Death to Life podcast
A podcast that tells the stories of people that used to be one way, and now are completely different, and the thing that happened in between was Jesus.
Death to Life podcast
#223 Stephanie Wagner, The Grease Slide: Confessions of a Love Addict
Stephanie shares her powerful journey from seeking love and validation in relationships to finding her true identity and freedom in Christ.
• Growing up in a Christian home with loving parents who demonstrated real faith daily
• Developing a destructive relationship framework in eighth grade after being cheated on
• Believing the lie that physical intimacy was required currency to gain and maintain love
• Meeting and marrying Taylor, but bringing unrealistic expectations into marriage
• Placing her husband on "the throne of her heart" instead of God
• Seeking affirmation outside marriage when feeling emotionally disconnected
• Experiencing the devastating consequences of an affair
• Finding transformation through understanding her true identity in Christ
• Learning that unconditional love comes first from God, not other people
• Walking in freedom and parenting from a foundation of complete acceptance
• No longer needing external validation to feel worthy and valued
• Sharing her story to help others recognize the lies that keep them in bondage
If you're struggling with finding your worth in relationships or battling guilt and shame from past mistakes, remember that your identity is not defined by what you've done but by who God says you are: loved, righteous, complete, and free in Christ.
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The world doesn't think that the gospel can change your life, but we know that it can and that's why we want you to hear these stories, stories of transformation, stories of freedom, people getting free from sin and healed from sin because of Jesus. This is Death to Life.
Speaker 2:And like nobody ever wakes up and decides that they're going to ruin their life, right, like it's always a gradual and insidious resignation of lines that you thought you would never cross, and it's a compromise here and a compromise there and a justification here, and a little bit here and a little bit there. And like it's like stepping down a staircase and like you think that you're just stepping down a step and the other one is still there to step back up to. If, like, you're not good on step, but you're actually just stepping onto a grease slide and, um, like it was just, and it was just. Yeah, it was terrible, it was all bad, but it was like this slow compromise and then this tipping point and then it was just this grease slide.
Speaker 1:Welcome to the Debt to Life podcast. My name is Richard Young and today's episode is with my friend, stephanie. And I met Stephanie a few years ago in Castle Rock, colorado, through my friend, floor, and I kept hearing from Floor you need to get this story, you need to get this story. And we tried and tried to connect, maybe last year, a year before that, to try to get the story, and it wasn't the right time. But right now is the right time and I got the story today and it's beautiful and it's not for kids. There's some adult, grown-up stuff in it.
Speaker 1:But it's a story of someone who believed the same lies that so many of us believe that we were only. Who believed the same lies that so many of us believe that we were only as valuable as what we were able to produce, and that lie leads to devastation pretty much, and you'll hear that in this story. But then you'll hear the beautiful truth of how God has set somebody free and set them free to love. And so Stephanie has a beautiful heart and her story will encourage you and edify you. So let's jump into it, buckle up, strap in Love y'all, appreciate y'all. Here is Stephanie.
Speaker 2:Well, before we start the story, I would say that some of the parts are not going to be for little listeners, just as, like a caveat, to people listening with their families. My story is one that I never, ever thought I was going to share. It was one that I thought I would be in the grave before I told anybody. I didn't want anyone to know ever my story. Um, but that's not the case any longer and I really feel privileged to share what the king has done for me. Um, in hopes that it may be encouraging to somebody else, but I don't view it as airing dirty laundry. Um, it's really just like my testimony of how I am washed white and clothed in righteousness and how I really became the person that Christ created me to be. And yeah, it's. It's, uh, it's definitely a story of of broken identity, and confusion led to clarity.
Speaker 1:Wow, I'm, I'm super. I mean, I was, I had no idea. Like I'm excited, I'm a little nervous now I'm like what's going to happen?
Speaker 2:It's probably not that exciting. What's going to happen in this story? Whatever, okay. So growing up, I grew up in a Christian home I am non-denominational here, representing the non-dominational church and I really grew up in a really fantastic home. My parents were very loving, very supportive. Faith and church was not just like a weekend activity. It was very much part of our entire life life. I have millions of memories of my dad reading the word in his chair and to this day his Bible is held together by duct tape. It has been so read and loved and used that it is held together by duct tape and that's the kind of faith that my parents had every single day. They still do devotionals together every single day.
Speaker 2:Um, and I grew up going to church and youth group and summer camps and I really loved Jesus. My faith was very genuine and real and I definitely knew Jesus was my Lord and Savior. I also had really real faith experiences when I was young and that really solidified my faith for me. For as long as I can remember, I had crazy nightmares as a kid Like not normal of, like oh, I'm in class only in my underwear. Like weird dreams, like I had really crazy, scary, like horrifying dreams, and so I would.
Speaker 2:I have so many memories of my mom. She would scoop me up and she would rock me for who knows how long in a rocking chair and she would pray over me and she would sing amazing grace and, um, like that's the kind of love that my parents gave me. It was very sweet. She would, you know, calm me down and then help me get back to sleep, but, um, she very much taught me that, like God was very accessible, that, like when I call, he answers, and um, that, even though, like I had these crazy nightmares and this fear, like God was always like very present in that. And so, yeah, I definitely have them to thank for demonstrating what, like real faith looks like in all the like ages and stages you know of your life. Um, but part of I don't know where it came from, I don't know. Are you a left behind generation? Remember those?
Speaker 1:stories. I do like Kirk Cameron, like, uh, the books the TV series. Yeah, yeah, because of my faith background. Like we looked at that as kind of like oh, that's crazy, was your faith background where they like really into it?
Speaker 2:No, not really. It was just like something that came out in my like for my age, like it just kind of came out at that time and I don't know why, but like maybe that was part of it, who knows but every night I had like this very real sense of impending doom. Um and for those who are not familiar with impending doom, it's different than anxiety. Anxiety is this heightened, constant fear, adrenaline, I mean we're all pretty familiar with what anxiety is.
Speaker 2:Impending doom is very specific. It's this sense that something very specific is going to happen, even though there's no evidence for that. Like it's a very specific feeling. Um, I'm a nurse. We actually see it a lot in healthcare. Um, if, like, a patient comes in with like impending doom or they feel like I feel like I'm going to die, like sometimes they're very right and like it's a thing, um, just this, like visceral experience of impending doom, anyways, so at nighttime I would feel this impending doom.
Speaker 2:I always thought like something was going to happen to me, or to my family, or my parents or my sister, and so late at night I'd be writing these notes to my family that's like I love you so much, and I'd like put them under their doors Cause I was like scared that something was going to happen and they didn't know, or like they wouldn't know, or like this was my last chance to tell them that I love them. And so my, my family would be like, oh, that's so sweet. And really I'm like, oh, my gosh. Like, um, yeah, it was sad. I'm like like, um, yeah, it was sad. I'm like, oh, poor little me.
Speaker 2:I was like any idea why you had this fear, I think I was afraid that I was going to have nightmare, and then like just this like fear sense like just kind of captivated me at nighttime and um, so I like this is my last chance to tell them that I love them and like slip the like little love notes under their door, um, but also then, like when I had the nightmare, then my mom would rock me and then, like she would always like circle it back to like you are not alone and like Jesus is with you and like it's okay, and like and like Jesus is with you and like it's okay, and like, so really like brought the sense of like his Holy Spirit was present with me even in like moments of fear, and so that like I had a lot of experiences where I felt just the presence of the Holy Spirit and like I'm this like little tiny kid with this sense of impending doom that makes no sense, that I don't know what to do with it I don't even have the words to like name yet and this beautiful sense of his presence and I'm, I'm okay, because he says I'm okay, and so that must mean that I'm okay and just that like faith, like a child that, like this is what the Bible says and so that is what it is and I'm going to be okay because he says that I'm okay.
Speaker 2:So it was this like balance of like fear and worry, but then total trust and faith in what the word says. And I had my own like pink little Bible, you know, like my own little girl Bible. And I had my own like pink little Bible, you know, like my own little girl Bible, and I would read it and I would recite verses back to myself, to my fear, and so my faith was very, very real and very genuine.
Speaker 1:That's so sweet. Yeah, I'm so sorry about all the nightmares. Like, what was it? What was the nightmare about? Do you remember any of?
Speaker 2:these, not them specifically. I mean gosh, that was forever and ever ago. But like, not like normal kid nightmares, like I was always like very impressionable and so like if we would watch a movie or something like my parents would always be like Stephanie, like before it even started they'd be like it's not real and I'd be like I know, but then still like freak out, like I remember like they tried to watch like spider-man with me and I was just like like the toby mcguire spider-man, toby mcguire, like whatever the green bad guy was.
Speaker 2:You know, like I was just like I couldn't hang, like I was just like I don't know. It was just like too much, for I was like a very wimpy kid when it came to that and so I don't know where it came from, but it was just like very crazy, like night terrors and nightmares and whatnot, but anyway, that's just where the story like kind of starts and picks up. But um, I but I very genuinely felt and experienced the Holy Spirit and his presence. Even in like these nightmare moments or whatever. He was still very present and very constant. And my parents did an excellent job of integrating and, like they knew, like you're gonna have, you know, things come up for the rest of our life, right, but bringing it back every time to you're okay. The word says this you are okay, like so, yeah, they did a great job with that and I feel bad for them. I'm now that I am a parent and have rocked a child many hours of the night. My poor mother rocked me forever, thank goodness for that.
Speaker 1:But you know you can do it. There's something about like I don't know, maybe what it is, maybe that they lived inside of you for nine months. I don't have that. But moms have it in a different way. You could not do it. You love those babies.
Speaker 2:I do and I do rock that. I rock both of them. It's precious and it very much reminds me of moments where my mom did that for me. Yeah, it was very sweet. That's awesome.
Speaker 1:So beautiful, beautiful, but a little impending doom, just a little sprinkle of impending doom.
Speaker 2:Yeah, just a little bit, but yeah, it was just this little thing in the background. So I very much loved Jesus, I loved the Lord, and then as I got older, it became very separate things. So I then grew up and would pray and I felt loved by him, but for some reason I didn't rightfully assign his place on the throne of my heart, his place on the throne of my heart. And as I got older I that seat was given away and I had this deep and increasing desire to be affirmed by a man or by a boy, um, and so it was like two sides of a coin. So I was like all about Jesus and I loved him and I loved youth group and I love church, but also this like pining for affection and affirmation from the world, um, so I was not allowed to date technically, until I was 16.
Speaker 2:Um, but there was a particular nameless young boy who I dated in sixth, seventh and eighth grade. And when you were in sixth, seventh and eighth grade, that's just like forever and you're obviously soulmates and you're obviously so in love because you're an eighth grader and that's what you think right. But we, this young man, we would make up and break up all the time, all the time, um, and while we were broken up, I always had somebody else either like lined up and I would be dating, you know, dating high school, you know eighth grade dating, um, you know, like this other person, or like I would see the writing on the wall that, like he was going to break up with me. So I would like quick, get somebody else ready to go for when, like he broke up with me. So then I had another boyfriend, so like I literally always had a boyfriend um.
Speaker 1:Were you boy crazy or specific boy crazy, like there was like you just loved love or you just loved boys?
Speaker 2:both like I loved, like I was very boy crazy, but I also loved the love that came from having a boyfriend.
Speaker 2:And this is all like quote, unquote love right, because right, it's not for whatever we can have at that point and, like you know, I say like dating, you know, like air quote, dating, like all I like. It's like we held hands in the hallway and you're like oh my gosh blush, oh my goodness, you know it's a big deal when you're a sixth grader, but, um, so during this time, like all I would do with my boyfriend or boyfriends, um, um, I would hold hands and kiss Um and that's all that I would do. Um, I did make make out with him, which I'm like golly, um, but that was a very big deal to me. And like I was like very, you know, like very blushing about all of this and I was like, oh my gosh, this is crazy, like I shouldn't't even be doing this, like I don't want to do anything more than that, excuse me. So, anyway, it's the end of eighth grade, and like this whole makeup breakup cycle with this young man.
Speaker 2:And then I was informed by somebody else that he had cheated on me with another young lady, um, and done physical things with her way more than what I was comfortable with and way more than any eighth grader should be doing. Anyways, um, but I was completely crushed by this because, of course, I love him so much. Completely crushed by this because, of course, I love him so much and like, obviously we're soulmates because we've been together, you know, on and off all this time. Um, and I was completely, completely crushed. How could the person who loves me you know, quote unquote loves me do this to me? And the lie that the enemy told me that I bought hook line and sinker was he cheated on you because you didn't want to do those physical things? If you had done those physical things with him, he wouldn't have cheated on you and he would still love you.
Speaker 2:And so the message that I received was that I wasn't as good as this other girl who he did these things with and I needed to do physical things to acquire love. And so it was very much like Romans 1 25, where, you know, they traded truth for a lie. I very much accepted this lie, and I didn't even know it at the time, but that's what I had accepted and I bought this framework for dating and relationships for decades, all the way up until freedom, that the paradigm that I lived in was. He stopped loving me and he cheated on me because I didn't do these physical things. So that means, in order to gain and maintain the quote unquote love, the affection and the affirmation. I have to do these physical things, so it was a very transactional. I have to do these physical things, so it was a very transactional type of love and framework that was all rooted in lies that the enemy told me and that I bought and it brought me so much heartache all the way to freedom.
Speaker 1:What if it was true? What if he didn't want anything to do with you because you didn't do those things?
Speaker 2:I was crushed. That's why I was so sad.
Speaker 1:But that doesn't say anything about you actually.
Speaker 2:Of course it does not. It says something about him. I don't know where that.
Speaker 1:It says something about him. I was talking to a couple I was doing premarital counseling and one of them had had an addiction problem to pornography. And I was talking to the one that didn't. I was like you know what that says about you? And they're like what does it say? I was like nothing, it doesn't say anything about you. You, they may be struggling and you know god bless them. And they're, you know they're going for freedom, but it doesn't mean that you're less than and that's the lie that you're less than because somebody chooses what they think you ought to be doing yeah, absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 2:It was definitely a worthiness issue, um, that rooted from adopting this horrific paradigm that you know I have in order to get love, I have to first give myself. Like physical, emotional, intimacy comes from my giving away of physical experiences and, unfortunately, I think that framework has like been so insidiously incorporated into our culture, especially of young girls. Um, as I've shared my story with um different people, I am not the first young lady to have thought that, um, unfortunately, and so I wish that I had realized it, for how like whack and wrong it was. But, um, I really feel like the enemy uses anything, will use anything that he can to like twist and distort and um, yeah, unfortunately, that was the lie for me, and somebody else might hear that and be like, of course that's not true, but like that's just, that was just my thing. You know, like everybody has their thing, but like that was my thing. Um and eighth, grade.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like how much I mean. This is eighth grade. Yeah, like how much I mean. Times have changed and I'm sure an eighth grader knows a lot more now than what an eighth grader knew. Yeah, you know. So in finding these things out, were you like I got to learn about all this stuff? Like I?
Speaker 2:got to figure it out or like this is what it's going to take. I knew enough things. I went to public school. I don't know enough things, um, to know what was what um, and I didn't feel like, I definitely felt like out of the loop because that was not something that I was doing, um, but I knew enough to understand, like, what had happened and I also knew that I wasn't comfortable doing that Um, and so, yeah, just like, put me in this place of like, not worthy of like your love and affection and not as good as this other girl who does do those things. But also I don't really want to do those things because I still, like, knew truth and like I still love jesus and, like I, my heart was still for god. But it was like very separate, two coin, one coin, two side kind of situation, um. And so all I wanted was to be cherished and to be loved and affirmed, and I was thriving on the affirmation that I would receive um as part of my value system. Um, and I was also very prideful about when I held the attention of boys. Um, if I got the boyfriend, I felt very chosen and special and extra valuable and worthwhile because, to start at the baseline of like unworthiness, based on this terrible framework that I had adopted. Then, if I was chosen, well, now I am special, now I am worthwhile, and so that was um kind of the value system there.
Speaker 2:Um, and then, you know, going into high school I was like a very average kid. To high school I was like a very average kid. Um, I wasn't like very popular but I had friends Um, I don't think I was actively disliked by that many people Like. I was like a very like middle of the road, like average high school kid. I played JV and sports like just because I was there for fun. You know, I was just like a very, um average high schooler in that department.
Speaker 2:But I had a lot of boyfriends. I had many, many, many boyfriends and I had the reputation of having a lot of boyfriends. Um. And so, because of the reputation, boys would come around with a specific expectation for a physical experience, um, and I would say no, and then we would break up, proving my framework correct that I lost those relationships because I didn't do the physical things. So that would leave me feeling worse off. So then the next boyfriend comes around. I feel special, I feel value I feel chosen, and then I would say yes to do, to do those physical things to either gain or maintain their quote unquote love, and then we would inevitably break up, because you're in high school and that's what happens, and high schoolers break up for thousands of reasons.
Speaker 2:Um, my theology told me that the reason we broke up is because, even though, yeah, I did those things, I must not have been good enough, pretty enough, done enough. They must've wanted more that I couldn't provide or do, or like you know, I still was holding the line and like, okay, well, now I'm going to do these things, but like, not this, you know. And then like, well, they must've wanted that. And so that must be why we broke up, not for the thousands of reasons that high schoolers break up all the time, but of course it had to be this. Um, that's very much what I believed. And so, um, it was just this cycle of like I'm going to say no, but then that proves me right, but then if, even if I say yes, I must still have been off. You know what I mean. So it was just this never ending cycle of like feeling worse off and worse off, um, and so I want to just like pause and like say a word on this.
Speaker 2:So, in all of these relationships, the message that I was receiving was very transactional, but just because that's the message that I was receiving, that doesn't mean that it's actually the one that was sent. Um, and I think all of us, many of us, have received messages that were not actually sent. Right. We hear things that weren't actually said, we perceive things that weren't actually reality, um, but the enemy will use anything to exploit or distort the truth into getting us to adopt frameworks or paradigms or what we now know as lies, um, and so, yeah, I mean, all of these actions and all of these experiences were with, you know, being young and dumb and not living in freedom. And when you put that combination of people who are living young, dumb and not in freedom, decisions that are made that very much reflect being young, dumb and not in freedom, and so I don't hold anything against these, um, these gentlemen over the years. You know they were just operating out of their own stuff. You know, and I'm sure that I hurt some of them as well. You know it was just sin, and hurt and pain is a natural byproduct of sin and not living in freedom, and so there are just consequences for that and that's probably why my parents didn't want me dating in the first place.
Speaker 2:Anyways, until I was 16, um, which I did not exactly follow, um, so, yeah, that's just kind of where I was operating from, and I remember driving in the car with my mom and listening to worship music. And listening to worship music and the you know, the person was either singing about all out, unconditional, complete, um, all encompassing and overflowing love, either that they love God that way or God loved them. And I would tell my mom, oh, this would be such a great wedding song. And my mom would be like that's actually about God, but that's very much the love that I wanted and the love that I wanted to be experiencing from people, from these relationships. I was looking for it in a human and completely missing the fact that that's the kind of love that we share with our father and like just completely missed that, like 100 missed it, and my poor mom would be like actually, stephanie, like that's the love of god, and I just was, didn't hear it. Didn't hear it. It wasn't for their like lack of trying, I just didn't hear it, yeah.
Speaker 1:When you get into that stage of life, there's there's things that come to the forefront that they're the most important right, and that boyfriend and girlfriend game and and the insecurity is so rampant and it's just tough.
Speaker 2:It's just tough, yeah we just want to be loved. We do want to be loved, and there's nothing wrong with that, but I definitely was looking for it and not finding it and continuing to look for it in the wrong places. Yeah, so, um, so, yeah. So then come along to 2010 and I met mr john taylor wagner, my now husband.
Speaker 1:Um, oh, jtw, yeah, we know him um, yeah, he um.
Speaker 2:I was 16 and he was 17, so he was my first boyfriend that I was allowed like the sound of music.
Speaker 1:Yeah that song, yeah I do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, not exactly, but yeah, I was just like smitten with this young man. He was my first official boyfriend that I was allowed to have and we went to different schools but we had mutual friends. We met that way and I thought he was just the best he was were you in the same school district but different high schools? Um no, he went to a private high school and I went to a public high school okay, what city, what town were you growing up in?
Speaker 2:um. So I grew up in like, um, like highlands, ranch, castle, rock, castle, pines oh okay, like that kind of centennial region, and he did as well. But he grew up, he went to a private high school you didn't go to columbine, did you? I did not. I went to rock canyon high school oh, okay um, and he went to a private private academy.
Speaker 2:But, um, yeah, so he was just the best. He was so cute, I was so into him, um, and we dated for this summer. But then when we went back to school and we went to different high schools you know that's practically long distance and practically earth-shattering when you are 16 year old. Um, and so taylor broke up with me, which I love to still give him a hard time about. But, um, it's true, he broke up with me and I was very sad, um, I was super crushed. I um, really, really really liked him.
Speaker 2:But, um, we kind of always like kind of held this place in our hearts for each other over the years. We would like kind of keep tabs, like kind of held this place in our hearts for each other Over the years. We would like kind of keep tabs on each other and like I would reach out to him and he would be dating somebody, or he would reach out to me and I would be with somebody. So like our timing never really worked out again in that department, but we always kind of like kept tabs on each other. Sure, so, yeah, it started to rain and storm. Is it really loud or is it?
Speaker 1:okay, it's cool mood.
Speaker 2:It's a vibe Okay.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's a vibe.
Speaker 2:Um. So then you know, life goes on. I had this one boyfriend in high school, who is also nameless, um, and we did it just for a handful of weeks and we broke up whatever, because that's just how things were, um, and then I got a text from him after we broke up and he said um, hey, uh, me and my friends are sitting around talking. You know what about you? Not just your looks, but your personality.
Speaker 1:And I was talking like talking trash, talking badly about you, and he texted you to let you know we're talking badly about just to keep me in the loop, apparently.
Speaker 2:Um, yeah, appreciate you thanks, guy.
Speaker 2:Um.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, I just like received this message out of the blue that, like we're sitting around talking smack about you um, not just your looks, but also your, but your personality, and I was super wrecked.
Speaker 2:Super wrecked because, first of all, um, I already have this like really tragic, complicated framework, tragic complicated framework, um, and then I was just devastated because, to this point, I had been assigning these experiences to like this must be a physical problem, um, but now my relationship paradigm was even more compounded because the message I received was not only am I not enough from a physical perspective, but there's something so innately wrong with my personality and who I am as my inner self that it is laughable and so unacceptable and so unattractive that, like, you and your buddies are going to like sit around and like talk trash about it and like saying these horrible things about me. So, yeah, I was just like just demolished the confidence that I had in myself and, um further deepened the desire to be cherished by somebody to make up for this wrecked confidence in who I was, even as a person. Um, and I just didn't think it was possible anymore that I would be genuinely loved for who I was, just for who I was. Hmm.
Speaker 2:Um, it kind of changed it just just it compounded everything and kind of changed, took everything to a whole new level man I'm so sorry to.
Speaker 1:It's crazy how like these moments yeah can determine so much yeah um, yeah, I'm sorry about that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I can close my shutters. It might be a little quieter.
Speaker 1:That might be the move.
Speaker 2:It's getting really like quite stormy, so let me just close it really fast.
Speaker 1:No worries, I'm looking at all these pictures of you from high school. What's Thunder Ridge? Was that the high school you went to? I'm sorry say that again.
Speaker 2:Was that the high school you went to?
Speaker 1:I'm sorry say that again Was Thunder Ridge, the high school you went to.
Speaker 2:I'm looking at all these photos from your Facebook. No, I went to Rock Canyon.
Speaker 1:I feel like I found some photos of you and your husband when you guys were both in high school.
Speaker 2:There's only one from back in the day and it is adorably cringy.
Speaker 1:No, you're killing it in these 2010s 2010.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that was the year. I don't know if it's on the interwebs, because that's also like back in the times where, like, you've had all these pictures and then, if you broke up, you immediately deleted everything because that was, that was the move. But I don't know if it's on there. I'll have to find it on my phone.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:So is that. I don't know if that's any quieter, but I try.
Speaker 1:It's all good, We'll make do so um so this thing happens that wrecks you. It's not just, it's the whole kit and caboodle for you. You're thinking what happens next?
Speaker 2:So I continue to have relationships trying to find this unattainable fulfillment in another person, and now my confidence was also fractured because of that text message from this person. Um, so it really just made me feel like I needed, I needed this affirmation. Um, and I also grew up in the culture very much of a perfect soulmate, another half, my perfect person, this boyfriend, husband, perfect, perfect fairy tale that, like that's what's going to complete you. I mean, when you look at every TV show, rom-com, movie storyline, it's this girl who then finds fulfillment and completion in their perfect partner or their perfect um match or whatever, and like that was going to be the key to being perfectly happy that was going
Speaker 2:to be it. That was the key and that's very much I think it's still like so common in like our culture and our movies and our shows, like that message rang in loud and clear that I needed a soulmate. I needed like I was a puzzle piece and I needed somebody else to be the other puzzle piece to complete me. And that was going to be. The thing was it was going to come through a relationship were you listening to a lot of taylor swift?
Speaker 2:no, I am. No, I was not, not a real, a real swifty, um. But it was just like. That was the culture, sure, I mean I and it was just like in all the movies, every tv show, every you know, like other girls had boyfriends and they seemed so happy and perfect and so like they must have found their person and I just haven't yet, and so I needed to find my person. That was my goal. That was my goal is to find my person gotta find him gotta find him, um.
Speaker 2:Okay, so then a little forward. I met this unnamed gentleman and I dated him for four years and I very much I was still a very, very young adult, but I very much thought, like this is the guy. So we were both words of affirmation people, words of affirmation people, and so we overcame the mountains of issues that we had by fulfilling this words of affirmation cup in like this very complimentary fashion, um, and I really thought I had found my soulmate, my other half, my puzzle piece, my perfect person. Um, and over the years, um, we did very much plan a future together. Um, we talked about getting married. That was very much the plan Um, and we made really big life decisions based on this planning goal for our relationship together. Um, like I chose the college that I chose because of where we were like geographically, and like he made professional decisions based on me and like that was very much the goal, that was the plan. We were going to get married. I had a promise ring, so adorable. Um, that was the goal. That we were going to get married. That was the thing Um.
Speaker 2:So at this point, um, I was having sex. I had lost my virginity in high school with a gentleman that like no offense to him, but like I meant very little to um, it was not like some super sweet special boyfriend, whatever. I very much meant nothing to him, um, but I really really liked him. And this was like the final line that like I hadn't crossed Right and so he had already done that with his previous girlfriend and so I was like, well, I gotta step up because like that's the expectation, that's where he's at, that's his level, so I gotta get there, um. And so I really liked him and I made that decision and um, he like hung out for for a little bit but like that was that yeah so I had crossed that line.
Speaker 1:That I, you know, is that breakup more difficult than the previous ones, then?
Speaker 2:or were you just like, wow, this is life um, it wasn't even a breakup, we weren't even together. That's the horrible, sad part. Um, we weren't even together. But I thought that if I did this, then we that was going to be like the currency for this, like I would do this thing and then you're going to be my boyfriend and it's all going to be great. But we weren't even together, sadly, um. And so then, like when he like just kind of gradually lost interest in me, I was very at a loss, because what else could I possibly give? I gave all the things. What could I possibly have left to give? So it must be just who I am. He just must not like me. I must be so unlikable from my personality. But even though I did all the things, it wasn't enough. So, yeah, I was really. It was quite crushing actually.
Speaker 1:But then once that you crossed that bridge, then cross the bridge.
Speaker 2:It's not a big deal in in the other areas or in the other um I, that was the only person within my high school that I did that with um. So then, like the next relationship was with this next gentleman, um, that was with four years. And so I, I um told myself and I believe, that I was comfortable with this because we're going to get married, so it's all going to be fine later. And like God is definitely disappointed in me, but it'll be, it'll be fine later. Like it'll be fine later. So like right now it's not supposed to be, but like it's going to be fine later, so like it'll be fine, right, um. And so I was having sex with this person and at this point in time I was in nursing school and like, oh, shout out to all of my nurses and those in nursing school you will get through. I promise you can do this, um, nursing school is, is not? It's not. Am I crazy? Is Natalie a nurse?
Speaker 1:She is, she's. She's downstairs right now studying to be a nurse practitioner, so she's still in school.
Speaker 2:Oh, good for her. I'm so glad that she's doing that. She's gonna be great at that. Um, yeah, nursing. I don't know if you you met in college right, so you knew like nursing school was like no joke yeah, I wasn't um, super serious, it is very serious and it takes over your entire life.
Speaker 2:You basically like say adios to your friends and family until you graduate. And then you're like, hey, I'm still, I still exist, I'm still around. And then, like it takes over your whole life. Um so, like tests, school, clinical, homework, discussions, like all the things, and I was still working full time. Um, so I was working and in nursing school and like just exhausted, and so because of the place that I was, physically, I didn't want to have sex. Like it just wasn't even on my radar. I'm like I'm going to do a 12 hour clinical to come home and study for several hours, to go to work the next day, to then come home and study, to then take an exam. Like it wasn't even like on the list of things to do, like it was just not on there. Excuse me, but because I felt so confident in my relationship with this person, I wasn't worried about it anymore.
Speaker 2:Like that was still the framework of like I do physical things so that you love me more, but I felt so loved by this person and so confident in like the plan that we had for our future that I was like it's fine if I'm not having sex or if I'm saying no, it's okay, like I feel I feel safe to say no. Um, this unnamed gentleman was also a professional athlete. Um, I was very aware that he was being pursued by a lot of, um, a lot of young ladies, and so I had seen him like respectfully and firmly like rebuff the advances of other girls. Um, so I was confident in our relationship, but the the message that I received later was and I wasn't having sex. He never like made me or like it was not like that.
Speaker 2:But the message I like I knew that he was disappointed when I would say no, like he would be like hey, girl, hey, and I'd be like no, and then I could sense that he was like shut down or disappointed or like felt some kind of way about it. And then the message that I received was there were a lot of other girls that wanted to be with him and to sleep with him and because he loved me, he was saying no to them. But because he was doing that, I should say yes, as like, as like out of gratitude that he wasn't cheating on me. Like does that make sense? That's like super whack. So like, let me try to say that again, a better way I don't think it.
Speaker 1:It's super whack. I think it makes a lot of sense if you're in that paradigm, like in a marriage, um, sex is good, you should, you know you shouldn't, yeah. But like when you're not married, I think the whole not being married throws uh, I think the whole not being married throws the weirdness into it. You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, but like it was a like, a posture of like I had better do this, because I know that there are a lot of other girls who are, who want to, who are pursuing him, who are like, like, like trying to get his attention and like actively trying to sleep with him and like he's saying, no, because he loves me. So because I love him, I better be grateful that he's not cheating on me, so I better just do these things.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that would bring resentfulness from your end. Like if you feel like you have to, that's the thing that would bring resentfulness. If you feel like you get to because you love them and you're sharing this thing and it's intimate, that's a beautiful thing. But if it's you have to, that will for sure bring resentment.
Speaker 2:It was resentment, but I that I was, I was the eighth grader. Again, I was the eighth grader who got cheated on because I didn't do the physical things and I love this person, I'm committed to my future with this person, so I better do the things or I'm going to lose this relationship. So it was resentment, but it was also like fear that I was going to lose him and like, and if he did, it would be justified because that's the framework that I've worked with now for a long time, because that's the framework that I've worked with now for a long time, and I remember I would say yes to him and I would just be like crying during, like. I would just be like silently, like.
Speaker 1:Is this right? Is this because you're so stressed out, or is this because you really didn't want to have sex?
Speaker 2:I did not want to have sex. I didn't want to. In my heart, I wanted to say no. I'm like I'm exhausted. No, thank you. I've got a thousand reasons that I want to say no. My heart is not in this at this very second. No, thank you. I wanted to say no. I did not want to be saying yes, but I did because I had better do this. It's my job, it's my responsibility, and if I don't fulfill this transactional love, I'm going to lose this relationship, and so we would be doing such activities it's dark or whatever and I would just be crying like tears and like incomplete and total defense of this person. I was not being honest, so he did not know. It was not like he was pushing this thing on me in a like um, like abusive way, like I want to make that super, like abusive way, like I want to make that super super clear, like it was not, like he did not leave, system was putting a lot of pressure on you that you had to do this or you would lose it.
Speaker 1:And even if you didn't want to, you had to.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and so, even though, like I'm having sex when I don't want to, I'm crying because I literally want to say no, but I'm saying yes, like in his total defense, like he did not know that that was the case, and so I don't want someone to be like he did what, like it wasn't like he did something, it was, it was like my decision and it was me not being honest and truthful. So I don't want to like throw that out there, that like he was doing this or what. You know what I mean. Like I just want to take accountability for a portion of that and not put on something that he doesn't need to feel like it's his responsibility. Um, so, anyway, that's that sex was really complicated for me. I didn't really want to.
Speaker 2:I still loved God very much. I was going to church and I still love Jesus. I was praying, I had this relationship with God, but and I knew that what I was doing was wrong but I was justifying because, like, well, it's okay, cause we have a plan that we're going to get married, so like it's going to be fine. Um, and turns out he did, in fact, cheat on me, um, even though I was doing the things, um, he did, in fact, cheat on me, but I didn't find that out until later, so it didn't exactly impact my like paradigm at the moment. But turns out he was um being unfaithful to me. Um, but thankfully, um, I, I, I truly feel like he loved me and I loved him. But thankfully, the Lord had better plans for me and for many, many, many, many reasons, we separated and decided to go our ways, and it wasn't like I'm mad at you or you did this or whatever Cause I didn't know at the time that he had been unfaithful to me. Um, it was a mutual decision, like we were separating and we were like mutually making this decision.
Speaker 2:But I, this breakup was the most painful, the most um most painful, the most um crushing. I just wept and wept. I was just in total despair, um, because I was losing my boyfriend, my best friend, my partner for the last four years, and I was also grieving my perceived future because I had made compromises, I was living with him, I was sleeping with him because, like, that was the plan and I very much believed that I was going to be spending my life with this person. So I'm making decisions within my education path, my career path based on our plans for the future. And so I was grieving the current, missing the person, but I was also grieving my perceived future, um, and so I was just not okay. I was not okay. Um, my mom actually would like just come over and like check on me and call me. She would like check on me often because I was not okay.
Speaker 2:I was, I had, I was like completely undone. I felt like I had given myself in all the possible ways that I could have. I had given myself in all the possible ways that I could have, and what was I left with? Who was I now that I didn't have a boyfriend? I had been like this cyclical boyfriend, haver, forever. I was committed to this person. I had given everything of myself emotionally. I'd given everything of myself physically. And now, what? Like? Now, where am I? I felt like I had nothing to show for it and I was worth nothing because of everything I had given away and I like was nothing. So I was just wrecked. Not okay, not okay. I re like I, when I read back to my, my journal or my whatever journals of that time period, like, I just feel so sad for that girl. Like, I genuinely felt lost, like, and I was just so devastated, like to my core. I was so upset and broken about what had happened.
Speaker 2:Um, excuse me, but because of this, um, I began pursuing God in a way that I never had uh because I was being fulfilled, sort of kind of in this partial flesh way of the world, kind of in this partial flesh way of the world, and now I didn't have that at all, and so I always had known that God was with me. But now I was pursuing God in like a very new and real way Um and so, but I was still in nursing school. I was um halfway through and so like it was becoming more and more strenuous. So I was like seeking God, going to church, but like very much like nursing school. I consumed all of my time in my life and then I did what every girl after a terrible breakup does I said I will not date again.
Speaker 1:I'm done.
Speaker 2:I'm done, I'm swearing off men, men forever. I'm never going to date again. Of course, of course.
Speaker 1:Everybody does that right how old are you in this heaven?
Speaker 2:math, math is hard. Hold on um 21, um 21.
Speaker 1:21. I'm never digging it, never 21. Never, never.
Speaker 2:How sweet I was. I was for real, I meant it, I was like I'm done yeah you did Um 21. I'm done Um. And then, a couple of months later, in breezes, john taylor wagner. Taylor wagner, that guy, just as cute and chill and wonderful as ever, and my life would never be the same but in walks is this person? Jonathan, his name is john john taylor wagner, but he goes by taylor, um, like everybody knows him as taylor.
Speaker 1:He is taylor, but his name is actually john taylor wagner oh, because there was this guy named jonathan taylor thomas uh in the 90s who was very popular with the girls oh yeah, I was wondering if that was john taylor. All right, so you meet taylor again it's taylor wagner, here he comes broken your heart before, how dare you not this time?
Speaker 2:not this time, um. So, like I said, like we had always kind of kept tabs on each other and like kind of peaked on social media here and there, um, and he had seen that I was single. Again on Facebook he saw that I was now single relationship status, um, and he reached out to me and he was like hey, do you want to go to dinner with me? And this guy like like um, his best friend from high school that I had known because of like knowing him in high school, he's like hey, do you want to catch up and go to dinner with me?
Speaker 1:and this guy and I was like, okay, a hard sell it's a real hard sell never again, until somebody asks me to until it's taylor, okay, I guess.
Speaker 2:Um.
Speaker 1:So yeah, we met up at outback and actually that's a good spot for the casual, you know it's the middle of the middle of the road, like casual, casual eatery.
Speaker 2:So, um, we met up at Outback. We had been like since I had said yes, like yeah, sure, yeah, sure we can hang out. Um, we had been like texting a storm up, so like constantly texting, full thread conversation on text, full thread conversation on Snapchat. We were just like like all about it. And then we go to Outback and he is dead silent. He says no words to me other than like hey, like no words, like complete silence. And I was like thank goodness this other dude is here, because it would be real awkward and long, long dinner. Like, just like he was dead silent to me and I thought, okay, well, I guess, like this guy just doesn't like me or like I'm not the same in person, as he thought I was going to be over, you know, over the phone, like okay, whatever, fine. Um, and literally by the time I had left the parking lot of outback and driven away, I had this text from him, was like I'm so sorry, I was so quiet, I was just so nervous and like I just was so, um, like nervous, can I please have another chance? Can I please take you on a date. And who? How can I say no? Totally redeemed himself, completely right, like, how can I say no? How can anybody say no to Taylor? He's the best.
Speaker 2:So we went to our next day. We went to the stadium series game for my NHL fans. We went to the Avs game, went to the outdoor series and we held hands and that was it. It was all over and we were just like completely obsessed with each other. Um, talking all the time, seeing each other like every single day. We were just super into each other, like super obsessed with each other. Like from the jump, we had said I love you.
Speaker 2:Within like two weeks of dating each other and in my heart, like I was like this is the man I'm going to marry. It's one of those like and I heard it all the time of like when you know, you know, and we just knew, like we very much were like yep, this is the person. And like it just became like so clear. This is why and like this is why it didn't work out with these people previously, because this is the guy, this is the guy. I loved this man Like with all my heart. Like so quickly I was like this is the guy, a hundred percent Like I. I'm sure a lot of people have felt that way with their spouses. When you meet your spouse you're like yeah.
Speaker 1:Sometimes it works like that for Natalie and myself.
Speaker 1:It was like within two weeks, we were telling each other that we loved each other. Some people does not work like that. It does Not for everybody. For me, I think my ADHDhd, I was so laser focused on her and she has it too. We were just like laser focused on each other, like locked in, and so us saying I love you that early. I don't think it's strange for us, but for people who, you know, take it slow and you, you know, yeah, that's cool too. I guess I don't know how it works, but yeah, I don't know how that works.
Speaker 2:That was not my style. I've never been that style, obviously, from my story up to this point. But yeah, like Taylor was just different, he was different and he was this is the guy, this was the guy. But yeah, I know, this is the guy, this was the guy, um, but yeah, I know that not everybody has that same experience and for some people, that like trips them up too because they're like, aren't I supposed to feel like all these things? But like you know, like your love and relationship is just as genuine. This is just happens to be how mine went down, was that this was the guy, um.
Speaker 2:So we dated for a couple of years, um, and we were just not like, we were all out, a hundred percent, love each other, but we were just not the great, great um communicator when it came to disagreements. Um, we had definitely had expectations for the relationship that were just different. I mean, that's like. You know, people right, everybody brings their unspoken expectations to the table Um, but we just like, we just weren't great communicators but we loved each other so much and like, can I just tell you like the cutest thing that he did? Can I just tell you, like the cutest thing that he did, let me um. So he lived like 45 minutes away and when we first got together I was like the first time I drove all the way up to his house.
Speaker 2:I was like I don't know, about this dude Like this is kind of far, like I don't know this is too far, but um he, we like started spending more and more time with each other at each other's house. It was either like my place or your place and he cleaned out a drawer for me. I got my own drawer.
Speaker 1:What a sweetheart.
Speaker 2:It was so sweet. It was so cute. Like I had my own drawer for, like my toothbrush. Life is like a permanently lives at this dwelling. Like this is my toothbrush he got me like. He got like I don't remember like hair ties or like a hairbrush or something.
Speaker 2:Like, and he was like this is for you, like it was the cutest dang thing, like, so sweet. He got me. He gave me a drawer. It was so cute and I think I like pretty much rapidly took over the rest of the drawers. But as a girl I just have a lot of things. I got a lot of accessories and stuff, but he gave me it was like. It was like like the demonstration of his heart. Like taylor is very much a acts of service person and so so like it was just like, so like the genuine love of his heart and like he was so sweet.
Speaker 2:Um, I was in my last year of nursing school, which is like the most strenuous, the most stressful Um, and he was very helpful and encouraging and supportive to me in that Um and like we always had so much fun together and overall like it was really great. Like we weren't great at communicating when it came to like difficult issues, but we were overall like his service and um, he was just so loving and sweet and um, I fully love this person and I fully put him on the throne of my heart. The things that he said to me or didn't say to me, the things that he did or didn't do, the way that I perceived this, that or the other thing is what I lived and breathed and died on every day. Um, he, like, his affirmation and affection, was the most influential input on my heart. He, if I felt like there was emotional disconnection for whatever reason, or like we had a disagreement, I used physical intimacy, or like physical, um physical intimacy as a currency for gaining emotional connection.
Speaker 2:So, um, I had bought into this idea that, like Taylor completed me. It was Taylor who fulfilled me. It was his job to take care of my feelings. It was his job to, like, show up with chocolates and flowers and a love note, like, and if he wasn't doing those things or fulfilling this like picture in my head, then, like it must be because I haven't done enough physically. So, like I was manipulating physical intimacy, which is its original intent, is beautiful and pure, but I was manipulating it and extorting it to gain this like false and fleeting emotional connection.
Speaker 1:So that's looking at the pictures of you guys right now.
Speaker 2:Isn't he so cute, he's handsome, hands, handsome handsome devil tell you what so you were exchanging this. He's the lord of your life, although you didn't know that did not know that, did not know that, um, but he was very much the like sat on the throne of my heart, he was lord over my life, and so then, when we got married, we got married in 2019. We got married in 2019. And we definitely had some issues Every relationship does right but I thought, oh, when we get married, things are going to magically transform.
Speaker 1:That's how it works, right? You get married and those issues just disappear.
Speaker 2:That's what happens you get married, you wake up. Things are perfect, obviously, like he's going to like we got married on August 23rd and on August 24th he's going to wake up and just be. He's going to completely adore me. He's going to be so sweet and special and extra and we're just going to be this like perfect little lovebird life, of course, because we're going to get like.
Speaker 1:That's how it's going to work. Well, you know what you probably did? That doesn't mean he or you became amazing communicators.
Speaker 2:We did not. That is not what happened to us.
Speaker 1:He didn't love you on August 24th.
Speaker 2:He loved me so much on August 24th. He still does Bless. That man thought the picture of what he looked like was going to fulfill this hallmark hollywood perfect romantic picture and, um, I had very specific, unspoken expectations for what marriage would look like. He had very specific, unspoken expectations for what marriage would look like and, shockingly, it was not the same.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it doesn't work out that way. I think one of the things that people misunderstand is that there are some problems or some things that you're just never going to agree on, just never. That you're just never going to agree on, just never Like because of your value system, the way you grew up. There's just that the key is to be connected to each other, that, even if you don't agree on them, you still maintain this connection. And so, like you, didn't marry him because you're like oh man, that guy, he communicates his butt off like I love his communication style. Oh, my goodness, the the words he chooses. No, you, you were connected, like you, you. And so what then happens is we think that every single kind of disagreement will just disappear. Well, that ain't so. That's where, that's where we might get into trouble.
Speaker 2:A hundred percent. A hundred percent and honestly, um, billy Graham's wife. I'm going to butcher the quote. You probably know it better than I do, but Billy Graham's wife said a successful marriage is between two people who forgive quickly.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's beautiful who forgive quickly.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's beautiful and I love that Like and I've heard. I heard it recently so I did not know, I didn't hear it at the time, I didn't know it at the time. Um, actually, the marriage advice that I received so like you have your little like bachelorette party or whatever the marriage advice that I received like written down on the like advice for the new couple. The marriage was no lie. I found it years later, cause I put them all like in a little baggie for my keepsake. Whatever the marriage advice that I received was have sex three times a week, no matter what. Ask for what you want after sex. This was the marriage advice that I was given, and not all of it was like that, of course, but these are the things that were being told to me. You're getting married, this is your job, this is your lane, stay in it, this is your responsibility. And I was like, yeah, you bet it is because last previous gentleman yeah like all previous gentlemen's, were reinforcing.
Speaker 2:I was reinforcing incorrectly, by nature of the lies of the enemy of my soul that was feeding to me that I was believing and accepting was this is a transaction. I missed the part about marriage being a covenant and I instead treated it as a transaction. I do physical things so you love me more. I better do this. If I don't, you are not going to love me as much and it's my job. So if I'm getting less love from you because I'm doing less physical things, well that's on me because, like, the pendulum starts with me doing the physical things to get the love. So that's how I was operating. Um, and tying it to the words of affirmation and the affection and this you complete me mentality. So at our wedding we did traditional vows and we also set our own vows and when I read my vows now I don't know like it makes me sad because you can tell in them that I was just pining for this soulmate mentality. So, like in my vows, I say like you are my everything, you are my soulmate. Like you complete me. Um, you're perfect for me, we're perfect for each other. Um, I really just wanted that. Happily, ever after that, like constant adoration, fulfillment in a very specific way. I wanted it to be your words of affirmation. That's what I wanted, um, and it was very unfair to Taylor, completely unfair to Taylor, because, um, well, so like, let me back up. So like, our love styles are super different. Like I said, I'm a very much a words of affirmation person. He's an acts of service person, and so Taylor was showing me all day, every day, all the time that he did love me and he did care for me, in all the acts of service and the things that he was doing for me, in the way that, like, he was genuinely loving me from his heart. But because it didn't fit how I wanted, I was, like, I don't want you to unload the dishwasher, I want you to tell me how much you love me, like, I want it this way. This is the way that I want you to give me love. That's great that you unloaded the dishwasher, that's fine, I want it. This is the way that I want you to give me love. That's great that you unloaded the dishwasher, that's fine, I want it. This is the way that I want my love to come.
Speaker 2:And so it very much projected on him this, um, this uh message of what you're doing is not enough. You're not enough. The way that you're loving me is not enough. I'm unfulfilled, I'm unhappy because it's your job to make me happy, because it's my job to make you happy.
Speaker 2:And so, like he very much unfairly received the message that he was not enough because of the way that I was, was not enough because of the way that I was treating him and how I was constantly pulling on him to love me in this very specific way. So it was very unfair to Taylor. It put his heart in a place of never feeling like enough, um, and our communication issues really just continued. And our communication issues really just continued. We were not effective communicators at all when it came to disagreements or hurts or whatever he like. If I brought something up to him a hurt or whatever the thing was he would shut down and he just like wouldn't say anything, like he would just like shut down, um, and he just like wouldn't say anything Like, he would just like shut down completely. And so then that left everything feeling worse off than it was before and we would just kind of sit in this tense, uncomfortable mess for like a day or two until something happened that like distracted us or reset it, reset us from this conversation that went nowhere.
Speaker 2:And so I never felt understood or heard or like confident that he heard what I was telling him, because our conversations were never constructive.
Speaker 2:Because our conversations were never constructive, um, the behavior that I, like Taylor would just be like I'm so sorry, and I'd be like, okay, well, like for what? Like what are you apologizing for? And he's like, well, I'm sorry that I did this thing wrong or whatever. But like I mean I think you know, like the arguments are never about what you're arguing about, right, they're always so much deeper and at the core of it, I never felt, like never as a strong word, I didn't feel that I was being heard and seen and understood because of our conversation style, our communication style, and so we would just sit in this like uncomfortableness for a couple of days until like something broke it or whatever, but then like the offense or the underlying thing or issue was never actually addressed and resolved and so, and then things just felt worse for even having a conversation, and so then I just didn't.
Speaker 2:So I was like it's just not worth having the conversation, it's not worth having this disagreement, and he felt the same way as well. So he wouldn't. If I did something that was hurtful to him he didn't bring it to me because there was no resolution I like I would become very emotional, very defensive, very reactive and so like we just never, um, kind of figured out how to have constructive conflict and conversation, um, and so it just kind of shut down.
Speaker 1:Um, how long were you married before this was really manifesting?
Speaker 2:This was a thing, this was always the thing, even like when we were dating. This is how like the conversation style was. But when we got married, obviously it was going to be fixed and it was going to be magically resolved.
Speaker 1:It was pretty soon into it then.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, just like we didn't have the um, the tools and the knowledge and the wherewithal to communicate with each other in a way that either of us could hear each other. Like we just didn't hear each other very well, um, it just wasn't like a good communication standpoint and so, like communication standpoint, and so like I was left, I was left feeling lonely, and so this loneliness crept in of like why bother having this conversation Because it's not going to go anywhere, nothing is going to be resolved. I'm just making things uncomfortable in my house. So like just don't even bother bringing stuff up, and like I won't speak for all of his feelings, but like he very much felt like I can't bring anything up to Stephanie because she's just going to like be emotional and defensive and reactive, so it's not worth bringing something up. And so then things would just kind of build until I had to say something about it.
Speaker 2:And then it was like this big thing, it wasn't like this one little thing that needs discussed. It was like, well, you do this and this and this and this, and it was this like snowball thing which was even more not a great communication style, um, and so it just like led to this like cycle of loneliness, and so if I felt like I needed to talk to him about something that I knew was going to be uncomfortable, I would wait until like the end of the day, because then at least, like the rest of the day hadn't been ruined, just the evening would be ruined, or like if I knew something else was going to happen in like the day or two. Then I'm like, okay, that'll be our reset thing, so I'll just wait to talk about it until, like, there's an outside distraction that's going to fix it for us. So just like, not great, not great communication at all. I wound up feeling very emotionally disconnected. I felt like I was a million miles away from the person I was sitting five feet away from.
Speaker 2:We did not have the tools for effective reconciliation, um, and it just kind of built and built into this, um, emotional separation and like just loneliness Cause we just, we just, yeah, it was just a hard. It was a hard place for sure, um, and all the while, all I wanted was the affirmation and the affection from my husband. Um, what he said to me made the most difference, like that's what I cared about the most, and so I would be pulling on him and pulling on him and pressuring him to love me in a specific way to make me feel all better. Meanwhile, that was making him feel all worse. Ultimately, I was feeling worse, um, and I had just inappropriately assigned him Lord of my life and I had put on him this mantle and this role and this expectation and job that he was never designed to hold, and I was setting him up for failure because I was putting on him things that he was never supposed to carry. So, yeah, it was, uh, it was not good.
Speaker 2:Okay, um, if you had asked me at the time like, I would have thought very much that I was like this leaky vessel, like a leaky vase, and like I needed to be poured into constantly to maintain being filled up and it was Taylor's job and he wasn't doing it enough and he wasn't doing it the right way. Um, but like, ultimately, like, even if he had lavished every type of love in the world on me, it was never going to be enough, because I was filling myself with this imperfect kind of love and I had missed the boat completely, that it was God, and God alone, who was going to love me in that way, like those worship songs that I was like, oh, this would be a great wedding song. Like no girl, you missed it. That's not the point. It's only God that gives that kind of love. You don't hear that, see, that feel that kind of love with a person. That's the kind of love that comes from God. Right, like, first from God. Right, first, that comes from god. Right, like first from god.
Speaker 2:Right, first, it comes from god absolutely um, we'd also gotten into this like terrible habit of like making jokes at each other's expense a lot, and so like. It'd be like if I was like oh, like, the closet door is broken, you're like, well, you're broken, and it's just like, and it'd be like that, like you know, and it was never like meant to be like for reals.
Speaker 2:It was just this like jokey, like terrible bad joke that just like became a thing and it like tore me up because I'm like dying for your words of affirmation but I'm receiving these like things that are supposed to be like harmless jokes, but I can't receive them that way because I'm just like way too sensitive for that. And so then, like, I carried those words as real and, even though they weren't supposed to be, and the message that was being sent was joking around, the message I received and carried was that's actually how he feels about you. He really does mean that you know, like and it's just like the whispers and lies of the enemy to be like he's not kidding. He really does mean that he really doesn't want you. Um, and so there was just like this rift between us in that department. And then, um, I also perceived that the only times that he wanted that he was like affectionate or like loving toward me was when he wanted to be physically intimate.
Speaker 2:And that probably was not true, but it seemed like to me that like he only wanted to be like jokey, lovey, flirty, whatever, when he was pursuing something physical, and then if I said no, then he was disappointed or he was like kind of let down, um. And so I was like all built on this paradigm and this framework that like I better do these physical things and like I'm feeling emotionally connected and so I better do something physical, or like I guess, yeah, how many days has it been? Yeah, I guess it is. Yeah, I guess I should like let me just do that so that I can gain, like I can build our emotional connection on this like faulty framework of physical things. You know, that kind of makes sense, um. And so I just felt like very emotionally, like stiff armed from him, um, like I just had this insatiable need for affection and affirmation and so like it was literally like way too much, like poor guy. I was just like harping on him all the time, it would never be enough.
Speaker 2:It would have never been enough.
Speaker 2:He could have done from sunup from sundown all the ways. It would have never been enough. But I thought that's where my fulfillment was going to come from, was from him. And so I was pulling on him, pulling on him, pulling on him, and he eventually was like chill him. And he eventually was like chill Um, and it really like put him in a in a place, because every time I'd be pulling on him I would be not satisfied with what he gave me and then it would make him feel less than not good enough and like it was really an unfair to be putting all of that on him.
Speaker 2:Um, and, yeah, like it was just it was unfair for sure for him. And the way that I was treating him was was, um, not loving, it was very self-seeking, um, it was very, it was super unfair to him. But from the outside our marriage looked very normal, very happy, run-of-the-mill, but on the inside I was really struggling and deeply lonely. I felt very pushed away by him. Um, I felt very pushed away from him by him. Um, I would like try to sit next to him on the couch or like cuddle up next to him, and he would be like, get up and move to another couch, or like, can you like, can you like sit like a little farther away? Or like, give me some space. Like you know, honestly, like the man probably just wanted personal space, but like I received and perceived that as like rejection by him. He doesn't want you, he doesn't want anything to do with you, he doesn't even want to sit next to you on the couch. Why would he? You know, like all of those lies and like previous paradigm coming into like why would he? You know, um?
Speaker 2:And so I started um counseling because I, like I was depressed and lonely and sad and I had gotten married to this person who was supposed to fix everything and, shockingly, he didn't. And so, like now what? And so I had gotten into counseling Um. I asked him if he would do marital counseling with me.
Speaker 2:He was not interested at the time, um, so I was like, okay, like it just must be me, it must be something with me, like I must be innately. There's something innately wrong with me, um. And it brought back to like that personality, like the text from the guy, that like it's not just you physically, it's your personality, like you must be so unlikable, unwantable, that like it's just you, um, and so I just felt unwanted by him, um, which, again, is the message that I was receiving, and not necessarily the message that was being sent by him, but it was the one that I was receiving, um, and so I had started googling and researching how to make my husband like me, how to make my husband like me, how to make your partner adore you, because I really felt like out of tools, like my toolbox was empty, like I'm trying what was the advice that those Google searches gave you?
Speaker 2:Um, make sure you're having sex. Um, make sure you're having sex, make sure you're looking good, don't ask for too much. It was like a terrible, terrible advice that Google was giving me.
Speaker 1:My bachelor party, my buddies took me downtown Kansas City and we're walking around and they made me ask couples questions. And they made me ask couples questions and so I was supposed to ask single like dating couples and married couples questions, and there were the same questions like what do I do to keep my marriage going well, or whatever. The couples that were dating all sounded the exact same. It was all sex and the married couples were actually like giving real advice that had nothing to do with sex, because they, if you understand, like sex is, is what comes from the intimacy. Yes, like for I think girls need to have intimacy.
Speaker 1:It seems like this is a. This is super stereotypical, to want to engage in intimacy that way, and it might be the opposite ways for for the guys, but like you need to have connection, you need to actually be on the same page. There needs to be self like giving love, like you, like you just lay your life down and you love that other person. Then all that other stuff kind of just takes care of itself. Yeah, um rather than uh, look good and sleep with them and then all your problems will be solved. You know, I don't. Yeah, it doesn't like that's the cart before the horse. It's not saying that that stuff isn't important. It's important but that's not going to solve your problem. Like let's love each other.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely, and I had completely missed that, a hundred percent. Like my framework was backwards. It was like, yeah, it was cart before the horse. So like, like I do these things so that you love me, but like I was very much lacking emotional connection because of the way that our communication style had, um, progressively gotten worse and like this rift had been established because of the way that I was inappropriately assigning this role to him, making him feel terrible, operating out of me, me, me, I need, I need, I need, um, yeah, I was not real good, uh, between us, and this was only like a couple of years into marriage, um, and so I was like, oh no, we're not that far in and this is not going the way that I thought this was going to go. Um, and then the other like piece of it was he?
Speaker 2:Um, it seemed like Taylor, with his friends. He had so much fun. He was like, joking, light-hearted, he just like lit up, came alive, had all this fun with his friends and then with me. It wasn't like I felt like he was just like, and that's what I felt, that's not easy and that's not again like to his defense, like that's not how it really was, but that's what I was seeing and perceiving and like the lies that I was just eating up were he doesn't even like you. He has so much more fun with other people than you and it very much brought me back to the eighth grader and it brought me back to that text from that person that it's a personality issue. It's a who you are as a person issue and I very much fully believed Taylor was just stuck with me. He didn't want me. He was just stuck with me and he didn't want this thing. He was just stuck in this thing and he had all this fun with his friends and then with me. He was just stuck and that's like where I thought we were at. I wanted unconditional, lavish love and I had been trying to gain it from a person and missed the truth that unconditional and lavish love first comes from God and God alone. And um, just I did so. I hurt him so much by putting on him something that he was never supposed to carry, um.
Speaker 2:But we have been married a couple of years and at this point we had started talking about having kids, um, and in our private conversations he was like yeah, like mostly on board, like yeah, I'm bored. But then in public, if we ever talked about it, um, he'd be like what? Like joking around but like very much putting out that like it was all me and like that he didn't want this. But I didn't realize and know um, or have a communication style to be able to have a clarifying conversation with him if he actually meant that or not. But I thought he doesn't even want that with me.
Speaker 2:And so this heart's desire of mine to be a mom and to have children I didn't know what to do with because I was shocked at his answers in public and I already felt so alone in my marriage that I was. I knew that I was going to need connection and support if I was going to be a parent and I didn't feel like this was a safe place to do that because I already felt alone and terrible. And how could I bring kids into this mess? And I actually wound up telling him I don't think we should be trying for kids anymore, because I didn't feel like I couldn't take that on in the heart position that I was in at the time. Um, I wanted to go to counseling together but he was not willing at the time and I really felt like we had been married only a couple of years and like my marriage is broken, it is a mess. This is not what I thought it was going to be like at all, um, and I just didn't know what to do. I was just like kind of shocked and stuck and lonely and sad and I would just like cry and I would just be like this was supposed to be the thing and this is not turning out to be anything like what I thought was going to be.
Speaker 2:Um, from a faith perspective at that time, like Taylor, um did not grow up going to church regularly. It just like wasn't like part of his upbringing, um, and so I was going to church by myself. But I was like praying and like God, like fix Taylor, of course it's right. Like what a sad prayer. Fix Taylor, fix my marriage, fix this. Like fix whatever's wrong with me that makes him not like me. Um, just like really feeling like it was just all broken, um. And then there was also this part of it where I didn't feel like I had the um. I didn't deserve to ask God to bless or to fix my marriage because we had had sex before marriage, we had lived together before we were married and so, like I hadn't done things God's way, so it was my fault that I was in this situation. And how dare I ask God to fix something that's my fault?
Speaker 1:Guilt, condemnation and shame.
Speaker 2:For sure guilt, condemnation and shame. I was ashamed of my action and choices because I had always wanted to be like the good Christian girl. So my perception of God at this time was like this big guy in the sky, you know, with his arms crossed and like furrowed brow, like he's definitely disappointed in me, but like he loves me because he has to, because I'm his kid, but not because he really wants to. Because, like I did these things, so like he's rightfully disappointed in who I am and how I turned out, and like Jesus is like the big brother trying to like take some heat from the dad, so like I got less of it, so like he kind of took some of the heat for me, but at the end of the day, like God was still like disappointed in me, um, and the holy spirit was just this like thing that lived inside me, but like I didn't know what to do with necessarily, um, so yeah, it was just like, uh, not, not in a good spot. Tough scene. Tough, not a good spot.
Speaker 1:So then, is there light at the end of this tunnel, or does it get worse?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it got a little darker before it got a little brighter.
Speaker 1:Okay, I want to take a real quick break from this episode. I want to read you something that I actually got today on Facebook, and this is from someone who's just recently kind of joined our community, said Not too long ago, I was a zealot, a preacher for the message that believers are still in slavery to sin. I was ignorant and didn't know what the real implications of what I was saying was until God showed up and corrected me. I was taught that wrong teaching by church leaders my whole life. But now my eyes are open. I no longer believe the lie that born-again Christians are slaves to the flesh and sin. Jesus set us free when he crucified our old selves on the cross. That's Romans 6.6. If the Son sets you free, you're free. Indeed, john 8.3.6.
Speaker 1:Thank God that he showed me Love Reality's ministry, because they're the only ministry that I know that's teaching this truth within my church man.
Speaker 1:I don't know if we're the only ministry teaching that truth, but I praise the Lord that this brother is seeing the truth of who he is in Christ, that he is free from and dead to sin in Jesus, and this is the privilege of what we get to do. We get to see this stuff happen every week. It happens on internet church, it happens in the Bible studies. Sometimes it happens because we put out a post on social media and so if you love this and you want the gospel to get out there, man, join with us, help us moving forward by donating to Love Reality, and you can do that at loverealityorg, and your partnership with us will ensure that we keep on producing these episodes, that we keep on doing Internet Church. We'll ensure that we keep on producing these episodes, that we keep on doing Internet Church and trying to tell the whole world that they're free from and dead to sin in Christ Jesus. So that's loverealityorg slash, give. Let's keep this thing going and let's get back to the episode.
Speaker 2:So it got darker before the light, in way, in what sense it did so. Um, by now, I have been working as a nurse for a couple of years in the hospital. Um, I had worked through covid, um, this was 2021. Um, I had worked through covid, which was just awful, um, as an inpatient nurse and um, I'd also started learning Spanish. Um, I wanted to, like better serve my Spanish speaking population of patients, and so I started learning medical Spanish. And um, we have a lot of um Spanish speaking employees and so, like, when they find out that, like I was trying to learn how to learn Spanish, like they'd be super excited and they like practice with me and like so I would um learn Spanish. Um, I can do a whole NIH stroke assessment in Spanish. That's my claim to fame. That's as far as my medical Spanish gets me, um, but anyway, like, so I really enjoyed speaking Spanish and learning Spanish.
Speaker 2:Um, and then, um, I was introduced to this nameless individual, um who spoke Spanish, um Spanish and English, but like Spanish, and we started chatting at work, like in Spanish, practicing Spanish and like becoming friends. Um, and then I'd also started working out because, um, I thought that if I looked better and was cuter. Then Taylor would like me more and so I wanted to be wanted by him and so I was working out. But I had no idea how to work out. Um, I was new to it and um, this person also worked out, and so we started working out like with a group of people. Um, and then more and more it just became the two of us working out together. And um, he like he was so affirming and flattering and um, this is not good.
Speaker 2:This is not good, we all know.
Speaker 2:Now we're all like oh no, girl no oh girl yes yeah, it was just like all fun, um and friends, um, and I hadn't. I knew that something had changed in my heart when he gave me a birthday card in april and I wanted to keep it and there was nothing like super special about like what it said. I mean it just said like have a birthday or whatever, like it wasn't even like a meaningful message, but I wanted to keep it because it was like this word, this affection, this affirmation, this affirmation and that scared me a lot and so I did throw it away and I was like whoa, whoa, whoa, hold up, um, but it's. It scared me, but that, like that little seed was there and like, slowly but surely, little by little, um, I made compromises in my heart and um, and in my actions and that led me to an affair with this person, um, and like nobody ever wakes up and decides that they're going to ruin their life, right, like it's always a gradual and insidious resignation of lines that you thought you would never cross, and it's a compromise here and a compromise there and a justification here and a little bit here and a little bit there, and like it's like stepping down a staircase and like you think that you're just stepping down a step and the other one is still there to step back up to. If, like, you're not good on the step but you're actually just stepping onto a grease slide. And, um, like it was just, yeah, it was terrible, it was all bad, but it was like this slow compromise and then this tipping point, and then it was just this slow compromise and then this tipping point, and then it was just this grease slide.
Speaker 2:So I wound up in an affair with this person, um, and it was an emotional one, so that is not any better than otherwise, like that doesn't make it any less sinny of sin than it was, you know, like it doesn't make it any better. But this really, um, wrecked my paradigm, because I'm like, oh, I have previously had to do physical things to gain emotional love from somebody, but you're giving me emotional quote unquote love without physical things. So that must mean you really actually love me, because I haven't done anything physically with you. So this must be where it's at, you know.
Speaker 2:And so, um, it was like just addicting and um, like just deeply intoxicating, like I would, like he would shower crazy affection and affirmation on me, like literally something that you could have taken out of like a movie or like a Hallmark movie or something Like. I remember there was a time like he was on his knees in front of me confessing his love for me, that he wanted to be with me forever, that I was his, he'd waited for me his whole life and blah, blah, blah and like all these things that like literally you could have. Like you couldn't have scripted any better if you had wanted to. Like the, the words of affirmation person in me is just like holy moly.
Speaker 1:Like this is everything that I've ever wanted to hear um, how long did it take from this to start to get to that point?
Speaker 2:um, the whole thing was about eight weeks. It was maybe eight weeks total.
Speaker 1:The whole shebang was oh wow I thought you were gonna say like eight months or something.
Speaker 2:No, no, no, like eight weeks was a whole, a whole shebang. So probably like four, maybe like halfway, probably, I would say it was like does that feel fast?
Speaker 1:That feels fast? Yes, it sure does.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Okay.
Speaker 2:Yeah, crazy, um, yeah.
Speaker 2:So it was this terrible like dichotomy, because with this person that I know is wrong, I know this is sin, absolutely, I know that this is not okay. He's like lavishing me with all the things that I would have thought that I wanted, and then I would come home to my husband and feel completely unwanted, rejected, pushed away, unliked, unwanted, and so I'm like trying to resist this thing that I know is wrong, but then coming home to I know is like supposed to be the right thing but that's not working out really great either, and so like that's part of why it was just like this grease slide, um, and like it was just so, so, uh, staggering to me, because we did not have sex and so all along I thought I had to get have sex to have love, but you're showering with me with quote unquote love without sex, but then the person that I am married to, that I am having sex with, is not doing that, is not loving me brain all the time. Because I knew it was wrong, I knew that it was sin, I knew that I was um, like in danger, like the things that I was doing. I was like this is there's no way, this is right, but it feels so right and, of course, feelings are everything and so, yeah, it was just like it was terrible and, um, I was just really torn apart emotionally because I'm going to say something and listeners are probably going to feel some kind of way about it, but during this time with this person, I still loved Taylor. I wanted all I wanted was the things that this person was saying and doing to come from Taylor. I was like this is what Taylor is supposed to be doing. This is the kind of love that I want to have from Taylor, and I still very much loved him.
Speaker 2:But I didn't know what to do with the relationship, with the marriage that I had with Taylor. That was like perceivingly falling apart and cold and silent and quiet and like just all brick walls. And then here's this person that I know is wrong and terrible and bad, but yet it fulfills this love cup that I think that I have. Um, and, yeah, I mean, I felt like like, with this affirmation that I've received from this person, like like the rush of, like an addict, it's like that dopamine rush, and it was so hard to resist that when I knew what I was coming home to, but knowing that it was wrong. Like you know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Like it was this terrible double-minded craziness, um, crazy craziness, um, and and also, at the same time, like looking to my culture and think about like name, like any rom-com, like, or any romantic movies, like the notebook, maid of honor, my best friend's wedding, runaway bride, the wedding singer, sweet home, alabamaanted, even like, if you're an office person, which I am, jim and Pam, all of these things are based on an emotional affair. This poor sweet girl is with this guy who doesn't really love her in the way that she needs or whatever, and then comes along this other guy who is the right guy. It was engaged, pam was to the guy that was working with. Yeah, he was engaged to roy, um, I mean, like the notebook is like the most classic stereotypical girl movie, romantic movie. She is engaged to that dude. What's his name? When she goes down back home to see what's his name like?
Speaker 1:well, it is ryan gosling right, it is ryan gosling.
Speaker 2:But like you know what I mean, like, yeah, that's kind of the message. Is the like you do you whatever you feels good to you, like that is kind of the message of our culture. And then I would like watch a movie or whatever, and then, like that's the reinforcing lie of our culture, is like, oh you, poor thing, you're just not with the right person, clearly, because you know, neither was, neither was pam poor. Pam was with roy, she should have been with Jim. You know what I mean. Like that's the culture and that's wrong and that's messed up, and that's a whole other thing. But, um, like in all these movies, like we root for them to get together, we root for the adultery and like so then I'm, like you know, like reconciling all these things at the same time, um, I'm glad that.
Speaker 1:Uh, in my best friend's wedding it doesn't work. I'm glad that, yeah me too. Yeah, yeah, me too sorry, keep going, but you root for them, don don't you?
Speaker 2:You're like oh.
Speaker 1:Well, she's terrible in that movie. She's the worst, if you remember. She tries to destroy that whole thing. It's awful, and I think she kind of shows herself in Cameron Diaz's characters. So oh the way she tortures her.
Speaker 2:Very sad Karaoke and all the things. So how did this thing?
Speaker 1:end like what happened let's, let's move on.
Speaker 2:Um so, um, during this time, god was no longer just disappointed with me, he was disgraced with me and he, like he. He used to be like standing arms folded. Now he is back turned, unattainable, unreachable, unapproachable, heavily disgraced with me, um, but I had always known the Lord. I had always known God, I had always had God as part of my life. And so for this eight weeks, I really felt like severed from my relationship with God, are we? No, that's how I felt was severed from God because the magnitude of my choices was greater than what he could forgive me for.
Speaker 2:So I remember, um, one day, um, this affair did cross the line physically. Um, we didn't like have sex or anything, but like it definitely like crossed the line physically and I Freaked out because I was like, um, I kind of like it was a moment of like wake up, of like, oh my gosh, like what's going on here. But I was also like so entrenched in that and then like so caught up in the limerence of the affair and of all the things. Um, but I felt like I couldn't even pray. Um, how dare I ask God for help in the mess that I created? So I remember driving on the highway and all I could send up to God was just this oh God, I didn't. I didn't even have words. I didn't know what words I was even allowed to pray or ask for, and I didn't even know what I wanted as an answer, you know. But all I had to give up was this just God. And I knew you spoke to me and he asked of me um, do you want to be healed? And it and it brought me to the story of John five one through eight, where the man is at the pool in Bethesda and he'd been lame for 38 years. And Jesus approaches him and says says, do you want to be healed? And we think, and we look at that and we're like jesus, like how redundant. Of course he would want to be healed, of course you would want this miracle. Um, how could he not? Right, but in my deepest heart of hearts, when he asked me this question, do you want to be healed?
Speaker 2:I could not answer him with a yes. I wasn't ready to let go of this limerence and this person that I had attached my fulfillment of affirmation and affection from. I literally felt like an addict. I was like I just need like one more. Hit like one more day to hang out. Like one more more hit like one more day to hang out. Like one more. Like I just need to. Like I feel like like an addict, like I was beyond the my own strength and power to say like no, this is enough, like enough is enough, like timeout, stop hard, stop. Like, when he asked me, I couldn't lie to God Like he already knew, so I, how could I lie? So I literally like I, just I couldn't lie to God Like he already knew, so I, how could I lie? So I literally like I, just I couldn't answer, I couldn't give an answer and I was completely disgusted and disgraced of myself, of my lack of answer and my lack of answer very much being an answer.
Speaker 2:Um, you know, my, my pastor, like, anytime God asks a question, it's not because he lacks the answer, it's us who need to realize the answer to the question. When we asked Adam in the garden, where are you? It's not because he didn't know, it's because Adam needed to realize his answer to the question For sure, um, and that's what he had done for me. Um, and at this point, um, it'd been about like eight weeks, seven, eight weeks or whatever. Um and Taylor had gotten suspicious. Um, he had asked me um, but I had like denied stuff. But he had gotten suspicious and truly, by the mercy and grace of God, taylor found out. Um, he found my messages.
Speaker 2:Um, it was first thing in the morning he had come to to the um to like say goodbye. He was leaving for work. And he like said goodbye and I just knew, I knew that he knew um, I was sick to my stomach. I was like, oh my gosh, like I knew that he knew and I followed him downstairs and he confronted me about it and like, how could I like it's like this is your messages. Like he, I couldn't deny anything, it was right there.
Speaker 2:Um, and I, like I saw the look in his eyes of just the insurmountable amount of pain and hurt and just devastation and anger that my betrayal had put upon him. And, um, I was standing there and honestly, I was incredulous. I was like, okay, well, do you want me to go to my mom's house? Or, you know, like, what do you want me to do? And he I will never forget, he said, no, you're going to stay here and we're going to figure this out. And I was shocked and floored because I fully believed Taylor did not want me, he did not want my marriage, he, if I just didn't come home one day, he wouldn't even notice or care. He'd probably prefer it that way. So that was like the lie that I had believed and I was completely astonished that, in the face and the reality of my betrayal, he said no, you're going to stay and we're going to figure this out. And that's what we did, um, and in that moment it was like the fog of the deception and the sin was like lifted from my eyes and like the magnitude of what I had done really like hit for me and like I called that person.
Speaker 2:I was like do not ever talk to me again, do not call me, do not text me, do not see me. Like lose my number, like do not, like we are completely again. Do not call me, do not text me, Do not see me, like lose my number, like do not, like we are completely done, period. End of story. Um, I blocked him and deleted him on like every platform, everything, and like that was that period at that I realized like Holy moly, what have I? What have I done here? Um and Taylor had a lot of questions for me, um, in betrayal, like typically, people either want all the information or they want, they don't want to know, like a lot of things.
Speaker 2:They just want to know, like what they need to know. But Taylor wanted to know everything. He had all the questions for me, um, and I made everything worse because I did this thing called trickle truth, where, like I tell the truth, like some truth, not all of the truth, but like it's technically true, um, and then later, when he goes to ask me more, actually turns out there's more truth to be told, and so really it like any ground that that person thinks that they like gained or built or whatever is like completely demolished over and over again because new truth comes to the surface or new stuff comes out. And so taylor was just devastated and like, by the way, like withholding truth is still lying. That's not being truthful, that's still lying, um. But I was just making it so much harder on him and um, I didn't have the courage to be completely honest with him because I thought if he knows everything, he's definitely going to leave me. He might've thought he wanted to fight for this, but there's no way, you know.
Speaker 2:And um, there was a really big truth that I hadn't told Taylor yet, and it was that things had um, progressed physically, like on that one day, like things had crossed the line um. Progressed physically, like on that one day, like things had crossed the line um, and like I felt so sick to my stomach all the time, like this lie, was just sitting there like acid and like to this point, taylor was not handling the information that I was giving him very well. He was not eating, drinking, sleeping, focusing like he was doing. He was completely heartbroken, and rightfully so, because I had violated the trust and the completely betrayed our marriage, right, so he was not doing well. But there was this huge, huge truth that I knew I needed to tell him, but I really didn't want to, and I remember being in the kitchen and just hearing, hearing from God and him telling me the truth will set you free. And I'm like well, not this truth, like this truth is going to get me homeless, like this truth is not going to set me free, like, and I just fought that I did not want to tell Taylor the truth, but I knew that I had to Um, and so I wound up telling him everything, telling him the truth, telling him the truth, um, and he was just beyond devastated.
Speaker 2:And, um, I was so disgraced and disgusted with myself. I was so deep in self hatred, um, over what I had done. Like it, really, I realized, like the magnitude of what I had done and the sin coming to. You know, like just to face the music of what I had done, and like I remember, like for weeks when I would brush my teeth, I would just stare at the bowl because I couldn't look up at the mirror and see myself, because I was so horrified and disgusted with myself that I couldn't even look at my reflection. Um, so I had perceived to this point that I was still somewhere in there, the nice Christian girl. Um, so how could I have done this? And like, my image of myself was destroyed. Um, and then also, um, to this point, um, one of my friends knew what was going on, and Taylor's uh, family knew about it.
Speaker 2:Um, and I was completely mortified in my pride that these people had known what I had done. Um, and even if, like, our marriage was going to survive, how would I ever hold my head high in front of these people again? Um, how could they not hate me for the rest of my life I was going to be, you know, like walking on eggshells, like just believing fully, like the guilt, condemnation and shame. Um, I felt like I would have to be like slinking around forever and ever, because that's all that I ever deserved to be. Um, and I just want to say, like, on behalf of my in-laws like they, like Taylor, told them I'm staying with Stephanie and we're figuring it out and through all of this, they were always loving, welcoming, supportive, kind, generous. You know, like I never felt like cold shouldered or snubbed, or like they, they chose to love me, even though what I had done. And so just like unbelievable shout out to my in-laws and to to them for it's I mean, it's truly remarkable, like I hurt their son to such a magnitude and they still chose to love me. Um, and so I just have so much appreciation for them.
Speaker 2:But, um, but anyways, I had all this pride in my self image and, um, I didn't want Taylor to to tell anybody else about this, um, so not only was he like being crushed under the weight of what I had done, I wanted him to keep it to himself. Deal with it yourself. Because and like privately, because my own pride and selfishness, didn't want anybody else to know. I was completely mortified, embarrassed, ashamed and like that weighed heavier than the grief and the struggle that he was going through. So, super unfair to Taylor, super um, pride based, wanting to salvage my reputation. Um, it was just, yeah, it was terrible, because he deserves space to share and for someone to come alongside him and support him and, like I was treating my reputation as more important than that. Um, so we wound up going to counseling I, we went individually and we went together Um, and then we got we sent to this program called a fair recovery, um, which was actually really, really fantastic.
Speaker 2:They were um, they taught us a lot of like technical tools and things and communication and all that good stuff. Um, the program itself was not officially, uh, christian, but like it was definitely like faith was integrated into it. Um, and one of the exercises they do there is called um the 40 costs. So, like the person who had been unfaithful has to write out like 40 costs, that the infidelity costs of the person. So, like my infidelity cost you your sleep because when you try it, when you close your eyes, all you can see is what I've done or whatever I mean. I could have written hundreds right Like, but like those kinds of practices and exercises were were geared to helping the hurt partner feel like the person who was unfaithful really grasped the magnitude of what they did and really got it.
Speaker 2:But it kind of made me feel branded as like once a cheater, for always always a cheater. This like marked as an adulterer, marked as a cheater. Um, I was branded by my sin and I was learning through my individual counseling that like I could be more than this, but like one day, you know, like for I had to. I felt like I had to live in despair and live in these things because, like, look at Taylor, like he is. So how dare I have a good day when he is having a horrible day? And it's because of me that he is. And so, like that's where I was operating from. Um, because he, he still was on the throne of my heart and I know that might like sound whack to some people like, well, how could it be because you did these things? But like he still was on the throne of my heart and he was on the throne of my heart and I know that might like sound whack to some people like, well, how could it be? Because you did these things? But like he still was on the throne of my heart and he was still the person that I loved and wanted his like, affirmation and affection from, and like you can sure bet that during this time there was none of that right. Like he was completely devastated and so I was. I was devastated because he was devastated and it was just like, oh, not good, not good, um. So.
Speaker 2:But one of the things that shifted for me was when I had my affair. I felt finally free to go to God. Um, I had confessed everything to Taylor. He now knew everything and I had repented before God and every day I just got on my face before the Lord, I was praying and reading and worshiping, and like I knew that I was forgiven, um, and I had, like this guarded hope for the future of my marriage. But I didn't have no idea what it was going to look like. I thought, hopefully it would survive, but like definitely it would never thrive again. Um, but because I wasn't receiving anything from Taylor for the first time, I really really turned to God to be the person to tell me who I was. Um, I dove into reading the Bible and listening to old messages from my church and like all of that.
Speaker 2:And at this time I became really good friends with floor, um. So if you guys don't know floor, uh, she's episode 51 and her husband, john, is episode 52. Um, but floor is the as a pharmacist. She's the world's best pharmacist. But I work with her at the hospital, I'm a charge nurse, and so a lot of times we would have like hours of the days that we were like in rounds together and we would just like get to chit, chatting or whatever and getting to know each other and becoming friends.
Speaker 2:And I remember her talking to somebody, like somebody else, like not even me, but telling them how, like her marriage had been so transformed that they'd gone through this hard time. So then, like when I was going through this, I'm like I need to talk to somebody who's on the other side of this and I didn't even know what had happened within their story. Um, I was just like I need help. Um. So Flora and I went to lunch and she um just like cut to the chase and she was very forthcoming and she was very honest and like I don't want to step on her story but if you'd like to, it's number 51. Um, but, like all I said, I was like super vague. I was like, yeah, we're having a hard time. And she was like, well, let me tell you something. And she like told her story. She whipped out her Bible and she's like no, no, let me tell you some things, let's go.
Speaker 2:And she was showing me verses like Romans eight one there's no condemnation for those who in Christ Jesus, second Corinthians five, 21,. That we were made to be the righteousness of God, ephesians 1, 3, and 7, that we were chosen in him, that we were called to be him, that we are righteous and all these things. And I'm like no way. Like no way. Like how? Like how could I be those things? Like I am the lowest of lows, I am the trashiest of trash.
Speaker 2:How could I possibly call myself righteous? Like maybe I'm forgiven, maybe, but like there's no way that I'm like righteous, like I was unworthy and unjustified of ever having the audacity to call myself righteous. Um, I just didn't feel like those verses applied to me. This was a juxtaposition of sin and the cross and actually it was quite prideful because it says that me and my stuff are bigger than the power of the cross. Um, it puts like myself as higher than the selfless act of the cross and what that really accomplished in me, and so, like it may feel like operating out of this like pretense of humility, but really it's a pride issue to say that what I've done is bigger than what Jesus could take care of and accomplish. Um, and it's like super, super self-righteousness over the righteousness of the cross. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Um, and, but like it, this conversation with floor and like our ongoing conversations, opened my eyes to the possibility that I could be righteous.
Speaker 2:Um, and she shared with me Tyler's story, more, uh, joyce's story, and I started listening to the podcast and like hearing from these people that were living and walking in freedom despite their past, and like it just blew me away and I like it just took like hearing and hearing, and hearing and hearing, so like I don't have like a specific death to life moment of like oh, this is where it changed. For me, it was more of like spending all this time in the word for myself and reading it for myself and praying and worshiping, and like daring to believe that these things could be true for me, and it was really the kindness of God to like break off these chains like one by one of like this is a lie, this is a lie. Like let me impose my truth on you instead, and it was just like kind of this gradual washing away of lie and replacement of truth. And so that was in December that I like started listening to.
Speaker 1:When you heard Joyce's episode, what like. How did that hit you?
Speaker 2:I love Joyce. I've never met joyce. I love joyce so much like she, like all of the episodes, especially like some of them just ministered to my heart in exactly the way that it needed to be. Um, and I just have such an appreciation for Tyler to be the first one, like he had no idea that, like there would be hundreds of episodes after him, like he was just like bearing it all and sharing the things and I was identifying with his things and I was like, oh, my goodness, this guy, like his confidence in his faith and his confidence in his righteousness, like I want to be that confident in, in, in the gospel, like it was just incredible. Like Joyce, oh my gosh, I love her. I've never met her. I hope to one day we'll have her. Oh, you're going to wonder.
Speaker 2:I love the meter, like she just yeah, like their messages just resonated so deeply with me. But then in January LRT comes to Castle Rock, colorado, yay. And I remember like I went along like with Floor and this guy named Jonathan Leonardo gets up and he's like I'm gonna ask everybody a question and I kind of like rolled my eyes internally. I'm like I have been around this Christian block for a minute. I'm sure I've heard the question that he's gonna ask. Right, I grew up in church. Like I'm sure I know what he's gonna ask, I'm sure I've heard this before.
Speaker 2:And then he asks this question what is your relationship to sin? And I was baffled. I had never heard this question before and I didn't know what to do with it, because I knew I was forgiven technically, but I didn't feel like I had the audacity to call myself righteous or redeemed. So, like my relationship, what is it like? What's the status of my relationship with sin? Like it's complicated, like I didn't have a very good answer. Um, I was owning the guilt, condemnation and shame for what I had done. Um, and I didn't have a very I didn't have a good answer for sure how long after this had all finished was uh castle rock?
Speaker 2:um. So my affair was um, um. I started in like, uh, like May 2021, it was like eight weeks, and then all of those things I got hooked up with the podcast in December and then it was January 2022 that I this question rocked me. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1:So did you buy his? Uh, did you start looking at roman six a little bit?
Speaker 2:I did I very much for my whole life, thought that I was the roman seven man and I had no idea that I was no longer the roman seven man, that I actually no longer live in the flesh but I live in spirit.
Speaker 2:And like these things were in this bible that I have read my whole life, like it's been there the whole time and like where were my ears all along, you know? And then like listening to messages from like years and years and years ago of my church, as I'm like diving into, like all things, gospel, all the time the message was being broadcasted from my church, like when I read, listen to the messages of the past of my church. They were speaking freedom, they were sharing all these things, but my ears just never heard, it, never received it, never picked it up. I don't know why that is, but, um, I had no idea that I was actually living in Romans eight, that I was free from sin, that I was blessed in righteous through Christ Jesus, that I was a woman of faith and that I could be that despite the things that I had done.
Speaker 3:faith and that I could be that despite the things that I had done.
Speaker 2:Hmm, yeah, um, and so the the byproduct of this realization is that I found my soulmate, and my soulmate and my completeness and my fulfillment is not found in my sweet, wonderful, amazing husband. It was found in christ, and I never knew that all along. It was found in him, it was found in god and I? Um. This really shifted my gear to operate in freedom. Um, taylor had been rightfully removed from the throne of my heart and Jesus was back in the position that he should have always been.
Speaker 2:Um, and this changed things for Taylor too, because I was no longer pulling and pulling and pulling on him. Love me, I was no longer pulling and pulling and pulling on him. Love me, love me, love me, fulfill me, fulfill me, fulfill me. I just got to love him. I was so thoroughly, completely and unconditionally loved and I overflowed with so much love that I now get to love my spouse out of overflow and abundance. I don't need anything from Taylor. Yeah, I love Taylor, I love my husband, I love my marriage, I love when we are loving to each other, but I don't need that to live and survive Like I overflow and I abound with this pure, beautiful love of God, and I get to give that to Taylor, to my patients, in the relationships that I have, to my friendships, whatever, like I just do. It is a byproduct of being so loved, so perfectly loved, by God that it is a natural overflow to love other people in that way too. So this changed everything for our marriage. It changed everything, yeah, I mean it was just revolutionary.
Speaker 1:Did Taylor come to any of the meetings?
Speaker 2:He did come to one.
Speaker 1:I think I remember seeing him.
Speaker 2:He did come to one Um or one or two maybe. Yeah, he came.
Speaker 1:And you were just just eating it up.
Speaker 2:Yeah, a hundred percent. Like I was like all gospel all the time. Um, because I now, like now, was like Colossians 2.10. Um, because I now, like now, was like Colossians 2 10, like you, have been made complete or full in Christ, and so I wasn't searching for the like for the things of this world that have no value. You know, like my value, my worth, my identity, who I am, was so firmly rooted and planted on the rock of truth and the word of God that, like I, was just so good, like so good, and like it reshaped my identity. It reshaped my paradigm of how I operate in my marriage, in relationships, how I view physical intimacy, how I view emotional intimacy and connection. Um, I have been restored to my original intent, which is child of God, fully loved, daughter of the King, and, like my father in heaven is not turned from me. He's not arms crossed, glaring at me. He is and always was arms open. I'm right here. I have better for you. I love you.
Speaker 2:This was a lie, like he, that was always the case, but I had traded. I had long ago traded truth for a lie and was living in this place and just like the devastation that it caused in my relationships, and especially with my, with my relationship with Taylor, like the power, like a lie is only as powerful is as the truth that we assigned to it. And by believing it I empowered that thing to just grow and grow and grow. And I had no idea that it was even there Like floor, when we were at lunch. She was like um, stephanie, you have put Taylor on the throne of your heart. And I was like what? No, you're crazy. No, of course I haven't. Like I literally didn't even know. So, like I can say all these things and know them and understand them because, like, the kindness of my father above has revealed them to me now, but back then I had no idea that that was the framework that I was operating in, I had no idea that that was my paradigm. So now I walk in freedom, I hold my head high, I was starting to get to know this new life of freedom and what that meant for me, but I always felt like I was still Um, but I always felt like I was still like branded and like I was walking out this thing with joy. But it took time for me to really let that go, um, and it was just something that like took time for me. So I don't have like a specific moment to be like this is it? It was just like a gradual process, um.
Speaker 2:So all that was great and fantastic but, um, there are natural consequences for sin. So, just like, if I had, if I were to rob a bank and I then met, you know, found salvation in Jesus, that's great, but I still like there's still natural consequences for robbing a bank, right, yeah. And so one of the natural consequences that came for me was actually, before we got married, I was supposed to sign a prenup and I really felt uncomfortable and icky with that. I didn't like the idea of entering marriage while preparing for a divorce. That was really just like I was not, I was really uncomfortable with that. Um, so I basically just like stalled and never did it and just kind of like stalled my way through, um. And then we got married and it just kind of like wasn't brought up again and I was like, okay, cool, cool, and I thought I had like gotten away with it, uh like not having to sign it.
Speaker 2:Um, but after this affair, after everything that happened um, it was brought to my attention happened, um, it was brought to my attention that now I needed to sign a post-snap agreement. Um, and this kind of threw me for a loop. Um, because here I am, walking in freedom, I am my new self, old Stephanie is gone and done and like, of course I would never do those things again. Because look at the freedom that I now live in and like living in this joy and abundance and this goodness and this greatness. But like, you're saying to me that like I'm still untrustworthy and um, it took me a long time to come to terms with this was a natural consequence of my actions, but it made me feel like I'm still the once cheater, always a cheater. Like I'm obsessed already.
Speaker 2:Um, and so as we and I like stalled, I like kind of like fought it, I didn't want to do it for a really long time. Um, and so as we and I like stalled, I like kind of like fought it, I didn't want to do it for a really long time, um, and it was just kind of like this thing in the background, but in the forefront, in the foreground, we were very much living in new marriage. Um, I can't speak for Taylor's part, cause that's his part, but like for me, like everything was completely different. Um, I no longer viewed myself as this broken vessel and like needing, needing for me, like everything was completely different. Um, I no longer viewed myself as this broken vessel and like needing, needing, needing a me, me, me, um, I was living in, in um freedom and abundance, and like assurance of righteousness and like completely in love with Jesus, completely in love with him, and like, for example, like every holiday, I would always ask prior to this, I would always ask Taylor, what do you want for your birthday, what do you want for Christmas?
Speaker 2:I always wanted a letter from him because this was my chance to hear words of affirmation, and so every holiday, I wanted a letter and Taylor's like I'm literally out of things to tell you lady. Like, like he had in, like, after this, I don't ask for that anymore. Like I don't need a letter from you. Like your loving card is still very sweet and I appreciate it, that's nice, but like I don't need that from you anymore. Like I'm operating in this completely different, in a completely different way and in freedom. Um, and so we um like years go on about like my freedom and operating in that. I was living in this new way. My relationship with God was vibrant and alive and it was beautiful, um, and I wanted, we wanted children. We always had.
Speaker 2:And I was like God, like praying, like every month um, I had, I was praying like God let this be the month let's be, let's let's be the month. Um, I had taken Taylor off the throne of my heart and I put Jesus there, um, but in the sovereignty of God, he knew that my faith was not mature enough to take on this thing of motherhood in freedom. And so every month I would pray you know, I'd be praying that I would get pregnant. And then God would ask me if this never happens for you, am I still enough? And every month I'd be like, yeah, of course, but like really, truly like I wasn't there yet. I wasn't ready for God to really really be my everything, to lay down my desires, my hopes, dreams, plans, whatever. I really wasn't ready to say yes. And so every month he would ask me. I would give this really like unconvicted answer, um, and then I would not be pregnant. And then the next month. And so, finally, the month came and he didn't even have to ask me. And he didn't even have to ask me, I was already at the place where I said, lord, if this never happens, for me, you are more than enough. And for the first time, I finally felt that and for the first time, I was finally truthful in that and that was actually true and real for me. For the first time, um, and I had come to that place of total surrender and firmly, permanently placing and keeping God on the throne of my heart, instead of so quickly substituting that for motherhood and for this thing that I wanted Um. And it was that month wanted Um. And it was that month that I said, okay, god, you are more than enough. That was the month that I got pregnant, um, and it was right before Easter that I found out, and so I was already like wild in for Easter and the resurrection and what Christ had done for me and this beautiful holiday that we get to celebrate the resurrection of Christ and the cross and all of these things. And on top of that, now I'm pregnant and I was just overjoyed, overjoyed, and um, um, god actually told me my like, what my son's name would be. So we were. We have been.
Speaker 2:I had been praying about what to name this child Um, because I really firmly believed and understood that this child is not just my kid. First and foremost, this child is your child that you are entrusting me with. But this child already has a name and a calling and a purpose and he is known by you from the foundations of the earth. Like, who is this child? God? And so, um, the Lord spoke to me and said so. The Lord spoke to me and said his name will be Samuel, because I, the Lord, have heard your prayer and I looked up then what Samuel means, and Samuel means the Lord has heard, like beautiful moment of, not only like does God love and see and know and hear me, but like my child will always walk with that name and the knowledge and the understanding that he is completely known, heard, seen and loved by God as well. Um, it was just, it was so beautiful by God as well. Um, it was just, it was so beautiful. And, um, he was due on Christmas day, and so it was just like sandwiched between like the best day ever, which is Easter, and the best day ever, which is Christ's birth. Um, and it was just, it was so cool and it was just like the most beautiful thing.
Speaker 2:Um, and then, when our second son came along, um, he was due on our anniversary and it was such a cool um, like testament to this marriage that I once thought was lost and broken and irreconcilable to. Here we are today. You know, I live and I walk and I operate in freedom, I parent in freedom and, like, this child is due on our anniversary, which used to be like this awkward 10th day, and now it was. It was so beautiful and you know, I again prayed. You know, lord, who is this child? Who have you called him to be? And God gave me the name Caleb. He will be my faithful servant, and so Caleb, meaning faithful, due on our anniversary. This day that once was lost, now is just like. I'm just like blown away. I'm like God, you are like out there playing chess, like unbelievable, like so crazy cool, like so, so cool. I love it so much, um, but then, like this post-nap comes up again.
Speaker 2:Okay, so it's identifying me as untrustworthy of the things that, where you know thieves can break in and steal and moth and rust may destroy. But God ministered to my heart and showed me like this piece of paper that's going to sit in the deep, dark desk, never to be opened or used, doesn't define who you are Like you are not the sum of your behaviors, you are not the sum of your actions. You are who I say you are and I call you trustworthy. I have entrusted you with my two most priceless treasures, and they are called Samuel and Caleb. And so, yeah, and they are called Samuel and Caleb, and so, yeah, like, this piece of paper is a thing and I don't like it, but it pales in comparison to the identity and the truth and the freedom and the joy that it is to love my children unconditionally, to love my husband unconditionally, and even now, like I parent them so differently than had I not gone through that experience because before, like I had some more archaeology, I had some stuff.
Speaker 2:Now, like I don't give my children, like, just words of affirmation, not just like, oh, you're the greatest, you're the best. They are indeed the greatest and they are indeed the best, of course, but I also speak life over them in a language, in a way that I never knew before, and so when I'm telling my son, yeah, like, please don't, you know, like, throw the tennis ball at the TV or whatever, like you know, like I love you, period, unconditionally. Like you are not your actions, you are who God says that you are. You are not good because of what you do. You are good because you were made in the image of God and he looks at you and he calls you good and he calls you loved and he calls you beloved.
Speaker 2:And like just this, like joy that it is to share the gospel and the truth of who they are, out of the foundational understanding of who I am, and parenting and freedom has been such a joy. I mean, you know he's now a toddler, like toddlers are toddlers and like you know it comes with all the things right. But it's just this overflow that I have the privilege of sharing and like I don't have to, unlike the super toddler days, I don't have to pray and ask God, please give me more patience for this kid who's acting a fool. I get to say thank you, God, that I am patient because you are patient and it is no longer I who live but Christ who lives in me and because your Holy Spirit lives and abounds and overflows.
Speaker 2:I am patient with this kid. How can I best minister to this child lord? What does your kid need right now? How can I glorify you in how I handle this situation? And I have you know like I have positioned myself in this like submissive partnership to god, to come alongside these children in a way that I would have never known to do had all of this stuff not happened. You know, it's really like changed everything and, like you know, floor and john, like they're still fantastic, wonderful people of our lives. They are actually the boys godparents, um, but like having a community like the one I have at my church and the one with floor, and like people within lrt like to remind me on the days that I forget truth um has just been invaluable.
Speaker 2:Like jayla oh my goodness, love her to pieces, um floor, of course I love to pieces, but like, and I remember a day that floor told me, like one day you're going to look back and like, count this as a blessing. And in the middle of the like, twister, tornado, hurricane, storm, perilous, everything, I was like that may not be true. I'm not convinced, you know. Like, oh, I'm not confident in that. And like, don't get me wrong. Like I very much understand and take responsibility and accountability for the sins that I commit and the devastation that it caused to Taylor and to so many other people committed and the devastation that it caused to Taylor and to so many other people.
Speaker 2:But that doesn't take away from the freedom that I now get to live in and walk in and operate in. And, like, I have godly sorrow for what I did, I have remorse for the pain and suffering that I inflicted on my husband. I have righteous conviction over the things that I did was wrong. But I don't like guilt, condemnation and shame rule over me anymore.
Speaker 2:Like I used to feel, like this story was like I would just be mortified to death if somebody found out about what I did and blah, blah, blah. And now, like with the sermon of the Holy spirit, like I share it, like left and right, like I literally was at the hairdressers a while back, sharing my story with my sweet little 21 year old hairdresser with foils in my hair, looking like an actual alien, with like all these foils in my hair, telling her about like the worst decision of my life and what the gospel has done for me, and I like catch a glimpse of myself in the mirror. I'm like you're a literal lunatic, oh my gosh. But like I just boldly share this gospel because it changed everything for me and like I wish that it hadn't taken what it took to get to this place. This just happens to be my story and how I got to where I am, but like I'm not giving it up for anything. Man.
Speaker 1:So usually I try to decide where we're going to go and ask the question.
Speaker 1:And I think there's this moment, and it was before all of this If you get to go and talk to Steph, who just got this phone call or this text message I forgot what it was Phone all these guys that said that they thought you know what we believe about ourselves, it ends up manifesting so many ways this needy girl who just wanted to love, looking for love in all the wrong places. If you could put your arm around this girl and and speak some life to her, what would you, what would you say to her in that moment?
Speaker 2:Um, I would just tell her do not trade truth for a lie.
Speaker 2:You, like your identity and your worth and your value and who you are is not defined by anyone other than the creator who made you. So don't give away the priceless name that you have been given for someone who doesn't understand it for themselves. And like you don't need, you don't need a soulmate or a person to be your other half, to be this perfect person for you, like lavish, unconditional, supernatural, unbelievable love was shown for you on the cross, when christ knew you, saw you, still loved and chose you. And so you might feel special when this guy or this guy or you feel chosen over some other girl. But that is like that pales in comparison to being seen and chosen by my heavenly father, by my savior. Like you don't need a person to complete you, like you are already complete in christ jesus. And now, like I have and like, and not to say like, oh no, I'm perfect, perfect, everything in marriage is perfect, perfect. And like lies don't still come, because of course they do, sure, but now, like I have so fully seen, heard, learned, understood, tasted, seen and received the truth that now, when a counterfeit comes by, I can easily identify it as such. And like I take every thought captive and hold it up to the truth, and so I can easily identify lies and counterfeit. Um and like I live in Galatians 5, 1, which is it was for freedom that Christ has set you free. Therefore, stand for, stand firm and do not put back on the yoke of slavery, because there has been times where the lies come back in or patterns of old ways and former ignorance come up and I don't have to like fall by the wayside and like, oh, it's all lost and I need to be saved all over again. No, I get to just say Nope, that's not, that's not what it is, we're not doing that anymore. Like that was an old way, but that's not the way that is anymore, and like thank you, god, that I now know truth, I now know freedom, I am now so fully and completely loved that I get to love in this way, and like my whole story is summed up in first Peter, two nine. But you are a chosen people, a Royal priesthood, a Holy nation, god's special possession that you may declare the praises of him who called you out of darkness into his wonderful life, and that's what it is Like. That's it, that is it. That is my whole story and, like every single day, like, thanks be to God, this is not so. All this, all this happened in 2021.
Speaker 2:Okay, so it's been a minute. This is not some spiritual high, some mountaintop, some summer camp, youth group experience. This is coming into new life, freedom and truth. This is permanent. This is fire everlasting. And every day, I am still wilding for the gospel. Every day I am still wilding for the gospel, like I remember in um.
Speaker 2:I remember it was a podcast, but they were like Tyler was just like crazy about it. He'd be like, yeah, this pizza is good, you know what else is good? Like God is good and like that's literally me. I'm like always. I'm like I'm about it Just because when you have been so fully loved and you have tasted and seen for yourself, there's like you just can't. You can't help but overflow with it. Like it's just who I am. It's not something that I've been through, it's now who I am Loved, cherished, redeemed, righteous, reconciled, transformed, made new, daughter of the king, priceless treasure. Like that's who I am, period. And I never needed to get anything even close to that from a person or a dude. I get to hear that from my heavenly father and like what could be better than this?
Speaker 1:Stephanie, thank you so much for sharing. You were right, this was a. We were just on a roller coaster, but thank you for sharing your heart and being vulnerable and I know this is going to be a blessing to so many people.
Speaker 2:So thank you so much. Yeah, my pleasure. Thank you for having me, absolutely. Thank you.