":1698.93,"body":"coaching and everything. I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1695.09,"endTime":1698.93,"body":"afraid that I wouldn't be able"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1698.93,"endTime":1703.22,"body":"to use paint to make the images"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1698.93,"endTime":1703.22,"body":"that I could make in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1703.25,"endTime":1707.3,"body":"photography. But ultimately, you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1703.25,"endTime":1707.3,"body":"know, your creativity has got"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1707.3,"endTime":1710.45,"body":"it, it's got a mind of its own,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1707.3,"endTime":1710.45,"body":"it's gonna make it happen. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1710.45,"endTime":1714.8,"body":"so, yeah, it was when I started"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1710.45,"endTime":1714.8,"body":"drawing and then Brave New Girl"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1714.8,"endTime":1720.08,"body":"and then painting and, and I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1714.8,"endTime":1720.08,"body":"sort of unleashed back into to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1720.08,"endTime":1723.38,"body":"the world of the paintbrush."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1720.08,"endTime":1723.38,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1727.76,"endTime":1732.02,"body":"I love sharing my guests stories"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1727.76,"endTime":1732.02,"body":"with you. But podcasting isn't"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1732.02,"endTime":1736.43,"body":"cheap. There are hosting fees"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1732.02,"endTime":1736.43,"body":"and software costs, tech to buy"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1736.49,"endTime":1740.12,"body":"and time to invest in planning"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1736.49,"endTime":1740.12,"body":"and editing to make sure the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1740.12,"endTime":1743.69,"body":"guests sound great. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1740.12,"endTime":1743.69,"body":"listeners hear the best content."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1744.56,"endTime":1748.25,"body":"If you would like to financially"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1744.56,"endTime":1748.25,"body":"support creativity found, please"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1748.25,"endTime":1757.22,"body":"visit kayo hyphen f fi.com slash"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1748.25,"endTime":1757.22,"body":"creativity found podcast. The"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1757.22,"endTime":1762.53,"body":"paintings that you're doing now"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1757.22,"endTime":1762.53,"body":"are large, and the sculptures"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1762.53,"endTime":1766.1,"body":"that you were doing for public"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1762.53,"endTime":1766.1,"body":"art were also large. Do you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1766.1,"endTime":1769.91,"body":"think there was a conscious or"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1766.1,"endTime":1769.91,"body":"an unconscious reason for this?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1770.48,"endTime":1775.13,"body":"Yeah, I love things being kind"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1770.48,"endTime":1775.13,"body":"of bigger than human scale and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1775.19,"endTime":1779.57,"body":"that you're kind of totally"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1775.19,"endTime":1779.57,"body":"immersed in, in the piece is a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1779.57,"endTime":1782.15,"body":"very different feeling. When"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1779.57,"endTime":1782.15,"body":"you're painting a small picture"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1782.15,"endTime":1785.81,"body":"you feel kind of outside of I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1782.15,"endTime":1785.81,"body":"feel outside of it. Whereas when"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1785.81,"endTime":1790.61,"body":"I'm making big work, I feel like"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1785.81,"endTime":1790.61,"body":"I'm really really part of part"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1790.61,"endTime":1794.27,"body":"of the thing and you know, these"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1790.61,"endTime":1794.27,"body":"are kind of quite spiritual"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1794.36,"endTime":1798.47,"body":"pieces. And so I'm very kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1794.36,"endTime":1798.47,"body":"aware of the physics of the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1798.47,"endTime":1804.05,"body":"universe of sort of Atoms and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1798.47,"endTime":1804.05,"body":"cells and particles. And so I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1804.05,"endTime":1808.76,"body":"kind of really feel like I'm in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1804.05,"endTime":1808.76,"body":"that world when I'm working big."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1809.12,"endTime":1814.97,"body":"Definitely because I was a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1809.12,"endTime":1814.97,"body":"sculptor. First off, I do work"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1814.97,"endTime":1818.84,"body":"in a very kind of robust way."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1814.97,"endTime":1818.84,"body":"It's a very physical way I work"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1818.84,"endTime":1824.72,"body":"on the floor. I use builders,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1818.84,"endTime":1824.72,"body":"paint brushes, I work in plaster"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1824.72,"endTime":1828.89,"body":"and sort of very textural and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1824.72,"endTime":1828.89,"body":"kind of scratch into the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1828.89,"endTime":1832.16,"body":"surface. And it's interesting"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1828.89,"endTime":1832.16,"body":"because I've been thinking about"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1832.16,"endTime":1836.81,"body":"who my influences are, and who"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1832.16,"endTime":1836.81,"body":"they have always been. They're"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1836.81,"endTime":1841.49,"body":"all male, Sean Scully, and a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1836.81,"endTime":1841.49,"body":"nice couple, he's a sculptor,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1841.49,"endTime":1844.76,"body":"but kind of uses colour, and the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1841.49,"endTime":1844.76,"body":"way that I like to think of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1844.76,"endTime":1850.13,"body":"colour and, and Tony tap, yes,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1844.76,"endTime":1850.13,"body":"who also made these big kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1850.13,"endTime":1854.63,"body":"very physical paintings, which I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1850.13,"endTime":1854.63,"body":"absolutely loved. The influences"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1854.63,"endTime":1858.35,"body":"are kind of far, far and wide."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1854.63,"endTime":1858.35,"body":"Joseph boys, definitely Shawn"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1858.35,"endTime":1863.0,"body":"scaly, but they're all very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1858.35,"endTime":1863.0,"body":"physical painters. It's quite"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1863.0,"endTime":1866.87,"body":"sort of macho work that they"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1863.0,"endTime":1866.87,"body":"they made. And it's interesting,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1866.87,"endTime":1871.04,"body":"because when Brave New Girl"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1866.87,"endTime":1871.04,"body":"started being seen, and the book"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1871.04,"endTime":1875.12,"body":"was published, and people would"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1871.04,"endTime":1875.12,"body":"say, Oh, this such cute"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1875.12,"endTime":1878.24,"body":"whimsical drawings. And that was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1875.12,"endTime":1878.24,"body":"like a sort of knife in my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1878.24,"endTime":1883.55,"body":"heart. Oh, gosh, me making"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1878.24,"endTime":1883.55,"body":"whimsical thing. It's just like,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1883.55,"endTime":1887.9,"body":"feels so kind of alien to the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1883.55,"endTime":1887.9,"body":"artist in me, which is, has"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1887.9,"endTime":1891.74,"body":"always been kind of very robust"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1887.9,"endTime":1891.74,"body":"and physical and, and so I think"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1891.74,"endTime":1896.24,"body":"that the painting is definitely"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1891.74,"endTime":1896.24,"body":"antithesis to do the drawings."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1897.17,"endTime":1901.82,"body":"But yeah, I love the kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1897.17,"endTime":1901.82,"body":"exploring these sort of abstract"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1902.33,"endTime":1905.87,"body":"colour fields. This painting"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1902.33,"endTime":1905.87,"body":"commission I've got at the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1905.87,"endTime":1908.96,"body":"moment, which is for one of the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1905.87,"endTime":1908.96,"body":"buildings in Canary Wharf,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1909.02,"endTime":1914.39,"body":"that's a 57 storey building, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1909.02,"endTime":1914.39,"body":"my paintings are in pairs,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1914.39,"endTime":1917.45,"body":"they're going to be on 55 of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1914.39,"endTime":1917.45,"body":"those stories. People have said"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1917.45,"endTime":1920.54,"body":"to me, Well, aren't you going to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1917.45,"endTime":1920.54,"body":"get bored painting, the kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1920.54,"endTime":1926.39,"body":"same things, but it feels like,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1920.54,"endTime":1926.39,"body":"the less you have to think about"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1926.42,"endTime":1930.44,"body":"composition and the things that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1926.42,"endTime":1930.44,"body":"you'd think about, if you were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1930.44,"endTime":1935.3,"body":"making figurative work, the more"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1930.44,"endTime":1935.3,"body":"you can explore the physicality,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1935.57,"endTime":1941.54,"body":"of colour and shape and of light"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1935.57,"endTime":1941.54,"body":"and hue and and how they kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1941.57,"endTime":1948.95,"body":"work together. But are under it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1941.57,"endTime":1948.95,"body":"all is the feeling of the kind"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1948.95,"endTime":1952.55,"body":"of physics and nature and what"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1948.95,"endTime":1952.55,"body":"it is that we're, we're all kind"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1952.55,"endTime":1955.85,"body":"of made up of. And some people"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1952.55,"endTime":1955.85,"body":"might call that spirituality."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1955.91,"endTime":1959.72,"body":"Other people call it physics,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1955.91,"endTime":1959.72,"body":"other people call it nature, but"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1959.72,"endTime":1962.66,"body":"it is that kind of essence of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1959.72,"endTime":1962.66,"body":"what we're all made up of, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1962.66,"endTime":1966.68,"body":"what our environment is made up"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1962.66,"endTime":1966.68,"body":"of. And, and that is what I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1966.68,"endTime":1968.57,"body":"explore through colour."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1969.41,"endTime":1974.93,"body":"Yeah. And whimsical comments"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1969.41,"endTime":1974.93,"body":"apart? Did you have any"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1974.96,"endTime":1979.49,"body":"nervousness? or How are you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1974.96,"endTime":1979.49,"body":"feeling about sharing both Brave"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1979.49,"endTime":1984.35,"body":"New Girl and you're painting"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1979.49,"endTime":1984.35,"body":"with Brave New Girl drawings,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1984.38,"endTime":1988.4,"body":"Ida had had such a brilliant,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1984.38,"endTime":1988.4,"body":"positive response right from the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1988.4,"endTime":1992.75,"body":"outset, and people were urging"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1988.4,"endTime":1992.75,"body":"me to, to get a book. And then I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1992.75,"endTime":1996.47,"body":"got an agent really quickly, the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1992.75,"endTime":1996.47,"body":"book went to auctions. So you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1996.47,"endTime":1999.47,"body":"know, publishing houses were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1996.47,"endTime":1999.47,"body":"sort of fighting over it. And,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1999.83,"endTime":2003.31,"body":"and that all happened in a very"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":1999.83,"endTime":2003.31,"body":"short space of time. So I just"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2003.31,"endTime":2008.83,"body":"kind of felt that everyone else"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2003.31,"endTime":2008.83,"body":"was behind it. So you know, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2008.83,"endTime":2012.43,"body":"could be behind it. I guess, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2008.83,"endTime":2012.43,"body":"felt like Yeah, she she needs to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2012.43,"endTime":2016.06,"body":"be out in the world, she's kind"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2012.43,"endTime":2016.06,"body":"of forced her way through me out"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2016.06,"endTime":2018.04,"body":"into the world. So I didn't"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2016.06,"endTime":2018.04,"body":"really feel like it was kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2018.04,"endTime":2020.92,"body":"me, that was making it it was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2018.04,"endTime":2020.92,"body":"the site, this was just"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2020.92,"endTime":2023.47,"body":"happening, and maybe it was my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2020.92,"endTime":2023.47,"body":"grandmother who, you know, from"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2023.47,"endTime":2026.95,"body":"the other side, or, you know, it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2023.47,"endTime":2026.95,"body":"just needed, she needed to be"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2026.95,"endTime":2031.24,"body":"out there, this character, and I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2026.95,"endTime":2031.24,"body":"had been, I don't know, chosen"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2031.24,"endTime":2035.32,"body":"to be the one to draw her. And,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2031.24,"endTime":2035.32,"body":"and so that we kind of felt"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2035.56,"endTime":2039.97,"body":"very, very straightforward. Then"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2035.56,"endTime":2039.97,"body":"I wrote a self coaching book"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2040.06,"endTime":2044.2,"body":"called fear less. And that was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2040.06,"endTime":2044.2,"body":"illustrated, but it was much"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2044.2,"endTime":2046.39,"body":"more about the tools and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2044.2,"endTime":2046.39,"body":"techniques to sort of help"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2046.39,"endTime":2049.99,"body":"people have more courage in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2046.39,"endTime":2049.99,"body":"their lives and, and use their"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2049.99,"endTime":2053.29,"body":"creativity. You know, people say"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2049.99,"endTime":2053.29,"body":"that they're not creative, but"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2053.29,"endTime":2058.24,"body":"to be human is to be creative."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2053.29,"endTime":2058.24,"body":"And that ability is what we can"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2058.24,"endTime":2062.14,"body":"use to get us through fear. To"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2058.24,"endTime":2062.14,"body":"use fear, you know, we call it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2062.14,"endTime":2065.71,"body":"fear less, rather than fearless,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2062.14,"endTime":2065.71,"body":"because you're never going to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2065.71,"endTime":2070.27,"body":"get rid of fear. You just have"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2065.71,"endTime":2070.27,"body":"to use it and see where it is,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2070.3,"endTime":2073.51,"body":"and then push through to the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2070.3,"endTime":2073.51,"body":"other side. And you know, maybe"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2073.51,"endTime":2077.65,"body":"use that energy in a different"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2073.51,"endTime":2077.65,"body":"way. And so when I wrote that"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2077.65,"endTime":2081.82,"body":"book, that was a bit more nerve"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2077.65,"endTime":2081.82,"body":"wracking. I felt much more"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2081.82,"endTime":2085.3,"body":"exposed. There was much more"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2081.82,"endTime":2085.3,"body":"about my story. I guess it Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2085.3,"endTime":2087.67,"body":"I felt just a bit more"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2085.3,"endTime":2087.67,"body":"vulnerable, putting that out"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2087.67,"endTime":2090.97,"body":"into the world. But then with"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2087.67,"endTime":2090.97,"body":"the paintings again, it was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2090.97,"endTime":2095.98,"body":"because I just had to make them"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2090.97,"endTime":2095.98,"body":"and then very quickly, I got a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2095.98,"endTime":2101.29,"body":"one woman show. I was in a group"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2095.98,"endTime":2101.29,"body":"show And then another woman want"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2101.29,"endTime":2104.83,"body":"one woman show, because I felt"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2101.29,"endTime":2104.83,"body":"so strong behind it that I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2104.83,"endTime":2109.39,"body":"just gonna find ways to get it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2104.83,"endTime":2109.39,"body":"out there. And I was saying yes"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2109.39,"endTime":2112.18,"body":"to things and being open about"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2109.39,"endTime":2112.18,"body":"things and you know, maybe"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2112.18,"endTime":2115.45,"body":"manifesting things, if you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2112.18,"endTime":2115.45,"body":"believe in that, you know, I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2115.45,"endTime":2120.25,"body":"on Saatchi art and I was selling"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2115.45,"endTime":2120.25,"body":"work across the world. So it all"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2120.25,"endTime":2125.62,"body":"kind of felt like it was meant"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2120.25,"endTime":2125.62,"body":"to be. And I just had to do my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2125.62,"endTime":2130.66,"body":"job, which was show up and do"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2125.62,"endTime":2130.66,"body":"the work, and keep the self"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2130.66,"endTime":2137.53,"body":"sabotage voices at bay. And then"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2130.66,"endTime":2137.53,"body":"with this commission, could be"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2137.59,"endTime":2141.37,"body":"quite daunting, the idea that,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2137.59,"endTime":2141.37,"body":"suddenly you've got this 116,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2141.37,"endTime":2145.78,"body":"paintings to paint, and they've"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2141.37,"endTime":2145.78,"body":"all got to be good, they've all"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2145.78,"endTime":2149.59,"body":"got to work in this space. And I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2145.78,"endTime":2149.59,"body":"think my MA in public art really"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2149.59,"endTime":2153.31,"body":"came to the fore with this"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2149.59,"endTime":2153.31,"body":"commission, because I really"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2153.31,"endTime":2157.3,"body":"understood the nature of the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2153.31,"endTime":2157.3,"body":"responsibility of putting work"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2157.3,"endTime":2160.42,"body":"into a space that other people"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2157.3,"endTime":2160.42,"body":"are going to use, and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2160.69,"endTime":2165.76,"body":"understanding the context and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2160.69,"endTime":2165.76,"body":"understanding what a brief was,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2165.82,"endTime":2170.74,"body":"and that I am working for the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2165.82,"endTime":2170.74,"body":"interior design, who has got a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2170.74,"endTime":2174.73,"body":"very specific idea of what she"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2170.74,"endTime":2174.73,"body":"wants, and the work has to work"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2174.73,"endTime":2180.07,"body":"with that. And within that, I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2174.73,"endTime":2180.07,"body":"can kind of privately have my"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2180.07,"endTime":2182.77,"body":"own journey and my own"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2180.07,"endTime":2182.77,"body":"investigations and my own"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2182.77,"endTime":2188.35,"body":"development and pushing walk the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2182.77,"endTime":2188.35,"body":"possibilities of painting within"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2188.38,"endTime":2192.04,"body":"this structure. And so that's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2188.38,"endTime":2192.04,"body":"been really interesting for me"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2192.04,"endTime":2196.96,"body":"that, you know, I can be"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2192.04,"endTime":2196.96,"body":"responsible as an artist in the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2196.96,"endTime":2199.9,"body":"world with the work that I'm"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2196.96,"endTime":2199.9,"body":"putting out there that, you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2199.9,"endTime":2204.88,"body":"know, other people have to walk"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2199.9,"endTime":2204.88,"body":"past. And also give myself the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2204.88,"endTime":2210.34,"body":"opportunity to really explore"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2204.88,"endTime":2210.34,"body":"and play and investigate and be"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2210.58,"endTime":2214.9,"body":"be curious, within the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2210.58,"endTime":2214.9,"body":"structures that that I have. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2215.2,"endTime":2219.73,"body":"this is absolutely golden"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2215.2,"endTime":2219.73,"body":"opportunity, not least because"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2219.73,"endTime":2224.74,"body":"I'm squashing that old idea of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2219.73,"endTime":2224.74,"body":"artists can't make money. But"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2224.98,"endTime":2228.34,"body":"because you know, when do you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2224.98,"endTime":2228.34,"body":"have the opportunity to make big"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2228.34,"endTime":2232.48,"body":"work, know that it's going it's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2228.34,"endTime":2232.48,"body":"got a home to go to, so I'm not"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2232.48,"endTime":2237.7,"body":"having to worry about storage,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2232.48,"endTime":2237.7,"body":"and just being able to explore"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2237.88,"endTime":2242.74,"body":"and push, push the practice"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2237.88,"endTime":2242.74,"body":"every single day. And so that's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2242.74,"endTime":2245.89,"body":"been a really exciting"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2242.74,"endTime":2245.89,"body":"opportunity."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2247.15,"endTime":2252.34,"body":"I bet it sounds fabulous. Well"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2247.15,"endTime":2252.34,"body":"done. You. Tell me about Brave"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2252.34,"endTime":2254.08,"body":"New Girl, the podcast."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2254.74,"endTime":2259.3,"body":"Yeah. So when the books came"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2254.74,"endTime":2259.3,"body":"out, I felt like they will get"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2259.3,"endTime":2262.84,"body":"out into the world, in book"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2259.3,"endTime":2262.84,"body":"form. But I, I just had this"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2262.84,"endTime":2270.28,"body":"sense that there was more. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2262.84,"endTime":2270.28,"body":"so I started doing t shirts. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2270.28,"endTime":2274.78,"body":"then more and more people were"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2270.28,"endTime":2274.78,"body":"sort of getting behind Brave New"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2274.78,"endTime":2279.28,"body":"Girl. And so I thought, well,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2274.78,"endTime":2279.28,"body":"it'd be really good to do a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2279.37,"endTime":2284.02,"body":"podcast. And because I was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2279.37,"endTime":2284.02,"body":"filmmaker, we started by doing a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2284.02,"endTime":2288.7,"body":"live live events and filming the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2284.02,"endTime":2288.7,"body":"experience. And so it'd be a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2288.7,"endTime":2292.96,"body":"q\u0026a. And it was once a month,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2288.7,"endTime":2292.96,"body":"we'd have an audience, I would"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2292.96,"endTime":2296.32,"body":"ask the questions, and then the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2292.96,"endTime":2296.32,"body":"audience would be able to ask"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2296.32,"endTime":2299.86,"body":"questions of the speaker at the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2296.32,"endTime":2299.86,"body":"end. And then it was put on"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2299.86,"endTime":2303.22,"body":"YouTube and out as a podcast,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2299.86,"endTime":2303.22,"body":"but it wasn't really gaining"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2303.22,"endTime":2307.18,"body":"traction, because it was only"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2303.22,"endTime":2307.18,"body":"once a month. And I was sort of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2307.66,"endTime":2312.85,"body":"limited to the people that could"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2307.66,"endTime":2312.85,"body":"come to a live event in London."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2313.33,"endTime":2316.72,"body":"And so then when the pandemic"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2313.33,"endTime":2316.72,"body":"happened, we had to cancel the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2316.72,"endTime":2321.61,"body":"last live event. And I had to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2316.72,"endTime":2321.61,"body":"quickly learn how to get all the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2321.61,"endTime":2324.67,"body":"equipment and learn to use it"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2321.61,"endTime":2324.67,"body":"and, and then it was like this"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2324.67,"endTime":2327.34,"body":"sort of whole new world just"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2324.67,"endTime":2327.34,"body":"suddenly opened up, because"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2327.58,"endTime":2331.3,"body":"suddenly, I could interview"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2327.58,"endTime":2331.3,"body":"women everywhere. And you know,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2331.3,"endTime":2333.85,"body":"they could do it from their"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2331.3,"endTime":2333.85,"body":"spare room, and I could be"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2333.85,"endTime":2337.12,"body":"recording it from from my spare"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2333.85,"endTime":2337.12,"body":"room and, and suddenly I"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2337.12,"endTime":2340.69,"body":"realised, well, this is the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2337.12,"endTime":2340.69,"body":"future for Brave New Girl,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2340.69,"endTime":2344.08,"body":"because what I'm doing is"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2340.69,"endTime":2344.08,"body":"interviewing real life Brave New"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2344.08,"endTime":2348.85,"body":"girls, and give them a platform"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2344.08,"endTime":2348.85,"body":"for their voices and for their"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2348.85,"endTime":2351.79,"body":"messages for their expertise,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2348.85,"endTime":2351.79,"body":"their stories for their"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2351.79,"endTime":2355.9,"body":"journeys, because we all learn"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2351.79,"endTime":2355.9,"body":"from what other people have been"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2355.9,"endTime":2358.09,"body":"through the lessons they've"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2355.9,"endTime":2358.09,"body":"learned the challenges they've"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2358.09,"endTime":2362.53,"body":"overcome. And I really felt like"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2358.09,"endTime":2362.53,"body":"yeah, this is this is the place"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2362.53,"endTime":2366.85,"body":"for Brave New Girl, you know, in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2362.53,"endTime":2366.85,"body":"real life, real women. And also"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2366.85,"endTime":2370.66,"body":"because, you know, it was"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2366.85,"endTime":2370.66,"body":"harking back to that performance"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2370.66,"endTime":2374.23,"body":"that we did the silent voices"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2370.66,"endTime":2374.23,"body":"that, you know, suddenly, the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2374.23,"endTime":2377.98,"body":"technology in 20 years has meant"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2374.23,"endTime":2377.98,"body":"that you're not doing on a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2377.98,"endTime":2383.17,"body":"postcard. You're able to reach"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2377.98,"endTime":2383.17,"body":"women everywhere across the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2383.17,"endTime":2387.85,"body":"globe. But then I was thinking,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2383.17,"endTime":2387.85,"body":"well, I can only interview 52"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2387.85,"endTime":2391.81,"body":"women a year, if that's once a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2387.85,"endTime":2391.81,"body":"week. So I decided to start an"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2391.81,"endTime":2395.11,"body":"agency to help get people out"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2391.81,"endTime":2395.11,"body":"there onto other people's"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2395.11,"endTime":2400.21,"body":"podcasts. So I can kind of"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2395.11,"endTime":2400.21,"body":"champion them and help them have"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2400.21,"endTime":2403.93,"body":"a positive impact in the world."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2400.21,"endTime":2403.93,"body":"And so that's when the silk"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2403.93,"endTime":2408.55,"body":"studios agency started. And from"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2403.93,"endTime":2408.55,"body":"that, I felt kind of full"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2408.55,"endTime":2412.06,"body":"circle. Not everybody can afford"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2408.55,"endTime":2412.06,"body":"to have someone represent them"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2412.09,"endTime":2414.58,"body":"to help them get onto podcasts."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2412.09,"endTime":2414.58,"body":"So I thought, well, I'll I'll"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2414.58,"endTime":2418.18,"body":"write a book then. And I've"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2414.58,"endTime":2418.18,"body":"called it dare to share. And"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2418.18,"endTime":2423.07,"body":"it's about sort of helping"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2418.18,"endTime":2423.07,"body":"people to connect with the world"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2423.07,"endTime":2429.49,"body":"through audio, social"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2423.07,"endTime":2429.49,"body":"communities. And so the book is"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2429.49,"endTime":2435.94,"body":"coming out in, in the autumn"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2429.49,"endTime":2435.94,"body":"2021. And it's all about really"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2435.94,"endTime":2438.85,"body":"digging deep into your story. So"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2435.94,"endTime":2438.85,"body":"you don't kind of churn out the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2438.85,"endTime":2441.49,"body":"same thing from podcast to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2438.85,"endTime":2441.49,"body":"podcast, what are you trying to"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2441.49,"endTime":2443.77,"body":"do? And what's the what's the"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2441.49,"endTime":2443.77,"body":"impact you're trying to have?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2444.1,"endTime":2447.79,"body":"And how do you do that? How do"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2444.1,"endTime":2447.79,"body":"you go about that creatively,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2447.85,"endTime":2449.44,"body":"but also, practically,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2449.92,"endTime":2454.99,"body":"that's gonna be really helpful."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2449.92,"endTime":2454.99,"body":"Lou, how can people contact you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2455.23,"endTime":2461.05,"body":"in your many guises as artist"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2455.23,"endTime":2461.05,"body":"writer podcaster agency?"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2462.31,"endTime":2469.15,"body":"The website is www silc dash"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2462.31,"endTime":2469.15,"body":"studios.co.uk. So you can get"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2469.15,"endTime":2473.95,"body":"hold of me there, or find me on"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2469.15,"endTime":2473.95,"body":"Instagram on three counts. One"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2473.95,"endTime":2478.72,"body":"is brave underscore new girl."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2473.95,"endTime":2478.72,"body":"One is Lu Hamilton art. And one"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2478.75,"endTime":2483.85,"body":"is silk studio dot s. So yeah,"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2478.75,"endTime":2483.85,"body":"come say hi."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2484.06,"endTime":2488.38,"body":"Let's connect. Thanks so much"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2484.06,"endTime":2488.38,"body":"for sharing today. Lou. It has"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2488.38,"endTime":2493.15,"body":"been a delight and a pleasure"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2488.38,"endTime":2493.15,"body":"and an emotional to speak to you"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2493.15,"endTime":2495.16,"body":"today. So thank you again."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2495.85,"endTime":2500.32,"body":"Thank you so much clay, you're a"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2495.85,"endTime":2500.32,"body":"great host guiding me through"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2500.35,"endTime":2504.97,"body":"and you're very generous in"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2500.35,"endTime":2504.97,"body":"giving this platform for"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2505.39,"endTime":2508.36,"body":"creative people to come and"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2505.39,"endTime":2508.36,"body":"share their journey. So thank"},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2508.36,"endTime":2510.13,"body":"you so much. You're welcome."},{"speaker":"Claire Waite Brown","startTime":2510.13,"endTime":2522.01,"body":"Thank you."}]}