The Cut Flower Podcast

From Spreadsheets to Seedlings: Donna Sutton on Career Change and Cut Flowers

• Roz Chandler • Season 1 • Episode 124

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Text Agony Aunt Roz with your Cutflower Questions.

In this inspiring episode, Roz welcomes Donna Sutton, a career-changer who swapped accountancy for horticulture. Donna shares her journey into gardening, her experience with the WRAG scheme and the challenges and triumphs of finding joy and purpose in a new field. Together, Roz and Donna discuss the evolution of The Granary Garden, Donna’s commitment to sustainable cut flower growing, and the role of community and social media in modern horticulture. From career pivots to preparing for Gardeners’ World Live, this episode is packed with encouragement for anyone pursuing a passion for plants.

Key Takeaways:

Donna transitioned from accountancy to horticulture through the WRAG scheme.

Social media has played a key role in sharing her journey and connecting with the gardening community.

The WRAG scheme provides practical experience and valuable exposure in horticulture.

Donna highlights the power of taking small steps toward big changes.

Community and mentorship are vital for new growers and career changers.

She’s preparing a feature for Gardeners’ World Live — a testament to following your passion.

Donna emphasizes the joy of continuous learning and adapting through the seasons.

Find out more and connect with Donna here 

Make the most of your garden by visiting bramblecrest.com and use the code FIELDGATE at checkout. See website for full details.


Roz (00:00)
So I'm delighted to welcome Donna Sutton of the Granary Garden to our podcast today. And Donna is a career changer into horticulture, a WRAG member, which we'll talk about a bit more, and also a member of our online business membership, the Growth Club. So lots to talk about today, lots of parallels going on, which I didn't realize to begin with. So I'm interested in your experience as a WRAG and obviously part of WFGA, as I'm a trustee. That was sort of a bit odd, isn't it? I've become a trustee and I volunteer my time to them.

But I'm inspired to hear that you are a WRAG. Let me know, let's start at beginning. What led you to discover the WRAG scheme and what drew you into the world of horticulture? What were you doing before?

Donna Sutton (00:41)
So I trained to be a chartered accountant so I was a chartered accountant for 10 years so totally different industry and then had got pregnant and had my son and that then totally changed my priorities so before that I'd kind of started getting involved into the world of horticulture I'd had loads of houseplants when I had my apartment and

Roz (00:44)
I

Donna Sutton (01:06)
Then when it came to my wedding I did one of the Create Academy courses there courses and did that so that I could do the bouquets and all my flower displays for the wedding and I grew the flowers on my allotment but as nature always dictates what happens they all flower the month before so then I had to contact a nursery to help me out with things to do that and then obviously I've got my allotment so that

Roz (01:27)
Yeah.

Donna Sutton (01:35)
kind of opened that kind of growing area that had already been inside me but that I'd never really had the space to ignite. So I was doing that and then once I'd had my son it came to going back after maternity leave and I just couldn't imagine going back like I was really struggling leaving my son and putting him into childcare or anything like that and I just thought I don't think that

Roz (01:45)
Yeah.

Donna Sutton (02:04)
my heart's really set in the accountancy world anymore, even though I've had a fantastic 10 years and met some incredible people, there was just something else that I needed to do and very different and so probably when my son was like 18 months me and my husband were chatting and you know deciding what to do and he said obviously you need to do something that you really love to be able to you know not be with him in the

Roz (02:15)
different.

Donna Sutton (02:33)
the daytime because that's what I was struggling with. was just like, so jealous of who's going to get to look after him and it's not me. So we were like going through things of what we could do and he just went, right, what do you love doing? And I said, my allotment, but I can't really work doing that. And he was like, well, why not? And I was like, well, I just don't know how. Do know, like when you go to college and uni, no one ever talks about entries, how you get into the horticultural world. It's a hobby. So I guess I just.

Roz (02:35)
Yeah.

Donna Sutton (03:03)
I just didn't even know where to start. So I started searching for gardening jobs and found a local contract gardener that I worked for and absolutely loved it. So I was doing that for a while and then the accounting firm I worked for, that's where I met my husband. So he went to see one of our clients and they were just talking and saying, know, like how's family? And he said, my wife's actually doing a big career change. She's not coming back to be an accountant.

and she wants go into horticulture. Well, he said, you need to get her to come talk to me. And my husband was like, why? And he was like, I do the WRAG scheme and it's a really good entry into the horticulture world. And he said, I've had lots of trainees that have also studied the RHS alongside, which is what I was looking to do. Yeah.

Roz (03:52)
Yeah, it's what lots do, yeah.

Donna Sutton (03:54)
So then my husband came home and said you need to talk to him and I was like right okay so got super giddy but then also felt inside my gosh no I've just got this really exciting contracting job but I don't want let her down either so I was like ⁓ gosh so I went and met with him anyway and he told me about the WRAG scheme and the RHS courses and I just thought I have to do this like without a doubt being this new into

the career, the experience that I was going to get in WRAGS I just couldn't see how I would get it any other way, especially with me being so new. Yeah, not having any contacts. And he'd sent me like the, you know, the job sheet of everything that you do, you cover every single season and do specific tasks for each season. And I just thought I could make a portfolio with that and just bring it back to it all the time. Like it was a no brainer. so.

Roz (04:29)
No, the practical experience. Yeah.

I know.

Donna Sutton (04:52)
He was actually looking for a student and I thought, right, I'm just going to have to talk to the contract gardener I'm working for and just say an opportunity's come up that I really can't miss. I need to go down this avenue. The WRAGS scheme is only for a year, the trainee position, so I guess if it weren't the right thing, then you're in it for a year. But when is it never not going to be the right thing when you're learning what you're learning on it?

Roz (05:10)
Yes.

Donna Sutton (05:21)
I started that in September, so I think I was contract gardening from May to September and then started on the WRAGS and then, yes I've been there like, just over six months. So here we are.

Roz (05:34)
You're halfway through your

scheme. Gosh, it goes so quickly though, doesn't it? Because I employ WRAGS I've always, always taken WRAGS because they're great. They're career changers and they love what they do because they're doing it because they love it. And generally I've had five WRAGS now and of the WRAGS, the five that have gone, I've employed four of them.

Donna Sutton (05:38)
I can't believe this.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Wow, that's just good to know though, isn't it, that there's like progression as well. It's not just the WRAG scheme and then it's over. There's more opportunities with the garden that you're currently with. I just think it opens so many windows.

Roz (06:03)
Yeah.

Yeah, no, it's brilliant. It's absolutely brilliant. It's glad that you found it, you know, because it's, that someone mentioned it to you. Sometimes we think that the WRAGS and then WFGA is the best kept secret and we're out there trying. It's a small organization and it's always really difficult, but once people find it and that's it, you know, they jump in.

Donna Sutton (06:17)
I know.

Yeah.

It's finding it.

Yeah and like when I started my course at college I told a lot of the students there what I was doing because obviously everyone's trying to figure out how they're going to do their career change and so I told a lot of those about it and then even with my social media account people have messaged me saying you know what's this WRAGS how do I get on it and you know some of them have recently joined gardens similarly people at the college have the problem that we've got is there's just not enough gardens.

Roz (06:40)
Yeah.

There's not enough gardens.

It's the biggest. Yeah, it's the biggest. We can get lots of WRAG trainees. The biggest issue is finding enough gardens and it's getting gardens to even know that the WRAG scheme exists again. So there's a lot of work to be done for sure, but it's getting enough gardens.

Donna Sutton (06:59)
No.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah,

yeah exactly because I know there's a few people that I've recommended to do it that are on a waiting list you know to get to get a garden because I think there's a lot less up north where I am so you know it's just getting that word out there into it please let go on yeah

Roz (07:27)
I know. So if anyone's listening and you've got a big

garden and you're willing to take on a training and train them for a year, it's worth its weight in gold to just do it. So

Donna Sutton (07:33)
Yeah, yeah

it totally is. I always think, I used to train people in my accounting career and I used to think these people that you're training, you're moulding exactly how you want them to be. So if someone takes on a WRAG student, you're moulding them to be the exact gardener you want in your garden and I don't think you can get any better than that really can you?

Roz (07:50)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Absolutely

not, so you're six months through, another six months to go and then what's the garden called that you're at, is it called the Granary?

Donna Sutton (08:01)
Yeah. Yeah.

No that's my garden so yeah.

Roz (08:10)
I was going to say,

so the granary is your garden and then you're working in another garden.

Donna Sutton (08:14)
The Grand Isle is my garden.

Yeah, so I set that up just as like an avenue to kind of express myself, connect and things like that. But the garden that I'm at is Mount Pleasant Farm. So that's just the one local to me up north in North Yorkshire. Thankfully, it's just around the corner. can literally cycle there. So it's not actually a running farm. It's just a private garden. So there's just 10 acres. Oh my gosh. Yeah, there's 10 acres of land.

Roz (08:32)
What do they do? What does the farm do?

Yeah, so you get the bit of everything.

Donna Sutton (08:43)
There's two ponds, there's a kitchen garden, there's like an ornamental garden, there's a woodland. I mean, I just... It's so mixed. Like there's nothing that I'm really not seeing. And there's so many plants that I've learnt just from doing that garden. Like in, you know, in January, I was like, what are those yellow flowers? And they were like aconites. I was like, I don't think I've ever seen them before.

Roz (08:50)
Right! So, it's very mixed. Yeah!

So your journey is inspiring absolutely for sure and hopefully will inspire others to jump into because it's real and it's relatable and I think because you've gone from a career as a chartered accountant that's a big jump that's a nice steady career with a nice steady income and you jumped and it's completely because you've gone for a passion. ⁓ What do you think is the most important mind shift that someone needs to begin to begin?

Donna Sutton (09:23)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Roz (09:36)
begin growing professionally to decide to take the leap. Because lots of my WRAGS tend to be career changes in their 40s or early 50s. What do you think it is that switches over that says do something that you're passionate about?

Donna Sutton (09:51)
I guess, I mean I'd say, you know, being open minded to things when you're learning things along the way and thinking, I do love this, can I make a career, how can I do it? And I think the most daunting thing for people is the fact that you are technically starting at the bottom again. So even with me, you know, I'd worked all my way up in a chartered accounting firm and had a great job with what I was doing. And I'd probably...

Roz (10:00)
Yes.

Yes.

Donna Sutton (10:19)
overcome a lot of the hurdles and I was in a really good position doing what I enjoyed but it just wasn't you know igniting that fire inside me and everything that I really want to do. So I think as you know be prepared for the journey because it is a journey there's lots of hills, straight roads, really sharp corners but you've just got to embrace it all. I think the one thing with the WRAGS though is that

Roz (10:28)
feeling? No.

Yes.

Donna Sutton (10:49)
It is two days. It's two days out of your week. You could do, you know, if you weren't ready to definitely take the plunge to totally quitting your career, you could still do the WRAGS two days and do another job for three days. Like, you know, it's, yeah. And that's what I keep saying. People keep thinking, well, if I just did the WRAGS, then how am I going to earn? But then you can work the other three days.

Roz (11:05)
Yes, you could. You could supplement it. Yeah.

Donna Sutton (11:18)
And I guess the perk for me was that I went into it after maternity leave. So you finish maternity leave earning no money. So you know you can do it. So you know you can start at the bottom again. So basically that's just, that helped me I think. I think I don't know, I do feel for people that are going straight from a corporate career or any career full time, well paid, straight into the bottom of a new career again. That's hard.

Roz (11:25)
Yeah, you used to it. Yeah.

Yes. Yeah, no, it's

very difficult. Sometimes the transition is the best way, you know, doing a bit, a bit of both. One of the WRAGS who worked for us, Len is not a WRAG anymore. She's now doing RHS3 and is still employed by us. So she works for us on the farm two days a week and another two days a week, she's our content generator and she's an absolute phenomenal writer.

Donna Sutton (11:49)
It is, yeah.

Yeah.

Exactly.

Roz (12:06)
It was one of her skills and she was a marketeer before she actually even jumped out. She was working at the Open University. Good job. Decided I don't want to do this anymore. Became a WRAG. Now obviously does horticulture two days a week with me, but also does two days a week with me on marketing and content generation because she's really good at it. So lots of people have lots of different skills that you can just tap into to do other things.

Donna Sutton (12:08)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Exactly and you won't necessarily lose those skills like the accounting skills will always stay with me and that mindset that I had then. I do think it's a good way, ⁓ use your previous career to maybe get into horticulture. I was speaking to somebody the other day and he's an engineer and I went and did like a insight day at Rudding Park because they take WRAG students and

one of the head gardener there had said that's a great way into horticulture. You know as an engineer so many nurseries want engineers because they've got so much going on that they need them so you know if that's your way in and you ended up getting a full-time job as an engineer for a gardening nursery so that's great you're building connections and you're going to find another route in that still means that you're not just quitting your day job.

Roz (13:04)
Yes.

Donna Sutton (13:25)
starting again.

Roz (13:25)
Yeah, because

that is quite scary, I have to say. But like you say, if you can have a break in maternity leave, it's probably the best thing you can ever do. I always say to people that either that or if someone's been made redundant, where they don't have a choice. Sometimes it's

Donna Sutton (13:29)
Yeah.

Yeah.

yeah.

Roz (13:38)
And in a way you didn't have a choice because you didn't want to go back to five days a week away from your son. So you had the same thing. So sometimes when we're faced with we can't, there isn't a choice. It's a better decision because we have to do what we really feel, you know, and that's always, you know, people have made redundant in the past. say this would probably be the best moment for you because now is your time to sort take a deep breath and do what you really want to do. So it's kind of.

Donna Sutton (13:42)
No.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, definitely, I totally agree.

Roz (14:02)
I

never, you look at it positively. So you've obviously had some unexpected challenges along the way and you've gone, like you say, uphill, downhill, round the way. What's the particular moment when you realise this is what I was meant to do? This is what I was, I am where I'm meant to be.

Donna Sutton (14:05)
Yeah.

Probably that first day at the contract gardeners when I realised, gosh I love this, I love being outdoors, I love learning again. I think you can get to some points in your career where you do stop learning, whereas I feel like in horticulture there's always things to learn. Nature will do whatever it wants and every year, you know, my tomatoes might work one year. Who knows if they're going to work this year?

Roz (14:34)
you

Donna Sutton (14:45)
Like, you could do the same thing.

Roz (14:45)
Nobody knows. No, except

we've been growing for 15 years and some years we grow really well of something. One year we'll have amazing Delfinium seed germination and the next year it'll be horrendous. And I can't tell you why or what. It's just what it is that you just accept the difficulty to germinate from seed and one year is good and one year is not. But that's the challenge and you accept failure, you just get up and do it again.

Donna Sutton (14:58)
and you've done the same thing. Yeah, exactly.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know.

And that's the joy, I think, that it's those little things of seeing a seed germinate is like the excitement that somebody is interested in horticulture. Exactly. So you just sat there staring at them, waiting and then when they do, I think so. And then if they don't, you just think fine, I'll just sow some more.

Roz (15:20)
I know. I still get that now.

I always say to some people, always sow some sweet peas along with anything you do, because they'll always germinate. And that'll always make you feel great, because somebody asked me to do some for charity quite recently, so I'm doing another batch. And so I planted up another 150 seeds or something in little pots, we're going to grow, sell them as little pots for charity. And they started sprouting and I was getting really excited. was thinking, Roz, you know, calm down, really. You have a tunnel full of sweet peas next door, but you're still really excited about these little pots. It's like, quite funny.

Donna Sutton (15:38)
Yeah.

No.

That's good.

Roz (16:01)
So tell us about the Granary Garden then, what kind of space is it? What do you grow?

Donna Sutton (16:07)
Yeah so it actually all started with the name though is that's the name of my house and I wanted something like that to be the name because this was my first house that I bought this is where I got married in the garden and this is where I had the free birth of my son at home so I was like yeah this has got so many memories that I'd love to be able to incorporate this into my business some way so

Roz (16:22)
No.

You dig, off?

Donna Sutton (16:37)
That's how the Granary Garden name started. then because here I've got the growing space, so already when we moved in there was nine growing beds and a greenhouse. And I was like, right, that's just amazing. Which actually the past two years of having a toddler has meant that I've actually only used like five beds. But still going there. ⁓ The year when I was doing my wedding flowers, it was a godsend. I had like a full bed of gypsophila.

Roz (16:47)
Whoa.

Donna Sutton (17:04)
so you could do whatever you wanted with that then. ⁓ So growing veggies is my passion really as to what I love to do but obviously I've got a garden around my house too which has got flowers and you know normal plants that are not veggies although I did grow a tree spinach last year and I was like I need that in my actual house garden because that was just stunning. Might get one in here. ⁓

Roz (17:18)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Donna Sutton (17:30)
this year but I'm just experimenting as well at the minute so there's so many things that I'm doing and growing that I'm just learning all the time with it and doing different things, seeing what other people are growing, trying new things. The one thing I'm not doing is trying things that I'm not eating so I learn that very quickly. ⁓

Roz (17:41)
Yeah.

Yes, it's interesting you grow all these

vegetables you don't even like or you grow loads of lettuce and it all comes at the same time.

Donna Sutton (17:56)
my god.

Yeah, my gosh, it's so true. even the first few years I kept persisting with sweet corn and I definitely got like one cob, two cobs and I was like this is not even going to feed the family and all the effort that goes into doing sweet corn. So I just said, was saying to my friend, you some sweet corn season? She was like, yeah. And I was like, you take them, you grow them.

Roz (18:13)
No.

Yeah, off you go. Yeah.

I honestly, you learn that, don't you? Because I'm not a veg grower, but I have done the last few years I've grown veg, but I have grown veg I haven't liked. What's the point of that? ⁓ Now, I tend to grow veg that I really like that I don't actually grow many potatoes, because I think you can buy those quite cheaply. So I tend to sort of do beetroots and carrots and kale and chards and stuff that I do like. ⁓ But yeah, it would be lovely to be completely sustainable, wouldn't it?

Donna Sutton (18:30)
Yeah.

huh. Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah well I've been trying working with that so with things like garlic and onions that's been quite positive to do more sustainably and then your herbs obviously they're really easy to freeze so that's another good one to do but I think the main thing with growing your own food is to eat seasonally and you can be so much more sustainable you know if you're yes you do get a glut of courgettes no matter what but so just

Roz (19:03)
Yeah.

Donna Sutton (19:19)
find a million courgette recipes then. And it's just making that work I think to be sustainable because you're not going to be able to courgettes all year round necessarily or tomatoes all year round. It's eating them and they taste best when they're in season.

Roz (19:21)
That's right.

Yeah.

I was gonna say there's nothing

like a homegrown tomato. Nothing. So.

Donna Sutton (19:41)
Yeah, yeah, so it's true. But

then, you know, experimenting with flowers, like the first year I think I grew so many different flowers and I had no idea what was going to grow. And now I've learnt the types of flowers that I like, more about my style. But I think it's important to just grow everything and figure it out and think, right, what flowers do I like? What don't I like? Yeah. ⁓

Roz (20:05)
Don't worry about it.

Donna Sutton (20:09)
and then you can narrow it down because I always think when you look online you can't really tell how things are going to grow.

Roz (20:15)
I grew orange calendula for years and orange wallflowers for years without, I didn't like them. What am I growing them for? It's a bit like vegetables as well. So I actually only grow what I like, which is quite, but yeah, you do learn what you like as time goes on.

Donna Sutton (20:25)
Yeah. Yeah.

you learn,

yeah, narrow it down.

Roz (20:36)
So you share all your beautiful work on Instagram, you're giving it a go. How has social media supported you? You know, your growth and your visibility and how you're using it.

Donna Sutton (20:46)
Yeah, it was really good at the start I think to have a place to be able to share all the gardening and the seed sowing and everything. I think the thing is when you do a career change, the people that you know aren't necessarily interested in that industry that you've moved into. You need to kind of make a whole new world of geeks in that field.

Roz (21:05)
Yes?

Yes, you do.

Donna Sutton (21:15)
The initial start of it, Instagram helped me with that and then obviously the RHS course, I'm on a full course of people that love plants, same with the WRAGS Scheme, every day I work with people that love plants so I didn't have that at the start so Instagram really helped me with that, build a bit more of you know a community of people that are also enjoying that and just to share what I'm learning along the way to be honest because you can read so much in books but actually does it...

work like that in reality, not all of it. So I'd follow a book and then think, ⁓ mine's not doing that yet. So I think it was just good for me to share and just to see, yes, everybody failed with tomatoes this year, ⁓ or there's a really great way of propagating rosemary. It's just good knowledge sharing into even if you're using it yourself as a business.

Roz (21:47)
I know.

Yeah.

It's a very tight community horticulturally online. And it's about sharing tints and hints and I love it. Love it. And people reach out and it's great. So you're part of the Growth Club. Yeah, which is our business Growth Club. What made you join? You know, what made you join the community of the Growth Club? Just interested.

Donna Sutton (22:15)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So I went

to one of your webinars before I joined and listened to everything that was going on there, asked quite loads of questions obviously and then thought I need to know more of this because I think there is so much information online about what to do, how to do it and...

Roz (22:38)
Yeah.

Good.

Donna Sutton (22:56)
It's just the same thing of when I did my Instagram account. It's really good to have a community of people that are all working towards the same goals, but also for like yourselves and Tom to, you know, you probably know more what we need. Right now we don't know the roots and the where to look. Yeah, you just don't know where to find the information or the tips and tricks that you'll share. I like well.

Roz (23:15)
It's almost like you don't know what you don't know. Yeah. Yeah.

Donna Sutton (23:26)
I don't know where else you would have looked because you don't know how to Google that. It's somebody telling you that. So I thought, right, well, I need to be part of this community to be able to figure out how to navigate because before in the accountancy world, I did so much business development and it was all about going to networking events, which is great, but you don't get them just for horticulture. So was like, where do I go?

Roz (23:29)
.

No, people are too busy.

Donna Sutton (23:54)
Yeah.

Roz (23:55)
You have an online, it's much bigger, an online community, much, much bigger.

Donna Sutton (23:59)
Yeah,

and it's quicker and it's easier, you know, we've got the Facebook so you can just post and put things in there, ask questions, see the things that you and Tom are posting to give us inspiration. And it's just...

really interesting and inspiring to see the other businesses and what they're doing. know, when somebody says, I've done my website or I've just got my new logo and it's like, this is just so exciting what we're all doing and the different areas we're getting involved in, in horticulture, especially when I'm so new and I'm still learning the careers. So. ⁓

Roz (24:17)
Yeah.

Yes.

Yeah, about where you're going

to develop and where you're going to go.

Donna Sutton (24:37)
Yeah exactly so at the minute yes I'm a WRAGS trainee, yes I'm doing the RHS course but how many different avenues are there you know am I going to do flower farming, I going to be a contract gardener, am I going to go into garden design there's so many more like

Roz (24:47)
Loads.

I know,

I know it's very difficult as well to work out which way to jump. And all of them take business acumen, don't they? All of them, you're going to need all of that visibility, that social media, you're going to need all of, well, you're an accountant, you're going to need all the numbers, all the business numbers, and you can't be good at everything. ⁓ And it's about running a business, but that's quite exciting. So, you know, if you could visualize yourself two years from now.

Donna Sutton (24:58)
Yeah.

Roz (25:20)
what you'd be doing. That's quite, I mean, the world's your oyster really, isn't it? You can be a flower farmer or you can be a landscape gardener or you can do both. I mean, there's somebody I know that did one of my very early courses, one of my very early growing courses who learnt about growing and she was a landscape gardener, but she learnt all about cutting flowers and now she does both. So you don't have to just do one.

Donna Sutton (25:43)
Yeah.

No.

Roz (25:46)
It's almost like your portfolio career, know, Monday and Wednesday and Friday can be one and Tuesdays and Thursdays can be something else.

Donna Sutton (25:53)
Yeah, and that's exciting. That keeps it exciting as well.

Roz (25:56)
yeah

yeah 100 % yeah and it but it all centers around visibility doesn't it all centers around what's your instinct if you can let everybody know what your instagram handle is what's your instagram handle yeah so you have to go and give Donna a follow that would be very much appreciated at the Granary Garden so so that we can keep in touch and know what you're doing and see your journey because like you say you're not a WRAG for very long

Donna Sutton (26:03)
Yeah.

It's at the Granary Garden.

Thank you. Yeah. Yeah.

No exactly, you're not, it's the 12 months and I know you don't get kicked out after that but it's still looking for what Avenue you're going to go down after that and I know the garden I'm at currently you know does do similar to what you do and keep on WRAGS trainees because why wouldn't you when you've invested that time and effort into them so I totally appreciate that but I am so keen to know other areas of

Roz (26:26)
and.

Yeah, why wouldn't you?

Donna Sutton (26:51)
you know, what's kind of to do because I think the benefit for me is that I have done this career change a lot younger, so a lot of people on my course or WRAGS that I've met have said, I wish I'd have done it when I had my first child. Yeah. So I do, that's so positive because I have done it, so I'm not looking back and thinking, I wish I have done it, but it's like right now, how do I harness this and how do I move forward into...

Roz (27:01)
Yes.

what they all say.

Yeah.

Donna Sutton (27:21)
You know, a long career, innit? Yeah.

Roz (27:24)
That's right. Yeah,

I it's exciting. It's really exciting. So if anyone's listening today and feeling unsure of their next step, maybe stuck in that job and they no longer love or maybe they never loved it. What's the one message you'd love them to hear from you?

Donna Sutton (27:39)
say take it one step at a time. Like I'd said earlier about if you're wanting to do coming to horticulture the WRAG scheme you can do alongside another job you know the the RHS courses you can do them.

Roz (27:50)
Yeah.

Donna Sutton (27:55)
My RHS course is like part time, you one day a week. You could still work four days a week, do one day at your RHS course, maybe the next year you'll do two days in the WRAG scheme. I think just look at different opportunities that are out there and just remember you don't have to go all in straight away. You know, do take those small little steps into it. Get yourself...

Roz (27:59)
Yeah.

No.

Donna Sutton (28:22)
into the industry, make connections, because you don't know who you're going to meet and where it's going to lead. Look at me. Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. Yeah.

Roz (28:26)
No. And make sure it's for you. Make sure you love it.

because you know,

slowly, I always say to somebody, you can't decide you're going to be a flower farmer on Friday and become one on Monday, because actually it takes investment. It takes loads of time. The growing takes time. The foliage is definitely not going to be there for a couple of years. So you've not got anything to sell. And then who are you going to sell to and how much money do you need to earn? I mean, there's so many considerations that it's, you don't have to do it all at once. You can take it very slowly.

Donna Sutton (28:38)
Yeah

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, and just remember that not everything does go to plan always and it's okay. And that when things go wrong you can just start again or take a different avenue or, you know, get further advice. There's so many other ways. It's, you know, failure. So many people fail many times before they actually succeed and it's usually those people that do have these failures that become the most successful, don't they, out of it in the end.

Roz (29:06)
Yeah.

100 %

have the resilience to carry on. So what's next for you then in the Granary Garden? Do know what dreams you're on the horizon? Are you just going to take it as it comes?

Donna Sutton (29:29)
Yeah.

So I have been accepted to do a garden at Gardeners World Live this summer for Beautiful Border so I'm going to be doing that. Thank you. You are? You was?

Roz (29:44)
Mmm well done I was one of the judges. No I was when you did

it. So you've been accepted to do it and you're doing going ahead. I'll be coming to have a look at it.

Donna Sutton (29:58)
So I've got accepted to do it, yeah, so going ahead with

that. Yeah, so that's in June. So that's kind of another area that I'm branching out into maybe, you know, looking at garden design because initially I went to the show last year and saw the beautiful borders and thought, oh wow, I need to do this. And I said to my husband, I'm definitely gonna apply and do a beautiful border. And then...

Roz (30:04)
June.

Donna Sutton (30:28)
You know it's funny how things come up in life because then the WRAGS scheme partnered up with Gardener's World and then did a talk on it and so I went to that talk and I was like this is just meant to be like so I applied through the WRAGS they're one of my sponsors.

Roz (30:34)
We did, yeah.

Donna Sutton (30:46)
to gardeners world and the WRAGS had given us, they put on like two courses so a perspective drawing course because obviously, well not obviously but myself I couldn't, I no idea about drawing, I didn't even know where to start with the 3D drawing and then we had another talk all about design and how to design your garden, body and how to put structure and form and plants to use. Again as a WRAG student you're so new.

Roz (30:59)
No.

Donna Sutton (31:16)
you're not going to know all of that so that was invaluable then putting them on and then they also gave us each a mentor that we met with before we handed our application in so they went over a few things on our design and the strong point that came out about mine was the theme so it's from maiden to mother and it's like basically my journey from having my son

Roz (31:17)
Yeah.

Donna Sutton (31:43)
and the career change, you know, to where I am now. So that was good how you had the mentor and I've also spoken with him since being accepted just to let him know how things are going and he says like, you know, I'm on track with everything, which is just great to have that reassurance when you've done nothing like it before.

Roz (31:45)
Yeah, it's brilliant.

It's really hard thing to do. Don't underestimate how

hard that is to do. It's an amazing challenge, but it's like any garden. You know, it's timing. It's getting it. And when you've got the first week in June, it's not always the best time of year for cut flowers or plants, actually, the first week in June. You know, we would always say on the farm, we'd say we have a June gap, which means all of our bulbs are over and our perennials and our annuals haven't grown yet. So it's a gap for sure.

Donna Sutton (32:07)
Yeah.

Yeah.

No.

Yeah.

Roz (32:32)
So it's how do you, know, lots of biennials is the only way really. But I can't wait to see yours at Gardeners World. I'm going in June, so I can't wait to see it.

Donna Sutton (32:40)
Thank you. ⁓

Yeah, it will be really good and because I'm like 80 % of the plants, so I've got a nursery at detail plants that are sponsoring me for the perennials, so I've got a backup because it's just I have chose perennials that are first year flowering.

Roz (32:55)
Yeah.

Right, they might not be flowering.

Donna Sutton (33:03)
Yeah,

Roz (33:03)
Yeah, yeah.

Donna Sutton (33:03)
unpredictable. And then I'm growing all my annuals with my college, so they sponsored me for that because I'm at Ask and Brian doing my RHS. But the thing is, some of our cornflowers have started flowering. And I'm like, excuse me, you're marvin'. I know. So thankfully I've done the succession sowing because my tutor, she's great. She's helped me with like, you know, better ways to be doing the growing because...

Roz (33:15)
Yeah.

Yeah, it's like, stop.

Donna Sutton (33:32)
I obviously have some knowledge but not the extent of... you know... yeah. Exactly.

Roz (33:35)
Yeah, so when you get into successional and who knows what the climate is going to do and,

you know, and it's a backup plan for sure. That's what I mean. This doing a border is not going to be easy and it's going to be a massive challenge. But what a challenge it would be when you get those you've succeeded and you've done it. mean, people shouldn't underestimate how hard those showed gardens are really hard.

Donna Sutton (33:43)
Yeah.

No, I'm really looking forward to it. I'm not gonna tell my family it's that hard because they're definitely coming to help me set up and I'm just gonna be like, it's gonna be so easy for you. You just put in the plants where I tell you. But actually, it's probably not gonna be that easy for any of us but it's gonna be fun. And I've spoken to lots of people that have done it in the previous years just to find out how they found it. And I think, you know, the biggest takeaway has been to enjoy it.

Roz (34:18)
Yes.

Donna Sutton (34:24)
to really enjoy it, not get too caught up in the judging, just really enjoy making your bar do. Yeah. Yeah. And that's so important because one person had said that he, you know, they really missed out on that because they were so focused on what medal they got when actually in the end they didn't get the medal that they wanted, but.

Roz (34:28)
the process absolutely.

No, no.

Donna Sutton (34:49)
but why not it was the first time they'd done it? So me just getting through and doing a barter it's like that's like just incredible in itself for me when I won't have even been in the video. We will see. Okay.

Roz (34:52)
Yeah.

No, it's amazing. Chelsea next then, Donna.

But the process is the same. The process

is the same in terms of the fact that you have to get sponsorship and it's bigger, obviously. ⁓ But the process is the same. And as long as you get your sponsor on board and you've got a plan, it's the same thing. There's nothing to stop you taking the garden and making it bigger and putting it in Chelsea.

Donna Sutton (35:13)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Yeah.

That can be like five year plan. Don't hold me to it though. Oh gosh.

Roz (35:28)
Yeah. ⁓ I will, you know that. ⁓ Donna, it's

lovely to speak to you. I shall put your Instagram handle in the show notes. I shall see you in June. Let me know when you're going to be there. You're going to be there the whole time? You're going to be in and out?

Donna Sutton (35:40)
Thank you.

So we're going to go from, you can go from the Saturday before the show, so the Saturday to the Tuesdays when you set up your border, Wednesday is judging and press and like the awards ceremony and then it's open to the public Thursday to Sunday so yeah I'm going to stay there the whole time because it's just going to be fun.

Roz (35:54)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah,

it is. I'll probably go on the press day, the Wednesday. So I'll let you know. Because obviously, WFGA will have a stand there anyway. So I'll be supporting them. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well, yeah, I'll be supporting them too. So we'll see you. I'll see you at the show.

Donna Sutton (36:14)
Yes, there's quite a few people.

Yeah, I'm next to their sound.

It's be so fun, I can't believe it's like two months. It's not long.

Roz (36:29)
⁓ It's not long, Jean's not long.

All right darling, thank you very much for joining us today and yeah, an inspiration for people who just going to jump in and do something different.

Donna Sutton (36:43)
Thank you so much for having me and I'll see you at the Grove Club and in June. Thank you.

Roz (36:48)
Thank you.