#89 - Should Your Coach Actually Be In Shape?

You can tell a lot about the fitness industry by one question: should coaches be in shape? The obvious answer feels like “yes”, but once we start pulling at the thread, it turns into a full audit of trust, proof, and what you are actually buying when you hire a personal trainer or sign up to online coaching.

We talk through what “in shape” even means in the real world, because fat loss, muscle gain, strength, and endurance all look different. We also get honest about the limits of visuals. A coach can look incredible and still lack fundamentals, while a coach who looks more average may have far deeper knowledge and better systems. We bring in the Mourinho comparison, the hype around pro cards, and why status often gets mistaken for skill. If you have ever hired someone based on a physique or a feed, this chat will sharpen your filter fast.

From there, we dig into the social media problem: photo shoots recycled for months, “lean year-round” branding, and how easy it is to look like an expert without actually doing expert work. We also talk about the pressure on coaches to stay camera-ready, the health cost of extremes, and why sustainable results and honest behaviour change should be the standard, not the exception.

If you want better fat loss coaching, smarter muscle building advice, and fewer gimmicks, press play. Subscribe, share this with a mate who is coach-shopping, and leave a review telling us what you think: should being in shape be a requirement, or just a bonus?

Got questions? simply email or dm us with those questions

Larry IG https://www.instagram.com/larry_doyle_coaching
Daniel IG https://www.instagram.com/danieldalycoaching
Website https://www.larrydoylecoaching.ie
Coaching with us https://www.larrydoylecoaching.ie/1-1-premium/
Email : info@larrydoylecoaching.ie

Transcript

Welcome And The Big Question

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hey guys, you're listening to the Gen Pop Podcast with me, your host, Larry Doyle. Each week, I'm gonna bring in friends, guests, and experts to help enhance your health, fitness, and wellness journeys. Sit back, relax, and enjoy the conversations. You are welcome back to another episode of the Gem Pop Podcast. This week, co-host Daniel and I, we're diving into another hot take. Daniel, should coaches be in shape? Let's dive into this one.

SPEAKER_00 0:32

Yeah, personally, I think everyone should be like just completely jacked, walk around, shredded 24-7, um, trimmed up to their eyeballs. But I think it is one of these things that like, would you really pay someone who's not in shape to get you into shape? And like I guess it all is gonna come down to like what's your definition of definition of in shape?

Defining What “In Shape” Means

SPEAKER_00 0:55

Because like that, you could have someone that is like you know, 120 kilos, lean, jacked, and then you could have someone else who's like 65 kilos, but they also are lean. So it's like, what's your definite definition of in shape? Um, and then you could also go down the rabbit hole of like saying, like, well, the guy that's 65 kilos is actually a lot more knowledgeable than the guy who's 125 kilos. It's like, where's the actual worth there? Should you go for the person who looks like that they actually know what they're doing, or the person who doesn't necessarily look like what they know what they're doing, but they know a lot more. So I think at a minimum, I think a coach should at least have demonstrated that they can, you know, say what they're gonna do with you to themselves, like if they were a person that you know was overweight in the past and has lost a ton of weight, um, or if they're a person that was, you'll say, on like the smaller side that they have shown that they actually can build a muscle, if they can actually just back up what they're claiming that they can help you with, then I think that's at the very least. Um, now that's not saying that they need to walk around lean all the time, but I think you need to be like in a position where like you are you don't have to be like 100% in shape, but like you should definitely be like five or so kilos off of it being like looking very, very good. You should be like tipping distance away from something. Like I think lifestyle lean, I think is the way I call it.

SPEAKER_01 2:15

But if if you're constantly yo-yoing up and down and it's like I'm gonna lose 20 kilos again, it's like, well, you're not really demonstrating competency in you know long-term sustainable approaches, but it's again come back to your values. What are you preaching? What are you actually doing with people? You know, if you're vastly out of shape and you're teaching people fat loss, well, if you're coaching people fat loss, right? One I think I think that's the bigger one. Like building muscle is a little bit harder, it can be more genetically thing. Like being fat isn't really genetically like some people have bigger genetic dispositions to being fat, but you also don't have a genetic disposition to losing fat. Everyone can lose body fat, where people may not have the same genetic structure as someone who is born. I'm not gonna get into any racist comments with it, but it's like, you know, some people have better genetic dispositions to grow more muscle tissue, and it's like then there's like white people who don't have the same genetic disposition to grow more muscle tissue. But it's like you look at the top lineups of all the bodybuilding tools, but like not even coming back to bodybuilding, but it's like um if you're talking about fat loss, you should probably be lean, you should probably not be fat. If you're talking about muscle building, you should probably have some muscle there. You don't have to be jacked, you don't have to be shredded. If you're talking about marathon running, you should probably fucking run marathons as well, too, right?

Competence Beats Status And Genetics

SPEAKER_01 3:30

Um, but even the the analogy used to be thrown back to me is like, look at Jose Mourinho, he's like one of the best football coaches ever. He was a shit footballer. It's like, but he's demonstrated competency in his task of being very knowledgeable, very insightful, very understanding of the game and the people he deals with who he coaches to play the game, right? So he's got competency, he's got an understanding at a very deep level and shown the ability to continue in that path and train people and coach people to a very high level. So, therefore, do you need to be, you know, Premier League footballer? Do you need to be absolutely jacked and shredded out of your mind to teach people that? No. It's like we'll see this all the time. People who get their IFBB pro cards, and now all of a sudden they've got a wait list out the fucking door. They didn't know anything more from the day that they've got their pro card other than now they've got validation by getting a pro card. Chances are a lot of those people are actually just genetically disposed to building more muscle tissue or maybe getting a little bit leaner or genetically have a better structure than other people because they are ultimately in the genetic elite. Yes, they work very hard. I'm not taking that away. I competed in bodybuilding for years, and it's not sour grapes because I was a ship bodybuilder, it's just the reality of my genetic and physique as well, too. But they are the genetically, those who have the disposition to be able to put themselves in a position to get a pro card, and they've been like coached to a very high level. The majority of them, there's not too many self-coached uh IFBB pros out there as well, too, right? So it's like they're just taking mostly what they've had from their coach and passing it on to others and diluting it down along the way as well, too. But now, because they've got the status of that or shown that they've done the thing, doesn't necessarily make them more knowledgeable as well, too. So this is like something you need to take with a pinch of salt. Yes, people who are talking about hypertrophy should have built muscle. You know, you might look at me now, and a lot of people are like, oh yeah, you're into the muscle building thing. It's like probably look like I have more muscle than most, but I'm like down 30 kilos from when I used to have a lot more muscle. I know des rate that people used to take a lot more uh insight or ask me a lot more questions if I was in gyms when I was way bigger. I know way more now at a smaller, skinnier version of myself than when I was much, much bigger, much stronger, like fucking high level strength, high level muscle tissue, grant, but I'm way more knowledgeable now. But people would probably have hired me earlier based purely off the visuals of what I was doing, what I look like compared to now. So again, it's with a pinch of salt that there's a lot more experience that some people are going to be after clocking up as well, too, over the years of doing it. And it's a very interesting topic. But if you're fat and you're coaching people, fat loss should probably sort your shit out, and you should probably be cautious to that if you see a coach who is doing another fat loss challenge themselves all the time and are continually oying up and down, and it's not like a structured gaining bulk and lean kind of phase with that, right? To um, we'll see this

Social Media Physiques And The Reality

SPEAKER_01 6:26

a lot. What do you see? Like, where do you find the line, Daniel, with this stuff? Like, what what where is enough with it when it comes to like what we'll see on social particularly?

SPEAKER_00 6:39

Um it's kind of hard to know where the line is because you will see coaches like and I know a lot personally as well, that they're doing the thing, like they're going, they're training like five days a week, six days a week, they're showing up and stuff, but like they're still not in shape, or then you will have the other side of it where again, because you know these people personally that like they're training five or six days a week, but because they're training five or six days a week and their output is so high, their eating habits or whatever are absolutely horrendous, but they're just getting by, they're just getting by because of actually what they're doing day to day, and people are lucky at that saying, like, I need to listen to these people, but it's like they're of they're not behind closed doors actually following through what they could recommend to other people, then you will have other people like it's that they might have like for females specifically, they might have like favorable fat distribution where like they hold more fat around their glutes or whatever, around their thighs, um they have a smaller waist, just fat exactly, and it's like they're just lucky to a degree, and you look at that and say, like, well, they know exactly how to grow glutes, that's what I'm looking to achieve. So I need to listen to this person, but they don't already know what they're talking uh or talking about. So I think I'm kind of like torn between two. It's like you kind of need to know, or you need to look like you know what to talk about, but you also need to like act in the same way as well, because I think the visuals is one element of it, but then like your action and your behaviors is another component of it as well. Because again, in this day and age, people are like paying online coaching, they've never actually met that person in person, like they're just seeing what they see on social media, and what you're seeing on social media is chosen by the person for you to actually see it. It's like I'm showing you the best pictures of me, I'm showing you only what I want you to see. Whereas behind closed doors, they could be a completely different person. Yeah, so that's why like you will see, and I remember you saying it to me before when I done the photo shoots that like, and I was talking to my girlfriend about this lately that like I done the photo shoot, get the pictures, and I put out 10 pictures of whatever the quest is, and that's it.

SPEAKER_01 8:45

In a one-never again will I post pictures, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:48

But some people will spread that out over six months, nine months, a year, and you will see people posting pictures of themselves like topless in fucking Spain in like a November. But like, I know you're not in fucking Spain, you're like in down the back arse of nowhere and some some place in southern Ireland or something, but it's like again, it's putting out that visual of like I'm lean year-round, I'm in shape year-round, I know what I'm talking about, or whatever. But you CRC do not know what's going behind closed doors. So I think you always have to be cautious, you always have to kind of like read um into things a bit more, ask questions, do your research and stuff. Um, but I think like in the coaching side of things, you just have to be fucking honest. Like, I think it is I think it's very I don't even know what word to use about like if you're putting yourself out there as a coach, you're preaching fat loss, you're trying to educate people about fat loss, you're trying to gain people's um business, but then like you're not doing it yourself. It's like it's you're you're just creating this false illusion about what you actually can do or how you can help people. So I think you need to be honest, number one, as a coach.

Cowboys, Scripts, And Fake Expertise

SPEAKER_01 9:57

Well, see, there's I could yeah, my my my thing, or like whenever I leave the fitness industry, I'm gonna do a fucking expose on like all the coaches I've coached who haven't a fucking notion what they're doing. I've coached people who have nutritional businesses that don't know what a fucking carbohydrate is or what certain proteins are. It's like I've had people who are coaches and they don't know how to perform certain exercises. I've had people who are yeah, they just purely visual based or based off a name or whatever it might be or some notoriety throughout the industry, and they're selling coaching packages, they're like profiting off people through visuals only without having any baseline fundamental knowledge or understanding of humans or physiology or anything when it comes to and this is not me with sour grapes again, I'm just the reality of it. I've coached a lot of people who are very well known within certain spaces, and they're like the whole thing, like the it just doesn't match up from what they know versus what they display. And particularly now you'll see a lot of this, like it's really easy for me to get an informative post and I put in like two prompts on ChatGPT and it can make me look like super knowledgeable. And I'll just read a script off that as well, too. So, again, like you have to be able to read between the lines. Like, I guess for people listening to this, is like you're not as dumb as what you may think you are when it comes to like health and fitness, and you are very smart and intelligent in your own rights and in every other aspect of it. You may not know everything about the fitness industry, but you should be able to spot bullshit a mile away. And if it doesn't make sense, if it doesn't match up, it should probably like perk your ears up a little bit more where you're like, Yeah, my bullshit radar is like flagging something here. I'm just gonna look a little bit deeper, as opposed to they've got a really good arse and they're selling an arse program, so I need to get an arse like theirs, I'm gonna pay the money for an arse program. And like that's again, you need to like look a little bit deeper, just be a little bit more cautious about it and be like skeptical about everything. The fitness industry has taught me to be skeptical about every other industry possible because I don't fucking trust anyone who's even putting a tire on my car because there's so many cowboys and charlatans and bullshitters in the fitness industry that I'm like skeptical about everyone. But anyway, that's my own issues. Maybe I need to work around. But just from seeing like so much over the years and been having so much exposure to it, um, you really need to be cautious, like when you're looking at this kind of stuff. Again, coming back to like, do people need to be in shape? Yes, I think people should be after demonstrating that they can get themselves in shape, but you might have just accidentally got yourself in shape. Have you demonstrated with many other people just like you and just like the people you were also selling it to? You know, that's obviously something else to factor in as well, too, right? When you're looking at this, so it's like social proof, self-proof, big factors when it comes to should people be in shape? They should be able to do the job that they're talking about. Uh ultimately, you wouldn't go to a plumber who's got leaky taps in their house, right? So, again, I factor that in when it comes to people in the fitness industry. Um, any closing notes on this one, Daniel, before I go off on too many rants and end up with a lawsuit.

SPEAKER_00 12:54

I

Honesty, Pressure, And Health Costs

SPEAKER_00 12:55

know it's we it's one of these topics that it's very hard to kind of say, like as we've been talking about, like coaches should be in shape, but then like being in shape doesn't just prove you know exactly what to talk about because, like, again, everyone's gonna have a different definition of in shape because like say I'm always amazed, and again, this is where people might get a bit fucking butthurt again, so we might have to start editing this podcast afterwards. I'm always amazed that like people I'm always amazed that like say people that are like running coaches or something like this, but like they're out of shape themselves as well. I said, But look, you could be a lot more efficient at running if you actually lost 10 kilos. Or there's people like that that are and like again, they could be coaches on fucking emotional eating or eating behaviors or whatever it is, and then you get clients that worked with them in the past. It's like, yeah, we actually I was actually on a thousand calories when I was working with this coach, like I lost my period and all this kind of stuff. It's like hold on for me, just seeing them on social media, I would have assumed that like they were like this kind of like holistic approach and like very kind of gentle approach, and it was all about intuitive eating when all they were doing is like give you them an eating disorder and fucking ruining their physiology. So it's like yeah, it's very hard to kind of say, like, should a coach be in shape? It's like yes, but then also coaches shouldn't be fucking people up at the same time, they should actually be leading from the front and kind of like being someone that people should look to look up to and not setting these high standards that like nobody can achieve. So, like, that's why like sometimes it actually is good to kind of get insights into honest coaches who are kind of saying, like, look, I'm fucking struggling, or this and that. And I actually saw that lately with um a coach that they put up something that they kind of succumbed to the pressures of social media, and they were like, It's just fucking too much, like what we have to kind of what he had to do, like because he kind of said he had to live up to this expectation of like being this person online that he just isn't because he got a following and whatnot. Um, so I think it's actually better when clients are sorry, when coaches are just that bit more honest and saying, like, look, it's not all fucking sunshine and rainbows, like we're human too, like we struggle. There's days where like I overeat, there's days where I don't go to the gym, there's times when I fucking hate the gym, when I don't hit my stems, whatever. But like when it is this kind of like hustle culture of like every day I'm doing the thing, is like you're not, you're not like unless like it is your job, like a bodybuilder where it's like you're just living full-time for that, you're not doing it every single day. That's cautious.

SPEAKER_01 15:22

I'm very aware that I could go back on a big cycle of gear, even a moderate cycle of gear, get in like shape, put on 10 kilos, walk around with like my top off, jacked and shredded with the kids on my shoulder and settle like some fucking dad bod program. It's like, but I'm not gonna put my health at that fucking risk as well, too, right? Um, and there is a huge financial reward for coaches to be like six, seven-figure rewards here for coaches to be in shape all year round, or kind of to develop that. And this is why so many of them are getting fucked up and like developing disordered approaches to both exercise and nutrition and putting their health at a massive cost. So it's like maybe it's something you should do. And

How To Vet A Coach Properly

SPEAKER_01 16:00

it's like, look, okay, if you got any social proof and you've got like show me your blood work as well before you hire a coach, like you know, do we look at this kind of stuff and say, like, are you actually fucking in shape internally and externally as well? Too, and you can see this again. Like, put on your put on your like sensible hat for a moment, don't buy just purely based off emotion, based off they're in shape, they look amazing, I need to look like that, and say, Is what they're doing actually in line? And look a little bit deeper and see, like, well, if they were on the stair mill for the fucking seventh time this week and they're like talking about like their lean gain, and it's like, okay, why are you doing that? And that's not for like cardiovascular health benefits. You're like beating yourself into a you know pulp and you're like on 1200 calories a day because you're afraid of your life of carbohydrates. It's like again, this is very evident, and people will spot this because you can see all the bullshit and cut through it pretty quickly. So, again, just be very cautious when you're looking at this stuff. I'm not trying to sound like the sour grape old man. I've been there, done that, I've walked, walked, done the thing, I've lost the fat, gained the muscle. Uh, but at the same point, be very cautious and aware. Like, I would still prefer people actually ask me more questions like that, as opposed to like, well, sure, Larry, you've been in the industry 20 years, let's just blindly follow you and do everything because you're seemed to be sensible. Ask further questions when you are looking at taking on some coaching, or just getting a bit more insight into people and what they're actually doing and their own approaches. Because again, what a lot of people will do, it's like it's work for me, so fuck it, it's gonna work for you as well, too. But I'm 25 and you're 45. Let's just apply the same shit and hopefully something sticks. You'll have people that will slip through the cracks and you'll get progress, but they're just gonna be uh the same stuff all the time in terms of like their before and afters, and you're gonna have that. Most recently, just to do a touch on this, there's an ad running around on social media of this client who got in tremendous shape at the time with that coach. That client has since been on to us horrifically out of shape, like in a bad way with their all sorts of stuff with their nutrition, their training, their lifestyle in the horrors, but yet that coach is still promoting their shit online, talking about how this guy is in shape. They're not in shape, and it's something I'd love to be able to help them out with and look be able to assist these people with, but they've been left in a really shitty way, and it's just gonna be continually promoted by those coaches as well, too. So, anyway, let's not get into our head about that because I will do a little bit expose at some point.

Final Takeaways And Closing

SPEAKER_01 18:13

I don't know. Uh Daniel, this one's been productive. I feel uh people are gonna be maybe a little bit more cautious and scary and afraid of the industry, but it's good to get some insights here as to what's actually going on sometimes as well. Daniel, it's been an absolute pleasure as always.