Torpedo Swimtalk Podcast with Swimming Australia's Open Water Head Coach - Fernando Possenti

What if every pool program could also be an open water program? We sit down with Fernando Possenti, Swimming Australia’s new Open Water Head Coach, to talk about his blueprint for building race‑smart swimmers—starting with juniors, scaling to elites, and aiming at LA 2028 and Brisbane 2032. Fernando explains how to keep most training in the pool for control and consistency, then layer in the skills that decide races: sighting, buoy turns, feeding and clean positioning under pressure. He makes a compelling case for racing often at home, using formats like the Australian Cup to create real stakes, real feedback and real pathways to World Cups.

We dig into tactics you can use this weekend. Learn when to sit on toes versus ribs, how to read line and triangle packs, and the simple buoy‑check that keeps you connected to leaders. Hear how feeding plans shift with loop length, heat and salinity, and how to practice feeds in the pool so chaos at the pontoon doesn’t rattle your race. Fernando also shares weekly training outlines and why composure after contact saves the energy you need for the final surge.

The mental game is the next frontier. A 10K demands two hours of sharp focus and rapid decisions, a tall ask in a short‑attention world. Fernando outlines practical ways to build attention and decision quality: detailed debriefs, cognitive drills for peripheral vision, and a culture that rewards calm responses over emotional reactions. He also unpacks event innovation—from skins‑style 1Ks to richer live data and scenic point‑to‑point courses—that can make open water more watchable without losing its soul. At the heart of it all is a mantra worth taping to your bottle: dream big or small, the work is the same. Australia owns pool excellence; open water is the next frontier.

If this conversation fired you up, follow the show, share it with your squad, and leave a quick review so more swimmers and coaches can find it. Got a drafting or feeding tip that changed your racing? Tell us—we’ll feature the best on a future episode.

Chapters

• 0:00 Welcome, Guest Intro, Big Picture
• 3:19 Role In Australia And Program Vision
• 5:20 Pool-To-Open Water Integration
• 8:05 Junior Pathways And Domestic Racing
• 10:47 Lessons From Coaching Champions
• 15:55 Australia, Brazil, And Building Tradition
• 19:26 Athlete Case Study: Strategy And Growth
• 21:14 Preparing For Heat, Currents, And Venues
• 22:52 Feeding, Sighting, And Skills In Pool
• 26:00 Drafting Tactics And Pack Dynamics
• 30:16 Weekly Training Load And Strength Work
• 31:16 Focus, Cognition, And Mental Control
• 38:33 Race Composure And Constructive Responses
• 41:06 Feeding Strategies And Hot Water Races
• 45:02 Skins Formats, TV, And Event Innovation
• 51:40 Safety, Course Design, And Spectacle

Transcript

Danielle Spurling: 0:05

Hello swimmers and welcome to the very first episode of 2026 with Torpedo Swim talk, the podcast celebrating swimmers at every stage from Masters Legends to Olympic champions. I'm your host, Danielle Spurling, and each week we dive into inspiring conversations from around the world about performance, resilience, and the pure love of swimming. Today's guest is Fernando Possenti, one of the most respected open water coaches in the world and the newly appointed open water head coach for Swimming Australia. Fernando brings more than two decades of high performance coaching experience, including guiding athletes to Olympic and World Championship success, most notably seven-time world champion and Olympic gold medallist Anna Manchalla Cunha. Known for his calm leadership, innovative thinking, and ability to build durable race smart swimmers, Fernando is now helping shape the future of Australian open water swimming as the program looks toward LA 2028 and Brisbane 2032. In this conversation, we're diving into what it really takes to coach open water swimmers at the highest level, from the training design and race strategy to adaptability, resilience, and winning when it matters most. Let's hear from Fernando now.

Danielle Spurling: 1:30

Hi Fernando, welcome to the podcast and thanks for stepping into such a pivotal role in Australian swimming.

Fernando Possenti: 1:37

Well, my pleasure. Thanks for inviting me and for having me here. And um, yeah, let's let's chat, let's talk about open water.

Danielle Spurling: 1:44

Yeah, I'd love to. What's excited you most about taking on the challenge of leading Australia's marathon program towards LA and um and to Brisbane 32?

Fernando Possenti: 1:54

Wow, definitely is one of the biggest nations in swimming. Um I used to say I grow up watching Kieran Perkins, Grant Hackett, all the big swimmers of long distance from Australia. And um, yeah, the the open water here is developing quite fast, we can say. I mean, you you guys are uh showing to the world that you you can definitely be good on both. I mean, in poo and open water at the same time. It's something that I do believe, so excite me more and more to work with that mentality. And um, yeah, it's a new opportunity, a new moment in my career. So it's it's a privilege, being honest, to guide such a great nation in swimming.

Danielle Spurling: 2:39

Are you um are you settling in well and quickly to Brisbane, to Queensland?

Fernando Possenti: 2:44

Yes, yes. I'm happy here. I mean, very nice place to be, uh, hot as Rio. I was living in Rio the last eight years of my life. Rio is really a hot place to live. And but Queensland, it's making me making me feel comfortable and at home in terms of weather and people, the friendly people from here. Yeah, I'm 100% happy and and wanting more and more to have my family with me, have a part of my family with me. So um, yeah, it's a definitely a nice place to live.

Danielle Spurling: 3:16

Yeah, yeah, it's beautiful, beautiful weather up there. Uh do you is in your new role is that overseeing all the coaches and swimmers, or do you have a hands-on sort of group that you're working with as well?

Fernando Possenti: 3:29

No, it's uh it's more like um overseeing them and um helping them to fill like the gaps that we we could have in an open water program, so how we can um also spread like open water skills around the country to have more juniors and more people involved with the sport so to make that base grow and and and then we will have the top of the pyramid with more and more athletes in the high level. Uh, this generation is definitely one of the best generations of of Australia ever. Um our dolphins nowadays they're really well ranked in the world. Um like looking for the world perspective, they they are top 10. Uh that was one of our best achievements this year. So four athletes and top 10 in the 10Ks in the Olympic Pro in the Olympic race. That was uh awesome. And um, but we need to build more the base. So we we need to spread the message for the juniors that you can add, you can definitely, if you're a long-distance swimmer, you can add an open water race to your schedule. Uh that will be that will make you more like complete as an as a long-distance athlete.

Danielle Spurling: 4:44

Yes, yeah. How many, how many satellite programs around Australia um are you sort of overseeing? Is it just one in each state or are they a bit more spread out than that?

Fernando Possenti: 4:54

My idea, um, since I'm here, it's to it's it's to say every pool program could be an open motor program. So every single uh club, every state, every program that runs poo program could could run an open mortar program at the same time in the same environment. So the concepts, the values, the the principles are the same. So we just add a little bit of skills that we deliver them in the camps. So we run a couple of camps as a Swim Australia or as a state federation. In those camps, we can give them those skills and train them those skills but basically the physiological basis and the things that they will need for the race, they are there. So the first step is um stop flagging uh yourselves, like coaches, athletes, and programs. Stop flagging yourselves as a poo coach or as an open water coach. We are swimming coaches. It's it's not about if you swim in a pool or if you swim in the nature in an open water environment, it's swimming. So we we are we are all swimmers, we are not pool swimmers and open water swimmers, we are swimmers. So just just understand that, understanding that we'll have more and more. And a couple of coaches already like catch or take that concept inside their their own their home programs, and uh we are we are having good results with that.

Danielle Spurling: 6:19

Yeah, that's fantastic. Yeah. Do they the a lot of the coaches that are sort of coming around to that way of thinking, are they doing all of that training for those swimmers that are interested in those longer distances in the pool, or do they explore the open water environment as well?

Fernando Possenti: 6:36

Well, another good thing in Australia. We have a lot of places if you want to explore open water environments. But the thing is, in high performance, 99% of the of the sessions of the trainee are in the pool. So we we need that pool control in terms of uh paces and uh stroke rates, uh all the elements that we need to develop on that on that atlet to put him competitive in a in a in a world uh worldwide scenario, as we would say. Um so yeah, most of most obsessions are are in the pool. What I recommend and what is important for them, I mean the junior athletes, that base that we were talking about, the junior athletes needs more to be exposed to open water environment because they are not uh how can I say that? They're not familiarized with with their environment uh yet. So, but the best thing, the best way of making them expose it and familiarize it with that is sending them to compete. So it's it's not it's not about only sessions. As I said, we we run camps, we can deliver in the camps the good skills that they need, like how to turn a buoy, how to finish a race, how to um uh position it yourself in a pack, how to um use that draft as much as you can to save energy. So all these details about open water, how to look in front to visualize the next buoy, so all those details we we can definitely deliver them in our camps. So what we need from coaches, clubs, uh state federations, pathways, let's let's say pathways for the juniors, it's send them to compete. And then we move for a second thing that I've uh I'm always saying in my uh speeches and and chats with with the coaches, it's that it doesn't matter if it's an official race. Of course, we we need to look for races with safety, so the safety environment, well organized. Uh um, but if it's a race of uh let's say 3Ks or 2Ks, it's not a 5 or a 10K, it doesn't matter. For those juniors, they want to be exposed to those kinds of races to understand the environment, to know when they need to start a sprint, how they like how they swim with people touching them, because it's a contact sport, it's not a violent sport, it's a contact sport. So, yeah, basically it's that if you have an opportunity in the weekends, even in cold places like Melbourne, let's say, you if if you have a master race, if you have a competition 1k, 2k, you can add that to your program as a weekend session. Okay, this weekend we'll do a two-case in in an open more environment, and then we come back to the pool and we finish our session. If you're planning like a six-case session, okay, let's do the race of two case and then we finalize in the pool. So give them that kind of opportunity, that kind of uh uh contact and exposure to to that environment. That's exactly what juniors need. So that's that's what I'm asking them to do.

Danielle Spurling: 9:46

Yeah, yeah, I think that's great. I mean, I think heading into LA and obviously Brisbane, with um that coming up in 32, we're gonna have a lot more kids interested in open water swimming. And I know, like over summer myself, it explodes over summer when we have all of those races, and that sort of gives them that exposure as well.

Fernando Possenti: 10:08

Yeah, that's uh another thing that we we are trying to add. It's the concept of the Australian Cup. We started this year, we're gonna improve that concept for next year. So um from September, so the second semester, our summer here in the South Hemisphere. So in the second semester, let's run a couple of state championships as an as Australian Cup stages. So you can collect points, you you you can qualify yourself for an international race. There's a couple of benefits. In um, first of all, it's opportunities. Second, be an exposure to open water, third, make the team or not qualify for the team, but qualify for trials, for example. This year, the winner of the Australian Cup will be funded for the World Cups next year. World Cups in the first semester, so we can divide our calendar in Australia. Like first semester, we focus on training, international exposure, and benchmark event. Second semester, we look internally, we look domestically, and we run Australian Cup. So Australian Cup, it's an opportunity for all those open water swimmers to compete along the states in the states championships, and to get not only experience but get something bigger than that. So we are we are going for this Saturday. I'm flying. So next Sunday is the last leg of Australian Cup in in Sydney, and um yeah, I'm super excited with that as well because uh not only dolphins but a lot of juniors, 70% of the points collected in the Australian Cup until now. We had three legs, um, are from junior swimmers. So their parents, their clubs, they're understanding the importance of sending them to compete. And sending them, it doesn't mean to sending them internationally. We can have good fields, good um quality races domestically.

Danielle Spurling: 12:07

Now you've coached one of the greatest open water athletes of all time, Anna Martella. What did you learn from coaching someone at that level that sort of changed your mind about performance?

Fernando Possenti: 12:18

The the first thing is that results are made on the bad days, not on the good days. So that's that's my first point. So we know that we we have a long period in terms of season in open water. We have a long season, a lot of um uh training and uh sessions, uh, volume, intensity, everything that needs to be added for a good program. But definitely the results are built uh on the bad days. So what I what I'm gonna say with that is um it's quite it's quite good and easy when you're feeling good, when you're in a good moment in the season, you have a good consecutive session. But the your attitude when you are in your bad days, I'm not meaning bad days, not only mentally speaking, but physically speaking, like you're tired in the bad days, it's for how long you stay focused, you stay uh present and concentrate and try to take your take out your best. So those days is the days that you're gonna remember that okay, I'm I'm really prepared because I I pass through those bad days with a good uh and positive attitude. Um the second thing is about the flow. So every every time I heard that, oh, it's just flowing. That's awesome when when the connection, when the relationships, when the program is just flowing, but the flows it's it happens what what I believe it's when you do uh believe in your teammates, believe in your staff, believe in your coach, believe in your program that you are like in, and when you allow people to help you. That's that's another thing. It's uh sometimes it's you you you're searching for something that you could be help. I mean, you need some help, but you need to be open enough for someone to help you because sometimes the help comes not in the way that you are expecting, so the way that you need, not the way that you want. So allow people that you do believe and you do trust. So allow people that you trust to help you when you need. Um, and and things will flow like easily in that in that time. But yeah, basically, there are the the the lessons that I take from this. There's a third one, but this this one I didn't learn from a specific that uh that atlet or was it was an idea that I need to build on myself living in a South America, in a in a country with not that tradition, like in in the pool and in open water. We we build that tradition along the time, but it's the the things that it okay, dream big or dream small will give you the same amount of work. We'll give you the same amount of work. So why why we dream small? It doesn't matter the situation that you are, where you are, where you you're born, where you grow up, if your program is completed or not, you need to dream big. Otherwise, you're not gonna take the outcome and the results that you wanted from from dream dream small.

Danielle Spurling: 15:24

So yeah, I love that. I love that mantra. That's uh that's really good. I mean, that just means that putting in the consistency and the hard work wherever you are is the most important thing.

Fernando Possenti: 15:35

In in in the end of the day, you need to wake up the next day and do everything again. I mean, and and train hard and go back to the pool. So why dream small? That's big and and and work hard for achieving that.

Danielle Spurling: 15:48

I wanted to circle back to something you mentioned. You said that Brazil wasn't known for their swimming, but you have had some superstars in Brazilian swimming, and and obviously maybe having Rio or the Rio Olympics there brought that on a lot more a lot more quickly.

Fernando Possenti: 16:07

It's just a comparison. I mean, when you when you move for Australia and and and US and you go for numbers, especially medal table, uh Brazil had a lot of, and and I'm again I'm I'm also privileged to to know that people, I mean to work with them, a couple of them. So yeah, um, but looking for gold medals in Olympics, Brazil, Brazil had has just two gold medals in all history in Olympics, uh Cielo 2008, the 53, and then a Marcella and the 10 case. So yeah, we I I do believe that we should have more. We are 220 million people. So it's a huge country. We have a a lot of uh we don't have resources, but we have a lot of uh for open water, especially good places to to run that kind of discipline. Uh yeah, it's uh it's more it's more about the structure around how you uh understand high performance, how you make that like that pathway something feasible for for all the the swimmers that you have.

Speaker: 17:15

Yeah.

Fernando Possenti: 17:15

So what happened what happened in the end is that most of them moved to US. So even Cielo to to to win that gold medal was living in the US, cultured by an Australian coach. So Anna Marcella's medal is a very special one because it was built at home. So yes, yeah.

Danielle Spurling: 17:34

I mean, you're right. I mean, Australia we have a very strong background and culture in swimming, and we are an island surrounded by water, so that sort of helps, I suppose. And most of the population lives on the coastal parts of Australia. So it is in our DNA to to be in the water, and something that I think we're lucky that we have that in the education system as well. Like swimming is is something that's in the curriculum, so that that helps.

Fernando Possenti: 18:03

Look, look what happened last Friday. Like Australia versus the world. That that was amazing. It was amazing. Yeah, it was this is about like look to swimming as a as a one of the main sports in the country, like country loves swimming, and uh for someone who works with swimming, you can imagine how happy I am and how glad to be in this kind of environment. It's it's unbelievable. So the the big thing about 28 and 32, back to that that your question is that you you guys don't need to prove anything to anyone else in US and like thinking 28 and 32, so US and Australia the world know that you guys are the best swimmers in the world, but the best pool swimmers. So in open more environment, there's a lot to build, there's a lot to grow. Exactly. In terms of metal table, in terms of uh uh participation, so that's that's what is happening now. So in those two big nations, they are all okay. So we we are the the best pool swimmers. Why we are not uh the best open water swimmers in the world? So let's let's fill that gap, let's let's see what people are doing now overseas and let's try to to develop here, and it's a hundred percent possible. It's uh it's a matter of belief and time.

Danielle Spurling: 19:26

Yes. Yeah, I've really enjoyed watching Moesha's um sort of development over the past few years, and she swam so perfectly, I thought, in Paris, and then obviously the world champs this year. Have you had a lot to do with her and her training?

Fernando Possenti: 19:42

She she's that's what what is amazing in Moesha is that she's still getting better and better, yeah. Still like growing and learning. So having um how can I say that? Having more uh strata strategic options. So uh she's She's getting more prepared for anything that happens. And it's really important in open water. So you need to be prepared for anything that happened. You need you know not how to react, but how to respond to that situation. And Moesha is it's gaining like a um a huge amount of knowledge, of knowing how to respond of any different situation. So she will be more and more under control, but on the other hand, she will be more and more the target of the other athletes. So yeah, it's a balance of okay, how I apply my strategy, not letting them uh use um my strategy as a strength for for the other athletes. Uh but yeah, she's she's definitely uh one one of the greatest in this sport now.

Danielle Spurling: 20:50

And to to I think it was watching her in Paris and then watching her in Singapore, it was so starkly different, the two environments, the still water of the sand, and then obviously the very hot water in Singapore. Um, she dealt with it really well, I thought, in both situations. How how do you get the athletes to deal with those differences in where they're going to race?

Fernando Possenti: 21:14

That's all about preparation. I mean, and that's that's the most excited thing in open water. I mean, in my opinion, you you I love pool swimming. Uh, I was a pool, I start as a pool coach, swim coach, as I as I mentioned in the beginning. So um we we made that difference, but we shouldn't anyway. Um but it's a it's a kind of predictable environment, the pool. So you know where you are in the season, so you know how your athlete will perform. Open water, it's completely unpredictable. Everything can change in the movement, in the moment. So that's what makes open water more more and more excited, in my opinion. So, as I was saying, it's about preparation. When you know the environment that you're gonna compete, you start preparing yourself physiologically, you start preparing yourself for the best strategy, and you start looking for the field and see okay, how they perform in this kind of environment as well. So the strengthness and the weakness of your opponents, so you start studying them to collect data and information of okay, how how I need to impose my strategy or use the the tools that I have, let's say the tools that I have to be successful in any kind of environment. But that's that's all about backwards preparation. So you know where we're gonna compete, you know how the environment looked like, and then you prepare yourself backwards so to to arrive there ready for anything to happen.

Danielle Spurling: 22:52

And I know you said a lot of the um open water swimmers train in the pool for the majority of their training week. How do you practice things like feeding and um and sighting for those longer races in the pool?

Fernando Possenti: 23:05

Listen, it's a it's a different groups that I'm talking about. If you think about high performance, high performance, they train 99% of their training in the pool and they they know how to feed the how to feed because they have enough experience for that. Feedings are uh something really normal as a turn in the pool for them. It's not something that they need to practice and practice. Of course, if you know who will be your feeder, so then you can make some training together before the race. Okay, how I prefer you to feed me. So that's the the athlete vision he you can just share with that coach. Again, open water is so excited that you you you need to prepare the athlete, but you need to prepare the coach as well. Because if you're feeding someone that you you never feed before, you you know you need to know how the athlete preferred to be feeded in that in that moment. Um, in the other group, let's say the less experienced um athletes, they need to practice feeding, turning buoys, sense of direction. But you can do that in the pool as well. There's a couple of strategies. We ran a camping now the light in the pool for the juniors. That was really nice. Um, we just take the lanes out, we we put some buoys in the pool, cans. It's the some some people call it buoys or cans, but we we put four in inside the pool and we practice with them. We bring the stick for for the feeding, so we give them all okay. If you stand your arm to try to catch a bottle, sometimes someone can just touch your hand and and drop your bottle. So put yourself in the back position. We'll give you the bottle so you have a um more safety environment to take that bottle from the stick, so you are seeing what you're doing, you uh you can continue swimming backstroke. A couple of details for feeding, we can practice in the pool. Again, what what the high performance, why why they're so experienced, because they compete more more times than the juniors. It's about being exposed because everything can happen again. Even in feeding, if you if you train feeding in the pool, in the race, you can have like two people that is feeding close to you in the pontoon in the what where the feeders are, and um they can drop your butter. You need to be ready for that as well. So, what what's my plan B? What's my plan C? Okay, I change uh I'm not gonna feed this lap, so I'm gonna feed the next one. What are the impacts of that in my strategy, in my uh um in my energy, in my how I'm gonna save energy in this lab to fit in another one? There's um we need to be ready for any plan put in practice, and the only way to learn that is competing more and more.

Danielle Spurling: 25:56

What's your philosophy on on drafting in the race? I mean, we can practice that in in training in the pool or in open water as well. Do you like do you like your athletes to sit on the toes or slightly to the side of the athlete they're drafting off? What's your sort of perspective?

Fernando Possenti: 26:12

It depends where they are in the pack. I mean, to sit on on the toes, it's it's uh it's more comfortable, let's say, even if it's pretty close. It's annoying for the one who's in front. We know that, but it's part of the game, but uh it's more comfortable. But in the other hand, you're not seeing what is happening in front of that one. So, what I want to say in terms of where you are in the pack, if you're in a line pack, so athletes are positionated in the kind of line every period of time or from one buoy to another, the the best moment to see that is when you're turning the buoy. So you just put your head up to see how far is the leader. Because if you don't know where the leader is, and you you you stick in the feet of someone that is a with a slower pace than you should be, so then the the gap is made like in front of the pack. There's a different um kind of pack, the pyramidal or the triangle pack, where there's a there's a leader, and then you have in the second line you have two, three swimmers, and then you have five, and then you have more and more looks like a triangle. In in that one, you need to be careful to not sit in the middle because you're stuck it there. So if you want to make a movement, you're stuck in there. If you if you if you're realizing you run a triangle pack, put yourself in one side or another. It depends for the side that you're more comfortable breathing. So if you're breathing, if you're more comfortable breathing to the right side, you put yourself on the left side of the pack. So then you're looking every one, and there's no one in your left side. So you you can make a move if you need, if you want to change that pace in the pack. So again, it depends the type of pack that you're swimming, where you position it yourself, and then you you decide where to sit it. In the triangle pack, sometimes you can sit on the rips. Because it's uh it's a all you are joined the draft, you're saving energy, but with you are with the the visualization of the whole thing that is happening.

Danielle Spurling: 28:20

Yeah, I think the try the triangle positioning is is good, it's much harder in the single single line, single file.

Fernando Possenti: 28:26

The single line depends like if if the guy behind the other it's able to hold that pace or not. And again, it's an opportunity. Look to the other way. For for the most boys nowadays in high performance, they wait for a while in the triangle pack, and then after a certain moment, they put themselves in line. Why? Because they know that they have more speed than the others, and then they just break that pack. Instead of having 10 swimmers in the pack, they just break for five, let's say. So five swimmers that know each other, so they can decide uh the the end of the race. So how how they're gonna finish. So that's uh that's good for the fastest swimmers in the pack to put themselves in line. The ones that are not that fast, they need to pay a lot of attention if the break is starting to happen. If the person that should be on the feet in front of him or her, it's not able to hold that pace.

Danielle Spurling: 29:30

Yeah, it's always a risk, isn't it, being on the feet of someone. Obviously, you mentioned you can't see what's happening ahead, but also if their pace is slower, you've got to take the initiative to get around them and and go.

Fernando Possenti: 29:43

That's why there's a moment in the race that you you you need to look what is happening if you are in the middle of the pack or in the end of the pack, what is happening in front. One of the best moments is when you have a turning buoy in front of you because uh you're not already there, but you can put your head up and see who already turned that buoy so you can calculate the distance you are from the leaders.

Danielle Spurling: 30:06

No, I like that. And a lot of people listening would find that kind of information really, really pertinent to their open water season because we've that's all coming up in the next few months over summer. What um what is an what is a training week look like for your high performance open water swimmers? How how often are they in the water and how often are they in the gym?

Fernando Possenti: 30:28

Usually most of the programs around the world, they they are in the water from nine to ten sessions. It means that they have doubles three or four times a week. Um usually they they have Sundays off to recover. And um yeah, they they they go for the gym. That is very specific for every different group, but they go for the gym not for weights, sometimes it's just for cause on or bands or different uh strain and condition and training, but usually three times a week.

Danielle Spurling: 31:04

With the kind of training that they're putting in, is there much emphasis on um the sort of the mental side of training? Like you're working with them on what to do when they get into a race and it changes and how to deal with that kind of thing.

Fernando Possenti: 31:20

That's uh 200% correlated to um what I call it capacity of keep yourself focused and concentrate. Um so let's say a 10K, it's a two-hour race. How you keep yourself concentrated for two hours in everything that is happening around you, because it's not only in your strategy in your own race. So you need to that's that's the difference of open one. It's not about time, it's about position. So you need to understand everything that is happening around you. Um, but the biggest challenge, in my opinion, in the mental preparation, that's two. One of them, it's a level of concentration. I used to give the same example for for the kids, the juniors that I share with them. Every uh school, not in Australia, I mean in the world, every school you go for classes that um they have like from 45 to an hour. So if you're doing a math class, it's 45 minutes, and then you go for an English class, and then you go for a science class. Okay, so why the classes uh have 45 to one hour in terms of period of time? Because there was a research in in the 30s, so a century ago. So it was a research that the period that a kid or a teenager could be concentrated in one subject, in one thing, was around 45 to 50 minutes. So that was the 30s, and then we start with the screams and TikToks and Instagram and scrolling and scrolling, and they did that research again uh a couple of years ago, you know, for how long a kid can be concentrated for five minutes, seven, seven minutes, seven minutes. So, how we we train the next generation to be concentrated for two hours? Yes, 30 seconds, they want to scroll. Yes, 30 seconds, 15 seconds. So that's the biggest challenge. It's and the easiest way to understand if you in your program you need to focus on that, it's feedbacks. Okay, let's go for a 2K race, a race in the weekend. There's a 2K in Noosa, let's say here, close here, and after Sunny comes. When you're at the go out of the water after 2Ks, oh what happened in the lab two? Ask, ask, ask for any kind of feedback. So I don't know. So you you were not there, you were not present. That's that's the biggest challenge.

Speaker: 33:57

Yeah, yeah.

Fernando Possenti: 33:57

How can we make them present, like focus, concentrate, enjoying at the same time? Because if it's not enjoinable, it it makes no sense if you're doing something that you don't love or like, but again, the biggest challenge is how we keep this new generation concentrated for two hours.

Danielle Spurling: 34:18

Yeah, that that's such a challenge. I didn't I didn't think of that at all.

Fernando Possenti: 34:21

Because that's that's one of the things that's the the mental preparation should be. The second thing, it's about decision making and it's about cognitive skills. So as soon as they cannot be concentrated enough, so how we can develop the mental, the cognitive skills in terms of um quality of decision, decision making, even peripherical vision. Because they they they nowadays they use the virtual reality in their games, in the famous video games. But how we use how you transfer that peripheral vision for a pack in open water, yeah, so that's good things. We we can just ask them, okay, you transfer that vision that you need in your game for your pack, but on the other hand, you need to be focused for a long period of time from one buoy to another. So, how we give them those skills of okay, there's two packs, which one I should pick up? Should I move to the right or to the left? How you develop that decision making and and give them elements of saying, okay, the right pack is the best one because I'm realizing that their speed are increasing. So I should put myself in that draft. So that's the future, in my opinion, in the mental um preparation for them. It's a work with cognitive and even for masters, let's say not only for for masters, for high performance swimmers, how you control your emotions in a context sport. Because if you if things are not happening the way you like you would like, or the way you you were expecting, sometimes just the touch makes you so angry. Say, oh why this person is touching me. So no, calm down, calm down. How you control your reaction or response to that. That's that's the kind of thing that the psychologists and and all the mental preparation should be ready for, plus all the mental health that we need to look after in in our athletes in in that season, because um before being athletes, they are human. That's and that's not negotiat negotiable. Um they are human beings. Let's look holistic to them as human beings, what they need in terms of manual preparation to be ready and to be happy in doing what the sport needs to be done.

Danielle Spurling: 37:06

Yeah, I think that's such an interesting perspective. I hadn't thought of about that before, but there's so many parts of open water swimming that people don't realize exist, like being able to change, as you say, and maybe running into someone or someone tapping you constantly on the feet, which is making you really annoyed, or the water conditions change, or you miss your feed.

Fernando Possenti: 37:28

How much energy you spend if you get like angry in that moment? Was one of the first things. Sorry to mention a couple of examples, but was it was one I I need to give a feedback from competition in March in Egypt, was my first official competition with the team, was a World Cup in in Egypt. And I I want to want to give a good feedback for Craig, the Nick's coach in Melbourne. And one of the most uh nice things that I saw from from Nick, there was a an Italian swimmer that just pushed his feet, go over him, take him out of the good position in the pack, and instead of getting back, or instead of uh putting himself angry, I saw Nick doing a deep breath, like coming back, put himself in a pack, pass that Italian swimmer, and finish with an amazing race. So that's the kind of mental control that we need to develop on them. It comes with experience, of course. It comes with uh okay, I passed through these a couple of times in my life, so I know how to deal with that. But it comes, we can we can develop that definitely, not only with um games and cognitive skills, but with a good um mental staff support. Yeah, I mean that that shows such um strength of character and obviously bodes well for his future races, and and and also like mental control, like uh I'm the quality of the the response, the quality of the decision, it it comes from from that way, like in terms of cognitive okay, the quality of my decision shows exactly how I'm dealing with with the sport, how I'm living the sport.

Danielle Spurling: 39:21

Are there any are there any rules around someone actually grabbing your feet and pulling you back? Or that's just all part of it?

Fernando Possenti: 39:28

It's all part of it. It doesn't happen quite often because um we we have uh sometimes flags, sometimes different colors in the sticks, so you know where your feeder are. Usually the feeder are in the same position that the athlete starts the race. So it's a random start. So the all the numbers are um they they go through a Google random uh app there. So athletes are positioned in the in the dive start. When when there's a dive start, they are positioned in their numbers, and the coaches or the feeders are in. same numbers uh as the outlet so it doesn't happen quite often doesn't happen quite often someone grab your feet but to drop your feet it's a again it's a one second thing so I'm trying to catch mine and yours are here so I'm gonna drop yours not on purpose but yeah obviously it when you're coming into that feeding station it can get quite busy if there's a big pack of people so that that's gonna be some contact there yeah and again another I I I never look to those kind of things as a bad thing it's another opportunity for you to create a different strategy and to feed in a different moment.

Danielle Spurling: 40:39

Do you advocate on a 10k swim them feeding each lap or is that entirely dependent on the conditions and they might pass by one and take the next one depending on the course.

Fernando Possenti: 40:52

We will have next year we we had um in Queensland states here and we will have in Bunbury too next year in our national a 1.25 course so it's eight laps you don't need to feed every every lap especially I mean I'm talking about high performance if you're a master swimmer and your dietitian said to you it's important for you to feed every lap just follow that instruction but in high performance 1.25 for them it's about 15 minutes so you don't need to feed every 15 minutes in this it's a this short course it depends the size of the course it depends the conditions if you are in a freshwater salty water um if you are in Singapore like you've dehydrated just in there if you don't need not even need to swim if you're just floating in Singapore you're dehydrating so it really depends on the conditions yeah yeah that was pretty tough in Singapore for um for the swimmers that was just very very hot in the water as well as the humidity one of the toughest races I I've ever saw in my career because um it was was hot unbelievably hot I mean the the water outside of the border you you to cool down it was really tough and to recover from from this kind of stress it's uh it's also hard and a couple of athletes compete consecutively so which makes them even greater like look to Maurasia winning two gold medals in with a space of 36 hours between them. Yeah that that's remarkable what did you think about that race they put in the the skins race where they had the the 1k circus and they dropped out after each one that's well that's a that's um well that's a happy question for me because we create that race in Brazil so yeah I was one of the the the persons involved in creating that race it's called the 3K in a couple but we start running those races in 2014 I think so 11 years ago in a in a race in Copacabana called the King and Queen of the Sea and the funny thing is that being quite honest I mean what was not a race that we thought for athletes or poo athletes joining nowadays it's it's a one of the best races for poo athletes to join us. I mean it's it's very good for them. When we created that race we were thinking about television we were thinking about how we attract television because they need that break for the sponsors so they need that break between races and then you you take a couple of then and the skills yeah I do love that race I I think it's the one of the futures of of open water in a couple of countries uh that's that's about creativity that's that's that's where we see the open water there's is a is a there's an empty field of races that we can imagine. So I received uh some suggestions from from countries saying oh why we don't do the 3k no count as a relay so one person 1500 another person 1k and another person 500 so then you can bring your team like your long distance swimmer your middle distance swimmer even your sprinter just for 500 meters and other countries um with a good budget let's say they are putting um time gates in the 500 meter instead of being a lap it's a straight 500 meter and they're putting time gates to collect their times in a 200 and a 400 so we can compare those times with the pool ones so how swimming in the pack or people around you affect you in a good way in terms of draft and in a bad way in terms of contact that there's a lot of a lot of creativity and the things that we can develop in open water um to make it more excited to have more excitement for the public and and for television and for we know that it's not only about getting faster that's that's my my other okay let's let's look to the other hand it's not only make open water a faster races because I know that people stay in front of the television for two hours watching cyclist or tour de France for example every cyclism called like Tour de Italy Tour de France so the the people stay in front of the television for an F1 race for one hour and a half so it's not the the time oh two tank it takes two hours to finish no it's the excitement that we have during that period so the excitement for public why we don't put data imagine showing the athletes are not swimming in a straight line they're moving inside and need to come back for the buoy uh what kind of angle they're doing what kind of pace they're changing imagine for the public in the television seeing that data so trying to understand it's not guessing but trying to understand with data the different strategies in in a different environment imagine in in the same with that current so what what is the impact of that current with numbers this is the kind of excitement that would like get more people staying in front of television for two hours yeah I I think you're right I mean technology could have such an impact on um bringing more people to viewing and and doing the sport and again what why they why they look I I asked a couple a couple of friends why you like to watch the True the Friends and cyclones for two hours so oh it's the view it's a beautiful scenario beautiful view look to open water venues yeah our open water venues are one of the most beautiful views in the world absolutely what's the difference the difference is that True the Friends goes through a lot of scenarios because you start in a point and you end in another one open water is turning like laps why we cannot do an open water starting in a point and finishing another one like a like crossing instead of a laps we can put buoys around that the crossing yes there's a lot of ideas that come up and uh for people that love to see open water but again look at our scenarios beautiful mountains beaches we are in contact with nature yeah I think you're right I think they they do the whole lap situation just because of logistics of having an and they're in control of that area yeah control control there's a third reason or the in my opinion the first reason it's about safety because you need to to create a safety environment for for open water i'm not i'm not talking definitely about sharks and animals and all that stuff like we are in Australia so there so I'm not talking about like this it's it's about safety of it's something happened there's enough people to help you out to help you to get out of the water so that lab situation it's good for safety and it's good in a certain way for television so you can put a drone on top but we we need to like develop different situations that we'll attract more and more people to to look at that and it's a perfect timing with LA and and Brisbane.

Danielle Spurling: 48:21

Yes yes and before I let you go I I just wanted to ask you what what sort of is the not the philosophy but what what do you want to leave with Australian swimming after your time here in Australia like right through to LA and Brisbane what what sort of impact do you want to leave with all the swimmers and the the culture?

Fernando Possenti: 48:41

Wow that's that's a big question that's a big question that's a big question um well there's uh three three things just comes through my mind the the first first thing is always a bit about gratitude you know i'm i'm i'm a grateful person of everything that i lived in my life everything that i experienced every people that it just just you know passed through my life gives me gives me something uh good or bad gives me something and i'm really grateful for that so my my first point that comes to my mind that being a becoming a dolphin it's something so big it's such an honor it's such a privilege so you are inspiring a nation it's it's huge i mean it's something that i never experienced in in my life so it's it just fills me of of gratitude of in being here that's that's that's the point that I start maybe Australians don't realize how big it is I mean how how beautiful it is um our philosophy in stream Australia make each other better that's that's exactly what I believe so it matches with all my principles but on the other hand I have my my coach um behavior that tells me all the time if you're doing something if you're dreaming big as I said um just make history just make history okay no gold medal was produced in aquatic sports in Brazil let's make history so Australia it's not dominant in open water yet is the Europeans are dominant let's make history let's make something that it's an example for the future it's a legacy for the future and that's all about what what a dolphin is a dolphin is a legacy for the future so those results it's not it's not for me it's not only for the athlete it's it's for the future of of of the swimming tradition in the country so that's that's in my opinion that's huge. I mean and if I want to dream big what more I can I can expect it. I mean it's a it's a it's a perfect place to be so and there's a third one that's this those two are really beautiful like gratitude something it's a value that I have on myself a legacy something that I do believe I'm away from a family so my kids are not here with me. If I'm paying this price in life I'm not seeing they grow up the the price is really high I cannot accept it less than 100% from myself.

Danielle Spurling: 51:33

So it's it's it's too high the price to to deliver or to give less than 100% so I'll I'll give you my best to make them proud I I love that I think we're very lucky to have you here leading this program for Australia because I can I can just feel I've never met you before but I can feel your passion and I I I love the fact that you're dreaming big because I know everyone wants to to dream big with you. I want to share that I mean that mentality with all coaches and athletes around they they they can make each other better they can they can dream big because they do achieve they they're really good they're really good they're better than they know yeah yeah I think so too well Fernando thank you so much for joining us on the podcast today it's been thrilling speaking to you and just um and and hearing some things I had never heard about open water swimming before and I I know everyone listening is is gonna get a lot out of what you've told us today. So thank you.

Fernando Possenti: 52:35

No my pleasure thank you for having me and I hope this inspired again more and more swimmers and coaches around the country to to join our community. It's a huge community and it is getting bigger and bigger and um yeah just enjoy summer enjoy open period yeah yes yeah all the races coming up okay well take care and we'll see you soon.

Danielle Spurling: 52:58

Okay then bye bye hey swim talkers if you love the show consider becoming a Torpedo Swim Talk supporter you'll get exclusive workouts early episode drops and a shout out on the pod. Join the Swim Talkers community the links in the show notes thanks for tuning in to Torpedo Swim Talk the podcast celebrating swimmers at every stage if you enjoyed this chat hit follow or subscribe on your favorite platform and give us a quick review it goes a long way to helping more swimmers find the show. Until next time happy swimming and bye for now.