Qualified - Lessons in Loss

When Joy and Sorrow Collide: One Man's Perspective

• Michelle Heaton • Episode 51

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Following two miscarriages, Darrell and his wife were thrilled to learn that they would finally become parents.   As they arrived at the hospital prepared to experience their greatest joy, they also received devasting news that would trigger a mix of emotions they were completely unprepared for.

Listen in on my conversation with Darrell Williams, former white  house communications director to the vice president,  military veteran, pastor, speaker, facilitator, and certified life coach. Darrell's candid discussion on managing emotional turmoil while offering support to his spouse, and drawing strength from their faith, family and circle of friends is sure to touch your heart, inspire you, and give you hope!

#miscarriage #joyandsorrow #faith #grief

Darrell's Website:
https://speakerhub.com/speaker/darrell-williams

Michelle:

Well, hey everybody, and welcome back to Qualified, the place where incredible people share their stories of overcoming great adversity and loss to inspire you and give you hope. I'm Michelle Heaton. Have you ever felt like things can't get any worse and then they do? Or have you ever experienced a moment of joy so wonderful, only to have it eclipsed by bad news? When the bad things in life start to outnumber the good, it can be difficult to stay strong and to persevere in the face of adversity, and sometimes we find ourselves wondering what this life is all about. Why do bad things happen? Why is it that our greatest hopes finally come to fruition? Yet the goodness can sometimes be diminished when new trials come.

Michelle:

Well, my guest today is a husband and a father, a military veteran, associate, pastor, a speaker, facilitator and certified life coach.

Michelle:

But he grew up with humble beginnings in the city of Compton, california, which was ranked the fourth most dangerous city in America at that time. Even with the difficulties he faced as a young man, he went on to become the operations and vice presidential communications officer in the White House Communications Agency, where he led over 500 missions. Following the tragedies of September 11, 2001, he was selected as one of five key leaders out of 30 senior managers to direct emergency action communications for the vice president of the United States, including duties as an Air Force II command representative. He's held senior level positions in Washington DC, earned numerous prestigious government awards and accolades, and he's had the privilege of serving under some of the most influential leaders in government. He's had a career marked by fulfilling service and rewarding leadership, but his personal life challenges began early in his marriage, when a roller coaster ride of sadness and joy occurred in his life. His name is Darrell Williams and it's my great honor and privilege to have him as my guest on the show today. Welcome to Qualified Darrell.

Darrell:

Thank you so much, Michelle, for having me.

Michelle:

Of course. So, Darrell, let's talk about that. That time that I referenced, when early in your marriage you and your wife were talking about starting a family, that your dreams of a baby were twice unfulfilled, when you both experienced two miscarriages. Can you talk about your perspective the male perspective on child loss, how you grieved and how you managed to support a grieving wife while coping with your own emotions?

Darrell:

Yes, that's a great question. A lot of times, for me especially we find ourselves in situations where we've never been there before, just like our spouses, but we have a sense of duty to the customer, protecting. And when that happens to our wives and our partners, it really does put us in a situation that's very unfamiliar to us, because most men just in nature they're just built, protected and take care of our spouses. But when things happen or things that we can't control is a very challenging situation for any man. So for me, we got married a little bit older in our lives. We were mature and we didn't think we would have any children. And then when we said you know what, let's go ahead and try.

Darrell:

And it was a really gut-riching experience because the first time she got pregnant we were kind of excited like, wow, this is really going to happen. And what made it so interesting, Michelle, was I was a youth pastor doing this time. So everybody would always say you guys take so much care of other people's children. We're going to pray that God blesses you with your own children. So that first time it happened we really thought like, wow, this is God rewarding us for being so faithful in our own ministry as being a youth pastor and Veronica being a youth leader. But I tell you, when that situation happened, where Veronica miscarried I mean I had never experienced anything like that before. It was just such a I mean, it just rocked our world. Just being honest. It was just devastating.

Michelle:

Darrell, I'm so sorry for your losses and I can only imagine the feeling of working with kids in youth group and then wanting to have children of your own and then later having to miscarriage. It's very, very difficult. So I know you had a full-time job and you were working with the youth group at church and I imagine you took some time off, but can you talk about returning to that environment with the other kids when others knew what happened? It must have been really difficult to remain strong.

Darrell:

The work part wasn't a big deal at that time, because things happen to a lot of people. But in the ministry it's like, where is that timeline when you can come back and stand in front of people? So it took us a long time to really get ourselves together, not to fake it and kind of stand in front of people like, oh, we're okay? And that was not the case. You know, we were just telling people we're still in the process, just give us time and space. So then once we got through that and we're like okay, we're good and we're moving forward, and then Veronica was pregnant the second time and then we're kind of nervous like, oh, hey, is this really going to happen? And once you got through a couple of stages we were like, okay, I think this is it. We got excited again.

Darrell:

But then the second time she miscarried and that pain was harder than the first pain, because now you're like what's going on? Never was why me or why us, but it was like how do we get through this? And so the emotions that I was managing was definitely hard, because I wanted to be there for my wife and in most situations a lot of men are really good at compartmentalizing things. So for me I had to put my grief to the side and say I'll get to it when I can. I need to be there for Veronica, yeah.

Darrell:

And what was really good was Veronica was very wise and she was asking me hey, how are you feeling as a husband? So that kind of helped out, because then I was able to share with her and then I did have a really good inner circle of men that gave me time and space. But then they would come and just say, hey, if you want to talk, we're here. And one thing I like about those friends they didn't let me sit too long. They really put themselves out there to say, hey, now it's just you ready or not, but we're going to keep asking you until you are. We don't want you to fall into a sense of depression or a loan or kind of strike out the whole world type of thing. I'm really glad that they did that, but definitely having friends that really cared about me.

Michelle:

Yeah, I think it's great that both your wife and your friends were there for you and that they were also sensitive and understanding. But you were getting ready to return to work soon and your job was pretty demanding back in DC. You were a senior leader and lots of people were counting on you back at the office. But grief can be so messy for other people and now you're about to enter into it. Can you tell us how you approached it and how others responded to it?

Darrell:

Yeah, absolutely. I'm one of those individuals with some organization. I was a mentor, I was a coach for a lot of people, so it wasn't like I was unknown, it could just hide in a corner. I was that person that everybody came to. It was almost like a running joke, like if your day is going terrible or you can't see anything good, make sure you walk by his desk because you're going to find a way to turn something into positive and you're going to walk away feeling better. So me being in that mode of despair and grief really did shake a lot of people because they're like you know, who comforts a comforter, and that was really kind of the quote.

Darrell:

And for me, once I got to a point, again, I wasn't the super person that bounced right back, it took me time, right, but once I got to a point I was ready. I reached out to my senior leader and said, hey, I know my status around here and I help motivate people. So I want to kind of take a different approach. I want to make sure I went to people ahead of time to let them know it was okay, because sometimes people they want to help but they don't know how they want to say something they don't know when. So I was like you know what, let me take that burden off.

Darrell:

I made it a point to go to everybody's office. I just went to visit everybody one-on-one to make sure they were understanding that I'm okay, you can come ask questions. And then you also you know young people that work that talk about their children. So I want to let them know please don't stop talking about the joy that you're having. Matter of fact, I encouraged them, I told them that sharing the joy about your kids will help me.

Darrell:

That really gave them more comfort, like, okay, I didn't want that to be awkward, so they couldn't talk about those things. So it was good for me to take that initial step, to go to each one of them one-on-one and ahead of time, and then once I can talk about how I was feeling and letting them know that being back in this environment is really going to help me get back to where I wanted to go and who I need to be. I think that really kind of took the pause and the unknown from my coworkers and allowed them to also help me. You go through the grieving by yourself, but then there's also grieving at work. So it allowed all of us to kind of walk through this together.

Michelle:

Well, that is truly inspirational to hear someone say I took the time to approach other people and tell them it was okay and all the things you did. That took a lot of strength, but you mentioned before you said that you had to compartmentalize your grief because you had to care for Veronica. Of course, but that's what you said. Men tend to do. So, in addition to the strength that you had and that you exercised with other people, did you have moments of grieving alone and, if so, what did that look like?

Darrell:

I did A lot of times, you know. At that time Veronica would kind of cry herself to sleep. So I would, you know, kind of be there for her and then, once I knew she was in a sound sleep, I would get out of the room and I would go down to the den and I would just pray and again, play gospel music, cry, just whatever I felt. I just let it come out because I found out that it was important for me not to let that stuff bottle up at me because eventually, I don't care how strong you think you are, It'll start wearing down on your body, you'll start getting sickness, and the last thing I needed was to get sick while Veronica was going through this.

Darrell:

So I made sure that I did have, you know, my time by myself. I played my favorite songs and that helped me out a lot. People didn't know me in the real big, in the gospel rap, but at that time they wanted any rap. Right, I needed to hear some Kurt Franklin or Fred Hammonds, you know music that really just kind of just reminded me that, hey, it's going to be okay.

Michelle:

Darrell, thanks for your willingness to talk about how you grieve, because it's honest and real, and I think it probably makes people feel a lot less alone in their own grief. And I couldn't agree with you more about holding emotions in and the effect on our physical bodies, because I remember thinking that going back to work for me would be a good distraction in the beginning and it was, but I didn't realize that I needed to let it out as well. So I experienced anxiety, sleeplessness, headaches, chest pain, you name it. So, darrell, having gone through the painful experience of losing two babies, you and your wife finally got the news that she was pregnant again, and it seemed like everything was going well this time. And then you told me that on the day she was going into labor, you're at the hospital.

Michelle:

You received the horrible news that your wife's sister suddenly passed away from an aneurysm. So here you are at this intersection of joy and sorrow yet again, and I know you had a great relationship with your wife's sister, Corliss, and that you knew her family as well. So how did this news hit you on what should have been such a joyful day?

Darrell:

Yeah, that was definitely devastating. She was just this amazing person. I mean just love all around. Right, she was the oldest, but everybody loved her.

Darrell:

It was hard because it was somebody that I didn't know but I heard of. I actually spent time with her and her husband, her older kids, so it was really, really hard. So I had a lot of emotions with myself, just like what's going on? Why is this happening? Not necessarily again, why us? But it was like you're struggling with you know whatever that message is. Can you please help me get it sooner rather than later, because I don't understand. I know things happen all the time. I just need some help on my end. The answer that I wanted was so that I could eventually help her. Should she come to me and say you know what you know? Why do you think this happened? Or what do you think the lesson is with this old part of me was? I was trying to get answers for myself in addition to, should the conversation come up with us, I want to be able to at least say something to say.

Darrell:

You know, what if this happened because of this, or what if this happened because of that, which none of it could be the right answer at all, but just want to have something to say or to add to the conversation Because, again, as a husband, you just want to be there for your wife, and even for me, again, that's one of those situations where, even though I wanted to grieve for her as well, I had to put it to the side because I wanted to have some possible I don't say answers, but at least discussion points, when the two of us eventually talked about it and I was definitely in a sense of searching for answers myself, trying to figure out, you know, what could I say and then also what not to say.

Darrell:

That's another thing for husbands. We really try to put ourselves in a place where we don't want to say anything stupid, heartless. I'm very careful, I will pause and, to my detriment, I will remain silent before saying something bad, even though silent is not good either. As a husband, sometimes I want to say something and we bite our tongue, bite our lip, because we don't want to say anything that we're going to regret. So I was.

Michelle:

That's so good. That's wisdom for sure.

Darrell:

You learn, you learn you learn Well.

Michelle:

So I really want to talk to you and get your opinion about this, because I know you do a lot of speaking and you coach people and you just have this experience and I know that, having experienced a loss of a child myself. It's one of those things where questions swirl in your head and you were at that place where you were kind of waiting for answers and to get in a good place of confidence to be able then to go back to talk to your wife and be assured about why things happen the way they did. So can we talk about the overall concept of how life can throw these trials and tragedies at us? Well, at the same time, we have blessings and beautiful things in our life and I think sometimes it's hard to comprehend the why, especially when bad things happen to good people. So can you address that from your perspective?

Darrell:

Yeah, unfortunately, I had this conversation with a lot of people, especially people that know that I'm a man of faith. A lot of times I don't tell people. I just allowed it to happen naturally. And then when they do, they're like oh, I didn't know you were a man of faith, I have some questions for you. So they will ask you a lot.

Darrell:

But a lot of times I tell you, Michelle I try not to be this know-it-all I'm very honest with people and I tell them that, even as a man of faith, there are some mysteries that we just don't know. Later on, maybe through the doctors doing further tests, you may find out that there was maybe some type of thing that was going on in the baby that was going to eventually cause them not to have a full life. And I always say things in a question like what if? And God's infinite wisdom and nothing that we know of that. Maybe he knew that we would wrestle with the pain a little bit better now versus it happening later. I say things such as well maybe God allowed this experience to happen because he knew there's a level inside of you that's deeper than what you could imagine, and maybe this is something that's going to bring out that deepness, not just for yourself but maybe later down the road when you feel comfortable that you may be able to talk to somebody else that's in a similar situation.

Darrell:

So for me, I just try to ask a lot of different questions, even if they're not a person of faith, just in their wisdom and their own personal strength. I tell them that they will get those answers eventually on their own, because God doesn't want them to walk around this earth and just not know and have that emptiness throughout the rest of their lives. I always tell them to pay attention to their life moving forward. For me I listen to gospel and music, but for them it could be any music that they listen to, or poetry that they normally read, or books, movies. I tell them you can get that answer in any way. I just share with them and kind of be open when that happens, because if you're really searching you will get that answer.

Michelle:

Well, thank you for your thoughts on this topic. I mentioned before that you're a pastor, so I appreciate and probably others appreciate your faith-based perspective. I loved it when you explained that there are mysteries in this life that we'll never fully understand and that perhaps God knew that we would handle something difficult at this time in life better than later. Also, when you talked about how the experience might have taken the individual to a new level of depth. I think that is so true.

Michelle:

I remember one of my previous guests who tragically lost her daughter talked about her other two children having a greater sense of empathy toward others as a result of what they've been through. So yeah, I know the pain of grief can really change us in a positive way, like you said. So I want to talk about purpose. You said maybe there would be a reason that this happened that can be used, so a lot of people like myself, after a great loss, will maybe start a podcast or write a book. You have coaching services that you offer and you're speaking engagements to do so. Can you talk about your view of how these tragedies and trials are allowed in our life to help us find purpose?

Darrell:

Yes, that is a very important lesson for people to understand. Here's the thing the pain doesn't go away. I tell people, it's all time. It may come to you in different ways later on, but that's always going to be there. So we do have a choice with what we can do with that reaction to that. We can react in a negative way or we can do something totally opposite to say how can I channel this into something different? And the example of that in regards to where you are in the United States.

Darrell:

You see people that have an unexpected loss and then they start a charity or they open up a scholarship with that person's name. All those individuals were in the same position that we were in, but somehow, when they were already, they figured out. I need to do something with this emotion and I believe with time, with great mentors and family support, we can all get to a point where we can ask ourselves what can I do now? What can I do next? What can I do to turn this tragedy into at least a little bit of joy for somebody else? Because I can't really do it for myself, because that loss is just too big. What if I can help somebody else?

Darrell:

Maybe it'll make it a little bit easier and that's why I like your show, because there's a lot of examples of people, as you said, that out there tragedy. They wrote a book, they started a podcast, they started support groups in their community, they led support groups in their faith-based institutions. So there's a lot of different things and that's just the same, not even from a spiritual perspective, but just from a life perspective. I just think that's one of those things as humans that we get to experience to be able to help someone else down the road. It's hard to explain, but I know people when they hear this they'll be able to go back and say, oh, I do remember hearing this on the news or reading about that story, and there's some truth into people turning pain into something positive.

Michelle:

Yeah. Yeah, that's really true, Darrell. You're such a kind and compassionate person and it's clear to me that you want to help other people with the hard things they go through in life. And you yourself had a difficult life as a child, growing up in a tough neighborhood, but you pushed past the negative influences around you. You pursued college, got your MBA and then landed a great federal job on the White House staff and with your hard work you earned your way to a comfortable and successful life.

Michelle:

But you also experienced a loss of two children and a close family member, and through it all, you chose to remain faithful and you and your wife never lost hope.

Michelle:

You told us you went back to work after your losses instead of isolating in your grief, and you helped those around you feel comfortable in their interactions with you, and you said you never asked why me? Because you knew that lots of people go through loss in life, and you encouraged others to continue sharing their joys of parenthood with you. You talked about how you knew that holding in emotions can affect your physical health and that you needed to be strong physically to continue to care for your wife, and you shared how you sought out and received counsel and support from your friends. You listened to music and cried and prayed in your deepest moments of grief, and that you tried to quickly discern the message or lesson that you needed to learn in your sorrow in order to heal and move forward in your life. Such good stuff, Darrell. What other lessons have you learned, having gone through all of this? Can you share with someone listening right now who needs hope?

Darrell:

I take. One of the big life lessons that I've learned is, for me, everything happened for a reason. Now I might not understand that reason, I might not even agree with that reason and I may not get it for a longer time than when it happened, but I do believe that there are some lessons that teach us something. And then there's also, unfortunately, some experiences that we go through because, whether you're a person of faith or as God, or if you're not a person of faith, life itself puts you in a situation to help somebody else down the road. And this is very evident, Michelle, especially with children. I'm always so amazed how children can be so resilient and, unlike adults, they know what to do to comfort a friend. They're so amazed. I love just watching how they interact, especially with the youth pastor. I would notice somebody that lost a brother or sister and I knew somebody in my ministry was like that. I would say you don't have to do this, but if you feel led, you just kind of go talk to Johnny and don't ask him a lot of questions, but just kind of just let him know that you lost a brother. To Don't say I know how you feel, right, don't say that, but just say, hey, I lost a brother to you, want to talk to somebody. I'm here and kids are so great.

Darrell:

I learned a lot of lessons from the kids in youth ministry than the lessons they learned from me, because they just have this way of just being there for someone else and I use a lot of those lessons when I talk to adults to say sometimes things happen. Pay attention to either down the road where you may find yourself put in a situation because of life, where there's somebody that's going through something similar. It's never the same, but it's something similar. And that's why I always tell people don't be surprised if you find yourself being somebody else's light while they're going through their darkness, regardless of how hard it gets and I know darkness is never going to go away. But I just want to leave everybody with a message of hope regardless of how cloudy the days are, even if it doesn't seem like it'll happen, brighter days will come. It won't replace the pain, but you will find a way just to put that one step in front of the other. And then the next day, the next day, and then you just find yourself moving full.

Michelle:

Yeah, I think that is the message that I wish I had back then, in my deepest moments of grief after losing Sean that brighter days will come. It's so hard to believe when you're in the pit, but we know it to be true now and we want to share it with everybody today. Darrell, thank you so much for being a model of positivity in the midst of hard times. I truly appreciate you and I'm so grateful that you agreed to be my guest on the show today. Thanks again, Darrell.

Darrell:

No, Michelle, thank you for having me and thank you for your podcast. Again, this is something that's really really needed. So glad that you were led to do this.

Michelle:

Thank you. So, for those of you listening, I hope this message arrived at just the right time for you. I hope you were encouraged to know that people who have suffered great loss can survive the pain and go on to do great things. Darrell had the difficult job of supporting a grieving wife while coping with his own grief, but he also learned the value of getting support, expressing his sorrow and helping other people interact with grievers, and he recognized that young people seemed to naturally come alongside their friends with a beautiful way of being present that stood out to him. My prayer is that you'd be comforted in your grief today, that you'd be blessed by other people who would support and love you in exactly the way that you need right now, and I pray that you would heal and have hope for the future and that you'd have a desire to move forward, even though it hurts right now, and one day you'll be ready to help someone else with the lessons you learned in your loss. Thanks for listening.