Pybites Podcast

#201: Transforming military discipline into Python skills with PDI

• Julian Sequeira & Bob Belderbos • Episode 201

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Christina Lang’s journey from nearly two decades in the military to becoming a DevOps architect shows how discipline, persistence, and a growth mindset can drive career transitions. She shares how the Pybites PDI course helped her rapidly level up her Python skills, the importance of being “humble but hungry” when learning, and how mentorship and structured practice make tackling new challenges achievable. 

Christina also discusses the unique hurdles veterans face when moving into civilian tech, from cultural adjustments to communication styles, and how their dedication and resilience make them valuable team members once they adapt.

Today, Christina applies Python to networking automation, building modules for specific tasks and exploring cloud deployments with OpenTofu, AWS, and Kubernetes. For anyone hesitating to take the next step in Python, Christina encourages: “If you don’t feel ready… you probably are. Just pull the trigger, just do it.”

Christina's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/christina-lang25

Pybites Developer Initialization Program for Veterans: https://pybit.es/veterans/

Pybites Podcast 118 - Veterans in the workplace, challenges and tips
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Swg0hj6BPJE

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Christina:

It's okay to be humble but hungry when you're actually doing the program, because you're not going to be the smartest person doing all of these things, and that's something that you have to, in a mindset ways, have to understand before you start doing something is hey, you're going to get knocked down a couple of times because you don't know what you're doing, but you have a mentor there with you that is going to step you through the actual process.

Julian:

Hello and welcome to the PyBytes podcast, where we talk about Python career and mindset. We're your hosts. I'm Julian Sequeira.

Bob:

And I am Bob Beldebus. If you're looking to improve your Python, your career and learn the mindset for success, this is the podcast for you. Let's get started. Hello and welcome back to the Pi Bytes podcast. I'm Bob and I'm here with Christina Lang.

Christina:

Christina, I hope I pronounced your surname, well, welcome.

Bob:

Thank you, bob, I appreciate being here. Yeah, it's a long time coming, this interview and thanks for hopping on today. And you've been with us in the pdi program and you took your python skills from here to there and I'm really impressed how fast you did that. So, yeah, today I wanted to talk a bit about that journey, um, about the mindset, what you use python day-to-day. Also a bit about military personal transitioning into civilian workforce and, of course, books, books, books. So, yeah, you're ready to dive in.

Christina:

I'm ready for it, bob, let's go.

Bob:

Awesome, let's go Okay. So first off, for dear PyBytes listeners, do you want to quickly introduce yourself?

Christina:

I am Christina Lang. First off, uh, for dear pie bites listeners, do you want to quickly introduce yourself? Um, I am christina lang. I have almost 20 years of military experience. Uh, before that, I started my collegiate journey in exercise science, uh, with uh emphasis on perceptual motor learning, which is basically how the brain is able to do motor movements and how it processes information, and I decided at one point in time that I needed something else in my life, so that's why I went into the military. So that's why I went into the military. I have been doing IT from help desk to up to DevOps, to a DevOps architect. So I spent a lot of time in the IT world and it's been a lot of fun, and I really appreciate doing the program for PyBytes. It definitely is a big journey that you do but it's so rewarding in the end, Nice.

Bob:

So, yeah, tell us a bit about that journey. I mean, first of all, interesting background and yeah. So the next question is where does the Python come in and where did you feel that need to upscale and how was that process?

Christina:

So I felt like I needed to upscale, because I, as a DevOps architect, I was in charge of full stack developers and we were creating solutions for people, but I wanted to understand the actual full stack.

Christina:

I understood how to write Python scripts and I could read their code, but I didn't fully understand everything that they were doing to better adjust the solution how a customer needed it to be. So I felt like joining PyBytes was a good transition and I do have to give a shout out to Eric Cho when you were on his podcast for Automation Nerds. It was that's how I met you, bob, and it was definitely a good experience. It was just learning to be able to set my own military background aside and be able to reach out to you guys to learn something new. But I definitely thought that moving into the realm of adding that full stack development and understanding the software development life cycle was very imperative to what I wanted to learn in the end thanks and a shout out to uh, to eric, indeed happy that you reached out from that podcast that was.

Bob:

That was a fun one. Um, yeah, no, cool. And and what? How was your? Yeah, what surprised you? Maybe in the program? Um, because you said you you wrote scripts and I think in pDI, right, I think what set it apart was that you had to now build an app from end to end and remember, you went into a lot of more advanced stuff which I didn't expect, which was nice, right. So I think you even went to TDD, test-driven development and stuff. So, yeah, maybe you want to highlight how that kind of changed your view of building software, how that kind of changed your view of building software and maybe also a bit of the mindset.

Christina:

If there was any mindset shift you had to make to really get to the next level, I believe that part of it was the coaches that you get in the program I was lucky enough to have you as a coach but also the fact that it's okay to be but hungry when you're actually doing the program, because you're you're not going to be the smartest person doing all of these things, and that's that's something that you have to like in a mindset ways, have to understand before you start doing something is hey, you're going to get knocked down a couple of times because you don't know what you're doing, but you have a mentor there with you that is going to step you through the actual process.

Christina:

I remember a couple of times where I was like I don't think this file structure is correct, or how do I, how do I reach the backend database, like things like that that were very important. Database, like things like that that were very important, and also the like test-driven development is. I didn't understand that, like I had studied it several times but until I was on the keyboard doing certain things and understanding what was happening in the backend, that totally clicked for me.

Bob:

Quick break for a note of our sponsor this week, which is HiBytes, hibytes, that's us.

Julian:

I'm here, Bob. What are we talking about this week?

Bob:

Well, we have a new coaching program PDC or HiBytes Developer Cohort. We thought it was never going to happen because we have been doing one-to-one for five years, but now we can do group coaching as well. We're going to build a real-world app six weeks in an exciting cohort. We're going to learn with one of our PyBites coaches the whole journey, but also work together and learn together. And yeah, no more tutorial paralysis Build, build build.

Julian:

It's wonderful. It's not something you want to miss out on, so please check out the link below, piebitescoachingcom. This is a program that bridges real building with a cohort, environment learning with other people, building with engineers. It's a wonderful thing. Check it out. Now, piebitescoachingcom, and back to the episode.

Christina:

And doing the pie bites, one bite at a time, you know, because that's what you guys have is one byte at a time. There's different tracks that you can go in there, like even in the backend, where you're just like okay, I want to look up how I'm going to do Flask. Okay, how am I going to correlate that with pulling my API or pulling my database information? Or how am I going to do a decorator? What exactly is a decorator? Things like that that definitely like have that mindset to be humble at Hungary and have that mindset to understand that there are coaches out there to help you.

Bob:

Yeah, I remember you definitely got stuck, but it was really great. You were very proactive, right, so you would have. Obviously we had our weeklies, but then every day we would be on GitHub either code reviewing or talking on issues. So I felt we went so much faster because we had very quick feedback loops, constantly right, but what I really like is that you went overboard, Like that TDD stuff. I didn't even ask you to do that right, but you did.

Julian:

So you were definitely eager to learn more.

Bob:

So you did the bytes, but then, of course, the project. So it seems like you did them in tandem. Right, the bytes on the platform, but then you did the weather app, capstone project right.

Christina:

That is correct, and I didn't realize that it brought it back into, like the natural language. When I started doing the natural language part and kind of building a language model for my application is when certain things started to click also with how how the language model is going to be used, like it made me think about, like how I'm going to use maybe telemetry in the future and how it's going to be pulled from a database with the timing to get information about things. So that was.

Bob:

That was pretty cool again people, this was not part of the curriculum, and christina just came up one day like I want to do nlp, and then you found a use case for it, right yes, hungry right no, definitely, definitely. I'll always stay hungry. Yeah, um cool, so yeah, and any other highlights from that journey you want to. You want to mention?

Christina:

I think I, I think the collaboration that we had, also that I got from you, is you. You provided some very knowledgeable uh interactions where it was all like you don't have to do this. These are options, but the fact that you have that in-depth knowledge and you've been doing it for a while, you can see why I would use Flask versus Django, versus different, different ways to do things like hey, you, you suggested fast APIi. That was awesome, um, but those different frameworks depend on what, what type of application you are building, which is really cool yeah, that and and being burned before and then, uh, awesome so no again.

Bob:

I'm impressed. How? Because it was just six weeks, right, and you really did all you could and wrote a lot of code and learned a lot of concepts. So these days then, because this has been a couple of months ago, right, what do you use Python for now, these days?

Christina:

I think what I use Python for is creating a module to do a certain task or fix a certain situation, like if you wanted to create a new job within an application or something that works with that other application. You can do that. I've also been trying to build on another repo which basically allows you to use OpenTofu to deploy into AWS and has specific servers or specific applications deployed to Kubernetes. So stuff like that I think is very important and I love the dead net debt, net ops side of things. So I'm obviously a big fan of networking and their automation track that they are doing I think is a great add on. Yeah.

Bob:

Yeah, nice how you brought it back to you, to your work. By the way, what is a open tofu?

Christina:

Open to tofu is just another fork off of Terraform and it allows you to basically set up your Terraform, apply and deploy applications or servers into the cloud. So it sets up your infrastructure. So if you wanted to create your own Kubernetes cluster at home, you can basically use that same thing to just draw it down and then push to your own servers to make your own infrastructure. So, like if I wanted a Rails server, I could deploy a Rails server.

Bob:

Okay, right. So what tech industry trends, or maybe even networking trends, because that's what you're working in, right? Are you excited about these days?

Christina:

I'm kind of excited on the fact of the telemetry that you can get and you can parse out data for your network equipment or your whole network in itself, like your servers and everything like that. You can parse it out and you can use that data to your advantage. So if somebody comes along and types in something and it takes down the network, it will automatically know what needs to be fixed and it can be fixed. So those things I think are very important. But in order to do that you need to have a way to parse out that data and one of the best ways to do it is is with python or or another application.

Bob:

So that's, that's pretty cool so there's a lot of um automation potential right in networking there is.

Christina:

There is a lot of automation potential in networking and and how the network learns from itself.

Christina:

Basically, yeah, and we don't need much more than python you don't need much more to understand python yes, um and be able to use it to your advantage, because a lot of what Cisco uses is they use a lot of Jinja templates which you can use some Python code within Jinja, and that's where you get a lot of that use case out of there, because then you can fully deploy a whole system that's already configured. So with ansible, you can take it in and and have a job run and it basically deployed out your whole configuration for a device, which is totally awesome that's pretty awesome yeah cool yeah, so the to um shift gears a little bit.

Bob:

So, as you have a military background, what challenges do you see military personnel having as they transition out into the civilian workforce?

Christina:

I think the biggest thing that I see is a different change in a mindset, and the reason why I say that is the mindset kind of changes, where it's a different culture. It's a different culture in the civilian side. It's kind of like you know, bob, you live in Spain, I live in the United States, but it's like me going to Spain and not knowing anything about Spain and the rules and what's happening, how I'm supposed to talk to somebody. It's just a different mindset in itself, like you have to get adjusted to that and you have to understand the way that people talk and the way that they actually try to communicate themselves. So I think that's the biggest challenge that most people face.

Bob:

Right. So communication and adapting. If you say Spain, I'm talking a whole different language but it can feel like that right.

Christina:

It definitely can feel like that because you've been in a culture for a certain period of time whether it's four years or whether it's 20 or whether it's 30. There's a different mindset in the fact that it's. It's going from a structured, highly structured environment in the military, where you are used to doing certain things, to a very lax or not lax, but a very open. You got to open your mind a little bit more to possibilities when you're in the civilian sector. So it it may take people harder time to get adjusted because it's it's partially like an unknown thing, like it's hard to, it's hard to know what you do not know right.

Bob:

So I think that's the biggest shift yeah, interesting, and do you see a lot of python being picked up and used in the military?

Christina:

so I do see a lot of python being picked up only because we have a software lab and it's basically called the DoD Software Factory. They basically look at applications and they build their own applications. So it's modifying applications to meet military's needs. So you definitely need to understand a lot of Python in order to do that, because then you're going to create a whole bunch of modules to modify the backend server a certain way. So if I needed the server to do a certain thing, I would add in that Python script to have it do that. And understanding different frameworks too. I believe that understanding the difference between Django and Flask is a big thing. And understanding different languages that you can, that you can possibly get from just learning Python itself, because a lot if once you learn one language, is easier to read the other languages, if that makes any sense.

Bob:

It does. Well, yeah, as we've spoken about right, we we have PDI for veterans veterans so we can help people with that transition. That's not the. You did the pdi right, so you get all the python and developer support, but we also have that career coaching right, so I think that's uh, that's very helpful.

Christina:

Um, but, yeah, julian is is more working on that, so I did get I uh, julian was really really awesome too and getting me connected with the actual veterans um coordinator Isaac and and he is pretty amazing also, like he, he's a prior SWCC guy, so so he he has dealt with a lot of things, but he is very willing to help veterans transition and understand that side of the house, so he's he's pretty amazing. You guys got a pretty amazing team, I have to say.

Bob:

Thank you. Yeah, no, we had Isaac on the podcast a while ago, but we'll link the episode. People want to listen. But yeah, I think we don't talk that much about this program, but this is an extension of PDI that we have, so it's good for people to know that. And then, yeah, probably go listen to Isaac. He's deeply involved in that. So, yeah, thanks for thanks for sharing that.

Christina:

any anything else you want to say in that context of of your military background and and the python there and career and transitioning uh, I, I think I think the civilian force needs to be a little patient with those people transitioning, because we don't always pick up things as fast as some some people, because we've been through certain situations. But in the end we're always willing to try something and sometimes we're willing to try something new, even if it's scary. So just be patient with us, because sometimes we're not always in the right direction.

Bob:

I would have said trajectory, because that's just how we talk, but, yeah, heading the right direction yeah, yeah, and and, and, but I, I think, and and maybe that's, yeah, that's a good question, I think. Um, what are, what are some of the advantages people with a military background have to learning? Well, any skill, but obviously in this context, python or programming, I would say the discipline and the persistence. But I'll let you answer because you have a better answer than me.

Christina:

I think they're very, very dedicated and when they have the correct path, like in this program, it allows you to have those little bites right. So you have the beginner, the intermediate and the expert tracks right. Having that set things of somebody learning those things is easier for that person because they're so used to doing step one, step two, step three right. There's not like some people can think outside the box and just head off into their own little like venture, um, but for the majority we needed structure. So having that structure, especially with the pipeline stuff, that that is pretty amazing. So I think we're dedicated and we're willing to put forth the effort, even if it's scary awesome.

Bob:

Yeah, the bites um learner, very famous for being bite-sized. But the pdi project can be a challenge, right, but that's where we, then the coach, really breaks it down with, uh, tangible issues. But I find it hard sometimes, as a coach as well. You go into this project, somebody's new, they might never have done a Python project, where do you even start? Right? But it's almost like the snowball effect, because once we had the first issues going and you had the first task and pull request coded, I think then it just was an avalanche of just next, next, next, next, next, next iteration. So, yeah, that can be harder with a project.

Christina:

Yeah, it definitely makes your mind wander of things. Having that DevOps background kind of set me a little bit different than most people, but I do think that most people not coming in, not knowing any Python have the ability to go just as far. Right in that PDI program I just had the like I had seen full stack development. So seeing it and then doing it is two different things, right, but it was definitely fun.

Bob:

Yeah, awesome. Yeah, that was. What surprises me often is people have done so much study and degrees and whatnot, but then, uh, yeah, when you have to code a project, it all changes and it's like a mike dyson quote right, like we all have planned till, we get hit in the mouth I guess, pdi sometimes feels like that right, yes, awesome.

Bob:

So you're coding a lot and I'm happy that you're still doing that after pdi um, because I thought you had maxed out in the program, so that I'm happy about that um. But when you're not coding um, what do you do? What are some hobbies or things you get joy out of?

Christina:

So my family's originally from Argentina, so we're kind of like in the same mindset of Spaniards, right, and we kind of just go right. And so I love spending time with my family and cooking. We often cook together. We like traveling together. So those are my main three that I like doing the most. It's to the point where, like, I'll make my own pasta because it's fun and trying to learn something new is definitely the way that my brain thinks, like if I can accomplish something that gives me satisfaction. So, yeah, those are my three top threes uh, traveling, cooking and spending time with family.

Bob:

Nice Any favorite uh places to go.

Christina:

Um, I would have to say that one of my favorite places was Italy. Italy is like number one. Italy is like number one. It's the food, it's the beaches. No-transcript, give me, give me a beach or pretty trees.

Bob:

uh, I'm good to go I haven't been there yet, but, uh, I heard amazing things. But, yeah, on italy and definitely on the same page there, and I think pasta is the best food on on earth, and it's relatively easy to make and and with ingredients. Yeah, you only need like three ingredients and it's good to go as I was cooking the pasta and then just adding the ingredients, and you can be very creative with that right.

Bob:

I think, somebody brought pasta to our little picnic and had like olives and tuna egg and I'm like you can just mix all that together and you have pasta right.

Christina:

I taught my co-worker one time carbonara, how to make carbonara, and she was like definitely afraid of cooking. Like she's all like I just don't cook. And I was all like here, let's make it kind of like, because she's a software developer, right, so she's a UX designer, so like it's kind of like science. Let's think of it like science, okay. And she's like I didn't realize how easy this was, so it's pretty cool.

Julian:

A quick break from the episode to talk about a product that we've had going for years now. This is the PyBytes platform. Bob, what's it all about?

Bob:

Now with AI, I think there's a bit of a sentiment that we're eroding our skills because AI writes so much code for us. But actually I went back to the platform the other day, solved 10 bytes and I'm still secure of my skills because it's good to be limited in your resources. You really have to write the code. It really makes you think about the code. It's really helpful.

Julian:

Definitely helpful, as long as you don't use AI to solve the problems. If you do, you're just cheating, but in reality, this is an amazing tool to help you keep fresh with Python, keep your skills strong, keep you sharp so that when you are on a live stream, like Bob over here, you can solve exercises live with however many people watching you code at the exact same time. So please check out pybytesplatformcom. It is the coding platform that beats all other coding platforms and will keep you sharper than you could ever have imagined. Check it out now, pybytesplatformcom. And back to the episode.

Bob:

Last question, always, is the books. What are you reading or what book can you recommend to us?

Christina:

what are you reading, um, or what book can you recommend to to us? Well, it's actually a book that when, when I was actually talking to you, so you're more of a coach, right, like it's kind of like a mentor, like, hey, I'm having this hard time, like my thing is trying to focus, right, so I chose. So I chose the one thing. It's right back here I will mess up the person's name, but I think it's Gary Keller and Jay Papasan, like Papa Palm Chair I hope I didn't mess up his last name but it's very focused on, like trying to find that one thing and try to set those priorities.

Christina:

It's very focused on, like trying to find that one thing and try to set those priorities, because setting those priorities, especially coming out of the military, going into civilian life, having the priority shift from work all the time to, hey, now I have work and family, let's have more of the time of focusing that. So it's kind of more of a um, a mindset book than it is a technology book, um, or a python book. But it was to try to retrain my mind or get myself in the correct mindset, mindset to do and motivate myself to do the next thing.

Bob:

So, yes, Did you read it now or during the program?

Christina:

I'm reading it now. I'm like near the end, but it's a very good book. My next one is a Python book also, so you got to switch back and forth every now and then.

Bob:

That's a good idea. Yeah, no, that's a. That's a great book. It's one of my favorites when it comes to productivity. It's also 200 pages, so it's pretty easy to to to actually finish um, but it's very ruthless, uh, about focusing on one thing, right? So, um, that's why I asked about the program, because when you go into such a program, or endeavor for that matter, then having such a mindset um is really good, right, because it's very easy these days to to be distracted either by the news or these gazillion libraries that come out, um, but what you want to do is just focus on one thing, right, yeah?

Christina:

and and focus on hey. Uh, I want to set these priorities and this is my priorities for when I am in the civilian workforce. Like hey, number one priority in my mind is family, right, so having that number one priority versus hey, my number one priority is work, then that means that you don't have that social interaction that you need, and we all need social interaction.

Bob:

So totally yeah we're not.

Christina:

We're not meant to multitask at all.

Bob:

It's a, it's a myth, right? You think, oh, it gets so much done. I'm constantly going back and forward. You're actually not right, because you're training your brain and yeah.

Christina:

Yeah, and transitioning from one subject to the next. If I were to transition from doing Rust to Python or that type of thing, it takes a while to get used to the difference of those different languages, especially since I've never done Rust right. Or like going from a Windows box to a Linux box. Those are two different things. I sat there trying to figure out what was happening on Windows and I finally just went to the command line and typed in some things just to understand what was going on. So it's a different transition. You got to focus on that one thing, but it also takes time for your brain to process the difference of that one thing.

Bob:

So it's definitely switching, yeah, and it takes like 20 minutes to get back, which we never acknowledge, but it's, it's, I think it's scientifically demonstrated, yeah, yeah. So talking about Rust, are you? Are you learning any other languages or a new library or skill?

Christina:

I'm diving back into Django a little bit more and I also am going back to. So Cisco has the automation track where you can become a professional in the automation track, but it uses a lot of Python. So I'm going back to their newly designed training and going over their Python how they're parsing out information, because they have PyATS, which is basically their own parser, to do testing on their equipment. So it's kind of like testing out, kind of the same thing, but with Python.

Bob:

Nice, always be hungry.

Christina:

Always be hungry Come to the end.

Bob:

So thanks for sharing. Really enjoyed our conversation. Anything I didn't ask you want to share or final shout out to the audience.

Christina:

I would just have to say, like, if you don't feel like you're ready to join the PDI program, you probably are. It's not just just pull the trigger, just do it. It's tons of fun. You have great mentors, they'll walk you through it, they'll, they'll step you through it, as long as you put in the time and you're motivated to do it Like that's the most important thing, and understand that sometimes we have bad days Like you, you, you fall on your face, but the good thing is how you pick yourself back up and carry on. So those are just something that I would say yes, Thank you, I appreciate that.

Christina:

You're welcome.

Bob:

All right, thanks, christina, at a blast Glad that we got to do this and, yeah, again, really happy how you have progressed and thanks for sharing these tips and experiences. This was fun, thanks.

Christina:

Thank you for inviting me, Bob. I really appreciate it.

Julian:

Hey everyone. Thanks for tuning into the PyBytes podcast. I really hope you enjoyed it. A quick message from me and Bob before you go To get the most out of your experience with PyBytes including learning more Python, engaging with other developers, learning about our guests, discussing these podcast episodes, and much, much more please join our community at pybytescircleso. The link is on the screen if you're watching this on YouTube and it's in the show notes for everyone else. When you join, make sure you introduce yourself, engage with myself and Bob and the many other developers in the community. It's one of the greatest things you can do to expand your knowledge and reach and network as a Python developer. We'll see you in the next episode and we will see you in the community.