A Literal Journey
Step into the world of stories with A Literal Journey, a weekly podcast/show hosted by author Seth Adam Smith. Each episode features thoughtful conversations with beloved and emerging authors about reading, writing, and the stories that shape who we become.
In every episode, Seth talks to authors about the stories that sparked their love for storytelling, their path of writing and publishing, and the lessons they've learned on their own "literal journey." Because, in the end, we don't just tell stories, we become the stories we tell ourselves.
So whether you’re a reader searching for your next favorite book, or a creative searching for inspiration and encouragement, A Literal Journey will help you move forward!
A Literal Journey
Writing Through Chaos 📖 Joan Reardon on Critical Thinking and The Grimsbane Family Witch Hunters
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This episode is for people who struggle creating something meaningful *especially* when life feels chaotic and uncertain...
In this delightful episode of A LITERAL JOURNEY, I sit down with award-winning author Joan Reardon to talk about her remarkable path to publication. Always a devoted reader, Joan resolved to write her own Middle Grade Novels *while simultaneously* navigating the COVID shutdowns, finishing school, moving, studying for the bar exam, getting married, and starting a career in law (holy crap!).
During the interview, Joan shares how The Grimsbane Family Witch Hunters grew out of her love of family, folklore, early American history, and cryptids (who doesn't love a good cryptid?!) and how Dad Rock Dragon Quest is a kind of "love letter" to her husband. Along the way, we talk about Percy Jackson, writing as a kind of therapy, family as the beating heart of story, and how she truly measures her success as an author.
Whether you’re a reader, writer, parent, teacher, or someone trying to finally make the thing you feel "called to create," I hope this episode encourages you to open a book (or pick up a pen) and embark on your *own* literal journey.
About JOAN REARDON:
Joan is an award-winning author and attorney from Youngstown, Ohio. When Covid cut Joan's senior year of college short, Joan thought she'd give writing children's books a chance. Six years later, and Joan has two novels published with Simon & Schuster's Aladdin imprint: Dad Rock Dragon Quest (2025) and The Grimsbane Family Witch Hunters (2024).
💻 VISIT Joan Reardon's official website: https://www.writingreardon.com
📖 READ The Grimsbane Family With Hunters: https://amzn.to/4bXGS11
📚 CHECK OUT Joan Reardon's other books: https://amzn.to/4mg32ic
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My name is Seth Adam Smith. I’m a husband, father, and author who believes in the power of stories to inspire people forward.
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Thank you for watching—and for being part of this journey!
What has been your response to the response? This is your first novel out there, and it's just getting a lot of praise. How how are you receiving all of this?
SPEAKER_00It's all fun. Um, I feel very, very lucky that people are enjoying the book. Um, when I first signed with my agent, like I will be completely honest, the first thing I told her is like, all that really matters is like I just want to be one kid's favorite author, right? I just want to make a difference for like one kid and for them to like love a story that I write, and then it'll all be worth it. So it's lovely to get accolades, it's lovely that the book's resonating with so many people, but the most important thing is that it resonates with young readers. And I feel like that's what we're seeing with both uh the Grimms of Vane family, Witch Hunters, and Dad Rock Dragon Quest. So I feel very, very lucky for that reason. Um, but that's what I think is mainly important to me. It's just, you know, focusing on the young readers and the people that these books are written for.
SPEAKER_01Because in the end, we don't just tell stories, we become the stories that we tell ourselves. And today's author is absolutely fantastic, Joan Rearden. Joan has been an avid reader and writer since childhood, devouring books like Percy Jackson, The Hunger Games, and Diary of a Wimpy Kid. She honed her love of storytelling through Ohio-based writing competitions and went on to earn a BA in history from Ohio State University, focusing on early American history, classics, and folklore. And I am gonna try so hard not to talk to you about those things because those are like my favorite topics.
SPEAKER_00So I'm gonna do the same, but they are normal. So we'll see how it goes.
SPEAKER_01We'll see how it goes. Um, in spring of 2020, the an infamous time, Joan moved back home due to her college being shut down during the COVID pandemic. During this time, Joan read the books she loved as a kid and figured why not give writing a children's book a shot. During the first few months of the pandemic, Joan wrote her first book, The Grimsbane Family Witch Hunters, which I mean, if you haven't seen that cover, it it it draws you right in. I mean, I'm I I started reading it when I was down at the Grand Canyon. Um, it's good. It is good. And Grimsbane Family Witch Hunters was inspired by what she learned while while earning her history degree. She then started attending Case Western Reserve University School of Law, where she penned Dad Rock Dragon Quest between classes. I'm gonna ask you about that because I just don't see how someone who could go to law school could also have time to be writing a book. Just seems you're already writing a book for every class with all of the homework you're doing. And then in between classes, I think that's just marvelous. Joan's books have earned a spot on the Barnes Noble and Amazon bestseller lists, a junior library guild gold standard selection, a starred review from Publishers Weekly, a selection for School Library Journal Best Books of the Year 2025, and a selection for New York Public Library Best Books of the Year 2025. Joan, thank you so much for agreeing to be on the show. It is an honor.
SPEAKER_00Thank you for having me. I'm very excited to talk with you.
SPEAKER_01Well, first, just give our listeners a little background on you. What is what's your story and what got you into storytelling?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so you covered uh a lot of it pretty well. Um, ever since I was a kid, I've always loved books. Uh, my parents are big readers, my grandparents are big readers. Uh, so naturally it just kind of like fell into place that I just love books. I've always read books. Um, writing, I kind of fell into by accident. You know, I enjoyed it as a hobby um all through childhood, uh, and then my early adulthood. And, you know, then COVID happened uh when I was in my final year at Ohio State, and I am a busybody by nature. I am involved in a million activities and I still am. So when everything shut down, I had literally nothing to do. So I was in my childhood bedroom and I was reading books like Percy Jackson, Diary of a Wimpy Kid, and I was just kind of sitting there and I was like, you know what, I might as well try this. Um that's when I started thinking about the Grims of Bane family witch hunters. And, you know, I was still finishing up my history degree. So I was really involved in that, delving really deep into primary sources from early American history. Um, and at the same time, I was just missing my family horribly. Um, my dad has seven siblings, you know, my mom has two brothers, three stepbrothers. We're all very, very close. And just not being able to see my family was just awful. And I feel like so much of that uh just permeates the Grimsbane family witch hunters. So it kind of combines me missing my family with everything I learned in my history degree to end up with a book that is best pitched as K-pop Demon Hunters meets uh Wednesday, and it's just K-pop demon hunters in the Midwest with cryptids. Uh it's it was a ton of fun to write. Um I sent it out to literary agents like almost immediately after I finished writing it. Um, I by, and that was in the summer of 2020, and by October of that year, I got picked up by my current agent, uh Larissa Piankowski, who is currently at a Xantian. Um, and that was actually a very straightforward process. I know that uh the query trenches, no matter who's doing it, it's very, very rough. Uh, but for me, it was honestly like, you know, it stinks to get rejections. I feel like it happens to every author. But for me, it was actually quick. So my suffering wasn't prolonged. Uh, we did a couple rounds of edits and then we sent that out to Simon and Schuster, got picked up by Aladdin. And that was in my first year of law school. And during that process, I was already working on my second book, Dad Rock Dragon Quest. Um, and I wrote that during law school. And while I was earning my law degree, I was also writing and doing, you know, book stuff. So it was kind of like that Hannah Montana double lifestyle where I was a law student by day and an author by night. Um, but yeah, I kind of just snowballed from there. And, you know, now I'm uh actively practicing law. I'm with Retzel and Andris. Um, I primarily do uh real estate work, corporate work, uh business, that sort of stuff. Uh, but now I also do a ton of intellectual property by virtue of being an author. And I've also had the opportunity to represent a lot of authors, uh, you know, just like reviewing their contracts, like um assisting them in the query process, answering any questions they have, that sort of thing. So uh the careers have like weirdly collided in a great way. It's you know great to represent authors, it's great to, you know, be writing books and publishing. So it's been fun. Yeah, but that's just kind of uh my whole deal at the current moment.
SPEAKER_01That's incredible. I mean, I I've talked to a lot of authors who who expressed you know feelings of their careers almost being devastated by COVID because they they had books slated for publication and then they were supposed to go on book tours and stuff, uh, and that didn't pan out, obviously, during the pandemic. And then, you know, just a lot of people who had career paths that were really derailed during COVID. I I find it absolutely remarkable that that a time that was so difficult uh for a lot of authors and just people who who weren't authors, uh, that you took that opportunity, even though you missed your family, you took that opportunity to be like, I'm gonna write a book, you know, and it was a a big turning point in your life. What was what was the inspiration behind the story? And then you said you're a driven person, but how did you find the motivation during such an uncertain time to complete the manuscript?
SPEAKER_00I guess that's the thing. Um, first I do want to say it comes from a place of privilege, right? Um, I was lucky enough uh to be able to move back in with my parents. Um, I had a ton of time on my hands, I was finishing up my degree. Uh, so that I was just very, very lucky to be in the situation I was in, because I know that that's not true for a lot of people uh during the COVID pandemic. Um, but you know, during that time as I was reading, you know, just delving into the primary sources, uh, specifically like the stuff that had to deal with like witchcraft in early America. Um, at the time I was actually taking a great class called Tolkien's Monsters uh because I needed an English credit to graduate. And I was like, I will never read Lord of the Rings unless I am forced to because those books are gigantic. So uh, and that was really interesting because it kind of went into the historical basis for a lot of the creatures that we see in uh Lord of the Rings and The Hobbit that I was just completely unaware of. So I feel like sometimes when we read uh fantasy novels, especially sci-fi, we kind of just take it at face value, but we don't question where the ideas um for those creatures that are located in those books come from. Uh so it was really fascinating learning about that. Uh, it was fascinating learning about how witches were treated in early America. At the same time, I was just reading a ton about folklore. Um, I've always been a fan of folklore and mythology, but you know, American cryptids for some reason was just really at the front of my mind at the time. And those all just sort of collided um uh as I was just all these different ideas simultaneously and just having a ton of time on my hands, just to be able to sit and write a manuscript and do pretty much nothing else for two months, uh, is the only reason that I was able to actually finish the first manuscript. So I've considered myself very lucky in that sense.
SPEAKER_01So give our listeners and our viewers a kind of a bit of an idea of what the Grimsbane family uh is all about.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so it's about a family of witch hunters. Um, the main character, Anna Grimsbane, is 12 years old. Uh, you could start hunting once you're in high school, um, but all of the witch hunters in the family are women because all the men are subject to a generational curse from hundreds of years ago by a witch called the Watcher. Uh, their hometown is actually kind of similar to like towns like Gravity Falls, uh, Twin Peaks, where there's just like a lot of spooky stuff that happens. There's a ton of cryptids because the Watcher, like the main big bad witch, lives in the woods and they all get drawn to her. So all the women are cryptid hunters, witch hunters are trying to break the curse. Uh, all the men are cursed to die strange and unusual deaths. This curse uh sets in when they turn 13. So, and it's nothing too terribly violent because it is a middle grade book.
SPEAKER_01We're talking like slipping on a banana peel, like that kind of a way to go. What a way to go.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, you know what I mean? Like it's nothing too gory because I have had kids ask, like, could this be a way someone dies? Could that be a way someone dies? No, we keep it pretty, pretty G-rated in the Grimm's veins. Um, but yeah, so Anna, the main character, her twin brother's about to, she and her twin brother are about to turn 13. Uh, and that kind of is just like a devastating moment for Billy uh because he wants to like go on adventures, do all these things. And the night before the 13th birthday on Halloween night, he's like, you know what? I'm gonna go hunt the Witcher, my the Watcher myself, and I'm just gonna go out into the forest and you know, just break the curse. So he heads out, and then Anna and all her friends are like, oh my god, what an idiot. We need to go save him. So they go out to rescue him, and the forest is full of cryptids and all kinds of fun stuff from American folklore. So it's them just kind of trying to beat the clock and rescue Billy before he turns 13 and the curse takes hold.
SPEAKER_01So you said, I mean, obviously it was inspired by your studies of American history, American folklore. Uh, can you point to anything in particular, specifically, that really pulled the story out for you?
SPEAKER_00Yes. Um, so The Watch is actually based on a real uh piece of folklore about the Bell Witch in uh, I believe it was Tennessee. Um Tennessee, yeah. Uh like I did do like a ton of early American folklore, and one thing I love about the Bell Witch is that she allegedly threw a plate at Andrew Jackson, you know, fun stuff. But she's kind of like this poltergeist that haunted a family uh out in Tennessee, allegedly. Um, but learning about her, and then I was also dealing, like just because I was like, you know, finishing my studies, uh, writing a ton of papers, dealing a lot with primary sources. And I found myself wishing that I re like really, really learned that much earlier in my education because you would deal with two people who'd witnessed the same event and have two completely different things written down about it, um, just because they have different perspectives. And I feel like oftentimes uh people will take everything at face value. There's not a ton of critical thinking uh that goes in when you read any source uh sometimes. And uh I wanted to kind of teach kids the importance of, you know, uh questioning sources when they're reading them, uh just not taking anything at face value, uh, which is a, you know, as the story continues, Anna realizes like her family might not be uh totally forthright about uh their relationship with witches and cryptids. Um, one important primary source in the book is uh Diligence's Diary, which was, you know, all the Grimsbane women going back hundreds of years have, you know, written tales of their hunts for cryptids and witches in it. Uh, and she realizes that, hey, they might not have been totally honest, you know, as they were uh writing this tome. Uh so it's been, you know, that was just kind of the thought initially was that I would like to uh help kids like deal with uh the uh issue that sometimes sources uh have a tendency to be biased.
SPEAKER_01You mentioned the the bell witch. What other cryptids kind of uh that you can talk about, what other cryptids American specific feature in the Grimsbane family murders?
SPEAKER_00We have a ton. Um we have Tailybones, also known as Tailipo, uh the Melonheads, which anyone who lives near Lake Erie is probably very familiar with. They're just kind of like creepy kids with like, you know, giant heads, hence the melon name. Uh we have the Nine Rouge. Uh, we have a ton of different ghosts uh from the area. But yeah, that's just kind of it's we have the Mothman mentioned, we have some cult stuff. Um, we have what's called a white screamer. Uh it's kind of similar to Wendigo, if you're familiar with that, but it's more uh, you know, Tennessee Appalachia-based. So there's just a ton of cryptins from all over. Um very, very spooky. Um, it was actually kind of funny. I had my uh sister, who's a year younger than me, read the book when I first wrote it, and she had to sleep with the lights on after reading it with the chat. Yeah, so it's got some spooky elements. Yeah, but I feel like oftentimes, especially with um historical information, you're getting it from a textbook where, you know, someone read the primary sources and then somebody wrote the textbook, and then someone might have written a textbook based on that textbook. So you're getting it sort of like a bottleneck of everything that really happened, uh, especially when you're like interpreting history when you're 12, 13, because most of your his historical knowledge is going to come from a textbook that somebody else wrote. Uh, so it's just kind of encouraging kids to like not take that at face value necessarily, because you know, you can't take biased bias out of anything. You know, I'm biased when I write anything, so are you, and we might see the same event and have two completely different opinions about it, uh, and just choose which information's important, which information isn't important. And then that's just how you know the story gets presented, which, you know, I think is a problem.
SPEAKER_01But well, also, and then just I'm learning this, I'm learning this especially this year, just just having I mean, we'll interpret things one way, but but having an openness, a willingness to be like, okay, maybe what I saw wasn't exactly the way I interpreted it, and and being open to that possibility. Um so you wrote the manuscript, it was published, and and it has received tremendous praise and accolades since publication. Um, what has been your response to the response? This is your first novel out there, and it's just getting a lot of praise. How how are you receiving all of this?
SPEAKER_00It's all fun. Um, I feel very, very lucky that people are enjoying the book. Um, when I first signed with my agent, like I will be completely honest, the first thing I told her is like, all that really matters is like I just want to be one kid's favorite author, right? I just want to make a difference for like one kid and for them to like love a story that I write, and then it'll all be worth it. So it's lovely to get accolades, it's lovely that the book's resonating with so many people, but the most important thing is that it resonates with young readers. And I feel like that's what we're seeing with both uh the Grimaz of Vane family, Witch Hunters, and Dad Rock Dragon Quest. So I feel very, very lucky for that reason. Um, but that's what I think is mainly important to me. It's just, you know, focusing on the young readers and the people that these books are written for.
SPEAKER_01So when you wrote your first book and it was published, um I mean, this could either be a question about before you had written it or while you were writing it or after, every protagonist basically encounters some form of resistance, either internal or external, on whatever they feel called to do. And you felt called to write this story and to write additional stories. You know, what kind of resistance have you experienced in your own, I guess, hero's journey in writing? How have you overcome that resistance?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I'm gonna start by just saying the bar exam. That one is blower up. But yeah, uh, it was kind of a unique situation uh to be, you know, writing my first book during like a very uncertain time, right? Um, and then also doing uh trying to get it published during uh COVID as well, which is kind of uh difficult, especially because I was completely online uh for school. I had just moved to a different city. Uh anyone will tell you the first year of law school um is just terrifying. Um they try to scare you to death, is like what they say. Like first year they scare you to death, second year they work you to death, third year they bore you to death. Um, so the fear factor was definitely there, first year law school. It's just a very competitive environment and just not being able to uh interact with my classmates and just find community was very, very difficult during that first year. And at the same time, um I'm trying to get the book published, trying to do edits, trying to work on the second book and trying to figure out how to balance all that uh was very, very difficult. And then when the edits rolled around, um, by that time I had, you know, met my husband and gotten engaged. Uh so fun for long fun for me to get and I'm not saying that was necessarily a problem. Um quite a quite a bit of resistance. So there was uh wedding planning, publishing a book, and taking a bar exam all simultaneously, and also moving because I was moving um Oh, you can't you can't do that to yourself at this hour. I was moving from you know Cleveland back to my hometown just because that's where you know we were planning on living, that's where I was starting my practice. So it was just a lot going on simultaneously. Um, and just trying to balance edits while studying for the bar, which is pretty much like a 24-7 thing, was very, very difficult. Um, and even, you know, in my first year of practice, which you know is a transition period for any attorney, uh, just going from full-time law school to full-time lawyering, you know, there were times where like I'd be up till, you know, two, three in the morning working on a book or working on edits, and then waking up, you know, to go to work in the morning and you know, it's a full-time job, just 24-7. So, you know, you get calls at like nine o'clock at night from a client. And I'm the kind of lawyer, like I like to pick up the phone if someone's calling because you know, you know what they need, they might need help immediately. So yeah. So it's just kind of it was kind of difficult just trying to figure out how to uh balance all of that sort of a thing. Um, but you know, it's just kind of learning how to adjust your schedule for to make time for things like writing. So during law school, uh, you know, my first year was kind of difficult to find time for writing. And then my second year, I was just like, oh, I'll just schedule it like a class. Like this is my writing time. So between classes, uh, I would just go to the coffee shop next to the law school, and that's where I wrote Dad Rock Dragon Quest, because I would just be like, okay, I'm going to take three hours every week, and that's just my writing time. Well, of course, that didn't work when I started practicing law because, you know, that middle of the week time I am, you know, actively, you know, at work. So I ended up now I uh write primarily like very early in the morning on Saturdays and Sundays, just because that's when I have free time to write. So just being comfortable adjusting, I feel like was the main main thing. Uh, and not being so set in my ways, uh, because I'm a creature of habit. I like having a set schedule, but it's just kind of like that part of just like, you know, you have to be comfortable adjusting your schedule if you're passionate about something. Uh, and if that's something you want to make work, then there's always time in the day, just finding where you can put it.
SPEAKER_01See, I find that just so remarkable. I mean, going back to COVID and then what you were talking about being in law school, but also moving and getting engaged and just everything at the same time. I I I get two things thrown at me, and I'm like, okay, I'm out. I gotta take a nap. This is too much, this is too overwhelming. My kids, my kids will come into my office, and if I hear them, like I I can't focus to write. And I I just find that to be incredible that in between law classes, you're writing a book. I mean, um what was it about about I guess both of your books that you felt compelled to devote so much time to those?
SPEAKER_00Uh for me, writing's always been uh very therapeutic. Um it really does exercise that part of the brain that doesn't get exercised when you're doing legal work because it's so creative. Um, I love doing it, it's a ton of fun. Um and I so I think it's like kind of important. It's like the same way some people meditate, I write. It's just a good way to get like out of my head and start focusing on characters and like what's going on in the story, uh, because it keeps me entirely distracted from anything else going on, because you could just really like delve into it and uh have a good time. So, you know, writing has always been uh more of an escape for me uh than it has been a burden, which is why I think it's necessary for me to make time to do it. Um so you know, that's just kind of like how it was, uh, especially like during law school and like all that stuff, just trying to find time to, you know, take time to focus on anything but my classes. Cause that can be really tempting, especially when you're, you know, a young lawyer.
SPEAKER_01Well, that's yeah, that's amazing to think of it more as an escape from all of the stresses. That's probably a better way to frame it. I mean, I I always feel like if it's creative on my end, it's like it's like I don't know, being Pregnant with something and labors about is on the horizon and it's going to be this terrible ordeal, you know. But but if you reframe it as something that's actually not terrifying, but actually something that's more of an escape, that's probably a better way to do it.
SPEAKER_00Um I don't want to like mischaracterize it. I always say this during school visits. Sometimes writing feels like pulling my teeth out. You know what I mean? Like where it's just like there's just some like times where you're looking at a sentence and it's just not right and there's no way to fix it and you don't know what to do. But again, it is distracting, which I think is like very beneficial. And then there's those certain times where you get to that scene you've been wanting to write for like a year. Um, and it's just so much fun. It's just a ton of fun. So it just kind of just depends on the vibe and the energy. But either way, it's an escape just because it's so distracting.
SPEAKER_01Well, give our listeners, our viewers uh a bit of background or an idea of what uh is you know, dragon or I'm sorry, I I have it written right here, so I don't stumble on Dad Rock Dragon Quest. Uh yeah, give our give our viewers and listeners an idea of what that book is all about.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Um, so that one's a bit of a tongue twister title, and I do apologize because that isn't time.
SPEAKER_01No, no.
SPEAKER_00Uh, but Dad Rock Dragon Quest is uh basically how to train your dragon, if it was an 80s action movie, uh with like road trips, you know, explosions, uh car chases, like all that fun stuff. Uh, it is about a blended family that goes on a road trip to rescue a dragon from magical poachers. Uh, this book is a ton of fun uh for me personally because it is basically a love letter to my husband, who is my fiance at the time I was writing it. Um, you know, it just includes everything he loves. So he's a huge fan of rock and roll. So just the main character wants to be a rock star. That's like what she aspires to. Um, it's got, you know, road trips, it's got travel, uh, national parks. We have uh dragons, you know, he's a big fan of fantasy. Um, his Subaru's in it. That's you know where they that's the vehicle they travel in. But it's definitely a family book. Um, I kind of tried to uh encapsulate like movies like Mrs. Doubtfire and Jumanji when I was writing it, just kind of like that 90s, early 2000s feel uh of family movies that like I loved when I was growing up. Um, but yeah, it was a ton of fun to write. And one fun fact I like to share about the book is that there are two characters that are based on my husband, uh, the dad and this mom's boyfriend. Uh they are my husband's left brain and his right brain. So it's just one brain knows one side and then his analytical side. So it's yeah, it was just a ton of fun to write. Um, that one was just an absolute blast. Um just uh writing those characters and just spending time in that world and you know, having fun just having this family just trapped in a car together, trying to go on this road trip to rescue a dragon.
SPEAKER_01So you say, I mean, it was a basically a love letter to your your fiance, your husband. Uh what was his reaction? Was he was he reading it all along the way, or was it like, now it's done, now you can read it?
SPEAKER_00Yes, I presented it to him when it was finally done, and he said it was the weirdest book he ever wrote, like wrote it because he was like reading his internal thoughts, like arguing with himself. Um there was one particular scene that got him where the dad and the stepdad are like trying to cook together, uh, and what the dad's like, you're not adding enough spice, and the other guy's like, It's gonna be too spicy simultaneously. So yeah, that was it was Ben just Ben really enjoyed that one. Um, he's very chuffed, you know, whenever anybody brings it up, because he's like, You know, I'm actually the inspiration.
SPEAKER_01Chuffed, chuffed. I've only heard uh uh British people use that word. That's good. That's thank you. I was interviewing Jonathan Stroud and he kept saying chuffed. I was very chuffed about it, and I thought I I had to stop and was like, what does that even mean? I don't know, I wasn't familiar with that word, and that's good, that's good. Um so every good book or good story has a has a theme or an idea that sort of reveals itself over time. It's basically the heart of the story, and you've written and published two books now. I mean, what do you feel are the the themes or ideas that that seem to come to the surface as you're writing? Obviously, there's a lot of humor in the books that you've written, a lot of and a lot of love for um well, I mean, for culture and for folklore, but what are the main like the hearts of the stories? I mean, to put it another way, like what do you feel is the why behind um your books?
SPEAKER_00So I think family is a huge theme in both books. Uh the first book primarily deals with uh learning to admit when you're wrong or that your ancestors' actions were wrong, and then how to fix that. It's about learning to say sorry. Um, and it's about learning how to improve going forward. The second book is more about understanding, um, just learning to understand the people in your lives, the way that they show love and appreciating them for who they are. Uh, I think one thing that's always bothered me sometimes with middle grade books is how parents are presented. Um, oftentimes they're either like perfect, they're awful, or they're dead. And those are like your three options. Um whereas, you know, I like to view parents as characters. I feel like they deserve to go in the adventures with kids. Cause, you know, I when I was a kid and I'd be reading, you know, some of these books, I was like, there would be no way my mom and dad would let me do this by myself. So I was like, so it's just kind of that idea like if mom and dad were on the adventure too, um, and just like their perspectives on that and like how they would be dealing with uh a situation where like the kids are in danger and they're in danger, but there's not really much you could do about it. And so it's just kind of like moving forward. But it's just kind of learning, helping kids understand like their not just themselves, but also their family members and learning how to collaborate as a family, uh, I feel like is more the vibe of the second book.
SPEAKER_01Is there uh a character or uh a moment or a scene in one of your books um that feels especially close to you, maybe more personal that you incorporated? Obviously, um your second book was a love letter to your to your husband. So that's that's personal by itself, but but maybe something a little bit more um personal to you.
SPEAKER_00Interesting. Uh, you know, I don't necessarily know. I feel like the first book was very uh personal, just in kind of like the presentation of the Grimmsbanes and you know, that learning to admit when you're wrong, um, because I'm a very, very stubborn person and I always have been. Uh so I feel like that was important. That's something I had to learn uh more so when I was in college than I learned in any other time of my life. And that's something I wanted to present to young readers. Uh the second book, um, I feel like that's something that every person uh comes to terms with as they're growing up, is that the adults in your lives aren't perfect or infallible, and sometimes they don't know what's going on just as much as you don't know what's going on. Uh, so I feel like that's that was very, very personal to me, just you know, from my experience going up. But I think it's a pretty universal thing for most people is that there's like a time in your life where you're like, oh, so that's like why this adult my life is the way that they are, and that's why they think this way. And I might disagree with them, but at least I can understand where they're coming from. Um yeah, so I think that's where a lot of that came from. Um, but yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, because you had said it was um writing is therapeutic, and and I guess you were pulling out the lesson that that you needed to learn about. You said you were stubborn, and and you're writing this this character has to learn. Learn a couple of things about that. I mean, I I had written something um years ago and it was a complete and total failure, I mean abject failure. Uh and people tried to stop me because they were like, don't do this. But I realized later that that because I felt so compelled to do it, but I realized later that that was actually preparing me to be a foster dad. Um we had we've adopted two of our foster kids. Um, but I mean it's yeah, there's just something there is something like you said, something therapeutic, something that just draws you into your writing, helps you see the world in a better way in a better way.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, just stories that like claw their way out, if that makes sense. Or it's like you have you feel compelled to write them.
SPEAKER_01Yes, yeah, compelled is the that's the word. I mean, it's and that that's why I like to compare it to the hero's journey. It's that you there's like a call and you have to do it, and it doesn't make sense. It takes you out of the world that you're living in, and you feel like you have to do it, and for whatever reason, there's just some sort of uh there's some sort of writing, uh deeper writing that you're looking at of your own life, and you're just being pulled towards that. If if you could go back and speak to yourself at the hardest part in your own journey, um, what would you say? Or to put it another way, I I get a lot of um aspiring authors that watch the show, lots of them, and they're trying to get the tips and tricks, I guess, you know. And you know, what would you say to them if they're kind of going through the slog of it and not seeing any success?
SPEAKER_00Uh I think it's important to reframe how you measure your success. Uh, success isn't something that is external, success has to be something that's internal. So set a goal for yourself that you know you can achieve without anybody else saying yes or no. And if you achieve that, then that is success for you. Uh so for example, saying, I will finish this manuscript, I will finish writing this. Regardless of whether or not you get an agent, regardless of whether or not it gets published, you're still a success because that's the goal you set for yourself. And that's something you have control over. So it's more just taking control back for yourself and your creativity. Uh, or say, like this picking a challenge for yourself. So, like this, if you're working on a manuscript, write from a different perspective that's very not similar to your own. And just, you know, I feel like it just kind of reframing success is very important because there's so much out of an author's control, especially with publishing. So, whatever you can control with your craft, pick on your challenges for yourself and just kind of expand from there.
SPEAKER_01Um, as you've published, and obviously you're getting feedback from people. There's kind of high praise from organizations and libraries and things, but then there's also the feedback you're getting from individual readers. Uh, is there any anything that really sticks out to you as very memorable that you've cherished as getting feedback from uh one of your one of your readers?
SPEAKER_00Yeah. So this is actually a couple of weeks ago. Uh I did a signing where uh a reader's mom reached out to me and she was like, hey, like my daughter loves your book. She's gonna be at the signing. And I figured, you know, if I'm gonna be there, just because like I like to write at that bookstore like beforehand, I was like, Would you be interested in getting coffee? Like you, me and your daughter can sit down and we can talk about the books. So I got to sit down with this mother and her daughter and talk about my books for like an hour and a half and had just the most wonderful time. Uh and the daughter's an aspiring author. So she was able to ask me questions. So I feel like that was just probably one of like, if not one of the most rewarding, if not the most rewarding experiences as an author, which is getting the opportunity to talk with young readers. Um, on a very different note, I did receive a mail from a third grader as a thank you for school visit. And it said, Dear Joan, I hope your next book has sharks or dinosaurs and not very memorable on the totally opposite front.
SPEAKER_01You could you could tell, I mean, probably that sounds like my son, he'd be in class. They're like, now you gotta write a letter to this. It's like an assignment, they gotta write a letter to them. They came and it's like, I hope the next book you do is sharks and dinosaurs.
SPEAKER_00That would be my zero out of five stars. Like, where were they?
SPEAKER_01Well, well, are you? I mean, uh, what are you if you can tell us, what are you working on next and kind of what can you reveal about that?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I will be totally honest. I have about a million coals in the fire right now. There's a lot going on. Um, but I think I'm trying to, especially with middle grade, work on a uh masculine uh POV. Uh, I've never written from a boy's perspective, and I thought that might be a fun and interesting new challenge. So that's definitely in the cue. And then I also have an adult book I'm working on, uh, which is totally different than anything I've ever worked on. Uh, it's called uh Bridesmaids and Broadswords. It's pitched as the hangover meets Narnia, and it's about it's about a bridesmaids that got for the bachelorette, uh wakes weeks later in Narnia with no memory, and the bride's gone. Um, so they have to go rescue her. But uh the reason for that one is I uh half of my bridesmaids got engaged within the same year. So I am in four weddings.
SPEAKER_01Wow.
SPEAKER_00And I'm the uh matron of honor in two of them. So yeah, uh weddings are on the mind. So yeah, there's definitely gonna have to be a wedding book that comes out of all this because it's I'm thinking so much about flowers.
SPEAKER_01And but but no, you're not bringing any broadswords to these weddings because that no, no, hopefully not. I guess it depends on the theme of the wedding.
SPEAKER_00It depends on the vibe and you know, whatever's required, you know.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00If I want broadsword, I will be there.
SPEAKER_01Um yeah, I mean you're you're your husband was into rock, and uh their husbands might be into you know actual sword fighting and renaissance festivals.
SPEAKER_00Dungeons, but yeah, that one's fun to write just because it's very chaotic.
SPEAKER_01But I mean, you're I can I can see why uh your ideas are instantly accepted. I mean, they're just they're just so they're just so different. They're not what you would expect when when you pitch an idea. So you I mean you're pitching this idea, uh bridesmaids meets Narnia. I mean, yeah. Already I'm just I'm picturing Lucy as very drunk, but that just that's a strange mental image. Um Well, how how do you hope that young readers feel? I mean, we've kind of touched on it, but how do you hope that young readers or readers feel uh when they read your book? What is it, what is the message that you hope they come away with?
SPEAKER_00Uh I guess it's twofold. Uh the first thing and the most important thing, I think, especially with young readers, is I hope they have a stupid amount of fun while they read it. I hope that they have an absolute blast reading my books. And, you know, that's the most important thing is you want them to have fun because that's what keeps kids returning to reading. Uh the second hope is that, you know, because my books, the only way to compare it is like when you puree broccoli into like food for kids. Uh, because there's like a deeper message in all of them. And it is that I hope that they resonate with the uh messages that we discussed previously of, you know, critical thinking, of learning to admit when you're wrong, of learning to understand the people around you. Uh, I hope that that does resonate with them. But again, like the number one mission, especially when writing for kids, is to make sure they have a good time.
SPEAKER_01Is there a story out there? It can be either, you know, something you've experienced, or a historical story since you you know American history so well, or a or a folkloric story, um, a legend. Is there a story out there that inspires you, that you're like, this is a really great inspiring individual or an inspiring event, something that inspires you to move forward?
SPEAKER_00I guess it's twofold. Um, so the first is uh just lessons from my own family, uh just knowing the stuff that you know my ancestors went through, my grandparents, my parents, uh everything that they went through inspires me to be better every day, um, just from the people around me. Uh, in terms of like actual books, Percy Jackson changed my life when I was a kid. Uh, it's what originally got me into reading. Uh, it's also what got me into history, because you know, just Greek mythology naturally drew me toward Greek history, which then changed a trajectory of my life because as I got into history, I got into American history, which is how I got into uh an interest in law and politics. And I became like a debater in high school and I was just obsessed with it. But it is strange to think about. If I had never had a friend recommend that book to me, uh my life would have been completely different, just because I might have never discovered those things. So I feel like every day, like I just turn back to those stories that I read as a kid that just it changed you in just ways that you can't really comprehend at the time. Um, but yeah, I feel like Percy Jackson, in terms of like books I read as a kid, was really inspiring to me. And I also got to meet Rick Ryderton when I was a kid, and that was very, very cool.
SPEAKER_01Um really, really, you got to meet him.
SPEAKER_00It was actually very, very funny. Uh, just like as a quick aside. Uh, so I met him right when The Son of Neptune came out. And I was obsessed with Percy Jackson at that point. Um, I had an Instagram account with 17,000 followers dedicated to making Percy Jackson memes when I was that's how obsessed with Percy Jackson I was.
SPEAKER_02Wow.
SPEAKER_00But I waited with my dad in line for three hours, and I got to the front and I had this big long question prepared in my head, and I was so excited to ask it. It was like about the Percy and Annabest relationship and the writing behind it. And I got to the front and I saw Rick and I just like blanked. Like absolutely could not speak, just like blacked out, was so excited. Um, and then he saw my book and he was very, very nice to me. And then as soon as like I stepped to the side, I just started crying because I was so excited. But it was just so important to me. Um, and I still love those books. Like, I think I've you know I've read them like once every two or three years, even as an adult.
SPEAKER_01Have you have you since uh met up with them and been able to have an actual conversation? Because I'm an author too.
SPEAKER_00No, that would be such a dream, but honestly, I might have the same exact reaction as a 27-year-old person.
SPEAKER_01Well, I was gonna I'm gonna try to reach out to him. I'm sure I could get him through the grapevine, but but I could tell him your story. Oh, yeah. Oh my gosh. Listen, we got this, we got this gal who she she set up an Instagram account just to just to really push Percy Jackson.
SPEAKER_00I was obsessed with Percy Jackson.
SPEAKER_01My my favorite author, I don't know if you know uh Lloyd Alexander. It's the he wrote uh the Purdane Chronicles, the the Book of Three, the Black Cauldron.
SPEAKER_00Oh, I know that one. I know the second one.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, they made a Disney movie of it that was terrifying for that generation. But um I didn't know, like, so I I had written him a letter as part of a school assignment my senior year. He's like, You're supposed to write to one of our authors, and and he wrote back, and I didn't know he did that. Like, I didn't know authors did that, like, but he wrote a like a physical letter. He answered my questions and sent it back. And what I learned later, so he died shortly after that, but what I learned later was that he actually, if you showed up at his house in Philadelphia, well, it was outside of Philadelphia, but if you showed up at his house, he would go, Great, do you want to go get a slice of pizza and talk? And he would just chat. Like this author who was a bestseller, had accomplished all these things. And I felt because I had learned that after he had died, I felt so bad because I was like, he could have been a friend. Like I could have just gone and chatted with him. And so kind of that's kind of where this comes from. I love talking to authors um about the stories they write and the stories they're living because it they're just phenomenal. And I I kind of partly I wish I had had that opportunity with Lloyd Alexander and I and and now I'm I hope you have that opportunity with your favorite author.
SPEAKER_00Hey, from real lips to God's ears, we'll see what happens.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Well, um, now you you had said earlier we we were talking about Dad Rock Dragon Quest, and it's actually coming out in paperback, is that correct?
SPEAKER_00Yes, in June. Yep, which would be great. Very excited about that. So yeah, it should be good. Um, yep, and then we also just had the audiobook for the Grimms Banes come out. So anyone who prefers listening, uh, which I do, honestly, um, whenever I'm driving around, I always have an audiobook on. So that's definitely an option for those people too. So yeah, lots of good stuff going on.
SPEAKER_01Yes, and you have a great narrator. I will endorse your narrator. Very good. They can make or break a book. So if if anybody listening to this, you know, is is wanting to listen to the audio version, I can recommend it. So it's you you got a good one. Well done. Well done. Well, um, where can people find you? Where can people support the work you're doing uh and and purchase your books?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, absolutely. So I'm writing rearden on everything. Uh just look up writing rearden, I should come up. Uh, writingrearden.com is my website. If you're looking to purchase books, there's a ton of links on there. That's probably just the easiest way to do it. Um, if anyone is looking for like legal work, if they're an author with questions, they can definitely reach out to me at Retzel and Andres uh because I'm absolutely happy to help authors and just sit down and discuss like any business related questions or IP-related questions that authors might have, uh, because that is part of my practice. Um, additionally, I am actually going to be teaching a uh querying boot camp this summer in June. So anyone in the Pennsylvania region can go on the Scribbler's Den if you're looking for some personalized advice uh about querying and uh you know writing and just want to, you know, have some one-on-one time with some great authors, uh, that not me, the other one. But yeah, it should be a good time. Um, but yeah, that's kind of those those big things that I've got going on. But that's some ways to contact me.
SPEAKER_01Well, uh tell me a little bit about that, the the writing boot camp. Uh is there a link to that?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. Uh so it's through the Scribblers Den. Um it's gonna be four days, three days in Clearville, Pennsylvania at an Airbnb. Uh anyone going has to get ready to lock in because we are gonna be working really hard on preparing queries, submission packages, uh, getting a really polished uh first three chapters. And anyone who signs up before April 1st will actually have the opportunity to be entered into a drawing to get their first 50 pages annotated by me and the other author who are teaching it.
SPEAKER_01Wow. Okay, so if you send me that link, I will put it in the info. Fabio wherever this episode is is shown. Uh and then lastly, the your if if they're looking for advice with you know legal advice, where do they go for that? Is that just your your website?
SPEAKER_00Uh, that's just my law firm. You could either reach out to me on uh the website or my law firm. Um, yeah, so like I have like the contact page on my website, which anyone could reach out to me on that. Um, or Retzel and Andres. Uh Retzel is spelled R-O-E-T-Z-E-L.
SPEAKER_01Rhymes with pretzel is not spelled that way, but well, I will I will include those links as well. Uh so for anybody who's interested, and I know I will get people that are interested. That's just the nature of it. So that'd be great. Thank you.