A Show of Faith
Millennial, Priest, Minister, and Rabbi walk into a radio station...
A Show of Faith
Faith Through Words: Quotations That Shape Our Lives
Tucked within ancient scriptures, philosophical musings, and even secular thought lies transformative wisdom that can change our perspective in an instant.
This episode invites you into an intimate exploration of the quotations that have profoundly shaped our hosts' spiritual journeys.
Rabbi Stuart shares his personal maxim—"Choose your theology carefully, because it will paint you into a corner you'll never get out of"—alongside the liberating perspective from Ecclesiastes that "time and chance happen to them all." This wisdom frees us from the theological trap that blames God or questions our worthiness when random misfortunes strike.
Rudy Kong offers "The magic you're looking for is in the work you're avoiding"—a secular gem with profound spiritual implications about how we procrastinate on the very things that would transform our lives. Father Mario Arroyo transports us into a powerful visualization of living for "an audience of one" in God alone, while Dr. David Capes unpacks C.S. Lewis's revolutionary understanding of humility as "thinking of yourself less" rather than "thinking less of yourself."
What begins as a simple sharing of favorite sayings evolves into a rich exploration of how we comprehend suffering through Job's questioning, the relationship between faith and reason, and the delicate balance between studying and thinking. These aren't mere quotable phrases but lifelines that have guided our hosts through their darkest doubts and greatest joys.
What pithy wisdom has become your life's cornerstone? Share your own guiding quotation with us and join our continuing conversation about the words that shape our faith journeys.
There's something happening here, what it is ain't exactly clear. There's a man with a gun over there Telling me I've got to beware. I think it's time we stop. Children, what's that sound? Everybody look what's going down. There's battle lines being drawn. Nobody's right if everybody's wrong. Young people speak in their minds Are getting so much resistance From behind every time we stop. Hey, what's that sound? Everybody look what's going down.
Speaker 2:Welcome to A Show of Faith on AM 1070 Answer, where our minister, priest millennial and rabbi discuss events in the news or anything of interest to religion that we feel like talking about Our priest's father, Mario Arroyo. I'm here, it feels like an echo. It feels like an echo. The reverend is David Capes Can you hear an echo I hear a little bit of an echo.
Speaker 3:I'm hearing a ton of echo.
Speaker 2:I'm hearing.
Speaker 4:I am Rabbi.
Speaker 2:Stuart Federo and Rudy Kong is our millennial alien. Now it feels muffled.
Speaker 5:Oh well, I feel.
Speaker 2:Well, here we go, it's one or the other. Yes, rudy, he's there. Oh, there, he is Okay. Yes, can he definitely hear you? Yeah, we can. Yes, rudy, he's there. Oh, there, he is Okay. Yes, can definitely hear you.
Speaker 4:Yeah, we can yes. Hey, welcome. Where are you now? Are you back in Guatemala?
Speaker 5:I am in Guatemala, Ah excellent, excellent, excellent.
Speaker 3:We are in Guatemala.
Speaker 4:So tonight Rabbi is sitting in the Watch him all along. So Tonight Rabbi, yes, Is sitting in the director's chair.
Speaker 2:Yes, I am the show director tonight. Yes, when I was a kid, I used to write down what I thought were cool sayings, pithy little sayings, okay, okay, or poetry that struck me, pithy little sayings, okay, or poetry that struck me. And I just think that these small, short little phrases pack a powerful punch, have a lot of meaning and touch us to our souls. And so I thought that tonight what we would do is give our favorite quotations and talk about them.
Speaker 2:I agree. All right, so since it's my idea, we'll see how it goes Now.
Speaker 4:these are not just our favorite quotations, but our favorite religious quotations.
Speaker 2:Or they are secular quotations that we feel have religious importance.
Speaker 3:Wisdom, they're wisdom quotations. Wisdom Like wisdom import.
Speaker 2:Wisdom. They're wisdom quotations. Wisdom Like wisdom, literature.
Speaker 4:Wisdom Like when you come to a fork in the road, take it.
Speaker 2:Thank you, that's a good one. That's Yogi Berra, right. Thank you, yogi.
Speaker 4:He was a sports person, Mario. You wouldn't know anything about that no I wouldn't know.
Speaker 2:All right. Well, I wouldn't know. I will lead this off, I guess. And that's to say that let me preface by saying this I have a favorite saying of my own, which you've heard me say, which is choose your theology carefully, because it will paint you into a corner you will never get out of. Choose your theology carefully, because it will paint you into a corner you'll never get out of.
Speaker 2:And I've used the example that people hold to a theology, and it can be. I'm a good person, I'm a righteous person, I do everything my religion demands of me. Therefore I should get everything I want, and then, all of a sudden, when they don't get what they want, their theology makes them question their own goodness. Am I really a good person? Maybe I'm not a good person, maybe I'm not as pious as I think I should be or think I am. And this is a quote, one of my most favorite quotations from the Bible, which is Ecclesiastes 9.11. I returned and saw under the sun that the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, neither yet bread to the wise, nor yet riches to men of understanding, nor yet favor to men of skill. But time and chance happens to them all, and to me that's a very freeing, uplifting quotation because it tells me that yes, believe god is in control, but I don't have to blame god when bad things happen.
Speaker 3:And bad things are going to happen. What? Where is that in the scriptures?
Speaker 2:ecclesiastes, chapter 9, verse 11 9 oh 9, 11, and that's the only reason I can remember the chapter and verse. But it it's, it's saying that it's not always God who's doing this to you. Sometimes random things happen. Okay, they occur, and you don't have to think God cursed me, god condemned me to whatever this is happening. I didn't blink right and therefore God's condemning me. It could be chance, and so I love that quotation. Chance, sometimes Time and chance happens to us all, and sometimes you know it's not fate or the will of God. Or sometimes chance happens to misquote the bumper sticker that you'll see. Sometimes Chance happens.
Speaker 4:Okay, yes, it does happen Right. Very good, I like that Rabbi.
Speaker 2:I love that quotation and it kind of goes with the idea of choose your theology carefully, because it will paint you into a corner you'll never get out of, because if you think I'm good, therefore I get everything I want I mean not that anybody really thinks they're good, but you know what I'm saying if you say I'm good, therefore I get what I want, you don't get what you want, then you're. You're in a corner now where you have to figure out. Maybe god hates me, maybe you know, and it doesn't always work that way yeah, exactly, I love it.
Speaker 4:Yeah, no, that's good. So Ecclesiastes you said one time Ecclesiastes is your favorite book.
Speaker 2:It is my favorite book of the Bible, not just for that quote, but there are other. For many it is as well. Right right.
Speaker 4:All right, should we go to the millennial next?
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 4:Now in Guatemala, Millennial. Let's hear from you.
Speaker 5:I have a few, so I don't know if should I just start with like maybe one or two, just one.
Speaker 2:We're going to take turns. It'll either take 10 seconds or 10 hours.
Speaker 5:I'm going to go with a secular one, because I have some Bible ones too and I have songs from saints. But I listened to a podcast and I heard this I didn't pick up I don't remember where, but it just always kind of stuck with me and it says the magic you are looking for is in the work you're avoiding. The magic you're looking for is in the work you're avoiding. The magic you're looking for is in the work you're avoiding.
Speaker 2:The magic you're looking for is in the work you are avoiding, is in the work you are avoiding.
Speaker 4:The magic you're looking for is in the work you're avoiding.
Speaker 5:Yeah, to me it's kind of like this old Chinese proverb too, and it translates weird, but it says swallow the toad in the morning, and it's so I don't know. It kind of speaks to me because I've always had an issue with procrastination and just kind of putting things off and putting things off and putting things off and and it. And I remember this, even going back to school and especially college. You know, I would just kind of wait for the last moment to to write a paper or to finish this or or not really study when I needed to, and it would just stress me out. And whenever I started kind of switching things around and and I just kind of remember my mother really always saying you know, the moment you think you need to do something, do it. This whole thing where you just kind of put it off.
Speaker 5:You know, so many people have all these great ideas and all these plans and all these things, but all they ever do is just talk about it. They don't actually do the work, right. They don't actually plan, they don't execute, they don't put the thing together, and so I just find that so, so curious, right. It's like people say, oh, I want to be fit, okay, well. Do you go to the gym? No, okay, well then. Well then, why, right?
Speaker 5:I mean, the thing that you're looking for is in the work that you're avoiding Right, and in so many of my cases not in my case, but in my case I wanted to get an A in the test. Okay, well, did you study or did you wait for the last second? You know to kind of go over things and then just work under pressure. No, I worked, okay. Kind of go over things and then just work under pressure no, I work, okay. So there you go. You know you want to be a straight-a student, you want to excel at your job. You want to be it. It just it takes preparation and it takes work. There's nothing. There's nothing easy in this life. These things aren't just given to you. As much as you can be born with a silver spoon in your mouth, you know it's. It's easy to lose a fortune, it's easy to throw things out, and I've seen it with family members and people. I know so it's.
Speaker 3:You know, there's a, it's kind of the same. There's a quote that I wasn't going to use, but it's kind of like that and my mom always used to say it, and at first when I say it, people say what? The lazy man works twice as hard. Yeah, exactly Because you have to do it over. You have to do it over. I hear that all the time. Try to do something lazy and then I have to do it over again.
Speaker 4:From Ben Franklin A Stitch in Time.
Speaker 2:Oh, really Stage nine. Same kind of thing.
Speaker 4:Yeah, A Stitch in in time saves nine. So you do the stitch now or you do it later and it will cost you nine stitches to do it Right. You know, if you stop and think about it, it's like the same. I was just going to say it's like the same that we have Measure twice, not once, Right, right.
Speaker 5:Yeah for doing the work, yeah.
Speaker 2:Rudy, if you stop and think about it, the paper you did, that you put the most effort in, is what you value the most. The things that come easy, that you didn't work on, you really don't value. But what makes you the most proud is the a that you worked your tush off for. Yeah, if it come, if it comes easy, you take it for granted.
Speaker 2:It's what you work on, that you value yeah indeed, and in hard work, you know, whatever you did, the most work on the hardest work on that's what you're going to probably be the most proud of.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I mean, there are a number of proverbs about this and one is in Proverbs, chapter 8, go to the ant O sluggard and consider his ways. In other words, consider the ant and consider the work that is done. But you know, a little, a little, a little, uh, sleeping, a little folding of the hands to rest, and suddenly poverty comes upon you. You know, if you just sit back and you just wait, and you just wait for somebody to do something for you, if you don't get the work done, if you don't put in the work.
Speaker 2:Poverty is going to overtake you.
Speaker 4:So it's exactly the same thing.
Speaker 2:So there is a religious text about that. Yes, well, if we knew what we were going to say beforehand, we could have looked it up in the biblical equipment no but I think it's better the way we do it now.
Speaker 3:We're just echoing each other. The wisdom that is coming out of the four of our mouths is vituperousness. What, what was that?
Speaker 2:word, it's mine, I just made it up. It's like a viper, vipers. It's like a viper.
Speaker 3:Isn't there a word called vituperous?
Speaker 4:Yes, I don't know what it means. I don't think it's the right word, though, for what you're saying Don't look at me. I'm not sure either what does vituperous mean Gosh, you've got to go back and look.
Speaker 5:Okay, yeah.
Speaker 4:All right, do you have one, Father Mario? We've got a couple of minutes.
Speaker 3:We have a minute Do you have a.
Speaker 4:What we're doing is we're looking at favorite sayings.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that each of us have well, I bet you we could go to break early.
Speaker 4:I've got one real quick, okay, you? Gotta be right, st Augustine. In order to discover the character of people, we only have to observe what they love. You really want to know the character of a person? Look at what they love. What they love will tell you what they love.
Speaker 2:And you said that's Aquinas. No, augustine, yeah, augustine.
Speaker 4:That's from a book called the City of God that he wrote.
Speaker 3:My favorite Augustine one is you have made us for yourself, o Lord, and our hearts are restless until they rest in you.
Speaker 4:Oh, you took more than mine, man.
Speaker 2:Gosh, I thought that was one you were going to bring.
Speaker 4:No, I'm just kidding. You've quoted that one before. I got plenty more. I got plenty more. Let's go to a break. Come back and Father Mario it'll be your turn.
Speaker 6:Okay, this is knth 1070 wisdom radio and we'll be right back am 1070 the answer.
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Speaker 1:Turn. Everything turn, turn, turn. There is a season, turn, turn, turn, and a time to every purpose under heaven, a time to be born, a time to die a time to plant, a time to reap, a time to kill, a time to heal, a time to laugh, a time to weep.
Speaker 2:Welcome back to A Show of Faith. That's not a bad quote to keep in mind either.
Speaker 3:Oh, the microphone sounds better, not mine, no, okay.
Speaker 4:It's just your voice.
Speaker 2:Rabbi, that must be it.
Speaker 3:Well, my quote is actually a very short quote, but it is I would say it is the central theme of my life. What's that? Now it feels like there's a it's a feedback.
Speaker 2:It sounds like.
Speaker 3:There it is. Whatever it was, now it's back.
Speaker 8:Okay, we'll ignore it Ignore it.
Speaker 3:Okay, the quote that I base my life on is you have to live your life for an audience of one. Now here's the background to that. I have a little self-created parable that I kind of fantasize about. I always imagine myself to be the lone actor in a play and I am on stage. On stage, and in front of me there is a theater that is full of people, Full of people. The people on my left are booing me. They're saying Father Mario, you're the worst priest in the world. Get off, we don't want to see you anymore. The people on the right-hand side are saying Father Mario, you are the best priest we've ever met.
Speaker 6:You're wonderful. And then the people in the center ever met.
Speaker 3:You're wonderful. And then the people in the center are asleep.
Speaker 6:They're all what Asleep, asleep.
Speaker 3:And they're snoring. So the question I put before myself is who should I act for? Who is my audience? Does my audience the people who hate me? Should I try to change their minds? Should I keep playing just for the people who like me because they are the ones and ignore the other people and try to get these people to like me more? Or should I try to wake up these people who are in front of me and the answer is none of them? There's a in the back of the theater, right by the exit sign. You can barely see his face. There's a little old man, and that little old man is god, and he is my only audience, and so I have to keep my eyes on him, regardless of whether these people throw tomatoes or they throw roses or they snore me to death.
Speaker 2:Mario, a hundred years ago I went to, I think, one of maybe two conventions I've ever been to and got into a conversation with someone about a religious concept.
Speaker 4:I can't imagine that conversation with someone about a religious concept and the can imagine that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, this is a Jewish convention, mind you. Okay, not sure I want to admit that. Okay, but the issue. The issue was interfaith marriage, and I have chosen my career not to perform it because they are, in fact, against Jewish law and tradition. I'm sure there are people listening who will radically disagree with that, but the person I was discussing this with felt that, as the hireling of the congregation, the employee of the congregation, I had to do the will of the people, of the board, of the powers that be, and his statement was I work for him. And you reminded me with that quote. My response to him was no, I work for God and for Judaism. You just pay my bill.
Speaker 3:That's why it drives me bananas when I hear people and a lot of people say this about Catholic priests or actually about others that you have to be a person who lives for others, that you have to give your life to others. And I fundamentally disagree with, as do I I you don't. I did not become a priest because I wanted to live for others. I didn't even become a priest because I wanted to serve others. I became a priest because I was given a task, a mission from God, and my mission is from God and I must proclaim his word. And whenever I deal with anyone, I'm not dealing with that person alone.
Speaker 2:I'm dealing with that person like God, exactly, I don't work for you. I work for God in Judaism. You only pay my bills.
Speaker 3:There's one that happened to me about ten years ago I had a lady who was tremendously angry at me. I can't imagine why would they even think that. I just think they saw the beauty in my face and were jealous. But anyway, she was so angry at me, so angry and because I said, ma'am, I'm sorry, she was so angry and she said, how dare you? And I said, ma'am, I'm much more afraid of God than I am of you, just that and that kind of shut her up. She actually demanded she was a big contributor to the parish and I said, well, I've been in this parish for a long time and I want I should have some extra. And I said, no, if you would like, I will look up your contributions and I'll give you every penny back.
Speaker 4:And she just kind of but that's the way it's not really yeah.
Speaker 3:So, anyway, that's my first one. Exactly, I like it. I know we've got to go to a break here.
Speaker 4:Let me do another short one here. This is I mean as a Protestant. One of the most quotable people of the last century has been CS Lewis, who wrote a ton of books, and this is what he wrote. He wrote about humility. Stuart, are you listening? Yes, Okay are you listening?
Speaker 2:I don't know why I have to. I'm terribly humble.
Speaker 4:Oh I know, True humility is not thinking less of yourself. It's thinking of yourself less. True humility is not thinking less of yourself, less of yourself, less Not thinking less of yourself. I'm adding that to my collection. Yeah, less. In other words, if you're thinking about yourself all the time, you're always thinking about how this affects you. That's not humility, right.
Speaker 4:It's self hatred, real, real. Yeah, I mean, it's narcissism, really. That's what you're doing. You're thinking of yourself all the time and how this affects you and how you think about that and how you feel about that. Blah, blah, blah. If that's it, then that's not humility. Real humility means I'm thinking of God and I'm thinking of what God has me to do. I'm thinking, in a sense, of others. I'd have to go back and play with that idea, but thinking of God's call, god's mission and just the beauty of the world that God's created.
Speaker 3:More often than I'm thinking about myself, think about yourself less See what I meant by not others, at least for you and me, probably somewhat a application for you, but as Christians, the difference between Christianity and social work is I don't do what I do to another person because they are the other person, it's because I see Christ in them. It's interesting because in the Catholic understanding there's interesting because in the in the Catholic understanding, there's a part in the mass that says that we give you thanks on, lord, for allowing us to seek to be in this life and to serve you. To minister, no, to minister to you.
Speaker 2:So what's the whole? Say the whole thing again.
Speaker 3:I can't remember. You switched it in the middle. I'll look it up. I'll look it up. Come back, We've got to go to wherever. This is 1070 KNTH and we'll be right back.
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Speaker 1:Oh yeah, baby, Like a cold-heart, went and stayed too long. I'm wondering if your love's still strong. Ooh baby, here I am, signed, sealed, delivered from yours. Then that time I went and said goodbye.
Speaker 2:Welcome back to A Show of Faith on AM 1070. Answer New microphone sitting in a different place. You sound better. I think I do.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you do. Let me read to you this part that I thought. It just amazes me every time. I say it, because I say it every Sunday. After the consecration, the gospel goes. Therefore, as we celebrate the memorial of his death and resurrection, we offer you, Lord, the bread of life and the chalice of salvation and listen, giving thanks that you have held us worthy to be in your presence and minister to you.
Speaker 3:Notice he doesn't say to others, it says giving thanks that you have held us worthy to be in your presence and minister to you. I've always found that tremendously interesting.
Speaker 4:Well, I mean in the Protestant tradition. Typically we call it a worship service. It doesn't mean a series of things that you do. It is a service to God, that's right, it is a service to God.
Speaker 2:In Hebrew, the word for prayer service is service. The word for prayer is service. The word for prayer, let's rephrase that. The word for religious service, okay, is avodah, ah, which is like to serve someone. You know, we think of services as something religious, rote, you know, repetitive, whatever. But the word service is aboda, work, effort, effort, right.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Evit is a servant or slave.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I mean. We use the term liturgia, the work of the people, which is what liturgy is.
Speaker 2:Work, work of the people. That's right.
Speaker 4:It's part of the work that we do. We work in service unto God All right.
Speaker 3:Okay, who's next? I think I'm next.
Speaker 2:You're next, all right, this is totally secular. I just personally think it has religious implications. Well, everything Okay, and you've heard it, but you may not realize this. The poem is Robert Browning, okay, and the title to the poem is Rabbi Ben Ezra, okay.
Speaker 4:Okay.
Speaker 2:And this is very meaningful to me. So I'm sentimental. Wait a minute, I just lost it, okay, rabbi Ben Ezra by Robert Browning, this is only the first of like 30 stanzas or something, and you'll recognize it. Grow old along with me. The best is yet to be. The last of life for which the first was made. Our times are in his hand. Who saith a hole? I planned youth shows, but half Trust God, see all. Nor be afraid. Youth shows, but half Trust God See all, nor be afraid, that's very good.
Speaker 3:Yes, that is profound.
Speaker 2:It is very profound because most people will and it is. I believe it is because part of his relationship with Elizabeth Brown Grow old, grow old along with me. The best is, take the grow old along with me. The best is yet to be the last of life for which the first was made. But the whole quotation of this first stanza to the whole poem is our times are in God's hand and God made a whole.
Speaker 2:Not just you know the romantic part of relationship when you first begin and your heart is light and everything's perfect, or whatever, but the ups, the downs, the, the mountains, the valleys, it's, it's a whole put together and I just I love the image. God sees the whole. God's god created the whole, not just the first part, but the last part, not just the good part, that where you're strong and you're able. But you know I'm walking on a cane. Okay, we get old. Yeah, you know, our aches and pains start showing a little bit more and more every second or whatever. So to me it is. It is a statement of absolute trust in God to me. That's how I look at it.
Speaker 4:So why do you think that's secular?
Speaker 2:No, no, I think the first Robert Browning was anything but secular. Okay, but I think that the first part people hear as secular and they've never even heard. Our times are in his hand. Who saith a whole? I planned youth shows, but half trust God, see all, nor be afraid. I think that's an important part of the poem that's completely lost on people. Yeah, yeah, and the idea that he named this poem Rabbi Ben Ezra, I think, is even more. What's the verb to make it more religious? Yeah, yeah, right.
Speaker 3:David, you have not had a solid block of time.
Speaker 4:I have, have I not?
Speaker 3:No, you have not.
Speaker 4:I thought I had no Okay, so go Okay, all right. Again. Cs Lewis not, no, you have not. I thought I had no okay, so okay, all right. Uh again. Cs lewis. This is one of my favorite cs lewis quotes, and cs lewis was both a literary critic as well as an apologist for christianity. An author and an author. Yeah, wrote lots and lots of books, but this is one of any. You know his most famous books are are the Chronicles of Narnia, and there's so many things I could quote from there.
Speaker 2:You don't think Mere Christianity is far more popular?
Speaker 4:I don't think it is. I think more people will have heard of.
Speaker 2:Chronicles of Narnia Right because of the movies and stuff.
Speaker 4:Nobody's made a movie out of.
Speaker 2:Mere Christianity, no, but they did make it out of uh his love story right and and joy davidson as well.
Speaker 4:Lewis said this, and I think it's very, very profound, and and the same thing could be said of judaism, I think. Um, but he's writing as a christian. I believe in christianity, as I believe that the sun has risen, not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else. To me, that's a very profound kind of idea Would you say it again yeah, I believe in Christianity, as I believe that the sun has risen, not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else.
Speaker 2:I could say that about Judaism, absolutely yeah.
Speaker 4:Absolutely. I figured you could.
Speaker 2:I figured you could. I would venture to say anybody of any religion could substitute their own religion.
Speaker 4:They might be able to.
Speaker 2:Because the religious community is supposed to see everything through the eyes of their faith. I believe, Rudy's turn.
Speaker 4:Rudy oh Lord.
Speaker 2:Won't you buy me a Mercedes Benz? That's very close man and religious, my friends all have Porsches, I must make a bet man.
Speaker 5:Okay, that's very close, man and religious. My friends all have Porsches. I must make amends, commends, okay. So I'm going to go with a biblical one here, and this one came about. There was a point in my time, a point in time in my life where I was really obsessed with let's just call it knowledge. I just wanted to know everything about the cosmos and creation and physics and quantum.
Speaker 4:Good luck with that.
Speaker 5:And I just kept trying to feel, feel, feel, feel. And I just kept trying to feel, feel, feel, feel. And I don't know why. But I just stopped and I read the book of Job and there's this part in the book of Job where this is in chapter 38. It's kind of towards the end and Job's already gone through a lot of things and Job's, you know, he's clamoring, literally clamoring right, and he just doesn't understand. And it says Then the Lord spoke to Job out of the storm. He said who is this that obscures my plans with words without knowledge, brace yourself like a man. And the verse kind of keeps on going right, and he's questioning and questioning Job. And Job is just sort of silent, right, I mean, he doesn't have all these answers.
Speaker 5:And I remember reading that and it just sort of hit me like a freight train and there was really a sense of peace that came about. It. That was sort of just serene because I realized that there is never going to be a point in time where I just understand everything. There's never going to be a point in time where I understand all the machinations of the world, the creation of God and why, and this, and it was okay, and it was okay. And it was okay and it wasn't going to stress me anymore and I wasn't going to be freaking out about it, because I used to get these things would really keep me up at night.
Speaker 5:I mean, I don't know if anybody's ever, or if you guys, kind of went through this, but I would sit there and I would just research and research and research and through this. But you know, I would sit there and I would just research and research and research and, and sometimes I would kind of throw myself into a panic attack almost just trying to figure things out. Like, okay, I just, and for some regard there was there was a lot of hubris in that, right, I mean a real lack of humility, because it's funny, here I am trying to fit the ocean in in my little bucket. Yeah, it's funny.
Speaker 3:It's funny that you say it that way, because I went through exactly the same thing, except that for me, what I did is I gave up on reading For about.
Speaker 4:You gave it up, I just gave up studying. Okay.
Speaker 3:Because I figured I could never know it all, so what was the use of trying? So I gave up and I just didn't care anymore to read, to study the more I tried to know, the less I knew yeah because every time I would read, the more questions I would have.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's part of ecclesiastes too yeah, I just said well, I mean, that's what Job, job's all about.
Speaker 4:How can you? I mean, where were you when I laid the foundation?
Speaker 2:he's throwing the power and the glory at him yeah, yeah, how can you figure this stuff?
Speaker 3:out, let me throw something at you what we gotta go to a break.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we'll come back to this.
Speaker 3:It's 1070 KNTA.
Speaker 10:What a segue? What a segue.
Speaker 3:We'll be right back.
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Speaker 2:Play am 1070 the answer is there a ladder in your bag for me?
Speaker 1:Postman, look at me. Postman, look at me. Must be a word today.
Speaker 2:Welcome back to A Show of Faith on AM 1070. Answer. So Rudy, all of you, gentlemen, that's not where the message of Job ends. There's more to it than that. It doesn't stop with God, as we said earlier, throwing the power and glory at Job. Where were you when I laid out the Big Dipper, the Pleiades? That's not where it ends, because to me, what is the most significant is Job 42, verse seven. Job 42, verse 7. And it was so that, after the Eternal had spoken these words to Job, the Eternal said to Eliphaz the Tamanite my wrath is kindled against you and against your two friends, for you have not spoken of me, the thing that is right, as my servant Job has. So, even though Job could never understand the workings of the universe, even though Job will never understand things from the view of God, he's right to ask the questions. That's correct. He's right to say where is the justice? And to demand justice, even from God, even though he'll never understand. That's right. It's 42.
Speaker 3:Yep.
Speaker 2:And to me that's the message of Job Well he didn't say what the message with Job was.
Speaker 4:What he said was this is what had touched him when he read it.
Speaker 2:Well, yes, You're right, but to me, what touched me about Job was something else. How's that? Say it again.
Speaker 5:At the end he multiplies everything to Job. Right, because he never spoke ill against God, you know. So you're right. I mean you got to read the whole thing, I just. I think to me it was it's I reflect on it now and it was in some sense I was trying to sort of understand more and more and more and more and more about god, too. Right, because I would read theology books and then I got into theology study and we're doing all this history and we're reading the, the old church fathers and all this, and at the end you know, kind of kind of going back to what David said and this is another. So I kind of took over.
Speaker 5:But something that St John of the Cross said is is at the end of your life, you will be measured on how you love, and it says it a little different in Spanish, but fundamentally we can sit here. It doesn't matter how much math I know and how much we can talk about quantum things or how much I can rattle off about history. At the end of the day it's how did I love my brother, how did I love my sister, that person that shared that image and likeness of God? And to me it was just and I kind of God and to me it was just and I kind of had the same reaction with Saul DeMar. I just like stopped reading for like months. I was just like I'm done, like I don't even know, I'm done with this. It's just ridiculous. What else do I need to do?
Speaker 4:I think we all go through that at some point. We just we kind of we grow weary, you know, of that and of the pursuit.
Speaker 3:And you know an ancillary part of that that goes with it is I went through a period where God was saying to me you are so in love with the questions that you don't want the answers.
Speaker 2:Ooh, ooh Wow.
Speaker 3:In other words, because I love philosophy. God was saying to me that faith is where my answer is going to be, but I was loving the question so much that I didn't want them to end.
Speaker 2:But I would argue, part of the answer is the fact of asking the question.
Speaker 3:It is. But the fact is that the final answer is not going to be verbal, St Augustine. It's going to be a trust.
Speaker 4:St Augustine. In order to discover the character of a people, we have only to observe what they love, that's right. Do we love the answer? Do we love the question? Yeah, do we love the faith?
Speaker 2:Or do we love the people for whom we're asking and answering the question?
Speaker 3:We could do that, yeah, but the ultimate thing is the love of God, not the love of the answers, because the answers are all verbal. God is one of the answers, yes, but God is a person. He is not a problem to be solved. I think that's what I was getting.
Speaker 4:I am not a problem to be solved.
Speaker 3:I am a relationship that you must have with me.
Speaker 2:So God is not reason, god is beyond reason, he's a person.
Speaker 3:God is not reason. God is person who is reasonable, but he is not reason. God is beyond reason. He's a person. God is not reason. God is person who is reasonable, but he is a person.
Speaker 4:You talked about the word the logos. Exactly. Praise and purpose.
Speaker 3:Yeah, but God's, in other words, God is personal.
Speaker 2:Yes, personal, absolutely.
Speaker 3:He is a person. Right, I am a person, I am a person, I am a reasonable person, but you can most of the time, most of the time there have been.
Speaker 2:Sometimes you've been very unreasonable in this, in this booth mario's looking at us like what are you talking about?
Speaker 3:I don't understand what you're even saying I will now give you my last one. Okay, your last. There's. My last one Is this your last rights. Yeah, god forbid.
Speaker 4:No, no, no, just kidding Just kidding.
Speaker 3:To study without thinking is a waste of time. To think without studying is an extreme danger. Say it again To think without study, to study without thinking, to study without thinking, to study without thinking. Is a waste of time, is a waste of time. Okay To think without studying is an extreme danger.
Speaker 4:All right Explain.
Speaker 3:Well, there's a lot of people who think a lot, but they only think a lot about stuff that they're totally misinformed by Right and they're not studying it, and they're not studying it.
Speaker 2:And they're not studying it and that is dangerous that is dangerous.
Speaker 3:I constantly tell people when I'm preaching and teaching. I say I want you to stop reading the Bible, and people are sort of shocked. I say no, I don't want you to read it anymore, I want you to study it. There's a big difference between reading and studying. If you're going to study, then great, but reading it just for the sake of reading it doesn't do you anything.
Speaker 4:It doesn't do you anything. I heard one time of the difference between really reading and actually reading. Did you really read that? Yes, I really read it, but did you actually read it? In other words, did you give it some thought while you were reading it? I have, I don't know about you guys, but sometimes I'm reading something and reading something and reading something, and then all of a sudden, what have I just? Read.
Speaker 3:I can't remember.
Speaker 2:Right, have to reread it or have to reread it Right.
Speaker 4:Now, that means that I'm reading it, yes, but I'm not actually reading it. I'm not getting it, I'm not comprehending it.
Speaker 2:And so that's. I see what you're saying. Yeah, you would be surprised how often somebody has said to me well, I've read the Bible five and six times all the way through, I know it cold, and I will ask them the most basic, elemental, simple question. I have no idea. Oh, but I've read it a hundred. You know I'm not, I know it cold. And the simplest basic question right over their head oh, like.
Speaker 4:What would you ask?
Speaker 2:why did Adam and Eve get kicked out of the Garden of Eden? It's explicitly stated in the Bible. It's's in Genesis. It's right there, and they'll well, they sinned. Where does it say that? It explicitly says they were kicked out of the Garden of Eden to separate them from the tree of life so they would not become immortal. It says that In that way. Therefore, the Lord God sent them forth from the Garden of Eden. It's right there, no, but I've read it a hundred times In that way. Yeah, therefore, the Lord God sent them forth from the Garden of.
Speaker 4:Eden, yeah, yeah, it's right there. No, but I've read it 100 times, but see, you've probably read it 200 times, maybe.
Speaker 2:Feels like it. There's probably no doubt.
Speaker 4:All right, all right, how many more minutes we got left, rudy, do you have another short one, because we're just about down to a short one.
Speaker 5:Are we down to or short one, or down to a short one? Rudy, you have one, I've got a short one. Yeah, okay, there was a time where she was cleaning uh pots and she was cleaning dishes and she went into a uh type of ecstasy, right as she's describing this. But anyway, the scene goes like this God walks among the pots and pans. And to me, what I take from it God walks among the pots and pans is even in the most menial of tasks perceived menial tasks that we do during our day, we can offer it all in God's name. Everything, everything. When our baby's crying, when we're cleaning dishes, when we're doing laundry, when we're sitting in traffic, every single moment is just an opportunity to transcend, to take you to that special communion with God.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Here's a shorty, a little poem, a little saying from St Teresa of Avila, the one that Rudy said. Yeah, she said From superficial devotions and sour-faced saints, gracious Lord deliver us and I wanted to ask you to bring them.
Speaker 2:Would you say it?
Speaker 3:again From superficial devotions and sour-faced saints. Gracious Lord, deliver us.
Speaker 4:Love it, love it. That's from St Teresa. This is my favorite poem from EE Cummings, ee, cummings. Do you know EE Cummings?
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:Wonderful poet. The title of the poem is Fleas Adam Hadham, that's it. He said that that's an actual poem.
Speaker 3:That's a poem, yeah, it rhymes Adam, adam, adam.
Speaker 4:That's an actual poem. That's a poem. Yeah, it rhymes Adam Adam, adam. He was a masterful poet in so many ways, with punctuation and all kinds of crazy stuff. But anyway, that's not necessarily religious, but I mean, you know, adam had them.
Speaker 3:Okay, folks, we are in the last minute.
Speaker 4:All right.
Speaker 3:Who's in charge next week?
Speaker 4:I think Rudy is.
Speaker 3:No, I think he just went.
Speaker 4:Was it Rudy? No, no.
Speaker 5:No, no, no, it's either Mario or I think it's Mario. Actually it is me.
Speaker 4:Mario, it is Mario.
Speaker 3:Oh.
Speaker 4:Mario.
Speaker 3:Okay, did you have something we wanted to say quickly?
Speaker 2:It's not quick, it's a quotation, but it's a great poem. Short, but it's too much time. It's too much time Next week.
Speaker 3:Next week. Okay, folks, we are at the end of our show. We hope you've enjoyed this. We're going to do this a little more regularly.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I think these sayings are really helpful.
Speaker 3:We're going to try to do it, maybe once a month, it'd be cool it. Yeah, we're going to try to do it, maybe once a month. It'd be cool. It'd be cool. I'll set it up, don't worry, I'm the manager here. Okay, this is 1070.
Speaker 6:He's in charge.
Speaker 3:This is 1070 KNTH and you've been listening to A Show of Pace, peace. Keep us in your prayers because you're going to be in ours.
Speaker 6:Find us at am1070theanswercom. Download our apps.