In this episode both Ghadah and Martin continue role #6 ‘Taking personal Risks’ but this time as usual from a small business and entrepreneurs’ perspective as they do in odd-numbered episodes. They talk about how entrepreneurs' lives are around personal risks and what are good ways to ensure they encounter minimal losses as they challenge and stand out in the crowd. Martin speaks of his own experience and Ghadah brings in some of her clients’.
In this episode both Ghadah and Martin continue role #6 ‘Taking personal Risks’ but this time as usual from a small business and entrepreneurs’ perspective as they do in odd-numbered episodes. They talk about how entrepreneurs' lives are around personal risks and what are good ways to ensure they encounter minimal losses as they challenge and stand out in the crowd. Martin speaks of his own experience and Ghadah brings in some of her clients’.
Welcome to this podcast series on Neocharismatic leadership with author, leadership expert and coach Dr. Ghadah Angawi. And executive leader Martin Hedley, where they will both explore the recently published book, Neo charismatic leadership and the coaching topics it covers
Martin Hedley:Ghadah last episode, we looked at taking personal risks, and use the model for large organisations to find most of our examples. Yeah, let's face it, though, we're not all grandsons and businesses. So this is something a bit more homespun for the rest of us to use.
Ghadah Angawi:Yes, in fact, smaller organisations and entrepreneurs have more at risk and stake to lose when it comes to venturing into the unknown and taking personal risks. Nevertheless, it is the spirit of entrepreneurism, isn't it, that you take personal risks? Yes. So we all know, in order to succeed, you must fail. And failing or falling is a natural way of learning, learning about what works and about what doesn't work. If you rise, you rise stronger, as Rene brown calls her great book rising strong. But in order to take that risk, just like large organisations, a leader have to have gone through the previous two stages, and have calculated the consequences of the decision and prepared for the impact. As we said before, smaller organisations, individual contributors, social entrepreneurs, they all calculate, they have smaller calculation, shorter time to reach the conclusions, they have maybe a team of two or three people, or they might not even have a team, but they do the calculation. So it means they know that this could work. What remains then is that they take the personal risk and make the decision. And throughout the implementation plan, they continue to take the personal risks.
Martin Hedley:Yes, I think that, from my own experience, too, particularly with small companies, also small organisations, not just companies, the rate of failure is much, much quicker. And the feedback, though, is also much quicker. So something goes wrong, and everybody in the team knows about it within hours, typically, and people rally around and support you. Of course, if you've done this groundwork, if you've got them on board, and you've shared the vision, then they just see it as a typical blip in the road that they were expecting, not that you were expecting that blip, but you were expecting a blip. And it's in the nature of any a charismatic leader to share that with the team, right in the beginning. It's raw, and it's on the edge. And it's the things you mentioned in the last episode, you know, in this situation, it's very true, the entrepreneur has their own money, their own time, invested in this. And so the consequences of failure could be quite significant for them. But if the belief is that they're doing the right thing, the altruistic driver, if you like, that things are going to turn out in the end, because the team will actually help you out. I have a real example of this in the very recent past. You know, I've recently taken on three new staff members onto the company, right as we're coming out of the pandemic. And yet, like your business, or my business literally stopped, the pandemic hit. And we had to reorganise change around to virtual format. But the three individuals that joined me, one of the first things I told them was, this is what we're going to create. I don't know exactly how to do it. It's all new. And we don't know what the post pandemic world is going to be like, how we've got six months to make it work. How do you feel about that, at first got three blank stares. And they looked at each other, a bit scared. But within minutes, they, they came back and they said, Wow, let's do this. Let's make it work. And I felt tremendous about that, because I really wasn't expecting it. I wasn't expecting it that quickly. Possibly, I wasn't expecting it at all, but it happened and it's working out very, very well. So you know, that to me was a learning experience because I took that risk to be vulnerable with them. They took the time to be vulnerable with me and they said, well, let's let's just make it work. Okay. So, you know, the mere fact that the leader has started a small organisation could in fact just be as bigger risk to them as it was for business to try and go into space.
Ghadah Angawi:Yeah, so really being vulnerable and speaking to your team about your shared vision. inviting them to take personal risks with you. And then making the decision to go on board knowing that there is a risk of this not working. But the reason that they went on board is that something in the values and the vision clicked. You all had this drive towards your own personal vision for the business. And actually the team is so the data, they know the visibility of what you're doing, and they know that it could work. If you are surrounded by the right people, they not only encouraged you and are willing to take risks with you there your buffer zone for optimism and perseverance. When you face challenges. Research shows that new charismatic leaders have in common, their ability to take risks on a personal level first before taking organisational risks. So personal risks can be defined in many ways. It can be physical, exemplifying hard work and long hours of tackling tasks or travelling, it can be also putting your own money into the business and hoping it will come back to you. And it might not. It also means you're risking your family well being by not having a regular job that provides your health insurance annually, or the regular money that comes into the account every month puts food on the table. You already have saved for this and maybe borrowed money, but you never know. In damnit kit and many small businesses that were starting posed and closed. And I'm sure our listeners identify with these things. But they didn't entrepreneurs stop here. No, they found other ways to start that business or another business. So yes, you're very right about the team and write about the risks that you take in a small business.
Martin Hedley:I think this is particularly true in social endeavours, small social endeavours, where you're trying to make some kind of a social change. And you're really going up against the world original culture, quite frankly, in many cases. But when you're in a small group, this is not just an organisational message, you're not just listening to the leader on a video or in, you know, a monthly email that comes out or something like this, you know, this is in your face. This is write down with a small group of people. And, of course, it's still a high stakes game. And the leaders ability to identify and quantify risk actually helps the small team understand what it is they're getting into. But so their followers can contribute in real terms, the leader has to demonstrate exactly as if they were in a big company, they still have to demonstrate that they're willing to do the things that they're asking their team members to do, that is still required to cement the trust that is essential, and to allow a person to lead.
Ghadah Angawi:Yeah, I'm talking about small businesses. I too, was one of the people who were affected by the pandemic, in terms of it was different before, before I had the opportunity to work with bigger companies I had in person training and coaching and I had the ability to interact more and network more. And when the pandemic came, all of this had to stop. But I found new ways of taking another risk by putting my efforts into social media and also doing a podcast writing a book. And here we are, we are about to overcome this situation. And people gotten used to being in this virtual spaces. So the essence of the experiences Yes, there is losses, financial losses, emotional strain and stress that comes with it. But there is always light at the end of the tunnel. And taking personal risks is the nature of who we are. If I want to call myself a new charismatic leader, on a small scale level, I have never given up on myself or on the world knowing that somehow somewhere something will happen that will help my voice reach. So I wanted to say to our listeners that even if you're experiencing this kind of pain, do not give up and just you know leave it persevere. Stay there and find another way. Another idea, pause this one, put it on the shelf for a while, find something else that works find another people or person, find someone who is support you and gives you the energy to continue. I hope that helps.
Martin Hedley:I mean that is very much the nature of risk, isn't it you can have some organisation that literally comes to a stop because it's come across something that is too big to allow it to continue. The pandemic of courses is one example of that. And I read just this week a post on LinkedIn, which I thought was fantastic. A senior business lady had posted that she was interested in coaching. And she'd had two or three approaches from coaches on LinkedIn that she didn't know, at all. So she blocked them. But then she went on, and actually chose to have a conversation with a coach. And she got in about 15 minutes, and then immediately, it was like, okay, so pay me a large amount of money, and I will coach you. And immediately she blocked them, because they weren't there yet. But I think what's happening is, even in the coaching business, as we are coming out of the pandemic, we are going to build back better. And you and I have said this all along, you know, in order to be able to coach somebody, just the same as if we're able to lead a team, we have to build that relationship, we've got to build that trust. And so there is a risk when somebody wants to be coached, and our risk has to be addressed. So it's very important that an individual get to know the potential coach, and understand where they're coming from, what how well, they're aligned, in order to be able to say, Yes, I will go ahead, and I will do this coaching. So I use that as an example. Because, you know, we were coaching as a habit. But you know, as long as I do, there are a lot of coaches out there that follow a very predictable path. And we don't feel that that really is his throat, well to deal with individuals, we want to look at, again, this sort of raw on the edge, let's take a risk, let's explore what it is that you want to do. And let's see if we as coaches can lead you in the direction that you want to go. So yeah, that's
Ghadah Angawi:very, very true. I think coaching is one example. But I have seen entrepreneurs who were doing things in person, and they learned they the platforms, and they started doing it virtually. And there's some of them told me that they had the fear of the unknown being speaking to public of which some of them sent harassing notes to them. Others were scammers, and they tried to steal their money by getting them into, let me show you the best way to do this and that these things exist online. And you know, but these people kept consulting and kept learning and really vamped up their ability to become more resilient to the dangers of the unknown. So with their personal risk taking, showing up visibly on speaking in social media, they learned how to become stronger, and they succeeded. And they're actually earning money by selling their services and products online. And this all happened last year. It wasn't something that they were planning years ago, it is just their agility, their ability to switch, you take a personal risk here, it doesn't work, it's okay, you fail, you feel pain, you're per server. And then you think again, what can I do that will bring results. So you continue doing something else. And this way you learn. So it's a learning journey?
Martin Hedley:Yes, it reminds me of an entrepreneur that I coached a number of years ago. And this is sort of back in your area when I was out in Qatar, and this young gentleman decided to create a perfume factory. Well, anybody who's been to the Middle East knows that perfume is a very, very important substance. It's used by men and women. And it's used even in malls to make a fragrance that you walk in, which is great. So, you know, perfume is very much a part of the life there. And everybody made fun of this entrepreneur, because if they get off it from anywhere, you know, who would want to buy it made locally in Qatar, and he persevered. And he had a small team with him. And he said, You know, we're going to face these kinds of problems. But one day, we're actually going to have a perfume factory. And so they tried a lot of different ways of making this happen. And in the end, one of the team members came up with the idea that well, what if we actually allow the people to come into the factory, they get a tour of the factory, and then they can go to an authority and they can experiment with their own perfumes. And if they like it, we can actually make that perfume for them. It became an almost overnight success. And just a year ago, he sent me a picture of his factory. And it's amazing, his big large factory out in the desert, making perfume. So you know, even as in something that you would think, gosh, there's so many people doing this and there's nothing new that can come up in this particularly industry. He and the team saw it through and they actually built it. So to me that is a classic example of facing risk head on bringing your people along with you and listening to the fee. But I can just learning from all the failures that you have, so that you can restart.
Ghadah Angawi:Definitely. And I really like to add the idea of altruism here. And knowing that you are working for the greater good, that you have moral values that you want to leave a legacy. It means that no matter how difficult it is, and how many challenges you face, you are going to come up with a backup plan that will help you rise again. So anything else that comes to mind, Martin, as we conclude this episode around personal risks,
Martin Hedley:I think that the key for the near charismatic leader is that you've got to help your team identify what the risks are, teach them, how to spot them, and how to overcome the fear that we discussed in the last episode. It's not so much the size of the organisation because the same activities that big organisational leaders do are the exact same activities that the small organisational leader has to do, but it is a matter of scale. And what we would encourage people who are running small teams to do is to have open dialogues, about risks about personal risks and the team risk and have them get comfortable with the ambiguity that is out there in the world. And that will give them the confidence to say, Well, you know, okay, if something really does go wrong, we're smart enough to sit down, plan this together, and come up with a plan B, or Plan C, or a plan D until one of those plans comes to fruition. And just like my friend with the factory in Qatar, it can happen. And this is real.
Ghadah Angawi:Yeah. So I encourage our listeners to reach out for coaching for support, whether with us or with other coaches, there is always someone out there who can reflect back with you on your risks, and how to balance yourself in the middle of stressful times, and how to identify a backup plan so that failure does not become painful, and that you can actually pick up the pieces and learn something from your failure, and arise strong. Thank you for tuning in with us. And hopefully, you will listen to our next episode on the next role of new charismatic leadership. Thank you. Bye bye.
Martin Hedley:Thank you, everyone. Goodbye.
Introducer:Ghadah and Martin, hope you enjoyed this episode. There is more information available at Neo charismatic leadership.org. And if you would like to discuss coaching or training for yourself or your team, you can contact Ghadah and Martin through the website. We look forward to your participation next week. Until then, goodbye