In today's episode, we sit down with Eden, who bravely shares her journey of overcoming a tumultuous upbringing through faith. From navigating fear and identity struggles to finding solace in spirituality amid life's challenges, Eden's story is a testament to resilience and the transformative power of belief. Join us as we delve into her inspiring narrative of finding peace and growth amidst adversity.
10:22 - Fear, Misunderstanding, and Seeking Structure
17:37 - High School Relationships and Need for Affirmation
29:02 - Family Trauma and Future Plans
35:45 - Journey From Partying to Finding Love
50:24 - Exploring Faith and Personal Transformation
56:34 - Journey of Personal Growth and Relationships
1:01:07 - Navigating Marriage, Faith, and Personal Struggles
1:15:09 - Donating to Keep the Ministry Going
1:27:06 - Transformation Through Believing in Jesus' Work
💰 DONATE & SUPPORT our Ministry: lovereality.org/give
👍 LIKE us on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/alovereality
📷 FOLLOW us on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/riyoung31/
📚 LEARN more at our site: lovereality.org
In today's episode, we sit down with Eden, who bravely shares her journey of overcoming a tumultuous upbringing through faith. From navigating fear and identity struggles to finding solace in spirituality amid life's challenges, Eden's story is a testament to resilience and the transformative power of belief. Join us as we delve into her inspiring narrative of finding peace and growth amidst adversity.
10:22 - Fear, Misunderstanding, and Seeking Structure
17:37 - High School Relationships and Need for Affirmation
29:02 - Family Trauma and Future Plans
35:45 - Journey From Partying to Finding Love
50:24 - Exploring Faith and Personal Transformation
56:34 - Journey of Personal Growth and Relationships
1:01:07 - Navigating Marriage, Faith, and Personal Struggles
1:15:09 - Donating to Keep the Ministry Going
1:27:06 - Transformation Through Believing in Jesus' Work
💰 DONATE & SUPPORT our Ministry: lovereality.org/give
👍 LIKE us on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/alovereality
📷 FOLLOW us on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/riyoung31/
📚 LEARN more at our site: lovereality.org
The world doesn't think that the gospel can change your life, but we know that it can and that's why we want you to hear these stories, stories of transformation, stories of freedom, people getting free from sin and healed from sin because of Jesus. This is death to life.
Speaker 2:There were two sets of bunk beds in my brother's room so I would sleep in the fourth bunk. And my dad came home that night and went into my room and I wasn't there and he was very drunk and he his mind immediately went to she's not home, she's out with that guy. And so this experience blew up and just that night was just awful. I think it was probably the first time I experienced actually feeling like depressed, because it was just like this person in your life, that's like one of the most important figures and it's like you're just scared.
Speaker 1:Yo, welcome to the Death to Life podcast. My name is Richard. Today's episode is with Eden and I have never met her in real life. She's just been coming to this these Bible studies and I've just seen I've seen such a beautiful growth in her and I needed to know the story. So I messaged her. I said what's the story? And so we recorded this podcast and obviously there's some adult themes, so be careful there. But you're going to love to hear how God transforms and that's what Eden's story is all about. So buckle up, strap in. This is Eden. Love y'all, appreciate y'all. Where, where does this story start for you, eden? Where does it start?
Speaker 2:It starts for me, I think, around like four or five. That's where I remember at least, like not even just my spiritual journey, but just in general. I feel like that's when my memories start to pop up in my head. So, like four or five, when I was little I remember praying before bed and I grew up in a Christian household so, but I remember praying before bed, praying for meals. We always had family devotions. I was homeschooled, so that was a big part of my life as a kid. But I do remember, just in general, even though, like, I grew up in a Christian house, but the way that God was talked about was just in more of a this is what we do not necessarily, this is why we do it I didn't really understand like a personal relationship with Jesus other than asking him into your heart, which is what most of us did as kids, or that's what that was the extent of, like what I knew about Jesus. So, yeah, I grew up in a Christian household and but when I saw it home, it didn't really I couldn't reconcile it with what I heard at church or what we read in our devotions, and I don't really remember too much about church, exactly like nothing really specific. I just remember being in Sunday school and like I went to a Presbyterian church, so we went to church on Sunday and I remember Sunday school, remember learning the stories, singing the songs, but then at home it just felt like a different environment. It wasn't. My mom was always very loving she still is. She's just very sweet. But growing up my dad was verbally abusive to my mom and physically to my mom, and then when I was around four or five it wasn't so much physical anymore, but it was just a lot of anger that my dad had, and so it really just that that is a big thing that stands out from that age. And my dad was, he was always a Christian, at least from the time that we were kids until now like he's always been a believer. But you know, I think he just had a lot of pain and hurt in his heart and just his own story and it just came out on everyone around him and so that's kind of where it started. And then so we grew up going to church and then my parents got divorced around like I don't know if I was nine or 10, I can't exactly remember but so around that time my parents started going to two different churches and also my mom had started working because my parents were divorced and so and we were homeschooled at the time too. So my mom was homeschooling and I have three siblings, three brothers. So she's homeschooling for kids and she's working part time and we're going back and forth to churches and I remember I don't know for what reason, but my siblings and I at least I don't know. So I have two older brothers and one younger brother, and we're all four or two years apart, and so I think around that time when I was like nine or 10, when my parents got divorced, my older siblings might have already gone through. Like we had a catechism class in church and then, when you got to a certain age, you could be dedicated to that church or become a member. And I my brother, who's only two years older than me, he went through that whole thing. I think my oldest brother did too, but myself and my younger brother just decided like we're not going to go to Sunday school anymore, and I'm not sure why, but at this point my mom was really just tired, with everything just worn out from life working and homeschooling, and just we were tough kids and not in a good way, she. We made it really hard for her and so we were just like we're not going to Sunday school anymore and so we just sat with her in church. But I remember just like I couldn't tell you one thing that I remember hearing, like in a sermon or anything. I remember committing myself to not enjoying it, like if that makes any sense, I was like I'm going to be miserable, this is going to be miserable. It was not something I liked or enjoyed necessarily. It just felt like we have to do this and like, even same way, is this because you were?
Speaker 1:angry, or because you were sad, or yeah, it might have been.
Speaker 2:It might have been and even like before that just what I experienced with my dad. I just know like it really shaped how I saw God. And if you learn about God primarily from people who don't act like what they're talking about or like all you know about God is from those people, and when you're that age unless you're having crazy God experiences at that age, it's not necessarily personal for everyone at that age, so you're just taking their word for it, but then you're experiencing their treatment of you and so it's just like okay, so then this is what God is like and so and I know it's the same for a lot of people and that's what it was for me, and so I don't know if it was just I don't want to be at church because God has never done anything for me. I don't feel safe. But I just remember not enjoying it Because it really just felt like we're just doing, we're doing this because we have to do this, and it was like, well, okay, is anybody going to tell me why? I just never really understood why. Or that personal relationship aspect. And it was the same with, like daily devotions. We would do them every morning since we were homeschooled and I remember my mom would, just we would all come out of the living for into the living room and I remember just being so grumpy as a kid like I'm just going to tune this out, I don't want to listen, I don't want to hear these stories, and so my heart was just in a, even as a young kid, like and this was probably so this was after my parents were divorced, it was probably around nine or 10. But when I was younger, I remember as a kid, I used to get nightmares a lot and I'd be really scared. I was scared of the dark. I remember going into my parents' room a lot and I do have a vivid memory of like I knew Jesus was with me, like I knew God, I knew God's CS, and. But I remember I don't know if I had a bad dream or I just woke up from a bad dream or something but I remember just like envisioning Jesus holding me, like as a little girl, like holding my hand, and I was like I'm holding hands with Jesus right now and it was it's just funny because it really was like that and just that little bit of faith, like I knew Jesus was with me. I knew he was holding me, I knew like he was my safety in that moment, even though, like I don't know, when I officially in my mind, like concrete, was like Jesus is God, because it's like that's a memory I have of Jesus. But God was scary. Growing up, I was very scared of hell. I was very scared of messing up and just doing, doing wrong. And it's interesting because I was thinking back and I was scared of hell. But I remember laying in bed at night and I did this so many times and I would just like imagine in my head eternity and this isn't even hell. This is like this is heaven and I'm. I'm like that almost sounds scary, though, like we just live forever and ever and ever and ever. And I it's like, wow, that's really sad, like those are thoughts, those are thoughts of heaven, like eternity with God, but it's like, okay, well then I really didn't know who God was. If heaven, if even the thought of living forever with God was scary to me, then I really just I didn't know what it was like. I really didn't know him and his character.
Speaker 1:It sounds like God was like a problem to be solved, like so. Many people have this idea that their main problem is God and they need to get their act together so God can be happy with them, rather than their main problem being sin and God actually sent Jesus to save you from sin. Like, God and Jesus aren't different, they are the same, they have the same goal. But if we don't understand God, we think he's the problem to be solved. And I need to get my act together so that I'll be like I'm right with God. I need to make myself right with God, which you can't, but then religion comes along and says kind of like this is how you do it, and so you fall for religion, which is not it right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, it was very focused on me. It was very what can you do? And I also have this memory, and I don't know how old I was maybe seven or eight and we watched a movie. I think it was a Christian movie or something, but there was a clip at the end of Rascal Flats and I don't know what song he was singing, but it might have been. It might have been Amazing Grace. But I remember as a little girl like it moved me, but I don't think it was in a maybe it was beautiful. But I said to my mom I remember being like why would he do it? Like why would Jesus do something like that for me? And it's like, even at that age, like I just highly identified with the title of sinner, like just as a little girl, just feeling like why would I be worthy of him to die for me? And just like that's crazy. I was seven or eight and I don't know what my mom said after that, but I just like that could have been a really beautiful moment, like, wow, jesus did that for me. But it was like why, why would he do it for me? Like, and I was, I remember I was bawling my eyes out.
Speaker 1:Oh yes, did you. Did you come up with a reason?
Speaker 2:Oh, no, nope, it wasn't love, and that also is me focused. That's very just like I didn't like and it's the. The point is I didn't do anything. He did it because he loved me. But I'm like, why would he do it for me? Like I'm rotten? I don't know, I'm a rotten seven year old, yeah.
Speaker 1:So did that fear of hell, did that motivate you to behave yourself, or was that just a scary thing?
Speaker 2:It was just a scary thing, I think. If anything, my behavior and I don't think I was like, I don't think I was a really bad kid, but growing up like my, my dad worked at home for a period of time and I just remember like if my dad was home working, we had to be quiet upstairs, we had to behave, or if, in a season where he wasn't working from home, when he would come home, it was just like, okay, you just like don't make dad mad. And that was kind of what it was. So it was like hell was scary. But my behavior was more just because I didn't want to make my earthly father upset. Um, because then you were getting yelled at and it wasn't just like um, I don't know, it was just basic yelling. It was like really scary. I just remember it was really scary, um. So I felt scared a lot and I didn't necessarily feel safe, um, even with my dad home, because then when my parents got divorced, my dad didn't live at home and I had this strong association with mom's house is safe, dad's house is scary. We just got to make it through till we can come back home, and there was a long time I didn't call my dad's house home either. I. I remember that, like just mom's house was home, dad's house was dad's house, and at dad's house you were a completely different child, like everything was perfect. And at mom's house, my poor mom, like she's got three boys and a really rebellious daughter and she's just trying to manage working, homeschooling, all the things and she couldn't control all of us. So really it was like it was pretty chaotic. It was a very different experience on both sides. And then we're going to two different churches every other weekend and it was just. This was probably like around the age of 11 or 12. And it was just um, it was, it was chaotic, it wasn't very peaceful.
Speaker 1:So what happened after that? You're getting into high school.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I asked to be put in public school. Um, and this was mainly because my, like I said, my mom was working and so our school structure at home was like non-existent, and I don't know what part of me was thinking like I need some structure. But it was bad enough that, like I could hide my own textbooks if I wanted to and then just not do that subject I'm talking about math for like two months if I wanted, because, oh, I don't know where the book is, and so it was just really bad. And then, I think so, when I was like 12, that summer I begged my mom to be put in public school, which if you're homeschooled or at least if, if you know homeschool people usually they wouldn't do that, because I know a lot of people who had just had incredible homeschooling experiences and I did enjoy my experience, but there was just a lot about it that, like my mom did the absolute best she could and she was amazing at what she did, but it was like it was bad. Um, I just I needed more structure and more discipline. So then I did go into public school and actually like around that age, so I was 12, and then I turned 13, my freshman year, and I actually knew quite a few people going into high school because we lived in a pretty small town, so like we would hang out with the kids from town and so I knew people and that helped because it wasn't quite as scary Like, oh, I don't know anybody and all my friends wanted me to come into public school too. So that also really like because that's the age I'm getting into like making more friends and oh, depending on the friends you have could determine if you're cool or not. So it was just, it was like high school that could be a thing and awesome. Just, you know, whatever you saw in TV or on movies, it's like I wanted whatever that experience was, that I saw and what I heard my friends talking about in middle school. I wanted that experience and so around that age, like I said, we started hanging out with people who were who, who went to our local high school, and we did it around much supervision. My mom always worked second shifts, so she was gone usually by like two or three PM until like 11 at night, and so we would like do our laundry, make our own like, make spaghetti-os, and just I don't know, we would just do our thing. But we would hang out with kids a lot and there was this one girl I was friends with and she went to the high school but she was cyber schooled. She was a couple years older than me and so, even though she was affiliated with that high school, she was home and while I was still homeschooled I would go over and hang out with her and at that time if I was like 12, she would have been like 14 or 15, but she smoked, like smoked cigarettes, smoked pot, and I remember like the first time ever smoking a cigarette. I was way too young and so I just started to like wonder about this stuff and I didn't mention like, growing up, my dad was very heavily into alcohol and he was just always, always out at the bar ever since he married my mom. So that was always something like I had it in my mind and I didn't like the idea of it, but I never wrote it off. Like you hear, some people, if they had a parent who dabbled in stuff, they'll be like I'm never going to do that and or I don't want to be like my parent that did that, and I never really wrote it off. I had more of a curious attitude about it, I guess, and just like this affinity for like bad things and bad people. And I don't know if it just had to do with the, the adrenaline or just this like rebellion or what it was, but it just really drew me. And so I'm in public school and I'm hanging out with some good kids and some bad kids, but I really just started to develop this need for affirmation and need for acceptance and it's like, on one hand, I wanted to be rebellious and then, on the other hand, I needed to do my homework and study for tests and I would strive to do well. And freshman year was really hard because that was a transition out of homeschooling with little to no structure, and so it was a big adjustment for me. And you remember going into my algebra one class and the teacher gave us a paper and it was like, okay, these are some problems. I want to see where you're at so that I can just figure out where everyone's going to be for this math class starting out. I look at this page. I'm like this is foreign. This is very basic algebra one. And I turns a page over and I wrote a paragraph for the teacher to read and it said something like I was homeschooled, I have no idea what any of this is, and then I was so embarrassed I erased it. So then you just see this paragraph that was written and then erased and he's walking around looking at people's papers and he's like what's up? And he was the best teacher ever. I had him again when I was a senior because I had to drop that math class and start even more basic. But so that first year was a big adjustment and some of the classes, like I, started out more ambitious in, like a higher biology class and a more advanced literature class, and then I had to drop them because I was like, okay, I thought I was going to be okay here, but I'm not. And so sophomore year I felt more acquainted. But oh man, just poor little me in sophomore year, I think. So I started out I was 14 in sophomore year, but then I turned 15 later that year and, like the attention of boys, it just consumed me. I just needed the attention of boys and just it was always like oh, I heard that I was talking about you or I this guy said that about you or just whatever. I was just so focused on having a boyfriend. And then I actually did start dating someone when I was like 15 and did stuff that I didn't want to do necessarily. And I remember even thinking if I don't do it, then I'm not going to have this person tell me these nice things they're not going to necessarily want me like they say they do, and so it was just okay, I'm going to do it. And I remember feeling like instantly very shameful, very guilty, like okay, there's no going back. Now this is who I am and it was a very personal like I'm that person. And the crazy thing is like a few years before that, my mom gifted me a purity ring for Christmas and like I still wore it and it's not like it matters, it's not like it really means anything, it's just a symbol, but anyway, like I remember just wearing it and being like this doesn't mean anything, like I'm not pure, like I'm dirty, so yeah, it was pretty messy. I still just really saw that affirmation of guys and my teachers Like I loved when they'd ask a question and I got it right, and like I had friends in high school, like, I think, a good amount of friends, but there were a lot of people who are my friend because they could ask me what the homework was and I would show them my paper and I didn't mind it. You know, a part of me did, because I'm like I would talk to my, my closer friends about it later, like, oh, they just use me for my homework. But in the moment it was like, oh yeah, like here's my homework copy off of me, I don't care and like, but then they would do it again and so it was like this, um, this feedback loop that I kind of liked, kind of kind of didn't like. I knew it wasn't like a genuine friendship. So I needed that from teachers and I really liked that. And I just remember like I tried hard in school, I would say, but even though I tried like and I got, I got okay grades. But for someone who studied a lot and did all their homework and paid attention and like needed to do well, in a sense I didn't do like the best. I wasn't like a straight A student Like I would get C's and B's and I think it was like this striving even just for acceptance by teachers and stuff. But then and I I still think like because I took it more seriously than the kids who literally didn't care and they were just there because they had to be. Like there still was this appreciation from teachers, but like it was like man I and this went all the way through college like man I really tried, but like I still got this and it was never good enough. Like getting a B wasn't good enough and A is what you were going for, or an A plus and so, and sometimes I got them, sometimes I didn't, but I just remember that was a big part. Like high school was like boys and trying to get good grades and then so we were still going to two churches and and with this guy that you were.
Speaker 1:Was this a boyfriend or was this just like?
Speaker 2:yeah, he was whatever like two years for like two years, Um yeah.
Speaker 1:Did that fuse together the relationship in a good way? In a bad way? No, it was. Did it bring more guilt and shame?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was really bad it was. And we broke up like one time and then got back together. I and and even in that relationship, like towards the end of the relationship I started hanging out with like the best friend of the guy I was dating and just like I just kept seeking affirmation, even outside of my relationship, and I remember being like man this is not good enough. Like I need more of this. And I did that in several relationships, even relationships that I wouldn't consider to be like a part of my life, like even small relationships, and I just remember, if I was in a relationship because I was in a few before that one that lasted like two, two and a half years and they were much shorter, but I would like have these intense feelings and this infatuation. And then, when it would fade, I'd be like oh no, is it happening again? And I'm like this. It was almost like okay, this thing is really fulfilling me right now. And then, just very quickly, it was like wait, but now I need something else. Like it was just yeah, it was a lot, I was really seeking that.
Speaker 1:That sounds tough.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:So then, in what did you want to do with your life?
Speaker 2:I just wanted to be successful, whatever that meant. I just wanted to be successful. We never had like a crazy amount of money, and my dad grew up really poor. So he was always saying to us, like you need to go to school, you need to do well, you need to get a job, you need to work to be successful, and it's like some people have parents that might instill that in them and that's like it's a good thing. But the way it was said to us was very fearful, like if you don't do this, you're not going to have enough. Or if you don't do this and you're not successful, like that's the worst thing possible. And so I just remember and I don't know if this is why I wanted to go into public school, if I was already thinking about that but I was going to just go to school to get a two year degree. It was the same degree my mom had in medical, laboratory, science, and it was just a two year degree. But you could make like pretty good money. And that was my plan because, okay, I could go to school for two years, do something I'm semi interested in which is science related and then make good money, and then after that I don't know. That was my plan even from the get go, like even when I was a freshman, just because my mom, like she, really enjoyed her job but she tried to get all of us to go to school for it. But the reason was like you can do this and you can make pretty good money for just two years of school and we could just do with that at our local community college in Reading Pennsylvania. So that as far as my five year plan goes, that was what it was. It was just go to school, get that degree and then just work with that degree and make money.
Speaker 1:Okay, yeah, so what happens next?
Speaker 2:Well, so I want to backtrack a little because so when I was like 13, we were staying at my dad's house one weekend and there was just this big episode, just like just my dad had a temper and so he I don't know what set it off. It could be anything, it could be very little, but I just remember he exploded over something and it was just really scary at that time and I felt trapped because we were at my dad's house. It was only 30 minutes away but I couldn't drive, so I felt like I was stuck there and it was just scary. I remember being like I just want to leave, and so after that period I didn't see my dad for like three months. I'm not because I told my mom I'm like I can't do it, like I'm not going, I'm not going to see him. I was like for what reason? And the reason that we had to was always because the court sent so and so in high school I even struggled sometimes because, like, if I wanted to go to a football game, but it was on a night, my dad was supposed to have us. Then it was always like this fear that, oh man, I have to ask my dad if I can go and he's going to want to see me, because he only sees me a couple of times a week. But it was just like, why would I go be there? Like why would I go stay in my dad's house I feel like I'm trapped there when I could just go hang out with my friends. And then that a similar thing actually happened in high school, where and I was with that guy I was with for two and a half years during this period and I had hung out with him on a weekend that I was with my dad, but he met my dad. So it was like planned and he came and picked me up and we saw a movie or something and it was like right around my dad's house and so this was planned and then he came back and dropped me off, whatever. But my dad was out that night and he always had girlfriends on and off and that was hard for us as kids meeting a new person, because you'd get attached and then they would break up and then they were just gone and like a lot of them were really nice women but they would all kind of leave for the same reason and it was just. It was because it was hard to be with my dad and then so he was out and he came back really late one night I don't know if it was like two or three in the morning, and I used to sleep in my brother's room because I had always been scared of the dark from being a little kid, so like even high school, and we used to watch a lot of scary movies which I do not watch anymore, Praise God but I don't know what it was. It was like addiction to the fear or something. So I didn't want to sleep in my own room and we had there were two sets of bunk beds in my brother's room, so I would sleep in the fourth bunk. And my dad came home that night and went into my room and I wasn't there and he was very drunk and he, his mind immediately went to she's not home, she's out with that guy, and so this experience blew up and just that night was just awful and I'm not going to necessarily recount all the details, but it wasn't just very traumatic and just for my siblings and I and we were, we were actually I think one of my brothers wasn't there at the time but my oldest brother and I were like okay, like I've just had it. We were at this age where it was like we weren't. My oldest brother probably was 18, or maybe he was just. No, he was 18 and he would still visit, though he didn't technically have to. We had to until we were 18. We had no choice. And so we, we, we were at the age where I decided like okay, I like we're, we're grown I was 15, but I'm grown enough to understand like this isn't okay. And so I told my mom again I am done seeing dad and I don't. I don't know how long it was for, but I just remember it was. It was hard, and that first time it happened when I was like 13, that was like three months that I think it was probably the first time I experienced actually feeling like depressed, because it was just like this person in your life, that's like one of the most important figures and it's like you're just scared. And so I just didn't, I didn't want anything to do with my dad for a while. And then it happened again, like I said, in high school, and I was still with this guy and I started having like some stomach issues and I'm not going to really go into this, but like I would get nauseous in the morning a lot and my dad would would talk on the phone with my mom about some you know, just stuff, because they're trying to manage four kids but they're just don't get along at all. And he said something like is my daughter pregnant? Or just he, he just had he could tell it was from a place of like I don't know love, because like he does love me and he always, he always told us, no matter what, he always told us that he loved us and he was affectionate. But it just was confusing with the behavior. But he didn't, you know, he didn't want that for me. He wanted good things for me. He didn't want me to be pregnant at 15 and just have a really hard time trying to figure things out. And so I get that. But looking back, it was just like, of course he thinks that about me, like he probably, you know, just he probably thinks the worst of me and and that he, he called me a name which I can't remember, but I very much took it personally and you know, you hear people get called something by a parent or a teacher or an authority figure, and whether it's good or bad, it doesn't matter. You take that with you and I think I did because it's like, okay, if I'm this person, then let me just go act like it and that's all I am anyway. Let me just go do that thing, because I'm nothing else than that. And so that was still in high school, and I think from then on, like things really just got worse.
Speaker 1:Um yeah, you were just like, if this is what you think of me, maybe this is who I am, and just kind of went for it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I would say so.
Speaker 1:Didn't bring happiness, though I'm not sure. If it did, you tell me.
Speaker 2:No, um, no, um, very, very temporary at least is what it seemed, but, like, when you look at it in the grand scheme of things and like everything that I have now, it's like, no, that wasn't happiness in one bit. Um, so at the end of high school, um, that guy was with for two and a half years. He broke up with me like a couple of days after graduation and I'm 17 and my beloved mother let me get a tattoo at 17. And, um, it is. It is cool. Like, looking back, cause it's not my favorite, but it's Ecclesiastes 311, which is everything is made beautiful in his time. And it's like, even though it doesn't look exactly how I'd wanted to, it's just such a perfect verse, just for life in general. Like that verse speaks like death to life, um, like everything is going to be made beautiful. And so I got the tattoo, I cut my hair off, I did all the things you do. It's like, okay, that's going to fix this broken heart, this rejection. Um, and it didn't, um, but so I, the town I grew up in is pretty small, it's rural, but it is a college town and um, so after high school, like a couple of my friends I graduated with. We just really really went into the party scene and it was like, okay, maybe, like, maybe this will help. So I'm going to college, I'm start at this community college and then I delve into this party scene, um, and just heavily every weekend it's what I'm looking forward to, just doing the school, just trying to get it over with so I can just get to the weekend. And it was just like it's such, it was such a miserable way to live. It was a cycle and at this point, like I had started to develop like a love hate relationship with alcohol because, like I hated it. I hated what it did to my dad, I hated what it did to like certain people around me, but like I couldn't stop going in and, you know, partying on the weekend and using it. So I was like I hate this thing. And then it was like, okay, but I'm going to use this thing. So it was just, it was like I didn't even put up a fight, I didn't even try, um, and so I would just be blacked out on the weekend and I did some really embarrassing, really humiliating things and it's like it was just normal to everyone. And I remember thinking sometimes in my head like. Does everyone else like? Like? Because I longed for more and I knew there was more. This whole time I I had even known like, if I, if I ask God and this is what I thought if I ask him, I know he'll forgive me if I ask because he has to. But it was like. So I knew he was there, but he was very disappointed in me and it was very like prodigal son, like if I really need something and I go back like he'll be there for me. So it was like I understood that, but I was abusing grace in a sense. I'm just like living it up because I know that forgiveness is there for me, but it was just absolutely miserable. So I met this. I met this guy who graduated from my high school a couple years before me and this started another two and a half year long relationship. But he was even more into the party scene than me and it brought me even deeper into it. And then I was hanging out with kids who went to my high school that I saw as like a freshman and a sophomore. Oh, those are the cool kids. So then I'm like in this group with the cool kids and now I'm like, wow, this is like. It's like what I always wanted, but it was just horrible. It was such a lie and so that relationship was very toxic and just I was drinking every weekend but this person I was with it consumed him and then it started to make me really bad and I just started to despise the party scene and I'm like this is just like. I knew it was a cycle, I knew it was endless, it was going to keep going, you were going to need it again and it was just it was awful. So we were together for a couple of years and then in freshman year, when did you know you're like this isn't going to happen?
Speaker 1:We're just here for a good time, not a long time.
Speaker 2:I think I knew it deep down, even when I kept continuing on with it because I didn't know what else there was and like. So I was in college but, like I said, after getting my degree and maybe just working using that degree, like I had no other plans. Even growing up, like in high school, there was a long time where I feared having kids and I feared births and feared being a mother. I didn't want to be a bad mother and this was even when I was young. So there was a long time where I wrote that off. But I don't necessarily think like in high school with that boyfriend I was with a couple of years we talked about having kids and stuff. So it was like, maybe in the future maybe I'd be a mother at some point, maybe I'll get married, but like after college, after degree, no plans, I'm just in college, just having a good time. So I'm dating this guy in this cycle. But in freshman year at college I met my husband and I just met him in this computer class, ift 110. And I'll just never forget, like when he walked in I'm like, cause this guy I was with, he was like, when I think about it, which I never had thought about it, then like, oh, do I have a type? But whether I had one or not, that guy was not my type. Like just everything he was was not what I wanted. And so when my husband walked in that room, I'm like, oh, wow, that guy's pretty cool. Like oh, he looks pretty cool, he dressed pretty cool. I see a little cross key chain on his backpack and I'm like, oh, I wonder if he's a Christian. And then so there's that moment.
Speaker 1:I'm in class At this point sorry for interrupting you At this point. Do you still consider yourself a Christian?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I never was like I'm an atheist, god, I'm done with you. There was just a time, like in high school, when I was with that guy and me and my dad were having some tension and there was a time where I just decided to stop going to church, but it wasn't necessarily like it was more like I'm not gonna be going to church cause I'll probably be hungover. But it was not. God, I'm done with you and you did nothing for me. I don't believe in you anymore. So I still would tell every now and then it would come up in a conversation. Actually, when I was drunk, I loved talking about it with people, because when people are drunk they get really philosophical and just. But I didn't know what I believed. Really Like I just at that age was just like it sounds so bad and it really is. But it was like God, you can just wait on the back burner, I'm gonna just do whatever I want, and so yeah. And then I met my husband and he just was the sweetest person I ever met and we just talked a little bit cause he was just a guy in my class. But I remember like coming home and telling my mom like wow, I met this really nice guy at school and he's a Christian and just he's just so kind. And I even told my one brother who I'm still, I'm close with all my siblings, but just me and my middle brother, we would, cause we're the middle two, I would just tell him everything. And I told him about this guy and he's like, yeah, but aren't you dating someone? Cause he was always a little bit more like I'm not, I don't mean to say this to be mean, but he was more pious, and so I was like, yeah, but we're just, we were just talking like friends, like he was just really nice and so, and so that that started to put into my mind like, wow, what could dating a Christian guy look like? Like someone who has their life together, he loves the Lord? Cause I'm like, huh, what does that even like? What does that mean for me? Cause I started thinking about, okay, I told this guy, oh, I'm a Christian too, and he, he has a little cross tattoo on his wrist and I have my tattoo, and I'm like, oh, we both have a Christian tattoo, but it's like I don't know what it means to be a Christian. I don't know what it means to be a relationship with Jesus. I don't know everything that I have in him and so it was appealing because he was very kind, he had his head on his shoulders, he, you know, he just loved Jesus. He was very open about it and, like I'll never forget, this guy in our class was playing some online like game, not paying attention. We're in the back of the room and he keeps saying like Jesus Christ, just over and over and my husband I don't want to, I always get it wrong he's like that's not what I said, but he said something like do you know Jesus? Or something like that. Or dude, do you even know Jesus? And he was just very like, unapologetic about it and that was just so appealing to me. So that's kind of where that ends. I meet my husband. That's the fall semester or the beginning semester and then it's the semester's over. But before that he walked me to my car in the parking lot and he asks me a question that 17 year old me is very offended. He's like so when are you gonna break up with your boyfriend? And I'm like, excuse me, like what? And so I just said I don't know. And then that was kind of that Like for a year, so I'm still dating this guy. I'm just in this cycle.
Speaker 1:Why did he want to know that? Cause he wanted to date you or he knew it was a growing one?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, Cause he liked me Bold move bold move. Yes, he's very bold, I like it. And around that time he had also had a dream about me and he's just always been like he grew up in a family who moved in the prophetic and I had never heard anything about that growing up Like the Holy spirit was there and he would help you and that was maybe the extent of that. So he like I don't remember if he told me about that dream later I think it was later, but he had had a dream at that time when I was just going off doing whatever I wanted, like he just he knew that I was supposed to be his wife. So he was like very low key, pursuing me as soon as he, like after those few months. But I'm just like so in love with this guy, like just cause we had broken up once and actually I broke up with him for my now husband, but that lasted two weeks and I just I hung out with my husband Donizan. We hung out for a little bit and then this is where, when I was in high school and I mentioned when I was in a relationship and I'd be like on this high of emotion and feelings when it would start to slow down, I started to get really fearful and I'm like oh no, is this thing gonna last? Is this gonna sustain me? Is this gonna give me what I'm looking for? And then I would get really scared and I would break up with someone, and then I would look for something else.
Speaker 1:And so well, it sounds really funny, Like is this thing gonna last? Nope, I'm done, I'm out.
Speaker 2:Pretty much, yeah. And so I did that. In college I broke up with that guy I met from where I'm from, the town I'm from, and I started talking to my husband and we just hung out for like two weeks. He wrote me a song on piano for my birthday and sent it to me on my birthday Cause my birthday is just a couple of days after Christmas and he sent it to me. But before I broke up with my boyfriend, at the time I was texting him a little bit my husband and obviously if you're dating someone and they're texting some other person, not cool. So that guy hated Jonathan and he actually knew, cause I had met him in college. He knew that I met him. There was nothing there, but he just was like, oh, like who's this Jonathan guy? And he called him. He always called him John and like my husband does not go by John. So it was just funny. He didn't like him for obvious reasons, like it's not, like it was okay, but in my mind it's like this guy is terrible. This guy is really awesome. So I'm gonna talk to him, cause I was miserable in that relationship but I didn't want to leave it and I had the four but I had gone back to it. So I broke up with that guy and I talked to my husband, for we hung out a couple of times and then he sent me a song on my birthday and I was like, wow, that is like a beautiful song. He just sat down on a piano in the church he went to and just played it and he doesn't need music, he just will play. And I was like that is like it moved me. It really did. It was really special and it was just really thoughtful. But I remember just being like what am I gonna do? Like I'm dating someone this feels so wrong. Like it is wrong because it technically was cheating on that guy in a way, because it was like but you just broke.
Speaker 1:This wasn't when you guys had broken up.
Speaker 2:You know what. So I think it was a very short period of time. I'm sorry, I'm trying to remember you know what. I think it was okay. So, no, I would listen to that song after I got back together with him, because we were apart for two weeks and I kept listening to that song while I'm with this guy who I claimed like I'm never gonna do it again, like I'm never gonna break up with you again, like I love you, and it was like no, I didn't, I really did not. Like we co-dependently felt like we needed each other. There was not an ounce of love in that relationship. So I went on in that relationship for another year, almost.
Speaker 1:Nice.
Speaker 2:Yeah, smart, great move. So like I had had that very short period, I don't know what we're doing when we're like-. They know it's like or late teens, early 20s?
Speaker 1:We don't know what we're doing? How did we even, how did we get out of there with like jobs and spouses and who knows? It's incredible. By the grace of God. That's the answer.
Speaker 2:Absolutely yeah. So in the summer of 2018, I start to ask myself those questions again, like, okay, I say I'm a Christian. What does that even mean? What do I believe? I've never even read the Bible for myself. So I like almost did a 180. Just start, I get a Bible, start reading it like crazy, start reading a bunch of theologians and apologists I get really into apologetics and stuff like that. But then I'm like I wanna know everything. Let me just know everything, all the religious things. And it was very much like okay, okay, God, I'm gonna give you what you wanted, which is me, but it's because you want me to serve you and I'm here. What can I do now? What can I do? And so I went like full force into that and things did get so much better, but it was still like half of the equation because I still had a lot of guilt and shame over things in my past, and so I break up with that guy. I'm not with that guy anymore. So, anyway, I'm reading. I'm reading books, I'm reading my Bible. There's a Christian group at the local college, which I didn't go to. That university I went to a community college, but my brother went to the university and it was right up the road so I would go with him and we would go and worship and have a message. And they also had a couple of Bible studies you could attend. I even attended a Bible study on Romans and it's like he went through a lot of the stuff that you hear in love reality, but the conclusion was different. It's like this is amazing, this is everything Jesus has done. But there was an emphasis on the Roman Seven battle, because that's still inherently like who you are. It's just gonna be a fight. And I remember coming out of that Bible study and being like, wow, this is awesome. And that being like I literally thought to myself wow, this is just the Christian life. It's just really hard. And it's because I felt like I was struggling with that back and forth and double-mindedness so much and I'm like to be honest, this kind of sucks Like because it didn't. It was like this is hopeful, but is this it Like? Is that it? And then I just remember pondering that and then I just continued on and things were still better, like I wasn't drinking and I wasn't smoking and I didn't want to Like those desires like I had hated it even when I was doing it. I knew it was stupid. I knew it was unhealthy. I knew it was like toxic, not good for me Do you get addicted to nicotine? Oh yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so from what I understand, that's the hardest to break. Yeah, did you find that to be true?
Speaker 2:No, not at least in that experience, and it almost had to be a supernatural thing, because I just stopped smoking pot, I stopped smoking cigarettes and I stopped drinking all at the same time. And I think after that there were a couple of times where I would just be like, oh man, I just really want to smoke a cigarette and I would go buy a pack. And then I would feel really stupid and I'd be like this tastes awful, like what was I doing? But I didn't feel like I had to fight against it or like, okay, I'll smoke half a pack today and then I'll keep going down and stuff like that. I never really had to break it off. It actually did just kind of like I was like I don't want to do this anymore and I'm not going to, and then that was that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so is this the Christian life? Is your question. Yeah, what did you decide? That was it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was like okay, this is what it says, this is going to be, this struggle is going to be mine At least Paul can relate to me and everyone else who relates to Paul we all just can relate to each other that we're just going to fight against our flesh and we're never going to win. So it's like okay, awesome, Like Jesus. It's like it is finished, Cool. And then it's like okay, so what do I have to do? It's like it's done and then it's not. And so I just, yeah, like I couldn't get my behavior together. I was still like just fighting really hard, trying really hard to just, and like I wasn't struggling necessarily with like those substances or addictions at this point, but like I would say I was mean, Like I was just mean, I was hurt, I still had hurt, I still had anger, just no patience, nothing like. And I still lived at home with all three of my siblings because, like I said, that college was, the university was like a couple miles away, so we all lived at home.
Speaker 1:So you were not struggling with the addictions, but you were struggling with just kind of being mean anger.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I just I think I just kept trying to be better, just kept trying to do better, and I definitely had that concept of sanctification, like it's something we're just always going to be trying to achieve and it's the work of the Holy Spirit, but it's also very much the work of yourself and what you're going to do and how you're going to get there. And then Jesus comes back and then you're you're all of a sudden you caught up, like all those, all those standards and that you missed. They're all of a sudden fulfilled when Jesus comes back, but until then, like you just got to keep, keep on trying, keep on going. So there was a lot of that and but I do think, like I started to understand the concept of personal relationship with Jesus and just that the Holy Spirit can speak to you, because ever since I had met my husband, like I had never heard anyone talk about the Holy Spirit like he had, and it was just a very personal thing. So in the summer, I in the summer of 2018, I start asking God, because then I'm, I'm possibly considering, huh, what would it be like to get married, like to be with someone who actually loves the Lord? Now that, now that I'm in this thing, now that I'm like actually doing what a Christian says they should do, so I start wondering like huh, I wonder what Jonathan's doing. And rewind to you guys weren't dating at this point.
Speaker 1:So from You're like I wonder if we should get married.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, you're not even dating. I mean, honestly, that's not wrong, but no. So when I was still dating that guy, before I ever broke up with him like six months maybe, maybe longer, maybe like eight months or something Jonathan had let me know just to keep me in the loop because, like I said, like he had been considering this since he met me in 2016. And he, I think he emailed me because he wasn't about to text me. He knew I was dating this guy. If he would see it, that'd be bad. But he's just like hey, I'm just letting you know, I'm moving across the country, I'm leaving, and he he's always had family here, so he just had the resources and he just was like I think I'm done with with Reading and I I want to change at pace. And so I'm like, okay, cool, that helps me, because he's completely out of sight, out of mind, he's across the country, like that's it. And so then fast forward again to like eight months later, and it's the summer. I'm like, okay, now I'm really a Christian If you say, read my Bible, and now I'm really saved because I go to church again and all the things. And then I'm like huh, like I wonder what he's doing like over there in Arizona. I don't know what I thought, but I literally just asked the Lord. I'm like where is he? And I knew he was in Arizona. It was like I'm going to ask the Lord a rhetorical question. And within a couple of days I checked an email I never checked before, like or on on. At that time it was like an old email. I didn't really use it. It was the email I gave him because when I had talked to him before it was a secret for a reason. So I checked his email and he emailed me out of nowhere and he basically was just like hey, I don't know if you're ready to talk yet the way that things kind of ended was not cool because I literally ghosted him. I like I, because I didn't know how to own up to like just oh man, I was so driven by my feelings in college. I just I was like okay, I can't explain to him why I'm breaking up with him. I have no idea even why I'm very fearful, and I just ghosted him, couldn't talk about it in one, two, and so he just is like very, very forgiving. And then this email he's like are you ready to talk about things like normal people yet and I'm like shoot, like yeah, I totally ghosted you. So we just talked for a little bit over email, but then he he ended up flying back to Pennsylvania in like November and we hung out and then we were kind of officially dating in November 2018. And I would say he really encouraged me in my faith just in a way that I hadn't been encouraged before, because it was just very personal for him and he just lived what he believed and he had been very rooted in identity. Even before, way before I ever heard anyone really talking about it, he had sent me like a. I remember him sending me a Dan Moeller sermon and I don't even think it was at that time when we were dating or maybe it was. It was probably in like November 2018. And I remember listening to him being like wow, that's a really good sermon, like cool. And so there were like moments throughout my relationship, throughout our dating relationship, where I and like this whole time, I am clearly like not ready to receive it yet because it never landed, and so he would talk about it and I'd be like yeah, and he would send me stuff and share me stuff, and I'd be like cool, and so we were long distance for like a year, almost exactly a year because we got engaged the following year and then so in November 2019, we got engaged and then a month later, we got married, and I know.
Speaker 1:I love that.
Speaker 2:It was like he's going to work. Yeah, and so he flew from Arizona to Pennsylvania and we got married on December 23rd in a courthouse. And that was four years ago now, so just like a week ago, a little over a week ago, we celebrated four years, but yeah, so we got married. And then right after that was COVID, and that, obviously for everyone, changed everything, and so at that point I was getting really close to finishing college. By the way, my two year degree took me four years anyway. No shame, I have a degree, but I'm not using it anyway, so it really doesn't matter. So I'm doing my clinical rotations in a laboratory and they are like get these students out. So we were out of school, we were out of our clinical rotations and I'm like, okay, it's like a couple of weeks, we're doing everything online. And I'm like, okay, this might be indefinite. And so one of Jonathan's family members actually encouraged me why don't you go spend some time in Arizona? Like you guys are married, you're still doing long distance, because we did it for a couple months. I think I officially, I officially moved to Arizona in May, or yeah, I think it was May but and I graduated around that same time that I moved here. But school was completely online from like January until we graduated. Graduation was online, so I packed some bags and I'm ready to fly to Arizona and I'm I'm. It's been like a year doing long distance. And then we were married for a couple months and that was long distance. So that was obviously incredibly hard, even though it was short lived. So I'm like all right, I'll probably be back soon when school starts again in person. I never left Arizona.
Speaker 1:Well, I mean, they're married. Wow, that would.
Speaker 2:the plan is to just go there and the yeah, and like the plane was like okay, once I graduate, then I'll move, but everything was online anyway. So like, well, I may as well, just, you know, spend some time in Arizona and see how long I have, I'll just do school online. It's online anyway. And so I never never went back like I thought I would like two weeks later, which is like okay, whatever, you're married anyway. So it was like that was going to be my home and it was cool. It was a cool experience, like wow, this is awesome. This is sooner than I thought, even though COVID just like really threw things off, and so graduation was online. So we're married, we're newly married and my husband is so gracious he would not, he would not say the same things that I would about my perspective of our first year being married, but just because of like I don't know, just because of me, but we, like COVID didn't help, but, and like my husband, he had his own business. He was doing contracting, but that slowed down a lot because he was doing commercial and retail stuff and that just a lot of those stores weren't open that he was doing work for. So we were both just at home in his aunt's house, keep in mind. So that's a, we're living with his aunt, there's other people in the house, we don't have our own place yet, and this was just for a few months. But I started to get back into drinking again, like just I don't know exactly how it started, but it was. I mean, like I said it was, it was COVID, so we're like, well, there's nothing else to do. And so I really just started and this was probably for several months just drinking again along like we would. I would drink during the day, and just it was. It was bad, because when I would drink I would get, like I said when I was living at home in college, I was just mean and that was something I was like trying to fix in myself, like I don't want to be this way, but it was just out of anger and hurt. But alcohol would just make it even worse and I really like hated who I would become when I would drink, and so like I really wanted to stop, but I just I don't know. And so that went on for a while and like there were some really good moments and it was the first year of marriage, so there were some good parts, obviously. But I just like going back, I would change. I would change the things. I would change some things that I did and the way that I acted and the way that I treated my husband and yeah. So if some time goes by and I'm kind of like, okay, this, this has got to stop and eventually I did I was able to just kind of stop again after I noticed like just it took a turn. It was all day COVID started to like Arizona was one of the states that they pulled back on some of the restrictions sooner than a lot of other states, and so I don't know if it was like around the fall. I think it was around the fall Things started to kind of continue a little bit again, faster than like the rest of the country and the world. So, like my husband went back to working, I got a job doing something that was kind of related to my degree, but not entirely, and we're going to a church which was closed during COVID. They also opened, I think, relatively quickly compared to some other churches. That was a whole experience in itself, because my husband grew up Pentecostal Romanian Pentecostal and I grew up Presbyterian, which is just very conservative, and so the church my husband was going to was just a different world and it was so new to me that I was like opposed. I was very opposed, very against just what was going on. I'm like, why are these people dancing? Like? Why are they so happy? It was just very different and so that was a hard adjustment for me. Too was going to that church and my husband knew there was resistance there, so that kind of put some tension between us. So I get a job, we're going to this church and things are going okay. I'm not drinking anymore. And then I saw Savannah Louie post something about the School of Kingdom Living, which is an online YouTube recordings of Dan Moller's School for Kingdom Living. That he did I don't know, it was some years ago and I'm like huh, because I had heard some stuff from Dan Moller and I'm like this guy, like he just he's just different. There's just something different. And so I'm like I'm going to listen to these and I just started like devouring them and they're like 37 videos. They're almost three hours long and I just have like headphones in at work and I'm just like I remember the first like 15 minutes of a video and I'm like what? Like this is amazing, like this is nothing like I've ever heard before, like everything's been done. It just it was this crazy sense of like this has to change things. Like I knew there was something more, I had hope, but I didn't know what the hope was in, and it was like so I'm starting to hear this. I'm like, okay, this is amazing. This has to be for me too, like this is what I've been living, what I've been experiencing.
Speaker 1:And you had. You'd followed Savannah before, just as long as I watched her on YouTube.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was a big YouTube person and so I watched Savannah's videos and then I think she was even off YouTube at that point, but I had followed her on Instagram so I saw her talking about it and then I had also started listening to the death to life podcast, I think around that time, because she was posting about both and that was when she got free and it was just you're like this is amazing and you're talking about it, and so I'm like what is she talking about? Like this, this has got to be good. It's got to be good. And I watched her videos and like they were very encouraging to me in the seasons that I watched them, even though she wasn't in the full understanding of everything Jesus did for her at that time and it's still really encouraging. It's also funny. I had watched Justin on YouTube too, for a long time and it all just like comes together at the end.
Speaker 1:But so you started listening to death? Did you start with her episode?
Speaker 2:I think I might have, because I remember it was. I don't remember when did the podcast start, because they were like some of the newer, like the older episodes, like Justin's episode and it's like October of 2020.
Speaker 1:It started.
Speaker 2:Okay, yeah, so it probably was not long after that, and so it was the older episodes where I started listening. And so I'm listening to, like the podcast, I'm listening to Dan Muller sermons and I'm like I know that this is for me, but why has nothing changed yet?
Speaker 1:Okay, we're going to take a quick break from the episode and I'm going to bring on my brother, kevin. Kevin, how long have you been rocking with the gospel?
Speaker 3:Um, like three years, three years. This gospel, gospel, truth for three years.
Speaker 1:What would you say it has done in your life?
Speaker 3:You say yeah, um, well, it's not done yet, it's only just starting, um, but what hasn't it done is a more appropriate question. Um, it's a seed planted and it's growing, it's taking root. So there's a lot of uprooting that's been taking place and just unlearning, relearning and reframing. Wow, everything, everything in my life has to be reframed. Wow, from the point of per and perspective of gospel truth. I've heard the gospel before and I didn't understand it, but now that I have a better understanding of it, it literally changes everything, everything in my life.
Speaker 1:You've, uh you've decided to donate of your time, your, your resources to keep this uh ministry going forward. Why is that important to you?
Speaker 3:I wait. The message of salvation this is. It's that verse 2 Corinthians 5, 18 to 19,. But all things are of God, who reconciled us to himself through Jesus Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation, namely the God was in Christ, reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against us. There's the key. And having committed us the word of reconciliation this is our ministry had to teach this to people, that that to be reconciled and and like this is that's it, like that's the point, that that we are coming back to him, you know, and and he's not counting our trespasses against us.
Speaker 1:So it's a big deal is what you're saying. It's a very big deal. Listen, if you're listening, and you and this is my appeal, I say it every week on here uh, we want this ministry to go forward. We want people to hear the podcast, we want people on the Bible studies, uh, and you, donating every single dollar you donate goes towards keeping this going, so you can go to loverealityorg slash give and partner with us moving forward. We want this message to get that there and, um, yeah, you, you, uh, partnering with us goes a long way to get it out there. So, loverealityorg slash give, kevin. Thank you so much, my brother. I appreciate you taking the time. Appreciate you too.
Speaker 3:Thank you.
Speaker 2:So I'm listening to all this stuff and, and after that, um, I don't even think I ever finished Dan Mueller's series. I got to like video like 32 or something, and then I just started to taper off a little bit of the death to life podcast and um was just living my life. I quit that job because for for not necessarily a good reason I just wasn't being treated how I wanted to there and I'm like I'm not doing this forever. I don't want to be at this place forever Cause, also, like I wasn't officially using my degree it was only semi related and there was a kid doing more work than me because he had more experience, but he's like literally a kid. And I'm like I just graduated with a degree and I'm like you guys don't deserve me and I quit so, so I'm not working anymore and this is like in the winter, um of 2020. And um, and then a little bit later in that summer, like we just we just carried on Um with life, but in that summer we started talking about having kids and, um, my husband would have been ready when we got married, but I wasn't ready. So we we didn't start trying for like over a year and then that took me a while. It started taking way longer than I thought. I'm like how come this isn't working? Shouldn't it happen right away? Um, it took like a year and a half and then I started to just like uproot things in my life and like health wise and I'm like, okay, I gotta figure out why. Why am I not getting pregnant? I was like maybe 21 or something Like 21. Yeah, I was like 21 and I'm like I'm young, I'm theoretically healthy, I should just I should be able to get pregnant pretty quickly. Um, and so like I around that time I don't think I was, um, listening to the podcast really anymore. I'm not sure why I tapered off, but I just was like I need to listen to all of this.
Speaker 1:And I did you show up on the Bible studies, cause that's when I got to know you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah so later.
Speaker 1:Sorry, I don't want to jump in, so it's fine, sorry, sorry.
Speaker 2:It's later, um, so, anyway, it takes us like a year and a half to get pregnant, almost, and during this time, like I I am, I'm focusing on my relationship with the Lord, especially like the Holy spirit. Um, just that, like the Holy spirit starts speaking to me, just in more personal ways, and I'm just getting to know God at a different level. So it's like he's still, he's still working, still doing amazing things. Like he gave me a few dreams and the dreams happened and I'm like that, like I never heard about that until I met my husband. He's the first person who talked to me about how personally God wants to speak to you and will speak to you. So I started seeing that happen a little bit. And then we're trying to get pregnant and then, finally, I did get pregnant in like December, um, all the years meshed together, like 2020, 21 December 2021. And then, um, yeah, so, um, then I'm pregnant and I I started to listen to the podcast. I think a little bit here and there and I would think back to, um, like everything that I heard, or even just like Dan Muller, every now and then I would listen to him, but it was just more like, okay, maybe this thing isn't for me, because I didn't see any any change and, like these experiences that people are talking about like maybe it's just not my time yet, like I don't know. And so I just kind of carried on with that, while still trying to just um maintain my relationship with God, because I maintain it so well and just being good at reading my Bible and all the things and um, and also since I was pregnant, like my gears really shifted at that time too, because I was so focused on my health and my um pregnancy and um started listening to birth podcasts because Savannah Louie inspired me to have a home birth. So then I'm like very focused on that Um and just preparing for that Cause I know that's going to be a challenge and I just want to make sure I'm healthy, and so that was like my biggest focus from during that whole time in um, like in 2021 and um or so it was 2021 when I got pregnant and then it was like it was right around new years. So then it's 2022. I I eventually did have my home birth in July and um it everything went like really smoothly and really well, and my midwives talked to me about like and told me like this was like a textbook case. It was, everything was great, you did so great, but I, in that like experience, I had prepared for it so much and believed that it was like going to be no pain and just like the curse was broken and and it was going to be. I just had envisioned this peaceful, blissful experience. And, um, so I go into labor and my labor and it was. It was quick, it was like 12 hours so, and that's quick compared to average. So it was quick. But it was all back labor, which the techniques I had practiced didn't ever talk about. Back labor. They didn't prepare you for that, which is different because you I've heard this from several moms who have had back labor and it's like the coping mechanisms that work for regular labor don't quite work the same. And I had planned to do it at home, no medication or anything, and so I'm like wait, what? Like my bag is on fire. So it was, it was just I perceived it, I think, like it was the hardest thing I ever did, but the way that I perceived it gave me like a negative view afterward because postpartum, my thought life started to spiral like just, it was so negative, so many lies and I'm so vulnerable, I am very emotional, my hormones are everywhere. I was really struggling to breastfeed at the time. It was just so difficult and I I didn't even want to think about the birth experience, even though everyone had told me everyone that was present was like it was beautiful, like you did an amazing job. I almost was like, but God, like that wasn't the experience I prayed and believed for, like where were you in that experience? And for a long time I didn't even want to think about it or reflect on it. And now, like, looking back at just like well, he knew I could do it and he was right there with me, so like I had everything I needed in that moment. It just was like I gave birth, like what did I expect it to be? Like you know, but it just it was really. It was hard in that season. And so October is when I joined that for his Bible study, because I had a lot of free time on my hands. I was just nursing my baby a lot and I was postpartum, so I was resting a lot and I'm like, hmm, okay, I've seen Savannah talk about these Bible studies a lot and I had mentioned to her before, like months before, and I'm like, are these Bible studies recorded? Because the time zone difference is a little, it's a little early for when I've been getting up and I always miss it. And she's like, no, they're not, they're live. And I'm like, oh, okay, and I'm like I guess I'm just not going to go to the Bible studies, that's okay.
Speaker 1:And this is the one that her and I were hosting together. Yeah, that's what we're interested in going to.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And so then I'm like, okay, and in this whole time, like even while I was pregnant, I would share Justin's stuff I think I probably even shared your stuff and I like believed it was true, but I didn't receive it for me, like I didn't receive it over myself. I was just like, cool guys, this is the gospel, but like I, I don't know, maybe I didn't actually think it was for me. And so, like there were, there were pieces of it here and there, but I'm like, okay, I I'm going to just go to the Bible study. And yeah, I remember you putting me on the spot and I'm like, oh man.
Speaker 1:What did I put you on the spot about? Like, who are you?
Speaker 2:Yes, who are you? How do you pronounce your last name? What episodes, what episodes stand out to you and how? How do you notice any difference in your life? It was like bam, bam, bam, and I'm like I don't know, like I just, yeah, so that was. I'm like, oh man, cause I even remember going on the Bible study, when you started, before you got to me, you had asked a couple other people oh, I've never seen you here. And you're like, oh, tell me how you found us. And I'm like, oh man, he's calling on people. And then you got to me I'm scared. Yeah, this guy is scary. And after that Bible study, like I remember, I liked, I liked what I heard, cause I always had. I'm like there, there's something here Like this is so encouraging to me, especially in that season, because, like I said, it was really dark. Um, just, I, just I felt like, off the bat, I'm a new mom, but I felt like a bad mom and I felt like why was my, why did my birth go the way it did, even though, like, looking back, like I said it, it went fine. So there were just, there were just lies in my head, um, so many. And I'm like this, something has to change, like, finally, and what? What's going to change? And well, plot twist, the change already happened. Um, like I just didn't know it yet or fully believe it yet. And so this time in my life, like this and and it's like I had heard bits of this throughout my life but hadn't actually received it, and um, so it's like I wasn't, maybe I wasn't ready to, and then, when I actually did start to be like, okay, like this has got to be for me, like Jesus did this for all of us. We are all his beloved, so he did this for me too, and it's mine, because I I died with him. Like I'm, I'm just going to take him at his word now. And it was at a time in my life that I really needed it and I was just able to receive it. Sorry, I was able to receive it actually. So, um, I just kept coming, and that was like over over a year ago in October, and just this encouraged me so much, just this community, the identity that it has brought my awareness to everything that I have in Christ, like I used to live and think that, okay, jesus accomplished, you know, all he did on the cross. And he said it is finished. And then I would turn around and be like, okay, what do I have to do now? And now I don't have to do anything? Like it's just, it's done for me, I don't have to perform and I don't have to try harder and even though I still fall or, um, I might believe a lie that comes into my head, like I, at the end of the day, like I know my place in Jesus is immovable, like nothing's going to move it, nothing I do is going to move it. It's just I am actually who he says I am, and that's not contingent on me, that's not contingent on my behavior, and it just these truths just started to be like really just washed me and just well up in me. I'm like, okay, I actually can renew my mind, because I had heard that verse so many times it's probably one of the most popular verses that people preach is that you can renew your mind, and I didn't know it was actually possible that it actually changes things the more that you actually just speak that life over yourself. And so I just started to see things change, especially my thought, life and just actually believing who I am and all that I was made for Like I was made for love and I didn't used to know that, I never knew that until hearing it over and over again in little ways, and being like, okay, maybe that's for me, but maybe not today. And then, like these Bible studies come around and they're like yeah, it's for you, like this is for everyone.
Speaker 1:You've been through. You know the one. The Bible study that you go to the most is the one that I have on 930s on Wednesdays and you've been. You've been there for over a year. You've been through like the cycle, maybe three times or something, but just yesterday we had because you wanted to know about what happens when you die and we don't normally talk about that, but we did that. Now that you've been through it three times and you're hearing all this stuff, you said that, while you're not trying harder, there has been transformation in your life. Describe the difference between trying hard for transformation and then just believing what he's done and there being actual transformation.
Speaker 2:Well, trying hard, it doesn't matter how hard you try, like that's just the thing. It's like you can never get there, you can never keep the law perfectly and you don't have a righteousness of your own, so you're gonna burn out or you'll do well for a little while and then, once you fall, then it's up to you to try even harder to get there. Believing what Jesus has done, it's you looking at what he's done and counting it as true for yourself, regardless of what you do, and you get to rest in that Like it's just a continual reminding yourself, like I am at rest because, like I said, like I'm securing Jesus. I died with him and I'm alive with him. That's where my life stems from. Now. It's not me trying to get to that thing, it just is.
Speaker 1:I pick people for the podcast. I don't know how I do it, but people being there for a while and I think I've just heard stuff coming out of your mouth that I hadn't heard before and just a confidence, and you speaking life to other people and you coming back, even though you've done this thing like three or four times, you know that it's good, and so, while I've never like you barely have your camera on, sometimes you do, sometimes you don't.
Speaker 2:Yeah, a lot of times I don't.
Speaker 1:But I've seen a change, even though I haven't even seen you on the screen, I've never met you, but I was like no, she gets this. Just because I've seen the confidence in how you speak and how you minister to other people, and so that has been a blessing to see. And no, I love it. I guess where I wanna take you. I'm trying to decide where are we gonna go? Back to old Eden, I guess? To this point in high school where the you know we act like that's weird. All of us were like that, like we were kids. We needed affirmation. But if you can pull her aside in the middle of these you know relationships where you're trying to be loved, looking for love in all the wrong places, you just pull that girl to the side, put your arm around her. How would you encourage her?
Speaker 2:Um, I would tell her that that's not where love is, or that's not what love is that? If you just look up, if you go back to what you heard growing up even though you didn't maybe understand it at the time like just Jesus, like it's just Jesus and it is nothing else. Like you have all that you need, you don't need other people's affirmation, you are so perfectly loved and you never have to seek it elsewhere.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's powerful. Thank you so much. Like I said, you're a blessing, you're a testimony to us. I didn't know anything about your story and I think it's an awesome story and I think that you're an amazing mom, I think you're gonna. You're an amazing wife, amazing daughter, amazing sister and, as you just keep on being convicted by these truths and believing it, I think your life, while there may be some hard things, it will be a blessing and you'll be a city on a hill. So thank you so much.
Speaker 2:Yeah, thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, man. Sometimes we don't believe it until we see it right, like that's what so many, like I'm from the show me state you gotta show me before I can believe it. And if that's where you're at, if you don't believe this is true for you because you haven't seen the transformation, let me. This is for you, father. I want transformation, I want to believe what you have done, but I haven't been able to because I haven't seen it. But I'm going to be convicted of this truth that if you say it, it's true, that you did it. If you did it, it's done. And I'm gonna put conviction on that, I'm gonna live by that and I trust that you will bring the transformation, because you said that you would. You said that I shouldn't be conformed to the world but be transformed by the renewing of my mind. And so I'm renewing my mind to the fact that you have done it and I'm praying this in Jesus's name. If you want to kick it with us on Wednesday mornings, that's the Bible study that Ian was talking about. It's called Made New 930 Wednesdays. We just talk gospel all day every Wednesday. Come check it out. I'm sure it would be a blessing to you. Hehehe, I hope is the Like comment below. I have to go Bye.