The Coordinated Attack Against Comprehensive Sex Education in the U.S.

Comprehensive sex education can help young people navigate relationships, traverse sexual and reproductive decision-making, and learn more about their own minds and bodies. Yet, sex education often varies in the U.S. from state-to-state, school district-to-school district, and teacher-to-teacher. Callie Simon, Executive Director of SIECUS: Sex Ed for Social Change, sits down to talk with us about the importance of achieving comprehensive sex education and the coordinated opposition of the anti-rights minority. 

Comprehensive sex education, which includes not only discussion of sex, but of anatomy, consent, sexual orientation and gender identity, healthy relationships, violence prevention, media literacy, contraception, and more, is delivered in age-appropriate ways. Yet, last year, SIECUS found over 1,000 pieces of legislation at the national and state level impacting young people’s access to healthcare and education. There was a 20% increase in aggressive legislation against sex education as compared to 2024. 18 bills were ultimately passed into law in 2025, which were aimed at restricting comprehensive, medically accurate sex education and information. For example, Baby Olivia bills require AI-generated, anti-abortion videos be shown to children starting in third grade. 

For more information, check out Sex Ed with DB: https://podcasts.apple.com/zw/podcast/sex-ed-with-db-smart-science-backed-sex-education/id1819071622

Transcript

Jennie 1:03

Welcome to rePROs Fight Back, a podcast on all things related to sexual and reproductive health, rights, and justice. [music intro] Hi, rePROs. How's everybody doing? I'm your host, Jennie Wetter, and my pronouns are she/her. So y'all, I mentioned in the last episode that I was worried that I was gonna have to take one of my kitties to the emergency vet and was relieved that she seemed to have been doing better. Unfortunately, I had spoken too soon. I ended up having to take her to the emergency vet on I don't know, what was it, Sunday the 15th? And so, threw everything off. I was hoping to make that Guinness cake, like I talked about on Sunday, so I didn't do that. Cinder had to go to the emergency vet, and luckily everything seems to be fine. The vet wasn't too worried. They gave her some medication, which y'all, have you ever had to give cats medication? It is not fine. She has one, a kind that is getting sprinkled into her wet food and like mixed in, and that first day she was refusing to go anywhere near it. And then it was like trying to make sure she ate it and not Luna. So, I like tried shutting Cinder in the bathroom so that she would eat it and Luna wouldn't, and it was just drama all around and it didn't work. Luckily, she seems to be doing better with the mixing it into her food now. I'm sure pretty sure she's eating most of it. Luna might be eating some of it, but since it's just like probiotics, I'm not too worried that if Luna eats some. And then she also has some that she has to take with, like, an inject it in, like a paste that you like inject into her mouth. And that has been brutal for both of us. Nobody is enjoying having to go through this process twice a day. If you've ever had to try to do something like that with your cat, you know how miserable it is to try and get them to do it. Today was the first time we had it go relatively painless and, like, all in her mouth instead of on her face where she had to, like, lick it off her face. Anywho, hopefully it continues to go better and that she's got a couple more days of it, and then we'll be done. But it has been a lot to have to do that, inject it into her mouth, the paste, twice a day. It's been brutal on both of us. Luckily, she still seems to want to be around me and not hate me for it because it has been unpleasant. But the good news is she seems to be doing better and is recovered. So, fingers crossed that stays the case. It was a little a little scary there for a while because she was really upset. So all of that is to say I didn't get to make the chocolate Guinness cake I was planning to make for St. Patrick's Day. I figure that this coming weekend, which is uh for me the the 21st, I am hoping to make it this weekend because I have Guinness in my fridge that I need to do something with. Because I don't really like to drink it, but I like cooking with it. So, I'm gonna make a Guinness chocolate cake. And I saw a recipe for Bailey's frosting to go on it. I don't have any Bailey's, but I might have to go out and get some because that sounds pretty delightful to go on top. Otherwise, the recipe I had was just for cream cheese frosting. So, I might, we'll see-- I'll do one or the other. I will let you know how it turns out after I do that and hope then that the rest of this that this weekend is a lot less stressful than last weekend because that was that was a lot. I hated seeing my little bugger really upset. Let's see what else. Oh, there was a story this past week about the impacts of the "One Big Beautiful Bill" on reproductive health, and you are starting to see how the attacks on Planned Parenthood is impacting access. And it was not good. They were seeing fewer people were getting cancer screenings or getting access to birth control clinics are closing. The the numbers they had in the report I read on MS Now was that nearly two dozen health centers closed, breast exam visits declined 25%, and IUD insertions dropped nearly 40%. That is terrible to think that all of these people are losing access to basic health care, and this is just the start of the impacts we're seeing from the "One Big Beautiful Bill." I can only assume it is gonna continue to get worse, and we are going to see more clinics close and less people getting services that they need. So, that is just something to keep an eye on. And then there's just been so much in the news to focus on, and so I think that's gonna be the one we'll talk about today. I think there was just a lot happening right now, and I know reasoning Dolores Huerta's story was also really upsetting, and there was just a lot of heavy news. So maybe let's try something fun. I don't know that I have anything fun, y'all. I've been, like I said, in this little world of dealing with kitty sickness and heads down trying to get our report card done. But I am enjoying the signs of spring that are popping up, even though I know it's gonna play havoc with my allergies, but starting to see all of the trees starting to get blooms in DC. We're not in, like, peak cherry blossoms yet. That's still a little ways off, but there are some of the flowering trees that are starting to blossom, and just a reminder of better things to come. And that is what I am focusing on right now, in the midst of all of this just bleak news of what is happening in the world right now. Let's see. I think with that, let's go to this week's interview. I was really excited for this week's interview because I talked to Callie Simon with SIECUS. Callie and I, when we connected for this interview, I was like, that name is so familiar. We had sat in a coalition together like 15 years ago when she was still in the global space. So, it was really fun to reconnect with her and get to talk to her about sex ed. That is one of my special ones that hits me in the special place. It is just a topic that is really near and dear to my heart after getting such terrible sex ed and seeing the ways it sets you up for failure later in life that it is such an important topic to me. So I'm really excited to have a conversation about the state of sex ed in the country right now. So, with that, let's go to my interview with Callie. Hi, Callie. Thank you so much for being here.

Callie 7:54

Hi, Jennie. It's so great to be here.

Jennie 7:57

I love that your team reached out, and I was so excited that I recognized you from like we worked together... like honestly, it feels like forever ago, like a decade ago at least.

Callie 8:09

Like, yeah, probably more at this point. Yes. It is wild, but it's so good to be here. I'm so happy to be on with you. I love the pod, and I'm excited to talk with you today.

Jennie 8:20

Well, first, congratulations on the new job. Do you want to one take a second and introduce yourself and tell us about your new role?

Callie 8:28

Absolutely. So, my name is Callie Simon. I use she and her pronouns, and I'm the new executive director of SIECUS. SIECUS was founded in 1964, so a very long time ago, as the Sexuality Information and Education Council of the US. A bit of a mouthful, but we go by SIECUS. And a few years ago added the tagline of "Sex Ed for Social Change." And since the 60s, SIECUS has been the leading engine behind comprehensive sexuality education in the US. We've done the research, we've defined what sex ed is and should be, we've set national standards. And currently we work on advocacy policy and coalition building to make sure that young people across America have access to comprehensive sexuality education. I feel like that's like an important thing to like dig in a little bit because as you and I both know, the sex eds you get really vary state-to-state, school district-to-school district. It can even be like teacher-to-teacher. So, like, what do we mean when we say comprehensive sex education? Yeah, it's so important to ask also because you know, in our field we throw around a lot of jargon and terminology, and it's important that that we define what we're talking about because it really is important that sex ed is comprehensive. And what we mean by that is that it is age-appropriate, it is accurate, and it includes information and skills related to a wide range of topics. A lot of people hear sex ed and they think sex, and absolutely, it's important to talk about sexuality and sexual health, but sex ed also includes anatomy, body parts, it includes discussion of consent, healthy relationships, violence prevention, recognition of abuse. It includes in these days, you know, media literacy, how to understand what is true and what is disinformation online, and of course, it includes you know how babies get made and how to prevent unintended pregnancy and contraception and HIV, and many more. So, I think it's just really important that when we talk about comprehensive sex ed and the sex ed that SIECUS is really fighting for, it is this inclusive set of topics that gets delivered to young people in an age-tailored way as they grow up.

Jennie 10:56

So, what you're saying is the sex ed I had from the nun saying that you have sex and you're gonna get this horrible disease and you're gonna die is not comprehensive sex ed?

Speaker 1 11:06

No, it is not. And that is the sex ed I had too, Jennie. I grew up in Florida. I did not get sex ed from a nun, but it might as well have been from a nun. It was "don't have sex until you're married." It was full of shame, it was full of stigma. Frankly, it's been something I've had to work kind of to fight against my whole life-- this sort of initial, like, shame. That is in there deep. It is in there deep because young people, their brains are still developing, they're still learning about the world. And so, to get in at that time, it really does create this foundation. And so, yeah, that is not comprehensive sex ed. That is not the kind of sex ed we want for young people. It is the kind of sex ed that too many young people have received, like you and I did, and still receive in America today. But that was actually like that. Because I later learned as a Peace Corps volunteer what good sex ed was. I later was asked to to be a sex educator, and I learned what good sex ed really looks like, and I learned that I had a very bad sex ed. I also saw firsthand what happens when young people get good, comprehensive sex ed. I saw young people understand sort of internalized gender norms. I saw them understand what is abuse and how to report abuse. I saw them understand how to choose, when and if they wanted to get pregnant and what to do about that, and that that can set young people on this trajectory in life that that they choose, you know, that that is that is what they want. And I think that is so important. And seeing that is what made me decide to dedicate my career to to adolescent sexual and reproductive health and rights, to sex ed, and and as you reference, like we know each other because I started in the global space. I spent 20 years on global sexual and reproductive health and rights, as I know you and many of your listeners have. And even during that time, I kind of always wondered like, why is the domestic, meaning the US context, sex ed so separate from the global work on sex ed? Because ultimately we are all fighting for the same thing, and we are all fighting in really difficult, fairly conservative contexts. And so, it feels like such an honor and a privilege to get to take what I've learned globally for so many years and bring that to the US domestic context as the new Executive Director of SIECUS, and vice versa. I mean, help harness some of that learning that we've had here in the US over many, many, many, many years and share that out with our global colleagues. So it feels like a really wonderful opportunity to continue to advance this mission that I care so much about.

Jennie 13:57

I'm really glad that you know the role of intimate partner violence being talked about in sex ed because young people are a group that is kind of disproportionately impacted as someone who experienced intimate partner violence at a young age. I didn't know the full scope of what is covered in that because that hides like a whole range of of what is under intimate partner violence. And if I had a better understanding, I may have understood what was happening until like it was like decades later as I was doing this work and like learning more, and I was like, uh oh, like that wasn't just like a bad situation, this was like intimate partner violence. So it's so important that young people learn about this at a young age.

Callie 14:39

I'm so sorry that happened to you. I mean, it is... unfortunately your experience is not... you are not the only one, right? I mean, there are so many young people who experience a wide range of intimate partner violence, and the only way that so many young people would ever know that they were experiencing that or what to do is through is through sex ed. One of the key- we have we have great evidence on sex ed. This is one of those things that's been studied for 30+ years, and we have really good, we have really good evidence, and one of the key bodies of evidence that we have says that young people who receive comprehensive sexuality education are more likely to recognize abuse, report abuse, and less likely to perpetrate abuse, which are really powerful outcomes. As long as we don't talk about that as a as a key and important part of sex ed.

Jennie 15:32

Okay, so I also saw SIECUS recently released their annual legislative look ahead. Can you tell us a little bit about that and what was in it?

Callie 15:41

Yes, I am happy to. I'm so excited to be here to talk about it. SIECUS, every year, develops an annual legislative look ahead. We summarize what happened in the past year. So, in this case, the report that we recently released summarized what happened legislatively and politically around sex ed in 2025, and we predict what's coming down the pike for sex ed in 2026. A lot of what we predicted, we are already starting to see play out right now. But that's the report, and we it's you know it's available on our website, it's a great report, and I'm excited to dig into it a little bit with you.

Jennie 16:17

So, we do an annual 50 state report card that should be coming out. Honestly, when this episode comes out, it might be like have come out that day, or that week, so keep an eye out for it. But we track sex education and what is required, but you also track bills, and last year you saw over a thousand bills that were impacting young people's access to health care and education. Can you tell us a little bit about that and what this moment is?

Callie 16:47

Yeah, absolutely. We tracked a thousand bills at federal and state level. It's a lot. The SIECUS team is amazing. I am so lucky to get to work with them. They work really hard every day, and they tracked these bills, and I'll say a few things about that. So, first of all, we saw a 20% increase in regressive or restrictive legislation targeting sex ed compared to 2024. So we are seeing year-on-year substantial increases in the attacks on sex ed, which tells me that there is a coordinated and well-funded and purposeful attack on sex ed that is happening in America. This is not sort of random ad hoc legislation. This is coordinated, this is targeted, this is well funded. In 2025, we saw 18 sex ed-specific bills that were ultimately passed into law. Every single one of them was restricting access to medically accurate, comprehensive sex ed for young people in America.

Jennie 17:51

Yeah, I mean, that definitely bears out with what our report card is gonna say. Like, I saw movement and it was definitely in sex ed where I saw things in areas we measure that were getting worse. And I also think it's important to note with sex ed, like again, the variability state by state, but often in states where you assume that it would be really good, that is not necessarily true. Every year I'm doing the report card, I'm always shocked that like Massachusetts doesn't require sex ed. The sex ed required in New York is also not very good for like the measures we have. Like, there are states where you would assume it is much better, where it is not.

Callie 18:30

That is absolutely right. And I was about to say, like Massachusetts, and then you said Massachusetts. It's a classic example. Classic example.

Jennie 18:39

Every year, I'm like wait, what?

Callie 18:40

Yes. And and I think, you know, there's lots of reasons for that, and we talk with our colleagues in Massachusetts about it often. But one thing I'll say, which I think is an important thing to remember, is that when you ask parents if they want their kids to learn about consent and bodily autonomy and how to prevent an unintended pregnancy, parents overwhelmingly say yes in the United States. Overwhelmingly. Like, 98% of parents respond yes to that question when they talk about their high school kids. And yet, most parents, most community members don't understand or don't know that there is this systematic attack on sex ed. They don't know that they have to actually fight back and raise their voices to get good sex ed for their kid. And so, in a state like Massachusetts, where you would expect to see sex ed, really great sex ed legislation, you know, one of the challenges we have is that there's just not this public uprising demanding sex ed that there really should be. And I think it's because a lot of parents just assume it's gonna happen for their kids, especially if they live in a state that has more progressive policies overall. And so they just don't take the action they need to fight for sex ed. And that's one of the things that you know we really work on at SIECUS is trying to increase public awareness of the need to actively fight for your kid to get medically accurate information in schools.

Jennie 20:13

You mentioned that this seems like it's a coordinated attack. It feels like that's worth digging in more. What are we seeing in terms of coordination?

Callie 20:21

I'm so glad you asked because this is something that really shocks me daily in my job. But it shouldn't. And here's why. We know, those of us who are fighting for good sex ed, that sex ed has all these wonderful outcomes when done well, right? It we just talked about how it helps prevent violence and abuse, and how it improves gender equity, how it helps affirm the identities of young people, it it helps understand consent. The thing is, we know it does that. And the opposition, you know, the anti-rights, the regressive minority, also knows that sex ed can do that. They know that if they reach young people in mass, they can spread their disinformation about contraception, about sexual orientation and gender identity, about abortion. And if they reach kids and young people at a time when their worldviews are sort of still being formed, when their views are not yet cemented, they are more likely to turn those young people into people who are living with this disinformation and who grow up to become voters and who grow up to become policymakers who will then perpetuate anti-rights legislation, who will then vote against the rights of people in this country. And I think that the fact that they know that means that those anti-right opposition groups are actively coordinating amongst themselves and actively spending millions, like millions of dollars to make sex ed a battleground, really, for reproductive rights, health and justice, for gender equity, for LGBTQIA equity, for racial justice, and so much more. And they have the resources to coordinate, right? Like we see copycat legislation across the country. We see opposition groups having these lavish retreats with politicians where they are teaching them about how to run these bills that are gonna limit accurate information for young people. So, it really is a coordinate attack. And I will just have to say that I recently forced myself to read the Heritage Foundation's most recent like radical roadmap. I don't know if you've looked at this, it's called "Saving America by Saving the Family." It is pretty horrific, and it outlines in black and white this dystopian agenda, and they make it clear that that attacking sex ed. And hijacking sex ed, using sex ed to teach that girls and young women belong, you know, married and at the home and sort of abundantly procreating is their agenda. Like, they write that down. It is their agenda. So, they make it clear that this is a targeted policy attack on sex ed at scale.

Jennie 23:21

And I think this is a report that's flying a little bit under the radar right now. Like I have seen a couple pieces written about it, but not very much. These are the same people who brought you Project 2025. So it is something that definitely needs to be taken seriously. And unfortunately, I have not had the time to dig into it yet. But the things I have read are very disconcerting. So can you maybe tell us a little bit more about it? Because I do think it is really kind of like an under-the-radar thing at the moment.

Callie 23:53

Yeah, and it is very, I mean, disconcerting is a is a great word and maybe even an understatement. And I'll just say, you know, there's a lot to say about it. You may even want to do a whole episode on it. Coming up.

Jennie 24:03

Feels like it.

Callie 24:05

It is long and it is detailed, and it's important because we have seen that project 2025 has served as essentially a checklist, right, for the current administration. Even things that seemed too radical and and unlikely to happen a year and a half ago or more are now being put in place in our country. And so it is important to pay attention to these kinds of reports that honestly, if you had asked me a couple of years ago, I would have said, like, eh, it's just, you know, it's too, it's too radical. It's trying to take us back a hundred years, it will never happen. And absolutely, I've now been proven wrong, and I think we need to pay attention. Like Project 2025, this roadmap is built on a foundation of you know, white nationalist nostalgia, characterized by homophobia and transphobia and racism and misogyny. And I think it is it makes clear that they want to teach our kids, you know, that there is only one sort of correct path in life, that it is heterosexual marriage and abundant procreation, that women should not be in the workforce, and that they really double down on using sex ed as a vehicle to advance those those goals. The goals of teaching kids there's only one right path. It's something that we often call success sequencing in our sex ed space, I guess you could say, and they really double down on that, and they talk a lot about a bunch of other horrible policy propositions that would systematically chip away at the liberties and lives of women and girls, people of color, LGBTQI individuals. And I think, you know, it's definitely worth unpacking and paying attention to this.

Jennie 25:51

Yeah, and just to be like explicit, you talk about like the sequencing of like married and then kids, but also being very clear that it's talking about a family that is a man and a woman married and having kids. It has a really narrow view of what is family, and that is definitely one of those things you need to keep an eye on when they're talking about doing things to protect the family. They mean a man, woman, and their children, and not any other interpretation of family.

Callie 26:22

That is exactly right, which is outrageous and harmful and stigmatizing and shame-inducing for young people. And I'll just flag that it is painful to read this report. My team at SIECUS has done it. We have written a terrific analysis of it, both summarizing some of these broader principles, like this extremely narrow view of what is a family, and also the implications for sex ed. And that'll be coming out very soon from SIECUS if it's not already out by the time that our listeners are listening to us. So, check it out. And I encourage folks to really pay attention to this and think about how we how we gear up to fight back against these policy propositions.

Jennie 27:02

And I think this is a little bit of where you and I having been in the global space serves us because this is something that we have seen certain administrations pushing, like at the UN, in the UN space and negotiations, and you see that in that space. This is, I feel like, one of the first times we've really seen this so explicitly in the domestic space versus like in the global areas for where you're seeing the anti-rights agenda really pushing.

Callie 27:29

You're absolutely right. I mean, we've been grappling with this in the global space for so long, but it is it is explicitly targeting the US context with very clear policy moves that would enshrine these... I hesitate to call them values, because they are not values... that would enshrine these mistaken beliefs in law and policy in the US.

Jennie 27:55

So I guess that makes me think of like you talked about the how they have success sequencing and pushing for success sequencing. Are you starting to see that as you're tracking state bills?

Callie 28:06

Absolutely. So in our legislative look ahead, we predict or discuss some key legislative trends that we expected to see coming down the pike in 2026. And one of those key trends that we anticipated seeing is around success sequencing. And in fact, that's exactly what's happening right now. It's you know, it's state legislative seasons or sessions around the country, and we are seeing that play out. So, this legislation is legislation that says that students must learn this very specific narrow life path. And it's exactly what you said. It's this idea that, first of all, you should wait until you get married to have sex, which is a rebrand of abstinence only until marriage, which we know is extremely ineffective. It's an extremely ineffective way of delivering sex ed, right? It just absolutely does not work. It doesn't work for their own objectives, it does not actually delay sex until marriage, so it doesn't work for their own stated objectives, but of course, it also results in shame and stigma and does not help young people prevent unintended pregnancies or prevent HIV if that's their goal. So what we end up seeing is that we have this rebrand of absence only until marriage, which is part of the success sequence. And then, as you rightly said, the rest of the success sequence is this uh is that you must get married, marriage must be to a member of the opposite sex, right? Like a very heteronormative view of marriage and family. And embedded in that is not just this success sequence that they call it, but also this idea that if you are a woman married to a man, that you are then responsible for having many children and staying home to raise those children. So it is this very gender inequitable, sort of anti-rights approach to life and the success sequences being promoted in legislation. We've only seen only four bills so far this year being introduced with this legislation. But the thing that makes this really important to follow is that as I was saying earlier, we are watching a coordinated attack on sex ed. And what the opposition does is they introduce a few bills in a few places and they see what works, right? They see what language is more likely to get the most votes. They see what language will mask some of the most horrible parts of the bill. They call it something like success sequencing, and everybody on the surface says, I want my kid to be successful, right? They're so good at the naming. They're so good at it, they're so good at it. You know, they call it something that every family says, I want my kid to be successful in life. Of course, I want them to be taught how to be successful. And so they are testing these bills, right? They're testing these bills in four states so far, and I we we expect and we are anticipating that a few of them will likely pass, and then we will see almost a complete scale of this kind of legislation in the future, just like we've seen with Baby Olivia bills, if you've heard of those.

Jennie 31:11

Yeah, so I was gonna ask about other trends, but I think the "Baby Olivia" bill is like the big trend right now. I feel like people probably have seen some stuff about it, but maybe let's let's dig into that a little bit. What do what are the "Baby Olivia" bills?

Speaker 1 31:26

Oh yeah. I hope your listeners have heard of "Baby Olivia" bills, but but I'm glad to talk about it a bit, which is to say that these bills are requiring young people, and I want to be clear, they are often targeting third graders. Like I have a daughter, she's in second grade. She is, would be in third grade next year, and if I lived in a different state that was not DC, she would likely be exposed to one of these videos. These videos are medically inaccurate, fetal development videos. They are generated with AI, and they are ultimately trying to indoctrinate our kids against abortion in third grade.

Jennie 32:04

Wow.

Callie 32:05

There have been 35 of these bills introduced so far this state legislative session. At least one of those bills has already made it to a governor's desk in South Dakota. And to be clear, the national sex ed standards, which SIECUS co-authored with a few other orgs, has no problem teaching fetal development. But we do have a very big problem with a teaching inaccurate fetal development, that is medically inaccurate. But also, these bills are being pushed in states that don't have any other sex ed. So these kids are not- they are learning medically inaccurate information outside of the context of all the other really important things that kids should be learning about development and their bodies and health and well-being.

Jennie 32:54

Okay, so beyond the "Baby Olivia" bills, what else are you seeing in terms of trends happening at the state level?

Callie 33:03

The first one I'll mention is the bans on sexual orientation and gender identity, and even discussing or introducing that concept at all in schools and in sex ed. And we know that this is harmful across so many fronts, right? We know for sure that removing content on sexual orientation and gender identity harms young people, LGBTQIA young people. They do not see themselves reflected, they do not see themselves affirmed. That has demonstrated negative impacts when you take it out and positive impacts when you put it in. But also, and I think this is important, evidence tells us that when we include topics around sexual orientation and gender identity in sex ed, it builds empathy and it creates positive impacts for all young people in that school, not just young people who identify as LGBTQIA. And that is super important to note, and it is part of why I think they are continuing to fight to include these bills because they know that young people, when they build empathy and you know, we raise better humans. And there have been 14 bills so far introduced trying to ban sexual orientation and gender identity content at the state level so far. It's really bleak and it's really something we've got to fight against. The other trend I'll mention is it's a tricky one. And it's being introduced as adoption education mandates. And let me be clear that comprehensive sexuality education already includes comprehensive pregnancy options, of which adoption is one. So, no problem introducing the idea of adoption. The problem is this legislation is presenting requiring educators present to present adoption as the only available option, which is essentially a disinformation campaign against abortion as an option, right? It is, and we've seen four of these bills introduced so far. Again, we believe that this is going to be one of those things where they're testing the water in a few places and then they're going to try to scale it up and replicate it, do copycat bills. And it is one of those that, again, on the surface, most folks would likely say, 'sure, it's fine if my kid learns about adoption as an option,' but that's not what this is. This is teaching about adoption as the only and the best option, which is absolutely disinformation.

Jennie 35:41

And I also think it's important to be clear that adoption is an alternative to parenting, not an alternative to pregnancy. Like exactly right. That is the distinction. And if people want to learn more about adoption and all the issues around it, check out Gretchen Sisson's book, Relinquished, and we'll also include a link in our show notes. We had Gretchen on when her book first came out talking about it, and there are a lot of issues around adoption to think about.

Callie 36:13

I'm so glad you said that, and I do hope your listeners will take a look at that book because it's very complicated. It's very complicated when we start mandating that educators teach our kids a very specific set of messaging around adoption that doesn't reflect the full complexity of the issue.

Jennie 36:28

That is so bleak, and there have to be are please tell me, please, that there are some bright spots. Are there some bright spots? Yes, I'm glad you asked. There are some bright spots. In fact, you know, there's actually some bright spots as it relates to "Baby Olivia." There were two bills that were introduced this session, one in Wyoming and one in Utah, that both have have died. They're they're both they're not gonna advance. So, we do see bright spots. The anti-rights folks are are well coordinated and well, well, well funded. But we are fighting back. SIECUS and our many partners at state and national level see these threats for what they are, which is threats on the well-being of our young people, threats on their ability to grow up healthy and strong. And we are coordinating a response, right? We convene state partners to learn from each other, to learn from the strategies that worked to fight back from one state and try to use that in a different state. We are convening our partners to share with each other and share with them talking points and resources and you know, fact sheets that show here is where baby Olivia is medically inaccurate and how you should push back against that. And so we are seeing some success, like I mentioned in Wyoming and Utah. You know, we're also seeing some other bright spots in states where we're seeing some positive legislative trends actually. They're a bit few and far between, but they are there. You know, we see some states that are seeking to enhance or ensure that certain elements of comprehensive sex ed are being delivered to young people. So, we've seen states that have moved forward legislation that's trying to include more awareness of sexual assault and abuse prevention in sex ed. As you and I discussed earlier, that is part of comprehensive sex ed, but certainly it is helpful to have states say we must teach this as a component. We've seen bills that make sure curricula are culturally inclusive, which can go a long way to advancing principles of racial justice in sex ed, which is very important. We've seen bills that are looking at countering book banning and promoting media literacy, all of which are important for young people to be able to access correct, accurate information as they grow up. So, we are seeing some bright spots out there. That makes me happy. This has felt pretty bleak, this whole conversation. So it's nice to hear that there are bright spots. I also really love shifting and talking about: how can our audience get involved? Are there things that the audience can do to get engaged in this fight?

Callie 39:15

Absolutely. You know, I mean, the first thing I would say to do is to go to our website, so siecus.org, S-I-E-C-U-S. But there we have two super cool new trackers that we just put on our website this year. And these trackers show every "Baby Olivia" bill and every other bill that's specific to sex ed. So that's where we see the success sequencing bills. We see bills that are maybe not calling themselves success sequencing, but are just trying to push the abstinence-only-until-marriage sex ed, which of course is completely ineffective. So, you can actually go to the website and see what is happening in your state in real time. What bills have been introduced, where are they in the process of you know, committees and hearings and passing different chambers, and you can use that information to take action. So, based on what those bills are doing, you can use the talking points and information that you can find in a community and action toolkit that we have on our website to talk to your friends and your neighbors, talk to your state legislators, talk to your school board representatives. There's a reason that we say that what sex ed you get in the US is dependent on your zip code, and it's because a lot of school boards make decisions about what sex ed gets taught, especially in the absence of good state policy. So, talk to your school board about what is being taught in your school district and how you can make sure that that aligns with our national sex ed standards. So, that's the first thing. Check out our website, take action by talking to people and sharing key information. I would also say that because some of your listeners do work in the reproductive health, rights, and justice space, if you or your organization are interested in getting involved in this fight for sex ed, we would love to work with you. So, we invite you to join our sex ed policy action council, which is our response to the coordinated opposition, right? It's the it's the where we coordinate to fight back, where we share resources intel strategies. And so, we'd love to work with you. I think it's not hyperbolic, I think, to say that sex ed is currently a battleground for the future of our country, right? It's where our kids can be taught lies about contraception or about abortion. It could be they could be taught to fear diversity, to fear different families. They could be taught myths about gender that take us back 100 years. Or it can be a place where our young people learn medically accurate information and where they build empathy and they learn critical life skills that they need to navigate their their youth, but also that they need to be future voters and leaders and policymakers. It really is where we are shaping the future of America, and we need everybody who cares about the future of America to then care about sex ed and take action.

Jennie 42:11

That's so good. I love when there's a bunch of clear, concrete things that people can do. Callie, thank you so much for being with me today. It was so great to catch up and to get to have you on the podcast.

Callie 42:21

Thank you so much, Jennie. It was so good to reconnect, and I am so glad to get a chance to talk about one of my favorite subjects.

Jennie 42:28

Okay, y'all. I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Callie. It was so great to talk to her about sex ed, and we also previewed that our 50 state report card is coming out soon. It is not out today, it'll be coming out next Monday. So keep an eye out. I will make sure we'll we'll talk about it on the podcast. I am still looking for the for someone to do the episode with um at this moment, but we will do an episode focusing on the 50 State Report card, and I can't wait to talk to you all about it. Otherwise, I will see y'all next week. [music outro] If you have any questions, comments, or topics you would like us to cover, always feel free to shoot me an email. You can reach me at jennie@reprosfightback.com, or you can find us on social media. We're at rePROs Fight Back on Facebook and Twitter, or @reprosfb on Instagram. If you love our podcast and want to make sure more people find it, take the time to rate and review us on your favorite podcast platform. Or if you want to make sure to support the podcast, you can also donate on our website at reprosfightback.com.