A Show of Faith
Millennial, Priest, Minister, and Rabbi walk into a radio station...
A Show of Faith
October 12, 2025 What we pass on at the table shapes what a nation becomes
What if the most radical act in a restless culture is setting a longer table? We gather to explore why family remains the quiet powerhouse behind character, faith, and civic health. From Genesis’ one-flesh vision to Jeremiah’s intimate language of being known, we unpack how Scripture frames marriage and parenting as a covenant that forms us for love, duty, and joy.
Along the way, we contrast the timeless constancy of parental love with the churn of modern courtship—from village matchmakers to swipe-right apps—and ask what we might have traded for convenience.
Our conversation gets candid about real pressures: fewer marriages, declining birth rates, thinner congregational life, and the lure of hyper‑individualism that treats people like brands and beliefs like identities. We share personal stories—airport chaos with toddlers, a mother’s fierce devotion that “infects” her son with faith, and a European encounter where work eclipsed wonder—to show how ideas filter into daily life. The throughline is clear: faith is often caught, not taught; homes are schools of virtue where truth becomes habit and love learns to keep its promises. Family is not merely a legal arrangement; it’s a covenantal craft that requires sacrifice for the person and for the relationship.
Still, we’re hopeful. False scripts eventually exhaust themselves, and the hunger for belonging returns. We outline practical ways to rebuild from the inside out: shared meals, sabbath rhythms, honest apologies, intergenerational friendships, and communities that honor mothers, fathers, and spiritual kin. Whether your household is bustling with kids or held together by chosen family, you’ll find encouragement, challenge, and a vision sturdy enough to live by. If this resonates, share it with someone you love, subscribe for more thoughtful conversations, and leave a review to help others find the show.
There's something happening here, but what it is ain't exactly clear. There's a man with a gun over there. Telling me I got to beware. I think it's time we stop. Children, what's that sound? Everybody look what's going down. Nobody's right if everybody's wrong. Young people speak in their minds. I getting so much resistance from behind. Hey, what's that sound? Everybody look what's going down.
SPEAKER_12:Welcome to a show of faith where professor, priest, millennial, and rabbi discuss theology, philosophy, morality, and ethics, and anything else we feel like discussing. If you have any response to our topics or any comments regarding what we say, we'd love to hear from you. Email us at a show of faith1070 at gmail.com, a show of faith1070 at gmail.com. You can hear our shows again and again by listening pretty much anywhere podcasts are heard. Our priest is Father Mario Arroyo, retired pastor of St. Cyril of Alexandria and then 10,000 Black of Westheimer. Hello. Our professor is David Capes, Protestant Minister and Director of Academic Programming for the Lanier Theological Library.
SPEAKER_13:Here at Academy Force.
SPEAKER_12:Rudy Kong is our millennial systems engineer and has his master's degree in theology from the University of St. Thomas.
SPEAKER_14:Howdy, howdy.
SPEAKER_12:I'm Stuart Federal, retired rabbi of Congregation Sha'ar Hashaloon, the Clear Lake area of Houston, Texas. Miranda is our board operator, and she makes us sound fantastic. So welcome to a show of faith. Rudy, you're up.
SPEAKER_14:I think it is my turn.
SPEAKER_12:Your turn.
SPEAKER_14:And um good to hear you guys. I I was hoping you guys got to read. I I sent out a little snippet. And the reason I I picked it is because I was fortunate enough to have my brother and my niece and nephew, who specifically my nephew, who I had not met. And and uh he's seven months old and I got to hold him and carry. You know, it was it was it was a it was a great time. My mom came down, my siblings were down here, and and it's been a while since we were united, and and you know, I saw my brother and and of course he's he's with two toddlers, right? He's got uh a year and a half old and a seven month old. And so he's doing the whole airport thing, he's bringing luggage, the carriages, the whole thing, and it's just very, very stressful. Um you know, it's just a lot going on, and I also thought, because I've had some really great conversations with my brother about how he wants to raise his kids, how he wants to how would I say uh uh pass on his faith, right? His values, his morals. And and I guess it got me thinking for for this week, maybe it would be something interesting to talk about because I I know I know we've talked a lot about before in previous shows on the importance of of family and and marriage and specifically, right? We can quantitatively break down the positive effect that, for example, marriage and having a strong family uh family nucleus have on our culture. I can try to increase GDPs, I could try to um reduce uh uh uh neurological um uh um say depression, suicide, uh violent crime. I mean it's across the board the importance of of what having a table, not just marriage, but a family nucleus had for the individual. So I wanted to I wanted to first um I wanted to first talk about a little bit what our faith particularly would say um about family and how and how each of the each of our faith sort of views I think obviously I think we're gonna have to find a lot of in common. I think within Christianity we we kind of see the symbolism of of the Trinity in there as well, right? But uh I think there's a lot that we agree on that that we could say is is is a foundational block for our culture and for the way we see things today is rooted deeply within uh within the family, right?
SPEAKER_12:So so I wanted to talk a little bit about that first, if if that's okay, unless you guys want to you're the director, you go right ahead.
SPEAKER_14:I shall be directed. Yes, take control strong Ram, I think the the one that always gets me is in Jeremiah. Before I formed you in the womb, I knew you. And and so so this is this is an interesting this is an interesting verse because I think about this this act of creation, right? And before we are born into this world, we are a thought, if you will, in the mind of God. God is an eternal being, an eternal evidence, an eternal He is. He is, right? And so that means that we existed uniquely and have existed before for all of eternity. And so this this act of love sort of mimics the same act of love, parental love, that we that I would argue we find within a father and a mother. Right? It may not be that we completely planned all our children, right, as as my brother. As my brother did. He he had his first kid, and then uh it's funny because he called me one day and uh his his daughter is maybe eleven or twelve months old. He calls I think we in English they call him Irish twins, uh, when they're born within within a I haven't heard that term, but I've heard some like it.
SPEAKER_12:But yes, there's a name for when they're very, very, very close together.
SPEAKER_14:Yeah. So then so so he calls me one day and he's like, Rudy, I don't know what happened, man, but Allie's pregnant again, and I was like, Well, I think I know what happened, man. I know exactly what happened there, don't worry. Um but that's what I mean, it's it's not necessarily it's not necessarily that you would plan to to to have another child, but there's still a participation and an act of love um that that exists between um a woman and a man, right, that brought up that amount. So so can you and I guess I can let me start with you, Rabbit. Like what how do you see, especially and and I want to kind of focus a little bit biblically at first, right, is is the view the specific roles and and purposes that you find within the family that that you kind of have found that that helped guide you, form you, um inspire you, if you will?
SPEAKER_12:Sure. I I think that anybody who has a child, let me rephrase that, anybody who sees a child with parents and they'll say, Oh, he looks just like Aunt Gertrude, oh, he looks just like the mommy, oh he looks like the daddy, can understand that in the primary family verse in Genesis 1 that that family is paramount. That a uh a uh husband will leave his uh family and cleave to his wife and they shall become one flesh. And you see the one flesh in the children because even without the understanding DNA, you understand oh, that looks just like you know, Aunt Sally or whatever, Uncle Uncle Uncle Bert or whatever. So you you see from the very beginning that family is paramount, and I I I must tell you that with all of our fancy equipment and computers and cell phones and find a fact instantly from anywhere in the world, or statistics, or math, or AI now, I'm not really sure that love between husband and wife, love between parent and child, love between child and parent, I just don't know if that's changed that much. I I think the Bible, when it speaks of uh the the romantic element I th I see, maybe that's just projection, but that I see in the book of Ruth, between Ruth and Boaz, uh and the flirtation and the and the you know, even the movie romance of falling in love, I I just don't think it's changed that much over thousands of years. I think parents love their children, children I'm sorry?
SPEAKER_14:I would agree. I would agree, River.
SPEAKER_12:Now, what's changed is the culture in which we create those families, for lack of a better term. I mean, you know, in the ancient world you had matchmakers, and I'll refrain from singing, I'll save everybody's ears in our listening audience.
unknown:Okay.
SPEAKER_12:Thank you, Rabbi. You're very welcome, but I would normally start singing matchmaker, matchmaker. But uh the equivalent of a matchmaker now is you know, move the picture left, move the picture right, whatever that's called. What do they call it, you know, uh dating apps, okay, has become the new matchmaker. Probably a lot less successful at it, but nevertheless. I think that's what we've what what we rely on for matching now. Uh and before that it used to be what? Anything and everything to meet somebody. Either some a friend introduced you or you went to the you know, your religious services. I'm sorry, yeah. Community dances, like they're absolutely dancing. Community dances, or you know, the local class at your synagogue church, whatever, underwater basket weaving, and you'll find somebody of the same interests. So, but I I just everything is fancy now, but I just don't think that people have changed that much. I think the relationships are the same. But the culture that creates them creates the matches. I think that's what's changed. Um parenthetically, I think it's failing right now badly.
SPEAKER_07:I think you skipped, though, arranged marriages. Because there was quite a lot of arranged marriages in in Europe and in other places that were political and sociological in nature.
SPEAKER_12:And that's true.
SPEAKER_07:But ultimately speaking. Like in India and stuff like that.
SPEAKER_12:And I'm sure in many, many, many cultures throughout the world you've got them today.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah.
SPEAKER_12:But if there's no will to be in the marriage, no acceptance of it, for whatever reason, political or I I I can't say no to my mom and dad, or just my dad, whatever the reason, you're not going to stay in the marriage unless you want to be there. You're going to give in to the pressure, you're going to give in to the policy, you're going to give in to the money, you're going to give whatever it is. Okay, I just think that they are in the marriage because they want to be, ultimately. They're sacrificing themselves for family, unity, whatever. Okay.
SPEAKER_14:That's that's that's the point there, I think, Rabbi, that's important, is what you just mentioned is is sacrifice. And and I think that's maybe that concept is what because being in a family I I think requires sacrifice. I mean you sacrifice it's not a sacri a sacrifice of an individual, right? You don't get to you don't get to choose who you are born to, right? I think it's to choose my parents.
SPEAKER_12:And Rudy, I I think it's not just sacrifice I think it's also sacrifice to the relationship. Not just sacrifice to the person but sacrifice to the relationship. Where you know we when we talked about marriage, it comes up every so often. We're talking about being committed to the commitment. And I think the same thing is true with the sacrifice. You you you sacrifice for the other person, but you also sacrifice for the relationship between you two.
SPEAKER_14:Now, I I know we have to we have to go to break here in a minute, but I I'd like to move on. Father Mario, you uh you and and this I get from knowing you for a long time, but I know that you're you're you're very close with your siblings.
SPEAKER_07:Yes, we are.
SPEAKER_14:Um you were obviously closest with your mom and and with your parents. Um now you are a Catholic priest, and obviously unless you've been lying to us for a very long time. You have no children.
SPEAKER_07:Not that I know of.
SPEAKER_12:That's not so funny today.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah, well should I say none none that I have participated in.
SPEAKER_14:Um but when we come back, maybe I'd like to I'd like to kind of and I know we can talk about family kind of as a broader perspective, um, but I I'd like to kind of get your take and how you kind of you've seen its role and and within kind of forming the person that you are and and if it helped or not to to kind of towards you if you will, yeah.
SPEAKER_07:Happy to reflect on that. But that first let's go to a break. This is KNTH 1070, and we'll be right back.
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SPEAKER_12:It's in the recording somehow. Do everything Welcome back to a show of faith on AM107 the Answer.
SPEAKER_07:Uh you you asked me to reflect on the role, I guess, but what's the question, the role of my family?
SPEAKER_14:Yeah, I think so. The question, Father Mars, is is and maybe to pose it in the same way that I did to to the rabbi, is is within your upbringing upbringing, and not just as a Catholic priest, but but as a Catholic, I mean what what has been kind of your take, the things that have guided you, I would say, biblically, experientially, to maintain a closeness to to to your family.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah, you know, uh I I recognize that um my family, my m especially my mother, um uh she was extremely religious. And um I I really hated it. Um the the religious part. I mean I never uh I I went to Catholic school from all the from the time that I was a little boy all the way through high school. And uh mom you know called us and we had to go to mass every Sunday, whether we liked it or not. And uh I th there was a long time ago that uh one of my um teachers uh in theology said um Christianity is not taught. It is caught. It's very interesting because he he said that faith is not taught, it is caught. The way you are infected. It's almost like a a positive infection that you you catch it, but you don't teach it. Teaching it comes later, but catching it is is uh is not a part of education. But I I I think that that's what happened. I think my mom her inten her ferocity was a a ferocious Catholic.
unknown:Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_07:And um I think I I got infected uh by it. Uh I at first I didn't like the infection uh because it gave me a conscience. And when I was growing up I didn't particularly want to have a conscience. Um but but it it imprinted into me so much so that it turned me into the person that I am, because when my life fell apart, mm what was there, even though I kept rejecting it, was uh the re the me that I had learned to be formed by the gospel. And uh you know, and and just in terms of the uh of uh family, you know, Rudy, I'm not married and never have been. And so the other half of my um of my experience of family have been that I have gone a consciously, I've consciously tried in the priesthood to create a family. Uh not by any sort of uh marital or sexual activity, but I have friends that if you were to say to me, Who's your family, I I would include them. And it's interesting because that's what Jesus said is if you remember who is my mother, my brother and my sister, who those who listen to the word of God and keep it, that's my mother, my brother and my sister. And that's a very important part of my life as a celibate man. But yeah, but I have family is very, very important in my character development.
SPEAKER_14:You know, it it's interesting because because when you said something you said something interesting, it's it's caught, right? And yes. Um I wonder, and let me jump to I know we have to go to break here in in a um in a minute and and two minutes. Um but would you would you agree with that, David?
SPEAKER_13:Would you say that um obviously you're protesting and so we don't hold it against you, we still love you, but uh to some degree I mean, I just think I'm far too important just to leave for the last two minutes of an hour of uh we can get we can go to a break early.
SPEAKER_07:We can go to a break early.
SPEAKER_13:No, I'm just gonna be able to do it.
SPEAKER_07:But let's go to a break early, David.
SPEAKER_13:No, no, no, no.
SPEAKER_07:No, we only have one minute.
SPEAKER_13:Oh, let me let me just affirm really quickly what you were saying is that the family is the place where we are morally formed, where we're spiritually formed, where we're socially um and we're our values are formed. And the some people have a very dysfunctional family, and as a result, they're malformed or misformed. But but for many people, the family has been that place where we are where we learn faithfulness, where we learn our faith. Most people practice the faith that they were were born into. Um, in other words, the the r one of the reasons the rabbi is is Jewish is because his family was Jewish. One of the reasons you're Catholic, Father Mario, is because your your your mom was Catholic, likewise Protestant for me, etc. So these things really uh prove to be true. The same is also true for an atheist. A lot of people are atheists because their parents were atheist. So we we we find that we grow up and we become the people very often that our families have already always been.
SPEAKER_12:Could even be biblical, and that's give me a child who they're six years old in their mind forever.
SPEAKER_07:Interesting. We'll be right back after these wonderful messages. AM 1070, the answer.
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SPEAKER_02:Johnny Angel, how I want him. He's got something that I can't resist. But he doesn't even know that he shit. And how it's gonna be of a fellow scaling. But I just said and wait. I'd rather concentrate on Johnny Angel. Cause I love him. And I pray that someday may. And together we will see how lovely heaven will be. And together we will see how lovely heaven will be.
SPEAKER_12:Welcome back to a show of faith on AM107 of the Answer. We're talking tonight about the family guy with a great cartoon. No, I guess we're not talking about that. We're talking about family.
unknown:Family.
SPEAKER_14:David, so you were sharing with us um something, something quite true. There's there's a lot of function and and dysfunction that is learned within the family nucleus. And and I think I want where I wanted to kind of take this a little bit later on, and I'd like you to share a little bit more, is is where I see a lot of dysfunction culturally, and I read a lot of the statistics on decreased marriages, less children, less um attendance of worship services of any kind. Um to me it's all it's all tied together, right? I mean there's there's there's definitely a correlation there. I don't know if if you have any thoughts on this.
SPEAKER_13:Yeah, um, yeah. I I do think, I think Mario said it earlier that, yeah, I we we are or maybe a sewer, that that these families do exist in this cultural world that we live in, right? So we we aren't living in a vacuum in an ideal sort of world. We're living in a world that's very itself dysfunctional and very Very messed up. And a lot of these influences that I think impinge upon family, we are allowing more and more of those to enter into because we're not willing to sort of stick it out going together. Uh you know, the divorce rate is is fairly high still. Uh people aren't having children. I was in Slovakia a while back and I was talking with this woman. Slovakia is the eastern part of the Europe, and she was uh indicating, she said, well, she you know, she could have grown up with sort of the remnants of communism, uh, because they were behind the iron curtain. And she was talking about how that she was an atheist and that how she um uh and and she was talking about though she was married, she had no intention of having any children because she just really wanted to work and that kind of thing. And and I and I said to her, you know, it's it's kind of remarkable that uh that you're not a communist. And she said, Well, why is that? And I said, Well, you you believe pretty much everything communists do believe.
SPEAKER_12:Ooh, good point.
SPEAKER_13:You you don't believe in God, which is the philosophical basis of communism, and you also agree with Marx that you're real the your real significance is not not as a woman, as a human being, but as an economic cog in the wheel. And she didn't know what to do with me.
SPEAKER_12:Oh, David, that's perfect.
SPEAKER_13:Uh but it was exactly the kind of thing that now the reason she's atheist, I think, is is is because she grew up in an atheist time, a time of atheism.
SPEAKER_12:Another victory for communism.
SPEAKER_13:Well, the the the same thing, you know, can be said. So I think very often these political and and and I would even argue say are spiritual realities and uh that are around us, these uh malevolent spiritual realities are misshaping family and causing us to look elsewhere for uh for for family. Um and and uh it's not to say that we cannot find in in a band of brothers family on a in a war time of war, that we cannot find a band of brothers and sisters in a time of peace uh in the church and through the church and through religious organizations, but um I I do think that there is a special place that God has ordained the family to occupy.
SPEAKER_12:The foundation of society. Culture, ethics, morals get passed by, passed down, like you said. Do you remember it years ago? Ten years maybe, something like that, where we were talking about and this comes up every so often, but not nearly as much, I don't think, and that is that in order to be counterculture, in order to go against the grain of our society, you have to be religious. Being religious is being counterculture. And I think that's only become worse, and I think that that has been one of the main reasons why the family has suffered.
SPEAKER_07:Do you really think it's become worse? You know, lately I've just seen a kind of a turn back to religion. Yeah.
SPEAKER_12:Recently. Very recently, like one or two years and nothing more.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah, yeah. I think that had to do a lot with uh the the Trump election. Not that Trump had knit, but the fact that um all the the postmodern uh you know culture didn't work. Uh well I I think it it suffered a tremendously public rejection when Trump not only won the election, but see, I'm using the word Trump to really signify more of a conservative and more of a rejection of all the woke kind of stuff.
SPEAKER_12:But I think that his election was a symptom of that rejection. Yes, yeah. It did not create it, it was a symptom of it.
SPEAKER_07:Now, and then with the Charlie Kirk assassination and uh and the desperation of the left, I think, you know, and you're seeing signs of of a tremendous return to a more conservative culture.
SPEAKER_12:And I think that the good parts are not the bad parts.
SPEAKER_07:Me too. But I think family is going to be um uh going to make a kind of making a return, though, because they people see the disaster of the divorce culture and the lack of commitment. You know, I I read something the other day that really impressed me that we no longer look at people as people, but we look as individuals, but we looked at at them as the aggregates of their opinions.
SPEAKER_12:In in what way?
SPEAKER_07:Well, in the sense that you're a conservative or you're a liberal, you believe in abortion, you believe in this, you believe in that.
SPEAKER_12:That's identity colour, it's a identity.
SPEAKER_07:It's interesting because they call it an aggregate. People have been de uh depersonalized, and you are now an aggregate of your political opinions.
SPEAKER_12:But the political opinions represent the identity that you've taken. I I see the identity.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah, but but ultimately I think that the whole return to family, I th I think there will be a return to more uh and we're seeing it in the Catholic Church, and you know, with a tremendous uptick in um in people becoming Catholic. But I think and I think the Catholic Church, especially, but I think all Christian and Jewish we emphasize family.
SPEAKER_12:The Catholic community does.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah, but I think that the reason I just made that comment is because I think that they are the anti-religious or the secular community is f is starting to decrease in in popularity.
SPEAKER_14:I can only hope that's Father Martin. Um you know, in in Garnium It's fest, which is a Vatican document that came out during the Second Vatican Council, um, there's a there's this famous quote that family is the foundation of society.
SPEAKER_07:Yes.
SPEAKER_14:Now, a couple of things that were discussed there is this notion that family is also divinely ordained. So what I mean by that is that it's essentially written within our nature. It's written as a natural law.
SPEAKER_12:That's what I meant at the beginning of our show tonight. I I just think that there's a natural tendency, drive, whatever, to be in a family.
SPEAKER_07:Is there something wrong with Rabbi's microphone?
SPEAKER_12:Speak up in the mic up, Rabbi. I can't get it much closer than it is. I can barely hear him. All right.
SPEAKER_07:Well but anyway, David, you want to say anything about about that? And by the way, I was just gonna say too, this idea of the importance of family, and that is that in the Christian tradition, the very definition of God is family.
SPEAKER_12:In Christianity, yes.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah, that's what I'm saying. In Christianity, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, I mean, you're talking family. Uh so for us it's uh it it's an understanding of family as uh when God created us in his image and likeness, I understand it more not as an individual, although an individual it is, but also as family. David?
SPEAKER_13:Yeah, I no, I no, I agree that that the whole sort of picture of what we have of of God at developing a a people, div uh this is a family, this is a huge, huge extended family, right? And I think it's an extension of God Himself, but the idea that the people of God are an extension as too. I mean, they're all in a sense related. They're sons and daughters of Abraham and such. And and there's a there's a sense in which relationship becomes so so important. You know, uh in in uh in in many ways we've ceded uh family to to legal to the law, you know, family law and and and legal contracts, that kind of thing. And but but the the idea of family is more covenantal. Yes, there's an agreement, yes, there is the taking of promises and and vows and such, but it's a very morally serious kind of thing. It's it's not just a legal uh relationship. Now that's not to say that there haven't been legal relationship marriages, those kind of things, but by and large, marriage is meant to be uh this covenantal relational thing for which that that we where we get companionship to our lives, where yes, uh it you know we we have sexual expression, which means procreation, among other things. It's there's a procreative uh impact to that. Children do that's where they come from. And and but but it's not it's not to say that there are not other benefits from a sexual relationship. And and one of the things it does is it brings unity to the relationship, it brings unity to the people, they become better helpers with each other and better partners uh throughout life. So uh all all of this, I think, is an expression of ultimately God's who God is and God's disposition toward the things that He has created.
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SPEAKER_10:The nation of Israel is a resurrected nation. So what if there was going to be a resurrection of another people, an enemy people of Israel? The Bible speaks about this whole war as a dragon representing the enemy, attacking a woman representing Israel.
SPEAKER_15:Dragon's prophecy.
SPEAKER_08:The dragon will not prevail.
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SPEAKER_14:Another Rabbi Stuart. There's never gonna be another Father Mario.
SPEAKER_12:There's never gonna be a Thank God, I mean, you know, for small favors. Sorry, Mario, couldn't resist.
SPEAKER_14:But but it's it's interesting when when I start seeing the importance that that family has has placed, and and you touched a lot a little bit on it um earlier, Father Mario, is is I mean marriage and families were used in a way to to secure peace. They were the famous uh Battle of Troy, it was because of this this this person that took Helen, right? That that an entire armada of of Greek warships was was launched to invade. So it's been I don't want to say the cause, but but uh how would you say uh uh a precursor, if you will, to to kind of mold culture and war and and nations really for all of the time, right? I mean it's how tribes initially would secure peace within themselves is is uh when you look at the indigenous people here, for example, and and the Tehuatihua Canis, for example, of of the Mexican, um Mexico City area, right? They the their king would he would marry off his his daughters with neighboring tribal um groups to secure peace and their allegiance, right? So when when we stop seeing the importance that we find with family, with marriage, and and we think more individu individualistic about things, I think what what we find is where we find ourselves or have found ourselves for the last maybe 30, 40, 20 years, where it's this been this kind of hyper-individualistic mentality, and you know, I'm free to identify myself and to and to say that I'm whatever I want and and to to forget really who I am and where I come from. And I think it's this it's this ideology that is that has caused I mean not just damage economically, right? But also when I look at the suffering that happens, it it's it's put us into difficult stances, not only culturally, but even I would say with other nations. And so I guess I just I wanted to give you guys opinion on this, is is I know there's a resurgence, but are we too far down the road to be how do I say I don't want to use the word save, but but brought back, right? Is is there a chance for this movement, for this resurgence of family to to kind of take hold again, you know, for our cultures, especially in American society, to kind of go back and and to the I think there is to the care of others.
SPEAKER_07:I think there is a chance. I think there's a good chance of uh uh the cultures can change tremendously, and uh I think there's a tremendous chance of returning because w the the only the um a lie ultimately or something that is false cannot stay for long because it ultimately shows its own falsity.
SPEAKER_12:Right. It also it it shows its own weakness.
SPEAKER_07:Yeah, it shows so so if something is untrue, it will not stand for a long time. So I don't know.
SPEAKER_12:Plenty of things last for a long time.
SPEAKER_07:A long time, but they ultimately fall because they they don't have legs, they don't have any staying power. So David, you want to jump in there?
SPEAKER_13:Yeah, I I'm I'm pondering uh so some of the things Verdi was saying, but but uh with you I'm more optimistic uh these days than pessimistic. In part because uh probably some of the people that I know and uh the things that I'm I'm reading and hearing, I I do think that it takes time for cultures to rebound after they've gone down uh the wrong path for a while. Uh you you can't just make uh a 180 instantly. It takes a while to to make that turn. So I would I would think that we're we're looking at something that would be another generation.
SPEAKER_07:Oh yeah, if not two generations.
SPEAKER_13:Yeah, if not two generations down the way before we see some substantial growth and reestablishment of that. But hey, you know, we serve a pretty big God who can do some things miraculously and quickly, uh more quickly than than we've can we can imagine.
SPEAKER_12:And patiently too.
SPEAKER_13:Yeah, and indeed, indeed. But I but I I think it's I think it's a great uh great conversation tonight, Rudy, because all of us have experienced the strength I I think many of us have experienced the strength of family and what it can do for us and what it has done for us. And yes, there are dysfunctional families, yes there are uh that's the reason a lot of people are in therapy today, because of families. But at the same time, uh uh much of what we learn that is good and true and beautiful about the world, we learned through uh through our families. And so it's it's important I think to give thanks to God for those those fathers and mothers that we've had, whether they're here or or b they've gone beyond, um, it's it's important to give thanks for them.
SPEAKER_07:You know, I I really think that especially kids, I mean people who are in have grown up with difficult or horrible families, that somewhere inside them they have a sense of knowing what a sha family ought to be, and which is why they miss it. Because there's a sense of you you you kind of in inside of you, I think I this is my opinion that inside each of us we know what it means. Somehow you're born with a a sense of what it means to be loved. And you know its truth when you experience it, and you know the lie when you ex when you don't experience it.
SPEAKER_12:You know there's something wrong.
SPEAKER_07:Something's wrong. You can tell. I think that's an inborn quality that something is wrong because you hate it and it's it's not according to your nature. So I think I'm h I've have high hopes that human nature, because it's in the image and likeness of God, that it will uh somehow re uh reach out to God even when it is has experienced the exact opposite. It will reach for the truth of God because the truth of God is is i is uh sort of uh stamped in the depths of its soul.
SPEAKER_12:And because I think that is part of our nature, it's inevitable. And it may take two generations, like you were saying, yeah. But because it's embedded in every one of us, with or without the background, the history of it, it it will it will sink the light. It'll come back to the light.
SPEAKER_07:Yes. Yes.
SPEAKER_14:Well I think I think we can all agree that the fundamental aspects of of family are ingrained in our very soul, and they are inherently good, and the good that they then do to our culture and community is is I w many people would say unquantifiable, but honestly, the statistics and and data is is quite clear. The the effects that positive families have on our world is measurable and there is just fundamental greatness that comes out of them across the board. So have more families and have more kids is the message.
SPEAKER_13:Yeah, exactly. Well, some of the happiest people that I know are people that have a lot of kids, you know. Um, I mean, you know, the they some some have had one and they're happy and but but I know a lot of people that have had four, five, and six kids and such. And boy, they're tired. You know, boy, they're tired. But they they are tired and happy at the same time because they sense what they're doing is they are joining God and creating and bringing life and bringing vitality into the world. And you know, right now we're welcoming in immigrants from all over the world because we can't get people to do the work, in part because we've been having so few kids.
SPEAKER_07:Yep.
SPEAKER_13:Yep, right? So more and and and we see a number of countries that are really beginning to struggle because it's time, David.
SPEAKER_07:Sorry to take you away. It's just 1070. See you next week.
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