I’m blessed to have many people in my circle that inspire me and push me to become a better version of myself every day just through their example. Some of these people are close to me, like my wife or my father.
Others, I’ve met throughout the seasons of life and am honored to have them in my network - cheering one another on as we reach new milestones. One of these people is Dr. Colleen Perry Keith, the president of Goldey–Beacom College in Wilmington and recent Outside Insights podcast guest.
Colleen welcomed me into her office shortly after becoming President and we engaged immediately in talks of leadership, higher education and all things business. During the pandemic I had the honor of being the commencement speaker for the College and Colleen had to listen to me at least six times with each graduation ceremony. I have linked here as the message fits our conversation.
During our talk, Colleen shared her inspiring journey, from her early career experiences to her current role as a college president, offering valuable insights into personal growth, mentorship, and leading integrative lives. All in all, the lessons she shared really highlights one critically important value of Outside Insights: Authentic leadership.
In this episode, you’ll discover:
Save this podcast for your next morning commute or start it now. You won’t want to miss Colleen’s lessons for personal and professional development as you reflect on your own journey and consider ways to cultivate growth and balance in your life.
Until next time, friends.
Chris
I’m blessed to have many people in my circle that inspire me and push me to become a better version of myself every day just through their example. Some of these people are close to me, like my wife or my father.
Others, I’ve met throughout the seasons of life and am honored to have them in my network - cheering one another on as we reach new milestones. One of these people is Dr. Colleen Perry Keith, the president of Goldey–Beacom College in Wilmington and recent Outside Insights podcast guest.
Colleen welcomed me into her office shortly after becoming President and we engaged immediately in talks of leadership, higher education and all things business. During the pandemic I had the honor of being the commencement speaker for the College and Colleen had to listen to me at least six times with each graduation ceremony. I have linked here as the message fits our conversation.
During our talk, Colleen shared her inspiring journey, from her early career experiences to her current role as a college president, offering valuable insights into personal growth, mentorship, and leading integrative lives. All in all, the lessons she shared really highlights one critically important value of Outside Insights: Authentic leadership.
In this episode, you’ll discover:
Save this podcast for your next morning commute or start it now. You won’t want to miss Colleen’s lessons for personal and professional development as you reflect on your own journey and consider ways to cultivate growth and balance in your life.
Until next time, friends.
Chris
That music was brought to you and played by Steve Miller, my brother in law and produced by Laney Miller, my niece. Today's episode of Outside Insights were hosting Dr. Colleen Perry Keith, the fourteenth president, the first female president of Goldey Beacom College. Colleen has been recognized for outstanding leadership. Colleen has received numerous accolades including a South Carolina Career Woman of the Year Award, and a women in business honoree recognition by Delaware Today Magazine. She serves on several prestigious boards in her field. These are going to be a mouthful, but I'm going to do my best. The Partnership Board of Directors and the Division Two Executive Board of the National Collegiate Athletic Association. My favorite part of Colleen is she's known for her accessibility and openness. And to personalize this, she was crazy enough to ask me to deliver a commencement speech at her college during COVID. You're a perfect guest for Outside Insights, my whole goal was to help subscribers and listeners of which there's sixty thousand, close their personal and professional gap. So welcome to our podcast.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Well, thank you. And you were an awesome commencement speaker by the way.
Chris Burkhard:I'm not paying her to say that you can never hear that enough. I can't decide if it was harder to do it recorded or live.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes and we had six commencements that year it was because it was COVID. So I got to listen to that six times and it never got old and I learned something new every time. People liked it.
Chris Burkhard:Well, my sense is that there's something in there that's relevant in this dialogue with you today, Colleen because here I was delivering a message about people maybe needing to understand themselves as they were putting everything they have economically and timewise into a career and a path in academia. And here my message was make sure you know yourself and for you to allow me to do that. I really appreciate it and it shows your understanding of careers in the world.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Well, thank you. You were awesome.
Chris Burkhard:So you obviously have a passion for higher education. Wher did that come from?
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Well, that's a great question. I was born and raised in Northern New York, very small town, very Appalachian like, and out of the one hundred or one hundred twenty people in my high school graduating class, very few of us went on to college. And the whole reason I went on was you know, that was kind of the path I saw for myself. But I also had teachers and my parents, who were very clear that this is, you know, you can stay here and you will not economically thrive. You know, you'll do okay and we've done okay but a college education is your way to be economically secure later on in life. It's your way to have that kind of financial security. And then when I was at one point in my life, I was working on a graduate degree in actually counseling at the University of Pittsburgh. So I ended up in Pittsburgh at some point. So I'm getting this degree and I started working after that in the temporary help industry, or actually it's right before I started working in the temporary help industry. And what I was seeing, I was the person who worked in the office and filled orders for company's, kind of like Placers. We had companies that were looking for employees and I was in the Pittsburgh area. And when I was there, it was the mid 1980s. And the steel industry had changed how things were working. So steel mills in the Pittsburgh area were closing, steel operations were moving overseas or to Mexico other places. And all of these union steel workers were out of work.
Chris Burkhard:And showing up.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes and so they're coming into the Kelly Services Office who I worked for and they're saying, I need a job and they're used to union steel wages which are, you know thirty or forty dollars an hour back then. The best I could do was minimum wage, maybe a little bit over minimum wage and certainly not heavy industry. We had light industry positions. So I couldn't do anything to help these people who were trying to put food on the table for their families. And there wasn't much I could do.
Chris Burkhard:I think what you're alluding to perhaps, or maybe I'm just sensing it, it's that they needed a job, but it was the understanding and needing skills or the understanding of needing to change their mindset. It's hard to think about but the market didn't bear what they used to get right?
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Exactly and I kept looking at it saying, How can we help these people? Well, there's not a lot you can do at that point, it needed to have been done years before that. You know, in the in junior high and in high school, people began to understand who they were and what they could do well, and then get trained for what you needed to do. College is one option, it's not the only option. And it shouldn't be the only option because not everybody's meant to be in college. I see that every year. You know, having been a college president for a number of years and spent my entire career almost in hiring.
Chris Burkhard:Can you pick out from the beginning first day who's not?
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Sometimes you can. There's just not ready for it? It's not their time to be here or it's just not they're not where their interests lie or where their skills lie. So I got really concerned about how do we help these people to become gainfully employed when they don't have transferable skills? We've got to do something to help them and I became convinced that working in education is where I could go and help people to be able to achieve economic security through education. I see it in my life, I see it in my friends that I grew up with lives, you know, my family. And that's what I felt like they needed. And so that became really my passion and my interest. I always did well in school but I never really thought about working in education. I actually thought about HR.
Chris Burkhard:So, I didn't realize the staffing industry overlap. And you know, my first job offer out of school was with Bethlehem Steel and they said my job would be to layoff six thousand people over three years. So, I realized that when I looked around, I was six five, two thirty and that maybe it had less to do with my brain and more to do with that. So I'm curious. It seems I mean higher education and you've allowed me into your school. You're very accessible, very open. I see you meet the local marketplace head on. How much of higher education is upskilling? Because that's what I think about rescaling. You talked about those steel workers, it was a little late and hard for them but they really needed to learn new skills. Do you focus on that? Just curious.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Not all of higher ed does. Your community colleges usually do because they're more workforce oriented. But colleges like Goldey Beacom can and do and we're starting to a lot more here because the world has changed. You don't have the same number of eighteen to twenty two year olds pursuing higher education any longer. And you've got people coming back and so not every college embraces that So you had more flexibility at a graduate level? You and I have workforce focus and the need to upskill in a very intentional way. Typically, you see that at the community college level where they spend a lot of time on that or career type colleges. Goldey kind of falls in the middle of all that and so that is a focus that we've done. We've actually created a bunch of new certificates specifically at the graduate level because it's a little easier to create them at the graduate level. We'll bring them on board at the undergrad level but you can do it easier at the graduate level in stack certificates into degrees at that level,.At the undergrad level you have more of a traditional focus that you have to kind of navigate within. talked about how long it takes to build content and curriculum. The world's speeding up so fast. How do you as president manage that cycle? I'm sure employers show up at your doorstep and say we need the following skills. How do you place that bet on new degrees? Yes, we listen. We have a career advisory board and we listen carefully to them and what they're telling us they need. And then we bring that information back to the faculty. We also listen carefully at all our career fairs. And we bring it back to the faculty. And I've got a person who does some instructional design stuff for us where she takes a look at what those new ideas are pulls together what are the classes that address that and the creation of new classes that could address that. And then we get it right through the faculty process. It has to go to a curriculum committee and then a division and then on to the full faculty. So we work it through the process, but we try to stay really close to what we're hearing through the Career Advisory Board through our internship programs. So if students are out there on an internship, what are they coming back and telling us? And then keeping an eye on what's the market saying in general. Reading the literature, look what Placers is doing and where are jobs that you're getting? But you've got to keep scanning your environment and bringing that information back and putting it inside the process. I've been pretty fortunate at Goldey because we're small, it hasn't been easy because inertia's a big force and who wants to change if I've not been able to show up to committee meetings for you know, twenty years. Why do I need to show up now to cast my vote for this program or that program. But getting everybody to buy into the mission of the institution and this is what we have to do. And then providing them with the documentation of why this is important, gets them focused on what we need to do doing. And I've been fortunate that people have really stepped into that in a big way.
Chris Burkhard:So you didn't start as a president, of course. You know, what does it take to be a president of a college today? I'm glad I made you giggle. I have found Colleen that folks think we fall off turnip trucks as presidents of companies or presidents of colleges. And if they stop and think they know, we've made mistakes and we have to learn stuff and it's not a straight line path. But you know, what was your path? What was it like, and what's your take today?
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:When I went back to grad school after my experience with Kelly Services, I went back and got my degree in counseling. I thought I wanted to be a guidance counselor in a school. And you know, go solve all those issues of understanding who you are and what you can become and how you can have skills that transfer into various industries and all of that. And I ended up working at a college instead. And so I became an academic advisor at a two year community college in Oklahoma of all places. So I went from Pittsburgh to Oklahoma.
Chris Burkhard:You really get around to some of the most glamorous places.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Everytime the rents due I just move. I'm out there and working in higher education in a counseling center. So I did academic advising and counseling. So we were in books called the Guidance and Career Center. So I did personal and social counseling, but also academic advising, and taught the freshman survey class for adjusting to college, that type of thing. Then, I was married to my first husband, we moved to Ohio and I worked again,for a short while in a counseling center. But most of the time, I started out working for Ohio State in a similar position academic advising for one of their regional campuses. While I was at Ohio State, I also did a lot of things. What I developed as a niche for I'm picked up and put into something that needs to be fixed and I fix it and then I move on.
Chris Burkhard:I sense that.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes, that's my my job is here, fix this and that I really developed at Ohio State. So the College of Education was making a lot of changes in Ohio State as a general institution have decided they're going to train teachers a little differently, so I had to help navigate that. And then one day I came into work and the guy who ran the program at a state prison, which in Ohio is the step below maximum. He had injured his back and he was going to be out for several months, it ended up being about a year so I had to go run that. And then I came back from that and I've worked in the academic dean's office, working a lot with the adjunct faculty and the master schedule of classes. From there, I went to a small graduate Theological Seminary where I had to do a little bit of everything. So I worked with the board, served as the HR person, did everything outside the classroom and then I've taught as an adjunct faculty member worked in fundraising. So my path has been, you know, we had somebody who left who was running the major capital campaign and the president of the seminary said, I don't want to refill that position from the outside, you and I are going to finish this campaign. All the sudden I had to be a fundraiser. So you learn and so all of that came together when I was recruited to my first presidency and all of a sudden, it was like wait a minute, I've worked in every area of higher education so I understand how the enterprise runs and how it should run. And that was the training. The traditional route to the presidency in higher ed is usually through the faculty. You become a faculty member, you become the academic dean, the provost and you go in, but that's really changed. That's the traditional way, but anymore you know, I've got a doctorate in higher ed administration so there are more people like me in those positions now.
Chris Burkhard:So I clearly see how you got to move around in colleges and do all the roles and how that gives you a big picture perspective. How is that different from being a leader as president versus all the roles you saw?
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:You have to be very true as the president, you got to be very true to the mission of the institution and the student first approach. So every decision, you got to think about how is this going to impact my students? And is it true to my mission, and are my students going to be positively impacted? Is this is going to help them to achieve their goals and their dreams? And you have to really align with that closely, much more so you use that kind of thinking in every job, but here in the presidency, you've got to be that big picture person.
Chris Burkhard:So and you're repeating that a lot. So is that the same as me saying, I have to know where I'm going, I know the values of Placers and I've got to make sure I take the customer perspective into mind?
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes because my students are my
Chris Burkhard:So I think that's probably really important customers. because you're providing almost like a compass and a map effect for everybody when they all the ideas and things they want to do and you plans they want to make. But it comes back to how it impacts those two things.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Right.
Chris Burkhard:I see. So you repeat yourself often.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes I do and sometimes you get tired of it.
Chris Burkhard:Yes, I've learned I'm sure you could teach me this. But sometimes I'm repeating a message that I'm bored with on the seventh time and enough people say, I didn't know that makes me realize that that's why I have to keep repeating those messages. And that is an operational strength that it's when you move off of it too quickly sometimes I think it can bite you pretty good.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes. I'm often asked to step into a mentoring role that different people and I've just finished up one with the American Council on Education, and they hit a women in higher ed program for the perspective presidency. So women who want to become college presidents.
Chris Burkhard:I love that.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes, it's a neat thing. And I'm often pressed into service because I've served now for fifteen years as a college president at three different institutions. So I kind of have learned the lay of the land. And my mentee, who is just awesome, who I just finished up with. She said, she's interviewing, actually this week, I guess, tomorrow for a college presidency. And so we were talking about this kind of thing, like how do you make decisions and how are you going to go talk to the search committee about how you make decisions? And one of the things I said to her is, you're going to get so tired of saying the same thing over and and over and over again. But if you don't do it, you're not going to have consistency in how you make decisions. And people, your employees, your faculty, your staff, your students, they count on you for that consistency, that they know that you're going to make a good decision, because this is how you make decisions and you're going to have to keep saying the same things over and over. And she's like, Yes, I know and that's the part that just concerns me because sometimes I gets so tired of saying it. I said, we all hear you but you've got to do it.
Chris Burkhard:So I'm probably projecting my own life on to this question, but I think you can handle it. You know how to be a president, but you've got this added skill of advice and mentorship with leadership. Do you think there's a difference now for you because you lead through this mentoring and advising approach? I get the opportunity to work with presidents of companies and I coach them. I certainly think my experiences give me credibility when I'm helping them but I find that I lead my own company with that same kind of advising mentoring approach as I do other people. I'd just be curious about your experiences.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:That's exactly what I do and since I've been at Goldey, I'm the first person that they hired from the outside in the history of the institution.
Chris Burkhard:That blows my mind.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:You know Goldey well enough to know that wow, that took a leap of faith for them because they did not hire from outside. So here I come in as their new president and we're now one hundred and thirty seven years old and I've been here four years. So what the trustee said to me was we know we have issues that we have to get resolved. We have a lot of long term employees, people that have been here forty eight years, forty five years.
Chris Burkhard:That's so impressive, in one way. So impressive
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:In one way it is and then in the other way, it's hard to make change. So we want you to come in and get us operational in the way we need to be operational, like the not for profit higher ed institution, because the trustees could see where the issues really were. And don't come in and clean house if you don't have to, if you have to, that's fine. But you know, people they've been here a long time. And I said, my MO is, people don't come to work to fail, they come to work to do the right thing and to be successful in their roles. So I'm not going to come in and clean house. I'm going to come in and everybody gets at least a year to do their job. Because you've been coming to work to be successful for all these years and you want to do what's right for the institution and students. So why would I come in and get rid of you? But what that means is I have to come in and teach people how to do things the way that things should be done. Goldey started as a for-profit institution, as matter of fact, I've got sitting over on a table in my office stock certificates. So when Goldey started, they sold stock to people. Now the major shareholders were the president and one of the vice presidents and the president's wife, that sort of thing. But we were a for-profit institution from 1886 through 1969.
Chris Burkhard:I did not know that.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes. We were a for-profit until then and in 1969, they changed the model and became a 501 C three, not- for profit higher ed institution. But they never really changed their model. The chart outs how business was done, that sort of thing, was still in a for-profit mode and the mindset was very much in a for-profit mode. So if we make a profit, we're going to sweep that profit into the endowment, not necessarily reinvest it in the institution, which is what not-for profits do so they couldn't give out distributions anymore. But what they did was they pushed it and so now we have a very strong endowment, but operationally and programmatically and all of that there wasn't the level of investment, reinvestment in the mission of the institution. So, I've had to help teach about that and explain. We had some retirements and I've got a couple VP's that are also long term employees but new in the VP role. But I have to work with them and model the decision making, model how you have the conversation with somebody. Because I'm in the fourth quarter of my career and sixty one so I'm going to want to retire at some point. And when I retire, my job between now and then is to make sure that this place is viable, has leaders to continue on the kinds of programs that are needed all of
Chris Burkhard:It's not the Colleen show, right? You know, it. Dale Carnegie said a long time ago, if you give people a high standard to live up to they'll probably surprise you. So the way you're operating is very core to my principles and I think it makes a ton of sense. And some make it and some don't and that's okay. You've lived by your standard and given everybody a very fair, very equitable way to make and drive changes.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:What I always love people to understand, and I've got one who doesn't seem to get this, but you can lead, you don't have to be a vice president or whatever, you can lead from whatever position you're in. There is a leadership role and you need to embrace that leadership role, and do what a leader would do in your position. And so that's my new thing to work on right now with a couple of people.
Chris Burkhard:I think it's a great journey. You know, I do ask similar questions so that listeners expect certain things. The one thing that I always get feedback on Colleen, is hearing leaders share their lessons, their valuable lessons. There's lots of ways that it comes out but if you as a teacher, as an advisor, what would you like to share? You've got sixty thousand mentees to share something.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:That it's really not about you. That you had said that just a few minutes ago. And if you're the leader, you're there to do a job and you're there to do the very best that you can for the mission of your institution. And it's not about you. And when you start to think it is about you, that's when it's time for you to reassess where you are, what you're doing. You know, maybe it's time to move on. But it should never be about you. And I know a lot of college presidents a whole lot of them. And I always say to people, like when search firms call me and, you know, what do you think about this person? What do you think about that person? We'd like to check in with you on this one. I always say, if the person really, really, really, really wants to be a college president, that's not the person you want to hire. You want to hire the person who serves because they can't imagine not serving to make this institution or this field or the sector of the economy better. That's who you want. You don't want somebody who's about them because then every decision is about them. And that's when schools fail, I see it time and again, those are the ones that have the most problems. So you've got to check your ego at the door and be about the mission and about helping others and improving society. I have to think that if I had those steel workers coming through Goldey Beacom that they would leave here understanding that they've got skills that can be used across a variety of sectors and they would be okay. They would have something to fall back on but if I was all about myself, I wouldn't even think about that.
Chris Burkhard:When a job seeker comes to see me or a leader that I'm working with that wants to say, they need to make a million dollars, I almost inevitably know that that's a problem. And I always try and tell them if you do the right things, the money will follow, if that's your goal, right? But if you do the right things, which is what you're saying. It's interesting. And it's hard, right? I mean, especially if you're not where you want to be and we're talking about a college president is different. A lot of folks are earlier in their journey and it's hard for them to think like that. They feel like they have to think about themselves, but it applies at every job. The more you take care of other stakeholders the better you'll do.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes, and if you have a healthy organization, everybody's going to thrive.
Chris Burkhard:It seems to me like you're establishing an entrepreneurial mindset and ecosystem at the college presently. It seems like it, that's the way I see the world. Are there a lot of obstacles to creating such an environment and how do you continue to battle it and overcome it and put energy to it all?
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:It can be. I love the phrase, inertia is a big force and it's a really hard force to overcome. So sometimes you will have people, whether faculty or staff who are just used to doing what they've always done, they don't feel the need to change. It's been easy to come here for ten, fifteen, twenty years and you're going to get a paycheck, and you're going to be able to do things, but you know, your classes might not be as dynamic as they could be. Are you teaching? Are you following your field? I've run into situations where after Enron happened, classes in business, business law, business management, something like that, where that didn't even encompass the learning the Patriot Act, the things that came out after the Enron situation. All of that should be built into that class, it should be built into that curriculum baked right into it, because that has to do with ethics and morality and all the things that are important for business to lead. Sometimes people are just very content with the status quo, even though they know they ought to be incorporating this stuff, they just don't. And you know, so getting people energized to do curriculum review, in a nice setting, it's curriculum review, it's looking at what you charge students. Looking at the whole issue of student loan indebtedness, that's a big topic anymore. We looked at it here and we said, okay, we don't want students having to go out and repay big loans. And we had been very generous with scholarship awards over the years but the problem in higher ed cost is not just the loans. It's not understanding how you pay for college and how that really works. So we said you know what, instead of us charging a higher amount and giving a lot of aid and people not really understanding that, why don't we just roll our tuition back? So we looked ta our endowment, and we took that endowment spending and we applied it to tuition so that we could cut our tuition by fifty percent. So we cut it down.
Chris Burkhard:And you simplified. There's so much friction and going to college and figuring all that crap out. You simplified it. But it's a strong business advantage to be
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes. And the thing with tuition rollbacks like that, with Goldey we had the endowment to be able to do it, not every college can do it that way. Typically, colleges take in tuition and then they give it back in the form of aid and that's how they do their discounting. So if we're going to do a roll back, it's going to be rolled back able to operate. I mean business is all about differentiation because you've got to increase in enrollment, so you've got some extra revenue coming in. So now we're going to use that to cut the tuition or reset it or whatever. At Goldey that's not how we did it because we have this strong endowment which is doing it even there. And even that, that's a lot of information for people to try to assimilate. People like me get it because I live it all the time. whether it's higher ed or staffing firms, so to be able to do that you have a compelling advantage and it's a smart move. Yes and it's a way to use your money in a way that helps students and influence mission in a very logical way.
Chris Burkhard:Go ahead, please,
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:You know, the valuable lessons to the one thing I sometimes think about, I don't know why this popped into my head just now but you know, you have your professional life and everything that you have to do in there. But then you've got the personal stuff that crops up sometimes. And what's the leadership lesson as you go along? And I'm a cancer survivor. So I was just finishing my first year as a college president of a college in South Carolina. I was like, two or three weeks away from the my first year anniversary date and I got diagnosed with breast cancer.
Chris Burkhard:Oh, my goodness.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:So I had at that point my trustees were concerned that what if she dies, what's the leadership void that we're going to have and all of that?
Chris Burkhard:Typical trustees.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes, a fair question.
Chris Burkhard:Yes.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:But you know, I had to go through surgeries and chemotherapy and lost all my hair and radiation and all that kind of stuff. So I had about eighteen months of active treatment that I had to go through for my particular kind of cancer, and instill I had to go to work every day. Throughout that whole thing I missed ten and a half days of work total out of those eighteen months and so I had to be there.
Chris Burkhard:I knew you were a badass. Now I know you are. Excuse my french.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes but you know, I learned that I couldn't be anybody except myself. You know, so I had to go be the leader, and do what I did with all of this personal stuff going on, and bring that in when it was in, you know, bring it in as appropriate. Sometimes that's the elephant in the room. It's like, is that a wig she's wearing, what's going on? So I would just, I would talk about it. And I would say, let me tell you how I'm doing. Today I'm really slow. So I know, I have to speak to this group. So I'm going to sit down when I speak to you because I'm just kind of not feeling like I want to stand up. And you know, I would get that out of the way. And I would talk about what that meant. I've always been good at delegation and work and asking others to do things. I learned then I really had to do that and that's an opportunity for that person. You know, I would turn things over to like the provost and I would say hey, I really feel like crud, could you cover this event tonight? Here's what that means. And it gave her the opportunity to go be the president. And then she started, you know, I said, if you want to apply for presidency, so I'll be right there behind you. You know, I'll support you in that.
Chris Burkhard:Colleen, did it take a lot of courage to be that authentic? Because I mean, there's a reason that you and I talk and like each other because I mean, I only know that way. Don't ask me why, but so I admire it. But was was it hard or was it the only choice you had?
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:I think it's the only way I know how to be. I can't be anything else.
Chris Burkhard:I wish you could teach that in a class. And I hope we can help some folks about the value of being that way because it just gets everything out of the way and out in the open.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes and I feel like if I didn't have that ability to do that, I don't know where I would be. I certainly wouldn't be as happy in life, that would be problematic. Because if I'm not authentically who I am, and there was a time, when I probably tried not to be that way.
Chris Burkhard:We think we're supposed to be a certain way.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:And in my first marriage it would have been like that. There were a lot of issues there. And, you know, I didn't want the world to know that things weren't rosy, but they weren't. And when I finally started being honest and open and said, No, I'm leaving this marriage, this is not where I need to be.
Chris Burkhard:Colleen, there might be the thought, I'm a step behind you so I still think this fits. There might be a thought from a listener that that's our privilege as President, that we have the opportunity to be authentic. That we can speak that truth because we've created the mission but I have the sense you're saying that anybody can and should do this. Am I reading you right?
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes and they should. I've been doing evaluations for some of our staff and I have one fellow who's great. He is awesome and he feels like he has to solve all the world's problems, whether it's his mother or his partneryou know, any of that.
Chris Burkhard:That was 1996 for me.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Well, when I said to him, you know, that's who you are. And it's okay to come into the office and say, You know what, this is how I'm going to manage my staff because that's who you are. There's no Goldey Beacom way that you have to manage. You've got to come in and manage your staff the best way you know how. As long as your legal and all, coming in and saying, Look, you need some time, take some time. We can be flexible in the workplace, you can work from home tomorrow if you want to, that's okay. And if that's what you need, as long as your job gets done and you stay within your budget, I'm good. But if the job's not done and if you're over budget all the time, then I've got a problem. But other than that we're good.
Chris Burkhard:So the pandemic is still hanging around for all of us a little bit.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes it is.
Chris Burkhard:How has that influenced leadership, how you approach things, the business, work life stuff? Where has it left you and Goldey?
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:I've tried really hard to allow people the work life balance that they need. If that means four days in the office one day out three days, in two days out. As long as the job is getting done and as long as the offices are open, because we're in a people business and we're a residential campus. So our undergraduate students, a lot of them live here on campus. So, you can't walk into the former building and have all of our offices dark. Somebody's got to be there but not everybody has to be there every day.so that's okay. So, I've tried to make sure that people understand that they can come and go and as long as the offices are covered, and students are served and our mission is implemented, then that's okay. They know they can do that. I've had not very many people who've really taken advantage of that. We have a person here or there who wants to work four days from home, one day in there, I'm not sure that their job is being done successfully, at least the supervisors don't really feel that. So, you know, there's some of that.
Chris Burkhard:I'm making Colleen choke to death here. I get her talking so much that she's going to cough, take a drink. It's got to be real world here, I think in so many ways. So, I have a fun question for you if you feel up for it.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Go ahead.
Chris Burkhard:You hang around a lot of twenty one year olds, but I'm going to ask it differently. What advice would you give your twenty one year old self?
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Oh! Don't rush into relationships. Take your time and make sure that what you end up in, in terms of whether it's a work relationship or a personal relationship, whatever is growth producing for you, then it's where you,you're comfortable and where you need to be. I think I rushed into some things a little too early.
Chris Burkhard:I don't know if we know, when we're twenty one, thirty one, forty one, how to spend time on any one thing like that. Is this the right relationship? Let me think about it. I think that's terrific advice.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:And I think if you have that mentor, that person who can kind of help your question that point, and that's part of where I see especially in the college environment, our faculty and our staff can do that. So, you know, a faculty member can say to a student, you know, are you sure this is where you want to go? Let's think about that a little bit. I kind of wish people had done that. But a small college campus like we are, you can do that. And so I like to think that's one of the intangibles that students get when they come here.
Chris Burkhard:Which becomes very tangible, what an advantage. Those are two very big advantages for the school and I've been a fan of the school. Folks have allowed me to teach your guest lecture or comment there for a long time. So I always appreciate the approach that the college has with its local people. Lessons to learn, lessons to share or maybe favorite books you'd like to hand out?
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:I have an elliptical at my house. I got it back when I was first diagnosed with cancer because I just wanted to be able to work out in the house. I've always been a runner or walker or whatever. But I got this elliptical and I am on it every morning and I read while I'm on it.
Chris Burkhard:So you've got coordination to.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:I do. And so you know, I have my nook, so I have that there. And I'm not in the elliptical and I do about an hour every day and read while I'm on there. And I try to not read anything in higher ed literature while I'm on there. I just finished a book yesterday it's Beyond That, The Sea, and it's about a family during World War Two. A family in England, who sent their daughter to live with an American family and know about the so cheap, lived over in this country for five years moved away from her parents. And that happened to a lot of people. There's historical fiction, I really enjoy that and so, as I'm reading that, you think about, Wow, can you imagine being this twelve year old, eleven year old girl who gets sent abroad to be safe? I mean, life changes with her husband, those are very formative years. And then you think back about what does that mean for me and what's people's story? What did they bring to the table that I don't happen to know about? Like this gal goes back home to live in England, and doesn't really know anything. The war had changed everything there. So that reading beyond your field, keeping a broad interest in understanding that there are different ways of thinking out there.
Chris Burkhard:I always find by my audience can see I've got books galore all around me, but an entrepreneurial mind, that's always the center of things. But I find that no matter what I'm reading, I have this reflection or flash that relates to my current environment or situation. So you're not saying that directly, but I don't read staffing industry report anymore, but if I can read a book on stoicism or our historical fiction, maybe it's just because our brain relaxes.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Well, I find when the brain relaxes, you can learn so much more.
Chris Burkhard:Yes.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:There's just so much that's out there. There was a book, the one before the one I just finished was called The Lost Ticket. And that was interesting about this man who was on a bus and he met a woman and she wrote her phone number on the back of this ticket. And he was in his early twenties He went through the next sixty years of his life looking for her because he lost ticket.
Chris Burkhard:Do you know the author of that?
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Sampson I think.
Chris Burkhard:And what was the name of the first author? Well, will we can always put it in show notes.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Beyond That, the Sea was the one that I just finished by Laura Ash.
Chris Burkhard:We'll put a link in. It's always interesting folks like that kind of thing.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:And there are a lot of them. Things that just kind of all the sudden, it sparks something in you. So I always encourage people to read broadly beyond not just your field. I spend a lot of time in higher ed literature too.
Chris Burkhard:You may think less of me but when one of my employees show up in the office and they say, I'm going to go get an MBA, I say do me a favor. I'll buy the Wall Street Journal for you and read it for a year and if you still want an MBA, let's talk. My own version of it. Go learn the world.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes, learn the world, and that's where I always hope our MBA programs focus on the world not the theory of whatever.
Chris Burkhard:I get it. We've covered a lot of ground and obviously there's some prep that goes in this. Is there any themes or things that you'd like a little open mic time to touch on or do you feel like we're getting your story out?
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:I feel like we are. There are things that I always hope that people can do in life and leading integrative lives where all parts of their lives are integrated. I came to Delaware to totally beat them. Because my mom and dad, my dad has since passed away, but yet lived in Oswego County, New York, in Parish, New York. So they were up there, my mom is still up there she lives in senior living. And my son was in northern Virginia and was in a serious relationship. He has since gotten married and they're now going to have their first child, so I become a grandmother for the first time in January. So, I wanted to get that closer because one of the things I learned is, and I'm sure this isn't new, but when my son graduated from high school and when I had graduated from high school, by the time you graduate from high school, you go away to college. And then you know, life takes you wherever in the world. By the time you graduated from high school, you have probably spent eighty to eighty five percent of the daily time that you're ever going to spend with your parents because you're away. So when I think about it, I graduated from high school in 1980 and I lived in Pittsburgh, Tulsa, Oklahoma, Marion, Ohio, Dublin, Ohio, Chittenango, New York, Spartanburg, South Carolina, all these place. And I would see my mom and dad, two or three days a year. So from age eighteen till when I moved to Delaware, I was only seeing them three or four days a year. You'd go up for Christmas, you go for something, but you were far away and you're busy in your job. So I knew if I was going to be able to spend any significant time with my parents, before they passed away, I needed to be back here. And so I moved back in 2019 and from June of 2019 until November of 2021 when my dad passed away, I actually saw my dad more days than I had seen him in the past fifteen years combined. So you know, that's it, family's important. Same kind of thing with my son. You know, he graduated from college in 2011 and lived in northern Virginia, I was living in South Carolina and North Carolina. I wasn't going to see him. So now I'm up here but that time you can never get that time back. And so I always try to encourage people who I've worked with or people I know, find a way if that's important to you. Find a way that your life can be integrated where you can have meaningful time with your family or who you want to be with.
Chris Burkhard:It can be difficult for people to think about that tree of their life and label each branch with a part of it. Family or spirituality or money or education, and then to be able to think about how they feel about that topic. And you're right, when you've got a chance you're very intentional about career and family.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes and you have to know who you are. Like when people ask me to describe myself, the first thing I don't ever say is that I'm the college president at Goldey Beacon College.
Chris Burkhard:That's why we get along.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes. What salient to me is that I'm married, I have a child, I'm going to be a grandmother. All of those things are what's salient to who I am as a person. That's what matters to me more than anything. I love my work. I love what I do. I think I do well, I love nothing more than setting the backdrop that students can come in and become who they want to be. But my job and my career is not the salient part of who I am. And I try to help people understand that because you'll see so many, especially young career professionals, who you know, they've got ta make it. They have to make their name, they've got to stake their plan, they've got to do all that. And I always want to say chill, know who you are and go be that person.
Chris Burkhard:You might have had a few things to share with me in my twenties I would say. And I always argued and you can argue or discuss. I always thought that if I could just achieve a few things it would help me figure out who I was. It's almost that's the whole thing is like, people say Well, that's your view from the top as president. Well, that's an earned privilege. Well no you're right. I worked a lot and I don't have regrets. But I know I don't get that time back and that having a more balanced approach in life sure makes a lot more sense if that's important to you.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:That's important, and that's okay. If career is the important thing, then that's okay. That's who they are.
Chris Burkhard:So I've got one big zinger for you.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Okay.
Chris Burkhard:What gives you passion today?
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Seeing everything working well and in a life giving way. When I see my organization and the changes we have made for instance, a freshman year experience program. Freshman year experience programs came out in the 1980's. Goldey never had one until last year. And I know and the literature shows that these programs have strong correlation to the completion agenda. Students will both retain and persist through to graduation if you're orienting them well at the beginning and helping them to understand well, what they're going to go through.
Chris Burkhard:Colleen, if I can get somebody through the first ninety days of their job, they're going to be with me in three years.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes, exactly. What are you orienting them to and what are you orienting them for? So you set that, that's got to be well done. And when I see that, I know that I'm going to have students through college graduation. And you know, that makes my trustees happy because then my revenue is there and I'm going to end the year with income over expense and all that kind of stuff. So there's the business side of all of that. But I love it when I see it working well because it means that I'm going to be graduating healthy people who can demonstrate to the world but they can start something and finish something. And they can go out and engage in their career and with their employer in a way that means that they're going to be able to be retained
Chris Burkhard:And then they can build on it. So when the there. Board of Trustees says Colleen, how'd you do it? It's everything all at once, right?
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Everything together, yes.
Chris Burkhard:Everything together.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes, it's the new student orientation. Actually, it's not even starting with the new student orientation. It's starting with your campus visit days. You know, how are you interacting with that student to recruit them to come? And then when they come, what's the environment you're surrounding them with while they're here to just look at the college. If they decide to come? How are you oriented? How are you supporting them?
Chris Burkhard:So if you're a guest, you come back two years from now, what do you hope to be bragging about?
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Higher graduation and completion rates. I want to be able to say that because our retention, fall of freshman year to fall of sophomore year, our retention has always been very strong. Seventy five, eighty percent. That's really good.
Chris Burkhard:Wow, that's amazing.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:But it didn't start losing from sophomore to junior, junior to senior, so that by the time your are at the time graduation, our graduation rate, both the four year and the six year graduation rate may only be thirty percent. That needs to be eighty percent. So two years from now, I'm hoping I can say we've gone from thirty to fifty or sixty or whatever. So to do that, to get to that point, you've got to make sure you've got the orientation, how you orient them, how you treat them when they are here. How you provide support services for them, all of that kind of stuff. How you mentored them. What are the in campus and out of campus activities? We're a part of the Campus Compact, which is campus, it's now called Transform Mid-Atlantic. But the Campus Compact is getting your students involved in civic engagement. So, involved outside the classroom outside the campus. And every class can have a civic engagement component. Not all of them do, but we're working on that and it's more than corporate social responsibility.
Chris Burkhard:My daughter was at Maryland where she was in a CIVICUS dorm.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Yes. That would be what Transform Mid-Atlantic would really applaud.
Chris Burkhard:Got it.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:So, you want your students to understand the world around them and what does engagement look like there? And that's another piece of student retention that leads to college graduation. So you've got to do it all. And two years from now, I hope that I can say I can look at the hard metrics like graduation rates, retention rates, I think there's something called the NSSE. The National Student Engagement Survey. I want our NSSE scores to be really high.
Chris Burkhard:Depending on my business audience, that's either a two year highly achievable goal or a two year hard ass goal depending on the audience. So whatever you can say. Colleen, it's been great to have you. I'd love to have you back. I had a good time. I think you've shared a lot of great lessons and I love that you're an advisor, mentor and leader. I think it's a whole different plane of impact and makes for great discussion.
Dr. Colleen Perry Keith:Well, I would welcome a chance to come back. I always love talking to you.