Leader of the PAC

Introducing Leader of the PAC — a brand new recurring series on Facts About PACs where we step away from the issues and programs to hear from the people who have built careers and shaped this community. In our debut episode, Micaela Isler, David Schild, and Adam Belmar sit down with Meaghan Killion Joyce, Director of Political and Advocacy Strategy at International Paper, for a conversation about her journey from Cherry Hill, New Jersey, to Capitol Hill to nearly three decades at the intersection of PAC management and government affairs leadership.

Meaghan shares how a middle school current events assignment sparked a lifelong interest in politics, how a $1,000 salary difference changed the course of her career, and how raising her hand for the things nobody else wanted to do became the foundation of everything that followed. She talks candidly about imposter syndrome, navigating major organizational change, what it really means to run a PAC like a small business, and why the NABPAC community was the turning point she didn't know she needed.

Whether you are just finding your footing in the PAC world or looking to take the next step in your career, this conversation is for you.

Episode Sponsor: PASS

Transcript

Meaghan Joyce (00:00):

I graduated college on a Friday and I started my first day at IDFA on Monday.

Micaela Isler (00:11):

Welcome back to the Facts About PACS podcast. I'm Micaela Isler, NABPAC's president and CEO. And as always, I'm joined by David Schild and Adam Belmar. And today we are so excited to bring you something new, a recurring series we're calling Leader of the PAC, and we think you're going to love it.

David Schild (00:28):

Micaela, I've been looking forward to this one for a long time. Leader of the PAC is something that we've been waiting to do, a chance to sit down with the people who have built careers inside this space and really get their story, right? Not talk about programs, not talk about political issues, but their journey into leadership roles in the PAC community. And we just have a fantastic guest to kick this series off.

Adam Belmar (00:50):

Coming up in just a minute, leader of the PAC with our special guest, Meaghan Killian Joyce. The Facts About PACs podcast is produced especially for members of the National Association of Business Political Action Committees. In every episode, we recap this week's NAPACtivities, share actionable intelligence and better practices all while connecting the PAC community. And today's episode is brought to you by Public Affairs Support Services. They have been keeping PACS on track for 38 years from preparing and filing your FEC and state reports to managing your PAC match programs and hosting your PAC website. The employees at PASS make your PAC program and compliance their business.

Micaela Isler (01:35):

Well, thanks so much, Adam, and thanks to our generous sponsor, Pass. We really appreciate all of their support. And guys, we're rounding the corner into May. It's been a busy week. We had our friend to the pod, Jim Ellis at our monthly luncheon this week just providing incredible insight on all of the craziness with the redistricting. We just had news today come out with the Supreme Court, making a decision in the Virginia redistricting and really how all of the redistricting across the country is impacting our members as we work through all of the upcoming primaries this month. And we're moving into June and excited about our summer soiree on June 11th and also excited to have our annual hill visit on June 10th. So just still a lot of programming left to do as we close in on the first half of the year.

David Schild (02:27):

Micaela, really hard to believe that there's only 179 days until the 2026 midterms. Things are changing every single day and it's so great that NAPAC is keeping people in the loop and abreast of all these developments.

Micaela Isler (02:41):

But now to the reason we're all really extra excited about today's episode, as David and Adam mentioned at the top of the show, we are launching our brand new recurring series called Leader of the Pack. And there really is no one I would rather have as our first guest than a woman who has been a part of this community for a long time and who has served our organization with great distinction and really has built a career that I think will inspire a lot of people listening today. Megan Killian-Joyce, Director of Political and Advocacy Strategy at International Paper. Welcome back to the Facts About PACS and welcome to Leader of the PAC.

Meaghan Joyce (03:21):

Thanks, Michaela. I'm thrilled and honored to be here. Very humbled by getting the invitation to be the first and to be your guinea pig in this new series. Look forward to the conversation.

Micaela Isler (03:34):

Well, we wanted to do something a little different because while you've been a guest on the podcast and you've done a lot with NABPAC, our members know you, we kind of want to just hear a little bit more about even before your time in Washington and your professional career. So would love for you to just talk a little bit about where maybe you grew up and kind of what you were into as a kid. We'd love to hear, I know you were an athlete through college and so want to hear a litle bit about how you ended up in Washington.

Meaghan Joyce (04:01):

Oh, my story. So I'm a proud Jersey girl, born and raised in Cherry Hill. For those of you who've driven the Jersey Turnpike, we have a beautiful water tower between exits three and four. So a suburb of Philadelphia, big sports town. So sports are a big part of my life growing up. The youngest of four, all of my siblings played sports. So being the baby, I was carted off to sisters field hockey game, brothers football game, grew up at the swim club. So swimming, soccer, basketball, that was what everyone in my family did. We played sports, we went to school and there was a lot of lively converted dinner table conversation.

David Schild (04:45):

And Megan, when you were growing up, did you catch the political bug at an early age? I mean, by the time you were in high school, did you know that you sort of wanted to work in this field or was that just not something that was in mind at that point?

Meaghan Joyce (04:56):

No one in my family worked in politics, but my dad was a huge follower of current events. And like I said, the youngest of four, didn't matter if I was six years old at the dinner table, I was expected to have an opinion about kind of the news of the day. And so I learned very quickly to follow the news. If I wanted to participate in family conversations, that was just what we did. And grew up in the times a lot of things were happening in kind of the New Jersey and Philadelphia politics of the day. And I think back to my middle school years, Mrs. Herman, she had a segment of current events and it's actually something I didn't like the idea of it at first. We had to go research a current topic and it couldn't be sports and it couldn't be entertainment.

(05:40):

So it had to be something kind of meaty and you had to put your index cards together and then you had to get up in front of the class and you had to have your opinion and pitch it. And I found by doing a couple of those, I kind of liked it. And so I think that's where I kind of got the bug. I think in high school I thought I wanted to be a lawyer. I kind of saw that whether it was like the LA law and being inspired by that and some movies, but I had this general sense I wanted to go to college in DC. I kind of dreamt about, my grandfather went to Georgetown. It was one of my lifelong dreams of like, I'm going to go to college in Georgetown, that's where I want to go. So I kind of always had DC for college on my radar and just being a swimmer and an athlete that was also part of it too is like swimming was going to help get me to college too and help pay for college.

David Schild (06:25):

And for our younger listeners who may not know, index cards are kind of physical media that you actually write on. And Megan, I love the plug by the way for paper products getting in early with the product. That's really strong, really strong stuff.

Meaghan Joyce (06:41):

I guess it was in my DNA. I don't know.

David Schild (06:43):

So did you know by the time you went off to college that there was like a field of study that might sort of capitalize on this current events focus that you had growing up?

Meaghan Joyce (06:51):

Well, I think when I applied into school, I think I ended up going to Catholic University. So that's where I ended up going. And the recruiting trip really sealed the deal for me. I felt like those are my people and that's where I belonged. And so I went in as a politics major and I really didn't, but at the time I didn't really know what that meant. I meant I was going to learn more about our government and like how to be involved and I did and I learned a lot of different things and it definitely continued to pique my interest and pique my interest to the point of my senior year of college. I had the opportunity to intern for Senator Frank Loutenberg, the former and the late, my home state senator from New Jersey. And I did that my senior year of college and it was a fantastic opportunity.

(07:33):

I did the first semester for credit and then the second just because it was great experience and I saw a lot from the very sexy things like when they would do budget negotiations like in the basement of the Capitol in a hideaway office and I literally would hand deliver notes back and forth from the office to covering the front desk phone duty during the lunch hour and getting to physically getting back to paper, David, like clip the clippings and paste them together, make photocopy packets for the team. I got to run the autopen machine. Frank Lottenberg had one of those too. So really cool stuff. And then I did get to work on some policy issues. I learned really quickly that super fund was not super fun and I did some crime statistics stuff, but I think I learned through that experience that like, I don't know, policy, I don't know if that's my jam.

(08:32):

And so I decided I didn't want to move back home. All my siblings had gone, I wanted to stay in DC. So I looked for a job right after college and I wound up at the International Dairy Foods Association as an executive assistant to the president and CEO tip-tipped in and it was one of the best decisions I made in my life.

David Schild (08:51):

Very cool. Now, like a lot of interns, there's that sort of fork in the road where you have to decide, do I want to go and work in the private sector? Do I want to go right up to the hill into some sort of legislative assistant role? Was that a choice that you faced or considered?

Meaghan Joyce (09:04):

It was. I had the opportunity to stay on and get an LC job in the Senator's office. And I would like to say it was a strategic choice of what I was doing, but it came down to I was going to get paid more money. I had to pay the rent at the Dairy Foods Association and that's why I chose it. It was that strategic. It was had to pay the rent, more money, just a little bit, $25,000 a year versus $24,000 a year, but that was enough to move the needle for me.

Adam Belmar (09:34):

I have to imagine that for people listening to this show, there are a lot of heads nodding along with that. I mean, I've been there. I wonder if we all haven't been at some point right after college where that next step is so much more influenced by the very practical reality of trying to keep yourself going.

Meaghan Joyce (09:50):

Absolutely.

David Schild (09:51):

And talk about now you're at an association right out of school, right, really multifaceted, probably a lot of things going on. What was your first exposure to the role of money in politics and maybe PACS?

Meaghan Joyce (10:03):

I didn't even know really what a trade association was at the time. And so one of the first things I got to do, as I said, I graduated college on a Friday and I started my first day at IDFA on Monday. So I really didn't take time off. And so we're all, if any of you have ever been on the hill and know the ice cream party that goes on, that was one of the first things I got to participate in because that was an all hands on deck event that everyone in the association had to roll up their sleeves and get to work and help build the brand of dairy and our members and what better way to do is serve ice cream. And so there's a really cool event that our pack did, the ice cream milk and cheese pack, of course, did for our top donors.

(10:45):

And so it was a private ice cream party in the capital for our top donors. And so that was really my first exposure to like, what's a pack? These people are giving personal money a lot. These are the max out people that got to participate in a special private ice cream scooping event and a Trent Lott's office. And so it was my first exposure to it. I was like, wow, this is pretty cool stuff. So free ice cream too. So who could complain with that?

Micaela Isler (11:15):

Megan, you and I have in our careers have crossed paths many times over the last probably 30 years or so. And your story sounds so familiar, although I was at the state level and working for a state political party and I graduated on same thing. I interviewed on a Friday and started on that Monday as I was graduating. And so just similar paths bringing back lots of feelings and emotions. And I wonder, did you feel at all as you were moving into the PAC management at the International Dairy Foods Association, did you ever feel a little isolated early on like you were doing something few people really understood and valued and I'm asking for personal reasons too.

Meaghan Joyce (11:57):

PAC was something that I worked on later in my career at IDFA. So maybe like six years in, I was there for nine years. And so we always had a PAC. I was always tangentially around it as part of the legislative affairs team, but an opportunity opened up where one of my colleagues who was running the PAC left and so there was an opening and I raised my hand and I said, "I'll take it on as an opportunity to grow my portfolio and to try new things." And so I remember actually Michaela, the first time meeting you was at a BIPAC event, which was more around grassroots and kind of some of the political intelligence and then just feeling like, wow, there's other people like me that are learning this and figuring this out. And that's when I've heard about NABPAC for the first time.

(12:42):

And I joined NABPAC. I was able to pitch the case that we could join NAPAC at IDFA so that I could meet more people like me and try to figure this whole PAC stuff out. I knew enough to be dangerous, but I really didn't know what I was doing. And so I needed to meet people like David and others to help figure this out what people are doing and that's what drew me to NAPAC.

David Schild (13:06):

Your story sounds so familiar to so many people who I think felt isolated within their organization and then realized that there is a professional community out there. I mean, NAPAC was significantly smaller than we are today, but I think similarly mission focused. What were your first impressions of the PAC community way back in the day?

Meaghan Joyce (13:23):

I remember one of the first couple NAPAC events going to, and that was back in the days when we would have the luncheons at Wiley Rhine on K Street and I was like, "Wow, there's a lot of people here." I mean, that was really my first impression and being earlier in career in those days just like, wow, there was a lot of, I think particularly in those days, more folks who were senior and they were like lobbyists number one and then kind of wore the PAC hat or were involved in their PAC. And so it was a very different community I think than it was today. But the thing that is the same is everyone was very open and welcoming and wanting to connect and share information and share best practices and no one acted like we're competing against one another. We're all trying to hold each other accountable and help each other and lift each other up and that's something that's held true to this day about the NAPAC community.

Micaela Isler (14:21):

Yeah. I feel the same ways and it's been awesome to watch you rise into a number of leadership positions in our community and obviously you went on to serve on the NAPAC board I believe a couple of times, but ultimately as our chair a few years ago, how did you grow into those leadership roles?

Meaghan Joyce (14:41):

I mean I think I transitioned, I just actually had my 20 year anniversary at International Paper this week on the first of the month, which is like, I guess I skipped the phase. Don't do the math because I did start working right out of high school. But anyway, I think one of the things that I've learned and just from sports, from growing up that just it's really important to have people around you. So like everyone needs a great coach to succeed. So like having good bosses, mentors and I've been very fortunate to have that in my career. I've worked for some powerhouse people and women in particular. I've had the unique opportunity to work for Connie Tipton for Anne Roblesky, some really, really trailblazers. So I've learned a lot from them, but having like great teammates, like you need the people around you. And so the people have always kept me really engaged in this community and wanting to do more.

(15:40):

So there's the natural wanting to continue to take all more responsibility, grow my portfolio, grow new experiences and new opportunities. And I really had the opportunity to do that at NABPAC. And again, it's by simply raising your hand and that's just something I was raised to do. You just raise your hand, like don't wait to be invited. Sometimes you just need to step up and raise your hand and say, "I'll do it. " Particularly the things that no one wants to do because that's how you dive in the deep end and you learn things really quickly about yourself and others. And that's how I've grown is just by trying to do new things. Because for me, just doing the same thing over and over again just feels a little boring and I don't feel like I'm stretching myself or growing.

David Schild (16:24):

So Megan, you talk a lot about being willing to put yourself in new positions and obviously you've expanded so far beyond somebody who just manages a separate segregated fund. How do you get over the imposter syndrome or the feeling that, "Hey, I am doing something way outside of fundraising now. It's still part of maybe a government relations umbrella, but I'm not a lobbyist or I'm not a guru from K Street." I think a lot of us have had that feeling at one point or another in our careers. Did you feel that and how'd you get past it?

Meaghan Joyce (16:50):

I mean, I've felt that way on and off through my career, but really was most recently. I mean, my role has changed significantly in the last two years. Our company has transformed significantly and so I've had to dust off the lobbying credentials and take on a lobbying portfolio again. It was kind of felt like starting all over and I think for me it's less of just, it's the network in raising your hand, but also don't be afraid to ask for help. No one gets a badge of honor by struggling alone. And so I'm so generous again, this wonderful network. I've got great colleagues just asking for help. And I think in my experience, nine and a half times out of 10, people will help you.

Micaela Isler (17:31):

Megan, having worked side by side all these years in DC, I've seen you grow into so much more than just managing a pack. How has that foundational experience informed everything else that you've taken on?

Meaghan Joyce (17:46):

When I reflect upon my nearly 30 year career, which I can't believe I can actually say that, but I have, I think very fondly and I think honestly I enjoy the most is the PAC work. And I think because I really love working with other people and it really like, that does it for me, like connecting with folks and getting them engaged. There's really hard tangibles with PAC. You either know you're succeeding or you don't. And so it's really, I think now that I'm back in the lobbying world, it's like the metrics of success are much harder to define than ... So there is something that immediate gratification of you go talk to someone and they sign the PAC and you're like, "Yes, that just feels good." I really enjoy that. And then I think NAPACS preaches this all the time, right? PACS are like a small business.

(18:39):

You get to do so many different things with the PAC. The ability of some of the creative things I've been able to do in my career, I never would have been able to do that in other roles. So you kind of wear your marketing hat, your sales hat, you're creative and you really get to do that. So running a pack really sets you up to be able to do anything, quite frankly. I mean, there isn't a job, you get shoulders deep into data, you got to figure out why your website went down. I mean, it's being a small business person. So really, I mean, I value every second of it because you can do whatever you want. Honestly, you really can do a PAC Foundation sets you up to do whatever you'd really like to do.

Micaela Isler (19:20):

Well, and at International Paper, you've led a major revitalization of IP PAC to your point and you can quantify that. You more than doubled receipts and nearly doubled that membership. Maybe walk us through that a little bit. What did leadership look like in that moment for you?

Meaghan Joyce (19:37):

Well, the PAC growth or let's see, the PAC story at IP has become full circle for me. So yes, when I started back we were raising 600,000 a cycle and then were able to really create a whole program. I had the latitude to create a whole program and we did a lot of wonderful things. I credit our PAC board as a backbone identifying the right people to be on the board. That also helped me build my network within the company and just having those wonderful treasured relationships. We got up in the 2018 cycle up to almost $2 million and since then it's been a whole different story. I mean, our company has really changed. We've sold off, we've spun off companies and it's kind of like the baby you built and I've watched it kind of decline over the last couple of cycles. So here I am.

(20:38):

We're a leaner, meaner company and I'm back in the midst of a PAC fundraising campaign. Kind of feels like starting all over again, but it's about the relationships, it's about setting metrics, being consistent in those and really finding every opportunity you can to connect with colleagues about the issues that are most important to the organization. And it's really that simple. It's not about the bells and whistles, it's about the relationships, it's about this consistent communication about the policies and the issues that drive the organization.

David Schild (21:12):

Megan, three decades in Washington means you've seen a lot of change. Two decades at the same organization means you're thriving and succeeding. How do you face change? What would you tell somebody closer to the beginning of their career than the end about all the changes that they're going to confront in their career and how you've worked through those?

Meaghan Joyce (21:31):

I think it gets back to the network. I mean, having a network of people that are a support system, I mean, so many of us have faced adversity in our careers at different points. The last couple of years have been very challenging, a lot of change inside my organization and just navigating all of that. And really it's having the network, the peers and the support system to just ... Someone's been through it before and then the willingness to be there for other people. And that's really been critically important for me. I feel like NAPAC is a place where we come together, we share our successes, but we share our challenges and we work through those and navigate those together. So I've never felt alone and NAPAC's been a really great community and just keep moving, make the next best decision. I think sometimes people can get overwhelmed by the bigger picture and the heaviness of it all, but really control the things you can control, make the next best decision.

(22:39):

What can I do today to make tomorrow easier and just continue habit stacking those things. And that's what's done it for me and know when to step away and take time to like recharge the battery with family, friends, go yell at the TV when the Eagles are losing, whatever it may be, like find your thing that gives you a break.

Micaela Isler (23:01):

Yep, yep. So Megan, if you could go back and give your five years and self one piece of advice, what would that be?

Meaghan Joyce (23:11):

I would tell myself, keep connecting with folks, build your network. You never know who you're going to meet and what opportunity could be ahead of you. And it's not to say it's a transactional thing, but just keeping yourself be open, be flexible, be hungry and curious. I do think I was those things and I remember being asked that question younger, more of like, "Where do you see yourself in five years?" And I always struggled to answer that question. And honestly, I struggle to answer that question now because I just have a growth mindset framework where it's like, you never know. So many times you set a plan and it changes 500 times. So it's like, be ready, know what you can control and what you can't control and be flexible. And in today's world, I mean, that's a necessity.

Adam Belmar (24:10):

I love the idea of confronting oneself at that five years in, right? Because what I hear you saying is you'd look at that, Megan, and say, "You're on the right track. Really, you're doing the right things and trust yourself because you're headed in the right direction, you're armed with the right stuff." When you look back now, Megan, and you think about the future leaders that you're identifying, how do you look at them? How do you think about their promise and what do you see in those future leaders?

Meaghan Joyce (24:40):

I see a lot of intelligent, amazing folks in our community the next generation. I know more and more I go to NATPAC events and I'm like, I love the fact that I don't know or recognize like 75% of the room. And I love that. That is so exciting. And I think today's world is so different. It moves so much faster. We were always told to be patient, be patient, and that's just something you can't say today. And so I think just keep raising your hand, keep stepping forward. Don't be afraid. I mean, I think the world is run by folks who show up. So show up and raise your hand and just keep doing that and keep that close network. You really need to have that sounding board of people around you, also not just who are going to tell you what you want to hear, but people who are also going to push back on you and tell you what you don't want to hear, because that's really, really important to hear all the feedback, not just the feedback you want to hear.

David Schild (25:41):

Really great advice. And a lot of people listening to this show today are probably looking up. They're seeing you as someone who used to be a mentee and now you're a mentor with a belief in the next generation that's going to take over the PAC business at some point from the older statesmen and stateswomen. So really great messaging and we appreciate you being our first guest here on the Leader of the Pack series.

Meaghan Joyce (26:04):

Well, it was lots of fun and thanks for letting me be a part of the conversation. And I'll put a shout out to folks as I think about the next phase of life. So I'm looking for some mentors for the next phase of life when all this politics and pack and GR work is finished. That's what I'm trying to figure out. What am I going to do in my Twilight career?

Micaela Isler (26:24):

Well, Megan, thank you so much for being our very first leader of the PAC guest. Your story is exactly why we created this series and I just know that our listeners are going to be coming back to this one for a long time and thanks to everyone for listening, subscribe and share and meet us right back here next week for another new episode of The Facts About PACS.