Joe Short - "Love Where You Live, Love What You Do"

What if the best leadership lesson starts with hauling your own kegs? We sit down with Shorts Brewing founder Joe Short to trace the arc from a teenage homebrewer in northern Michigan to a 22-year craft mainstay known for fearless creativity, consistent quality, and a culture people want to join. 

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Transcript

Welcome And Trip To Northern Michigan

John Broer 0:11

Welcome to all of our good friends out there in The Bosshole Transformation Nation. This is your host, John Broer, and I'm going to take you on a little trip today. That is a trip to the beautiful parts of northern Michigan where we go every summer, and I've been going up there my entire life. My father, my grandfather used to take us up there. But 22 years ago this spring, a young man by the name of Joe Short opened up a brewery. And you're going to get a chance to meet him today because this is one of, in my opinion, one of the best craft breweries that you will find anywhere. Great product, great people, great atmosphere. And you're going to learn more about Joe's entrepreneurial journey, more about his leadership style and the kind of culture he has really worked to develop at Short Brewing. So sit back and let's get a chance to meet Joe Short. Make sure to check out all the resources in the show notes and be sure to follow us and share your feedback. Enjoy today's episode. Joe Short, we've been trying to do this for the better part of a year, and it is great to have you on the Boss Hole Chronicles. Welcome. Thanks for being patient with me.

Joe Short 1:44

It's uh better late than never, I guess.

John Broer 1:46

No, no, it is it is great to have you here. And uh just for everybody's benefit, Joe is being safe. He is on the road, but we want to make sure that he's being safe. But uh was committed to being on the Boss Hole Chronicles. And uh really what I want to find out, Joe, this year represents, I think, 22 years at Shorts Brewing. Is that correct? That's right.

Joe Short 2:06

We turned 22 in April.

John Broer 2:09

Yep. And um for anybody that knows me, our sons who are in their 30s are fourth generation going up to Lake Bel Air, Michigan. An amazing place, just uh a very special place in the Brewer household. And 22 years ago, when Joe opened up Shorts Brewing at the old hardware store in Bel Air, Michigan, I remember I used to buy, my dad used to go there to buy his fishing license. And you have converted it into this amazing business. I'm gonna put all the show notes, all the information in the show notes about Shorts Brewing, and we want people to know more about it and the great story. But I want to talk about your leadership journey, Joe. What was the inspiration for starting out? And how would you characterize your leadership approach then and then now and and how you manage people?

From Hospitality Kid To Homebrewer

Joe Short 3:00

So, inspiration for starting out, I guess, was I say this a little differently every time, but um I really wanted to love what I did for a career and love where I live. And I dropped out of college to pursue a career in craft brewing, uh, knowing that um as a young man, I thought um now's the time to see if I can do this on my own. Okay. And I've got everything to gain and nothing to lose. And so if it doesn't work out, I'll go back to college.

John Broer 3:39

All right. So for all intents and purposes, your work history up until that point, would it have been just your typical work when you're in college or were you at a were you at a brewery and then it actually sort of kicked in that you want to start start your own thing?

Joe Short 3:57

So I started in the hospitality industry as a 14-year-old. And I I remained doing um restaurant work into my college years. And then as a 19-year-old, I taught myself how to make beer because I wasn't old enough to buy it yet. Okay. And that led to this obsession with craft beer that um kind of got me to drop out of school and then pursue a career in craft brewing as soon as I turned 21.

John Broer 4:30

Yeah.

Joe Short 4:31

From there, I I kind of began my journey working for a couple different breweries before I decided, like, hey, now's maybe a good time to see if I can do this out on my own.

John Broer 4:41

Okay. So that sounds like a classic entrepreneur founders sort of story, which is awesome. And then when you start, obviously you have to bring people on board. You didn't do it all by yourself, and then you know, started hiring or and and if I'm not mistaken, I know Leah, your wife, she actually she actually worked there for a while and you eventually got married, correct?

Founding The Brewery And Early Team

Joe Short 5:05

Yeah, that's correct. So we um we knew each other as teenagers and uh kind of reunited over one summer when she was kind of um post-college pre-career, came to work a summer for me at shorts, and then as the story goes, uh now I work for her. But that's not a bad story, not necessarily.

John Broer 5:30

No, no, it's a great story. Yeah. So tell me a little bit about when you realized, okay, this is this has got real traction. Because I remember again, not only was the beer is the beer great, and you had such an amazing spot there in the old hardware store, but the menu, you have been as attentive to the menu and the quality of the food and the atmosphere as you have the beer, but all of a sudden now you have employees. So did you have much management experience up to that point, or were you just sort of thrown into this leadership role by virtue of you know, founding Shorts Brewing?

Joe Short 6:07

Yeah, no real management experience. Um, largely it was uh just having people who were kind of interested in what I was doing, and then them asking me what I needed help with. Okay was really kind of how it started. And that kind of grew into uh they just uh the same model for really years and years, where we were just trying to figure out what was going on, how we were gonna do what we were doing. And I think you know, without that management experience, I was just kind of another coworker. I think one of the best compliments I've gotten from one of my long-term coworkers was that when I work at Shorts or I work for Joe, I don't feel like I'm working for Joe or at Shorts, I feel like I'm working for myself. And um that person is now in a in a leadership position, but it was kind of like we were all on the same team and everything was everyone's job, and you know, no one was above or below anything. It just you just did what you did needed to get done.

Hands-On Leadership And Culture

John Broer 7:10

You jumped in wired. Yeah, you jumped in for based on what was what was necessary. Well, you know, I think that and and let me give you a quick glimpse as to why I really wanted to have you on the program. It was not this past summer, it was two summers ago, and we were in the beer garden across from the the pub in Bel Air, and I see you just hauling around kegs. Okay. I mean, you are schlepping stuff all over the place. And this was uh, you know, an evening, and I mean that was packed. And I'm thinking, okay, this guy's name is on the building, and in a on a bunch of buildings, you got Elk Rapids, you got Bel Aaron, and you were there busting your hump. And my my sense is, Joe, is you know, you wouldn't ask anybody else to do something that you weren't willing to do yourself. And it seems like that's still pretty much a theme of the way you approach work. Now, am I wrong? Am I right? Tell me, tell me your perspective. Uh, you're absolutely right.

Joe Short 8:10

I mean, that's essentially kind of how Lee and I operate. The beer garden where you saw me is, you know, kind of a newer component of the Bel Air campus, if you will. And so being new, you know, working in it and figuring it out was a big part of kind of developing how the beer garden was working. So I I actually had to do all that work myself to understand what needed to be done and how it needed to be done.

John Broer 8:38

Right.

Joe Short 8:38

But yeah, so I've been kind of hands-on the beer garden ever since we got it up and running. I think we're going out four years now.

COVID Sparks The Beer Garden

John Broer 8:46

And and if I may, I thought I thought part of the genius of what you and the team did, that really stemmed out of uh or had its origin back in COVID. Because I remember um when COVID hit, we were up at the lake, and I think we came up in the fall. We usually try to come up a couple times a year. I mean, you opened the beer garden, uh, so there was social distancing, and it was absolutely ingenious. But I also realized, I mean, you know, the circumstances when when you you talk about the teamwork and jumping in when necessary, my guess is the beer garden was really a result of that very theme that you have at Shorts Brewing. It's like, man, we still got customers, patrons. How do we keep them safe given this whole COVID thing, and yet keep the business running? And and it was such a great spot, but I remember what it looked like. It was all on gravel, and now it's this it's this amazing beer garden, and it seems like everybody sort of jumped in with both feet to make that happen.

Joe Short 9:45

Yeah, so COVID was really the catalyst that kind of brought that together because the the pharmacy adjacent to us, you know, had claim on the on that parking lot, and we just kind of said, hey man, we we need to do something here because we got people that need work and they got bills to pay, and everyone else has got cabin fever. So we're just gonna have to take the the beer garden over. And it started with the Kegger campground. At that point, we weren't selling any draft beer because every place was closed, so we had this surplus of empty half barrels that we used to make 12 little campsites with. And then um we had little fire pits within those campsites and uh tables and chairs, and people could go to the pub and order through the to-go window, buy beer and food to go and firewood and have something to do, which was pretty cool. And then as COVID kind of faded, we kind of leaned into the idea of like, hey, this is uh actually a pretty useful space, especially when the pub's in full swing and there's a lot of people waiting for tables. Now we can give them a place to hang out and they can have a beer and have something to do while they're waiting for their table.

John Broer 11:10

Yeah. Games, trivia, music, all kinds of stuff over there now that you've got the stage, which and it's just and actually I think people, well, people go there primarily. I mean, it that's become a destination in addition to the pub itself. So, Joe, let me ask you this. In 22 years, again, great story, an amazing story in a beautiful part of the country that holds a very special place for our family. If you were to talk to yourself 22 years ago, when you decided, I'm gonna, I'm gonna step out and do this on my own, when it comes to being a business owner and a business leader, what are a couple of things, or for any entrepreneur, lessons that you've learned that you would say, hey, if I could do it differently, I would do this. Or listen, make sure I, you know, these are two or three things that you absolutely have to make sure are in place. What kind of wisdom could you pass along after these 22 years?

Turning Crisis Into Community Space

Lessons From 22 Years Leading

Joe Short 12:07

And I I still think I'm trying to figure it out. But um I mean, I think I think the older I get or every year that I have under my belt, you know, I I realize that my line of work or anybody who's in a position of entrepreneurship or leadership, those roles are inherently stressful due due to a lot of different factors, whether it's cash flow or staffing or unpredictable scenarios, uh maintenance malfunctions, late nights, early mornings, trying to do it while you're raising a family, all those things. We tell ourselves every year that it's um it's not any easier, it's just different hard. Yeah, so if I was to tell myself anything back then and and being an emotional person and somebody who's like really passionate about stuff, like that's kind of a blessing and a curse because like that that energy and that passion, that love really attracts people to your business. Sure. Yeah, so when you're a passionate person, and I would like to think like entrepreneurs are because that's what excites them about doing stuff, uh you know, kind of carving their own way out into the uh the world of free enterprise. Um the same can be true if you're not having a good time with it. And learning how to temper my expectations or my frustrations with my team because I'm telling myself that um they don't live the same life I live, so their level of stress, their their level of job fulfillment uh or enjoyment, like it's all way different than mine. So you need to remember that you know, even if it's with the person or with an outside scenario, that at the end of the day, what you're trying to do is something fun, and this needs to be a fun place to work, and people wanna have you know, you you want this to be a place where people want to come to work.

John Broer 14:17

Right.

Joe Short 14:18

And so if you're having a bad day, keep that in mind because people don't want to be around you when you're having a bad day. Yeah, and that's good, champion champion the good things, but you know, in the same breath, like you don't want to be the kind of boss who's telling everybody they're doing a great job when they're not, because that's not good either. So really pick and choose when you're gonna have tough conversations where your temperament's gonna be manageable, and you know, make sure you keep the hype level high, keep the excitement level high, keep people excited about coming to work and working with you.

Managing Intensity And Tough Talks

John Broer 14:59

You know, it in our company, so the Boss Hole Chronicles is is something that we do. Our actual consulting company, um, it's called Real Good Ventures, but we focus on our mission is to help people find meaning and fulfillment in their work. That is our number one mission. We just we happen to help our clients do that in a lot of different ways. But one of the primary things that we talk about are managers and supervisors and leaders. And like it or not, you're in a fishbowl. And so as an entrepreneur, I mean, you are, you're right. You're faced with, you know, the balance sheets and supply chain and all this other stuff that other people may not see, yet you want to show up in authenticity, but also not alienate your folks. And I think that that is so helpful because like it or not, there are a lot of eyes on you always, because you you set the tone. And that tone, you just want to make sure it doesn't drop below the line. But I'm I'm yeah, so let me ask you a question, Joe, for you. If you feel like you're, you know, going a little bit negative, how do you deal with that? I mean, you know, just to make, you know, it's like, listen, if I have to step away, because I if I have to have this conversation right now, it's not gonna go well. So how do you personally manage that or mitigate, you know, possible bosshole tendencies? And I'm not calling you a bosshole, by the way, but you know what I mean.

Joe Short 16:20

Yeah, well, you know, I'm fortunate is that I've got um some executive coworkers, my partner, Scott, and my wife Leah, and some of my other executive team members, we're kind of in a collective team who tackle a lot of you know, the things that may dovetail into boss holism, if you will, right? So the main thing I try to try to keep in mind is that I'm a walk-in-through facility, if I see something I don't like, I just make a mental note. Okay. And then I try to process it and work with the team members associated with whatever it is I'm taking issue with, and then try to have constructive um conversations around that at a later time.

John Broer 17:03

Right.

Joe Short 17:04

So if there's something I'm struggling with on a higher level, I can always bounce it off Scott or Leah and they'll also be the first people to be like, you don't want to talk uh not now is not the time or place to address this kind of thing.

John Broer 17:18

That's a har that's hard to do though. That is really I for me, I mean my temperament, I know it's hard. I get the sense that you're a a bit more composed and relaxed than I am. Um, but that can still be really difficult.

Values, Accountability, And Quality

Joe Short 17:32

Yeah, I mean I I operate in a high level of intensity, whether it's you know, super exciting, fun type stuff, but it's regardless, intensity can be the same across the board for me. Um so if I'm really passionate or really upset, like that can also be super intense. Um but I I have tried to create a structure over the years where like again, I I take notes um and we have regular meetings with our leadership teams, and so those notes will end up or not, but more more often than not in a meeting discussion where I will have had either hours or days or weeks before uh they're discussed, depending on the nature of whatever the issue might be.

John Broer 18:22

Right, right.

Joe Short 18:23

And normally those aren't one-on-one meetings, they're usually two or three people in a meeting where it's like, okay, well, you know, on this meeting agenda, here's one bullet that um we need to discuss. And it's try to save it so it's more of a constructive thing and really work backwards from like why there's an issue in the first place. Yeah, it might be like, well, because um, you know, we really pride ourselves on quality and consistency. And if you work backwards from these pillars of our core values, then you'll understand that this doesn't align with that, or X, Y, or Z doesn't align with that. And that's why there's why I'm taking issue, or that's why we're having a discussion about it now.

John Broer 19:08

Right. So what I hear in that too, Joe, is is shared leadership uh and accountability, which um again, for some entrepreneurs is really hard to do. The the relinquishing control or at least sharing control can be really challenging. And one other thing that I wanted to point out that I think is so admirable about how Shorts, the atmosphere and the culture of Shorts, and and again, to our listeners, go into the show notes, read the story, learn about you know the fearless creativity and loving what you do and loving where you live is all part of the culture. But you're in northern Michigan, and so the the labor pool up there is considerably smaller. I'm in Columbus, Ohio. You know, you've got to deal with you can't afford not to have a a place that is appealing and attractive and still realistic because your pool of of people is generally smaller. I'm I would think that's still the case.

Hiring In A Small Labor Market

Joe Short 20:04

Uh it is, especially um when we need to ramp up for seasonal stuff. But you know, fortunately, our our full-time year-round team is, you know, the turnover is very low. I'd like to think that we're a good employer and and we have you know competitive wages, and you know, we provide a good working experience enough so where uh our team recognizes that and uh enjoys the fact that they can have a a really fulfilling career and be able to live and work in northern Michigan with some pretty decent folks.

John Broer 20:41

Yeah, who love what they do and they do it so well. And I'm telling you, you know that there are a bazillion craft breweries around the country, and I know that you are are truly committed to the craft because you travel. I know that this past summer when we tried to connect, you were I think you well, you were at a conference, craft brewing conference, and you you stay in the mix, you stay in the community just to better what's going on. But let me ask you this, and we'll we'll wrap things up now, Joe. But I and I again I certainly appreciate this time.

Joe Short 21:12

Oh, yeah, I got plenty of time. I got seven and a half hours to go.

Psychological Safety And Growth

John Broer 21:18

Well, I I've got poker night tonight at our house, and by the way, there are four shorts brews that are in the fridge uh specifically. So yeah, there always are, but my my supply is running low uh from this past October when we were up there. Anyway, one of the other things you talk about when you when you think about your senior leadership and your executives, um, or I'll just say senior leadership, coming together, having those discussions, you know, putting these issues on the table. You know, there's something we talk about in our our world called psychological safety. And it's it's become a bit of a punchline lately, which is unfortunate, because what it measures, what it talks about, and we can measure this on a team, is the level of trust and uh honesty or openness that That people can have even about mistakes. So, in other words, it's about destigmatizing failure. If I've done something wrong or there's something wrong, we can talk about it and there's no retribution. And it sounds like you have cultivated and created that really safe environment, which is commendable, and that's not easy to do. I don't want to put words in your mouth, but that's what it sounds like.

Joe Short 22:21

Yeah, that's um it's definitely been a work in progress for us, but it's been especially true as of late, as we are now de you know, developing sort of a middle management team. And, you know, one of the things um I think Scott said it best was like you should be happy that we're sitting down and talking about you know something that might be a potential write-up because we want you to have this feedback and we care about your development and we want you to grow and learn. And the only way we can do that is that if we hold you accountable for, you know, missing the mark or whatever. So know that really when we have these sit-downs, it's because we care a lot about you and your development and you know, the future of your career.

John Broer 23:10

Absolutely.

Joe Short 23:11

So we should should be excited about it, really, to some degree. I mean, obviously, there's gonna be a level of disappointment because for whatever reason we're sitting down to discuss it, but um the fact that we're sitting down to discuss it is the most important thing.

John Broer 23:25

Absolutely. And now, coming into their almost 22nd anniversary, you've got just shy of almost 180 employees. Is that correct?

Joe Short 23:35

Uh it ramps up considerably in the peak season, where I think we carry an average up, yeah, probably close to 180 peak season. And then probably closer to 125 year round.

John Broer 23:47

Does that blow your mind?

Joe Short 23:49

It really does.

Team Size, Seasons, And Scale

John Broer 23:51

It's so cool. Oh my gosh. Yeah. I mean, think about that origin story, and it's like, man, I have I have the privilege of having these 125 up to 180 people working within my my sphere. That is so cool. Well, Jill, one more, one more question. What do you see for yourself in terms of growing as a leader? I mean, maybe that sounds cliche, but what do the next 22 years look like?

Evolving Into Mentor And Guide

Joe Short 24:19

Well, I'm I'm I'm kind of at an interesting, I I would say maybe transition as far as you know, where I'm at in my career and where the crap beer industry is and where I'm at as uh like a husband and father, right? So my kids are at an age where they're working more in the business. And I like to see myself in, I guess, my leadership evolution being more of a consultant to uh not only my kids, but the short screwing team and the management team that we're developing now. So I can look to maybe taking a step or two back and being more of a a person who's helped guiding the vision and whatever the next generation is gonna do with uh the the company.

John Broer 25:10

Yeah.

Joe Short 25:12

Being uh kind of a core support um to share not only to maintain our our level of shorts growing DNA, but to really just kind of pass on what I know. And when you do that, you're also learning from other people too. So of course. You know, my kids are both teenagers now, and I'm learning a ton from them painfully, uh, because it's it's telling me that I'm you know I'm getting older.

John Broer 25:39

And oh, tell me about it. That's right.

Joe Short 25:42

Interesting, interesting place to be.

John Broer 25:45

Yeah. Where does where does AI fit in with craft brewing? Um, don't that's a rhetorical, stupid question. I mean, but you know, I mean, that's we we have that all the time. Those questions with our clients is like, what is AI gonna do? And it's like, man, just don't just don't mess up shorts brewing. I just don't want that to happen. So yeah. Joe, is there anything we didn't talk about that you would have wanted to share with our audience?

Parting Wisdom And Closing

Joe Short 26:07

Man, those are um those are always good follow-up questions, but I always like to leave it as like, you know, life is shorts, drink it while you're here. You never know what tomorrow's gonna bring. You know, take advantage of uh every day, love where you live, love what you do, uh, be a good human, leave the world better than you found it. You know, we we we get one chance at this and it shouldn't be lost on anybody.

John Broer 26:32

Great wisdom, and I appreciate that. Joe, listen, um I you know if we can have you back, that'd be awesome. I would I would love nothing more than to hear how perhaps this coaching and this mentoring evolves for you. But listen, I really appreciate the time. Be very safe on your continued journey back to northern Michigan. So listen, everybody, uh, make sure you check out the show notes, learn more about this amazing craft brewery in northern Michigan and a personal favorite of ours. And we will see you next time on the Bosshole Chronicles. Thanks very much for checking out this episode of the Fox Hole Chronicles. It was so good to have you here. And if you have your own Fosshole story that you want to share with the Fosshole Transformation Nation, just reach out. You can email us at mystory at the Fosshole Chronicles.com. Again, my story at the Fossbull Chronicles.com. We'll see you next time.