Episode 93: Why so Much Hatred Between Muslims and Jews???

Why is there nonstop fighting in the Middle East? Why can’t Israel just get along with all of the nations surrounding it? Although it’s not easy to fix, it’s not that hard to explain. Stu and Todd will do just that in this episode about the longest-running conflict in human history.

- Check out Dennis Prager’sThe Middle East Problem: https://www.prageru.com/video/the-middle-east-problem?gclid=CjwKCAjwhNWZBhB_EiwAPzlhNvd-XdGNwT9L6hXMn1TbNSC5RlEFkJ0hvkLWYl3Kezopqtiilx1f6hoCJY4QAvD_BwE
- “If the Arabs put down their weapons today, there would be no more violence. If the Jews put down their weapons today, there would be no more Israel.” - Benjamin Netanyahu
- “When peace comes will perhaps in time be able to forgive the Arabs for killing our sons, but it will be harder for us to forgive them for having forced us to kill their sons. Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us.” - Golda Meir

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Transcript

Todd  0:06  
Welcome to the Truth Wins podcast where the truth hurts sometimes, but it could save your life.

Our heart on this podcast is for you to know why you believe what you believe and to be able to give a defense for it. This is episode 93 called Why so much hatred between Muslims and Jews. Very controversial topic that we're going to tackle today. We'll probably get flagged. Definitely get flagged for it, but not the first or last time. But as always, my good friend Stu with us. Hey, Stu. Hey, Stu. This is Todd Sherman. I'm your host. We're gonna jump into a controversial but important topic. But before we do that, I haven't seen your free for a few weeks how you been? Pretty well, I think about you. You know, I'm feeling old today. I played Pickleball for the first time last night. I did too. I played down in the springs school. They have a pickleball court. It was the first time I really Yeah. So I mean, I was kind of a big deal. I crushed it. But I wet the bed last night. No, I didn't actually but it was fun. But I went to bed last night feeling fine. woke up at like three in the morning. My hip is in incredible pain. And so it still is to this moment. I'm heavily medicated. So whatever I say, you cannot hold against me take in. But it stings getting old. I mean, I played pickleball. And now it feels like I pulled my hip. You know, I'm gonna have to get one of those Life Alert things around my neck here pretty soon. So because you fallen in,

please. Sorry, Grandma. But yeah, how'd you do on Pickleball?

Stu  1:36  
You know, it was something similar to tennis. Yeah. So I could, I could figure it out. Yeah, the part that I had trouble with was the bouncing, you gotta let the return bounce. Because my intentions in tennis were always to get to the net and just smash it as hard as I could. And that doesn't work in this game. So you have to at least let it go twice before you step in the kitchen. Unless the balls in the kitchen or it's the second Thursday of the month, and you can't you know, so we're having trouble in the kitchen anyway. Yeah, no good in the kitchen and the scoring too. It's like, do you have to make it that complicated? It's like 2242973 numbers, what's up with that love for love 15 You know what, I'm gonna hire an accountant. Next time I play it, just let them handle that I'm gonna focus on my game, although I'm gonna have to do it inside because I think those Clay courts, a lot of people have hip injuries. So um, unfortunately, maybe at that age where I can't do certain sports without how you take ibuprofen, and you're just gonna have to hang upside down and a traction device and then get massage and, you know, Rolfing therapy and stuff like that. I did think of you. Wait a minute, I do want to do a quick shout out to my boy, Brian. All right. My rolfer your role? Yes, I have my own professional rolfer. That may be the first shout out to a Rolfer in human history. So we'd like to do a lot of firsts on the show. But yeah, I did think a you because Stu's  back goes out like every other month if not if the wind changes. And then he's flat on his back for literally for days. And then he's hanging upside down like the Addams Family and all that. So but anyways, this side, I guess it's the second law of thermodynamics. Is that right? Entropy? Yeah, we're getting older and breaking down. We're not getting better. But we still got it up here. And today is an important topic. But before we get there, Stu, I would like for us to do something that we hear on the Truth Wins prod, podcast, whatever we call this call time to stump Stu.

Todd  3:39  
Alright, John said I go by ample thinking and logic itself. I don't know if amples means what he thinks it means. And by the way, I told you to be nice on our last episode still got a little angry. So I told him be nice because I'm usually the guy who's you know, inappropriate and gets canceled. So you're supposed to be the nice guy. It's good cop, bad cop. But you were bad cop, bad cop last time. But this time, he's gonna be nice to John, when John says I go ample thinking, I go by ample thinking and logic itself, therefore would not be convinced of a theory or a concept simply because it's written in a book, no matter what that book is.

Stu  4:14  
How about if it was Charles Darwin's book, and you're convinced of that by that book? You very well could be sorry. Yeah. And I'm going to be a little nice. But John, do you think I don't think and I don't use logic. Do I go by fairy tales and myths and whatever I feel right. I mean, no, we all use thinking and logic. I taught logic, John, maybe you should take a course in it. Now

Todd  4:43  
so that taught did no good. The kinder, gentler Stu, here's

Stu  4:48  
the point. All right. Every book needs to be examined on its own merits. The Bible is a book that's written by 40 Different authors 1600 years three different continents and yet conveys a unity and it ties together in a way that no other book can. It exposes our false flaws and faults. It's, it's, it's a book like no other because it's written through the power of God. No other book has lasted this long. It's the number one best seller, as we said, every time So, John, I asked you just to check this out. And when you talk about thinking, probably some of the most brilliant thinkers ever have found that it it's words have brought them comfort in difficult times. But also, they became followers of Jesus because it's the truth.

Todd  5:47  
And that's, that's the whole point of this podcast. That's why I believe God called us to do this is because there's that mentality of if I wanted to be a Christian, I have to check my brain and at the door. But like you said, most Christian, most thinkers, throughout history have had a biblical worldview. And for those who don't go to that book and question it to just as much as you question the Bible, and at least give the Bible a chance. That's all I would say. But right. Yeah. All right. Well, thanks for jumping in there, John. Sorry, against who was a little grumpy today, but he's gonna get better as the episode goes on. So hopefully you stay with us. But that is today's time to stump stu. All right, before we jump into the whole Muslim Jewish conflict stuff, I want to tell you guys about constructify, they are a sponsor of Truth Wins, they're your go to solution for home improvement, energy efficient projects, where they construct it for you. They'll tackle your windows, siding, roofing decks, painting projects, all along the front range of Colorado. So if you have a project that you've been meaning to do, but just didn't think you had the time or money, called Joe, he'll do a free estimate for you. and his team at constructify will take good care of you call them at 303-502-1096 You can go to constructify.com or just email them at info@constructify.com. And in the if you do it within the next 66 minutes, and tell them that the Truth Wins that your follower with Truth Wins podcast, you will get an additional 15% off. Wow, there we go. You can do it after those 66 minutes and still get the 15% off. But I think you should do it before the 66 minutes. pressures on clock start and go to constructify you won't be sorry. Alright. hatred between the Muslims and Jews. Why is there so much hatred going on there? Why can't they just get along Stu is the question.

Stu  7:44  
Oh, well, in order to understand the conflict, you probably want to go back to the beginning of it, like every conflict. And the place where we find the beginnings of this is once again in the Bible. Yeah. And it shows us some interesting things in Genesis.

Todd  8:02  
Yeah. So we're getting in the DeLorean. We're going back 4000 years to a guy named Abraham and his wife, Sarai, and God came to him and said, Hey, I know you don't have any kids. You're 75 Your wife's 65 I think at the time, but I'm gonna make a nation out of you. Years later, still no kids. So his wife Sarai says, Okay, I'm going to take things into my own hands, actually, I'm going to put them in my husband's hands. So she gives her servant who's from Egypt to Abraham, and says,

Stu  8:31  
Hagar, she was later big in the slacks industry. Hagar doesn't

Todd  8:36  
like it. Yes. And nice pair. Overalls should always work. You can tell she's pregnant because she had those little pregnant overalls that she wore all the time. But anyway, she slept with Abraham got pregnant, then Sarai, and women, you understand where this is coming from? It was her idea. She put her husband and her servant up to it. And then when she got pregnant, pregnant, she despised Hagar and treat her poorly. And so yeah, there's some. There's just a kitties gonna scratch. If you get too many kitties in the same tent. They're gonna scratch and so basically, Hagar is like, okay. See, I'm the one who offends you're supposed to be the nice guy. Let me do your

Stu  9:16  
email. Yeah, exactly.

Todd  9:18  
Which is our best demographic. That's right. Sorry, ladies. But you know what I'm talking about. So, anyway, she leaves and the Lord appears to her I think this pre Incarnate Christ, right, and this one that seems to believe.

Stu  9:32  
It says the angel of the Lord with all caps so.

Todd  9:35  
So this is a big enough event where the pre Incarnate Christ comes down and speaks to her and says to her in this is in Genesis 16, verse 11, you are now pregnant and you will give birth to a son. You shall name him Ishmael, for the Lord has heard of your misery. What does this mean,

Stu  9:52  
Shema. Remember that that's the issue is God has heard me you know, and the Shema piece is here important because it's the Deuteronomy six for the Shema itself.

Todd  10:09  
And that's just a little side note too is that when you talk about a book of the Bible in the Old Testament in Hebrew, or like the Shema, that passage, they call it by the first word right in there. So like Genesis is beginnings, better she better sheets and things. Yeah. So Shamar means here because that's the first thing hero Israel, that's what it says. And she, the Lord heard her cry, because she's like, I'm gonna go out and die in the desert, because it's better to die in the desert than have this lady mad at me all the time. So Jesus comes to her Angel the Lord and says, Your son will be a wild donkey of a man. Probably not the prophecy. She was, oh good, an angel of the Lord. He's got good news for

Stu  10:52  
me a lion of a man be pretty cool. But wild donkey. Yeah, that's

Todd  10:58  
the literal Hebrew was wild ass of a man. Just because it has that field. It's like the most stubborn wild, just crazy beings out there. They want to Yeah, his hand will be against everyone and everyone's hand against him mean he will live

Stu  11:12  
fighting is fighting with everyone.

Todd  11:15  
And he will live in hostility towards all of his brothers. Right? So what's what's this prediction? Then?

Stu  11:22  
It's saying that the descendants of Ishmael who are the Arab peoples, and Mohammed comes out of that people group

Todd  11:31  
and the Arab people know they are right and say they are right, Ishmael says,

Stu  11:36  
well, they call themselves sons of Abraham to and they try to say that's the reason they should get the land.

Todd  11:41  
But because he's the firstborn to Yeah, he's born polarizing

Stu  11:45  
Isaac. But it says they will live in hostility toward his brothers. And if you look at modern day Islam, you start to end even old Islam. There were conflicts from the get go. On Muhammad dies, you know, who's going to be the next Khalif who's going to take over? And some people said it has to be a blood relative of Muhammad, and they became the Shia Islam, you know. And then the Sunnis were, no, it can be somebody else. But he was a gifted leader and teacher. But so there's been fighting and so there were assassinations, and the first fork cut leaves, it was pretty bad. Yeah,

Todd  12:31  
it's been bloodshed and fighting for power since day one. But you know, Islam becoming a religion was what seventh century.

Stu  12:42  
So Mohammed is born and 578 D, and he has a vision. He dies in 632. So it's in the six hundreds that he has his vision at near Mecca.

Todd  12:54  
So seventh century, we're talking 2700 years later. But that doesn't mean that the prophecy was finally fulfilled, then, because the descendants of Ishmael had different names before what we understand it now is mostly the Arab nations, right? Because Israel had a long history with the descendants of Ishmael way before Mohammed ever walked the planet. Correct? Right.

Stu  13:17  
Right, because you start you reading the Bible about the Moabites and the people around Israel. So, yes, there, there have been a ongoing conflict. It's just kind of an it's prophesied that it'll be that way. But it's also prophesied that Islam will be in conflict with itself. And that's really important, because you have, you know, in Sunni Islam, which Sunni means the path, and they believe that the Quran is the ultimate authority. They even have a violent sect in Saudi Arabia called Wahabism. That's where Osama bin Laden comes out of. He's a Sunni Muslim. So you'd think well, he's not one of the real radical crazies, like in Iran, where you have the Shia Islam, which make up only about 15% ish of Islam. But because the difference being that Shia Islam believes that the Quran is the word but also that the Imams or the Ayatollah is have the same authority as the Quran. So they can actually give an order and you follow that as much as you would follow the Quran. It's kind of like Catholic Catholicism, you know, with the Pope speaking ex cathedra and Protestantism that says the Bible is the key authority. So

Todd  14:48  
Scripture so do you have wasabi when you're hanging out with a will hobby? Is that the food of choice blue bow? Hey, you did the Hagar jokes. I get a little pond now and again wasabi. Okay, so have had their hands against each other, but top of the pyramid in the hatred category is Israel and always has been correct the Jews I mean, that's, that's what they jump out of bed is pushing Israel all the Jews into the sea just having no more Jews on the planet Earth is the goal

Stu  15:25  
right? I mean and goals explicitly stated by you know, Nasser when they first come into existence back in when he was the head of Egypt and it's explicitly stated by Hamas and all these terrorist organizations that Islam foments and creates because Islam has this vision and this is kind of hopefully something that explains this better in Islam they believe you have two angels you know one's on your left and one's on your right shoulder and one is writing down your good deeds and one of the right is writing down your bad deeds. And when you get to the end of your life, you have to get over 51% Good deeds are you can't go to alGianna or paradise and Paradise is mostly for men in Islam in the Quran, it says that a woman is worth half of a man her testimony and also that it says that it's okay for a man to beat his wife if she you know disobeys some either. Yeah. And I I used to illustrate to my classes, what we saw in in Tripoli in Libya. When I lived in a Muslim country, there would be a line of women you know, and a man in there walking and there'd be a woman out in front 10 yards and other woman husband kids, another woman another woman because in Islam, you can have up to four wives. And we asked Ali who was a Muslim Arab you know, we I said Ali why did they walk single file like that noted down the streets. He said, Well, after World War Two, when Mussolini left he left behind landmines. First woman is you know, Minesweeper, number one least favorite wife, Minesweeper, number two next least favorite wife, then the most important husband and kids than the favored wives. 

Todd  15:51  
So do they ever LeapFrog? Like, could you go from wife three down to two and get in the back, I would

Stu  17:37  
imagine depending how you were treated, I

Todd  17:40  
feel a little sweet, sweet and better cook and, you know, kept yourself in good shape, you might have a good shot. And I joke about it, but it's very oppressive. And, you know, people people love and in our culture to act like they know something that they have no idea what it's about. It's like, oh, we're all pretty much the same. We all care know, the rights for women and homosexuals in a Muslim country. Forget about it. And yet everybody's afraid to mention the obvious. It's like the Emperor's naked. We got to talk about that, because women are very much second class or like a half class citizen, as you said, and they kill people for being gay. And that's, that's how it is over there. And we'd love to sugarcoat it, our culture would but that's, that's not what we should do. We got to talk about the truth.

Stu  18:26  
And if you choose to leave Islam as a, you know, son, or daughter of a Muslim father, you know, Hadith nine 157, you can put them to death. It's, you know, they've got that because they left the true faith, you

Todd  18:41  
know, they have every right. Unfortunately, a lot of people look at Christianity as the same thing. You were talking about the 51 over 49. It's like, hopefully, my good stuff outweighs My bad, or even people are just good people. But don't you know, they went to church a little bit growing up. But that's not the gospel message is like none of us has enough to get 1% worthy of going to heaven. It's only by the grace of God through his Son, Jesus Christ. So that's the hope that we have that we're all in the same boat apart from God for all eternity. But because of Jesus, we have that access. The problem is with all with Islam, and many other religions, and even people who unfortunately don't understand the gospel, but say they're Catholic or Protestant, is that it's all by works and like you do enough, then you can get there, but we can never do enough. That's the gospel message.

Stu  19:28  
And when I was in Egypt, I got to go into some schools. And we went into this one school specifically. And it was elementary up to about eighth grade school. So like, first through eighth, and I looked at this one classroom, and it had pictures of what the students had drawn, you know, like you put all the kids artwork on this board. And it was kind of interesting, because I'm looking around at all these pictures. And when I was young, I used to draw, you know, airplanes and ships in little fighting men and, you know, all this kind of bombs blowing her and cool things, because that's how boys are, we're kind of, you know, crazy like that. But as I'm looking around, I noticed this one picture specifically. And the people that are in it are punching and beating up these other guys and fighting, you know, and I thought, Oh, this is cool. And then I saw what they had drawn on the outer part. And it's a kid's drawing, obviously. So it's like a third grade, fourth grade kid. And on the one people there was written, you know, the sickle of the Egyptian, every Muslim country has the harvest, you know, the moon as part of its symbol. And so that was on this one guy's army stuff. And then the other people had on starve David's, they were getting the poor beat out of them. And I'm thinking, Where is that coming from? You know, this is being taught in the elementary schools to these kids. So let me read a couple of quotes from textbooks from the Arab world. So in Jordan, this is for third year junior high school modern world history says the Jews in Europe were persecuted and despised because of their corruption, meanness and treachery. And then in

Todd  21:23  
Jordan, yeah, which is probably one of the least friendliest if you could even say that of all Arab nations around Israel.

And first year high school glances at Arab society page 117. And exercise. Israel was born to die prove it. So that's your essay question. You know why Israel was born to die. It's called a leading question. Yeah, Syria, Damascus. The religious ordinances reader says the Jews lived, exiled and despise since by their nature, they are vile, greedy, and enemies of mankind. Yeah, I mean, and you can just go on the Arabs do not cease to act for the extermination of Israel. That's an Egyptian textbook. Israel shall not live if the Arabs steadfast in their hatred that's in their books.

Now, we want to be careful about not being just one sided and hear both sides of the argument. So what are some things that you've come across where the hatred goes the other way like Jews hating on Muslims doing some things if you come across any of that?

Stu  22:29  
I haven't seen it taught in textbooks in you know, Hebrew schools, like when we were in Israel, you don't see that kind of, you know, because they actually have Arabs who are members of their Knesset, you know, they get to vote. They're the it's the only place in the world where Arabs get to vote usually because most Arab nations are run by dictators or Ayatollah is or something like that. So yeah, it's it's different.

Todd  22:58  
They have more rights and freedoms in Israel, Arabs do, right than anywhere else in the world, pretty much. Maybe not everywhere, but pretty close. Okay, so it's not taught in the schools where, and I've seen you as you were reading some of those examples in textbooks. I've seen videos where it's like a kid show, it's like a blinky the the clown show from our Bozo the Clown from our day, in the clouds going up to the kids and saying in Arabic, or whatever the language of that country is like, who are the filthy people? Oh, the Jews, and they have the drawings of the big nose. And they're the animal. You know, they're the bloodsuckers of the world. And so they teach these two year olds, this hatred of Israel, and specifically the Jews right out of the gate, and, quite frankly, the hatred of America because we're the big Satan. Right, right. The Great Satan, right.

Stu  23:45  
And they're the little Satan. Yeah. But it turns out, when we'll talk about this in our later episode today, but Israel comes back as a nation in 1948, after, you know, 1800, close to 1900 years, with no homeland, for the Jews, they're scattered around the world. And immediately, there's war declared on him. Here's the interesting piece with a British mandate that whole land, which they falsely called Palestine, and we'll talk about that too. But 77% of that land is given to Jordan. Jordan takes that the Arabs and then 23% of what they should have got is all that Israel gets it and then the Arabs decide they want that 23% So they immediately declare war, Egypt, Syria, you know, let Jordan all the countries around them declare war on Israel and try to take them out at the beginning when they have no army, no navy. No, you know, they're not organized,

Todd  24:59  
but Again, I'm being facetious here, but you look at all the nations around there and for the United Nations just to give Israel like over half of all the real estate in the Middle East, maybe even more than that, that just doesn't seem fair. Does it still? I mean, how big was that 23% of ancient Israel.

Stu  25:20  
There's a cool golden my air quotes, you said, I have this against Moses, that he took us all around the Middle East, and he brought us to the only place that doesn't have oil.

Todd  25:33  
They make the finding. It's true, isn't it? Yeah. But you know, the modern day Israel, which, and we'll talk about this more on this next episode that episode. But you know, it was it was very small 1948. And then after the Six Day War, they basically doubled the size, but then they still gave back a ton. And they've been giving back ever since. Right? They give in the Yom Kippur War, they got the Sinai Peninsula, I believe, and they gave it all back a few months later, if that just to get them off their back, right. But it's modern Israel now is the size of New Jersey. And in 1948, are you saying that basically, they got a quarter of that size, even small, United Nations. So think of a quarter of New Jersey, the state of New Jersey, that's the amount of property that was given to the Jews, after going through everything they went through being dispersed for 900 years going through the Holocaust camps, death camps, half of the Poppins Jewish population in the world was destroyed because of the Holocaust. And when they 1/3, okay, and yet, they're given just a little piece of ground smaller than one of our smallest states. And yet, this still is not an that's still too much to all these nations that want to destroy, and so there's a hatred on the other side. But again, back to the original, or the earlier question is, have we seen it go the other way, too? Or is it just a one sided hatred for Israel? And here's like, just all we want is just a place to live and leave us alone.

Stu  26:56  
And that's what Israel pretty much strives to do. They just want to live there. They want just let us alone. They don't launch rockets into Arab territories, and from schools and from hide behind. It's like the Hamas and those guys that are in the part that they gave back to the Arabs, which was a huge mistake. The Gaza, you know,

Todd  27:23  
that was that 15 years ago. Yeah. What is so just to our listeners who watch the nightly news, and when they see stuff over there, it's painted in a way though, where the Israel is the oppressor, and it's the poor Palestinians. And then they roll the camera when there is a a missile that goes off, and all these poor Palestinian kids and the moms weeping holding a child, what's going on there? Is it is it really fabricated? Or is that stuff going on over there? 

Stu  27:52  
Well, there are some things that happen accidentally in warfare as always, but also the the Hamas because women are not as valuable as men, they can use them as shields, you remember when they catch Osama bin Laden, he hides behind his wives, one of his wives, you know, it's, it's just sick. In the United States, we view women as men's job is to defend and protect my wife and I don't use her as a shield. And one of the things that golden my hair said that really is, is powerful. She said, we can forgive the Arabs for killing our children. We cannot forgive them for forcing us to kill their children. When you use your kids as shield and as human bombs, when they strap bombs to kids, and send them into Israeli territories, says we will only have peace with the Arabs when they love their children. More than they hate us. Yeah.

Todd  28:59  
Wow. Yeah. Like you said, she's like the Winston Churchill of Israel. Yeah. And it is sad when you know the truth, because not only are they firing rockets from schools and mosques, because they know that Israel won't retaliate there. Israel will also going to go into the Gaza days before they're going to make a military strike on a place and say, hey, everybody get out of here, because this, these are the bad guys. And we got to destroy them because they're trying to destroy us. So what will they do? They will take their women and children to that spots just for the fact of they will get hit, they will get killed, cameras rolling. We see it around the world and everybody's like, How could Israel do this? So that is the truth of what's going on there. In fact, when you and I were there last, what's going on eight years now it's hard to believe it's been that long, but there was a Palestinian who got in a car and drove into a bus stop with all these citizens, women children waiting for the bus drove the car right in there killed the baby in the stroller killed the mom all that just because of the hatred, no other reason than they just like, didn't know, there was no bad guys or no military idea for anybody there. It's just that hatred for the Jews is so extreme, they're willing to do anything. And that's