Torpedo Swimtalk Podcast with Ebony Ebenwaldner - World ranked Masters Pool and Open Water Swimmer and Rower

Want to learn the secrets of a successful win at one of the biggest ocean races in the world? Or how to harness a champion mindset to be successful in the pool? Well my chat with Ebony Ebenwaldner for this week's episode of Torpedo Swimtalk Podcast
might just have all the answers you are looking for.

Fresh from her age group victory at the famous Pier to Pub swim, 20 years to the day since she triumphed in the super-fish category at the same race, Ebony gives us a front-row seat to the evolution of her training, her strategies for leveraging race day conditions, and the incredible mindset that has fuelled her sustained success.

Transitioning from competitive swimming to the world of masters and beyond, Ebony's experience sheds light on the significance of embracing change and the joy of rediscovering one’s passion. Her battle with self-belief, injuries and illness, and the delightful pivot to rowing during the unexpected twists of life, like pool closures during COVID. Her narrative isn't just about personal growth; it's also about the fascinating interplay between the sports she loves and the wisdom gained from decades of athletic pursuit.

This episode is about more than just sports; it's about the life lessons they impart. Facing the challenge of degenerative disc disease head-on, Ebony discusses how she's adapted her training to ensure she remains at the peak of her physical abilities. But it's not all about the competition. She reveals how the sporting world, particularly swimming, has rekindled her dreams and aspirations, drawing inspiration from fellow masters swimmers. 

Ebony’s journey resonates with anyone looking to find enduring joy and success in the pool, on the lake, or any other arena of life.

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Torpedo Swimtalk is sponsored by AMANZI SWIMWEAR

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Transcript

Danielle Spurling: 0:05

Hello Swimmers and welcome to another episode of torpedo swim talk podcast. I'm your host, danielle Spearling, and each week we chat to a master swimmer from around the world about their swimming journey. I've been wanting to get today's guest on the podcast for quite some time. Ebony Ebenwaldner is a super master swimmer both in the pool and in the open water, regularly hitting world aquatics top 10 lists and crushing it in the open water swimming races. What also makes my chat with Ebony interesting is her master's coaching background and also the fact that she took up rowing during COVID and now ranks on the world stage in master's indoor and outdoor rowing. We talk about how the rowing complements her swimming. As you can see, we had a lot to chat about and I will certainly be taking on her open water tips for future reference.

Danielle Spurling: 0:58

Let's hear from Ebony now. Hi Ebony, welcome to the podcast. Hi, danielle, thanks for having me. Yeah, you're really welcome. I wanted to start by saying congratulations on the age group win you had at the Peter pub on the weekend. That's fantastic. Thank you very much. Yes, I was very excited, I bet. So, 20 years to the day after you won the super fish category, tell us what's the secret to your success in winning so many Peter pubs.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 1:28

I guess consistency. Like 20 years is a long time and lots happens over that period of time and it's just about trying to maintain consistency in your training. Year after year after year. It looks different each year but I think just over that period of time I have managed to maintain my time in the water At my elite level probably 7-8 times a week, down to now just a couple of times a week. But it's really just about not having any extended periods of time out of the water and just trying to keep in touch as often as you can throughout each week, month after month, year after year.

Danielle Spurling: 2:08

How did the race look for you on Saturday? What were the conditions like and what was your mindset going into the race?

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 2:15

Funnily enough, I don't normally again. Each year is very different. Some years I'm particularly nervous. I am not as focused as much on open water swimming as I used to be. However, in the back of my mind for the last couple of months I have thought about the fact that it's been 20 years since I first won the super fish category and not a lot of things actually play in the back of my mind or I get sort of emotional or philosophical about. I just sort of had that thought it would be really nice to win the age group. It's not the super fish category, but just to be able to say 20 years and I've commemorated this day by winning the age group category. So basically I was a little bit more nervous than I have been in the past, just knowing that that's what I wanted to do. So I had a few things on my side.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 3:10

This year I've been pretty injury free and being able to maintain a consistent training went to Warrnable over Christmas for three weeks, was able to train many more times than I normally would per week, both in the pool and in the ocean. So it had just been constantly in the back of my mind, particularly that month prior. The conditions were perfect. It was definitely more on my side than maybe a stronger runner or a surf swimmer, because there wasn't an enormous run up the beach and there weren't enormous waves Like there was rolling waves and thankfully I caught them, but in general it was very much a swim.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 3:49

I would call it the swimmer's conditions. It's always a swimmer's race, being a deep water start but just lawn at the end you can have if the tide's out. It's an enormous run and it's a surf beach so you can have really good waves which, to be honest, don't suit me. So when I rocked up on the day, I sort of thought you know, if it's going to happen today is probably all in my favour. I've got some extremely great competitors in my event, so I just didn't have anything to lose. I just took it from the start and really just stayed positive. I knew I was fit, I knew I'd done the work and it just was going to come down to whether or not I caught a wave. And thankfully I did and to be honest, I couldn't have been happier. I couldn't have asked for much more at the end of the day.

Danielle Spurling: 4:36

Absolutely, and were you ahead, straight away from the gun, or did you stay with our friend Lissandra for a little while?

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 4:45

Well, it was probably a little bit controversial because they did say a minute to go and I looked at my watch and I knew exactly where I was sitting with one minute to go. So with five seconds to go, I don't know how most people start, but I always have my toes on the rope that's across, and with five seconds to go, I sort of took my toes off, put my legs behind me and got ready for when that gun went to start kicking, which is exactly what I did. So from that very start, I felt like I was in front and I could feel on my feet the entire way. So, yeah, definitely, as far as I could see, was in front from start to finish. So, like I say, mindset's everything and that's how I plan to do it.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 5:29

I do remember, a few years ago, being out in front thinking, oh my goodness, what's happening? I've been in front and I literally slowed down because I didn't know how to race it from being in front. You know, sometimes, particularly in the years where you swam with men, you were used to swimming behind someone and it was when they separated the girls and the boys and you did. You just sort of had a panic going.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 5:49

I don't think I'm supposed to be way out here by myself, but you know, years and experience all play apart when you're swimming. These big ocean, water swims and yeah, so I was comfortable being there, had a game plan and just followed it, which is basically swim from one boy to the next.

Danielle Spurling: 6:06

I was going to ask you about that. Whether you divided into segments or you go fast at starting, hold on.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 6:12

I think that. No, yeah, so for me I saw that large boy right at the turning boy. So I think that's about 800 meters mark and due to the conditions being so flat, I could say pretty much the whole way. So my intention was always just to swim as fast as straight as I could from that first boy to the turning boy and then, as soon as I turned, just sprint. So really I'm going hard the whole way it sounds like it Pretty much.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 6:44

Look, you know it's a 13-14 minute race and I've recently started rowing and then nine, you know, between eight and nine minutes. So, unlike a swimming race, that's maybe two or three, in particularly 200 backstroke, which is what I normally do, even at 400am, which hurts like a lot, but still only about five and a half minutes. It wasn't as daunting as it could be being between the difference between nine and 13 minutes from, you know, a rowing 2K to the ocean swim.

Danielle Spurling: 7:17

Yeah, I mean it's even more sort of amazing that you were able to do that because you for all of those people listening, Ebony lives inland away, a long way away from the coast and any open water. So obviously going down at Christmas and having a little bit of time in the water really helped with that prep for you, but the rest of the time is in the pool, obviously.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 7:39

Yeah, and I don't get any other time. You're exactly right. During the year it's basically just swimming at the Ballarat Aquatic Centre in the 50-meter pool and nothing more than that. And then the only other time I get is the ocean swimming at Christmas time in Waterville. But I did do the 2.5K state swim at Geelong in November, but again, that was pretty flat. That could have been a swimming pool. The only difference is you're looking, obviously, where you're going. But I feel like you know with Peter Pub, you know what. You've done it many times, you know what to expect. It doesn't change, so it's just about making sure you've got the training behind you and then the confidence comes. But I always love the fact that you can go there and people have not swum at all since the year before and they're going. I had to go there today. Well, I haven't swum since last year, so you know I'm just here for fun and that's what the Peter Pub's about and I love that pub about it too.

Danielle Spurling: 8:41

Yeah, it's got such a lovely carnival feel, hasn't it on the day it?

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 8:44

really does, and you know it's funny because a lot of people it's not their favourite swim, but for me I love that part of it. I love the fact that it's crazy busy, so many people around, all the fanfare, and you know so much to see and do, because, yeah, you do catch up with so many people that you do see once a year and you know what's not to like about that.

Danielle Spurling: 9:07

So take us back to the very beginning of your swimming. How did you get involved? And I know you swam as a teenager and early into your twenties. Tell us how far you went with that.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 9:17

So just started, you know, in Wadonga, actually in Victoria, followed my two sisters who were swimming. My mum does tell a story about how I just jumped in one day and started swimming and I hadn't had any swimming lessons and I joined squad after that so I didn't formally have, you know, the learn to swim program, I just jumped in, kept going. I just always loved swimming and you know, for me I sort of am a Pisces and I feel like it was just in my blood. I'm just a fish Not very good at anything else, like I can honestly say. For me there wasn't any other sports. I tried dancing but you know I had to choose between the two because they clashed so it was always swimming.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 10:03

But I didn't do anything else in my teenage years and so my life was swimming. And you know we're talking morning and night, we're talking nine, eight, nine times a week. We're talking life. It was my life and I loved it and there's no regrets whatsoever. So I swam mainly at well, melbourne Vic Centre as a young ancestor and then also went to Padstow which turned into the SLC Aqueduct in Sydney, swam it as an age group nationals swimmer and then moved into open nationals, always the bridesmaid, you know, always at one level behind, of course, at nationals or b-finals, at open nationals type thing, nothing really exciting or to shout from the rooftops.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 10:49

But you know, I probably lacked a little bit of confidence. I think I was just one of those athletes that never thought they were good enough or, you know, had athletes ahead of them that were faster and just never had that self-belief that I could do it. I have since learned a lot about mindfulness and I've read a really good book about champion mindset recently and I sort of really wished I had that book around when I was youngster because, yeah, I do now know that. You know you can put all the effort in training but it does come down to your mindset on the day and how much belief you actually have in yourself, which I just didn't have at that age, ended with chronic fatigue syndrome in probably two, say 1996, I think.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 11:38

Olympic trials 1996 had a rest and then was introduced to master swimming at 24 by Leigh and Greg Chaplin from Casey Seals. Yep, I was coaching their daughter and they said you should really come and do master swimming. So that's where the master swimming journey started and the rest, as they say, is history, because everything that I couldn't take into my age group swimming I could bring into master swimming because it really didn't matter. It was all about fun, fitness and friendship. Sorry, let's do that one again Bring into master swimming, because it was all about fun, fitness and friendship, which was really the three things that I love most about swimming.

Danielle Spurling: 12:24

I mean it's amazing that you had that career and then you went straight into masters. A lot of master swimmers have a huge gap out of the water and that is probably one of the reasons why you've kept your time so close to what they were back then, because how far is your 200 back stroke time now outside of what you did back in the day, like nowadays it's probably maybe about I would be within 10 seconds, maybe eight, 10 seconds.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 12:50

200 breaststroke, amazingly enough, is even closer. Wow, even more recently it went out a bit more, but then once I started rowing being a leg sport, the breaststroke times dropped quite dramatically, amazingly enough. So, yeah, not too much. Well, when you consider we're talking what you know 20, 30, nearly 25, 30 years it's not a huge amount of time. You know, I always do. When I was coaching masters, I used to always say to my masters athletes make sure you start your times again at the first of every new age group, because otherwise you get to the point where you're 60 and you're going.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 13:30

You know, I'm not as fast as I used to be. I don't know, was that 30? Well, there might be a reason for that. I still tend to do that, but you're right, there hasn't been a post baby. Pre baby there's a little bit of a gut, but post baby there hasn't been a huge change in my times, which is, you know, 15 years, nearly. So not too bad. Again, like I said, it comes down to consistency.

Danielle Spurling: 13:57

You obviously have coached a lot of masters, so are you still, are you coaching presently the moment?

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 14:02

Not swimming obviously had years of doing the swimming and I would do the swimming at the drop of a hat and I always say when I retire, I'll probably go back to coaching swimming because I absolutely love it, particularly masters coaching. I have a you know great love for masters coaching and definitely something I'll go back to when I have more time.

Danielle Spurling: 14:22

Yeah, and I know you started rowing during COVID. Give us a bit of a background to how that all came about and what you've been doing with the rowing now.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 14:31

So, basically, when COVID started, the pools closed and it was as simple as that and, living in Ballarat, if anyone knows Ballarat, we have the 1956 Olympic rowing course. It's called Lake Wendery and it's just across the road from my house actually. So when the pools closed, I actually grabbed some wetsuits and started swimming in Lake Wendery and that went quite well throughout the lockdowns until the lockdowns lifted and the rowers got back on the course and one day I actually nearly got knocked out and someone yelled at me you need to be swimming in lane three and I said well, what does that mean? There is eight lanes. But I had no idea what it meant. So I looked up what the rules of the Lake Wendery rowing course were and, lo and behold, the rowers aren't allowed to row down lane three, so it would be quite safe.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 15:19

Anyway, whilst looking all of that, I saw that there was a learn to row course available at the Ballarat City Rowing Club and I thought you know what? I might just give this a go. I did do a talent identification training camp back at the New South Wales Institute of Sport when I was about 15 or 16 actually came back that I would be a good rower, so I thought, oh, maybe I could give this a go. So anyway, I ended up doing the learn to row course and Meg, the lovely lady that taught me, actually just instilled this love of this new sport. It was very similar to swimming in terms of it was about feel for the water. It was about kind of aesthetic feel. It was about understanding where your body was in the boat as opposed to in the water, and there was so much synergy between the two I just couldn't help but quickly fall in love with it. And the nice thing about it Denial was that you don't get bit unless you fall in from the boat.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 16:28

I also had an issue with because I wasn't scared to fall in. When everyone else has this huge fear of falling in the water, here you've got me that go. Uh oh, I'm falling in, never mind. So they actually called me aerial because they were like you're like a mermaid, you don't care whether you're in the water or in the land. So after a while I did stop falling in.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 16:51

And the thing about rowing is that it's so nice just to be out on that lake, clear mind, very, very similar to swimming.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 17:01

So you know, it's all about technique, it's all about endurance, it's all about programs like I create crazy programs because my rowing programs are very similar to swimming programs, which for rowers, you know, can be a bit odd because they generally do like a steady state which is like a 12 k of one speed or they'll do six, five hundreds or something, whereas, you know, I like to throw in all sorts of different strange things. Um, but the brilliant thing about it is, you know, like swimming, you can just concentrate on what you're doing and forget about what's going on in the world, you know, which is always lovely, and the fact that I live in Ballarat and the fact that the weather here can be a little bit up and down, works beautifully with swimming because, um, a rowing is a leg sport and swimming, predominantly for me, is an arms upper body sport and when it's too cold and too wet or too windy in Ballarat, which is quite often, I can go swimming.

Danielle Spurling: 18:03

So they really do complement and work well together, because I can do them both and neither competes with the other yeah, so are you still competing in your rowing as well, because I know you went to the world indoor rowing championships so, um, I do both.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 18:20

The only negative, to be honest, is that the seasons almost run concurrently, so the rowing seasons pretty much from December, january probably. They do have what they call head races, which run over winter, which are a bit long distance races, which again suits me beautifully, um, but if you could say from January to May is the rowing season, which you know basically is also the open water swimming season here in Victoria, and then we run into states, so, um, and nationals, so national rowing is in May, which is, you know, inevitably often when our nationals is, whether it's April, may, um, and so there's a little bit of a clash there and at the moment, I've been choosing rowing only because I do love the rowing at the moment and I am rowing a bit more than I'm swimming. However, but they don't clash. Um, you know, I'll always swim as well. I tend to prioritize certain things, and the things that I prioritize in swimming is, um, the state championships, both on course and short course, and that's, you know, got a lot to do with gaining times for world rankings and things like that. Um, and you know, if they clash with a minor rowing regatta or something, obviously I'll take the swimming over rowing. But yeah, I do row at both state and national level now in the Masters rowing it's not.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 19:49

It doesn't have the depth of swimming, so it's not as competitive. I guess you could say in terms of you know what I've come from in swimming. It's a shame actually, because it's such a great sport. I think I feel like many more people should try and give it a go and they'd love it. But it's not the easiest sport. It's not as many opportunities there's. You know you've got to obviously have a place you can row and a rowing shed and equipment that you can use, and that's not all readily available, unlike swimming, which is, you know, basically catgobbles, vaiders and a body of water. But they are very complimentary and you know, at the end of the day, if someone doesn't have the opportunity to roll on the water, then you're right. Indoor rowing or rowing on an erg is just as good, to be honest, if not better, because it's hard work.

Danielle Spurling: 20:43

Yes, yeah, it is hard work. I was doing a little bit during COVID and had a little. We had a little Zoom group that we would meet and do some rowing, and boy it was tough.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 20:53

Fantastic? No, it is. It's just like I've got one. And first word my mother-in-law used when she saw it at home was that looks like a torture machine. I went you know what? That's actually a really good way of summing it up it can be very torturous.

Danielle Spurling: 21:07

Absolutely Well, with what you're doing at the moment, give us a bit of a sneak peek into a typical training week for you now.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 21:15

So my training weeks are often varied and this is because it's all dependent on the weather. So on Sunday I'll sit down and have a look at what the weather's doing for the week and, you know, if the winds pretty low most of the week, then I'll, you know, probably row five or six times a week and then I'll break it up with a couple of swims. However, if it's the other way and it's quite windy or it's quite wet, then I'll probably swim three or four times a week and I'll row an erg when I've required to. So, on an average week at this point in time, I'm probably rowing Monday, tuesday swimming Wednesday, rowing Thursday, swimming Friday, and then doing some long rows on Saturday and Sunday.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 21:59

You know, it's a funny thing, I've swum a really long time probably what nearly 40 years, I guess and I do find just twice a week in the water is enough, but obviously can do a little bit more if the weather allows it. And, however, because I'm still a new rower and I'm still learning and I'm still doing a lot of development in the leg power, then I do, yeah, like to row when I can and I find that still required to continue to improve my rowing. You know I've been rowing three years. It's not a long time to have been rowing yet, and I'm still on that progression.

Danielle Spurling: 22:35

How about strength and conditioning outside of rowing and swimming? Do you manage to fit that in with that busy timetable?

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 22:41

I do actually because about six months ago at the National Rowing Championships, a gentleman Tim came up to me and said you know, even though you do it, I follow you as a driver and you do a lot of cardio but I really think you could benefit from doing strength training and obviously at the age of mid-40s I sort of had that in the back of my mind that I should probably be doing a lot more strength training than I do, but I hadn't really included it. I wasn't a gym person. I didn't see myself as somebody that enjoyed the gym. However, with rowing being a leg sport and also considering my age, I did think that doing a bit of weight training wouldn't hurt. So I have, since June, started going to the gym until three times a week actually and, funnily enough, enjoying it a lot more than I thought I would.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 23:31

Different muscles and feeling the muscles that you sort of haven't felt for a while, and somebody that does like to have a bit of pain that's actually quite enjoyable. I'm like I can really feel that I've worked those legs or used those shoulders at the gym yesterday or the other. Oh gee, my abs hurt and it's something I guess, coming from a swimming background, just training every day, you don't really feel those sore muscles after a while. So heading back into the gym and constantly feeling them the next day, I don't know, it's sort of a good feeling, I think. So six months now we'll see how we go, keep going, build up some muscle, not too much conscious of it being, you know, not wanting to be too heavy in both the water or the boat, but definitely feeling the benefit. So far.

Danielle Spurling: 24:24

What exercises in the gym with your strength work do you think are complementing both the swimming and the rowing?

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 24:30

Yeah. So I like to do lots of leg press and single leg squats and leg curl. That's an actually calf extension as well there for my legs there's a lot of. If you consider rowing, it's very much a leg extension type of sport and then I complement that with tricep extension and dips and chin ups and lap pull down for the swimming. So I'm very much balancing it out, I guess you could say, and obviously doing the ab work as well. So looking after the upper body for the swimming and the lower body for the rowing probably look a little bit odd in a boat because I've probably got the wider shoulders on the water, but that's okay.

Danielle Spurling: 25:19

I think it sounds like it's working really well. Have you got yourself a strength and conditioning coach or are you just writing up your own programs?

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 25:26

Yeah, no, I've just read a lot about what's required for the sort of rowing exercises and I do have a little bit of degenerative discs in my back, so things like heavy squats or dead lifts, which are very much designed for rowers, I can't really do with my back. So I do have to do those supported exercises like leg extension and leg press, where you're sort of not having to lift those really heavy weights but compress it, press them out. So, yeah, absolutely still looking at the exercises required, but I haven't got a strength and conditioning coach as such because I guess, yeah, done a lot of weight training when I was younger and sort of have read about what rowing is required and just put the two together.

Danielle Spurling: 26:15

And aside from that problem with you, is it your upper back or lower?

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 26:19

back. No, it's actually I've got three. So I've got Shearman's disease, which is basically curvature of the spine at the top, bondiliosis in the middle, which is like a degenerative disc disease. So I've got osteophytes which basically have grown on the side of vertebrates where they fracture if I sort of run which is why I don't do anything weight-bearing and then a bit of scoliosis in my lumbar. So it's basically designed for heavy lifting. So basically they've said to me, if you don't do any heavy lifting, and I also find anything hard, hard impact, like running for example, they're not ideal and and not recommended. But swimming and rowing both, you know, non-weight bearing and the weight training, like I said, I've adapted that to ensure that it's sort of supporting the back and not hurting the back. They allow me to continue and keep going.

Danielle Spurling: 27:15

Yeah, well, I like the fact, too, that you are doing backstroke as well as freestyle, because I feel like that balances out that sort of you know, when we're doing freestyle and we're sitting, we're in this day and age, we're sitting forward on our computers and it pulls it all forward, whereas I think backstroke really helps with stretching out the back part across the chest and it makes it a little bit easier on the back. Do you find that?

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 27:40

Yeah, absolutely, it's probably one of those things, Danielle.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 27:43

One of the reasons why I probably have been so consistent over so many years is because I can't not swim, and exactly that, like using backstroke it's also really I find I use my core a lot more.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 27:57

You know you tend to do dolphin kick on your back. You tend to do backstroke kick you tend to do, you know, like periscope drill, Like there's a lot of drills with backstroke that also help use your core and like to say, open up your shoulders. And because I am a backstroker, I do spend a lot of time in that position and definitely helps. But I have had periods of time not a long time, to be honest, because I couldn't, but where I hadn't done a lot of swimming and my back basically told me that I wasn't acceptable and I had to get back in. So but yeah, definitely being a backstroker helps with that body position and you're absolutely right, Like I do have a sedentary job on my marketing and at a computer all day and so easy to just get that curved shoulders, Very conscious of the fact that you know, over time I'll probably end up in like a curved spine anyway. So the longer I can stay up, nice and straight the better.

Danielle Spurling: 28:56

Yes, exactly. Are you the type of swimmer that does activation before you hop in the water, or are you just going cold?

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 29:04

No, okay, I'm the type of person that turns up to the pool with my jacket on unzipped bathers underneath cap on goggles on you know go. That's my warmup.

Danielle Spurling: 29:19

That's funny. Don't tell the swimmers that you coach that that's what you do.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 29:23

Look, I think it's a new thing. You know, like, again, I sort of haven't been in the environment with all these new ideas. You know, like I really wish that I was around when we did things like yoga and Pilates. I did stretch cords when I was younger a lot and I got them out during COVID, which was interesting. They were still okay, but we didn't do a lot of. You know, those things that they do now that are so good. It was a, you know, stretching Definitely after training, weight training definitely. But you know, now they do a lot more stuff and I see some of the amazing things people like Kate Campbell and Ariane do on, you know, instagram and that and I think, wow, you know you can see how they are so good and how they are so fast and how that strength and extra work that they do out of the water is, you know, improving their in-water and how come they're so fast and so much faster than we were.

Danielle Spurling: 30:19

I guess, yes, and they're doing it at a very young age as well. Yeah, it's great following all those swimmers on Instagram because it really gives you a glimpse into you know it's a small part of what they're doing, but they're so strong in the GMI find.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 30:33

They are so much stronger, like I look at what they do and you know I was watching the video I don't know if you've seen, you know, kate Campbell's recent videos but she, you know she was rolling out full extension on in a core position and you know, doing chin-ups with all these heavy weights and I just think, oh my gosh, I can't do one. You know tall girls they're not like tiny things, so just exceptional. And it just goes to show, you know, what the body can do and how powerful it is.

Danielle Spurling: 31:06

You know yes.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 31:08

Being able to transfer that strength into the water and watch how fast they go. It's just amazing.

Danielle Spurling: 31:13

So yeah, I got you a lot. I know it's going to be an exciting Olympics this year.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 31:18

It really is. It's going to be a great. I know I can't wait either.

Danielle Spurling: 31:23

I love what I love watching. I mean the rivalry, I think, between Australia and the US, obviously after last year's World Champs, where we had the most gold medals, but the US had the most medals and both were claiming to be the premier swimming country. I think it'll be great to see what it all comes down to in Paris.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 31:41

So exciting. Yeah, I, like you, know all the sports, but especially the swimming. You know, because a lot of them, you know it's the old swimmers, it's the new swimmers, it's the ones that come out of the woodwork, and I think it's just one of those sports where it is about you know who is the best on the day and you know it's anything can happen, and it usually does. Yes, absolutely.

Danielle Spurling: 32:07

And what goals have you got for yourself this year in 2024?

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 32:11

Well, ones achieved, which was to win yeah, the Peer to Pub. For my age group I've also got a few. Obviously I'd like I didn't have a great year in the pool last year because I actually hurt my neck I got a slip disc in my neck so the times I did last year were as good as the year before. So I'd like to actually get back to the year before times, just improve those rankings a little bit, particularly in the backstroke and the breaststroke, and then in the rowing I have some times. So it's a funny sport rowing, because you shouldn't have times, because every day is different and, unlike the pool, where everything is controlled, it couldn't be any further from that. So we'll see how we go with that.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 33:00

But when I first started rowing I set some times 500, 1,000 and 2,000 metre times which I achieved all of them last year. So now I've just set some newer times that are a little bit quicker. I've had a lot of improvement in my stroke. I guess you could say I sort of learnt to row like a swimmer and now I'm slowly learning how to row like a rower, and so I'm hoping the last eight months of technique improvement will help me achieve those.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 33:28

So basically it's a bit time-based, not really outcome-based in terms of medals or anything like that, except for lawn, but the rest are about personal goals and very much about improving myself or at least trying to maintain where I was A time where we can be injury-free. I think it's a good time to be able to achieve those things. Obviously, sometimes we go in life, especially as we get older, we have things that happen that don't allow us to maybe be in that mindset where we can compete against our own personal best times, and it's just about being there and that's enough. But this year, because I have had a good 12 months of injury-free, I'd like to think that I can get back to some of those good times.

Danielle Spurling: 34:13

Yeah, well, I think you're certainly on the right footpath, I should say, to get there, because you're doing everything right.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 34:20

Yeah, and I think just even adding the gym it feels like that's an improvement and the mindset improvement as well. So if anyone's interested, it's the books called Champion Mindset by Alastair McCall I believe it is, and it's very much focused about champions do more, and I think we don't have to be an elite athlete but we can think about how we approach our training and it is very much about gaining what we get put into it. So I think I've probably lived in a little bit in that world that enough is enough. You know, if I turned up, that was enough and when I got what I, you know, achieved at the end of it I sort of thought, oh well, that's good enough.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 35:10

But after reading this book it sort of just changed my mindset about you know, if you do a little bit more, you'll get a little bit more out of it and it's then not just enough. But you know, enough and a bit more. Yes, I don't know. You get to an age where I never thought I would have that mindset again. You know, I thought that was past. You get a bit selfish as you. You know kids grow up and you start to become not just you know, isabella's mum anymore, I'm back to being Ebony Ebenwaldner and it's like oh, what can Ebony Ebenwaldner achieve that Isabella's mum could?

Danielle Spurling: 35:48

I love that yeah.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 35:50

So you know what I mean you sort of not the priority. And then all of a sudden they start to grow up and they have their own priorities and goals and you think, well, maybe I can start to think about that again. You know, and swimming is really a sport from cradle to grave and you know, at 44, nearly 45, I look at someone like you know, dorothy Dickey, and I think I still got 50 years.

Danielle Spurling: 36:11

Yeah, exactly, she's still smashing it out of the beard pub?

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 36:15

Absolutely, and what can we achieve in 50 years?

Danielle Spurling: 36:18

Yeah, who knows, have a go. I know, yeah, that's right, I love it and that's I mean, that's a great thing about master swimming you can. We've got a lot of people, particularly in Victoria, who are swimming well into their 90s and late 80s and still just amazing coming to training all the time and putting in the time and effort.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 36:38

Yeah, so motivated, so motivated. But they get there and they bring something to the session. So they bring inspiration and motivation and, just you know, the fact that they get out of bed and turn up to training is inspiration in itself, and that's a lot of the time all it takes. And once we get there, we're, you know, motivated and we do what's required. But being a non weight bearing sport, you know, if you can stay injury free, it is just something that we can do forever.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 37:11

Forever, that's right, which you know, however, ever that long maybe. But um, yeah, no, lots, lots to afford it, and then you can obviously extend it into other things, like I watched your podcast with Gillian and I kept seeing all these Finn swimming come up.

Danielle Spurling: 37:30

Yes, very interesting. Yeah Well, she's very, very keen to get people involved in that.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 37:38

So much fun. Yeah, new sport relatively new sport can start at any age and you know, just have a go. And yeah, like I say, I've got, hopefully 50 years to go. My tick one of the boxes, not one of those years.

Danielle Spurling: 37:52

Finn swimming, tick yeah Next. So everyone that comes on the podcast, I love to ask them the deep dive five, which is a bit of a snapshot of your swimming. So just give me the first answer that pops into your mind the favorite pool that you've ever swum in? Um Bondi, yep, that's a very popular answer and also my favorite as well, it's beautiful, isn't it Amazing?

Danielle Spurling: 38:17

How about your favorite open water swimming destination? It's not really random, but Port Ferry, here's a curly one for you. Put your coach's hat on Favorite backstroke training drill. To correct overreaching.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 38:30

Periscope into six well, 12 kicks. Six on one leg, one stroke. So starting off with pausing in that vertical position, thumb, thumb, first turning it around to your little finger and then rotating the shoulder to ensure that we are entering outside. Well, 11 and one, so 11 on the right hand side, and then pausing there for 12 strokes before we pull through. So very much about breaking that stroke down into considering, before we enter, where our hand is going and then, once we've entered where our hand is, yeah, I like that I like that a lot.

Danielle Spurling: 39:09

Now put your swimmer's hat on and give me your favorite training set that you like to do.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 39:13

Well, you've joined me with this one and it's still the same one. I'm not very exciting, but I like five 100s. The first one is 25 fast, 75 easy. The second one is 50 fast, 50 easy. The third one is 75 fast, 25 easy and the last one is well. The fourth one is 100 fast, followed by 100 easy being the fifth one.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 39:37

And the reason I love it is because it's so versatile. Like you can do it all form stroke you can do. Like you could do 2100s, for example, one set free, one set form. You could do 2100s form. You can do 2100s and have one set of each stroke. You could do one set kick, one set pull. You know you could do it all freestyle, like I. Just like the versatility of it. You don't have to do it four times. You could do it three times. You do it six times, you can do it on all different times as well. So you could do it all on two minutes, or you could start at 140 and go to 145, 150, 155, two minutes for the easy. So it's the same set, but it offers so much variety and I'll always revert back to it if I'm training for anything, in particular week 200 backstroke or, you know, 400 am 800 am Yuck, it's just that set that you know.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 40:31

you don't have to think, you can just do it and do what's required in the set without having to overthink anything else. Really, yeah.

Danielle Spurling: 40:40

I like it? And how about the swimmer you most admire? And why?

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 40:46

good question. You know who I really admire at the moment. It's probably Emma McKay-Lan. I love her poise, I love her grace. I can see that she's actually really competitive on the inside, very quiet and under, you know, shy, almost shy, but non aggressive on the outside. But I watch what she achieves and I think there's somebody that trains hard, there's somebody that would be easy to train and I think she'd be joyful to train with, just because she'd be someone that you could look up to in training and learn a lot from her.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 41:24

I obviously love a lot of the swimmer's past and present, but when I look at Emma above everybody, I see somebody that's, you know, really maintained her self, be it from beginner to end. She's never really changed in personality. The last world championship she didn't do great but she didn't make a big fuss. You know she was still Her same poise person, yeah. So I really think that I admire her the most and a little, you know, like her a lot and I look forward to seeing how she goes in Paris, should she get there because of course, you've got to get there.

Danielle Spurling: 42:03

Let's hope so. I'm sure she will, but yes, let's hope so. I mean, it's very tough being an Australian female freestyle sprinter. It's just stacked.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 42:12

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, she does also the fly as well and she's so beautiful, so flat. I love how flat is With her fly. You know, it's quite amazing to watch really.

Danielle Spurling: 42:25

Yeah, she's, she's beautiful technique. I went and watched the the trials for the world championships which we in, and second just watched her warm up and go about you know, everything, just as you said, very understated. Just other people were quite a presence in the pool, but she was just in there doing what she needed to do. Beautiful technique. Just enjoyed watching her.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 42:49

Mmm, and she would be so much. But you would never know it, and I think you could walk past her in the street and if you didn't know who she was, you wouldn't know it. You know what I mean? I think there's, you know, just, it's a lovely humble, that's probably the word is way to be, and I'm sure she'll achieve a lot post swimming as well because of that. Got Cody.

Danielle Spurling: 43:10

Yeah, I hope that that's that. Have that stays together. That would be nice.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 43:15

Yeah, why actually they say no article the other day where he said that she's really shown in. You know a lot about, you know he could have gone off the rails, obviously as a International singing star, but as an athlete, you know you've got to be healthy and Focused and focused on the good stuff and I thought you know that. I think they make me come.

Danielle Spurling: 43:38

Listen to us. Well, Ebony, thank you so much for joining us on the podcast today. It's been lovely getting a bit of a glimpse behind Everything that you do to be such a success in the pool. So good luck with all your goals this year and we'll catch up at the next meet.

Ebony Ebenwaldner: 43:59

Lovely Thanks, danielle. Thanks for having me.

Danielle Spurling: 44:01

You're welcome, okay, bye. Bye, I hope you enjoyed my chat with Ebony and that she has inspired you in your own swimming journey. Look out for a competition that we have coming in the next few weeks, which I'll be putting up on our socials, so make sure that you enter for a really great prize that I've been gifted, and I think that you will enjoy using it along the way. Till next time. Happy swimming and bye. For now, you.