From Outer Space to Inner Place with Justine Guillermou

Engineering a life of colour.

Justine Guillermou transitioned from a rigid career in space engineering to the vibrant world of professional interior design. 

In this episode Justine shares how her childhood experiences of home renovation in France planted the seeds for her future, despite being pushed towards more traditional academic paths. 

We explore the therapeutic benefits of colour, Justine’s experience as a contestant on a Channel 4 interior design show, and how embracing a creative outlet helped her manage the challenges of living with endometriosis. 

Justine also provides insight into her signature Rainbow Shaker style, and offers advice for those who believe they lack a creative spark, emphasizing the importance of the process over the final outcome.

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Listen to Creativity Found on TrueFans by downloading the app from the Apple App Store or Google Play Store. Listen on the desktop version here.

Transcript

Justine Guillermou: 1:03

It's not like you're gonna invent something different. It's really like you have to follow what's been done before. So it gave me a bit of outlet, but I would say wasn't enough for me. It was still missing something. And I think also, like, I was missing the variety. You know, when creative hobby start becoming like your work and you, you need to get paid for this, then you have this pressure and then you're like, oh, no, I don't like this anymore. So I didn't want to feel this way, having those symptoms for more than 14 years without knowing what it was. So it helped me to be more in the moment as a therapeutic way, because sometimes you're not feeling fully capable of doing things, but you can do still some little things. You can still be creative. It really helped me.

Claire Waite Brown: 2:03

Hi, I'm Claire. For this podcast, I chat with people who have found or refound their creativity as adults. We'll explore their childhood experiences of the arts, discuss how they came to the artistic practices they now love, and consider the barriers they may have experienced between the two. We'll also explore what it is that people value and gain from their newfound artistic pursuits. I'm here today with Justine Guillermo. Hi, Justine, how are you?

Justine Guillermou: 2:34

Hi. I'm good, thanks. How are you?

Claire Waite Brown: 2:36

I'm very well, thank you. Start by telling me, please, what your current creative outlet is.

Justine Guillermou: 2:43

Yes. So I'm an inter and set designer in London. Full of colour.

Claire Waite Brown: 2:50

Brilliant. Did creative activities in any form play a role in your life as a youngster, whether at home or at school or both?

Justine Guillermou: 3:00

Yeah, I definitely think that creativity was an outlet for me. More so I would say a bit later in life, like, in terms of colours, when I was young, the colours weren't such a thing, but I always liked to do something with my hands, like pottery or collage or something like this. And it felt like my own little bubble, I would say.

Claire Waite Brown: 3:30

And was it something that other people around you encouraged?

Justine Guillermou: 3:34

My mom is really similar. She's also very creative. She likes diy. She always encouraged me to help her, for example, on the house, because we were renovating a house and I grew up, like on a renovation site. So I was always installing wallpapers, painting, or doing DIY at home. It was really fun and I was encouraged to do it as an adult later in life as a hobby. I was encouraged to as some career. I wasn't really encouraged. School was fine. I had good grades. My parents really wanted me to either become a doctor or an engineer, which I later Became. But it was a lot of I think pressure also because I'm the eldest with my siblings. So you have even more pressure. And even though I had good grades, I think maybe too also I didn't feel that it was something that I would enjoy. But doing something with my hands was more fulfilling for me. It's like you, you're kind of stepping out of time when you're doing something creative. Like you're kind of stopping time almost. It's really how you feel like you don't see the time passing by and you're so focused on doing what you love.

Claire Waite Brown: 5:16

Yeah. You're engrossed in what you're doing and that takes over your whole being at the time. I completely understand. So tell me about the engineering then. You mentioned that what path did you take to get to there?

Justine Guillermou: 5:27

Yes. So after school I did what we have in France, preparatory classes. And then I went into engineering school. I didn't really feel like I had a choice or I could decide this sort of career. One of my dream was good, go into more like fashion design because I also love to sketch, loved the textile, love all colours. So it was something that I really loved. But then yeah, I became an engineer after that and decided to pursue space engineering because I thought it was more passion related, like everything space. But yeah, when I step out of school and started working, it was completely different from what I imagined. Not all starry eyed and yeah, it was different.

Claire Waite Brown: 6:24

What was the actual role then? What did you find yourself having to do in the job that wasn't what you thought it was going to be?

Justine Guillermou: 6:31

It was like really process related, like really organized. I know that as an engineer you need to be very organized. You need to follow a strict routine. I felt that looking from for example, what's happening in the US that innovation was starting to see the light of day in this sector. But here in Europe we are more into like we need to stay more traditional because it always worked. So we going to carry on the work. We don't have to think outside the box. And this was a bit hard for me. And also the process were taking a lot of time. Some projects were taking 20 years, 30 years or even a lifetime without seeing the light of day. For some it was yeah, really sad and also kind of like the environment was really kind of gray or bland. So yeah, it was missing something for me.

Claire Waite Brown: 7:32

Yeah. I wonder then if because you were saying earlier about doing things with your hands and how that takes you to another place. I'm thinking engineering was perhaps what you Were thinking it might be that it might be actually doing more stuff with your hands.

Justine Guillermou: 7:50

Yeah. So during my day to day job at one of my job, I managed to do some more hands on thing, build a system for example, and be there for the test and everything. But then what you don't see is like you need to write down all the reports. You spend much more time writing than building and doing the actual thing. And also it's not like you're going to invent something different. It's really like you have to follow what's being done before. So it gave me a bit of outlet, but I would say wasn't enough for me. It was still missing something. And I think also like I was missing the variety of things. Like on my hobbies, I like to sew, I like to upcycle things to do crochet, to paint. So I think if you do different things, you definitely can express yourself even more. So that's what I was missing.

Claire Waite Brown: 9:01

Yeah, you mentioned about crocheting and painting and doing these things. When did you start becoming aware of and interested in interior design specifically?

Justine Guillermou: 9:11

I think that when I was helping in the renovation when I was a child, I really liked it, but I didn't really know what it was. And then when as an adult, because I changed homes a lot because of my job, I always found that bringing colours and my own style into the flats, it was really kind of therapeutic. At that time I was really, really happy with doing that. I also traveled abroad for work, for study and I felt that when you're out of your country and you're discovering in your country, you like to have your own little space, you feel that it's kind of your cocoon. So I always tried to create that. And then a bit more than five years ago, I thought that it could become even more because I was really finding kind of a sense of purpose and it was really fulfilling for me. So that's when I started my own company.

Claire Waite Brown: 10:18

Okay, cool. So to begin with you were doing this for yourself and then you're thinking, oh, I can do this perhaps all the time for my job. Were you doing the two roles at the time, the engineering role and the starting the business. How did you manage that startup of something new?

Justine Guillermou: 10:36

It was during COVID So what was good was that we had a little bit more time, I would say and we were spending more time at home. But I was a bit afraid to yes, go directly into startups and maybe start something that as day to day career maybe I would start to get bored off or you know, when creative hobby start becoming like your work and you, you need to get paid for this, then you have this pressure and then you're like, oh, no, I don't like, like this anymore. So I didn't want to feel this way. And I also offer my services to some French expatriates in Germany at that time for free. So I tried five projects and I really liked it. I also studied and got my diploma and I was always more and more curious and I think that in interior design we see the design aspect, but it's like so much more. The range is so wide of things that you can do. You can be on site, you can style, you can do really what you want. So this is really fulfilling for me because I know that some days I will be maybe more really creative or even like on the morning when I wake up, I'm like, oh, not a really morning person. So I will read my emails, do maybe some project management, which is a bit more routine. And then in the afternoon I will be more creative and will want to really focus on this. It's really varied, so it's really what I like.

Claire Waite Brown: 12:21

Yeah, well, that's good that you recognize when you take your creative passion and you make it a business, it can ruin your creativity or at least make life more difficult. So I like the way that you found your kind of flow. At least it seems you found a bit of a balance in doing that. You have a very colourful style. You've already been talking about colour a lot and in particular saying about the work being grey when, when you weren't feeling fulfilled. So thinking about your style, did you ever feel that with clients that you should perhaps reign in your own style?

Justine Guillermou: 13:00

Yeah, it's always, I think, hard when you begin. I think the more confident you grow and also the more of it known you become if you have more and more project people know a bit more your style and they come to you for your particular style. So I don't have anyone coming for me for like something all white or something all beige. But at the beginning it was also difficult because I knew I loved colour. But my style kind of evolved when I was starting. It wasn't as colourful as it is now. And I think I was still trying to find my own voice, my own signature style. And I remember that some, like my first projects weren't as colourful. I even had some rooms that were all black or all gray. So it was completely different. And you also have, you're less confident, so you, you're not like pushing as you are now, but then you're starting to find your. Your voice and then after. Yeah, you. It comes naturally or when you're trained to find your voice. Also, what's helping me is that I kept also my other hobbies as an outlet, sewing, upcycling and painting and. And diying. So I think it nourishes as well. Like, I think having other creative hobbies kind of nourish your inner creativity. And it helped me as well. And I think that depending on where you are in life and which experience you have or something, your creativity is not the same. Like, your style isn't the same as well. And also, depending on the client, I keep my signature style, but I'm really trying to put myself in the client's shoes. Their experience, sometimes you can feel that maybe they're a bit wary, but they would like to push more, so you kind of help them.

Claire Waite Brown: 15:13

Yeah.

Justine Guillermou: 15:13

So, yeah, it's. It's also very, very interesting to do that as well.

Claire Waite Brown: 15:18

Yeah, I get it. People wouldn't come to you for that style. But also I would certainly go to somebody else to do something that I wouldn't have thought of myself.

Justine Guillermou: 15:27

Yeah.

Claire Waite Brown: 15:28

Now, early on in your interior design career, you were a contestant on a Channel 4 TV show. Tell me about that experience. And was that quite early on in your interior design experiences?

Justine Guillermou: 15:42

Yeah, it was definitely early. So I had started my company when we were in Germany and I had my company for maybe a year before we moved to the uk. And then at the end of this year in Germany, I saw an ad that a teacher from my interior design institute sent me saying that the TV show was starting in the UK about interior design. I just applied, like, even on a whim or something, like, oh, maybe it could be nice, but, like, it's so not real. And then I got selected, so it became really real fast. I had to go to Sheffield and spend a month and a half there. It was definitely an adventure. I also met new people, the other contestants, who are really, really nice. We had a very good team. Was more of a team than a competition, I would say. I didn't expect it to be so stressful as well, because we were filmed all day from 8 to 8 and having those camera all the time on you felt a lot. So they were also pushing me to do a lot of diy. But when you're trying to do something and trying to disconnect and you have someone here saying, like, please explain to us what you're doing and you don't even know yourself first, because you're trying to find an idea, you're like, oh my God, it's so much pressure. What should I do? So, yeah, this. This was a bit hard for me because I'm more spontaneous in my creativity. But it was a nice experience and it started at the right moment, I would say.

Claire Waite Brown: 17:31

Yeah, exactly. Looking at the rest of your life around, you've already said that you keep up with your. With creative hobbies, which is brilliant. Do you feel that by going all in with interior design and pushing yourself as you have, that this has benefited your life in other ways, the rest of your life?

Justine Guillermou: 17:52

I'm sure that it really benefited me. I feel more confident in myself, I think, because of also telling people to listen to themselves, to find what they want, etc. At some point I also needed to take that advice for me and I started to listen more also to myself. It also helped me because two years ago I was diagnosed with endometriosis. I have been having those symptoms for more than 14 years without knowing what it was. So it helped me to be more in the moment as a therapeutic way, because sometimes you're not feeling fully capable of doing things, but you can do still some little things, you can still be creative. It really helped me. So, yeah, it's really nice. And sometimes I'm like. I'm a bit sad that, for example, in France people are pushing the young people to go towards more mathematics, career and just thinking only logical and not thinking about creativity, art and all that, because it's really important. I feel it's both. They can be combined, like you can also have both. It's a bit of a shame and I really feel that it helped me become. It's a bit cheesy, but the person I wanted to be and more confident.

Claire Waite Brown: 19:21

That's lovely. And I think as well, the creativity, the making beautiful things, the act of making it is good for the person, but it's also good for the person receiving it or viewing it or listening to it. So, I mean, I'm sure it is the case, but do you have any, like, kind of examples of how your clients may have benefited from having you create the space? What other kind of benefits do you think people have from living in beautiful homes or beautiful rooms that have been designed by someone and them together? Working together?

Justine Guillermou: 19:53

Yeah. For example, I remember my project for a French family living in London and they were living in the house for already five years and the house was really gray, but then didn't really have time to do anything. With two young children, they really didn't have time. And they contacted me. And I remember that my client was saying that she was always kind of depressed and she was the one working from home. So it was also having an impact on her motivation at work. And she didn't really want to relax after work, also in her home. And she felt like, because in London the winters are very long, so it's even more depressing. So she was really dreading the winter as well. They had a happy memory of Miami holidays with Bohouse style and everything. And I knew that they trusted me, but they told me something. They weren't sure like, of the design, but they wanted to see. They were a bit hesitant. And also the husband was dreading the pink, and I put some pink, and he didn't even see it at the end. And when it was done, they saw that as a whole, it was really working. And they invited me, like, they prepared a dinner for me at the. In their new home, on their new table and everything. They were really happy. The children were happy also with their bedrooms. They were inviting also more people, like, so it has an impact on your social life. And then they sent me also a card during winter saying, I'm really not depressed of the winter now I'm really happy at home. I feel like I can relax in my little cocoon. So they're very happy with their home.

Claire Waite Brown: 21:59

Oh, that's super. And it just shows how important it is. And you might not even quite realize that that is what's missing in your home, that that's why you're feeling low and that can make such a difference to you. That's really lovely. It's got me all emotional.

Justine Guillermou: 22:14

Y. Yeah. What's even funny is that this year I got a. A message from someone with the same name in. In Paris, and she said, like, yeah, I'm the sister of your clients and I'm so jealous of your. Of her home. So I want you to do the same in my flat, please, because we need more colour here as well.

Claire Waite Brown: 22:38

Brilliant. What about any plans or aspirations for the future? Have you thought about that?

Justine Guillermou: 22:44

Yeah. So I'm still learning. I'm always trying to learn more and more. And after the TV show, I was really interested in the set design aspect, so I did a short course at a school in London to know more about set design. And I would really love to maybe do more of that. I do a bit more as well now for photoshoot, styling, feeling, even, like, in a shorter time than for a project. So it's also a nice little dopamine boost sometime and I would love to maybe I already did a hotel and a workspace, but maybe retail or a cafe would be nice as well. Yeah, I have my own online course also doing, trying to do bit more talks. I discovered that I love that as well because I can see like minded individual or people that need more confidence as well and it's really nice to, to do those as well. Maybe more roles also towards that.

Claire Waite Brown: 23:54

So yeah, lots of different places you can share the joy.

Justine Guillermou: 23:58

Yeah, exactly, exactly.

Claire Waite Brown: 24:02

And do you have any words of advice for other people in whatever form or whatever stage of their lives who are thinking they might like to reignite something creative in themselves?

Justine Guillermou: 24:16

I see a lot of people saying you're creative and I'm not. And I don't think that you can't, you can't be creative. I'm sure that we are all creative. We only need that spark, as you said. And then you just have to try, you just have to start. First thing is to start. And don't be also too harsh on yourself. I did a lot of things, like some things on crochet or some collage that looked awful. It looked awful. But it also worked as an outlet because for that moment of time I was creating this, I was really focused on it and it, it was really fulfilling. Most of the time we focus on the outcome, but it's not the outcome that's important, is also the process. So you just need to start and be in the process, in the moment and don't put a lot of pressure on the outcome.

Claire Waite Brown: 25:17

Perfect. Thank you so much. It's been super duper to chat, Justine. Tell me how people can connect with you.

Justine Guillermou: 25:25

I have a website, rainbowshaker.com and I'm also very active on socials, especially on Instagram. So Rainbow Shaker. Yeah. So it would be a pleasure to talk to people.

Claire Waite Brown: 25:40

Brilliant. Thank you so much, Justin.

Justine Guillermou: 25:43

Thank you. I had a great time. Thanks.

Claire Waite Brown: 25:46

I hope you enjoyed this episode. If you did, perhaps you'd like to to financially contribute to future episodes at buymeacoffee.com/creativityfound There's a link in the show notes. If you are listening on a value for value enabled app such as Fountain, TrueFans or Podcast Guru, feel free to send a few sats my way. And if you have no idea of what I'm talking about, you can find out more by listening to my sister podcast calledPodcasting 2.0 in Practice.