Torpedo Swimtalk Podcast with Bobby Hurley - World Records To World Class Coaching

World champion and former short-course world record holder Bobby Hurley joins me for a ripper Torpedo Swimtalk episode — from winning the World SC 50 Back in Istanbul to racing everything from the 50 back to the 1500 free, then flipping the script as a coach and World Aquatics commentator. We get into range, resilience, and how the sport’s shifting toward stronger, more athletic swimmers — plus his current role leading the program at Tanglin School in Singapore.

Why listen: Bobby’s one of the rare swimmers to master both sprint backstroke and long-distance freestyle — and he shares exactly how he trained both ends of the spectrum. We unpack his pivot from missing Olympic teams to claiming a world title, then moving into coaching world champions Chad Le Clos and Cameron van der Burgh. Bobby dives into how late-career PB's are becoming the norm thanks to smarter training loads, strength work, and mental-health support, and he breaks down the short-course tools that made him a world champion — underwaters, rhythm, and race-day precision. He shares how he prepares to commentate for World Aquatics and keep his insights sharp, and we chat about how adding the form-stroke 50s to the Olympics is changing the sport. Bobby also reflects on racing the 50 back at Masters Worlds in Singapore — including what he’d tweak if he raced long course again, and how Masters swimming reminded him that joy matters just as much as results.

Chapters

• 0:00 Welcome And Bobby’s New Chapter In Singapore
• 2:35 Building An All-Through School Program
• 4:55 Coaching Amanda Lim And Longevity In Sport
• 8:25 Rethinking Volume Versus Sprint Models
• 11:00 Training Across Extremes And A World Record
• 15:10 Why Short Course Strength Didn’t Translate Long Course
• 18:35 Australia, USA, And The Rise Of Strength Culture
• 21:05 Lani Pallister, Surf Skills, And Open Water Potential
• 23:00 2012 Short Course World Title Mindset
• 26:20 Supporter Break And Community Perks
• 27:14 50s At The Olympics And Sprint Specialization
• 30:20 Injuries, Stem Cells, And Reinvention
• 34:20 Two-Stroke 50 Back And Selection Drama
• 37:10 Coaching Chad Le Clos And Cameron Van Der Burgh
• 40:40 Commentary Breakthrough And Staying Current
• 45:10 Masters Racing Return And Singapore As A Swim Hub
• 49:30 Masters Mindset, Training Reality, And Coaching Trends
• 52:20 Deep Dive Five And Closing

Transcript

Danielle Spurling: 0:05

Hello, swimmers, and welcome to Torpedo Swim Talk, the podcast celebrating swimmers at every stage, from Masters Legends to Olympic champions. I'm your host, Danielle Spurling, and each week we dive into inspiring conversations from around the world about performance, resilience, and the pure love of swimming. My guest today is Bobby Hurley, world champion, former world record holder, and the rare athlete who could win everything from the 50 back to the 1500 freestyle. His career has spanned elite racing, elite coaching, and now leading the program at Tanglin School in Singapore. Plus, you'll know his voice from the World Aquatics commentary. Let's hear from Bobby now. Hi Bobby, welcome to the podcast.

Bobby Hurley: 1:01

Hi Danielle, yeah, thanks for having me. Excited to uh to chat all things swimming with you for the next uh 30 minutes or however long we uh we end up speaking for today.

Danielle Spurling: 1:10

No, it's really really great of you. I know you've got such a busy schedule as you're the director of swimming at the Tanglin School in Singapore.

Bobby Hurley: 1:18

Yeah, um I've been here for for over three years now, and um I guess it was a really fortunate opportunity. Um, and I feel like since retiring from swimming, I've I've been lucky enough to have to have a few of these opportunities. But I was, I guess, approached for the role from a colleague back in Australia that thought um, I guess one that that I had the skills and um I was capable of of doing a really good job here at a at an international school, a British school. Um, but obviously Singapore's made up of a lot of international schools, but but also it's it's been he thought and and it has been a really good fit for my family. Um, you know, my wife's Russian, um, my mum's Filipino as well, so we've got a lot of mixed mixed um heritage in my family, and and my kids have been fortunate enough to to move countries, um, go to an international school, and and then we travel all around Asia and we've been over to Russia and Europe a few times as well as a family. So traveling was something that's um really important, important to us as as a family, um, and still involved in in coaching and and at a school level as well. Um, and it and it cont uh I guess it goes well with my commentating as well that I do with Walt Aquatics for the World Championship. So it's a good uh it's a good life balance here, and I'm really happy.

Danielle Spurling: 2:31

And what does a sort of a day, a typical day, look like at Tanglin? Is it teaching or mainly coaching?

Bobby Hurley: 2:37

Um no, it's still yeah, it's still mainly coaching. Um, so we have eight swimming sessions a week for for my squad, but um you know overall I I manage the program um for the co-curricular program, so not PE swimming and curriculum swimming. Um but we've got 600 kids in the whole program from learner swim all the way up, and it's just internals, so it's a little bit different to Australia where they allow externals to come in. It's it's strictly internals, it's strictly students. So, in terms of that, there's a lot more um pastoral care and safeguarding that goes into looking after each and every one of those um students, all the way from three years old, is when they start school here. So we've got an infant learn to swim program all the way up to 18-year-olds, so it's um pretty busy. And then the last 12 months I've been coaching uh a Singapore national team swimmer as well, Amanda Lim. She's 32 years old, so she comes in during the day um and uses our facilities. And I coach her, and she raced the 50 freestyle at uh World Championships a few months ago and is preparing for the Southeast Asian Games in December this year. So I still um wanted to have uh I guess skin in the game at that high performance level and have somebody that's um you know a professional athlete that's really focused towards their goals. So that combines in well with firstly with my my day and then also um uh coaching the school program. Yeah, uh Amanda um she swam in Brisbane in 2024 for six months leading up to the Olympic trials with with uh David Lush in Brisbane um and did two PBs at 31 years old, which is pretty impressive in the 53 and 100 free, and missed the Olympic team by a few one hundredths of a second, which is uh uh uh uh as I know, but uh pretty pretty heartbreaking. Uh and she wanted to be in Australia again and and do things differently. Um so you know, again, with with my intentions of having a bit of skin in the game at that level, and um, you know, I'm good friends with uh with Tim Lane, who's who's my mentor and one of my best mates, and what he's done with Ken McAvoy, we've tried to um add a little bit of that to her program um and and keep her swimming at a high level for the remainder of her career um for the next year or two. And she also did swim masters in in Singapore uh recently. So she's one of the I think she was the only athlete that swam at World Champs and at Masters. Uh and she obviously won the 50 freestyle for her age group uh at Masters as well. But um, yeah, it's been a um I guess a challenge, but also um it's good to see her enjoying her swimming at this age and still striving towards her goals. Yeah.

Danielle Spurling: 5:09

I mean, that's amazing to get that that time at 31. And we're we're seeing that more, more and more, like with with Cam actually and then other swimmers. Just the um this last weekend the British Masters Championships have been on, and a few people have posted um you know, times, lifetime PBs.

Bobby Hurley: 5:26

Yeah, well, I I mean in all sports, I guess it's carrying on like the professionalism of of sports, sports science recovery protocols. Um, you know, you look at LeBron James, who's 41 years old, uh playing NBA at you know, still one of the best basketball players in the world. Tom Brady through to his uh 40s, Cameron Smith in rugby league was I think 39 when he retired playing 400 plus NRL games. So, you know, that's certainly tracking upwards, which is giving, and obviously with more and more money going into, I wouldn't say swimming, but other professional sports. They want to be involved in sports for longer, so they're gonna take care of their bodies. Um, and you know, we're seeing swimmers do PBs and perform at their best well into their 30s. Um, I'm sort of looking forward to, you know, in in five or 10 years' time, we'll get a generation of athletes that also, for lack of a better word, weren't flogged in their youth, you know. Um, so they're gonna get to 25 and 30 in a much better position than Ken McAvoy did or Amanda Lim did, or myself, in terms of um, you know, their understanding of the sport and what their body needs, but also just, you know, a lot less mileage in their shoulders and and overall body, and probably less intense scrutiny from a from a mental health point of view. You know, that that's certainly been a big shift, I think, on the Australian team and in sport in general is um taking the pressure off everybody, um, having a psychologist and and people being open to working with with sports psychologists and looking after their mental health, whereas it wasn't really something that was ever talked about in sports, you know, even not that long ago when I was swimming, let alone um 15 or 20 years ago.

Danielle Spurling: 7:05

Well, what's your stance on on say a Cam McAvoy type person, having done all that sort of slog in the early years and obviously was working for the 100 free? Now shifting that to his three sessions a week, very, very minor, not minor, but very small amount of Ks that he does per week. Do you think that you can come to that without doing that slog background? Because a lot of people think you still have to do that, and then once you've got that sort of base, you can go to that sprint format that Cam's doing. What's your stance?

Bobby Hurley: 7:39

Well, that's the um that's a million-dollar question, isn't it? Um, I I guess, you know, and I've been asked this before, but probably the the first thing to acknowledge is that Kim McAvoy is really, really talented. He was talented as a 15-year-old, he was talented as an 18-year-old. You know, um, I think he went 54 low and 100 backstroke as a teenager. He's done 400 freeze. Like this guy's one of the most talented athletes that we've seen in the pool on the men's side for the last few decades. But no, we didn't we saw glimpses of his best, but it wasn't a consistent, glittering career over the space of his first three three Olympic experiences, right? And and he's been able to figure out what he needs and what what he wants to do to perform in the 50. And originally he did want to focus on that hundred as well, but it um you know the priority was to just win that Olympic gold in the 50. Um, and you know, how he's been able to transition that, but but Cam's also very staunch that if if he I guess had the confidence and and the knowledge to apply aspects of what he's doing now earlier in his career, it would have benefited him. The the other bit I would say is that there's no, if you've got a really talented 10 or 11-year-old, there's no sprint training for a 10-year-old kid, right? That you're not training speed, that there's no anaerobic capacity for anybody who's pre-puberty, right? It's it's all technique, and you can make more gains in your aerobic base than you can in your anaerobic, probably to the age of 15 or 16. So I think there's an element of, and I like even with my program that people got to step through the hoops of of the sport. You've got to you've got to sit at the pool for 12 hours on a weekend and swim three times, right? You've got to do relay relays with your teammates, you've got to do training camps, um, you've got to fly in the state and be able to race on a six-day meet, you know. So there's elements of aerobic capacity that goes in in all of that as well. But um the the main bit is I I think if if somebody doesn't want to do it, then then the coach has got to be out adaptable to be able to get the most out of that person's potential or their talent, right? Um, you know, I I swam probably 10 times a week since the age of 14 or 15, but but I loved it. I loved training. All my mates did it, it was very normalized, my sister did it, and I enjoyed the process. So um, you know, it was always more volume, more training, the better you're gonna get. And for a long time, those were the results that I got, but I was never forced to do it either. So I I enjoyed that process. But um, yeah, up at Somerville with with Tim Lane, he's got Josh Conyus there who's you know 22 low as a as a 16, 17-year-old, and and he's doing a very low amount of volume as well. So there's you know, you've got one person in their 30s who's the best in the world, and one person who's a teenager who's the best in the world in their age group. So that project with Tim and Josh will be uh uh you know interesting to watch over the next few years.

Danielle Spurling: 10:42

Yeah, watch this space.

Bobby Hurley: 10:44

Yeah, yeah.

Danielle Spurling: 10:46

Taking it back to just you rather than more of a general thing, you've world record holder, multi-distance specialist, and you were that rare mix of a mid-distance freestyler, but also a sprint backstroker. So you did the four and the eight hundred free, and even the 1500, 50 and 100 back. That's a really unusual combo. How on earth did you train for that?

Bobby Hurley: 11:07

Yeah, I I guess summarising my career, like um I had success in all those events, so I trained for them at different points. Um, so I can understand what distance swimmers are going through, what sprinters are going through, what what older athletes are going through. Um, but as a teenager, I was I was just a sprint 1500 um, you know, fly back, maybe a 200 im every now and then. But um, and my sister was the same. So I think genetically, you know, we had long arms and and a really low stroke rate, and I wasn't strong in the gym, but technically we were pretty good. Um so I think you know, physiologically uh I was a sprinter. Um then I because I again I enjoyed the process of training, and um in the year above me at school and at and at swimming was um well, people might might know Josh Minogue, who won the cooling out of gold, Iron Man, um, commentator now for for the surf. And Josh was like a hard ass 200 fly, 400 freestyle trainer, like one of the toughest guys that you'll ever do a workout with. So that was to me, that was just that was normal. That's Josh led the squad and we all had to go with him. So when I was about 17, I just jumped into the into the distance group. Um, and I I plateaued a little bit, and I just did a couple of 70, 80k weeks with him through year 12 in school. And again, we we thought it was cool, we thought it was fun just doing 10, 8k long course sessions in Wollongong with uh with Ron McKean as our coach. Then I did my first 400 freestyle at 18 and went um 401, I think it was, and then went to nationals that year, and um Neg split a 354, um yeah, and and got six at Open Nationals that never even you know never got an age medal at nationals before and got six at open nationals behind Gren Hacken and Craig Stevens. So this is the back end of 2006, and um and then got recruited to go to the AIS as a as a mid-distance freestyler, but I was so new into it, and and I went there and Doug Frost was my first coach, and then Vince Rayleigh there, and everybody only ever knew me as a mid-distance freestyle. And I was like, hang on, like I'm a pretty good sprint backstroker, and you know, I always prided myself on underwater kick. I loved underwater kicking sets and just being able to hold my breath longer than everybody else and and little things like that. Um, but the older guys there never really believed me, and then um it was 18 months later, um, I broke the world record in the 50 backstroke, which I mean I'd had some really good short course backstroke success at that point. And and again, I was my underwater was was definitely my my strongest point. Um but I swam, you know, what I haven't really said before in other podcasts, like I broke the world record on a Sunday afternoon in Sydney at the World Cup. Um, and I've got logbooks of this. I swam 50k that week and broke the 50 back world record on a Sunday afternoon. Um, I think being in the water, obviously double Saturday, double Sunday, I think I was in the water like 11 times um that week. But you know, I had the aerobic capacity to to perform um at a high level for a long time. But um, yeah, I realized I've done a long talk, a lot of talking, and we've only got to the start.

Danielle Spurling: 14:25

But I'm so interested.

Bobby Hurley: 14:28

Yeah, I I guess quickly, quickly to move through it. It was probably in the end like a gift and a curse that it was I was so versatile and I was good at really good at obviously short course backstroke, um, but long course was never as strong. Um, and you know, even after I broke that world record in October 2008, I think it's almost 16 years, 17 years to the day, uh, which is crazy to think. But um in 2009, you know, with with Vince, um, Grant Hackett and Craig Stevens both retired. So I got third in the 400 free at um Beijing Olympic trials, and fourth in the 200-back, fifth in the 100-back. So I got third, fourth, and fifth of those Olympic trials. But I was pretty young, missed the team. But my opportunities were going to come in the distance freestyle, whereas we had um Ash Jelaney and Hayden Stokel in the backstroke. So that 2009 I was and 2010 I was all 400 up, you know. Um, so we we trained for the 1500 free and and I and I went upwards towards that. So it's pretty crazy. I broke the world record in the 50 back, and literally after that World Cup tour, uh, I was training for the 1500 freestyle. But yeah, maybe you can ask Vince what what the mindset was behind that. But but again, I I agreed. I went, yeah, that's my ticket onto the Australian team. Went to Rome, swimming the 4, 8, and 15 there, and um, and that was the focus for the next few years. But you know, again, in hindsight, that I I had a couple of good 1500 freestyles. I went 1432 short course and 15 minutes flat long course, but I and I enjoyed the training for that. My stroke was suited for that, but I I don't think my body was suited for that. Probably after 18 months of of of that high volume long course training, um, my body started to break down. I got glandular fever, got a lot of shoulder, shoulder problems, and my mind wanted to do it, but my body couldn't do it anymore. Um, and and you know, uh then whenever that happened, then I've gone, oh well, I'll switch back to the backstroke. And then I I narrowly missed the London Olympic team as well. And and from that point, there was a lot of too-ing and froing between short course, long course, freestyle backstroke, going to the US and back to Australia and changing coaches, changing programs. But that's probably when I learned the most about myself and about the sport, and um got to travel and live in the US and and do a few uh be successful at a lot more World Cup tours as well. So um I think that that um you know seesawing between the two opposite ends of the spectrum has has been able to help me become the coach I am and the commentator I am and and articulate so well um to people that are that are watching and listening.

Danielle Spurling: 17:11

Yeah, I I agree. I want to dive back into something you you just mentioned before, that you had a lot of success in short course sprint backstroke, but you found it hard to sort of move that into long course. What what do you think was missing there? What looking back on it now?

Bobby Hurley: 17:26

You know, at the time we thought just needed to do more more backstroke training. Um, and I, you know, I didn't really enjoy training backstroke because uh yeah, I technically I didn't think my backstroke was great. I was just such a good underwater kicker and and kicker, you know, and and it again it probably disguised a lot of things, and my stroke rate was so low and it would always decrease throughout a 50. Um, whereas in short course I only had to do eight strokes a lap, so I was able to maintain a better rhythm and then just go 15 meters underwater. Um, with the knowledge I have now, I'm purely I'm pretty confident I just wasn't physically strong enough to swim long course. Um when I was 18, I could only do one chin-up in the gym. That's what I always tell these kids now. Um, you know, I remember going to the AIS doing testing, and we and it was max rep chin-ups, and I did one, and they said, What are you doing? Keep going. I said, That's all I can do, you know. Um, and 18 months later, I broke the world record in a 50-meter event. Um, and and I got a lot stronger, but I was, you know, in any squad that I was in, I was uh the skinniest, uh weakest person in the gym. Um, so that's something that I'm trying to improve, you know, now as an adult, but I don't, you know, it I don't think it was a a training thing or a training capacity. I I sort of think I wasn't physically strong enough to swim to hold stroke rate in a long course pull, um especially backstroke freestyle. I I was better at long course freestyle, but long course backstroke, I just don't think I had the strength to do it with my arms and my levers were so long, and and again, I didn't have I had a lot of elbow and shoulder problems towards the back end of my career, and uh didn't didn't have the physical strength that other people have now. And I think that's one of the big shifts in elite swimming at this point is these guys are physically putting a lot more focus and effort into their strength and conditioning programs than than we did in you know the late 2000s, 2010s. Um that becomes a major part of the program that the college swimmers as well. And I think they're just they're they're more physical and more athletic than let's say the best swimmers in the world were 20 years ago that were fishers. Now they're now we're getting athletes. Um and and that's translating into short course racing, as we saw with all the world records broken recently at the World Cup.

Danielle Spurling: 19:45

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, someone was telling me just yesterday that um Kate Douglas and Gretchen Walsh were actually lifting on the days they were swimming at the World Cup.

Bobby Hurley: 19:55

Yeah, yeah, incredible. Um and I mean you're getting, you know, Gretchen is, you know, like literally she must be six foot four. Yeah, she's very tall. And and she's got dynamite underwater kicks and everything else. But um, you know, that Virginia program with with Todd DeSorbo is producing a lot of top-tier athletes, more so on the female side as well. So he's got that combination right. Um, especially in short course. I think overall I would say Australian women long course are better. And if you look at our women, they're not as physically big or muscular, but they're a lot more fitter, and again, they're a lot more long course specialists. When you look at Kaylee and Ariane, Molly, Emma, Kate, they're a lot more that slender, lean, fit and strong, functionally strong. Whereas some of these American male and female swimmers are you you walk past them on pool deck, you're like, oh my god, they're just so athletic. Yeah.

Danielle Spurling: 20:52

Although in saying that, Molly and Kaylee did and Lani did beautifully world records over the weekend. Yeah.

Bobby Hurley: 21:01

Yeah, they they they did. I mean, Australia's in such a golden pocket at the moment, um, even with obviously, you know, quite surprising news for that Ariane is is retiring, but she's had an amazing career, can't take anything away from her. And there's, you know, we've had Emma, Kate, and Bronte retire in the last few years, and it just keeps going, you know. Uh, we just keep producing, and there's a lot more sprint girls that that are waiting for their opportunity as well. And um, obviously the the the high performance side in in Australia figured out the the combination to get the best out of these girls uh when it matters the most in the long course pool. And if Molly and Kaylee and Lani are doing that short course, then geez, watch watch out for for their next long course season next year.

Danielle Spurling: 21:44

I I thought Lani's swim was just amazing. 800. I mean, taking down one of Ledecki's records is uh not something to be sneezed at.

Bobby Hurley: 21:52

No, incredible. I mean, by by over three seconds, you know, and she she got better throughout the three stops, which was the theme from from all of the swimmers. But you know, she swam a gutsy race in Singapore to to put herself in the frame um against Ledecki and Summer and almost came out on top. But again, Lani's, you know, she was such a talented junior swimmer coming through. She's she she dominates in the surf. Like, you know, she's she swims with that two-beat kick. Um, if she ever wanted to, like Lani would be almost unbeatable in open water. I don't know. 10k is at the stretch, but her skills in the surf, being able to navigate through water, uh she'd be I uh she'd be tough to beat, you know? Yeah. If she ever wanted to do it, but she's so good at the pool and she's got range all the way down to the 200 as well. So um that's somebody you know the media and everybody's gonna be talking a lot more of in the next few years.

Danielle Spurling: 22:49

I I saw her swim the um, or she's won the Peter Pub um down in uh lawn for the past few years, and I saw her swim it last year. She's just so strong, so strong. And as you said, great surf skills.

Bobby Hurley: 23:01

Yeah. She'd probably beat, I mean, in a in a race like that, she'd probably beat what all but one or two of the men as well. Yeah. Like there wouldn't be many guys that could beat her in in the Peter Pub.

Danielle Spurling: 23:10

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, it's hard to know because they put them in different waves, but um, yeah, that's she's definitely yeah, so versatile and will be really one to watch, obviously heading into LA.

Bobby Hurley: 23:25

Yeah. Well, also, I mean, you know, uh a lot more I don't know Lani, you know, personally too too closely, but you know, she was a star in 2017 at Junior Worlds and obviously had some some setbacks and missed Tokyo, but it's it's sometimes it's those that have missed that then then light a fire, right? So then even between Tokyo and Paris, she'd like I remember in Budapest World Champs one year, she'd made the final, she's looking good for a medal, then she got she got covert and had to pull out, you know. And then in Paris, I think she pulled out of she got COVID there, had to pull out of one of these finals. You know, she swam an awesome leg on the relay, so she is an Olympic gold medalist in her own right, but I guarantee you she doesn't feel like the world has seen the best of her in that 800-1500 freestyle, you know. So that chip on a shoulder on the right type of athlete can can drive them for a very, very long time.

Danielle Spurling: 24:19

I agree. I don't think we've seen the best of her yet.

Bobby Hurley: 24:22

No, no, not at all.

Danielle Spurling: 24:24

Let's look back at your world um world championships in 2012. Won the 50 back stroke, um, world title, and in 2304, take us back to the beginning of that swim. How did you feel? How did you swim it? What are you what are your thoughts on it now?

Bobby Hurley: 24:43

Yeah, I mean, that one, you know, that was at the end of 2012, and again, that was a tough year. Um, missing the the London Olympic team. Um, and then there are a lot of changes. So, I mean, you know, again in in 2008 Olympic trials, I got third, fourth, fifth, and then 2012 I got third in the 400, seventh in the 2003, where they take six, and uh sixth in the 1500. So at those Olympic trials six months before, I swam the four, eight, four, two, four, and fifteen hundred free. I didn't swim any backstroke that I basically didn't swim backstroke from 2010 to 2012, didn't race it, didn't didn't do any any quality work at training backstroke. And you know, I I for the space of a couple of days, I think I quit after London Olympic trials. Um, I was 23 and a half, had missed the last two Olympic teams. But I knew I'd love swimming and I wanted to swim. But um, you know, what I was doing just wasn't working for me and I I wasn't enjoying the process every day. I was struggling at um racing, obviously, and and hit a big plateau in those uh freestyle races. So I um I started training with uh Adam Cable, who was the assistant coach at the time at Olympic Park, um and said, yeah, let's just do short course, um, focus on that, get back into some backstroke again and see what happens. So I I went to that 2012 World Cup tour. Um back then it was eight legs uh over six weeks. So eight two-day meets across six different countries, three continents. So a lot of fun. So I'm I um again, I had no financial support. I I maxed out three credit cards, paid 20 grand, went on the World Cup and said, uh, if I make the money back, I'll keep swimming. If I don't, I'm I'm finished, you know, I'm washed up in Australia. So um, and I had a great time that year um rooming with Kenneth Toe, who who was the overall winner, one of my good mates, and and we tore up the short course circuit and then went to uh Istanbul at the end of 2012. And um, you know, even the whole time I'll I'll I always trained for the 100 backstroke. That gave me more chances to use my underwaters, and obviously I had a higher capacity, more of a mid-distance background, and had the hunter back on the first two days, and and I broke the Australian record in the heat, fastest qualifier. I was like, sweet, PB in the heat. Um went a little slower in the in the semi, slipped off the start. This is before backstroke wedges, and then in the final went 0.1 slower again, which I never go slower from heat semi to final, and um and got fourth and missed the medals. And I was 24, and I remember um Marie Kagura swam that night and got fourth in the 100 freestyle. And she was a bit older than me, and we're like, what are we doing? This is our chance, you know, to get medals at world championships, and and we keep slipping. And I was so mad after that race, I was so angry. And I think that anger like fueled me leading into the next few days. So the 50 back was the next two days after that. And that would like I said with Lani with that chip on the shoulder, I was I just remember thinking, I'm not gonna let this slip, you know, I'm not gonna let this race slip. Um uh I had two fast guys obviously on on either side of me, and I was just I'm I just said I'm beating both of these guys next to me no matter what. And uh if someone gets me from an outside lane, so be it. But um, yeah, when I when I saw that I won the race, it was it was a great feeling of of relief. Um I wouldn't say relief, but just just joy. Um yeah, I'm that was the only time I've really um punched the air um, you know, like you really meant it. And mum and dad were in the stands watching as well. But it was for on a such a tough year, up and down year, um, that was like finally like I did it, you know, and I was world champion. So and yeah, it's something I'll never forget.

Danielle Spurling: 28:29

Well, I mean, what a great memory to have in your your bank of memories. You've got so many of them, but that's a that's a a you know, a special one.

Bobby Hurley: 28:37

Yeah, it's it's um, you know, I I always sort of think um, you know, especially short course wise, you know, I got one world record and one one world title, but um did a lot of World Cup tours and I was consistent, I could be consistently fast for a long period of time on especially short course. So, you know, you know, I beat Matt Grievers in that race, who was um, you know, Olympic champion, um, and Stanislav Donitz, who was he was a short course guru at the time as well for a long time. But I knew that um, you know, when when I went to World Cups and these guys saw me there, you know, that their eyes would roll, they'd be like, oh man, I gotta I gotta race him. So I knew on my day I I could be the best in the world um and and and achieve those really big moments. I just didn't have that for eight years in a row, but I knew on my day I was I was I I was one of the best swimmers in the world.

Danielle Spurling: 29:33

Hey swim talkers, just a quick break to say thank you for supporting the show. If you'd like to become a Torpedo Swim Talk supporter, you'll get early episode updates, master swim workouts each month delivered straight to your inbox, and access to our private WhatsApp group. And a personal shout out on the podcast. Your support helps us keep sharing the stories of swimmers from masters to Olympic champions. You can find the link to become a supporter in the show notes. And I'd love to welcome you to the swim talkers community. And I mean, obviously the 50 form strikes are coming into the LA Olympics. What are your thoughts on that? That would have been your ticket onto the team, I think, back then.

Bobby Hurley: 30:14

Yeah, yeah, I mean, not just into the Olympics, but um it, you know, in Australia, that was I mean, the other thing with winning in Istanbul, that was it was almost looked down upon in Australia. It was short course, which we never respected, and it was a non-Olympic event. So, you know, I got that year from you know swimming Australia, I got no funding, um, no, no incentive, no bonus for anything for winning Australia's only gold medal at the world championships, but that was that was the rules. I I accept that. But um, very different now, where people can continue getting funding even if they get injured, even if they have a year off after the Olympics, if they swim only form stroke 50s, that now gives them funding. That now gets them selection onto world championships and now into the Olympics. So I think it's just progression of where swimming as a sport is at. Um, and you have to respect all of the events that that are on that program. Um, but on a wider scale, we'll just those 50s, obviously, the flyback and breasts will get a lot deeper. Um, the top end obviously will get faster as well, but more people will take them seriously. So the top eight in the the time required to make the semis or the finals will take big steps forward, and it did in Singapore this year, um, because there's more at stake on those events now, and federations which you know have the funding and have the control over coaches and swimmers uh are gonna have to take that more seriously. So I think um people will specialise more as well. Um, it'll be very rare to have those people that do 50 hundred, 200 um in a form stroke because the level of those 50s will get a lot higher. Yeah. And then the other the other bit, I think we'll see specialist programs come through. I think we'll see specialist sprint programs in Australia, and then we'll then we'll see, you know, those 200 meter form stroke or mid-distance programs come through as well. I think coaches will be encouraged to get training groups together where they're specialized versus you know, Dean Box will got 50-meter guys and 800-meter guys, and and that just gets so difficult to manage over long periods of time. Yeah.

Danielle Spurling: 32:17

Don't know how he does it, but he does it very well.

Bobby Hurley: 32:20

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. He does it better than anybody else, right? I think he's got a lot of support around him. He's got the buy-in from athletes and their families, and and he does it from a young age as well. But um, you know, there's there's the the secret is Dean himself. There's there's nothing else that can be replicated.

Danielle Spurling: 32:36

Yeah, that's true. It's a character. How about your elbow injury that you mentioned before? Was that a tendonitis type thing, or was there a tear that you had to get repaired?

Bobby Hurley: 32:46

Um I I wish it was so simple like that. Uh it was actually um arthritis in my elbows. Yeah. So um that was again when I was I had a really good back end of 2012, had a great 2013 World Cup as well, um, was was in the US at the time, um, put on about five or six kilos of of uh muscle, of strength, training with Matt Greavers, and um, you know, things were looking were looking really promising. And then the back end of 2013, um, my elbows were just getting so swollen and inflamed after after most training sessions. And um I tried to push through, but after 2014 trials was like I could do like a 6k threshold freestyle set, and the next day my my elbow would be like a tennis ball. I wouldn't be able to bend it past 90 degrees just through inflammation. Um again, so I was pushing, pushing my body so hard like that, and I couldn't have six months off because if I missed the team, I got no funding. If you didn't do a qualifying time, you got no funding. So you're forced to, you're living on six-month contracts every year, right? So I I pushed through and in the end, all the cartilage had worn away, and it was just bone grinding on bone. Um, and it started on my left and then it went over to my right elbow as well. Um, and I'd had two previous surgeries on my right elbow as a as a kid, just um you know, playing footy and falling off my bike. So there were you know maybe some lingering effects from that. Um, yeah, so I had um stem cell injections in 2014. So I think I was one of the first athletes in Australia to to have that done. I had to put on um five kilos of fat. So I did no aerobic training and just ate as much as I physically could, and and they basically draw fat from your your back and your and your and your butt, um, take out the uh the stem cells and then inject it back into your elbows. Um so like PRP blood injections, but um at a at a much more concentrated level. Um so I did that, and that that certainly prolonged my career, but that's certainly the point where I had to alter everything I did. I I didn't do a push-up for the last five years of my career. Um no overhead exercises in the gym, no pushing exercises, no bench press, no push-ups. Um, and then in the pool as well, had to had to change. And and that's where backstroke was a lot more manageable than than freestyle. Um, just that high elbow catch in freestyle was really causing a lot of a lot of continual pain there. Um, but you know, that was I for after 2014 I swam for another three years and and did World Cups and traveled the world and and had did one or two PBs in that time, but but had a great time. But that's certainly the point where um at 25 years old that you're you're not the same anymore.

Danielle Spurling: 35:39

I read something when I was researching um a little bit about you that you you swam a race at um at trials, was it 2016 where obviously you had the elbow trouble and you you kicked the whole way and still did you come a third?

Bobby Hurley: 35:53

Yeah, yeah, I got a third.

Danielle Spurling: 35:55

That's your backstroke kick must be phenomenal.

Bobby Hurley: 35:58

Yeah, I did um so it I guess maybe I feel like I'm telling too many stories. No, please keep going.

Danielle Spurling: 36:05

Um I'm intrigued.

Bobby Hurley: 36:06

Yeah, that's why we're um that's why we're podcasting. Um 2016 um had a good World Cup tour, it was was coming third overall, and um got to the last cluster in in Asia. So it was it was in Singapore actually, and um I remember getting getting into the into the taxi one day to go to the pool, put my right arm over to pull put the seatbelt on, and I couldn't I couldn't move it, it was just dead. So I grabbed it and I had no muscle to actually pull the seatbelt down to put it on. So that was, you know, I had to withdraw and and um you know sacrifice a potentially a lot of prize money there as well. And um, you know, we're we were sort of doctors and physios were were really unsure what it was, but it was actually a a nerve infection in my supra scrap scapular nerve that I got whilst traveling. And um I'd lost with when the nerve gets infected and switches off, I lost there's no muscle connection. So you can actually see on my uh if you're looking at my back, like my left side was significantly bigger than my right side. Um, so all the muscle had deteriorated. Um, and that was more or less like I was 28 and and again missed the 2016 Olympic team. So um that was more or less going to be the end of my career, and I was going really good again and enjoying the process again, and then had that um you know really big um hurdle. And um came back from the World Cup and Tim Lane was my coach at the time at Waringa in Sydney. Um and and we just we basically just kicked for a couple of weeks and very sparingly used um my right arm and then went to short course nationals, which I think was about four weeks later, and we thought, well, we've got to give it a go, we've got to give it a shot. I'd love to represent Australia one more time, go to short course worlds um to finish my career, but but if it's not to be, then then there's nothing I can do about it. And the 50 back was not selection um for short course worlds, only the hundred was. So we had the 50 back, and I said to Tim, like, I think I need a it was a time final because again, Australia doesn't really care about short course 50s. Um I said, like, I think I need a race because I need I didn't even know if I could do a backstroke start, and I didn't know if I could streamline, like I think I need a race, but I don't want to, you know, I don't want to use up all my energy because the 50 was before the 100. So he said, why don't why don't you do kick on your back and and and do that? So so I did so I went 15 underwater, did fly kick on my back, did one stroke into the turn, one stroke onto the finish, and got third, went um 24-3. So it was about PV plus 1.3 um with on two strokes, you know. Amazing. Um so that yeah, that's that's how good of a dolphin kicker I was. Um yeah, and then um, you know, I particularly short course had a good rivalry with Mitch Larkin for a long time, who wasn't as good short course. He had one bang in year, but um and and he and he after the race said, Are you okay? Like what what what happened? Because it was obviously a much slower time than what we used to, and he won the race. And I said, No, no, I'm I'm all good. I only did two strokes. And he's like, What? And then then we sort of walked away. And um, then the next day I went real easy in the 100-back stroke heat, had an outside lane, and then um, you know, I I feel like miraculously had a really good 100-back stroke final. I I said, if if I've got um 16 strokes in me, uh 16 right arm strokes in me, I'm gonna save it for the 100-back final. And um went just over my PV, beat Mitch, um, won that that Australian title and and uh made the world short course team. So that was that was pretty cool. That was cool. And then um, yeah, that was really good story, and and Tim and I had had a really good moment there. And then um, you know, going to Windsor in Canada um wasn't able to continue that. Made the 50-back final there, didn't make the hundred, and of course Mitch won the hundred final there. So I beat him at the trials and then he ended up being the world champion and and I wasn't in the final. But I was able to I I got fifth in the 50-back final there, which was good to be a part of that race. I I would have liked to have obviously got a medal or or or been um been on top of the podium, but but yeah, it wasn't to be.

Danielle Spurling: 40:32

But then soon after after that, you jumped into coaching and you coached Chad LeClo and Cameron Vanderberg. How did it feel to be the one writing the programs rather than the one doing the programs?

Bobby Hurley: 40:44

Yeah, um, I mean, another really fortunate opportunity that I had um that I spoke about earlier was actually so the day that I got in Singapore that I couldn't move my right shoulder was the day that Chad asked me to be his coach um on the World Cup tour. We're we're obviously good friends. Um and and I said, Chad, like you're asking me to to retire um to to stop like I'm I'm coming third on overall on the World Cup behind Chad, and he's and he's asking me, Do you want to be my coach next year? And they, you know, Chad and Bert knew that um you know what kind of mind that I'd had and I'd spent a lot of time with them on tour, and that that I knew that I wanted to get into coaching. Um but yeah, it was it was just you know a tap on the shoulder and Chad Chad said this is this is what we're thinking. He he got two silver medals in Rio that year, um, and it announced that he was leaving his longtime coach. And you know, in the swimming world, there's a bit of question marks as to what Chad was going to do. And and he asked me, and I was like, wow, that's uh that's pretty crazy. And then you know, Chad was moving to Cape Town and Cameron Vandenberg was was going to Cape Town as well. And Cape Town's an amazing, beautiful city as well, um, very safe and um yeah, nice place in the world to live. And they were going to um join Energy Standard, which was based in Turkey, and um do training camps over there, and then I was going to be their their traveling coach. So for me to get a foot into coaching, that was you know, Cameron got silver at that Olympics, they're both world champions, world record holders, Olympic champions from London, um, and they're asking me to be their coach. So I thought that was pretty cool and and certainly um too good of an opportunity to to turn down. Um so again, that's was the big motivation for me to try and make that Australian team one last time and and be in Windsor and competing, which which I was able to do. And Chad and Cameron both won won gold medals, and then the next week I I moved to Cape Town and um and was coaching them. And I mean I'd I'd kept a logbook since I was 11 years old. Um, it was handwritten for probably 15 years, and then it was on the computer after that. So I've got everything written down. So I've I've always been a swim nerd, um, like that, and always asked the coaches why, why, why, why are we doing this, what's the purpose of this, which probably pissed off a few of them. But I had that, you know, I I wanted to know, I wasn't questioning them, I just wanted to know, I needed to buy into it and understand it. And and also I I knew I wanted to be a swimming coach one day, uh a high performance coach one day. Um, but at the same time, when when you get that moment, that first session in Cape Town, I didn't have a stopwatch, you know. Like swimmers don't own stopwatches with and then I got one, I didn't know how to use it. Like you're coaching three or four athletes at a time, taking splits, taking stroke rates, like it's it's an art form in itself to pick up on that. And um, Andrea Di Nino was my mentor mentor coach at the time, um, uh a famous Italian coach. So he was there with me, and and I was able to learn from him, James Gibson, Tom Rushton, and a lot of others. Um, so I was surrounded by you know by the world's best for that first year um and learn from them um and you know, and be around Chad Cameron. And when we went to training camp, Ben Proud was there, Sarah Sostrom, Michael, Roman Shuk, like some really high-level really some some pretty good, some pretty good guys, you know, Kaleshnikov, Rilov, the the Russians were there as well. Um, and and that was a great year. That was I had I had a lot of fun. And Chad um won the turn of fly in Budapest, so he got his redemption from Rio and beat Laszlo Che in Budapest. That was an amazing crowd and swam his second fastest time ever behind what he did in um in London. And Cameron did a PB and got third in the 50 breast stroke. So even at at uh 29 years of years of age, and again, similar to what McAvoy's doing now, uh a much reduced training program, Cam Vanderbeer was able to do a PB in the 50 breasts, um, a former world record holder doing doing a PB. Obviously, Adam Peady broke the world record and won that race, but um yeah, I was I was pretty proud of of that as my first coaching experiences, and then um um that was a great year, but uh I missed Australia and wanted to move home, so I did so at the end of 2017.

Danielle Spurling: 45:01

Yeah, what a great experience though. My gosh. I mean, um getting to work with those high-level swimmers has just set you up for all your coaching following through now.

Bobby Hurley: 45:10

Yeah, yeah, it has. And um, you know, that's where I met my my now wife, Kisenia. So she was the team manager at um at Energy Standard and and we hit it off that year and and had a great year together. And that's uh she moved to Sydney with me at the end of 2017, and and um, and and we've been obviously been together ever since. And so, you know, when I speak about I I feel like in my swimming career, a lot of the times I was I was unlucky, you know, I I missed um three Olympic teams and had so many close calls. And I I at the same time I had luck, but when you review yourself, you think about the the setbacks and the near misses, you you you remember the losses more than you remember the wins. And then as soon as I retired, all of a sudden I got this amazing once-in-a-lifetime chance to coach two Olympic champions, right? Um, doing that, I meet my wife. Uh doing that, I I spent more time with with the FINA staff and they asked me to commentate. That was just uh again, it was just a converse conversation that people hear me talk about swimming and have a conversation with me, and they thought I'd be good for the role. And that's a role that I'm that I'm really blessed to have. And then three people that I met that year as well, uh, you know, the Singapore opportunity came up um to move overseas too. So um they're the certainly the the three opportunities that that I think I've been um very, very lucky to have, but uh, but at the same time, I think I've I've taken them with both hands and and made the most of it as well. And and being able to say yes and and do a really good job at these things um helps other future possibilities come up as well.

Danielle Spurling: 46:45

Absolutely. Yeah, I was gonna ask you how the Fina job sort of uh came about. You do a amazing job. I love that feed. I wish we got it more here.

Bobby Hurley: 46:53

It's just so me on channel nine.

Danielle Spurling: 46:56

Yes, please. How do you you what's your sort of contract with them like? Do you do you just do the main ones? You don't do the world cups, do you just do the world champs and and Olympics, that kind of thing?

Bobby Hurley: 47:08

Yeah, yeah, it's just a um obviously it's just a contract for for services for those championships. Um, so it's it's once a year. But I did do the World Cups last year, um, which were in Asia, so time zone was friendly, and there's a studio uh not far from from my workplace, so I was doing that by myself from a studio, which was which was tough. But then the third leg was in Singapore, so I was able to do that um live. And they did ask me to do this year's one as well, but it uh it was it was it was very last minute and and it didn't work out, and I had a family holiday booked, and um, you know, that was certainly the priority at this time of year, especially after commentating in um over the summer at the world championships. But um, yeah, that was uh again a another really fortunate opportunity. Um the the people at FINA just thought I'd be a good fit for the role, and and the previous person had had left, I believe, and and something had opened up. And then uh my first one was um short course worlds in China, end of 2018. And and obviously, like I I was at the last short course worlds, and I coached at the world championships the year before. So my knowledge of that current level of swimmers was was huge. And I geled well with with Mike McCann, who's who's a genius commentator, and he's taught me everything when to chime in and how to articulate things. And um, I just work around him really. But um, when I started speaking in depth about different events and distance events and and um short course racing, um, people were just blown away by by the you know, I guess it's a different form of knowledge coming through, and I can relate to it as an athlete, as a coach, and and overall just a fan of swimming. That I think that's the underlying thing is that I'm just passionate to watch and talk about swimming. And you know, I'm fortunate to do it at the world championships at the highest level. But also, if I also do a 12 and under mini meet, if if there was 25 to go and there's three guys in a line, I I would equally get as excited about three little kids racing because that's what it's about, right? That's that's the fun bit about racing and and not not so much about winning and losing, but just the just how people are going to respond when they're under pressure and they're racing like that is is what I like to see.

Danielle Spurling: 49:20

Well, I think the the reason that you're so successful at it is you can tell that you're you're very so passionate about it and you've got this huge, as you say, this huge background knowledge. And it it it definitely comes through, but in a in a very humble way, which I I think listeners like.

Bobby Hurley: 49:36

Yeah, I mean, again, I've got those experiences as an athlete that we've talked about, but I don't need to reference that or talk about that, you know, every single night. Um, I think at the end of the day, I'm I'm gonna be remembered more as a coach and commentator than than as an athlete, and and that already feels like a really long way a pass behind me. Um, but the the main bit again is is the passion for the sport because you know you see on Instagram or on the TV just like a highlight of the end of an exciting race, which is the easy part. That's the fun part to deliver that moment, or or for me doing the replays after you know a world record is broken or whatnot. But the hard bit is you're doing eight days, you know, heats and finals, so four hours on air in the morning and night, and it's it's it's a grind, like emotionally it's a grind. You're so like you forget about everything else that's happening in the world because I'm reading everything, I'm reading comments on swim swam, I'm memorizing everything on amiga timing, split-wise, um, trying to talk to coaches. Uh, I I certainly stick away stay away from the athletes. I don't want to impede on that, but just trying to get little bits of useful information from coaches that that might help, and you're so engulfed into that whole week of world championships, it's it's really tiring. Um, and in Singapore, I was losing my voice halfway through, so I was actually stressed about losing my voice. So when I was off air, I was I was just alone. I was like, I can't talk to anybody, I have to rest my voice. Um, but yeah, so it's uh it's it's really difficult to do. But the the other part is um I'm current in swimming. I'm a current coach, so I'm seeing swimming every day. A lot of commentators that you see or you hear in in particular in swimming, because we're not on TV that much, you're getting certain people, you know, very, very well respected names, but they're not living and breathing swimming every single day, talking to coaches, watching results, watching heat swims, watching age group is trained to see little faults or how kids are talking and reacting about different things these days. So I think that's one thing that keeps my commentating sharp, is that I'm current with you know coaching at age group and a high performance level as well. Yeah.

Danielle Spurling: 51:49

Yeah, absolutely. Well, it definitely comes through in the feed. So you're doing a great job, and I hope it continues.

Bobby Hurley: 51:55

Thank you. Thank you.

Danielle Spurling: 51:56

I just before I let you go, because I know we've talked for quite a while, but I wanted to ask you about your swim at the World Masters in Singapore recently. You did the 50 backstroke. How did you how did you like that? Getting back in competition.

Bobby Hurley: 52:08

Yeah, I mean, I've done a few um fun races in relays uh and things, I guess, in the last few years. And and on the last day of world championships, there's always a media relay, um, which has gotten a lot more a lot more um spectacular in the last few years, I guess. Um it, you know, back in 2018, 2019, it was like the camera crew and the Amiga Timing crew, the volunteers, and then a couple of teams from FINA. And now um now everybody's recruiting like the the ambassadors to swim. So, you know, um, you know, and our team was was James Gibson, John Mason, who's who's life of the party, like a lot of fun, and uh Elizabeth Beisel, but you know, Kate Campbell swam for one of the teams, Dylan Carter, who's still actively swimming, he raced, um, and Chad raced as well. So these teams are now recruiting like ambassadors who have recently retired or active swimmers to try and win this relay, and then it's um it's produced as well. So it's the full TV show, um, you know, walkouts, lane assignments, post-race interviews, slow motion replays. So it's it's hilarious to watch back. Um, yeah, so that's been a lot of fun. But but doing masters back back to masters again. Um it was good. I like I I wanted to do it um because it's in Singapore and I always thought about doing masters as well. I wish it were short course. I still I was like, oh man, it's long course. It's that couple of extra strokes. Um and I feel like if it was at the end of June, I could have done a better job. I mean, I went 27-0 when my you know my lifetime best is 25.0. I I thought I could be in maybe the 26 lows, but um, as soon as school finished where I am, I was out of routine and holidays with the kids and not being at the pool every day. So my training went downhill a lot leading into the master's meet. Um, but it was good, you know, it was good to be competitive again and um to actually, you know, set a goal and and shoot your sights for. So I didn't do a whole lot of swimming leading in, which is probably what what every master's swimmer says, like you're I guess you're especially being an ex-professional, you you're never gonna be as prepared as you once were, right? So everyone's underprepared, but um, it kept me really accountable in the gym and nutrition-wise. So that was a a big help because I'd never, you know, and it's one of the things when you retire from professional sports, you you're never really truly tested to the point where you know you're not gonna drink for a couple of weeks or you you you're not gonna eat takeaway for a few weeks and you're gonna go to the gym five times a week. Um, you know, obviously I've kept fit and healthy over the past um seven years or so since I've retired, but not to the point where you're preparing for a performance. So um, you know, I got second in that race to to um Charles Hocken, who's you know maybe one of the best master swimmers around the world at this point. He he swims um at a very, very high level from from Paraguay. Um and it was good to see him and and he was he was really happy to meet me and race me as well. Um and it was a it was a fun overall experience. I wish I did some relays actually, that probably would have been a lot more fun too. But um, you know, I don't really have that master's community in Singapore yet, but um potentially it's something we can dig into later on.

Danielle Spurling: 55:22

Singapore is becoming a real hub for swimming. I mean, they they just put on them. I mean, I thought the masters championships were superb with four pools and just so easy to get to and everything was easy and well organized. It was amazing.

Bobby Hurley: 55:40

Yeah, it's it's great facilities. And um, I just saw recently that um the the World Champs Arena, which they constructed just you know probably six months ago. Uh it's it's temporary, even though it it well and truly looks permanent, but it's class as a temporary facility. But they've now just uh the government just said they're gonna keep it open till 2030. So that's I mean, that's a long time. So hopefully you get other high-level international swim meets here in Singapore because it's a great city, one to be a tourist in, but also um just to get around, like the the ease of transport, obviously the weather, which is great for you know, for for masters and and for all athletes. And you know, they they have the F1 here every year, which is really successful. And I feel like they're probably shooting for an Olympics at some point. They had the Youth Olympics back in 2010, um, and they had junior worlds as well. So I think they're capable of of hosting high-level competitions like that, and it's a great city to be in. Yeah, it definitely is.

Danielle Spurling: 56:36

I really enjoyed my time there for sure.

Bobby Hurley: 56:38

Tell me about your master's experience.

Danielle Spurling: 56:41

Oh, look, I I'm sort of at the end of the age group.

Bobby Hurley: 56:44

Um so that makes it that's a disadvantage, right?

Danielle Spurling: 56:48

A very big disadvantage. Um yeah, look, I got four top tens, so I was happy with that. But onwards and upwards to Budapest, where I hope I can do a little bit better. But yeah, my my hundred backstroke was probably my best of the of the meet, but um lots to take away. And I've I've got I'm better at short course as well. So I've got to listening to particularly to what you said about that, and I I need to increase my stroke rate as well. So I'm working on that.

Bobby Hurley: 57:14

Strength.

Danielle Spurling: 57:15

Yeah, strength. So yeah, I'm hitting the gym big time.

Bobby Hurley: 57:18

Yeah, I mean, when I was um I was coaching at Loretta Normanhurst in Sydney, and and we had a master squad there, and it was uh a couple of those swimmers were in Singapore as well, so it was good to to connect with um with those guys. You probably know Stu Ellicott, um, breaststroker. So so I had I was coaching Stu for a couple of years in Sydney. Um, and it's amazing. I mean, there were a few guys and and girls in that squad that were swimming, you know, four kilometer sessions. I think Stu's in his 70s now, probably doing three or four kilometre sessions, and I think uh Christmas Eve, he still does the hundred-one hundreds. Um, and it's but I I I do feel like it's the um the people that have an affinity for swimming, maybe as parents or didn't get the opportunity in their teenage years or their 20s that swim for a long time. Um a lot of the the professionals or whatnot, if if if you have made it to the highest level, it's it's tough to go back to that because you're you always get that feeling that you'll you'll never be able to satisfy your your demands for preparation. Um and it and also I there's a trend I I sort of see that there's a lot of coaches in Australia that swam at a high level but never made an Australian team. So they're they're they're better at coaching and they've driven themselves so much because their way onto the Australian team is as a coach, not as an athlete, right? Um and that's again that chip on their shoulders um proved to be uh a really successful for for a lot of those people too. So um, but yeah, back to master swimmers, like I swim, you know, leading into my race, I think I swam three times a week, probably less than a kilometer each time. Um, but anyone who's who's got the the ability to to swim, you know, four or five times a week and and swim for an hour, hour and a half, like I don't I don't have the mental capacity to do that anymore, especially now as a coach as well. I'd I'd I'd love to, but the idea of it is always better than than actually diving in and doing it. I guess I get bored after about 15 minutes.

Danielle Spurling: 59:10

I can see that, yeah. Understandable. Look, everyone that comes on the podcast, I like to ask them a deep dive five to finish off. So just give me a quick answer. The first thing that pops into your head. Favorite pool that you've ever swum in in the world?

Bobby Hurley: 59:22

Uh the one at Einhoven is uh yeah, that was a lot of fun. Um I can't remember the the exact uh layout of it, but but yeah, it was it was a good vibe there. I had a great time in Einhoven.

Danielle Spurling: 59:35

What's your favorite backstroke drill?

Bobby Hurley: 59:38

Um shoulder rotation kick. So hands by side, um, shoulder rotation kick, just trying to get that that shoulder all the way up to your chin. Um, I think shoulder rotation's the most important thing in backstroke to get length and power.

Danielle Spurling: 59:52

And how about um a set that you'd bring back from your racing days that you do now?

Bobby Hurley: 59:58

Uh it's very difficult. Different now, I can tell you that it's very different now. Um, you know, in terms of the training that we were doing compared to to how I coach the kids now. Um again, I enjoyed like threshold freestyle, probably wasn't good for me, but but I enjoyed that. So um with Vince at the AIS, you know, we would do through a a block, you know, 40100s on 120 on a Monday afternoon, then a week or two later it was 32 100s on 130, and then it'd be 24 on 140, pretty much all messed average, and then finish with maybe 16 or 18 on on 150. Um, but but I enjoyed that, and and that's great mid-distance training as well.

Danielle Spurling: 1:00:38

Yeah, that's good. How about your best tip to get a perfect backstroke turn?

Bobby Hurley: 1:00:44

Uh backstroke turn. Well, obviously, you've got to count your strokes under the flags, but a lot of people are turning too close to the wall and not utilizing that last freestyle stroke to its full potential. So especially if you're taller like me, or if you have a slower stroke rate, if you're close to the wall, like you're gonna jam up and lose all your momentum. So it's better to be further away from the wall. So you can glide, you can reach out and use that last stroke, that last stroke on your front to its full potential. That's that's the most important part of that of the turn, freestyle or backstroke is the last stroke to get hit the wall at speed.

Danielle Spurling: 1:01:19

And how about past or present swimmer that you most admire and why?

Bobby Hurley: 1:01:24

Obviously, everyone, you know, growing up, you know, in my era was was Ian Thorpe and Michael Phelps. But um, from a young age, I remember like really respecting those underwater kickers, and I just thought it was really cool. So, you know, Matt Walsh was was really good in the early 2000s, and I raced him at the back end of his career. Um, and uh, you know, Ryan Lochtie as well was more of the underdog all the time, right? Um, up against Phelps. So so I like that, like that underdog story. But um to be honest, there was no real upset hero like that because you know I did race Phelps once and you know I stood there and wanted to beat him, you know. Um, so there's no one that you really put up on on a pedestal. Um, I was more like you know, basketball fan, so Kobe Bryant was was my hero, and and and that mentality and that work ethic um is what drove me for a long time.

Danielle Spurling: 1:02:17

Yeah. Oh, he's a good hero to have.

Bobby Hurley: 1:02:19

Yeah, he is.

Danielle Spurling: 1:02:21

Well, Bobby, thank you so much for joining us today. I I've loved speaking to you and hearing all your perspectives about swimming and wishing you every success with your coaching career and commentating career heading forwards.

Bobby Hurley: 1:02:33

Yeah, thank you. Uh I enjoyed a trip down memory lane, and and hopefully everybody listening enjoyed some of those stories too.

Danielle Spurling: 1:02:40

I think they will. Okay, take care.

Bobby Hurley: 1:02:42

Thanks.

Danielle Spurling: 1:02:43

Okay, bye.

Bobby Hurley: 1:02:43

Bye bye.

Speaker 2: 1:02:44

Take care of us.

Danielle Spurling: 1:02:46

Thanks for tuning in to Torpedo Swim Talk, the podcast celebrating swimmers at every stage from Masters Legends to Olympic champions. If you enjoyed this episode, please follow or subscribe on your favourite podcast platform and leave a review to help more swimmers find the show. You can also catch past episodes, guest highlights, and swimming stories from around the world at Torpedoswimtalk.com. Until next time, happy swimming and bye for now.