BeerWise Podcast
The BeerWise Podcast, hosted by Mark DeNote, editor of Florida Beer News, delves into the dynamic world of craft beer, offering listeners a comprehensive look at industry trends, news, and in-depth interviews with key figures shaping the beer landscape.
Each episode explores the past, present, and future of brewing, providing insights into the evolution of beer styles, brewing techniques, and the stories behind renowned breweries. Whether you're a seasoned beer enthusiast or new to the craft beer scene, BeerWise serves as an engaging platform to expand your knowledge and appreciation for the art of brewing and craft beer culture.
BeerWise Podcast
Ep. 43: St. Pete's Grand Central Brewhouse Story with Zac Collins, Eric Trinosky, and Travis Rebstock
In the bustling St. Petersburg craft beer scene, Grand Central Brewhouse has carved a unique identity by embracing tradition in an industry often chasing trends. Join host Mark DeNote as he sits down with Zach Collins, Eric Trinosky, and Travis Rebstock to uncover how this relatively new brewery is making waves with its focus on lagers and classic beer styles.
The conversation begins with each brewer sharing their unexpected journeys into professional brewing—from homebrewing experiments to career-changing opportunities. With candor and humor, they discuss the challenges of opening during the pandemic and how they've adapted their business model to thrive in an evolving market.
What truly sets Grand Central apart is their commitment to community. Their "Brew Good Program" has donated over $150,000 to local charities in five years by giving 15% of their top beer sales each month. This philosophy extends to their brewing approach, using domestically-grown Riverbend malt and building relationships with the farmers who grow their grain.
The team offers fascinating insights into their partnership with the Tampa Bay Rowdies soccer team and how they've embraced their customer demographic, which skews older than many craft breweries. This has allowed them to successfully brew styles other breweries might avoid—from smoked beers to brown ales—while maintaining a core lineup of consistent, high-quality offerings.
Perhaps most refreshing is their humility and genuine passion for beer. As Eric notes, "Every day that we wake up is the most exciting day of this industry because there's new hop stuff, new yeast stuff, new research." It's this enthusiasm, combined with their community focus, that makes Grand Central Brewhouse worth watching—and drinking—as they continue to pour their way into St. Petersburg's heart, one traditional style at a time.
Hello and welcome back to the BeerWise podcast. This is the podcast that looks at what's going on in the world beer-wise. Hello and welcome back to the BeerWise podcast. I'm your host, mark Denote, and I'm the editor of Florida Beer News. Hello and welcome back to the BeerWise podcast. I'm your host, mark Denote, and I'm the editor of Florida Beer News.
Speaker 1:This episode, I'm joined by Zach Collins, eric Trinosky and Travis Rebstock of Grand Central Brewhouse in St Petersburg. While Zach and Eric are no strangers to the Florida craft beer scene, grand Central Brewhouse is one of the newest craft breweries to join the St Petersburg brewing scene. With an emphasis on lagers and traditional styles, grand Central Brewhouse is working to make their mark, one pour at a time. The guys talk with me about lagers having their time to shine their philosophy on beer and joining or rejoining the St Petersburg craft beer community. Before the interview, though, I need to thank my sponsor, copper Tail Brewing.
Speaker 1:Copper Tail Brewing has been crafting Florida-inspired beers since 2014 in its brewery and tasting room located just outside Ybor City. Enjoy a Freedive IPA, cloud Dweller, new England IPA, night Swim Porter or Unholy Triple, wherever fine ales and lagers are sold. And now here's my conversation with Grand Central Brewhouse. Gentlemen, thank you very much for inviting me down here and for sitting with me in your hospitality. It's a blast talking lager, talking Grand Central, and I'm looking forward to what else we get to talk about. Heck, yeah man.
Speaker 2:We appreciate you coming down.
Speaker 1:Oh man, it's quite a place you have here, and the wide-open spaces and the bright light and the aesthetic is something else. So I want to talk about though while I have you guys on um, when I when I like to talk to all the beer people about is how did you, what is your background in beer and how did you get to where you are in terms of the beer world? Because nobody starts out saying, mom, I want to be a brewer when I grow up, so how did you, where did you get your start in beer and where did you? Where did you get your start in beer and how did you come to Grand Central?
Speaker 2:I mean, I was a home brewer. A good friend of mine had brewed like in the 70s and 80s, and you know we would drink beer together and he's like, well, we should home brew. So I said, sure, why not? And started homebrewing. And then, you know, through a few things, I met Doug from you know Cycle.
Speaker 2:He was working at Cigar City at the time and I was basically just like is there any chance I could come bother you once in a while? And just like, looking to be a better home brewer. And then we just kind of hit it off and he would give me tasks. And one day he said, hey, man, you should just work here. And I was like this business doesn't make any money, you don't have any money. I know you don't have any money, but he was like we business doesn't make any money, you don't have any money. I know you don't have any money. But he was like we'll figure it out. And I remember calling my mom and my parents and being like I think I'm going to pivot and become a professional brewer. My mom said the same thing. She's like nobody does that professionally. I'm like, well, of course they do. There's, there's you know, there's Anheuser-Busch.
Speaker 2:You ever heard of them? I mean? Um, so I didn't. I didn't actively try to get into this industry, I just kind of fell into it. And I fell into it at like the perfect time. Sure, I mean especially for Florida. You know cigar city was was doing its thing and there was buzz around it. I was interested. I love the science part of you know all of it and and Doug was like so like super encouraging Um, and it just kind of went from there. Like you know, we started on a really small system and then you know, we got some bigger tanks and then we got a bigger system, we breed outside and you know, like it Peg's Cantina, and it was just like man, it was like the wild west of like everything we were doing was like just kind of new. I mean like we didn't. We didn't really. I mean we knew what we were doing and Doug is so innovative about things that we just we kept growing and getting bigger and that scene kept getting bigger.
Speaker 2:And then I spent, you know, a very long part of my brewing career, you know, working for cycle and I mean what a ride. Crazy, crazy, crazy. And then you know pandemic comes, all that you know kind of pivot and end up here, end up at Grand Central, you know, kind of on a whim, I was friends with Zach. Um, you know, he said they were looking for a brewer and I, I like I was like you need to call these four people, like this, is you need to hire one of these four people to work here? And it was not me. And then my wife was like what are you? Are you dumb? Like you should take that job? And I, it just never like, it just never made sense. Like I was like no, that's like, I don't know how to brew lager, I brew stout, you know like. But I told Zach, and Zach was like yo, dude, I was waiting for you to ask for the job. So, yeah, he was like but you've got to get a hold of four people and tell them that you're taking the job.
Speaker 4:I sort of mentioned this before.
Speaker 2:I did, I did, and you know it's been such a learning curve of, you know, working on a new system, brewing a lot of lager that you know really you've got to be a little bit more precise on, you've got to pay a little bit more precise on, you got to pay a little bit more attention to details, and I mean it's, you know, taking us a bit of time to like really get our feet under us. And I'm I'm super excited about, like, what Grand Central is doing right now and the beers that we are releasing, um, and I I think we're just getting better each batch we're getting. You know, you know what whatever craft beer is now like I, I, I I'm still very excited about it. I'm still very excited to be part of this community and to see a lot of the people that I've, that I've known for a long time this industry, either open a place or go to a new place and, like you know, thrive and do well is I don't know. It's still very fun, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, Absolutely. Zach. How did you wind up here?
Speaker 4:Yeah, I was always a beer fan and it got to be. I was home brewing, I was in the Coast Guard, I was in Hawaii, so there weren't a lot of. There were no breweries at the time on Oahu when I was there and then. But there were no breweries at the time on Oahu when I was there and then. But there were bottle shops, okay, and I got Charlie papazian's book like I think a lot of people have the same story and now I gotta go find a barley one. I got to go find an IPA, I gotta go find these things.
Speaker 4:And then I've always been a beer fan and I kind of just carried on and when I was dating my wife, we would try to go to a different brewery every weekend, cuz there's a lot in this area. And eventually she got to be like yo, dude, you got to find a way to make this beer cheaper or free, because we can't afford your beer habit. And I'm like, okay. And then, yeah, I talked to Dan and Joe who were at Wrap at the time Dan Graston and Joe Scribble Shoots and they're like, hey, our buddy John McCracken needs an assistant brewer. And I was like, hey, man, whatever you can teach me, I'll work hard at it. So that's kind of how well that's how I got into beer.
Speaker 4:And then, yeah, then I worked for Dan and Joe when they opened Arcane. Yeah, they had me over, which was great, I loved working with those guys. And then, um, and then I got hired on here when they, when we were going to open, and uh, yeah, and the rest is kind of like what Eric said yeah, we, we opened during the pandemic and uh, then there were some changes in staff here. And then, uh, yeah, I needed help and Eric gave me a list, and then then he's like scratch that list, yeah, and I was call them, yeah, and then uh, yeah, and so then we've just been, you know, making beer together yeah, okay, travis, how did you?
Speaker 1:how did you find your way in here? Um?
Speaker 5:I I'm. I'm a little bit of a youngin when I was in college, so I had the fortune, I'll be all right. Um, my junior year of college I was still 19, on 20, and I found out it was legal to buy beer ingredients, not to buy the beer. So I started a pocket full of Cooper's Drops and maybe a stout recipe or some DME and a dream, and then ended up brewing some real horrible homebrew for my college buddy, who are still all alive.
Speaker 1:Some DME and a dream I'm telling you.
Speaker 5:That's the way it started Brewing some real still stouts and some bottles that still probably had a Sam Adams label halfway on it that couldn't scratch off we would put ours in two gallon Coke.
Speaker 4:I'm going to drink all of it anyway.
Speaker 1:The girls flip tops, life safety.
Speaker 5:If you can afford it. That's the way I started in in the beer industry in general and then in st pete I worked over at hawthorne bottle shop for a few years with the fantastic ladies over there, really sharpened my chops, got to work with all eric a couple times, some guest bartending shifts, and then I did the um. I started working at grand central three years ago and I'd already graduated from the usf brewing arts program a local little program here and, yeah, some some online modules, some more sharpening my craft a little bit, and then got lucky enough to work under these two fantastic gentlemen and then, and so how many years have you been here?
Speaker 5:I've been here for three and then brewing in general for a little over a decade. Maybe we probably shouldn't count the first eight years or so.
Speaker 1:Oh, we won't say how old you are to me. I'm brewing, yeah. So then what's the first question? The questions I have really start with St Pete and establishing yourself in St Pete, because it has been. It wasn't for so long, and then it became so quickly a crowded market. How, um, how do you, how do you blend in with the community when you're here, Because you have to be part of the community to begin with? How is it that you open the doors and welcome people in um in a market that's so crowded?
Speaker 4:Yeah, that's a. That's a good question. I, we well, are. You know, it kind of starts with at the top of the owner and he had a vision for this place. If anybody's ever been here, you know. It kind of has a distinct look, it has a design. You know it was purpose built the way that he wanted it to be, and so that's kind of where we start, okay, and then I think we've always been, or the way that the at least the production team or the team at GCB, I think, in general, is that we're going to be. You know, it's a rising tide floats all boats type thing. It was never us versus them. We are one of the newer breweries in the area, I think at five years old, but it's still, you know, the version of when we.
Speaker 4:I want you to come here and have our beer, and then I want you to go have beer elsewhere. You know what I mean. I want you to have our, our friends beer. Go try our other beer. I want you to get excited about beer. Okay, it doesn't have to be just at GCB. Yeah, so, and I hope, I think that a lot of our peers have that same attitude, a lot of our colleagues have that same attitude of where you know we're, we're making a luxury intoxicant. I always say, like you know. So it's like if we're expecting you to spend seven or eight bucks on a pint of beer, you know, I want, I want you to then be excited and go do that someplace else, and if you go someplace else first, I want you to be excited enough to now come try our stuff.
Speaker 4:So blending in it was, it was uh, I guess blending in or fitting in it was just kind of like we, we want to be a part of this community. We all love beer, you know, and our and our owner does as well, and so, and we have the good fortune of working for um Kevin and Jean Milky, and they, they wanted to be. This is their hometown, this is their town and this is like where we wanted to be a part of. So we're in, we're in the grand central district. That's where the name comes from. It's a growing neighborhood, and so we just want to, we just kind of want to continue the pedigree of like that St Pete Tampa area is known for kind of like excellent beer. So that's kind of like that's how we see our vision, you know.
Speaker 2:OK, no, it's, it's, yeah, it's, it's really. You know, I didn't know. You know, obviously I knew Zach, I didn't know Kevin. And then once I started working here and just really seeing how involved Grand Central is in the community and I guess I just never really thought that beer was that way. That beer was that way and it's like encouraging and it's. You know, I'm always like super honored to say that I work here. Just, we put a lot back. You know we work hard, we put a lot back and I think you know, moving forward in St Pete and St Pete's such a local, you know I've lived here for 26 years now, you know, when no one lived here, sure, and you know it was always about community and I came from a small farming community. So it just made sense Once I got in here and like started to really understand like what they were about. It was just like the beer part is like the fun part we can do, but like what we do for the community is like it's so cool.
Speaker 2:You know, it's just it's cool to be part of that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. So then same question flipped how do you stand out? So that's how you open your doors and welcome people. How do you stand out and say, you know if you're gonna. If you had to pick one or two, yeah, we're the ones that you should come to.
Speaker 2:I mean I think like part of it is just, you know the aesthetic of the place um, you know it is, it's beautiful, like I mean I still. It's a cool place to have a beer.
Speaker 2:Yeah it's a cool place to have a beer. I still like we'll come in in the mornings and like, look at the tasting room and just be like man, this is like the coolest place in the world. Like I get, I get to share like my creations here. Um, yeah, I, I don't.
Speaker 2:In such a market, I think, like how Grand Central, you know, stands out is you know just trying grand central, you know stands out is you know just trying to, you know, make a a consistently good product and like you can, you can come and you can have your beer, that, whatever, if you have a favorite, and hopefully every time it will be the same, you know I mean that's worked well for big beer, sure you? You know I mean craft was always like innovative and whatnot, but that doesn't mean you can't be, you know, consistent in quality and consistent in just like you know, the, the services, or you know, like your bartending and everything you offer. That's why I love this place, cause, cause I, you know we have a tight group. A lot of people have been here for a long time. It's nice, I think, when you go someplace and you see familiar faces and you have a product that you like, I think it keeps you coming back.
Speaker 1:Okay, and then, excuse me, what was the reception like when you opened your door? I mean, it was the pandemic, so as much as you could have gotten a reception.
Speaker 4:If you believe in that kind of thing. Wait, I want to just real quick. I'm joking, obviously I want to elaborate on that.
Speaker 1:Had to hold my breath for a little bit On Eric's answer.
Speaker 4:the question was like is it how we distinguish ourselves? On Eric's answer, the question was like is it how we distinguish ourselves? And I think just like two big points, without belaboring it too much, is that we use a lot of Riverbend malt without doing too name droppy, but like 95 percent of everything we use is domestically grown malt from Riverbend. We have a good relationship with those guys. We love those guys. We've been up and met those farmers that grow our grain. So I think if think, oh, what, you know what would bring me to grand central? Yeah, the aesthetic, the plate. Like you know, it's a cool place to drink a beer, like eric said, um. And so we do pay homage to these old world styles or or even new world styles, but but we're using grain that's grown domestically. So I think that does set, that would set us apart. I'm not saying better or worse, it sets, sets us apart.
Speaker 4:The other thing is we have a program that's called the Brew Good Program and he was kind of alluding to it where the top 15% of our top three beers every month since we've been open are donated to three local charities that the staff picks, nonprofits. So I mean, over the course of our year. We try to. You know, we try to give without being boastful about it, but it is important. It's been five years and like $150,000 or more. So I think that for us, like you know, a lot of breweries come out and they're like we're part of the community, we want to be part of the community and they are and they're aware or whatever, but literally we put our money where our mouth is and that's a huge thing for us and that's something that we're always all very proud about.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's one of those things where you come and have a beer here. That beer is staying in this community. It's helping whatever nonprofits or just the people that work here and the people that live in this area. So it's nice we're not owned by some corporate overlord which seems like everything is now. Yeah, that's such a big selling point to me.
Speaker 1:Okay, yeah.
Speaker 5:Just got to bundle both questions between distinguishing ourselves and also, obviously, opening mid-pandemic. I would say in general that service is paramount here. That's one of Kevin's main staples is we are all about. Every beer is an olive branch to the other person on the side of the bar and we hope that you're greeted every time with I mean unbridled enthusiasm.
Speaker 5:We are so jazzed to be here and if anyone picks us up, the people in town, I mean you're my best friends exactly I mean we and I try to foster in our staff I do some of the bartend managing here as well, so I hope that people get it reflected in their experience. But we are, we're here to remember your order, we're here to know your kids names, we are here to you know, ask how baseball went this weekend. It is really. It's community, community, community. And from opening during the pandemic I know I was walking by this place of seeing, like man, what on earth are they building? It's got two floors. We don't really do that in Florida too much. So to to see the beautiful building and then come in once it's open, to see the people who we put behind the bar, I mean I can't speak highly enough about them, but I had John, one of our rock stars, here as my first bartender here and that getting me in the door was the liquids, and I came back for that experience.
Speaker 1:Okay, Very cool. So, from there, how did the pandemic affect your trajectory? So, opening in the pandemic, I'm sure you had a plan that you probably had to throw out the window and rebuild mid pandemic. How did that? How did how? Is that still going on? Are you in phase? Are you beyond that when? Where are you in terms of that phase?
Speaker 4:Yeah, so it was a weird thing and it's, and it's this is not an uncommon story for breweries. We, you know, we had to open, right, so we opened with a lot of guest taps, we opened with some beer that we rushed a little bit. You know, very common story. It's not unique to us, but but obviously the pandemic was a was unique to everybody. So yeah, so, um, what it did? I think the, the lingering effects of that are it skewed our numbers, for you know, maybe the first two years we didn't know really what sales look like, we didn't know what, you know how our summers should be, you know, being a seasonal Florida type of thing. So then, so then it was kind of like really, we feel like those first two years, even in house we'll say those first two years are kind of like throw those out, let's start on year three. Okay, you know what I mean, and that's that's sort of how we've dealt with it, because none of that makes sense for us to bounce anything off of. Okay, you know what I mean Absolutely.
Speaker 4:And it was a crazy time to open. We all knew it. We were all telling the owner, but he's like yo, we got to open, it was nuts, you know, brew guys were essential workers. You know we still got to come to work, you know, luckily enough, man, and yeah, it was wild, but yeah, that's just kind of how it was. And then, but then when, when it was like hey, you're allowed to go back outside, obviously that was huge for us, you know, and we're, and we're the new guys, yeah, you know what I mean. So that was a huge bump. But again, all those numbers are, aren't? You know it's a real both yeah.
Speaker 4:Not real numbers. That's kind of what that was about. It's just a wild thing.
Speaker 1:Did that affect your draft versus package or moving to cans swiftly, or did you have to kind of move any direction?
Speaker 4:When we opened, the owner again had a clear vision and it was if you want to have a Grand Central beer, if you want to have a GCB beer, you come here and have it with us. There was never a distribution plan, necessarily. Obviously, we're a 10-barrel brew house. It's not super set up for that kind of a thing, and he liked the idea of you know, when you have a beer here, you have it with us. He's. He's around quite frequently. We all make ourselves available. You know we see that as part of our job. You know people like to meet the beer guys. Right, I always did, I still do so. That was, yeah, that's kind of how that was. That's that's how we approached that.
Speaker 2:Okay, well, I also also think, like you know, with you saying, like you know, people like to meet the beer guy, like I like to meet the people who are like drinking our beer. I mean it's like, yeah, from the beer guy perspective.
Speaker 4:I want to. I want to. I mean, yeah, sometimes I look around and it's, and it still blows my mind a little bit. I'm like man, like we made everything in all those people's glasses. I'll tell my wife I'm like that's pretty wild. You know what I mean. So whether you're having a good day and having a beer, or whether you're having a bad day and having a beer, I'm just happy that you're having a beer that we made. We love doing it.
Speaker 2:I think it was always super interesting when I first started really making beer and then I would bartend at Peg's Cantina, so I'd make beer and you know, make a product and then sell that product and see like the joy, or like or the disgust.
Speaker 2:They aren't all winners. Um, I think I got kind of just I don't want to say addicted, but like that that gratification of like, yeah, man, like I took, you know, my knowledge, my time, my passion, and I made, made something, and now you're sitting on the opposite of the bar enjoying that and it's like that's so cool to me, it's still so cool to me, you know, whatever 14, 15 years into this industry yeah, if a customer's paying you know paying for a pint of beer and they tell you that they're enjoying it, I mean that's awesome that's cool that's fantastic that's a good day at work.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 4:You know, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:As opposed to when you're a home brewer and giving it all away and everybody loves it. And then it's different when you say okay. Everybody says they love it because it's free.
Speaker 4:Nobody does. Yeah, we all have that in story of like oh no, we drank all of it and it was terrible. Yeah, and we got drunk and it was. I was drinking out of two liter bottles. Yeah, that's what I mean. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Oh, buddy. So that's, that's a good segue into a distribution. We talked briefly how you recently signed distribution. That's correct how, how?
Speaker 4:is that going? So I mean, it's very recently and, uh, we're still working out the kinks of it. This is in my role here. This is a new, new sort of avenue for me. So I, you know, I have the good, the good fortune, of being friends with a lot of other beer guys that I have more experience with, so when I have questions I ask them. So we are, we're kind of plugging along. It's, it's one, it's one skew. Essentially it's just itw, essentially it's draft only essentially.
Speaker 4:And we're trying to figure out what does it look like from a Grand Central brew house standpoint? Do we fully rely on our distributor to make these sales, to make these house calls? Do we hire a brand ambassador inside? But something's got to move in that direction. So these are all the conversations we're having in-house right now and again, like I said, I'm learning as as I go, trying to do the best I can. The distribution was something that we, that we thought as a team we like would need a little bit more exposure, right, so that's, that's kind of what the angle was. We never, we don't want to be in every Publix. You know, you can cut that, you can put any grocery store you want there.
Speaker 5:I don't know if they're a sponsor or not.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, no, well I mean also distribution was kind of, because we have the partnership with the Rowdies, so it was a logistical thing too of getting beer there.
Speaker 1:Okay, that's right. Yeah, because you guys can't just drive a truck over there.
Speaker 2:Yeah unfortunately not in Florida. Yeah, you know we're fighting, but you know it's an uphill battle.
Speaker 1:So it's interesting to realize that in terms of you have to come here to have the GCP beer and then the distribution. I'm just curious, was it the partnership that kind of prompted that, or was it time?
Speaker 4:Is it time to flip that switch, or I think a little bit of both. Okay, yeah, um, kevin, this is his first time as a brewery owner and so, and uh, yeah, us doing this, I think was kind of he he's always been a soccer fan, his son's a soccer fan. We're kind of like a soccer brewery. Honestly, a lot of our bartenders, yeah, football, I think there's always a game on. Yeah, so when we got that partnership with the Rowdies which is super cool because they're right down the road from us and it is super fun and then, yeah, that facilitated us needing to kind of get, we had to obviously get beer down there. There's only one way to do that in Florida, right, but then it sparked conversations of OK, so we're, the reason we're doing this partnership is again for exposure, right, right, we're 20 blocks away. Hey, man, you had that beer, you liked it. We're right up here. Hey, there's an away game. That beer that you like is 20 blocks away, right up there. So we're like, okay, so maybe we double down, maybe we double down on this. We're not going to, we're not going to put eight SKUs out into the market. That we're, that we're juggling, but maybe we get into a couple hand-picked places and then that draws traffic here. You know, that's the.
Speaker 4:Again, the idea is, we want, we want to have beer with you here, okay, but yeah, having a couple hand-picked places. It's never it's not going to be a distribution brewery or that model, uh, but yeah but. But those discussions, yeah they, they have happened recently in-house because we because we weren't maybe getting the like or it wasn't, uh, our, our in-house numbers weren't where we sort of wanted them to be or projected them to be Okay. So it's like okay, what, what can we do to change this? Obviously we're, we're always uh, evolving and trying to figure out what we want to do. You know it's a big. If you've ever been here, it's a big space.
Speaker 2:So but I think beer is always evolving too, like you know. You know what people drink, of course. Yeah, you know, and I, and it can be hard when you're not in distribution if you, you know you can't pivot or you know we don't, we don't can um, so you know we only have like a kratler machine. Uh, we have done some mobile canning, you, you know it's done well, but I think it's just that idea of like trying to figure out what works best for your brand, and you know like.
Speaker 2:Zach said, we're not trying to be in every grocery store. You know we're not trying to be throughout the state. You know we still want to be a very local product and you know I don't know we're still. We still want to be a very local product and you know I don't know. Try to try to move along, try to stay. You know, stay above the water, and you know I mean craft is changing so rapidly. But I feel like Grand Central's in a good. I feel like we're in a good spot. I feel like, um, you know that, going back to that consistency and going back to just like quality and like being being part. You know, making ourselves available. You know, really I've always loved that idea behind. Like you know, back in the day at pegs, it was just such a community and trying to build that here and I think if you do that, you can get pretty far with that. We don't have to have 10 SKUs. That's not really what Grand Central is about.
Speaker 2:I don't think it's viable for anybody. Anymore, not anymore.
Speaker 1:I don't think Sam Adams has 10 SKUs in distribution at any one place, right, yeah. So then I want to move and talk about. You segued perfectly about your partnership with the Rowdies, and how did that come about? Did you seek them out? Did they seek you out? Was it organic in some way?
Speaker 4:Yeah, it was a little bit of both. Obviously they have a team that looks for that kind of thing, but again, our owner does love the Rowdies and it was something he talked about very early on. And from my point of view I don't have a business background necessarily, but I was like I don't know that we're fully ready for that. Again, we don't have a canning line, you know what I mean. So even right then I didn't even know what kind of volume they were they were talking about. They couldn't even give me really a good number.
Speaker 3:So so from my point, of view from the things that I can control.
Speaker 4:I'm like this is insane. Yeah, Like it sounds like a rad idea, I would love that, but, but, yeah, it seems a little insane, but yeah, so I think it was a little bit of both. And then finally we got to a spot where we were like, okay, I think we can do this. And so now, yeah, and I think it's been very positive. Again, it's like for an exposure thing. Okay, we do parties down there. They do away watch parties.
Speaker 4:Part of our partnership is that they come here for away games and they'll bring the mascot and we'll have a big party. They do little ads for us. This is all part of the package. So that's very cool, okay, and um, but it's hard for me to quantify how much like foot traffic, if you want to, if you want to say it in those terms that we're getting just based on that. But I can tell you that that when we go to the games, we, um, we get a tremendous response because we so like two games for opening game every season. We'll go, we'll set up a tent, give out free pours, like you know. So we're pouring light water and an IPA down there, right? So just the bangers, right, that's yeah, yeah, so we get a tremendous response.
Speaker 4:This is our second year doing it. When we first took over last, the brand that we took over for everybody was like man. This is like leaps and bounds above For all of their season ticket holders. Every game they ask they have a survey about all their concessions and stuff like that. How can they be better? Because it's low level soccer. So they, yes, but they've been super happy with it.
Speaker 4:We've been super happy with it, I do. You know it's hard for again, it's hard for me to put an exact number on it, but I do think it's a positive thing, yeah, well, and I think they were looking for, you know, looking for someone that was, like you know, more local. Sure yeah, like I said, we're 20 blocks away.
Speaker 2:That's the best part about it.
Speaker 4:Most of those games are Saturday nights. I don't know if people know this. So most of those games are Saturday nights. Obviously, saturday nights are already nice for us, but it's good, like again at away games, and then it's just good knowing that everybody down there is like holding a can of our beer In the games. They're fun as hell to go to. They're super fun. They do the fireworks after. It's kind of like, yeah it's, it's pretty red.
Speaker 2:Downtown St Pete in like this bustling city now. Yeah.
Speaker 4:And an old baseball field was like yeah it's red.
Speaker 2:Oh it's red, it's right on the water.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I love, I love every bit of it. I'm glad we're down there. I'm glad we got to kind of use their colors and stuff on some of our merch.
Speaker 1:And yeah so it has it.
Speaker 4:This is our second year. Okay, yeah, and we're about halfway through this season. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Okay, and then why did you decide on an IPA for the Rowdy's beer?
Speaker 4:Well, because IPA sells. Everybody knows that yeah.
Speaker 2:I think that's what they had. There was an IPA.
Speaker 4:Well, I think they had four brands, four brands Before us. Yeah, light Lager, well, yeah, I mean there's a lot went into it, a lot of thinking went into this, even though it sounds kind of cavalier, but so Light Lager is always going to work right. We got to have some version of like the best selling beer in that stadium is like is, is is make ultra Okay. So, yeah, we can take that, you can edit that in post, but yeah, it's, but it just always is going to be right. And they're like you're not. And they're straight up like you're not going to beat them and we're like that's fine, we can. I mean, we know we're not. Yeah.
Speaker 4:Yeah, we get that. But, um, you know what sells light lager cells, ipa cell. So out outside that you have to go get a beer and get back to your seat where it's still cold and crushable, and then you want to have another one. So that's exactly what we did. We thought a lot about it and we designed a beer that's like for set and setting, like for that exact thing.
Speaker 4:Yeah, yeah, and I think we did a really good job. You know what I mean? Just like a lot of late hops, like real, like easy. But it also packs a punch at seven percent because people are it's 12 or 14 bucks, I don't even know exactly what it is, but you know. But so people want to feel a little. You know they want a little juice, yeah, you know. And they want, yeah, and they and and they want to be able to crush it before it gets hot. So it was a lot of thought went into that and that was and that was and that's really the genesis of it and and so our two brands that are in there, they would take another brand. We're just not quite there yet.
Speaker 4:We're thinking maybe mexican lager okay yeah, we did outsell modelo, which was like huge for I mean. Which, yeah, which is huge for us at a soccer game. I know I'm like so that's rad, yeah, and I'm like yeah so I'm like, I'm like drinking modelo.
Speaker 2:So I'm like no, no with ipa, with the ipa but I think that that also like shows you like really a lot about what St Pete is.
Speaker 4:Like if there is, if there's a local beer.
Speaker 2:people are going to buy that yeah.
Speaker 4:And if, yeah, if we can give out some free samples, if we can get some. Some people maybe oh, I don't know what this is, or where is this place, or whatever. Whatever that looks like. Here's a free beer card. Here's the sample. Boom, now you know, just takes one little pint to be like dude. This is I can. Oh, I don't usually like IPAs, but I do like this. Right that kind of thing.
Speaker 4:And and again. This is not unique to us. But yeah, people say, yeah, they don't like IPAs. Well, I was like well, you haven't had ours. Yeah, yeah, it's like that same thing. Yeah, it's hard to paint with such a broad stroke.
Speaker 1:What's in the same audience that says, I don. Well, there's, there's, what 90 plus styles of beer? Have you tried them all? Exactly yeah, exactly, okay, okay. So then, what, um? How does this? How do you, how does the community affect you here at grand central? So what, um, what changes have you made or what have you seen from the community that has made you pivot or cause you to change or adapt what you do? Wow, that's a good one.
Speaker 4:Yeah, that's a good question too, Do you want to?
Speaker 5:Trevi, you got it, I know. One big thing is that obviously a market trend seemed to be leaning towards NA and that side of things. We recently partnered with Hog Batch about two weeks ago, a local coffee shop right across the street to do a coffee pop-up on the weekend. Okay, so, featuring some of the, featuring some of our beer that we were already using their coffee beans in because they're fantastic, but then also tackling that you know, the latte, shakerito, espresso side of things.
Speaker 1:A little of that with a beer or with a like a beer, coffee combo or so it's a it's a coffee concept, and then serving some of our beer alongside.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I tried their coffee a good amount of time ago and you know I still enjoy making stout, so you know I still make stout here. They're a little bit smaller than what I used to make, but I really fell in love with the way their, their coffee interacted with, uh, with our stouts. So, um, it was just a thing of like you know a locally owned business and you know, like we go back to the St Pete. Thing of like we, we try to stick up for each other, we try to, you know, and it just it was a partnership that made sense. Um, and, and we're, we're super excited. If you never had their coffee, if you're a coffee lover, you know, come, come, try it here, cause I have been overjoyed with, like, using their coffee and our stouts and whatnot.
Speaker 4:Okay, Another um, I think, thing that kind of speaks to that question is that our, our, um, what we've seen is that our customers kind of skew a little bit older in this neighborhood, and so that took us I mean, I think it took us a little bit of time to kind of like really embrace that right, because I think everybody wanted like, oh, the kids don't drink, or whatever is going on. We all kind of know the industry trends. I'm sure your listeners kind of know the industry trends. Yeah, so our customers skew older and there's nothing wrong with that. Um, yeah, so, um, our, our customers skew older, but the and there's nothing wrong with that. That's awesome.
Speaker 4:Like who's off during the day, who's got money to spend, retired people that want to come have these beers, and so and Eric spoke about earlier like we like we love that idea of if you're like, oh man, you got to go to GCB, you got to try this beer, and when they say that that beer is on tap and it's the way that that guy remembers it, right, yeah, yeah, cuz there's a lot of like, you know, some of it is again like setting, setting, or some of it is just like, oh man, the first time I had that, it blew my mind and that's great and we all have those stories and we all love that stuff. So but when we started embracing the fact that yeah, it's great excuse a little bit older so like, let's do events that kind of go that route to like, what are those, what? What does that crowd interested in? Right, what are the? What are the? What do those people want to do? What bands do they like? What kind of stuff? So then that and that's kind of made a nice little like um, a kind of a change in our, in the way we approach things.
Speaker 4:And that's just business stuff. You know what I mean. That's just regular stuff. I want everybody to like beer. I think the kids are going to start drinking again down. I'm sure that it will. So, yeah, they'll be here eventually, but until then, give them lager, man that if it ain't broke. You know what I mean. We're not reinventing the wheel.
Speaker 1:We yeah, we talk a lot about that Like we don't need to. Yeah, well, a lot of, I think, the older demographic, a lot of them, have very good, very positive associations with lager and growing up with lager and going to Germany or, you know, serving in the military and that being part of their story.
Speaker 4:And I think that's one big reason why lager has come full circle and really it's the only commercially available beer style in cans, even if it was domestic. Yeah, yeah, so yeah, and I like it, man.
Speaker 2:I think it took a little bit of time here to understand what our demographic was. That's right. And so Seltzer doesn't make sense to us. Like like, I'm not saying that there's anything wrong with that, but it's just like we're not going to sell a lot of it. If we make it, it's just not our clientele, okay. So it was like understanding, like okay, I can't make 10% IPAs, no one's going to drink that. Like no, no one's. Like chasing whales at gcb. But we can make four and a half percent beer and make it consistently good and people can come in and be like yo. I like this american light lager. It reminds me exactly like I grew up in the midwest. It reminds me of what my uncle drank or my dad drank. You know middle light.
Speaker 4:You know whatever strohs, hams, you know all the terrible ones and it does, and it does in a unique way. It puts us in a situation that, like we like um, I sort of spoke to you earlier before we were recording but like we can sell, we can move smoked beer. We we had a, you know, smoked schwarz beer that we did as a collab with sesh and it moves. And like we can do styles, we can move brown ales, we can move dunkles, we can move these, we can move these things that some places wouldn't typically, you know, put on.
Speaker 4:There's like I mean, we made it, we're drinking and it's been moving well, yeah, and as beer guys, we all know if we go into a place, like you even said, if I go into a place and as a esb, I'm ordering it yeah, because you can't, because no one has it on the menu, yeah, but but our clientele, in a super joyful way, will try stuff Like our regulars, will try the new stuff and it gives us, like this, really creative leeway.
Speaker 2:Well, and I think a lot of that comes too from just like you know, going back to that whole thing of like we have been consistent, you know, and people trust us to like, hey, man, we tried a new style and you, man, we tried a new style and we put a lot of time, a lot of effort into making sure that style is good. And then they try and they're like dang, this is quite good. When was the last time I had an ESB? That's right, it is super cool.
Speaker 1:And I think, as a brewer, for me, as a drinker, if you've proven to me that you've done this style and this style and this style, Well, I will trust you to make the esoteric stuff and the stuff I don't see very much because I've seen it done poorly so many times. But if you've, you know I've come this far with you. You've gained my trust to the point where I trust you as opposed to I don't know that.
Speaker 2:I want to try your, you know, smoked hot dog water or whatever, and I don't know if like that was ever like something that Zach and I had in our brain, but I, you know it just worked out to where, yeah, we would throw things on that were. You know, we sold the hell out of a Gratzitzky, Like who drinks that, who makes that?
Speaker 4:And again, this is, like you know, a guy who kind of came from Cycle, if you, you know, and I came from Arcane, right, so those are specific specific things that those two breweries did and they did them well and people liked them for that reason.
Speaker 4:But then, and you, but then you get in your brain like, oh, I have to have, I have to have nine hazies on and a lot of water. But like we, we don't like we can do these fun things. We keep our cores on and they're tight, getting better every time, and then we can you know, we can go out of our way to do kind of fun things like that. Yeah, I kind of, I kind of well, oh, go ahead. No, no, I didn't mean to sorry. Yeah, um, I feel like I'm just doing name drops at this point.
Speaker 4:But yeah, uh, jason at golf world invited us to pour a beer at his anniversary and that's super sweet of him and he's like, and he came over and it was his idea, and he, he's like, I want a low ABV English mild with some smoke to it. And like most beer guys would be like there's no way I can put that on tap. And then, but we're like, oh, we can do that, like we can do that, we can move that beer, we can give you some for your party and we can sell that beer and I love that I can say yes to that, because that would normally be like no way right, yeah, you know what I mean.
Speaker 4:And but then you know, those styles die in the dark because because of that, because the difference of brewing beer and the business of beer, I mean I think that speaks a lot to like kevin.
Speaker 2:You know, with he's like. You know, I've hired qualified people. Yeah, do do your thing. Yeah, like and do it well, and that's worth its weight, you know it is.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I mean if he wants us to do something, we do it, and If he wants us to do something, we do it, and otherwise he lets us to our own devices. We get to try new products, we get to try the latest stuff. We went through a lot of malt before we landed on Riverbend. We try all the new hop products to see. You know, not for the, you know. I mean, is it going to make our beer better? Is it going to make our yield better?
Speaker 2:Yeah, if it does or if it doesn't, but yeah, so yeah, a lot of the credit goes to kevin, sure, sure, I mean I know when I got here, like just the, the, the freedom to like, try other malts to, you know.
Speaker 2:You know when I was at cycle, like you know, we brewed a lot of stout or brewed a lot of crank cream and sugar, you know fixie and and you know big distribution and and that was fun as everything. But like coming here and like actually having to think about recipes and actually having to delve into books and be like shit, I don't know what this is, you know, I don't know what this, I don't really know what an italian pilsner is like, so and but, but kevin has just been full-on, like I trust you. You know if, if, if you say that you can make the best beer with this malt, then buy that, fully supportive. If you say you need this new flowable, hot product, then buy that, because it's all about you. You know putting a good product out. And then you know getting people to come in and like we go back to this consistency thing, like just being that and like and like doing it well, so it's, it's been like such a we're in a unique situation.
Speaker 4:We are in a very, very unique situation and we know that and I want and I and I want to say a lot of guys, like a lot of guys under a lot, of, a lot of our peers, a lot of guys we love, you got to do what the owner says. You got to do what the group says, you got to do what where the money, what the money says, and I get that. And a lot of people are doing great jobs within those boundaries. Kevin gives us big. It's like a blessing, it's exciting, so, yeah, that I don't always have to go to him. And again, it is a unique situation and all the credit goes to Kevin and his wife. But you know, from our perspective, when we can sit down and like, oh, we could try this, we could try that, you know it's really awesome. You know what I mean, there's no other way to say it. You know it's really awesome.
Speaker 2:You know what I mean. There's no other way to say it. Well, it's so cool because, like you know of you know all the collabs that I did, you know, at Cycle, and I got to like literally brew with, like some of the best people you know in this industry. But you know, we were what we were, so we're not brewing an ESP're not gonna do those things. It's not, it's not what we were. So you come here and then you're given that, you're given that ability, and it's like, oh wow, this is, this is really cool. Like like I can just do these things and no one's gonna be like, dude, we can't, we can't move that like it's. We gotta like push this beer out in a certain amount of time, but here it's just like kevin's like, if you've got an idea, roll with it, man. So that's such a like Zach said, it's such a unique situation. Yeah, it's pretty awesome.
Speaker 1:And how freed are you to experiment with your customers? I mean, if you decided to brew a barrel-aged stout tomorrow, would that move the same way that your Gretzky or your pills would probably not.
Speaker 2:The weird part is, like I don't know that I think people come here for like lower ABV stuff. I think people come here to have a few pints and sit back and and enjoy the scenery and, you know, enjoy the camaraderie of just having a beer scenery and, you know, enjoy the camaraderie of just having a beer. Um, I, I think if we, you know, if we did make a barrel style, it would be delicious and we would still have people buy it. But I don't think it would define or like really kind of be us, you know I think differently about.
Speaker 4:I'm interested what you hear too, because I but you know so, um, oh, I'm just gonna keep name dropping. So, yeah, so I know. So berry house does on their anniversary they do a barrel age, that's it. Yeah, once a year. And obviously you know eric from cycle. I don't know, I don't end up, I don't hear a lot about those guys anymore. What happened with them? But uh, yeah, I feel like we're doing a cycle commercial where, uh, yeah, um, you know, you know, like yeah, like no, but I think what I my point was, though real quick, is that, yes, we could make an awesome barrel-aged beer. I don't know that we would keep like a huge one on all the time, but if we did an anniversary style or that version once a year, I think it would get like I think we would do really well, it would be a special occasion beer.
Speaker 4:I think so. Yeah, it's not what we do necessarily or what we're known for, right, but I think just with the pedigree and kind of where he came from and like I think it would work. What do you think, travi? That's interesting, yeah.
Speaker 5:I think you'd make about like 30 of our regulars day if this ever happened.
Speaker 3:They would jot this down on a calendar and come back on the day.
Speaker 5:No, I really feel like we've talked about they do trust us, us, which is fantastic, yeah, and as much as we do have light lager, we still have our good buddies who swing through it or hey what, what eric cook up on the dark side this week. So, yeah, I really do feel like and that's hats off to kevin, zach, eric, everybody in the building, the bar staff of people will come back and trust us and I really feel like if y'all make it, we'll sell it, yeah.
Speaker 1:Okay, so then, what's next? What's the next hill? What's the next milestone for GCD?
Speaker 2:That's a that's a.
Speaker 5:That's a I got a good Kevin answer. Good Profitability would be great. Make money, oh man, profitability would be great. Make it work.
Speaker 2:Oh man.
Speaker 2:I know the next step for me is just to continue to grow as a brewer, continue to foster relationships with our community. You know there's still a handful of people I still want to make beer with. You know there's still a handful of people I still want to make beer with. You know, just continue to enjoy what we do. You know, have a passion for what we do and you know, I don't really know that I suppose you can still push the envelope in craft beer, sure, but I just really. You know, I live three miles from here. This is, you know, this is my community. I just, yeah, it's so cool.
Speaker 4:I think if we could get uh Chris Johnson to come in here, that would be for me that would be a huge milestone.
Speaker 3:funny, okay, I'm just kidding yeah, hey, uh no, but the next steps for gcb, I think um yeah, I think, yeah, it's a hard one, man.
Speaker 4:that's a. That's a good question because the industry is so backwards from what we've all been accustomed to, right, so we all know the numbers. It's it's the first time more closed than opened. We've all, you know, the ones that are still around are kind of plateauing. So that version, I guess, yeah, being being a a profitable business from, if you want to look at it bottom line style, if you want to look at it from production side, you know the part that that we're all familiar with.
Speaker 4:It's, yeah, how can we go from good to great? You know, I say a lot of times these guys have heard me say it over and over it's pretty easy to make good beer. It's incredibly difficult to make great beer. That, that half step from good to great, what? What's in our control, right? So, uh, again, we don't. We're not, we don't have hop hop contracts right now. That's something Eric and I can do. We can go to selection, we can pick the you know the hops that we're going to use for the year. So there are still steps, there are still things that are within our control, within our budget, within this building, that we can do to make GCB have the best beer that can come out of this building. That would be, I think, what our goal would be.
Speaker 1:Okay, I'd agree. So by those same thoughts, how do you know when your beer has gone from good to great?
Speaker 4:When, when Chris Johnson tells you that no yeah.
Speaker 4:When? Yeah, I think he's going to be so mad at me. Yeah, when, you know, I don't. I don't know because I don't, I don't. Every, I hate every beer we've ever made. I all I see is the flaws. So when? When would it be great? Yeah, I don't know, I don't know that I would ever be like.
Speaker 4:Obviously, our core beers, I think, are the best they've ever been Professionally. It's the best beer that I've ever made, and I think Eric would probably echo that sentiment. How would I know when it's great, man, man, that's a good question. I don't know. I think we're always going to be just striving for great. I don't know if that's something you get to or you find. I mean, maybe it is. I guess it's not like we're radically changing these recipes every time, but we're certainly still tweaking them again and again. I don't think this is unique to us. This is beer guy stuff. You know us trying to be the best we can. Yeah, I don't know how. How would you, as a drinker, you, how would you say? When do you? When do you? What's the difference when you have a good beer and when you have a great beer?
Speaker 1:that's an interesting so the the good beer is something that appeals to my palate. Great beer is something I can sit and talk to the different specs on and see what it's hit, and then, personally and professionally, they kind of join together.
Speaker 1:So, um, yeah I think that's right I think that's accurate, yeah so as a drink, I mean, I, I can drink a beer and it might not be technically perfect, but it's one that hits all the right notes on my palate. But then if it does both hits the specs it's supposed to hit and I like it, then that to me, me personally, my standards are different and it is subjective. Yeah, yeah, it's subjective, certainly yes, it obviously subjective, yeah it's a subjective search way yeah, it obviously is.
Speaker 4:Yeah, because you can go by style guidelines or you can go by just the guy sitting that's paying for it, like it yeah yeah, and although and I think those, all those things are right and it's some combination of those things, maybe when, when we pull a beer and we're, you know, and we take it off the lottery tank, and me and him look at each other and smile, yeah, maybe that's.
Speaker 2:I mean, we've had, we've had a couple beers. You know here where we've made and just been like, oh wow, like man, we've never, we've never, like I don't, I've never pulled those flavors out of that hop. Or you know, maybe you know because you know we don't, we don't have contracts, so you know we get a lot of spot buying and like, every once in a while we'll just hit a great lot of hops and be like, oh dang and then, you never.
Speaker 4:You can never do that again, that's right, yeah, yeah, there's something sort of fun in that, but then, but then there's also, man, I wish we could replicate that batch in that lot, but I mean, but there is something almost like whatever, like vintage wines, right, like, oh, man, you had to be there for that one, but yeah, so there's a version of where we want to replicate, certainly core core beers, I mean?
Speaker 2:I think really the answer to that question is when Untappd tells us that we've made great beer, if you could get a five star, if you could really, if it says best.
Speaker 4:Pilsner I've ever had four and a half stars, boom, we've nailed it and that's a check Pils, you know yeah.
Speaker 2:Not as German as they feared. You know that's a good one. We should have got to untapped.
Speaker 4:a little bit earlier. You should have In this interview.
Speaker 1:Well, you know, you find that one user who's got a really good palette and then you follow what he or she says.
Speaker 4:Yeah, oh man, that's so funny there you.
Speaker 5:They got bad boy to find where they live.
Speaker 2:Yeah Well, I know as brewers we make it ourselves that we don't look at untapped, but we all do. We all do. Sometimes I look at it just for the funness of man. You have a really terrible palate, my man. You'll go through. You'll see somebody be like two stars. I'm like dang two stars, like that's a bad beer and I know I don't make like bad beer. But then you'll go and be like, oh, you know, like Steel Reserve got a four and a half Like my man. You don't really like yourself.
Speaker 4:I just couldn't give it that fifth star.
Speaker 3:I just couldn't give it that fifth star, but it'll get you where you're going. It was breached too far.
Speaker 4:Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah, I don't hand out that five star easy.
Speaker 1:I used to love when Angry Chair first opened and Ryan Dowdle was bartending, I would wait and I would put my untapped up and I would type in I don't like this style and I'd put two stars and he'd just walk by like yeah.
Speaker 4:Really, those are always the best ones. I don't like IPAs. One star I don't know.
Speaker 2:I think at this point like some people are.
Speaker 4:When you gamify anything, it's ridiculous, it gets ridiculous. But I got a badge for it.
Speaker 2:I think some people on Untap now are just. I feel like most are just trolls.
Speaker 1:Honestly, I still use it just to keep track of if I pass had. I know a lot of people that do that.
Speaker 4:That's the only I was wondering if real drinkers use it.
Speaker 1:But you, but you're a real drinker, yeah I mean I was on, I was, I mean I got my start on rate beer and beer advocate and all those sites back in the day, but there was a community associated with it. There's no community with untapped yeah, the way that there is. Uh, the way that there was with rape beer. Like if I go into another city, like I remember walking into the brick store in in atlanta and like great, you look like you're here for a beer tasting, it's like, yeah, how yeah, it's like I got.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I look like I look like so many other people. Yeah, I'm like no, but you brought and just named it off like son of a gun. I am here for a beer tasting.
Speaker 4:Yeah, you're not wrong, yeah, yeah, I am a white guy with a beard, so yeah, so me, and the other 800 guys that are white guys that are here with beards.
Speaker 2:Clearly we're here we're all here for the tasting, yeah, yeah you know it's funny you say that mark because, like you know, back in the day, when you know we somehow, magically, you know, rated so high on rate beer at cycle, like because it was a community, I really did feel like that was like a hell of an accomplishment, yeah, and like if that was untapped I'd be like eh, eh, okay cool, but it was.
Speaker 1:I mean, it's more so than I think, more so than the beer itself and the people rating it. People came from all over the freaking world, literally all over the globe, to fly in. Now, kudos to Doug for finding the niche day. And that Friday when, when everybody was here for on saturday to do an event before sure, but like you had all these people that made a point to go from tampa airport, wherever they were staying, and drive across the bridge, which the rays can't even do got people to drive across the bridge to drink that beer.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's, that's not nothing. Yeah, so, and it was also lightning in a bottle, in the fact that I I mean those beers super fresh right off the tap. Yeah, dude, there was an environment there with it, because everybody was there all day too. Yeah so, yeah, it was. It's definitely something special.
Speaker 4:We've all waited in our fair share of beer lines for cycle beers, but it was like it was.
Speaker 2:It was like back in those days. It was such a community of beer. Well, you and you met people. I met so many people.
Speaker 1:Either you're standing in the line or you're waiting, or you're making sure nobody gets rowdy in the line.
Speaker 4:Yeah, so many good beers were shared in those lines that's right, you get to try some of the stuff you never had Sometimes.
Speaker 2:I just get in the morning and go down the line and be, like what do? Y'all got man. Oh some Sante Darius, that sounds great yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, or you know, here let me chug this Crayonza Helena so I can try this other beer that was made like four bottles of Exactly, exactly, you can get exposed to stuff that you never, which is cool, which is a cool aspect of it.
Speaker 4:You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and you're making line friends and you're, yeah, you know and it was like I'm already, I'm already like nine, you know, I'm already, I'm already like nine tastings in.
Speaker 1:I'm like, oh god, I still gotta work all day, not to mention the tasting you probably had when you got there, because you've got all these rare kegs that yeah yeah, yeah. Shaking babies and kissing hands, that's what it was what's the biggest challenge for you beer wise, here at GCB.
Speaker 2:I think it's just the market, I think it's just the changing demographic and you know, I mean we're obviously, you know, coming out of this. I don't know if it was, the Tampa Bay beer scene was, and I still think it's so cool, yeah, but I mean we were oh it was rock stars.
Speaker 2:Florida was like the place to be and it still blows my mind. I think it's just it's changing and adapting, with you know what people want and trying to stay semi on the forefront of you know making a quality product and providing quality service. And I think if you do that, I think you can survive pretty easily, hopefully maybe I'm wrong.
Speaker 1:No, maybe you're in the minority with it, but that's definitely not nothing. How have you changed as a brewery since you opened?
Speaker 2:We've changed a lot.
Speaker 4:I mean, I think the focus is the same, but how we approach it, I think, is different. I would agree with that. And again, this is from going, you know, going to conferences, going to, you know the things we try to keep. You know it is our job, so we try to keep on the forefront of it. But so we, we know that there were, we keep talking about these. You know these glory years of the Tempe beer scene and we all grew up in it and it was awesome, yeah, but that doesn't exist anymore, right? So we, you can't just have good beer, right, you can have great beer and still fail as a business. We've seen, we've seen breweries that get best small brewery at GABF and they close. Yes, so, uh, yeah.
Speaker 4:So for us, it's like we know now that, unfortunately, by some metrics, the liquid is like the lowest on the list. Right, what else do you got for me? What's your food like? What's your service like? What's your bands like? What's your space like? Yeah, so I think, so, having to take that on and realizing that do like doing the best we can with beer, but that is not enough. We have to survive as gcb.
Speaker 4:So all of us, we don't, we can't think of it from an individual standpoint or like, oh, we made great beer, like, figure it out. We all have to come up together and be like we have to make coming to GCB fantastic. Right, you know what I mean, yeah, so I think that's kind of I wouldn't even call it a pivot, that's just adapting. That's where this industry is at right now. So that's that's where we're at. It's, it's, it's. You can't rest on your laurels, you can't just make beer that you think is is the better than anybody around. You know what I mean? Because, yeah, everybody's got regulars, everybody's got a good crowd, there's a lot of great beer all around, yeah. So, yeah, what do we now? We have to figure out a way to stand out. We have to figure out a way to be a little bit better.
Speaker 2:Um, from the struggle Right, which can be, can be, I think, very hard to do. You know, trying especially, you know, with how the world's connected anymore, you know, through all the social media and whatnot, and still like wanting to grow but also just wanting to be what you are and what you believe in, and it can be incredibly hard, you know, to not get pushed in certain ways to like, oh, we've got to make hot water, like I don't, I don't, I can understand that, but it's like I don't think it's something that's, like you know, we would ever do, just because, like you know, kind of sticking to those, you know ideas of what we are as a brewery and you know just continue to do that and you know improve where you can. Um, yeah, weather's the norm.
Speaker 1:But, like what we were talking about earlier, do you think you lose out?
Speaker 2:because you don't make hot water or no? I don't, I don't, I don't think. I just don't think that's really our clientele. Ok, you know, I like, like Zach said earlier, you know a lot of, you know retirees, a lot of older people, and I think they're just looking to have a beer in the afternoon and I think that suits us well. I don't think they're going to come in and be like yo, what kind of hops do you have in your hop?
Speaker 1:water, I only drink Cascade.
Speaker 2:I only drink Cascade hop water. Oh, you got Centennial, I'm not drinking that.
Speaker 4:And it's not. Um, we have a lot of options, like everybody does, right, we have alternatives to, to to alcoholic beverages here. So we and we've had these discussions internally we, we went to CBC, we went and sat through the hot water classes, like from the guys doing it at the highest levels, and then we're looking at each other like, if we're going to spend eight hours brewing, let's just make some beer. Yeah, you know what I mean. Yeah, so yeah, we have options. We've talked about it, even from a service standpoint. Do we need another NA option? Do we need? Are there people clamoring for this? Are people going to sit here? You?
Speaker 2:know do to move into the THC. You know, yeah, I mean that comes up a lot too.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I mean this is just any, this is any business is having these same. Any brewery is having these same conversations right now. How can we keep these doors open?
Speaker 1:Well, and in the state of Florida, I mean, you don't have the luxury of THC yet, right?
Speaker 2:So yeah, Okay.
Speaker 4:Our bartenders have that luxury.
Speaker 5:I don't know. No, nobody does. Oh, okay, we're a sober campus. If you need that luxury before you leave.
Speaker 1:So then, how do you make being in Grand Central different than any other part of St Pete? We talked about your audience. We talked about standing out. How do you make this a destination brewery and how do you make it so that it's? It's unique, more than anything?
Speaker 2:yeah, I'm, I'm just, uh, I'm just a, like you know, dumb brewer. I don't, I don't have, I don't, I don't have an answer. Yeah, I just want to say, but for your listeners, though eric is very old okay, I go to.
Speaker 3:I go to bed. We gotta get him home soon so we'll, I would say.
Speaker 5:I mean just a lot of it is Grand Central is now, and something that's changed since we opened is that people didn't used to walk around this neighborhood in general at all, and not even for a fear of your life. There was nothing to do around here, so now we are surrounded by bars. We have some great restaurants Polpo just opened down the street, so where it used to be a spot where you'd maybe start here and end up somewhere else, you can now kind of hang in Grand Central and piping on. That collaboration not competition thing is that from us we'll tell you the next restaurant to go to, we'll tell you the favorite breweries in the area area. So a lot of that is just the fostering the community where the grand central district feels like it has more of an identity than it ever has in the past okay, okay, different and unique and different than say, downtown, central downtown, yeah, correct, okay, that's exactly right, you could you?
Speaker 4:could. You could spend a whole afternoon, a whole evening in the grand central district and check all the boxes. Yeah, yeah, you can find a parking spot. But that is a good question. But that's the nice thing and I think everything is just keep. You know, it started downtown. It's growing. This way it'll eventually make its way all the way to the beach.
Speaker 1:And then start spreading outward and upward again.
Speaker 4:And I think that's true. Obviously, if you're from St Peter, if you're around, there are still condos going up. There's a version where you think, man, we can keep this rocking and rolling for a couple more years. We'll kind of have a baked in audience if half those people that buy those condos are beer drinkers. You know what I mean. Yeah, so yeah, okay, yeah, that kind of thing okay.
Speaker 1:Well then, gentlemen, I want to be respectful of your time, but I do like to close every interview with six kind of quick questions. If you have time for a six-pack, we got, we got, okay. Oh, dude. So, every beer person's favorite question what is your current favorite beer?
Speaker 4:Sip of Sunshine Lawson's Okay.
Speaker 2:Mine is the Grand Central ESB. Okay, entirely Scandinavian bitter.
Speaker 5:I just came back from Jacksonville and the boys over at Southern Swells threw this mosaic session IPA. I brought a crowler for these boys and we were all like what in the hell did they can on it? It's fantastic. Where the mosaic things are is the name Okay.
Speaker 4:That's a fantastic name. Every now and then someone nails it yeah.
Speaker 1:If you could only brew one style and of course you're going to probably be drinking this style what would it be and why it definitely wouldn't be Kolsch Pilsner. I mean for obvious reasons. I like clear, bitter beer.
Speaker 4:I like clear bitter beer Okay.
Speaker 2:Anything with tetanus in it.
Speaker 5:I think that's German-style Pilsner.
Speaker 1:What is the last beer you had that changed your mind? Oh, that's a good question, oh man. So the example I always use is Duchess de Bourgogne, where it's wonderful, but it's balsamic vinegar. I don't know why. I love it, but I do.
Speaker 4:No, we talk about this a lot because people do bring us a lot of beer. We're kind of lucky in that way, and then you'll still have some where the joke is always like let's shred every recipe we haven't started over, because we're not even making anything close to this good Right, um, man, the last one cause cause the that is the thing I love about this industry is that beer does still blow my mind. I still someone brings me stuff every now and then and I'm just like Whoa dude, and I love it. I'm like I'm so happy these guys are doing so good. Like I'm going to just crack an email off to this guy I've never met and be like bro, you're killing it. Yeah. And man, I think for me the last one just in recent memory that really like kind of blew my mind is a Pale Breaker beer.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was going to say I mean, those guys are just knocking it out of the park. I can't say which one specifically but you know fresh hop beers from Yakima, from the beer farm, yeah, you used to get so many more of those.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Like Founders did. One Engine 15 in Jacksonville did one a wet hop Citra years and years ago and they had it at CCB and that beer just yeah, my brain cells last. I couldn't get enough of that. But it was a wet hop beer so I be sure they had to take apart the whole system, scrub it clean all that. And what a pain in the rear. It must have been, yeah, but at the same time there was nothing else like that beer.
Speaker 2:I mean, you know, I know Jason's not at Clues anymore but like some of the stuff that Clues was doing, some of the, you know, some of the wet hop stuff that he was doing was just like crazy, crazy, like innovative for Florida, you know because we're not really a wet hop, no like pretty much the entire state could not be farther from.
Speaker 4:Yeah, Um, I had a. I had what they were calling a Polish Pilsner, uh, at Live Oak in Austin recently, and if and if and if yeah, I wanted to. Yeah, Are we allowed to curse on this thing? Yeah, but, uh, yeah, it was awesome. They're making I mean, they're making great beer.
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah, Well, and they refuse. Not it's amazing, Cause they refuse? They have been holding that line. I mean, I remember when Live Oak Hefeweizen was the best beer you could trade for in Texas and you could only do it in 64 ounces, and that's not even their best like I mean, yeah, I feel like all their yeah, yeah, it was, uh, that one killed me.
Speaker 4:It was all hops with polish names. I don't even remember, like yeah, lubelski and clip pops, clacker or something. Yeah, I don't know, but uh, it was so good it was yeah um, okay that sounds amazing it was good yeah really good.
Speaker 5:Oh sorry, what's good? I'm trying out for a week long bender up in st augustine, jacksonville. So the guys over at Bog they had. Anytime I see oat on a list, I'm like y'all use oat, all right. Feels like 10 years ago and they had this oat black lager that I was just like like Schwartz beer and creamier like a fluffy Schwartz beer and I was just like took a four-pack home, drank them all. That sounds awesome. Okay, could have been a test.
Speaker 2:Didn't even share them.
Speaker 4:No, we didn't. I want to go on record. We didn't get to taste that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was just trying to find Baba. That's the closest I can get there, you go.
Speaker 1:Okay when it comes to beer what do you wish you?
Speaker 4:really understood Water chemistry more. How do they get that grain flavor in the beer man, I know this.
Speaker 5:That's going to be a long answer. These boys let me on the brew deck every once in a while. And man, just from following these guys up, they make everything look so easy. I mean, man, a clean mashing would just make my day Not running out of water first or grain first. It's a moving target that I'm chasing forever.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:What is one thing you wish everyone knew about your brewery? I really wish everybody, uh, you know, really understood that, like the three of us, we're we're beer fans first, like we, you know, enjoy drinking beer, talking beer, uh, obviously, making beer. Um, I'm overjoyed when somebody asked me a question at the bar about beer. Like I will, I'll talk your ear off about it. Um, yeah, I think I think it's just that. It's that, like, I'm just like you drinking beer man, I'm excited as hell about it, you know Still, yeah, like we know we have a cool job.
Speaker 4:Yeah, we know we have a cool job. If there's one thing I wish people knew about the brewery, it's how incredible our wine list is, oh yeah.
Speaker 5:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:You got a real answer? Yeah, my real. I think I stole Zach's answer.
Speaker 4:Yeah, for the most part. Yeah, because, dude, I will. I mean, I love talking about beer.
Speaker 2:I think we just really like, we really really enjoy. You know beer and a lot of styles and you know getting to be part of this. You know big world of craft beer. You know it's like.
Speaker 4:For me it's been an honor and even the community here is so great, like, yeah, that's, that's like picked me up, that like when I needed help. Obviously, like that that still does to this day, you know. And yeah, just the guys. Like you know, relationships are my favorite part. Yeah, I think of this industry.
Speaker 2:And it's such a cool thing that we still do have, like you know, we can call. We could probably call 30 people Like high level dudes and they would break things down, great brewers and be like oh, we knew you guys weren't very good. Here we go again.
Speaker 4:Or have you tried this product? Have you used this? How should we do it? What do you recommend? I mean, you know, because it's every day that we wake up I always I say this a lot too is that like. This is every day that we wake up is the most exciting day of this industry? Right, because there's new hop stuff, there's new yeast stuff, there's new research, yeah, where they're growing hops, how they're growing barley, like dealing with climate change. So every, if you're not like as excited about this, like as you should be, then I'm like man, you got to find a different gig. Cause like for for me, like beers, never beers the best it's ever been today and it'll be better tomorrow. It's never been better than it is right now. Yeah, and so we like to keep on top of that and like we want to be a part of that, like to whatever small degree we can do that. We want GCB to be a part of that.
Speaker 2:It's like knowing that if you come to Grand Central, any beer you drink here, a lot of time and effort has been put and a lot of thought has been put into that beer. It definitely is a passion thing for us. I'm not sure we answered the question.
Speaker 4:I like where we're at, though. I think I got something to wrap it up. Maybe he's got six questions for you. I like where we're at, though. Yeah. Yeah, that fits. I think I got something to wrap it up, maybe.
Speaker 5:Okay, yeah, he's got six questions for you, travis, even just coming from the, from the customer side of things, I understand like seeing this building, seeing these Mueller tanks, seeing three dudes with beards stare at you when you walk in man, it's, it's, it's intimidating. Love new beer people, yeah, and it is all about getting people in and man, we'll have friends who are like dragging the guy and he's like, oh, we got a bud light guy and we're like we love bud light guys. You kidding me? I know exactly what beer you want. You'll probably have four of them. So I think that's such a cool thing of like. It can be alarming to see the beautiful building that kevin has built out, but on the inside there's still people who are just as excited about beer. No one's going to call you an a-hole if you ask the difference between a check or a german pills. You know it's really all about welcoming and fostering that community well, and I mean with blood.
Speaker 1:Light people there's always, you know. I remember when the craft beer ethos was to laugh and but look at how much. But look at how much craft is taken from you. Remember when cans were faux pas pas. When you did, canning, beer was a sign of low quality. Yeah. Yeah, I heard if it started with an A, a, b or C, it would have to be bad. We've come a long way from there and we've learned a lot from those guys, yeah, and.
Speaker 4:I well, yeah, the last thing I'll say about this is like, uh, to Travis's point I say I Brewers Guild board at one time and I heard him say one time it takes one, just takes one pint of beer to change the way someone drinks the rest of their life. And I've always thought like man, that's incredible, Right. So, yeah, Cause somebody. And the question was to him like what do you think the next trends are? And he and he said the regular stuff. Right, it's going to be, it's going to be big sours, whatever. But he's like his point was if there had been budweiser brown ale, maybe there's never maduro. He's like I had to make brown ale because no one was doing it. That's why it exists. So he's like it's not that sexy. But yeah, put seven hazies on but put a brown ale on your. Yeah, you know, I mean like now you're gonna get a guy searching brown. It ain't gonna be every customer you have, you know what I mean, not everybody's drinking your grizzitskis and stuff, right, but I mean it might blow somebody's mind, dude.
Speaker 4:And to me I'm like that's the thing you get when, like when we all crossed over to craft beer. You know what I mean, and this is from a previous Bud Light guy, this is from, if I'm being honest, like a current Bud Light guy. But like, yeah, when you have a beer that blows your mind, like the questions you just asked, these ones that still blow our mind, like dude, then you seek that out, Like where can I get this stuff?
Speaker 1:But isn't I mean? To me that's kind of the quest in craft beer. Like I'm still, my mind might have been blown a dozen times, I'm still waiting for the next one that's going to do it again. Oh yeah, because you need that. You need that dopamine.
Speaker 4:It's worth all the garbage, it's the jam and I get so incredibly happy when I'm so proud of this. You should try this. And I'm just like, dude, you nailed it. You know what I mean. Like I still get so happy about stuff like that. Yeah, sure, I love. I just love beer. We all love beer. I think you got to love beer to do you know this? Yeah, it's hot guys.
Speaker 1:I want your listeners to know it's hot back there, it's because I won't turn the air conditioning off. He's real weird about it. Yeah, real weird about it. Don't tell me weird. He grew up with a dirt floor. I lived in all of our street cred. Last question and then we'll head out. But what is the greatest lesson you've learned in beer?
Speaker 2:Be humble, just be humble about it. Like you're not the first person to make beer, you're not going to be the last person to make beer.
Speaker 4:Yeah, keep the ego out. I think that's a big part of it.
Speaker 2:You know, like understand that you're in a like you know you're in a group of other people who you know, like I know, when I first got into craft, you know I would go to like collabs or be, and I would be like starstruck, like holy cow, this is X Y, z. Then you realize that that those people are there, those brewers are just like you, man, that they're trying to to do their best and and they're looking for your you know approval as well because you're in their industry. So it really taught me to be super humble and and and especially, like, with the height that we you know got, and you know, getting to do such cool things A lot of people haven't been able to do in this industry. I like to just like you know, just kind of be cool about it, Like you know it's still pinch myself a lot of times and say, man, like, what, what, a, what a trajectory I've I've been, you know, able to be on, and I'm I'm very appreciative of a lot of it.
Speaker 5:I. I really think that that nailed it on the head. And the opposite side of that is that a lot of these brewers are humble. And I know I've hung out with zach and eric before ever getting the job here, guest bartending alongside the both of you folks, I think, got conned into a hbs shift or two. And I mean, man, you come at them with, uh, what kind of use you put in this.
Speaker 5:You probably go make some enemies, but they are people who you can sit down and have a beer with. And I mean, if you were to tell me I'd be sitting here, I could spend back at house time with these two, I'd be, I'd be over the moon five years ago. And I also tell you, no fucking way, I mean, even before Eric got the job here, we had someone who was like, oh, eric should get that job. And I was like Eric's not going to work here. You idiot, that's the dumbest thing I've ever. So I mean, eric's a person, zach's a person, I'm a person and, like you said, all of this beer has brought us to it, so let's share one together. We can hang out. They're pretty cool.
Speaker 4:Let's, let's go, have one together right now.
Speaker 1:It's the greatest lesson you've learned in beer. That's a good lesson. That's a good lesson, all right, good way to end it. Gentlemen, thank you very much again for being on the podcast.
Speaker 2:It's been a lot of fun Cheers, guys.
Speaker 1:That was my conversation with Zach Collins, eric Trinoski and Travis Rebstock of Grand Central Brewhouse in St Petersburg. My thanks to Zach, eric and Travis, along with the rest of the crew at Grand Central, for their conversation and their hospitality. My thanks also go out to this episode's sponsor, copper Tail Brewing Company, located just outside Ybor City, across from Ikea. Stop in for a Florida-inspired ale or lager today and enjoy Copper Tail Brewing's beers wherever fine ales and lagers are sold or on draft. Are there any guests you'd like to hear on the show? Reach out.
Speaker 1:I'm on social media at FLBeerNews or mark at FloridaBeerNewscom and let me know what's going on in your world beer-wise. Please remember to like, subscribe and follow BeerWise on your favorite podcast platform so you don't miss an episode. And please remember to review the show on your favorite platform to help us reach new audiences. If you like the show, please tell others, if you don't, please tell me, and I appreciate your feedback. Either way, florida Beer News and this podcast are now on Patreon. I have ongoing fundraising efforts to the website and podcast in hopes of making some updates and changes. Check out patreoncom slash floridabeernews spelled out for information on how you and your business can help fuel our growth and receive some cool rewards. That's all for now, until next time when I'll be back to talk about what's going on in the world. Beer wise Cheers you.
