The Heart of Hope - Antowan Hallmon Sr

If you want to get a super charge of hope and faith in something bigger than yourself, sit down and talk with Antowan Hallmon for an hour or so (Even just 20 minutes if you're rushed for time).  He is sincerely one of the kindest and most gracious people I have ever met.  He is also genuinely interested in knowing peplfinding ways to care for them and meeting their needs whenever possible.  He also just happens to be a Christian Pastor of the Faithworks ministries in Baraboo Wisconsin.  Faithworks is a 100% virtual, non-denominational church and if you listen to our conversation, you'll find out what that means and how a kid that grew up in taverns ended up becoming an on-fire minister.  A minister that tries to just get people to focus on Jesus Christ and getting to know Him, then getting out of the way of Christ's work in those people.  It's not about church, it's about a person and getting to know Him.

Antowan J. Hallmon Sr is the Founder and Senior Pastor of FaithWorks Ministries (FWM) in Baraboo, WI.  Pastor Antowan was born in Chicago, IL.  He grew up between Chicago, IL, Lakeland, FL, and Madison, WI.    Pastor Antowan has 25+ years of restaurant/service industry experience and has managed restaurants across the country in Boston, Los Angeles, Phoenix, and Madison, WI.

In 2008 Pastor Antowan gave his life to Jesus Christ after a life changing accident, and in 2011 dedicated his life to ministry.  He learned ministry and God granted him tremendous spiritual growth under the spiritual leadership of his spiritual father Pastor Matt Fearson at Hope Through Christ Ministries. 

If you want to check out Pastor Hallmon's Sunday services you can find the live link for Sunday morning's at 10am here: Calendar - FaithWorks Ministries (fwministries.com)

Thanks for listening. Please check out our website at www.forsauk.com to hear great conversations on topics that need to be talked about. In these times of intense polarization we all need to find time to expand our Frame of Reference.

Transcript

Announcer: 0:04

Welcome to frame of reference informed intelligent conversations about the issues and challenges facing everyone in today's world, in depth interviews with salt counties, leaders and professionals to help you expand and inform your frame of reference brought to you by the max FM digital network. Now, here's your host, Rauel LaBreche.

Rauel LaBreche: 0:26

Welcome to another episode of frame of reference, talk County and beyond. And we're going to Sauk County today. But my guest today is someone that has experiences that go way beyond sock County, so and it's someone that I've never interviewed before, which is always exciting for me on this show. Not only do I get to talk with people that I know want to have some idea of their expertise, but people like Today's guests are just in a whole different caliber, not only because I've never talked to them in this format before, but also as I get to know more and more about them, I start to think, Oh, this is going to be fun. And today is one of those days people. So if you've managed to tune in or download this episode, you get ready to rock and roll here because my guest today is Antoine Holman senior Antoine is the pastor of faith works ministries, which is an organization in Baraboo, Wisconsin, but he's been associated with a variety of of ministries. And I was really happy to find out before this, that he had an extensive career managing jazz clubs. And what he doesn't know about me is I'm a huge jazz fan. So I'm going to get picking his mind about you know, favorite jazz artists and, and favorite albums and all that good stuff too. So if you're a jazz person, and you're someone that wants to know more about how ministry works and how people get into it. Today's your show, Antoine, thank you so much for joining me very

Antowan Hallmon: 1:47

welcome, Joe. Thanks for having me.

Rauel LaBreche: 1:48

It's, it's like I said, Great to have you here. Great to I'm just excited as we were talking before, folks before I started recording. And you know, we just started going and that to me is always a good sign that we're not going to have any problems following up the podcast. Absolutely. So it was organic. Yeah, exactly. You got to go where the conversation goes. Right. And Tom, tell us a little bit about yourself. let the audience know who's Antoine Holman and how did you get to where you are?

Antowan Hallmon: 2:17

Okay, just try to make a long story short, I've shared my testimony all over the all over the place, and sometimes to my own detriment to anyone else. out there. Yeah. It just, uh, yeah, my name is Antoine Hall. I'm a senior I was born in Chicago, Illinois. I grew up in Lakeland, Florida, moved to Madison, Wisconsin, my sophomore year of high school, which was 1989. And, of course, I course over that time, I just started develop a heart for service. And that led me into restaurant nightclub management, which took me on a journey from Boston la Fenix back to Boston, then I moved back to Madison in 2006, where I finished up my journey as a member of the management team at the nitty gritty downtown Madison. Okay,

Rauel LaBreche: 2:59

so when you're doing that sort of thing, how does that work? I mean, are you at one club in say Boston and somebody you find out about another job that's opened in LA or whatnot, is that you kind of through the grapevine, if you will,

Antowan Hallmon: 3:11

it was pretty much just that, you know, it was a single dad at the time. So I'm just like, You know what, let's just go kind of course, it's like I had never really traveled, you know, other than to like, say family places like Mississippi, Memphis and Florida, places like that. But it just like when the opportunity arose, I was a single dad, it's like, let's just go. Okay, and so Boston Marathon if you remember the old monster.com Yeah, I remember monster dasa where a lot of the job leads will come from it. And of course, it's funny. One thing I learned that in my travels is always someone in another city that knows someone in another city. Yeah. And of course, when you dealing with the nightlife and you dealing with that particular kind of life, someone always knows someone. Well, yeah, I

Rauel LaBreche: 3:50

mean, jazz artists, they play with people all over the country, you know, sit in on a session or, you know, we're gonna do this gig at suction suction and you're in town. Hey, come play with us. Whatever.

Antowan Hallmon: 4:00

Just a little clarity wasn't just all jazz clubs. It was a high volume nightclubs. This is my one place that I've managed to actually in Burbank, California was called Fantasia Billiards. And it was right down the street from NBC and Warner Brothers. So it was like we got a high dose of celebrities. I got to shake a lot of good hands. And it was just it was just a it's been a great journey. Life has been good.

Rauel LaBreche: 4:21

Okay, so now you mentioned that what's one of your fondest memories of a celebrity you've met that you went, Oh, there's a really good person here.

Antowan Hallmon: 4:28

Oh, let's see. Check. Meeting him in person. Really. Not only was of course you hear the stories of him being a great tipper, but he really is because he took care of the staff, but he actually came and shook my hand because he was like, Man, you run it, you run a good ship, and sort of get a compliment from him on the organization of how things were flowing. It was huge

Rauel LaBreche: 4:47

when he's like huge tours. I mean, yeah, man, like six checks or something. No, he's

Antowan Hallmon: 4:51

seven foot. He's seven foot two and of course, probably come to his hip. So it's like looking up but I'm standing back I can't.

Rauel LaBreche: 5:01

And he's not like a lot of basketball players where they're tall and thin. He's taller than me.

Antowan Hallmon: 5:05

I mean, as massive. I mean, it's like, me and my shadow consumed.

Rauel LaBreche: 5:12

My biggest set of clothing, right? Yeah. So

Antowan Hallmon: 5:15

another good interaction with Andre 3000 of outcasts. Just so happened, that happened to be one of my favorite rap groups back when, okay, and so meet Andre 3000. And even as he is on stage, or in the videos, he was in person, okay. And it also was like, flamboyant. It was feathers and no, it was like, alright, so it was just a good vibe.

Rauel LaBreche: 5:38

So what's the what's the, I guess the tone of places like that? I mean, did you ever feel like this was just too rowdy or too crazy? Or did you find that in general, people were just having a good time. And it was a good, like you said vibe, you know, so would you still be doing it today? hadn't had the Lord not called you to do something else?

Antowan Hallmon: 5:59

Yes. And of course, it's funny how to look when we don't hear the calling. Clearly the Lord will do whatever he has to do to get your attention. But yes, it's just like a service again, is always just kind of been a part of me. And, you know, even prior to how I came to know the nightlife is no course my mother. She was a dancer when I say dancer, skin dancer. And so when I was a kid I grew up behind. I was grew up behind the bar on a barstool and my my father is a

Rauel LaBreche: 6:32

pain. There's all kinds of stories of people that did not have your life, having gone through that life.

Antowan Hallmon: 6:37

And, of course, my father's parents, they owned a tavern in Chicago. So when I was with him, I was on a barstool behind the bar. And so that was normal for you. You just learned all the rackets that are involved in the course of life journey, you begin to partake in some of those rackets, insurances life lessons. Yeah,

Rauel LaBreche: 6:57

yeah. What what what drew you out? What was there like a decisive event? Or was it God just working on you over time saying, yeah, there's, this just isn't right for me. I got to do something else.

Antowan Hallmon: 7:07

Well, of course, it happened when I had a life changing event in 2008. I fell down some stairs and I broke my neck. Okay. And it's true. They say when you have a life event like that, that's when you go crawl to the Lord. Oh, help me now. Please. Yeah, foxhole conversions, right? Yes, yeah. And, of course, it was a group of people came and pray for me in the church. It was a capital land in Verona. Some people came in, pray for me, and I got to know kind of attached to one of the associate pastors, okay. And then of course, I just my knowledge of Christ, and just my love for His word just started to grow. Okay. And, of course, in that course of that journey, we came to a revival in wearable and I fell in love with the little small, quaint church there. Okay. And I just started coming from Madison and barebow, every Sunday, every Wednesday and in May of 2011. I just moved up here for good. Okay.

Rauel LaBreche: 7:59

So strange and mysterious ways. Right? Right. So well, I'm trying to I always, I think I warned you ahead of time, I gave you the Shido things to look at, right? Yeah, I tried to start with my favorite things. And that's again, just, I think, a way for people to get to know the person I'm talking with. And hopefully somebody goes, Oh, that's my favorite do that can do nothing. But you know, bring us close to each other. Right? Yeah. So okay, so let's start. This will probably be easy. Favorite recording artist,

Antowan Hallmon: 8:26

favorite recording artists all time? Stevie Wonder. Stevie Wonder, Stevie. Stevie Wonder, because it's like, is very few artists. I mean, there's a lot of great arts throughout history, but it's like, I cannot think of one song he has made that I did not like, okay, so Stevie Wonder. Okay. Yeah.

Rauel LaBreche: 8:42

It's hard to argue with that one, too. I mean, you know, you think of the things that he's overcome, to become as great of an artist as he is. And he's got, I mean, he's just, like, tuned into so many different kinds of music, too, which is just, that's what I've always loved about his stuff is like, that's such a different sound than what he did this last time and an album or whatever, right? Uh,

Antowan Hallmon: 9:02

yeah. And just of course, that he was always in tune with the time Yeah, even back, say when he the 60s 70s. And, of course, no indivision songs on key life, you know, and so he was always in tune with what was going on at the time. Okay. And so that just made him even at that time, he was probably more progressive, because he talked out in song about some of the things that were going on. Yeah, just even just being just a music lover just again, just like I hadn't heard a bad song from him. Okay.

Rauel LaBreche: 9:30

Yeah, I kind of you know, you made this connection. And I don't know enough about the music to know for sure. But you talk about the messages of his song. Do you do you think that might have been have some roots to where rap came from as well? I mean, the kinds of messages that he was doing was that a route to what happened later with with rap?

Antowan Hallmon: 9:48

Oh, yeah. And of course, like, you know, I think all a lot of the older music has influenced rap because you know, and then of course, some forms of rap, I should say, Sure. No, because I know like, some rappers are Do you call them those conscious rappers? Okay rap about environment, they rap about issues they rap about, you know, humility and things like that and our party rappers and then some are just a, Hey,

Rauel LaBreche: 10:13

make as much money as I can. I want to talk about my lifestyle which a pretty.

Antowan Hallmon: 10:17

Have you heard? Have you ever heard a loop? Don't stop getting it.

Rauel LaBreche: 10:23

And we know what? Read yeah, there's no denying. So Okay, how about our favorite thing to do when you have some free time,

Antowan Hallmon: 10:31

listen to music, again, listening to music. It just when it comes to music, I love all kinds of music. So I'm pretty much open to that. And of course, I've shared with a lot of people even in like, in my skill class, I shared the fact that I like to collect vinyl, you know, so it's like, when I go to Madison, or if I'm in another city, I'm like, let's find a record store. Just see what they got. Right? Right. So just but yeah, music,

Rauel LaBreche: 10:55

that's really become a thing, too. Isn't it interesting how when I remember when CDs came out, I was in graduate school, I think what so this is probably the early 80s, late 70s, early 80s. And, boy, we were all so like, oh man shoot is so much better. You know, it's like, get rid of your vinyl. You know, and you know, like, okay, and I went along with the crowd, I got all these CDs. And at one point What an idiot I threw out so much vinyl. That was like, you know why? Part of mine too was like church oriented, where people like, you know, you can't be listening to that kind of music. I'm like, What is Emerson Lake and Palmer? What would you mean? You know, or, or it would be, you know, at that point didn't have a whole lot of jazz albums. Probably some Coltrane and Phil woods or something like that. Okay, but anyways, but now vinyl is like if you really like music you on vinyl,

Antowan Hallmon: 11:46

right? Oh, yeah. And it just you pick up everything that you see, of course, I grew up. Let's see I born in 73. So I grew up in the 80s. So no, corsia is funny. We were talking about rap a second ago before rap really hit No, we used to listen to stuff like Duran Duran and total. You get the answer. Yeah, you just again, where the love of music came about, you know, and just because it's like a music. It's like a timestamp. You know, like, when that song came out? I remember what I was doing. Right. You know, and,

Rauel LaBreche: 12:18

yeah, it's, it's interesting to me, too, that, you know, music I think in the arts in general are really great. unifiers. You know, because when you go to a crowd, you know, and I think there are some kinds of musics that, that don't appeal to as wide a spectrum of people, you know. But there are other types, like jazz, I think, is one of those great unifiers, where you see all kinds of, you know, sizes and shapes and colors of folks at a jazz concert, because it just, it does something to pull us all together, right? Oh, absolutely.

Antowan Hallmon: 12:47

Like say, uh, you know, you go to a, like a jazz club in Boston, you know, you got everybody from the mayor down to the guy that works at the local factory. And they're just sitting there. vibing Yeah, is about the environment, the music. And of course, when you're talking about jazz, it's gonna take you to a different place. Yeah. And, you know, of course, some people use muted music for motivation and whatever have you. But sure, me, jazz is just, that's my, how you say, is equivalent to My silent prayer. That's why there's like the reset for me. Well, it's

Rauel LaBreche: 13:18

interesting because jazz, so much of jazz is instrumental, ranted, there's, you know, lots of stuff that's got lyrics to it as well. But I've always gravitated towards the instrumental stuff, because you can feel what's going on in the lead licks, in particular, you know, anyone out there doesn't listen to jazz, you need to get some jazz. And so, but it is, it's, you know, I agree with you, there's kind of a meditative quality there, because you can lose yourself in the Lexx, you know, you can move yourself in the subtle things that are going on with the guys that are on the backline. And you know, who's doing the lead work, and then the way that they trade, you know, when you do the, you know, trading eights, or whatever kinds of things, and you just hear each of those musicians kind of adding their own little flair and giving something, taking something from the previous lick and adding something more to it. And it just, yeah, it's it's just such a cool communication process. And, yeah, I hear you.

Antowan Hallmon: 14:12

And of course, I like in course, my journey, like I was saying, managing all these various types of clubs and bars, you know, it's like a jazz musicians were the coolest to actually work with, of course, during the break, they were like, Hey, let's step outside for a second, then. Of course, knowing during the summer were a little more egotistic. They thought too highly of themselves, too. And it's like, you're not really that good. But yeah, but

Rauel LaBreche: 14:35

it's everywhere, right? A legend in their own mind versus the guy. I mean, you know, you hear stories about Louis Armstrong and he was one of the sweetest, most humble man and you know, if anyone had a reason to have, you know, stick up as you know, where, and an attitude. I mean, you think of what Louis put up with early on in his career, even into the later part of his career, you know, so what about it so of all the jazz musicians you met? What who is your what's your

Antowan Hallmon: 15:00

Before they were all local artists like say, but like in Boston, you know, I met Paulo Denae Tracy immers. I believe her name Tracy immers. And she was just she had a beautiful voice and it was just the see. There were so many Oh my goodness. Use the book these guys. Oh my goodness.

Rauel LaBreche: 15:21

That's the thing though, right? Yeah, get away from it. It's just like, it's not my vocabulary anymore. I

Antowan Hallmon: 15:27

Paulo Denae he strung out he stuck out the most. I mean, he was just he was a Brazilian or something like that. And I tell you when they hit the stage, and he got on that Sax Man, it was just something else in your voice. Yeah, it just people start standing up. Yeah. And it was just a it was again, he just created an environment.

Rauel LaBreche: 15:45

Yeah. I think of soul. Have you seen that movie? The Pixar movie? So it's, it's about the concerts? Yeah. Well, it's, they're, they're following this musician, who is like a middle school teacher. And he but he's always he's wanted to be a jazz artist, but never got his professional break. So and I forget, gosh, who's the really famous actor is the voice for him. But then I am so horrible with names Antoine. The guy that's the lead musician for Stephen Colbert band just won a bunch of Emmys to quest love. Yeah, no, no, no quest loves with other. P And

Antowan Hallmon: 16:24

Stephen Colbert. Okay, I don't watch that show. Okay.

Rauel LaBreche: 16:27

He's a pianist. Oh, goodness, gracious, my, my daughter is going to kill me because she and I listen to music all the time. But he does the piano thing in it. And at one point, he's playing with this woman who's a jazz saxophone player. And he, he ends up coming in sub and because the regular piano player is missing, and he comes in and starts playing and he just gets lost in the zone. And the woman who is just like really hardcore jazz, you know, a saxophone is looks at him after he comes out of the zone. And she's like, Dude, where have you been? From that point he gets to play. So it transports us. Yeah, I hadn't seen that. So okay, well, I'll get you lined up with that because you with your background, you'd really enjoy it. So And besides it's Pixar. So you know, you can't go wrong. Right? Absolutely. So how about a favorite book,

Antowan Hallmon: 17:17

a favorite book. There's a book called innovative prayer leader by see Terrell Weitz. Okay. And I'm actually a part of one of his prayer classes. Okay. And he is actually the prayer intercessory, leader of the church that is ours, our spiritual covering, which is New Life Covenant Church SE. Okay. So but yeah, innovative prayer leader, just talking about being a leader in prayer in your church? And of course, because because, again, the church without prayer, I don't know what the I don't know what to tell you. Yeah. If you're not in prayer, you how are you going to get revelation?

Rauel LaBreche: 17:51

Well, and it's so strange, isn't it with some prayer. I mean, I came up with a Catholic faith, and then, you know, slowly moved into, like Pentecostal background and evangelical backgrounds. And it, it struck me how different prayer was, once I left the Catholic practice, the liturgy, there is all very sound, you know, it's all biblically based, but it's very controlled. Right. And it's very regimented. You know, there are specific prayers that you read and responses to those prayers. So to get introduced to word were, a prayer became a conversation, you know, whose CS Lewis says, you know, it's, I pray more not to influence what God will do for me, but to for God to influence me, you know, and that having that understanding that, you know, just because I asked God to do something, doesn't mean his answers gonna be yes. You know, having that, you know, well, sometimes he says, No, and sometimes he says, Wait, you know, and you know, having that acceptance right

Antowan Hallmon: 18:46

in through prayer. That's how you get those answers. That's how you get the discernment. That's how you get that revelation. And of course, it's like, I preach, and I teach all the time. It's like, Hey, you had to know, things a guy can't be explained, they have to be revealed. And in order to get that revelation, you have to have a relationship. And that relationship consists of not just reading, not just studying, but learning to love. God's word is going to require prayer, right? Prayer, that's what you get, like, you're a download dread. You know, of course, that's like, regardless of what you're going through. You know, I preached this a little bit ago on prayer, and it's like, you know, of course, a person that can know you have to learn how to be specific in prayer. You know, the Bible tells us, you know, the effective, fervent prayer of the righteous availeth much, and of course, a lot of times you see a lot of general prayer, it's like the Lord's hand. Be specific. Tell me what you want from me. Right?

Rauel LaBreche: 19:38

Right. Well, help me to see it the way I see it, right. So

Antowan Hallmon: 19:42

it's, he says, Wherever two or three are gathered together, my name touching the ground there, I'm in the midst, and whatever you ask me, I will do and a lot of us don't get we won't because we don't ask so that also we don't sit still enough to hear the answer.

Rauel LaBreche: 19:58

What it says no Oh no no no no.

Antowan Hallmon: 20:01

No prayers a two way street.

Rauel LaBreche: 20:03

Exactly. How about a favorite paper food?

Antowan Hallmon: 20:07

Favorite food is is a combination is a catfish and Spaghetti.

Rauel LaBreche: 20:11

Spaghetti. That's the first time I've heard of that combination. I've heard Italian food. So spaghetti. Lasagna sometimes, but catfish.

Antowan Hallmon: 20:19

Oh yeah, catfish and of course is a is a unique flavor to it. And of course it's gotta be fried. Right? You know, ya know, it's like some if, depending on where you are, who it is, they can blacking it and make it real good for you. Okay, but otherwise, you fry it with cornmeal. Not better. Not bad. Okay. Yes. And nice and flaky and crispy. And you can doctor it up to your liking? Absolutely.

Rauel LaBreche: 20:42

I'm a big Star Trek fan. And one of the series enterprise, the chief engineer, there's big on catfish keeps talking about you got to have cat fish the way that we prepare cat fish, right? Yes. So and couple points that are worse. Yes. Okay, so how about a favorite place to go when you need to like destress

Antowan Hallmon: 21:07

right now, going by Devil's Lake. I love being by water. Something about water that just kind of resets me, you know, and I just I can actually get a little bit of clarity. Once it's just a regardless of the weather regardless of the season. I'll just ride out there. Whether it's the waters covered in ice, I'm just looking at the the skyline so to speak, and just the sky and just know I'm in prayer and just like okay, Lord, you want to show me the next steps here and whatever, whatever it is I'm trying to distress from so yeah, how about a favorite hobby? Again, that goes back to music, trying to collect vinyl when I can and just listening to music. Of course. Right now I do early for a brief time. In my teens, I was able to experience DJing Oh really? So eventually like when my wife and I get the right space. I like to get two turntables, a mixer and all these exactly and just learn how to blend again and those kinds of things. So that would be a music as a hobby.

Rauel LaBreche: 22:05

Okay, well you and you got a great name for it. You know, Antoine ah so the aura you know, however you want to cut that it's got some potential right has to a pastor a doing his thing on the vinyl. There you go, folks, my guest John Holman, senior is the pastor of faith works ministry. We're going to take a quick break to hear word from our sponsors, when we come back, dig into the meat of things, the kinds of questions that are sometimes hard to answer. But you talked about the the big thing segment I call it, we're going to be talking about some big things. So don't go anywhere. We'll be right back here on 19. I can't even say it 99 Seven Max FM and frame of reference prior to lousy service. You know, President Woodrow Wilson once said there is no higher religion than that of human service. At McFarland, we take that to heart and it drives us to do the best we can to serve you. Whether it's in the service we perform on your tractor, farm machinery lawn, more snowblower chainsaw, car, truck or SUV. We're here at your service Macfarlanes one block south, the highway 12 At seven at Carolina Street, where service is a family tradition. Well, we're back here on frame of reference on 99 Seven Max FM's Berra boos most prestigious channel because it has this podcast on it for one, but it's also prestigious because of my guest today. Antoine Holman is here. Holman, senior is the senior he is not Antoine Holman, Jr. In case you're thinking what if? But no, and he is the pastor of faith works ministries, in barebow, Wisconsin. Antoine tell me about faith works. How did that come about? And you had had some ministry experience before, right?

Antowan Hallmon: 23:49

Yes. And of course, when I like I was explaining to you how you know, when I broke my neck, I did get involved with a church called capital land in Madison. That was Verona. And then of course, I came up started coming up to variable which was hoping Christ at the time. Okay. And then whose church was at that was the fear since pet pastors met and Rochelle fierson. Okay. Are they still up there? They are in Arizona now. Okay. And so during that time, I served four years as a deacons four years as an associate pastor. And it's funny when they announced that they were leaving my wife and I were like, great, whoever y'all bring in, let them go ahead and do it. I will support them in whatever way because we had no plans of starting a home ministry. And so basically, just when Pastor Matt came to me and it was like, the Lord told me to ordain you into your pastor, and I'm like, Nah, I just want to be an evangelist. Just go and blow up a spot and leave

Rauel LaBreche: 24:46

there's a good idea Yeah, we're gonna shake these people up and go away.

Antowan Hallmon: 24:51

Just dropped a dropper

Rauel LaBreche: 24:55

Yeah, that's where that mic thing came from. Boom. Was that kind of attitude? Yeah,

Antowan Hallmon: 24:59

yeah, and And when they decided to leave, and of course, you know, I really got a crash course in what it means to be a pastor, of course, when they announced that they were leaving in the transition was in place, I started note the meet with people, of course, the fierce winds. They had their ways of doing things and of course of just through prayer through Bible study, and through just experiences with other pastors, I just says, like, hey, coming into FaithWorks ministry, this is the expectation, you know, because I just refuse to pastor ignorant church, you're going to study God's Word, you're going to learn to do that. And of course, basically letting out just kind of given a prerequisite to the fact that you're going to be held accountable. A lot of people didn't like that. So a lot of people live.

Rauel LaBreche: 25:47

Well, countability is all fine and good until it's you being accountable. You know, so I'll hold you accountable. I'm great with that. But you don't try to hold me accountable. Right? Yes.

Antowan Hallmon: 25:56

And so that's a what's missing in the church today. No one wants to be held accountable. But yes, after they left, a faith works, ministries was born. And of course, Faith works ministries. We are a Christian, non denominational Bible teaching church. We believe that the written word of God is true. We believe in the eternal Godhead of God, the Father, God, the Son, and God, the Holy Spirit. And we just do we believe in know that Jesus Christ is Lord. And of course always have to explain nondenominational these days. We are a Christian nondenominational church simply meaning we just preach the word from the Bible, there's not a lot of denomination denominational, extra things that go along with I'm trying to, like, you know, of course, like, I don't know, I'm kind of in relationships with a various like, say, the Kojic Church, the Church of God, you know, just a Baptists in his life, but there's all the different bylaws that are attached to those nominations. So I just felt like it'd be easier for a person to come to Christ, if there was no hurt no man set hurdles, you know, and of course, I know, I know and understand that a lot of bylaws kind of derived from the Bible, but in my personal thought, is that know a lot of bylaws actually hinder people sure to know, you know, if you tell a pregnant person, pregnant single mother, that she can't come and worship the way she wants to worship. You know, I say that's a hindrance, you know, and I'd say, you know, I will, but also when we talk about non denominational, we are Christian, non denominational, again, like we preach the Bible course, when people hear non denominational, they think Unitarian or some some from out of space, right. And so I just had to clarify,

Rauel LaBreche: 27:37

well, this is actually from outer space, Christ, where he came from. And so there's some alien things that are going on there. Especially we talk about alien to human ways of doing things, right. But, ya know, I get what you that affiliation is both kind of a blessing and a curse, you know, you know, that those rules and bylaws came about as a result of them trying to do the right thing, I think and trying to kind of set some ground rules for what was going to be acceptable and what wasn't going to be acceptable. But, you know, what's the old thing about, you know, the biggest thing wrong with the church as Christians that aren't Christians, so and, you know, the more you get into that, and the more you realize that, wow, you know, each of us individually has a long way to go, if we're going to try to be that. So when I start to say, you know, what, your way of doing things not quite the same as my way of doing things and so that makes you less of a Christian than I am. Yeah, no, I think, you know, why are you worrying about the speck of dust in his eye when you really should be focusing on a tree? And if that can't be any clearer than it is, I don't know. You know, he spells it out pretty clearly don't worry about judging other people right?

Antowan Hallmon: 28:51

Just not let you be just the same measure you use will be used against you. And that's what is that's kind of one of the hurdles in the church now and judgmental and but also is just again, like we were touching you just kind of touched on it but it's like, we I preach everyone having their own individual relationship with God. Like you know, these bylaws are supposed to kind of create a structure to create a characteristic of a church of a Christian right only the Holy Spirit can do that right you know was only the Holy Spirit can develop the develop that character and of course, when the Lord puts you on his potter's wheel or puts you through that refining fire, you know, that's when your character no fun, but I can't I can't sit and write a list of things and if you if you do this, do this, do this because again, this we're talking about the spiritual walk because, you know, what we're talking about being Christians is spiritual, not religious. And so you have to let the whole you have to have a right heart posture towards God to allow the Holy Spirit to do the work in you because it's going to come a lot of conviction is going to come a lot of correction, but no glory be is just he chest As them who he loves, so a lot of people can't take the chastisement. So they don't necessarily always all the way come to Jesus.

Rauel LaBreche: 30:06

Right? Well, having that humility that says I, you know, I can't judge you, I don't have my own act together. Exactly. I have no right to tell you because you're homosexual, or whatever, you know, the sin of the day is or the, you know, the Book of the Month Club, I have no right to hold you to some standard that says, You need to stop doing that. When there's plenty of stuff I need to stop doing. And the Lord reveals to me on a daily basis, I don't get to pass judgment on you.

Antowan Hallmon: 30:34

Absolutely. And the thing is, none of us have arrived, or I believe will arrive, we'll be learning until we go home. Just went blank. Yeah.

Rauel LaBreche: 30:43

Which is a good thing. I mean, when you think about, unfortunately, most of us are lazy, or a lot of us are lazy. We would rather just walk out, I be there already. Sorry, that's not going to happen to

Antowan Hallmon: 30:54

every time you can read a scripture 10 times you might get a revelation.

Rauel LaBreche: 31:00

Come back to a different points in your life and different things have happened. It's like, bats. What that means is that you come back five years later, no, that's what that means. It's all true. It's just a different layer of the onion has been peeled away. Right? Absolutely. So I was thinking about that, too. You know, we talked about doctrines and you know, different churches have their doctrines of faith. And I say, you know, I want to go to a church where the doctrine of faith is Love the Lord your God with all your heart and all your soul and all your mind and all your strength, and then love your neighbor as you love yourself. And that's it. That's our doctrine right there. You know, and we get, we start pasting other things into it, which may be based on a biblical verse. But I mean, just get those two. Right, you know,

Antowan Hallmon: 31:40

and that's, that's what he asked us to do those those Tuesday view, do these you have performed all of the commandments, basically. And that's where you know, Jesus. In Luke 1616, I just like to quote it exactly here. But what he says is he says in Luke 1616, the law and the prophets were until John, since that time, the kingdom of God is preached. And every man pressive, Intuit, he was saying, basically, I'm here now up into John, the law and the prophets were breached. But here I am. And the kingdom of heaven is standing right in front of you, but a lot of them missed it completely.

Rauel LaBreche: 32:21

They were looking for something else all together. Yes, I'm sorry. I thought you're gonna be red and blue. I whatever. Yeah, that whenever I hear that scripture, I think of Godspell. And the beginning of you are the light of the world starts with the casts all the cast members go on law and the prophets, the Law and the Prophets, law and the prophets, and then, you know, break out and you are the light of the world. And, you know, it's one of those things we go, oh, yeah, that I guess that does make sense that out of that came this, but you know, we sing about the whole song is about the light of the world, you know, and if that salt has lost its flavor, or your art savor, you're not going to be season. Yeah, exactly. So how so? What kind of leaders do you admire? When you when you think about the your leadership style and the things you're trying to, to accomplish with your ministry? Because I think, you know, ministry, in some ways is probably the hardest kind of leadership to do. Yes. Just because, you know, there's all the societal boundaries, there's all the, you know, personal, you know, experiences that people have had, I'm sure there are people that probably have tuned out of this already, because we talk a lot about Christian. And that's a battle that you have to fight that's an uphill climb because people have been the well has been poisoned pretty badly in some cases, right? Absolutely. So are there leaders that you look to that you think found, like, I don't want to say magic pills, but they found, you know, a real successful strategy for countering that kind of thing, so that you can lead them to a closer relationship?

Antowan Hallmon: 33:55

Yes, there's a multiple but one in particular, his name is Dr. Hart Ramsey. And he his testimony is very similar to my own you know, you grew up in some tough surroundings, you had a lot of bad things happen in life, some self inflicted, for glory, be the guy that you know, your the Lord actually drugged you from a situation and just begin to work on you. And but he has built that he built he was able to build a really strong ministry and pass it on to his son and now he's a leader of another ministry. But again, just him, him and his testimony being similar to mine. I admire him. He's one of those pastors that know the Bible. frontwards and backwards Egan, almost tell you every Greek or Hebrew word for word, and it's like, okay, and I just admire that spirit, that high level of spirituality, that high level of Bible knowledge, that knowledge of God I admire that night. That's kind of where I desire to be. And of course, he's in his 60s and so so I was like, I just like okay, Lord, I know what I'm shooting for. And but yes, but he also has let me

Rauel LaBreche: 34:59

get it by respect Seven days if if it's at all possible around a year, yeah, it has a level

Antowan Hallmon: 35:03

of boldness about him. But he's always speaking the truth regardless of the consequence. Right?

Rauel LaBreche: 35:07

When it's interesting, I, you know, and I sensed this from you Antoine that, you know, there's a difference between boldness based on what arrogance, I think ultimately is what it is because I remember a pastor that I knew was that was very on fire, very Pentecostal. And he would go through like McDonald's and say, you know, you'd order his hamburger or whatever and say, Do you know Jesus, he's coming, you know, he's coming. And I remember the first time he did that being like, is that really the best way to approach someone that may or may not have ever heard about that, I mean, you, you conceivably could have put that person 16 steps back from where they were, because you were so arrogant about that, because that's what it seemed like, to me, versus the humility of, of just getting to know someone, and having a compassionate, empathetic response to where they're at. And, you know, letting I guess, you know, putting putting some feet to it, instead of just, you know, speaking into someone's life, I'm speaking love Bible into their life. And always seems to me like, dude, what about just sharing the love of Christ? You know, isn't that what we're really called to do? You know, he sat down with the well with a woman that had a, you know, horrific background with multiple husbands probably was abused, probably had, you know, a life that, you know, most women would say, you know, no wonder she left him he was sold, blah, blah, blah, right? He just sat there and talked with her, you know, it wasn't Oh, you need to do this. And you need to do this in your your bla bla bla, he just talked with her. That seems to me, that's the real challenge is to get past all the guys that don't do that. And be one of the ones that does is yeah, my

Antowan Hallmon: 36:51

it just, uh, you right? And it's like, you know, of course, is the approach. But again, it's gonna start with the leading of the Holy Spirit course. One thing I tend to do is I try not to miss an opportunity. So I speak to people just hey, how you doing? Hey, how are you today? So you just speak into people. And of course, even through our outreach, you know, people will say something like, Why do y'all do this, and I'm like, It's not me, it's the Christ that's within me. And of course, because that's we as Christians, that's all we are to do, basically, is to exhibit the culture and manifest the nature of Christ. And when we talk about exhibit the culture that is love people, forgive people and give. And then of course, when we talk about the nature, that's the glory, though very weight of it. And of course, that thing, because like people are going to read you and not the Bible. So it's very important that you walk according to, you're gonna do you want to live close to God's biblical standard as you humanly possibly can. But otherwise, it's always going to be better leading of the Holy Spirit. And again, this usually starts with the introduction. And it just simply like, a person will say something like, You are so nice. Why is that? And they're just like, well, you know, I'm a man of God, you know, in the black really what know what it is? In the comp? Because it has to it has to happen organically, right? And sometimes, like, when, when we're talking about discipleship, no, you can speak to a person speak to a person, and you may not get them to the third or fourth time. Right, but the thing is, is just like you really, you had to let the love of Christ show through you. And there's a there's a, you know, there has to be a meekness, you know,

Rauel LaBreche: 38:26

do you find there are times where you just don't feel like you can do it, you know, like your something has happened to you personally, or you, you see something on the news, it just makes you go oh, Lord, we're just never gonna get there. And then lower put somebody in your life you have to minister you're like, or somebody's making the same stupid mistake over and over and over again. Right?

Antowan Hallmon: 38:49

So it's just like, you know, course when I will say this discipleship, and trying to get people to be saved is getting harder and harder, because you know, the people that are exhibiting these really bad behaviors out and about, they call themselves Christian, you know, the same people that are trying to take away voting rights. They say they're Christian. Yeah, the same people that are trying to wipe out the true history of America are Christians, the same people that are trying to stop me from reading certain books. They are Christian, the same people that stormed this Capitol building, they say they are Christians. And so if a person, a person that's in the world, and you're saying, Hey, this is I'm trying to get you to learn to love and trust Christ, they'd be like, if that's Jesus, I don't want to deal with that. Yeah. And that's where it is. And that's what I say the problem stems from there because a lot of these behaviors and that are being exhibited. Unfortunate to say they are coming from the church. Yeah. You know, yeah, one of my, one of my, one of my, how do I say this? One of my Talking Points and things I stand on is like, you know, it's like I can't be scared to call things out anymore. You know, when Jesus turned Saul to Paul, he didn't change his personality, he just changed his heart. And so it just like we have to, we have to, again, we have to be able to tell this truth, regardless of the consequence, because people today The truth is irrelevant to how they feel, or it's irrelevant to their emotions, when all actuality to truth is the standard by which reality is measured. And that standard is God's word. You know, because like you say, in today's world, the word of God has been nullified, because again, people will go back, just a tad bit. No, I was, uh, talking to this African pastor at a conference last summer. And he was saying, Do you know that the Bible in America is in danger? And I was just like, Yeah, I can see that. And nobody went into depth about how like, you know, in America, we tend to put our ideals on the Bible instead of letting the Bible influence ideals. And so in his like, because will people cherry pick scripture to make it fit? Mr. Trudeau?

Rauel LaBreche: 41:04

Yeah, I mean, pull things out of context. I mean, exactly. And that's one of the reasons I think you really have to encourage people read it, read it for yourself, exactly. understand all that it says, And there's, I guarantee there's gonna be things that you're gonna go, what exactly can that be, but you need to know the entirety of it in order to know when it's being manipulated, right,

Antowan Hallmon: 41:23

exactly. Because we take Jesus well, when he came, when he got baptized, he went to the wilderness, what the devil do he tried to manipulate them by? No, no screw up messing up scripture, right. And Jesus actually came back with actual scripture from Deuteronomy. But yeah, the thing is, you know, is this a situation where like, I, this is why we preach and teach you to have that relationship with God, to read your Bible, to study your Bible, learn to love this word, learn to love it to the point where it starts to talk to you, because God's Word is living, this living, and a lot of people need to get that experience for themselves. Because I mean, you can listen to a passage this person might be out of his mind, you don't know. You got to read them. I encourage people like, hey, take the scriptures, go and read them for yourself, ask God, what does he have for you in this? And you know, and that's where, you know, yeah, it's really just a teaching people because again, it's about relationship. You know, Pastor, I can't preach I can, I can lay hands on you and give you some feel good for a little bit. But if you want that, that that long lesson in spiritual infilling, you got to have a relationship. And because again, is at the end of the day, what's in your heart is between you and God, just like what's in minds? And so that's where you try to teach it just that somewhere in the walk is simple, but not easy.

Rauel LaBreche: 42:41

Yeah, I think if you know, you shall know them by their fruits. Absolutely. You know, so you look at somebody and think, you know, Jimmy Swaggart, I love to pick on, because Jimmy Swaggart, here's a guy that had an evangelistic ministry that was huge, absolutely huge had, you know, worldwide impact in so many ways. And you know, anybody who was anybody knows what happened to that ministry. Right? So you gotta wonder, you know, at what point did you know Jimmy let himself become center stage instead of the Bible and Jesus become center stage? Because that that is that's the real journey, right all through our lives is, Lord, make me take me out of the way so that you can be apparent so you can be seen. And that, to me, that's the over arching problem and all of his face, you know, if Peter and John and Paul can have as much trouble as they had, just imagine how much trouble we have and say, Well, yeah, it makes sense. They were with him for three years and saw him up close and knew exactly what was going on. And they still blew it, you know? So, of course, we're gonna blow it right.

Antowan Hallmon: 43:45

And that's the thing, we all gonna make mistakes. But the thing is, we have to just again we live with, let's see, Psalm 119 160 says the entirety of My Word is true. So what has to happen in church today is we have to cheat. We have to teach, teach from every area of the Bible, right? You know, of course, some people just pick the feelgood scriptures. It's like oh, prosperity.

Rauel LaBreche: 44:08

Are we giving so we'll teach about tithing today? Yeah, whatever. Yes.

Antowan Hallmon: 44:11

Like you have to preach against some of the hard things No, when the Lord gives me a message to preach

Rauel LaBreche: 44:16

is like ah, no not gonna go over well,

Antowan Hallmon: 44:19

I'm gonna like okay, I wasn't start clearing up my inbox

Rauel LaBreche: 44:24

lots of after commentary stations right and so but

Antowan Hallmon: 44:27

but yes in but you know, it's getting harder harder to disciple because of what people are seeing in a course um, you know, there's a lot of things coming out in about that are just not becoming of a Christian attitudes, behaviors speech. You know, actually a Friday I teach why I don't teach but I give a few minutes speech. No, they're gonna give a pastor five minutes,

Rauel LaBreche: 44:53

five minutes, left to say hi. So nobody's

Antowan Hallmon: 44:57

up for the youth outreach to prove that violent extremism, just from being put on by the We Are Many united against hate group in Madison. So they're gonna give me a few minutes to talk about, you know, of course I'll be representing variable x coalition force ministries and the got unity initiative and I'm just going to talk about a few of those things. But it's like talking about where those things originate and how they come about and how they ensure in so how

Rauel LaBreche: 45:27

are you coming to that you better be having the Holy Spirit right alongside you right because that that's the sort of thing you go, man want to lose and battle that is, you know, but at the same point, you've we've seen God do mightier things than that, right? You know, and if you don't believe that he can and just say, God, get me out of the way here so that your work gets done, not mine, right? Not my agenda. It's your agenda. So because you may get taken completely off what you thought you were gonna say. But that's kind of how the Holy Spirit works. You know? Absolutely. Those of you that wonder about the Holy Spirit. We're going to talk about that probably, and much, much more. On our next episode as Antoine and I continue our conversation. My guest is is Antoine Holloman senior Antoine is the pastor of faith works ministries, you can go to a website, I'm assuming you'll see more about FaithWorks ministries, right?

Antowan Hallmon: 46:15

Yes, you can go to our website, please to just see exactly who we are and what we're about at WWW dot F w ministries.com f.ministries.com.

Rauel LaBreche: 46:26

Or F ministries.com

Antowan Hallmon: 46:28

www dot F w ministries.com.

Rauel LaBreche: 46:32

Okay, FW ministries got this. So I forget about the www these days, because it's like I already know it's WWE. Yes.

Antowan Hallmon: 46:41

That's just normally I don't even say it, but

Rauel LaBreche: 46:45

you want to make sure I just so folks, we're gonna take a quick break to hear a word from our sponsors wrap up this week's episode. And then I'll be back next week with Antoine to dig in even further to some meat of not only what we've been talking about so far. But one of these questions I want to get to with him is what do people need to understand when the major issues are discussed? Because I think that's just ripe with all kinds of things we can talk about. Right. So Antoine, thanks for being here. We'll be back with floating words this week. And make sure you join us next week here on 99 Seven Max FM and frame of reference.

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Rauel LaBreche: 47:51

If you want to get a supercharger of hope and faith in something bigger than yourself, sit down and talk with Antoine Holman for an hour or so. Marie even 20 minutes if you're rushed for time. He is sincerely one of the kindest and gracious people I've ever met. He is genuinely interested in knowing people and finding ways to care for them and meet their needs when possible. He also happens to be a Christian and the pastor of faith works ministries in bearable Wisconsin faith works is 100% virtual nondenominational church. And if you listen to our conversation, you will find out what that means. And how a kid that grew up in taverns ended up becoming a pastor, a pastor that tries to just get people to focus on Jesus Christ, and getting to know him, and then getting out of the way of Christ's work in people. Talking with Antoine is inspiring and challenging. And if you think that Christians are a bunch of hypocrites or misguided fools, give them a chance to show you a person who talks the talk but more importantly, walks the walk. It's a tough topic because for a lot of people just mentioned the name Jesus and they go out one of those people, but give Antoine a chance. He's different. So join us next week as we carry on our conversation and more here. frame of reference 99 Seven Max FM's digital network