DC's Animation Excellence vs Marvel's Movie Mastery

The age-old debate between DC and Marvel fandoms takes center stage as we explore a fascinating consensus: DC consistently delivers masterclass animation while Marvel dominates the box office with its cinematic universe.

Our passionate discussion reveals why DC's animated offerings—from the groundbreaking "Flashpoint Paradox" to the emotionally resonant Batman storylines—capture the essence of these characters in ways their live-action counterparts often struggle to achieve. We break down how producer James Tucker's unified vision created a cohesive animated world that rivals the MCU in scope and depth. Meanwhile, DC's television shows from Smallville to Doom Patrol demonstrate an understanding of their characters that sometimes feels missing from their blockbuster films.

Turning to Marvel, we examine how Kevin Feige's singular vision transformed obscure characters into household names and created an unprecedented interconnected universe. Yet Marvel's animated offerings haven't reached the same heights, and their TV shows often function as "connective tissue" rather than standalone experiences. The acquisition of Fox by Disney opens exciting possibilities for integrating the X-Men—one of Marvel's most beloved properties—potentially addressing a significant gap in their cinematic storytelling.

Whether you're Team DC, Team Marvel, or appreciate both universes' unique strengths, this episode offers fresh insights into what makes each company special. With guest experts joining our regular hosts, the conversation dives deep into character analyses, missed opportunities, and the creative decisions that have shaped these beloved fictional worlds.

Have you noticed how each universe excels in different mediums? Share your thoughts and join the friendly debate about which universe truly delivers the most compelling stories!

Transcript

Welcome to the DC vs Marvel Debate

Donte 0:12

Welcome, welcome, welcome, welcome. Welcome everyone back to the Reach for the Clicker channel. Check, it's your host, dante, along with the co-pilot of this show, Jay. How you doing, jay? What's up? Hey, ben, it's been ailot of this show.

Jay 0:24

Jay, how you doing, Jay. What's up? Hey Ben, it's been a while.

Donte 0:26

I know, ben, I see you being out on assignment doing homework, getting stuff right for the audience. That's what we do. We got to be right or be semi-right, or be close to right. But you've been all right, man. You feeling good, you feeling confident with all your information.

Donte 0:45

Feeling good feeling great, feeling fine, ready to go now, ladies and gentlemen, on this very special channel check, we're doing a little bit of, you know, a little bit of nerding here. We're going to be doing some straight up DC vs Marvel and we had to bring in some other experts because I would dominate the conversation all day about this and overwhelm my co-pilot here because he's going to be like yo, shut up, just stop. So we're going to bring in our first. Well, I don't know. I would call him a resident expert. You know, jay knows the guy. Jay says he vows for him. He says this guy knows his deal. So we're going to find out. Ladies and gentlemen, let's welcome John to the show. John, come on in here. How you doing today, man?

John Paul 1:34

Hey, what's up how y'all doing.

Donte 1:36

There you go. Welcome to the show. Welcome to the show. You feeling good, you feeling around, you feeling like you're ready to throw out some knowledge teach us um I'm I'm ready to end up arguing and our other guests as these conversations always go and our other guest, who has kind of become a resident and just lives here now.

Jay 2:00

in fact, we kind of just keep them in a closet locked up most of the time and we let them them out to record once in a while. It's Tim Tim.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:07

Hey, what's good to do everybody? It's a little dusty in here, if y'all mind Just kind of dusting that a little bit. There was a cat in there last Tuesday that I had to fight for by a piece of cheese. Anyway, how y'all feeling.

Donte 2:19

Hey, hey, hey, give us some more. Can you at least put holes in the closet?

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:22

No, ask him a lot now. It's stinking.

Donte 2:26

Can you at?

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:26

least move them. Cleats that you have from 92? No.

Jay 2:29

Those are collector's items. Those are vintage.

Donte 2:32

Right, it's going to make us a lot of money one day.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:35

A lot. From whose stinking ass feet would he use it?

Jay 2:38

Don't worry about that Stop asking questions.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:41

Geez.

Jay 2:42

No Slow.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:46

Can't take you nowhere. You're damn right. I'm gonna tell you about it, sir.

Jay 2:49

How y'all feeling I'm gonna go ahead and I'm gonna start off this conversation and I believe that this is factual what I'm about to say. Okay, okay, dc makes better animated stuff, but their live-action shit is well shit.

John Paul 3:12

I mean. In what sense?

Jay 3:20

Right Justice League. Flash movie Pause Batman v Superman. Movie oh pause Batman v Superman.

John Paul 3:27

Hold on pause because right off the bat, we're going to talk about Justice League. We got redemption with the Snyder Cut. We got redemption with the Snyder Cut though the other one.

Donte 3:38

Yeah, like the.

Overlap 3:40

The Josh Whedon version.

Donte 3:41

Yeah, the Josh Whedon version. That was terrible. I don't know what she was doing, because you created one of the greatest television shows the Josh Whedon version.

Jay 3:46

Yeah, the Josh Whedon version. Yeah, that was terrible. I don't know what he was doing, because he created one of the greatest television shows of all time Firefly. That's right, fuck y'all. I wasn't going to say Buffy, because fuck Buffy, it's all about Firefly.

John Paul 3:58

Brown cuts for life Buffy's good though, but regardless, I don't know what Whedon was thinking, because he came in and was just like oh, you've already shot 75% of this movie. Cool, let's scrap most of that, let's shoot a whole bunch of new scenes, that single Batman movie that Ben Affleck was supposed to do, fuck that.

Donte 4:30

So when you say all right, live action, All right, all right, all right For DC, I would say their TV shows are good. Their TV shows are pretty good.

Jay 4:39

Okay, I will agree with that. The movies the WB's Flash, the WB's Green Arrow Very good.

Donte 4:49

What about Supergirl?

John Paul 4:50

I agree.

Donte 4:53

What about CW's Supergirl?

Jay 4:56

Sorry what I couldn't hear you.

Donte 4:58

CW's Supergirl.

Overlap 5:02

Supergirl was decent.

John Paul 5:05

Supergirl was decent. Supergirl was decent. Uh, I the problem with supergirls, it felt like even in the comics, though, she's really used primarily as like a superman's on vacation.

Jay 5:16

Here you go.

John Paul 5:17

No, not even that she's usually used as like a. No, not even that she's usually used as like a we got.

Jay 5:24

Superman at home. We're not going against.

John Paul 5:26

Superman, she's a nexus to like the Tomorrowverse.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 5:31

That's Power Girl. We got Supergirl at home.

Donte 5:37

I mean we got Legends of Tomorrow.

John Paul 5:40

Legends of Tomorrow was good. It was okay. I won't lie, though personal opinion. I feel like it went on a little too long yeah. Like they should have ended it and it was like, okay, cool, we're just continuing to keep going.

Jay 5:54

That sounds very familiar in the MCU, where it was like all right, we wrap things up with you know, avengers.

Donte 6:03

Hold on. So we still got. You had a what's that one, the one, but it was like the Justice Society, the kickoff of Justice Society. Was it like Stargirl or something like that?

John Paul 6:18

I mean, power Girl is an analog for Supergirl. I forget, forget where she originates from.

Donte 6:28

We can't forget the greatest television show of all time, DC Gotham.

John Paul 6:37

That was something. Gotham was a I'll be honest. When Gotham was initially brought. I'll be honest when Gotham was initially brought up, I thought it was going to be a Batman show Like, even as a young kid, Bruce Wayne, but still Batman-esque. And when it came out as like a gritty cop drama, I was not expecting that Following, young Jim Gordon cop drama.

Donte 7:05

I was not expecting that following uh, following young jim jim gordon, you know what show?

Jay 7:10

because, like it boggles my mind, because the dctv shows the majority of them are really really good, like pennyworth, huh, that was good penguin.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 7:23

Penguin is good, penguin's solid too. Good lord, he immersed himself in that character.

Donte 7:32

All the shows are great. I always sit there and say the shows are good. I still go back and watch the Lois and Clark Superman adventure with Dean Cain and Terry Hatcher. Terry Hatcher, I still watch that. It's 90s cheese.

Jay 7:49

It was cheese, but it was good cheese.

John Paul 7:50

It was good cheese, that's like the Batman, like the Michael Keaton, val Kilmer, all those. They're cheesy. But they're cheesy in the part. At one point the man has a Batman MasterCard.

Jay 8:09

Let's not forget about the bat nipples.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 8:12

With Bat Jordans.

Donte 8:17

We sit there like even their failed shows were pretty good, Like River Power, yeah, Power with the 50 Cent Show. No, no, no.

Overlap 8:31

Shit that's in the DC universe.

Donte 8:34

No, I didn't even know.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 8:38

Oh my god, that'd be good.

John Paul 8:43

That explains so much about Kanan.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 8:46

I'm gonna get you, batman, I'm sorry.

Donte 8:55

I don't know.

Overlap 9:00

Could you imagine?

Jay 9:01

fucking Bruce Wayne Coming out Gotham. He was constantly going to war with the Joker. I'm dying.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 9:06

Can you imagine fucking Bruce Wayne coming out Gotham? He's constantly going to war with the Joker. He has to you stole my chain, Joker.

John Paul 9:15

I don't know what you heard about me, but I got the whole Bat family after me, so this show is called Powerless.

Donte 9:35

I'm sorry, oh okay, that's without 50 cent.

Donte 9:37

I retract all previous jokes had a had a favorite person, abbott in it. You know our favorite person, abed. You know Vanessa Huggins and then the great legendary DC character himself, alan Tudyk. So the show was great Like the show was. It was a great like attempt to be like, yeah, we're in a DC world, what if, like regular people in DC world, what they gotta go through? And everybody in the show was like working at a Wayne, at like Wayne go through. And everybody in the show was like working at a Wayne, at like Wayne Enterprises. And Alan Turdick played as Van Wayne, like the cousin of Bruce Wayne, who didn't know that Bruce was Batman. He just knows that Bruce gets all the accolades and he was so jealous of him that he just wants to be as cool as him. So, like, even his fellow show was actually pretty good. And then, of course, you know you got your um. What was the um? The Misfits one. The Misfits show, the one with uh, uh, brendan Fraser as the uh, as the Tin man.

John Paul 10:39

Oh fucking, oh shit, ah God damn it, and it was really really good shit, god damn it.

Jay 10:47

And it was really really good too, because it had Cyborg in it.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 10:56

The Invisible man I love that research.

Jay 10:58

Doom Patrol there it is. Doom Patrol was very good, doom Patrol was solid.

Donte 11:05

Their TV shows are pretty fucking Like. Tv shows are pretty awesome.

John Paul 11:08

No, I will also throw out, though. So why can't they make a good fucking movie? I will throw out, though. Personally, I felt like whatever the budget on Doom Patrol was was abysmal, because, like I've seen them do better on like that robot dude did not like. He looked like a dude in a costume.

Donte 11:29

It was, it was rough.

John Paul 11:32

No, cause that wasn't cyborg. That was like uh, how, what is he called?

Jay 11:36

Oh, you're talking about Brendan Fraser's character.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 11:38

Oh yeah, yeah, Um, but you gotta remember his he was supposed to be.

Donte 11:41

uh, he's cliff. He was supposed to be Cliff, Remember he was supposed to be made back in the 50s, or something like that.

John Paul 11:47

And I get that, but it looked so much like a dude in a costume it didn't look like I feel like it was supposed to.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 11:59

I'll give you that Because, honestly, they were probably going by the old character shirts that he was drawing before, so it was probably like a wink nudge towards people who were fans previously. So I'll take that yeah, he wasn't like.

Donte 12:12

This wasn't like when Cliff was made, when he was created back in the 40s and 50s, they were still crude, making robots and stuff, sleek designs and stuff. Sleek designs and stuff.

John Paul 12:28

I mean GI Robot would disagree. But go off.

Jay 12:31

GI Robot was animated dude.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 12:37

Let's live action, live action. Let's stick with that.

Jay 12:41

We'll get there. We'll get to the animation part, because DC animation is fucking on point.

Donte 12:47

Absolutely.

John Paul 12:49

If we're still talking about it. Personally, I know it was critically hated. Constantine was a banger for DC.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 12:58

I love Constantine.

John Paul 13:01

I'm still dying for a sequel.

Donte 13:04

What about Lucifer? That's a DC character, is it?

Jay 13:09

Yeah, is it really? Yeah, lucifer is a DC character. I didn't know that the devil was a DC character. I'm here, me thinking it was all biblical.

John Paul 13:19

Well, I mean, technically, marvel does have Santa as an X-Men, so he is an Omega level mutant that makes sense how you deliver the presence one night 100% dog that does kind of work now so you got Lucifer.

Donte 13:37

You had um, like Titans was. I think they could have did better with Titans.

John Paul 13:47

So I will say there were moments in Titans where I was really hooked and I was like, okay, this is great, I'm digging the story. I see what you're doing. I see you're drawing the lines primarily to the story everyone wants when it comes to Teen Titans. Primarily to the story everyone wants when it comes to Teen Titans, robin and Deathstroke Slade Wilson, whatever you want to call him, that whole pulling Robin to the dark side. The problem was that wasn't Because that was supposed to be Damien in Titans, right, yeah, it was supposed to be Damien in Titans, right, yeah, it was supposed to be Damien. So it immediately was out of place.

Donte 14:28

No, no, no no, that wasn't supposed to be Damien. That Titan was supposed to be, not Dick. It wasn't supposed to be Dick, it was Jason Todd.

John Paul 14:40

It was supposed to be Jason Todd, wasn't?

Donte 14:41

it yeah, it was supposed to be Jason Todd To calm his anger issues is why they put him on the team, or some shit, right, yeah. Yeah, it was supposed to be Jason Todd. I mean what before?

Jay 14:53

he got killed or after? Is this pre or post Red Hood?

John Paul 14:55

So evidently, if I'm not mistaken in the later seasons he does come back as Red Hood yeah. Red Hood goes hard he does, but like they definitely tried to shoehorn in that storyline from a classic Teen Titans story with a different character, where it isn't going to make sense of like converting a good guy over to the darkness and then like it really being like like a double agent play Because, like when that happened to Dick in the comics and in the Teen Titans cartoon, that was a major thing, like we were all hooked to that.

Donte 15:40

It's just Like DC shows are. They're good and sometimes they're you know a mess, but they're good, and sometimes they're you know, but they're so good though, like they do great jobs when they're serious. I mean Watchmen. That's part of well, you know DC owns that property, but I don't want to say it's a DC.

John Paul 16:00

I mean, it wasn't DC until it came over to like the HBO show.

Donte 16:05

Yeah.

John Paul 16:05

Right.

Donte 16:08

Stargirl, that's what it was.

John Paul 16:09

Now it was in the comics, of course, and stuff whenever it was initially purchased or brought over. You can't count the original Watchmen movie.

Donte 16:20

Superman and Lois I mean Smallville.

John Paul 16:25

Smallville yeah. Smallville was good, I'll be honest, I'm not a Superman fan. But people love Smallville.

Donte 16:35

They did a great job.

John Paul 16:36

It had cameos from heroes.

Donte 16:40

Yeah, they did a great job of telling Clark Kent's story growing up before he became Superman. They did a great job on that. I think that's what they were trying to do with Gotham. They focused primarily on Jim Gordon. Bruce was there, popping up every once in a while but they focused more on all the villains in Gotham than they did on Bruce Wayne.

Jay 17:00

I kind of want to bring up why I wanted to make this episode. John and I were having a conversation and this goes to the Marvel side because Marvel has a really hard time making shows. They make great movies, but their shows are. And the key one that I brought up She-Hulk.

John Paul 17:25

And the key one that I brought up She-Hulk and I argued that if you look at the majority of Marvel's TV shows, they are not meant to be standalone things. They are connective tissue.

Jay 17:41

First off, punisher standalone amazing John Bernthal killed it.

The Quality of DC TV Universe

John Paul 17:45

Hold on pause. Because Punisher itself was spider-webbed through Daredevil. He had to be introduced and raised up through the Daredevil series before he even got a chance at his own show and, honestly, the Daredevil-Punisher thing was an anomaly in what they had been doing, because people attached to Daredevil so quickly during the pandemic and then they pumped out that Punisher show Like it was classic. It was everything you wanted, comic, accurate. Yes, I remember one moment in the Punisher show he literally stomps a dude's head and they don't cut away and I was like hell, yeah, this is Punisher.

Donte 18:40

Yeah, but also the Marvel shows feel so small. I think that's what. I think that's what makes the show, the show's, not so great, because they feel so small, like with the dc. So you, you know, so you know who's supposed to be like, whose area it is. You're like this is taking place in gotham, so you know who's supposed to be around. This takes place in star city, so you know a central city, you know who's supposed to be around. They stay takes place in Star City, so you know, in Central City, you know who's supposed to be around. This takes place in Metropolis, so you know who's supposed to be around. Where are you watching? You know you're watching, let's say, the Defenders. You know this is placed in New York, so do you know that? Okay, we're looking at Luke Cage and Jessica Jones and Daredevil, and you know Iron Fist, but we also know it's New York, so why can't we see Spider-Man flying by? Or why can't freaking Cap be driving by?

John Paul 19:31

Do you want the answer to that? Yeah, because Sony owned it. Sony still owns Spider-Man, so that's why Spider-Man couldn't be swinging by.

Jay 19:41

Well, that one, yeah, but why not? Iron Fist, luke Cage, jessica Jones, captain America, how many other characters?

John Paul 19:48

live in New York. Hold on Captain America's from New York, but let's not get it twisted. He's not hanging out in New York all the time, then where?

Jay 19:58

the fuck does he live that?

John Paul 19:59

man is globetrotting.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 20:01

That's my question. This is my question because you have all these different characters who live in New York. I'm from Brooklyn, I'm from Bed-Stuy, So-and-so forgot you. You can't go two blocks and help out Luke Cage neighborhood. I'm sorry, this is just me and my soapbox. You just you couldn't go over there and help out. You said they got explosions and shit like that. No, I can't help you.

Donte 20:18

You ain't on 71st neighborhood spider-man well in in that defense I mean luke cage probably told him get the fuck out of my neighborhood, I handle this myself so can't use luke cage as a good, as a good example on that one, but also very good explanation for that one.

John Paul 20:33

Yeah, yeah, like which I'm gonna be honest the the luke cage show. It was perfect. I I loved every moment watching that show. The soundtrack like there was one moment where he's standing across from the drug house and Wu-Tang's protected net comes on and I went, oh shit.

Donte 20:54

So, they're live action shows. I think because they feel like Okay.

Jay 20:59

all those shows, though, were pre-Disney.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 21:03

True, this was before the mouse. I'm going to be honest. No, no, no, they were pre-Disney.

Donte 21:07

True, this was before the mouse. I'm going to be honest. No, no, no, no, they were part of the mouse.

Jay 21:11

The Punisher was not part of the mouse.

John Paul 21:13

Yes, 100%. I'm on Marvel's thing right now Marvel series on Disney+. Marvel's the Punisher.

Jay 21:22

Yeah, everything's on Disney+ Now.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 21:25

Now, yeah, they's on Disney+ now.

John Paul 21:27

They licensed it through Netflix, but it's still their property.

Donte 21:31

No, remember, the mouse owns Marvel. They've had it since when They've owned Marvel for a long time, Since like 92.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 21:38

Really 92? I don't know about 92. Hold on.

Donte 21:42

Blade, you forget Blade's what kicked it off? I get that. I don't believe about 92.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 21:45

Blade. You forget Blade's what kicked it off? I get that. I don't believe the mouse was in charge of that.

Jay 21:49

Blade is the original OG superhero and I fucking love Blade. And thank you, wesley Snipes 2009 was the deal.

John Paul 21:56

There we go. I'm about to say that makes more sense.

Donte 21:58

Yeah, because 92 is when they start selling their properties off. Yeah, that's when 92 was when Marvel was selling itself off piece by piece, just to survive. So that's why I went back to 92.

John Paul 22:10

But yeah the last thing we got before Marvel was bought by.

Jay 22:16

Disney was like the X-Men trilogy. Yeah, no, what I'm thinking is before. What I'm thinking is pre-Disney Plus, before the mouse started, so pre-pandemic. Yeah, before the mouse started saying oh shit, hold on. All these people are making all this money streaming our shit. Let's make our own streaming shit and make the money, right.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 22:40

No, I agree with that, but I see what you're going for.

John Paul 22:43

Well, see and I feel like that was the moment where it really takes my argument a little bit further with the, that's when they started using TV shows as connective tissue. For example, they're wanting to bring Moon Knight as a movie eventually. Well, they started him off as a character they know, hawkeye isn't as popular as most of the. We're not gonna get another season of moon night I I feel the same way about hawkeye, because hawkeye the show was amazing love.

Jay 23:15

The hawkeye show was good it was really good.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 23:18

My only problem I'm having with this is connective tissue idealism is that for some odd reason, it's like without the sum of its parts, you lose steam, and if you miss one part of a connection. It's like you don't have the full embodiment of the show that you're trying to watch. Perfect example that, like all this, everything has its own show. Now which?

Jay 23:37

honestly, as a moviegoer, it pisses me off yeah, like everything post in game is like they're chasing the dragon. They're trying to capture that lightning in the bottle again and it's not fucking working for them, except for little bits here and there.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 23:51

See, and this is where I got a chance to talk to you, Stan Lee, of course.

John Paul 23:55

I mean granted, but I'm going to steer the argument. So did you guys watch the what If series? Yes, yes.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 24:02

No. I watched a little bit, not the whole.

John Paul 24:04

thing if series, yes, yes, no, I watched a little bit, not the whole thing, okay, so the first season it ends with that dr strange one which actually leads into the multiverse of madness. Uh, the loki tv series leading into these other, what should have been the kang movie, um, you know, yeah, that's what I'm saying. The falcon and the winter soldier really turning into the introduction of falcon becoming captain america, wandavision merging into the. What if it's all connective tissue, the, the she-hulk. Granted, it was a little bit of a miss in the connective there are more misses than just She-Hulk.

John Paul 24:45

I mean not a lot. Ms Marvel wasn't too terrible.

Donte 24:51

It wasn't great. I didn't like they had to water her down Like.

Overlap 24:54

Marvel would.

John Paul 24:55

Yeah, they Kara Davers had a fucked up past Like her shit was fucked. No, no, no, no. No, I'm talking about Ms Marvel, not Captain Marvel. Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah, the TV show, yeah, I feel like they didn't really do her character a ton of justice, but it was all right.

Donte 25:11

Yeah, they swapped her, for you know.

John Paul 25:13

X-Men 97, but that's more animated again.

Donte 25:16

Yeah, the fact that they made her a mutant. They swapped Ms Marvel into a mutant to explain her powers, marvel into a mutant to explain her powers.

John Paul 25:25

I see here we're supposed to be getting an Ironheart TV series which kind of interests me.

Donte 25:31

Yeah, because she has replaced Tony. Tony is not there, no more. In Ironheart. She is there. They're Ironman right now, and she even has Tony Stark as her mentor.

John Paul 25:44

He pops up and gives her know they're iron man right now, and she even has tony stark as her uh, as a mentor system.

Donte 25:47

Yeah, he pops up and, you know, gives her, you know, points and ideas of what she need to do and everything is it going to be rdj? I don't know if they're going to do it in this tv show.

Jay 25:58

They probably can't afford it it makes me wonder because, uh, they probably still have that man on the contract. I mean, they are bringing him back as dr doom, so they probably have they probably still have that man under contract.

Donte 26:05

I mean, they are bringing him back as Doctor Doom, they probably have a Jarvis, or you know, gal Friday.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 26:12

Yeah, I just once again. It's really frustrating as an OG moviegoer that now that you have to watch these microcosms of shows instead of just like watching the films and you'd be completely caught up by watching two or three films Now I gotta watch 16 series just to see what the hell happened in between time.

Donte 26:28

But no, so that to your point. That's. The problem is, if you watch these shows, it really doesn't advance anything like remember, agent and shield was supposed to be like the big connector, like after what happened with the avengers, you go to the shield and you're supposed to be like all right, while the avengers away doing stuff, agent and shield, the agent and shield go to Agent of the Shield and you're supposed to be like alright, while the Avengers are away doing stuff, the Agent of the Shield are running in the background looking for the next issue that they're going to bring to the Avengers. Like, oh hey, here's the next problem, you guys will solve it.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 26:55

And I thought that was well done. I'll give them that I liked it.

Donte 27:00

It was done the first two seasons, like when Nick Fury showed up, oh snap, we're connected. We're connected to the universe, the movie universe, when Fury showed up.

John Paul 27:14

And I get that side of things. But I look at it not from the moviegoer side of things. I look at it from the comic book side of things where I'm like, oh, there's all these different stories going on and sometimes they'll connect and dovetail together and like cause, like I'm I'm essentially looking at this as like independent stories that come up and, like I said, like weave together and create sometimes a bigger narrative. Sometimes it leads to nothing, Sometimes it's a one shot, Like the defenders was cool. I didn't really need a second season or anything to ever come from it.

Donte 27:53

But that's the problem with the Marvel show is. Me personally as a comic book reader reader. Marvel stories are not interesting, maybe like their big events yes, but you know, their regular stories. I'll go grab a Deadpool.

Overlap 28:17

I'll definitely grab an X-Men, but everything else everybody else.

John Paul 28:21

I'm like yeah, I'm good, I'd rather DC grab like two or three different stories and see where they're at well, to be fair, that also falls back on, like the like the real focus of dc comics when it started, the detective comics that, like they, really they had a lot of like batman doing investigating, even superman being an investigative reporter. There was a lot of intrigue, a lot of mystery, whereas Marvel was always more of, oh, the big bad.

Jay 28:54

Yeah.

John Paul 28:55

Like the big bad of the week, the big bad of the month, whatever Right.

Donte 29:03

You sit there and you look at these shows, all right, all right, so we're going to name off some of these Marvel shows. Right? So we had Incredible Hulk with Lou Ferrigno so that was pretty cool.

John Paul 29:16

I mean, we're going that far back, I'm naming them off that means.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 29:21

I get to go Adam West Batman. I'm excited.

John Paul 29:23

Let's do it oh shit, the number one Batman in my heart. Holy press of metal Batman. That means I get to go. Adam West Batman. I'm excited, let's do it.

Jay 29:28

Oh shit, the number one Batman in my heart. Holy press of metal Batman. He wasn't the first, but he was the best.

Donte 29:36

He even had an Avenger hookup in that show and then Cloak and Dagger. There was so much teenage angst in that one.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 29:45

I wasn't a fan.

John Paul 29:48

Hold on. Are we talking about the 2019 Cloak and Dagger, or are we talking about a Cloak and Dagger from the 90s? You jumped from Incredible Hulk with Lou Ferrigno.

Donte 29:59

I'm just going down this list right here. I got the Incredible Hulk. If you want me to incredible.

Jay 30:05

I take it we're not doing chronological order here.

John Paul 30:08

That's what I'm saying, if we're just talking about random shows like that. That's the thing is. There was a lot of these shows that just could be thrown away the runaways I never. I never watched the runaways. How do they get two seasons?

Jay 30:22

I didn't even know that that was a fucking dc show, that's. I never even watched it. That's a marvel show.

Donte 30:28

I don't know who the fuck it is. I never watched it the runaway, see. But here's the thing about it. The runaways was an interesting story. Like Like okay, so you know how you had. Like the Teen Titans over in DC.

John Paul 30:36

Oh no, that's the thing. The characters are interesting.

Donte 30:38

Yeah.

John Paul 30:40

Like I've seen stories about them. The video game Midnight Suns focuses heavily on some of the characters from the Runaways.

Donte 30:49

Like you had. Like you had. Like you had the Teen Titans and then, of course, had like the Teen Titans over in DC. What you do with your, you know your younger, younger heroes, or you know those who just that figure out what their, your powers are going to be. That was your. What I would run away it's Marvel's runaways was like hey, we had these powers, what are we going to do with it?

Overlap 31:14

Like I gotta try to do good.

John Paul 31:14

I better do something At one point one character's storyline is I just want to be a normal teenager, but my mom's in a cult and wants to sacrifice me to the devil.

Donte 31:27

Exactly. The kids are like I got these powers, I just want to live life, but all their parents are villains.

Overlap 31:35

They're literally running a villain organization.

Donte 31:38

They would be part of the.

John Paul 31:41

Legion of Doom or something.

Donte 31:43

Yeah, that would make Runaways kind of interesting. Season 2 was like okay, what are we doing?

Marvel's TV Shows as Connective Tissue

John Paul 31:52

But if I'm being honest, that could have been one season.

Donte 31:55

Yeah, it could have If you put that whole show into one season.

John Paul 31:57

that could have been one season. If you put that whole show into one season, that would have been great, Especially if it would have had Daredevil level writing.

Donte 32:06

But it was a Hulu show, though I don't think they got Daredevil level money. That's what.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 32:14

I was going to bring up Maybe now.

Donte 32:17

No, no, because Hulu was partially owned by 3, because ABC, disney and Fox.

John Paul 32:23

I'm saying they're locked in with Disney, like Disney Plus and all that stuff before Disney completely took it over.

Donte 32:32

Fox was kicking in money, so they had money, but it was a Hulu show. It was like one of those hey, come to Hulu and watch our show on Hulu, because we got this going Go ahead.

John Paul 32:43

No. I will say like as of right now, though, because I feel like at this moment we're in a lull. What Marvel show, what Marvel like movie is coming up that's supposed to? I've not heard anything crazy coming from Marvel lately.

Donte 33:05

Movie-wise. You're talking about the movie side.

John Paul 33:07

I'm talking about TV show anime. What's their next big thing?

Jay 33:13

That's the problem I don't think they even know.

Donte 33:18

Look at your character, know Well, I mean look at your character lineup.

Jay 33:22

Here for a perfect example, Dante and I. I don't know if Tim has seen it, but we've seen the new Falcon or Captain America. Brave New World.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 33:31

I'll put it on my list though so yeah, so what he was like.

Donte 33:41

Okay, spoiler alert, your big reveal in this was thought about rose. Thought about ross is red hulk. That's your big reveal. Like you sit in this movie and they're like the crescendo, the climax, the big part is Roscoe's Red Hulk. It's like you showed me that in the trailer and at the same time, as soon as I saw Thunderbolt Ross, I'm like it's fucking Red Hulk. Like we remember that back from the Edward Norton Hulk movie.

Jay 34:13

Yeah.

John Paul 34:14

Like you movie. You're not showing me anything new here. I just don't understand the casting on that. Don't get me wrong. Harrison Ford, great actor.

Jay 34:26

He's Han Solo in Indiana Jones.

John Paul 34:29

Yeah, but how old is that man? And not to mention, he essentially hates those characters. The man he plays characters that he doesn't want to continue playing.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 34:42

It kind of shows on screen too sometimes. I'm not going to lie.

Donte 34:47

But like.

Jay 34:50

I have an issue with that? Yeah, but you know what he doesn't hate Money.

Donte 34:53

Like I think that's the big problem with the, with this Marvel side is, besides what, spider-man, the next Spider-Man?

Jay 35:05

Tom Holland. There's not really any new up-and-coming actors that are.

Donte 35:12

The Tom Holland Spider-Man and the animated one. We're all looking forward to that one. Oh, the Spider-Man.

John Paul 35:17

And the animated one. We're all looking forward to that one, oh, the Spider-Verse that's coming out to be announced.

Donte 35:23

Yeah, probably 26, probably going to come 26, maybe 27. Who knows?

John Paul 35:28

Maybe 28.

Jay 35:30

We're waiting on those two, I bet we get it before we get GTA 6.

John Paul 35:40

See what you did there I mean popping back over to DC shows, though. I mean there was a Constantine show that they had for a season. Black Lightning was pretty solid.

Overlap 35:56

Yeah, I thought it was entertaining. Oh, I didn't get to see that one. Was it good?

Jay 35:57

Lightning was pretty solid. Yeah, I thought it was entertaining. Oh, I didn't get to see that one. Was it good? Yeah, it was pretty good. It was pretty solid.

John Paul 36:02

It's on.

Donte 36:03

CW too. Let's be real, they really CW took care of the shows.

Jay 36:10

CW. They do it good. They did a great job with it. Just fucking let CW do all the fucking TV shows.

John Paul 36:18

Now I will say personal opinion I don't want to. I haven't seen and I don't want to see the Peacemaker TV show. I don't care, I liked it. This is just because I don't like the idea of Peacemaker as a character. Why I thought he was. I like thought he was great in the things that I've seen, like the Suicide Squad, things like that, but like the Peacemaker is like the weakest attempt at a parallel to the Nova Corps.

Jay 36:56

I thought you were going to say I do not agree or align with that at all.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 37:02

That's an interesting perspective, though I'll take that.

John Paul 37:05

His whole gimmick is like it's a wrong perspective, but you know. Because, if I'm not mistaken, in their universe he's like the last Peacemaker, right yeah?

Jay 37:17

his dad was Pe, was peacemaker.

John Paul 37:19

Now it's him yeah, because originally, like they were just like a police, like a, an evil villain police force in like the comics and stuff, we didn't need to make one of those, uh, a tv show. We didn't need to make one of those a TV show.

Donte 37:39

That's a background.

John Paul 37:40

Minion that they made a main character.

Donte 37:43

But that's how you.

John Paul 37:45

Instead of doing something new, instead of doing something that people wanted.

Jay 37:50

They did. They did something new by making the Peacemaker show. That's not what I mean by new, though.

John Paul 37:58

What I mean is new with a new main character, like bigger character that people are wanting to see. It's like all right, we're going to take this like Name one. That's what you're supposed to do. What do you mean, though? Name one, a Justice League regular movie that doesn't suck like the Whedon one? That isn't technically four hours long.

Donte 38:22

But this is what you're supposed to do. You have this roster of characters and you put them on screen. If people react to hey, we like this character, then let's write this horse you brought Peacemaker as a gimmick and people loved him because everybody loves John Cena. It's like yo, let's keep riding this, even though he had a short run in comics, which, oh my god, this series was so fucking stupid.

John Paul 38:49

But then we turn around and in upcoming we've got Lanterns in 2026. That's interesting.

Donte 38:55

And we should have been had Lanterns. I can't believe it took this long for Lanterns.

John Paul 39:00

Well, to be fair, Ryan Reynolds did his damage. Yeah, I love that man, I love that man to death. That movie is so bad.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 39:14

He went back in his own universe as Deadpool and killed not only himself and the character he's forgiven. In my opinion, he's good.

Jay 39:22

Let it die. We're not going to talk about it anymore.

Donte 39:28

But DC did it right by bringing these characters and giving them a run Like Kite man. I know we're going to the anime side, but Kite man, this dude, was not supposed to be a somebody he's like C or D, tier villain.

Jay 39:43

Okay, two things, though. Two things.

John Paul 39:44

I'll throw out there, though One. I feel like with the animated universe you can get away with things like that, where it's like throwaway characters. If Peacemaker would have been a cartoon like an animated cartoon, that would have been okay.

Jay 40:00

I don't want to see a whole live action series about peacemaker I don't know, I kind of want to see a live action kite man but now the second thing is there.

John Paul 40:13

now there is a real good storyline involving Kite man in the comics that made him iconic in the comics, which is like where the Joker gets depressed. The Riddler tries to make him laugh and the way he does it is essentially by building up Kite man to thinking he can take down Batman, and then Batman, beating the shit out of him, goes justice.

Donte 40:43

That is awesome and that makes the joker laugh.

Overlap 40:44

that's awesome, right there that adds some villain shit right there like yeah, yeah, yeah, that's pretty villainous see, that makes him a great villain right there, like you know what well, and the thing is that that literally developed kite man into like one of those like high level meme characters in the dc universe, which is it's understood.

John Paul 41:05

It's understandable why he would get like a little short tv show. Now I don't know how long it's going on for, because it's at least one season now. Is there? Are they more of it?

Donte 41:16

They could probably run a second season out of it, because I mean Bane like Bane alone in that series bouncing around in both Harley Quinn and Kite man.

John Paul 41:25

That's true.

Jay 41:27

I did because I haven't watched the whole series of Kite man. I love that version of Bane.

John Paul 41:30

so much I was like I haven't seen the whole series of Kite man, but I did see a couple episodes with Bane in it and that was fucking hilarious.

Donte 41:38

And here's one thing I want to bring up to you guys. It's like, alright, we're looking at the DC side, like we're even there. You have your big three, you have the Trinity and you have a whole lot of side characters like hey, everybody's getting a chance on screen and you know, people are liking some of their stuff and some they might not. If you go over to the Marvel side, your main cast of the Avengers, because apparently the X-Men do not exist in the MCU.

Jay 42:06

Well, I mean now with you know the whole Brave New World movie. We know the X-Men are coming. Yeah, it really chuffs me to no end movie. We know that X-Men are coming, which really chuffs me to no end, that they're like oh, here's the celestial that we haven't talked about at all because that movie was so fucking bad no mention of it in any other TV show or movie.

Donte 42:35

And then all of a sudden.

Jay 42:36

Oh, by the way, here's a dead celestial in the Indian Ocean, not the Atlantic, not the Pacific. You know the two biggest, the Indian, a very small one. We're just going to fucking gloss over that.

John Paul 42:50

Nobody's noticed it.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 42:53

Can I just pinhole one thing in particular, one thing that's always bothered me is that we have scarlet witch. Right, we're gonna talk about the scarlet witch we're gonna talk about her we're gonna call about quicksilver not a good shit, right? So we can't talk about her father being the single most devastating, fucking vicious villain on the fucking planet, and he can't tie into it at all because someone had the rule of the word mutant yeah, like that's the thing, yeah wanda is a mutant.

Donte 43:16

And's what made me pissed off about it. It was Quicksilver and Wanda are mutants.

John Paul 43:21

Quicksilver had to die, not a mutant.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 43:24

And it made me so mad. I was like wait, you're just going to end Quicksilver. What do you call him inhuman?

Donte 43:30

They were referred to as inhuman or something like that.

John Paul 43:33

Why couldn't they use the word mutant? They don't ever really say what they are. You know, they're just like they're enhanced individuals. Yeah, because I know Fox coined the phrase. I know what was it? Flash, which was DC, had the metahumans. Yeah, I don't know if they had anything specific they were calling them. Now, the Inhumans were a different thing and, I'll be honest, it was a weird twist on a TV show where one of your main characters never says a goddamn word. But the Inhumans TV show wasn't half bad.

Donte 44:12

I like the comic books.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 44:13

It was solid.

Donte 44:15

And that's one thing that irks me about it. You have the three factions, you have the mutants, the Inhumans, and then you have the Brick Inhumans or the Enhanced Inhumans or whatever you know. You go and look at the characters. You look at the characters again at Marvel no, x-men. So you don't get like the awesome, like you know the awesome characters over there.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 44:35

So you're stuck with the Avengers and who else and then this bothers me also because you think about it and from your X-Men you get to see T'Challa. You know what I'm saying? God rest Choway Bozeman. Oh my gosh.

John Paul 44:50

Rest in peace. To a legend.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 44:52

But the thing is, I wanted to see the comic book where Storm becomes T'Challa's wife and they become a power couple and start wrecking shit. We are missing pivotal moments here. And I'm like, but you know, it's literally like you've been edged. It's like, hey, you might get it. No, no, we still own this word. You can't have those two.

John Paul 45:14

I would kill, I would so kill, to have a Deadpool-Spider-Man buddy cop movie. Oh God, yes.

Jay 45:24

That would be the best Tom Holland and Ryan Reynolds.

John Paul 45:28

Oh, perfect, him being so tied to the X-Men and like, because in the comics Spider-Man is also like, not like super, tapped in primarily because they thought he was a mutant and he was like yeah, no, definitely.

Donte 45:47

I got bit by a bug yep, like you sit there, like if you go back, if we go to the marvel animation but the spider-man show, you know when, when deadpool popped up, but the Spider-Man show, you know, when Deadpool popped up on the Spider-Man show, he's all like, yeah, I can't say kill, so I'm going to say that I'm alive with him.

John Paul 46:03

Oh yeah, when did you get these jets? I borrowed them. I owe you two jets Stole them from Tony.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 46:11

Tony's looking like what the I got another bone to pick because the funny thing is Spider-Man. He was a part of the Fantastic Four at one point. We're not even going to get to that because we can't have a Fantastic Four.

John Paul 46:24

That doesn't suck well, supposedly we got one coming.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 46:29

We do, I didn't know.

Jay 46:30

Spider-Man was part of the Fantastic Four at one point.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 46:33

Yes, wouldn't that make them five okay, pause, so what it was.

Donte 46:39

It was when Johnny was gone, wasn't it?

John Paul 46:43

I wasn't even trying. I think what it was was Wait hold on. Spider-man somehow lost his costume, so they gave him a spare Fantastic Four costume and a paper bag and he swung around with a paper bag on his head wearing a Fantastic 4 costume and they used that as an excuse to team him up with the Fantastic 4 and stuff.

Donte 47:09

I think that ruins the whole Marvel side of their shows and stuff, because all their characters are always interconnected with each other, especially with mutants, but when you go watch their shows they're so isolated on an island that they're supposed to interact with just their core people.

John Paul 47:27

It's much like you said. It feels like a lot of their shows are waiting for that moment of like. Okay, sony's contract's expired.

Donte 47:37

No more mutants we're sitting here like drip-dropping, like okay, so what are you gonna do after? What's that? What's that? What's the big one, doomsday, like? What are you gonna? Do like are you actually gonna mosh everybody together? So now when I watch the next, you know agent and she'llIELD, they bring it back. Let's say, they bring Agent of SHIELD back, we have them. Or She-Hulk, we get Spider-Woman in there too. Like what are we going to do?

John Paul 48:09

I mean technically.

Jay 48:11

Big Hero 6 is in the same universe.

Donte 48:16

I like.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 48:16

She-Hulk, you bullshit. Wait, big Hero 6.

Jay 48:18

She-Hulk was not good, I'm looking at the She-Hulk was plagued with bad writing based on Marvel comic publications and Big Hero 6 is on it.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 48:29

I like She-Hulk. She-hulk had a lot of tongue in cheek and, as she is in her comic book, she was actually really fun. I just feel like they just did a lot of things. That was like kind of cringy. That wasn't like ultimately her character that's my problem, was all the cringe because she and she always was doing fourth wall breaks before deadpool the bad guy was internet trolls of that show.

John Paul 48:54

Yes, but as I said as I said before, when we had, when you had this argument the other day, who was the bad guy in the first season of daredevil?

Jay 49:04

I said wilson fisk and you're like no it was the justice system the justice system is always the bad guy. Let's just get that out there because it doesn't matter who the big bad is the justice system, is the bigger bad?

John Paul 49:18

okay, perfect example Arkham Asylum they have not rehabilitated a single that's not entirely true who comes back better from Harley. Quinn is making progress, as she is no longer fucking. A joker, entirely true. Who comes back better from Harley? Harley Quinn is making progress, as she is no longer fucking a Joker.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 49:40

She worked there first. I was just about to say that she made a lot of loss of progress.

John Paul 49:48

She's making progress back.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 49:51

She literally turned into a villain, a super hot villain, while working in the justice system.

Donte 50:02

In Arkham's defense. If they haven't broke out, they do get released and they get back into the streets of Gotham where, as we can see, there's not a lot of great opportunity to be on the straight and narrow. And if you do go on the straight and narrow, you know there's not a lot of great opportunity to be on the straight and narrow. And if you do go on the straight and narrow, you're getting screwed over by either your boss or you're not making enough money Cause you got to live, you got to take care of your family. So sometimes you just gotta you know you gotta go grab yourself a gun. You know you gotta tell people to get down or lay down.

Jay 50:41

I'm going to argue, and I'm going to argue. Who has?

John Paul 50:42

Arkham rehabilitated Zero, absolutely zero fucking people.

Overlap 50:45

Jack Napier.

John Paul 50:46

Jack Napier From Batman White Knight Did he?

Tim "Big King Kuma" 50:54

They did.

John Paul 50:57

The Babel In Batman White Knight. He is a functioning member of society. Batman hates it, but he is a functioning member of society.

Jay 51:06

Again, that was like. I just really want to punch him like, I just want to punch him in a stupid face.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 51:11

He's like waiting, if your success percentage is less than like I don't know 0.2, then you, I don't call it success rate hey, but that's a win, like if you're ever gonna have a win.

DC Animation Excellence

Jay 51:23

That's the lowercase w right there it's a win.

John Paul 51:29

If you're gonna have a win, it should like it. Better be the joker. You better fix that dude of all the people who've been in your system. Yeah, you're not going to fix it. No, that one you can't.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 51:41

Harley Quinn used to work at Arkham bro. That's what I'm saying. She was a functioning human being, that was normal and sweet.

John Paul 51:48

Then she went to work at Arguable.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 51:50

And got turned up Arguable if I'm not mistaken.

John Paul 51:58

She's from Gotham, and nobody from Gotham is a normal, rational human being because they keep boiling the water supply are you kidding me? That and like if you live in Gotham, let's be honest, if you live in Gotham, Gordon normal person, normal functioning contributor to society.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 52:18

Gordon's also a thug that beats people's ass all day. I don't know.

John Paul 52:25

He doesn't. He doesn't so does.

Donte 52:29

Batman.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 52:34

I don't kill. Give me a rib cage. Wait what?

Jay 52:40

I mean, batman may not kill motherfuckers, but he sure do be crippling hoes let me tell you.

Donte 52:46

Bovla Hill and Bruce Wayne Wayne Enterprise will take care of your medical bills you know?

John Paul 52:53

yeah, it's weird Batman blew up all my shit and then Bruce Wayne showed up with a check for three hundred thousand dollars I will say I don't know why that was probably one of my favorite scenes in in the uh the dark knight series was

Jay 53:12

when home dude comes up to, uh, lucius fox talking about I know bruce wayne's batman, and he's like okay, he's like well, I'm gonna expose him, unless was when Home Dude comes up to Lucius Fox talking about I know Bruce Wayne's Batman, and he's like okay, he's like well, I'm going to expose him unless I get money, blah, blah, blah, and he goes. You really think you're going to blackmail a guy who dresses up and goes out at night and beats the shit out of people all night?

Overlap 53:34

I'll patch off my own purse.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 53:35

Basically, that's what happened.

Jay 53:38

He's like well, well, I'm gonna go back to work now all right.

John Paul 53:42

All right. It's like the two people you don't want to confront about their secret identity batman, spider-man oh spider-man, oh my gosh, just what he did to freaking like old buddy in prison oh, when he took kingpin yeah, I'm talking freaking old buddy in prison oh, when he took Kingpin yeah, yes, I'm talking about old buddy when they showed up to his house and he kept telling them to not show up. And they showed up at his door and he beat the ever-living shit out of them and said not at my house.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 54:12

That's right.

Overlap 54:14

Forgot about that that was during the Civil War, wasn't?

Tim "Big King Kuma" 54:17

it.

Jay 54:17

I feel like the majority of the villains in Gotham know Bruce Wayne as Batman, but they're too scared to actually say anything to him. Like someone comes up, like some you know villain's, like I know, I figured it out, I figured it out Bruce Wayne's Batman and all the other villains are like yeah, we fucking know, dude, just don't fucking say anything.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 54:39

Who can afford this much ways to whip somebody's ass? I don't know.

John Paul 54:44

Actually it looks like it's Marvel Adventures Spider-Man, issue 59.

Donte 54:49

So let's switch over to the animated series. We all know DC it's.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 54:54

DC all day.

Jay 54:56

I love Marvel to death, but DC just fucking kills it in their anime.

Overlap 55:00

Every time.

Jay 55:02

Ruby x Justice League Fucking gold I'm going to argue from the jump.

John Paul 55:10

it's been just superb. They started out initially with Justice League, Flashpoint Paradox, which is a perfect starting point for a universe, because A it shows you time is fluid. It shows you there's other universes we can tap into. That.

Jay 55:31

And it also shows you how exactly OP Barry Allen is, which, by the way, Flash is my favorite character from DC.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 55:39

He's also Batman's favorite character from DC, but at the same time, Batman says I will take him apart.

Jay 55:46

It's also the only reason that we don't have the Justice.

John Paul 55:49

Lords 100% has. If you watch or read Batman, dark Knight or not, dark it's, was it Darkest Night or something, I forget what it's called. Dark Knights of Evil.

Donte 56:07

You're talking about the metal one.

John Paul 56:11

Bad Metal. That's what it was.

Donte 56:12

You're talking about that series?

John Paul 56:14

Yeah, where he one universe's Batmanman beats the shit out of uh, barry allen straps him to the hood of the batmobile and drives him to the end of the universe and acquires his power to become red death bro oh my god, I want to watch that, I want to read that if they made a series of if they made a series off of that I would to watch that.

Donte 56:36

I want to read that. If they made a series off of that, I would so watch that.

John Paul 56:40

Bro, that would be so savage I will throw out and this is just a shout out to one of my favorite YouTube channels Comicstorian. Yes, yes, Love the guy. He's got a whole series on that, oh yeah, it's so good series on that.

Donte 56:56

It's so good when I'm working on something and I need some background noise. Throw in some comic story and what's the other channel?

John Paul 57:03

Rest in Peace, benny.

Donte 57:05

The comic story and the other guy. Comics Explained Comics Explained what's the most?

Jay 57:13

recent Batman series where Batman's just fucking straight yoked. Oh poor Batman, he's got a battle axe on his chest what's?

John Paul 57:20

the most recent.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 57:20

Batman series, where Batman's just fucking straight yoked.

John Paul 57:22

Oh poor Batman, he's got a battle axe on his chest, oh my God, and it's got one of the greatest stories.

Overlap 57:30

It's essentially what if? Batman was poor, absolute Batman. That's what it is.

John Paul 57:34

It's absolute Batman I was watching.

Jay 57:36

I was on TikTok the other day and someone did an animated deal about absolute Batman. That's what it is. It's Absolute Batman. I was watching. I was on TikTok the other day and someone did like an animated deal about Absolute Batman and it's like he shows up and jokes. There you go, he turns around and he's like yo, what the fuck? You look like Batman. Ate Batman. Like one of your legs is the size of my fucking torso.

John Paul 57:52

Well, it literally is the story of if Batman, his, his dad was a doctor, but he was a failing doctor, and things like that, and he grows up to just become a mechanic. But he works out all the fucking time.

Jay 58:11

I feel like that Batman only works out. He works on cars for maybe two to three hours a day and then just goes straight back to the gym.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 58:19

He's got to make his own tools because keep breaking them.

John Paul 58:22

I would say, and that's why he's got such like brutal tools, he's his bat symbol is really the head of an ax. Yeah, so he pulls out like a handle and like, rips the thing off his chest and shoves it on his. His little bat horns are essentially knives that he pulls out.

Jay 58:41

That Batman is on steroids. You cannot tell me any differently.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 58:47

He's fighting Bane, wouldn't you?

Jay 58:49

That man is straight running cycles. It's only one cycle, but it's forever.

Donte 58:58

I want to point out something. Everybody like this whole conversation. We're supposed to be talking about marvel and dc, and the whole time we've been talking about dc, just dc, just that much that much better yes until you get to their movies

John Paul 59:10

now see, and the thing is I and I wish that dc's movies would take the same route that that marvel's movies have, with the kevin feige approach of, like he has, we have one guy who's in control they just did that'd be nice and honestly, like, for example, the first bit of the animated films, the.

John Paul 59:35

There was one producer who was in charge of everything, james Tucker, and he put together the Flashpoint Paradox, justice League, war, son of Batman, throne of Atlantis, batman vs Robin, batman, bad Blood, justice League vs the Teen Titans, justice League, dark Teen Titans, the Judas Contract and then Suicide Squad Hell to Pay, which was also co-produced by Sam Liu. But like there was this one guy involved with this main story through the animated series Yep, or the animated films, Yep, and that's because Warner Brothers couldn't.

Donte 1:00:13

I'm not gonna lie.

Jay 1:00:14

I came into this totally ready to defend Marvel and everything, but we have been glazing the shit out of DC.

Donte 1:00:20

Because Marvel outside of your core, of the Avengers. What else do you?

Jay 1:00:26

have their roster's. Not that great if we're being 100% honest. If you cut out the.

Donte 1:00:31

X-Men and you cut out all mutants. You cut out mutants.

John Paul 1:00:37

I mean we do have Deadpool, which does include Wolverine.

Jay 1:00:42

Yep, I mean, think about it. You've got Iron man Thor, the entire Avengers lineup can all do their own standalone shit.

John Paul 1:00:54

Yes, and they've all been good We've reached a point, though, where we can include mutants. It's just they haven't had a chance to do it yet.

Jay 1:01:04

Yeah until Sony either hands it over or no, fox had mutants Fox had the time.

Donte 1:01:13

Mutants oh Fox.

Jay 1:01:14

Sorry, I'm thinking Spider-Man, for some reason.

Donte 1:01:16

But yeah, Fox is just fucking let go. But Fox has got rid of their entertainment division. And Mouse bought it Mouse got the mutants.

John Paul 1:01:27

Mouse has mutants. They just haven't had a chance to do anything with it yet why the Mouse has an unlimited budget. They got a hold of it and they went cool, deadpool, wolverine that'll be how we introduce mutants and we'll somehow incorporate it further down the line.

Jay 1:01:46

Right, yeah, but they should be able to do it a lot sooner when your budget is yes you can do that. They've had so many wasted opportunities where they could have had such great Don't worry, we'll sell six more bottled waters at the theme park and it'll pay for the next movie, right?

Donte 1:02:07

Exactly so.

Batman Characters and Storylines

John Paul 1:02:09

Like the Marvel side is like kind of thin, like your characters are thin characters are thin, like I well, especially if you go to and this is what initially spawned mine and uh, jay's conversation was the animated series of marvel vs dc. Marvel's animated series, like the, the cartoons and stuff as kids were great. We all all remember the original X-Men. We all remember the.

John Paul 1:02:37

Spider-Men. But when they started trying to make movies, they started trying to do these animated movies in 3D, rendering anime style. Everything was a different person producing it, directing it, storyboarding it like it was just like Kevin Feige, do it right like. The worst one I remember was I tried watching. There was one with the Punisher and Black Widow and it it hurt my eyes to watch. That's how bad it was.

Donte 1:03:19

But the reason why they do that is they keep both of those stories separate, Like you keep your animated world separate from your movie world, and that's the problem with DC is your animation world, you know everything happens.

Jay 1:03:35

I think it's just so dominant that it can't help but bleed into the live action to the movies.

Donte 1:03:42

Well, you can tell whatever story you want in the animation, like you've got more freedom to tell a comic book style story or whatever, but when it comes to, why can't? You do that in live action Because you don't have all the characters you can use in a live action. You know what I mean. Like you, sit there, you run your Avengers, you know Wolverine, you know, pops up as an Avenger every once in a while. You got Spider-Man. Pops up as an Avenger every once in a while, shoot even.

John Paul 1:04:09

Luke Cage is an. Avenger but you know, I mean to be fair, like everyone, and their mama is an Avenger.

Jay 1:04:14

Don't just let anyone into the damn Avengers.

Overlap 1:04:21

Except Deadpool.

Donte 1:04:21

Oh Punisher they won't let Punisher be an Avenger.

John Paul 1:04:26

To be fair, they tried to get Punisher as an Avenger and he shot a guy in the face to say no.

Donte 1:04:31

Cap was like nah, great answer. They were like we need Punisher.

John Paul 1:04:36

He was like you won't let me play by the rules I want to play by. And what rules are that? He just shoots a guy?

Donte 1:04:43

Cap looked at this dude like yeah, no, no, I'm against it.

Overlap 1:04:47

Cap was like.

Donte 1:04:48

I don't want him Although.

Jay 1:04:51

I'm really sad that Chris Evans has stepped down from Captain America. Like I get it, you know, oh shit, I almost dropped my whole fucking mic.

John Paul 1:05:01

I liked him reprising his role as the Human Torch.

Jay 1:05:04

Yes, that was fantastic, but I'd really like to see a fucking, because you know, captain America and Cyclops have gone toe-to-toe, yep, and Cyclops fucking ran that shit.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:05:19

Yep, of course, and I really want to see that live action Put some respect on Mr Summer's name.

John Paul 1:05:26

There's a lot of things I want to see from the X-Men universe and I would love if they, even if they start with a TV show, give me something. I need to see Jean Grey, I need to see gene gray, I need to see storm. I need to see we cyclops hell let me, get havoc but like.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:05:45

So what happened for what you're saying? Like they had this whole thing with the marvel was having trouble I'm joking on beach.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:05:54

So they had. They had this one thing this uh, series of comics that came out when marvel was having trouble, called marvel knights, I believe, and marvel knights had like these great retelling of a lot of these stories and like, give a good origin point to whatnot, and that's where I saw like a lot of the um, the rebirth of certain stories. Perfect example wolverine versus freaking hulk. That, oh my gosh, great stories, outstanding story brilliant.

Jay 1:06:17

I did like the nod to it in Deadpool vs Wolverine.

John Paul 1:06:22

Well, I will say, because there are some animated Marvel movies that have slapped, and there is one, I believe, specifically with it's like Marvel, or it's Deadpool vs Hulk, vs Wolverine, and then I think, deadpool versus somebody else, versus Venom.

Donte 1:06:44

They're like two 20-30 minute episode movie things like you know that fight between, like hulk and, uh, wolverine and deadpool just kind of showing up in the middle of it, like I'm sitting here looking at the enemy. I'm looking at the animation series. I'm like like the egg the only bad, the only awesome one was the freaking x-men series. So the x-men evolution, x-men animated series and x-men 97 and then wolverine.

Jay 1:07:22

I haven't finished x-men 97 yet, but I've been enjoying it whoa, that's, that's what I see and that's why.

Donte 1:07:31

That's why I feel bad for marvel, because your x-men, like your x-men stories are better than everything else like yeah they are serious, but if they embrace them they'll do better we can be camped at this point.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:07:46

They should be able to, because the word mutant was holding back, right?

Donte 1:07:50

yeah, it's just as a.

John Paul 1:07:51

It's just a matter of they haven't had a chance to do anything. The the most they've done so far is Deadpool, wolverine, past, that they haven't had a chance to truly bring.

Donte 1:08:01

Oh, the Captain Marvel, the Ms Marvel series.

John Paul 1:08:08

Oh, technically she is a mutant. No, she's an inhuman.

Donte 1:08:12

At the end. Was it the Captain Marvel 2? The Captain Marvel 2 movie, wasn't it?

Jay 1:08:19

Yeah, I don't know it's kind of forgettable at the end. Uh was it, uh was it a captain.

Donte 1:08:20

Marvel 2 the captain marvel 2 movie, wasn't it? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, because the um, I believe the miss marvel series moved. It moved into the captain marvel movie. And if you remember, at the end of uh, the captain marvel two, when uh, uh, jean 2, when Jean was like Remy or something, first off, remy Lebeau is Gambit.

Jay 1:08:46

I'm trying to remember what her name is. Well, she ends up getting tossed into space.

Donte 1:08:52

She ends up getting tossed into space and then she ends up going to one of the little warpholes where she's captured and she's in the mutant universe because she's there with Beast and her mom and she comes to find out that her mom's a mutant. So, they had that little tidbit of hey, there's mutants coming.

Jay 1:09:12

A little sidebar. I kind of really really want a Channing Tatum Gambit movie.

Donte 1:09:18

Oh, we're going to get one, oh trust me.

John Paul 1:09:21

Channing Tatum also really, really, really wants a Channing Tatum Gambit movie.

Overlap 1:09:27

I mean yeah that's true.

John Paul 1:09:29

That man has been campaigning for that movie to happen for so long.

Jay 1:09:33

And he finally got to play Gambit and he fucking killed it, and you can tell he loved being a part of it.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:09:41

Like that's what I like to see when I see an actor in something um.

John Paul 1:09:47

Wesley Snipes'.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:09:48

Blade. Oh oh, my gosh brilliant. I gotta say this because there's four guys talking about a bunch of stuff and I want to make this very clear to all those who are listening. Understand that we may have valuable opinions and we have opinions that you may not agree with. But understand we're not against women characters because I feel like we've been shitting on some women characters. I want to make this very clear. If a woman character is written correctly and is brilliant, I love it A hundred percent.

Overlap 1:10:11

It just seems like some of the ones that just some of my favorite characters are women ones.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:10:19

They just some of my favorite characters are women like, like, like I'll be honest, like raven as a character, as a character, absolutely like a lot of them have amazing order stories. Dc writes women characters brilliantly in my very well, I feel like marvel sometimes lacks, to kind of let them like oh, I need a big, strong man to help me. You're super girl, what are you doing?

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:10:37

it's like if you don't throw them hands, it's not granted in dc of what's it? A bat girl? Oh my gosh, even if I can't go out there and fight, guess what? I'm gonna become oracle. That'd be the meanest fucking hacking thing you ever seen in your fucking life. Like like brilliantly devoted characters, let's shoot cat woman. He Catwoman. Batman is the best detective in the world, but he can't run from that kitty Right.

Donte 1:11:02

At the end of the day, he's not like hey.

Jay 1:11:04

Metaphorically and physically, he's trying to tell her hey, baby, I need you to go straight.

Donte 1:11:09

I need you to go legit, I need you.

John Paul 1:11:11

I mean you say that, but who did he have a kid with, huh?

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:11:18

Well, at the same time he was kind of, you know, Well, it was taken by Raejean Gould's daughter. She kind of took them juices. Talia O'Gould.

Donte 1:11:21

Put some respect on Talia's name.

John Paul 1:11:23

Hey, Talia took them juices.

Jay 1:11:25

Talia said I want you and I like you, hey to be fair. She took them twice.

John Paul 1:11:30

The choice is yours.

Donte 1:11:37

I don't forget it is. You also gotta remember when he did get the opportunity, bruce had a chance to say no. He was like. You know what I'm here I will not let it down again.

John Paul 1:11:48

Batman at the end of the day, is still a man which I'm gonna throw something out. This is a personal opinion. It was really. We're talking about the animated DC. I'm going to throw something out. This is a personal opinion. It was really. We're talking about the animated DC. It was real aggressive in the Harley Quinn show when she straight up assaults Dick Grayson when he's strapped to a bed and not able to say.

Jay 1:12:10

He's saying no.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:12:13

That was assault.

Jay 1:12:14

That was.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:12:15

You're not saying no, but your eyes are saying yes, no, no, don't take off that beautifully tight, hold on. No, don't do this to me. Bat daddy help me. He was like oh no.

Donte 1:12:28

Batman came in that room, looked at both of them like really, what are you doing?

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:12:33

and dad don't get mad at me, batman, I've seen your roster. All of them are evil. All of them are literally evil that's not entirely true what is it?

John Paul 1:12:47

specifically Silver Saint Cloud. I know way too much about Batman. You guys, let's go for it that's why I brought you this is due to a tumblr post I came across years ago, silver St Cloud, which is someone who Batman had sex with and made come 11 times in one night, and that's in the comics.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:13:09

Why Damn Batman? I don't know why this is Bruce Wayne, Because you're going to get this justice.

Jay 1:13:18

He's out there busting.

John Paul 1:13:23

Which also brings the point of, like I'd get it all for my city. So he was doing that all night. We can assume that was an all night job, right, right, because he doesn't, because that's what he do, he stay up all night. So crime was just happening while you busted nuts, alright.

Donte 1:13:40

I feel bad for that person. This is the night.

John Paul 1:13:42

Two-Face got to rob the bank because you was busy fucking.

Donte 1:13:46

Think about it. Think about it. Guy Bruce stays up all night so he was giving it to her all night, to the sun rising. She's all like please let me sleep. He's like no we still got time.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:13:59

You know, it's the same energy he will fight Bane You've got me I've got you for the next three hours.

Overlap 1:14:08

I have a question.

Jay 1:14:11

You're in here with me. Superman has kids right, Correct? I have a question.

John Paul 1:14:20

Was this like a Hancock situation?

Jay 1:14:23

Is this going to be the Mallrats question? Wait, hold on what's the Mallrats question.

John Paul 1:14:26

The mall rats question where he says like, so, like, if if superman came in lois lane, it would just blow her back out like a shotgun, right, right or lunge into the air which that was actually initially, uh, played off of. There's a scene where she gets pregnant with Superman's kid and he kicks and like rips through her stomach.

Overlap 1:14:50

Oh.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:14:51

Oh no.

Jay 1:14:54

Well, I mean Superman Stunned him you won't get this justice.

John Paul 1:15:05

Hey, superman symbol stands for hope.

Overlap 1:15:07

You better hope you don't die.

John Paul 1:15:20

You better hope you don't die.

Donte 1:15:25

You better hope they can fix your ass. You feel bad for the man because he probably knows. No, no, you gotta finish outside, damn.

Overlap 1:15:31

Now leads me to my second part of the question.

John Paul 1:15:35

When Hulk smashes, that's also brought up in Mallrats.

Jay 1:15:40

God damn it. I've seen that movie and it's like subconsciously coming out is everything green or like?

John Paul 1:15:49

does everything grow the thing, the thing is his thing is his junk made of rock yeah, yeah, but oh, did he ever?

Donte 1:16:01

did he ever have? No, because he did. He got turned. Ben got turned back to human one time, didn't he? He went back to human and he was able to have a kid.

Jay 1:16:09

Oh, you know, he was smashing for like a solid 48 hours when he turned back human Right.

John Paul 1:16:16

This is another random comic fun fact. The Thing and the Hulk meet up once a year to beat the shit out of each other because they're the only people that can hang with each other when it comes to taking damage.

Donte 1:16:32

He said I need to fight and Nova, freaking Hulk's like to fight Supernova. Is it Supernova? Yeah, Supernova.

John Paul 1:16:41

Yeah, until Century. I'm sorry.

Donte 1:16:44

He likes fighting.

John Paul 1:16:44

Century. Oh, I was gonna say until it was World War Hulk, and he beat the hell out of Nova.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:16:50

Which also is funny how Hulk's powers comes directly from hell. But we'll get on that later. I mean that's none of my business. That's none of my business at all.

John Paul 1:17:02

Funny how Constantine never brings that shit up. It ain't none of my business all.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:17:05

Funny how Constantine never brings that shit up. It ain't none of my business. He gonna beat my ass and beat everybody else.

Donte 1:17:10

Constantine, you've seen some shit. He, like you know.

John Paul 1:17:14

Does that make Bruce Banner Doomguy? No, he just gets angry and just starts destroying everything, and his power comes from hell.

Jay 1:17:25

No, because Doomguy is actually the grandson of BJ Blazkowicz from Wolfenstein. Oh, Jesus Christ.

Overlap 1:17:34

Stop it. Yes, he really is. Stop it Are you serious, that's canon.

Jay 1:17:40

That's canon, that's canon.

John Paul 1:17:45

Hold on. Does that mean that Doom takes place in a world where the Nazis were like in charge for a long time?

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:17:54

yeah, that would make perfect sense.

John Paul 1:17:56

Actually, that's great that changes so much of like the Doom lore you're welcome Also.

Jay 1:18:06

Canon. Doom guy is married to Isabella from Animal Crossing.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:18:16

Alright, that's another episode, you're welcome. Nope, nope, we gotta do this. Another episode. Nope, you're gonna have me. You're not putting me in a tizzy. It's canon, I'm episode, you're gonna have me. You're not putting me in a tizzy, I have enough.

Jay 1:18:25

You know how my age is.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:18:27

It's canon. I'm sorry.

Jay 1:18:28

They're married. You're welcome, that'll be another episode.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:18:33

Let's get back to the DC.

John Paul 1:18:37

You are not gonna play me in Swiss Borrow? I mean, Batman Hush was a great one.

Overlap 1:18:45

I mean, Batman Hush was a great one, you had the death of.

Jay 1:18:50

Superman, I love that hard steer back towards it Like it's so good.

Overlap 1:18:53

I really love how they did.

John Paul 1:18:55

Death of Superman and then the Reign of Superman.

Overlap 1:18:59

That's true, there's one thing I want to say that DC, dc has that it bothers me personally.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:19:08

Our strongest combatant or, I guess, our strongest hero in DC Superman you know what I'm saying.

John Paul 1:19:17

I mean arguable arguable.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:19:20

Of course, you got a couple of people that contend every now and again because due to like circumstances, or just they come in and out of the universe?

Jay 1:19:26

he's not really lobo's not relatively not stronger than superman.

John Paul 1:19:32

I mean every time they fight, batman puts him in his place because he had prep time and I love that I'm just saying that. That's what. I'm going to pause you right here. I refer I get into this argument all the time I refer to one moment in the comics.

Overlap 1:19:57

I believe it is.

John Paul 1:19:59

It's a Batman comic. I believe it's part of the Batman hush series where there's a point where poison ivy has essentially like taken over superman okay okay, batman shows up with uh catwoman.

John Paul 1:20:16

Okay, they're trying to catwoman's trying to find poison ivy. Batman's trying to distract uh superman. So super batman essentially kidnaps lois lane, takes her to the top of a building, trying to distract Superman. So Batman essentially kidnaps Lois Lane, takes her to the top of a building and throws her the fuck off and it snaps Superman out of his mind. Shit from Poison Ivy to go save Lois Lane. And at the end of the comic they ask him why did you do that? And he said deep down I know Clark is a good person and deep down I'm not.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:20:53

Ain't that deep. You beat everybody's ass every night.

John Paul 1:20:58

The problem comes that Batman is willing to do the things to win. Superman is the Boy Scout. He's not willing to do those things to win. Superman is the Boy Scout, he's not willing to do those things. Now you can have all these Elseworlds stories like injustice and things like that, but put regular Superman versus regular Batman. Every single time they fight, batman comes out on top.

Donte 1:21:22

Because Superman won't use his full power to because superman won't do it. He's just not that guy like and go back to injustice, like he punched a hole through. Joker like yo, you killed my wife. You're done, like you. There's no ifs, ands and buts about it, you know you killed my baby, so, but here's my problem, though.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:21:42

Here's my particular issue superman, and this is why I'm not a fan of Superman. Superman is weak-minded, and I'm going to say this why? Literally how many things have taken over Superman and turned him evil?

Donte 1:21:53

At least three. At least three.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:21:57

Thank you, Starro.

Donte 1:21:59

Mr Mix-a-pedalick Fucked with him for a long time. He's weak to magic.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:22:06

He's weak to magic. He's weak to so all these things. You're the most powerful being that we have, but everybody can tap into your shit. How often does Batman put it under hypnosis?

John Paul 1:22:15

Or put it into a stupor the last time someone put him under hypnosis, it activated Zoranar, which turned him more ruthless and psychotic. It's case like. So zuranar is a backup plan for batman, where, if he ever loses control of his body, he has subconsciously implanted a secondary uh personality. That's just a psycho.

Jay 1:22:41

I'm sorry, batman is just broken, okay, yeah he's a horrible human being. No, I meant like his character is just broken. It's OP.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:22:51

Oh yeah 100%. He basically attached himself from freaking Naruto. But I'm leaving that alone.

John Paul 1:22:56

The thing is their entire brand is built on Batman it's Detective Comics.

Superman's Powers and Weaknesses

Donte 1:23:03

I was gonna say I was gonna answer Tim's question about the Superman thing. There is one stupidly OP Superman out there and that's. Superboy Prime.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:23:13

Yes.

Donte 1:23:15

Remember, the reason I say that he's like the ultimate Superman is because he's from our universe. He's from here, this plane of existence, and he's been brought universe. He's from here, this plane of existence, and he's been brought into the DC universe, so he's not affected by Kryptonite or, you know, the Red Sons or anything like that so he's not.

Donte 1:23:35

he doesn't have the weaknesses of Superman. So when it took three Supermans that beat his ass and he was still handling them three on one, Like they had their freaking plot, armor was. They beat his ass all the way across the universe till they was able to beat him into the source wall and that's where he remained until the metal, the DC metal storyline happened.

Jay 1:24:03

I think you've just kind of pointed it out to me why the Marvel live action movies are so much better.

John Paul 1:24:11

You can't film that shit, you can't film that live action you say that, but the first Avengers movie was them fighting aliens invading from space through a wormhole that opened up in the middle of new york city in new york city, thank you.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:24:28

So, like the unfavorable, for some odd reason they can't put in the context. You can draw some intergalactic wild shit and give me depth through animation. When you try to make me believe it as a reality, they make it look so stupid and we lose focus of what we're really trying to be in. I'm a, I have nhd. I'm really bad at poking holes of things. I can see that's like bullshit. It's like, oh, you did a terrible job developing that. But when you put new york, okay, that gives me a little bit of grounding, that gives me reality, that gives me turf. That's what dc is great at, marvel not so much. They want to go fly off of the handle with a lot of shit and sometimes it's like, oh, we lose context, that I, I lose care that's what I just want to say, that marvel, though, we haven't lost context.

John Paul 1:25:09

in the big picture movie wise yeah which? But in dc big picture movie wise they have no way, they have no context of like, well, how do we show people in space? What do you? They've been doing it for fucking years, yeah.

Donte 1:25:27

Green.

John Paul 1:25:28

Lantern like. Granted, green Lantern was a flop, but majority of that movie had a fuck ton of space in it.

Donte 1:25:35

He is a space character he also had spandex suits too Like. Dc, you can do so. Okay, so back to.

John Paul 1:25:45

I have a quick comics question. And this is just so, everybody knows that Superman's suit comes from the blankets that were used to, like you know, send him to Earth, right? Where does the black suit come from? Didn't they make it no.

Donte 1:26:06

No, because of the shipmates we all love the black suit come from, didn't they make it? No?

John Paul 1:26:07

No, because of the ship we all love the black suit Superman after he's died and he's come back Dope looking suit. Where does it come from?

Donte 1:26:13

He gets it in the ship.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:26:16

Because that's what some of the yeah, somebody had it, because I think that's what the regular uniform was for their military, wasn't it?

Donte 1:26:23

Yeah, because what Zor-El had? Yeah, zor-el, that's Zor-El.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:26:32

Crazy motherfucker.

John Paul 1:26:33

Zed, no Zed, yeah, lord Zed.

Overlap 1:26:35

Zed yeah, lord.

John Paul 1:26:35

Zed the Power Rangers.

Donte 1:26:37

Not that Zed, not that one.

Overlap 1:26:40

No but, yeah, it's Zod, it's not. Thank you, general.

Donte 1:26:44

Well, yeah, on the station On their ship.

Jay 1:26:47

I was wondering Let me burn, yeah, I'm sitting here, just wondering how long this shit's going to go on for. I'm going to wait.

Donte 1:26:54

Don't let us burn. Yeah, but the suit were black. It's on the ship Like know was brought back to life. He got it from.

John Paul 1:27:04

He got well, like the blue beetle show. Uh, our movie did a great job at doing like it was really you know fantastical things it was great.

Donte 1:27:12

That was a great movie. Like I like that character, like that character was is a recent, recently new character. I think what in the tens?

John Paul 1:27:20

I mean I mean Suicide Squad. They had Starro, they did. I'm saying like and those were.

Jay 1:27:29

TV shows why?

Donte 1:27:31

do they have movies? Suicide Squad was a movie, oh yeah no, that one was a movie.

Jay 1:27:35

But why do the majority of their movies.

John Paul 1:27:37

Only Beetle was a movie. It was just a short movie. Yeah, straight to the century, it would have been straight to TV been straight.

Jay 1:27:43

I'm just saying you've named off two though that were good because I okay, okay, I see, I see why.

Donte 1:27:48

So the reason I think my theory is this it's like all right, you got james gunn who's in charge of the dc movie universe. Now I guess you can say well, yeah now yeah.

Donte 1:28:01

so before, like if you, when you did your own standalone movie like a Blue Beetle standalone movie yeah it was. You know you made a good movie. You're just Blue Beetle and whoever, maybe somebody might show up, maybe not, you never know, it's just a Blue Beetle movie. Same thing with Suicide Squad 8. Suicide Squad 8, you're going on a mission, go fuck shit up and hopefully you might not die, but you're probably going to die. That's why it's called a suicide mission. It's a standalone thing. But when you try to do the whole Batman, wonder Woman, Superman and we're going to combine them to make them the Justice League.

John Paul 1:28:38

I want the Justice League Space Center.

Donte 1:28:42

Just give me the Hall of Justice first. True.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:28:46

Technically they did have that when.

John Paul 1:28:50

I mean the CW-verse. Yeah, the.

Jay 1:28:52

CW. I'm talking about the movies. Why do the movies suck so bad?

Donte 1:28:56

Because there was no.

John Paul 1:28:59

I said it once, I'll say it again the reason why is because they have no direction up until now.

Donte 1:29:04

And DCWB did the whole Ford model of managing 35 committees to make one decision.

John Paul 1:29:13

And, honestly, as much as we love the Snyder Cut, if we could have all Snyder cuts I would not complain if you told me every DC movie that comes out will now be four hours long. No, I'm being so for real though, because A that man should only make four hour long movies, because look what he did. It was so much story in that movie, so much story that when Whedon came through we didn't have a clue what was going on. And then come to find out there was a fully fleshed out story going on.

John Paul 1:30:07

A whole fleshed out story going on a whole flesh out story, like it really multiple story lines coming back and dovetailing like it's playing, while we randomly ended up in like uh, eastern european village, like why are we here? You know, starter cut explain how we got here, you know so like if you came and told me like every DC movie from now on is going to be like Zack Snyder is going to be in charge of the universe and every movie is going to be four hours long, I would be like great when do we start?

Donte 1:30:44

and how they introduce, like you didn't go back and just do origin after origin after origin either yeah, but like fuck it, dude, we don't need.

John Paul 1:30:52

I don't need to see Batman's parents dying for the 50th time yeah, right what are you talking?

Jay 1:30:57

about.

Donte 1:30:57

We've seen Uncle Ben die a hundred times bro, if I see those pearls fall one more time or freaking spaceship crashing in Earth and shit, like we already know, bro, if I see those pearls fall one more time, one more time. Or a freaking spaceship crashing in Earth and shit.

Jay 1:31:11

Like we already know we're this deep, Just tell us. I will say this about the new Spider-Mans with Tom Holland Thank you for not making us fucking sit through Uncle Ben dying again.

John Paul 1:31:21

Dramatic enough and personal opinion. I know this is probably going to get me clowned on personal opinion. A lot of people clown the scene. I don't think it's that bad. The Martha scene. Because, it is one of those things that it's never really brought up. Both of their mothers are named Martha. Like it's never really brought up, but like both of their mothers are named Martha, yeah okay like it's never brought up but here's my problem, so make it a pivotal point like

John Paul 1:31:52

said like randomly because, let's be real, if you're in the middle of a fight and someone said protect your mom, and said her by like her name, first name, you'd be like hold up. What the fuck did you just say yeah how do you know my mom's name?

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:32:06

exactly, and that's what happens but, but it's so dumb, yeah, but that's a real life situation.

Jay 1:32:16

Oh yeah, a real life situation is a guy in an exosuit fighting a fucking alien very real. I'm so glad you brought that up. Thank you for grounding me.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:32:27

Okay, ridley. Honestly, what bothers me more than anything is, like the real reason for those two fighting in that particular premise was dumb Batman should have never got coaxed into that fight at all. That's stupid.

Jay 1:32:38

Batman killed a lot of people in that movie.

John Paul 1:32:42

So from what I've heard, so from what I've heard, so from what I've heard in the things that did get cut from the Snyder version, evidently there's evidently a moment or it was either that, or from the Batman v Superman there's a moment where Batman essentially cucks Superman.

Overlap 1:33:03

What he?

John Paul 1:33:03

essentially fucks Lois Lane, and superman is watching from outside like with his x-ray vision yeah, like that was supposed to be the thing, that like set them off lois.

Jay 1:33:17

No, don't take that bad justice did he have a chair with him? Did he have a chair?

John Paul 1:33:24

with him. Yeah, but there was no corner to put it in.

Donte 1:33:29

That ain't right. Can you imagine that in a scene that's in a theater? There's no way that's real.

Jay 1:33:32

There's no way.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:33:35

That might be rule 34.

John Paul 1:33:38

You say that like there's not actual footage of Nicolas Cage in a Superman costume, so like let's not say it's not real.

Jay 1:33:47

I mean, we did finally get it.

John Paul 1:33:50

I have seen that glorious mullet on Superman.

Jay 1:33:57

I mean we did kind of get Nick Cage as Superman.

Overlap 1:34:05

God.

John Paul 1:34:05

I would pay so much money for that movie to never be made. I would pay so much money for that movie to be made.

Overlap 1:34:12

I don't know if you're familiar with our show, but we're kind of fans.

Jay 1:34:18

He's got his own category.

John Paul 1:34:19

As much as I love Nicolas Cage, one thing I don't need him being is the symbol of peace and justice.

Donte 1:34:28

Well, he was a symbol of justice.

Jay 1:34:29

Why he's about to be Spider-Man Noir.

John Paul 1:34:33

See, that's great. That makes more sense, which I'll be honest, a lot of people are not prepared for Spider-Man Noir Like.

Overlap 1:34:39

Spider-Man Noir kills people.

Jay 1:34:41

I'm just thinking he's going to be. I'm to say they're going to think he's all like happy-go-lucky and shit and it's like nah.

Donte 1:34:47

I would like to remind everyone that Nick Cage was all about justice as the Ghost Rider. Yeah, forget about that.

John Paul 1:34:56

He was dishing out justice. He did pee fire in that movie. See.

Jay 1:35:01

Ghost Rider was cinematic.

Overlap 1:35:03

That is amazing.

Donte 1:35:04

Ghost Rider was cinematic more you need so let's not act like you know, nick Cage, can't you know, go out there and dispense some justice?

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:35:15

I wouldn't want to see him as Superman for one reason because Superman always kind of just like he. How do I say he's tender? No, I can't do that. No, I am too good to do that. I believe in the good things.

Jay 1:35:31

I don't care.

Donte 1:35:31

I need to see Nick Cage as Superman like can you imagine this scene that Justice League is about to roll out but Superman is like hold on, and he puts on low rider, and you know they're sitting there, y'all getting hyped up and he's like hold on.

Overlap 1:35:45

He puts on Lowrider. They're sitting there getting hyped up. He's like let's go.

Donte 1:35:49

Everybody just jumps out of the watchtower.

Overlap 1:35:54

They're all getting into the invisible jet and they're playing Lowrider.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:35:59

Lowrider.

Donte 1:36:02

Wonder Woman's up there flying. Everybody else is nodding their head and like, yeah, feeling this getting hype, I don't care.

Jay 1:36:11

I fucking love Nick Cage and I need to see Nick Cage as Superman, not CGI. Nick Cage Superman.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:36:18

Right.

Jay 1:36:20

I need full-blown Nick Cage cinematic masterpiece Superman.

John Paul 1:36:26

Who plays the Batman opposite of that Superman.

Overlap 1:36:34

Why not?

Jay 1:36:36

why don't we just make it face-off, but DC.

John Paul 1:36:40

I swear to God, if we put Travolta as Batman, I take it back. I want that movie. Travolta Batman. Oh my God. If we put Travolta as Batman, I take it back. I want that movie.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:36:46

Travolta, Batman, oh my God yes, travolta. Batman. Travolta, now I want now Travolta, so bald head Travolta.

John Paul 1:36:57

Bald head beer guy oh my God.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:37:01

So that's old man Batman. Now give me Clooney, give me Clooney.

Donte 1:37:04

So that's Old man Batman. Give me Clooney.

John Paul 1:37:09

You want Clooney still, so he can look at you with the eyebrows, but the thing is it has to be filmed. The same way Face Off was filmed, when you give them a script and they go. I'm just going to improvise all my stuff.

Marvel Characters and Universe Limitations

Jay 1:37:24

So we get John Woo.

John Paul 1:37:26

We get John Woo. John Woo's not in control.

Donte 1:37:34

We're going to film the ending scene first. They're sitting and diving. You can see a Toronto Batman diving, throwing batarangs at dogs flying by. Slow motion batarangs at dogs flying by. Slow motion batarangs Grappling hook.

Jay 1:37:54

We have gone down a rabbit hole.

John Paul 1:37:57

We have. We're a little off track.

Donte 1:37:59

It just shows, how great DC is.

Jay 1:38:00

Welcome to the show. Again, I'm trying to point out how great DC is.

Donte 1:38:05

You can take these ideas and'm like yo in a dc universe.

Jay 1:38:08

Yeah, until we get to the movies I feel like we're gonna need to do a whole second episode just for marvel because we've just been glazing the shit out of dc because we're all fans like marvel would be like 10 minutes whoa, whoa, whoa

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:38:24

I wouldn't say it's 10 minutes.

Overlap 1:38:25

Now we're being a little overreached now. Yeah, I may be a DC fanboy.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:38:31

When I'm a DC fanboy but at the same time Marvel has a lot of things to offer. They just can't do animated anywhere near as great as DC and I feel like their stories in comparison sometimes can be hollow, it can be shallow, I should should say, in comparison to the depth that you get from dc. Like you go, you go through, true, like emotional discord dealing with dc marvel, like, oh, I'm a little sad, oh, here comes the happy. Yep, there we go.

John Paul 1:38:54

Time that there's a reason for that. Where a lot of dc's characters are normal people who ascend to some kind of position, Superman is an exception. In Marvel, it's a lot of god-tier people lowering down to help the mortal man. You have Thor and you've got these people with these crazy powers we're talking about.

Jay 1:39:27

Captain America started as a normal guy.

John Paul 1:39:30

Yeah, he's the one guy.

Jay 1:39:34

Tony Stark normal dude. No, first of all, he doesn't have any powers. His power is the exact same power as Bruce Wayne's money. No, no, no, no, no, no, he doesn't have any powers.

John Paul 1:39:44

His power is the exact same power as Bruce Wayne's Money. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, he doesn't know any martial arts. First of all, Iron man has an intelligence that is insane. It may not be super human.

Jay 1:40:01

So does Stephen.

John Paul 1:40:01

Hawking.

Jay 1:40:02

So is.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:40:04

Boom Girlking. So is Boom Girl and Devil Dinosaur, but we'll get on that later.

Donte 1:40:08

I mean you gotta remember Tony Hawk is part of Illuminati too.

John Paul 1:40:14

He is.

Jay 1:40:16

Did you say Tony?

Donte 1:40:16

Hawk, tony Stark.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:40:19

That's what I was gonna say. Kid Flippin got something to do with it.

Jay 1:40:23

More Tony.

Overlap 1:40:24

Hawks sitting there going wait what.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:40:27

So, here's what we're thinking about.

John Paul 1:40:29

Here's what we're thinking about sending the Hulk to a different planet. What do you think, Tony Hawk?

Donte 1:40:36

Will you please?

John Paul 1:40:37

stop doing 900s.

Donte 1:40:40

Yeah, let's do it.

Jay 1:40:42

Why do y'all keep coming to me.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:40:45

Not even just that he finds out. It's like so now outside Dante's house is going to be a bunch of people with skateboards, beating to death Like Tony.

Jay 1:40:52

Hawk's going to show up to my house and he's going to be like, hey, is John Paul home? And I'm going to be like sure. And I'm just going to hear him getting smacked over the head with a fucking skateboard. You know too much, bitch.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:41:04

Ah, ah, why the truck's so hard, Ah.

John Paul 1:41:08

Loose the book Ah.

Donte 1:41:11

I'll play kick push in the background. Coast, kick push, coast.

Jay 1:41:17

And he's just gonna roll out of here and be like bye, tony Hawk.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:41:23

Only you can stay alive.

John Paul 1:41:24

Iron man does not have, like normal people, intelligence, like he is one of the three smartest people in the entire Marvel Universe, like that man is not normal okay and if I shot him without a? Suit he would die sorry, that's very true, but if we're talking about intelligence, you're saying that, like he can't create a suit out of fucking paper clips and rocks in the middle of the desert he did it in a cave he did it in a cave if you shot him in the head, yeah, you might have a chance yeah, but if you shot a lot of people in the head, you'd have a chance.

Donte 1:42:04

Yeah, but if you shoot you shot a lot of people in the head, you'd have a chance. Yeah. But if you shoot Tony Stark in the chest, I mean, his freaking nanosuit's gonna come in and stop it.

Jay 1:42:11

So I mean, you shoot Superman, nothing's gonna happen. You shoot Tony Stark, he's dead.

Overlap 1:42:18

Yeah, you shoot.

Jay 1:42:18

Black.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:42:19

Widow, she's dead.

Jay 1:42:20

Yeah, shoot him in the head. There's another normal person you shoot.

John Paul 1:42:24

Captain America, you shoot the Green Lantern in the face he's dead.

Donte 1:42:28

No, no, no, Captain can take a bullet or two, he can survive. Captain can take a bullet or two.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:42:33

I don't know if he can take a bullet. He wears helmets.

John Paul 1:42:37

He does wear helmets.

Jay 1:42:41

I mean, I'm just saying you say there's all these extraordinary people, but the vast majority of them, with the exception of Bruce Banner and Thor, are pretty much dudes.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:42:55

You know what? And also, this is another thing that got me too, Do you?

Jay 1:42:58

guys know about Moon Girl and Devil Dinosaur. That's a neutral term. Fuck y'all.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:43:02

True? Do y'all know about Moon Girl and Devil Dinosaur?

Jay 1:43:05

Nope, tell us about it?

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:43:06

Uh-uh, there's a full-blown show that they ended that you need to watch. It is brilliant, it is. And her brain on and this is canon. She is smarter than Tony Stark. She is the most intelligent being in all of Marvel freaking universe Brilliant. Which caveat she is the most intelligent being in all of Marvel universe brilliant.

John Paul 1:43:28

The true smartest person is Reed Richards.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:43:33

I think they said that she was a competition with Reed Richards.

John Paul 1:43:35

To be honest with you, I believe she is in competition, but he is the smartest as of.

Jay 1:43:40

I mean to be fair. It doesn't matter, squirtle can 1v1, all of them DC or Marvel. I mean Squirtle has beat Thanos. So I mean to be fair, it doesn't matter, squirrel Girl can 1v1, all of them DC or Marvel.

Donte 1:43:46

I mean, squirrel Girl has beaten Thanos. So I mean Okay, wait.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:43:50

Accidentally. If I say that's a full-blown accident, don't you dare put that into play.

John Paul 1:43:55

That's the thing you can't put, I'm sorry. As much as I love the idea of a parody character like Squirrel Girl being someone who beat Thanos, you can't put an accident as a win, Right.

Donte 1:44:10

What did the greatest street racer ever say A win's a win Rather by an inch or a mile, a win's a win and family.

John Paul 1:44:21

You know what he also said? You never had me, you never had your, you never had your call.

Donte 1:44:27

So in the unbeatable squirrel girl, a win is a win. She has beaten Thanos, that's what we're sticking by.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:44:37

That's where we're at. A win is a win.

Donte 1:44:39

A win is a win there you go Decker. See.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:44:46

I'm going to just let that Y'all do that which I won't.

John Paul 1:44:50

I'd just like to note this man dismantled Wolverine. This man turned a superhero into a pile of cubes. Yep, he did it with a gun. Right, he put a fucking ball around Cyclops' head that bounced his beam around and blew his own head off.

Donte 1:45:15

And y'all were like how did Squirrel Girl?

John Paul 1:45:18

can legitimately beat him. We didn't say she did.

Donte 1:45:23

She just won. She won her battle, so I mean I mean hey, everybody when they inch by a mile. If he slips and, you know, crack his head on the luminal tile, he dies.

John Paul 1:45:40

I'm just saying if I show up to a fight and right as we square up, the guy has a heart attack, that's not a win.

Jay 1:45:51

That's a win.

Overlap 1:45:53

That's a default.

Donte 1:45:55

If we're playing Halo and I see you about to do an execution and I shoot him, hey, that kills counts for me, yoink Remember that, by the way, he does that're playing Halo and I disconnect.

John Paul 1:46:06

You're the worst kind of person.

Overlap 1:46:09

But if we're playing Halo and I disconnect.

John Paul 1:46:12

That doesn't mean you beat me.

Donte 1:46:14

I won. It's on my record. It's a loss on your record, it's on your account, just because the game ended doesn't mean it was fair, hey step your internet up. Don't disconnect. It's on.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:46:23

It doesn't mean it was fair. Hey, step your internet up, don't disconnect. This ought to own you. This ought to own your cow, this ought to own. How dare you? Yeah, don't disconnect. I just want to point out that in all the universes in my

Jay 1:46:34

head the way Thanos really died in Endgame was Ant-Man shrunk down, crawled up his butthole and then expanded in his head, and this is why, we can't

John Paul 1:46:45

have nice shit in the hood.

Donte 1:46:48

You just watch the boys and you're like, yeah, that's how they should have won.

Jay 1:46:54

He didn't crawl up his butthole, he crawled up the other hole.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:46:58

Hey, I'm not living through that again right now.

Overlap 1:47:00

Yeah, let's not.

Jay 1:47:04

This show is not PG. My guy, I will lie that scene definitely traumatized me. You, I was like oh God, no, and that wasn't his butt. He crawled up.

Donte 1:47:15

What makes it even great is the deaths that you get in the show. We still got some way worse ones in the comics. It's like jeez, oh yeah, yo. Everybody's like jeez like yo like oh, this is crazy. Like they didn't even do the private jet.

Jay 1:47:32

I have a question the boys is that even part of the DC or Marvel universe? Nope, no, it's independent. Oh it's independent really neat much like Invincible.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:47:43

Oh, it's independent.

Jay 1:47:44

Really.

Overlap 1:47:45

Yeah, Huh neat.

Jay 1:47:46

Good for the home party, yeah Much like Invincible yeah, invincible Preacher, yeah just a lot of.

Donte 1:48:00

Let's lose confidence. Man, I like going up. When I go to the comic book shop, I always check out the independent section. You're going to get some awesome stuff.

John Paul 1:48:07

I will throw this out there as well. The Lego stuff Bangers Every time Not canon Granted. The Lego, batmans, the Lego, especially the shows, the games, always great, they're hilarious. Oh, I can't complain.

Donte 1:48:31

Superman threw Batman up in front of the moon.

John Paul 1:48:38

Oh, they have fun in those, they really do.

Jay 1:48:42

They are great.

X-Men and Marvel's Missed Opportunities

John Paul 1:48:43

One of my favorite moments. It was I think it was Lego Batman 2. At one point Killer Croc hurls a sewer cover, a manhole cover, and it just straight up decapitates Robin, and then he catches his head and he puts it back on. But I like to think of it as like what, if it was the real world? Killer Croc just killed that kid.

Donte 1:49:12

And now he has to go to Arkham and rehabilitate him.

Jay 1:49:16

I will point out that I'm very surprised that Batman has not been put in jail for child endangerment.

John Paul 1:49:22

Oh, if they knew who he was, they definitely would.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:49:26

Because them kids throw hands too. Don't tell them my daddy Bing bing bing.

Donte 1:49:31

It's kind of how it goes man.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:49:34

It's going to happen.

Donte 1:49:36

Hell, even Damien, like shit, Damien, like yo I'm with you, pops. They want to take you in.

John Paul 1:49:41

We'll fight them all Damien's like just say the word I'll straight up murder them, I'll take the whole GCF out and go.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:49:51

Murderer, and I loved it. Don't kill, but, daddy, that's what I was trained to do. It's like what I'm best at.

Jay 1:50:00

Ask mama, you don't even know me, do you? What is this? You act like you don't even know me, do you Wait? What is this?

Overlap 1:50:06

Act like you don't, know my mama, what are we doing here?

Donte 1:50:09

When they send him to the Teen Titans, he's like I'm still trying to kill them. I'm like, no, you can't. That's my granddaddy. I'll be honest.

John Paul 1:50:18

When they announced that Batman was going to have a kid, I was like I'm not really into this we that Batman was going to have a kid.

Jay 1:50:27

I was like I'm not really into this. We've got enough Robins.

John Paul 1:50:30

And then they introduced him he said we've got enough Robins, we do dog. I was like let's move on from the Robin thing.

Donte 1:50:34

Matter of fact. Yeah, we're supposed to be getting another Robin, aren't we?

John Paul 1:50:38

Technically, so hold on. So we have Dick Grayson. Jason Todd, yep, yep on. So we have dick grayson.

Overlap 1:50:45

you know, jason todd, yeah, yep, um I can no, I can never remember his name drake, tim drake, that's it.

John Paul 1:50:52

Uh, damien stephanie, stephanie brown, yep yep uh, then we have the one who became robin for a short time and then became spoiler oh, uh, oh.

Jay 1:51:07

There was the one who became Robin for a short time and then became Spoiler. Oh, there was the one girl too, from Batman in the future, when he's like old man Batman.

John Paul 1:51:13

Yeah. I can't remember her name either.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:51:15

We've had a lot of Robins. Spoiler was Stephanie Brown, I think.

John Paul 1:51:21

Okay, then that's the one I'm thinking of before. That, then was the one I'm thinking of before. That then was the one from um, when he's super old and it's the girl who's got like the red hair yeah, that's the one I was talking about oh, for some reason I thought you were talking about from batman beyond no I was talking about from like Hold on.

Donte 1:51:47

The one where he beats the shit out of Superman. Was it Helena Wayne?

John Paul 1:51:52

No, it was done by I can't remember his name now. He did Spawn. I think it was Carrie.

Jay 1:52:01

Carrie Kelly.

John Paul 1:52:04

Which honestly wasn't.

Jay 1:52:04

Great Robin Frank Miller. That's what it was, carrie, which honestly was a great Robin. Frank Miller trilogy.

John Paul 1:52:08

Frank Miller, that's what it was. Duke Thomas, when they announced him I was like, but then he started his whole thing of like I really want to just murder people and Batman being like kid, you've got to calm down.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:52:28

But it'd be so easy. Just give me two seconds, Dad.

John Paul 1:52:32

I don't understand the problem. We'd have no crime if you would just let me kill them.

Overlap 1:52:39

Also I'd like to point out do not shit on Batman Beyond.

Jay 1:52:42

That is one of the greatest shows ever.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:52:45

Whoever has beef with Batman Beyond has beef with me, because I'm like to point out do not shit on Batman Beyond. That is one of the greatest shows ever. Whoever has beef with Batman Beyond has beef with me, because I'm gonna tell you something, terry McGinnis.

John Paul 1:52:49

I mean, my dog is literally named after a character from that show.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:52:54

What's your dog name?

John Paul 1:52:56

10. Like the number 10 from the Royal Flesh.

Donte 1:52:58

Gang. I knew exactly what you were saying. The.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:53:02

Royal Flesh Gang was solid, by the way.

Jay 1:53:04

Solid.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:53:07

They were solid like bad guy troop. Anyway, and honestly, I'm waiting for a Batman Beyond game to come out or a movie, but once again, one of my favorite games.

John Paul 1:53:16

I'll chase this game to the end of the earth. It wasn't a Batman Beyond game, but it was a Batman game for the Xbox called Batman Rise of Senzu. Oh Senzu, no, no, no, I think it was called Rise of Senzu.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:53:31

Senzu. Oh okay, no, I don't know.

John Paul 1:53:34

And it was all about like this like some, I've never heard of this villain before, but that game was so good. Oh, I could talk about classic Xbox games for a fucking year.

Donte 1:53:48

You know I'm going to add one more caveat to the whole Robin thing, Did you? Know, Staru's son, Jaru, was a Robin.

John Paul 1:53:57

Oh yeah 100%. I didn't know, that which, by the way, Jaro is just a Starro that they put into a jar.

Donte 1:54:09

He even had a little Robin suit on and everything.

John Paul 1:54:12

Yeah.

Donte 1:54:12

Terrible. Yeah, he even he's like he uh feels that Bruce Wayne, well Batman is his dad, because he's so infatuated with him. He's like yeah.

Overlap 1:54:23

Bruce Wayne.

Donte 1:54:23

He's like Batman's my dad, he'll do anything for Batman. He's wrecking shop against the Legion of Doom. So, yeah, that's another Robin right there.

Overlap 1:54:37

I love you, daddy.

Donte 1:54:38

I got very.

John Paul 1:54:42

Squid Billy vibes from that.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:54:47

I was thinking about the kid from Shrek who said Do the roar. I love you, daddy. Do the roar.

Donte 1:55:01

Matt McGinnis was a Robin McGinnis, so apparently he was was a Robin.

Jay 1:55:05

McGinnis so apparently.

Donte 1:55:09

I'm sitting here looking at the DC database and it said Matthew McGinnis featuring oh, that's Terry's brother, yeah, the younger brother of Terry.

Jay 1:55:16

McGinnis oh, I forgot about him. Same everybody did.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:55:22

I mean, I definitely forgot, I ain't gonna lie dude.

Jay 1:55:23

I was like you're not important to me.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:55:25

Yeah Same, everybody did. I mean I did. I ain't gonna lie, dude, I was like you're not important to me.

Overlap 1:55:30

What do you mean?

John Paul 1:55:32

There's multiple storylines involving his brother getting kidnapped.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:55:35

Yeah, that's what I'm saying, Not important. You keep getting kidnapped, do better Stop getting kidnapped. Fight back, shoot Bite somebody. He's a child. You can shoot yourself. Fight back, shoot Bite somebody. He's a child. You can shoot yourself. You can change places.

John Paul 1:55:50

You can get kidnapped and shit yourself.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:55:53

Mudslide, you two One time. Get on out of here, hey mudslide. Tell me it's not super effective oh fuck oh. Tell me it's not super effective.

Donte 1:56:12

Do we have anything else we need to discuss?

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:56:18

Empty bowels no jutsu, Slip and slide. Oh, he's wearing shorts.

John Paul 1:56:26

Earthwall jutsu let go of my purse that's my purse. I don't know you remember kids. If they're trying to take you shit yourself so I think what we've really established here is that the DC universe is amazing and maybe one day we'll talk about the Marvel universe yeah, we're gonna have to like re-fucking is that the DC universe is amazing and maybe one day we'll talk about the Marvel universe.

Jay 1:56:45

Yeah, we're going to have to like re-fucking name this fucking episode to DC Glazing Episode and like, do a second episode where we talk about Marvel and no, it won't be five minutes. Fuck you, dante.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:57:00

I said ten minutes. This was Bordelon's love letter to DC, to be honest.

Jay 1:57:05

Well, well, they have so many good well, tell them to make a good fucking movie beetle uh batman green animated.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:57:13

They have good like interesting characters yeah, they got.

Donte 1:57:18

They just came late to the whole. Let's make a shared universe, movie universe, like when marvel was creating. So wb's all like, hey, we gotta do the same thing, but they didn't have a plan like you don't like a dc like they have. Like so many villains, like you can't really make them like one a big bad, like what brainiac like your big bad is brainiac and you, you gotta, somehow you got.

Jay 1:57:43

Brainiac you got, lobo you got.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:57:47

Lobo's not really a villain, a bad guy. He's more of like an anti-hero.

Donte 1:57:51

He's a bounty.

Jay 1:57:54

We are bad guys, but we are not bad guys.

Donte 1:58:00

There we go, he gets it.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:58:01

He's like Dog the Bounty Hunter.

John Paul 1:58:03

Don't use Dog the Bounty Hunter. That's what he is. I'll be honest. The problem with a DC live action is, if you wanted a villain, you either have to go to those weird extremes of like Brainiac or even like they tried to do Steppenwolf For the flash and the CW-verse did it the best with the flash and the reverse.

John Paul 1:58:24

Or even, like they tried to do Steppenwolf For the Flash, like, and the CW-verse did it the best with the Flash and the reverse Flash and all that stuff they did phenomenal. Why can't we move that into the live-action movies? Because that would allow us to have those wonderful over-the-top villains. You know, we had Gorilla Grodd, we had, was it Man-Shark?

Donte 1:58:49

Mantis.

John Paul 1:58:51

No, no, no, King Shark, king Shark. Yeah, that's what it was, man-shark.

Donte 1:58:59

I'm sorry.

John Paul 1:59:00

You say that, like there's not literally a character called Man-Bat, that's a valid argument yeah you got me there. In the comic Batman there's Man-Bat. Okay. What's one of Spider-Man's villains' name, the Lizard? Okay.

Jay 1:59:21

The Red Skull.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 1:59:24

Just on the nose, like some of these people really not original

Jay 1:59:32

who needs those oh god you want to go break out my book of of what was it called. It was like really bad heroes or something. Unfortunately named heroes or something. Yeah, there was one that was powered by cocaine. I think, everyone's powered by that. No, I mean, he had like superpowers with cocaine.

DC's Complex Character Development

John Paul 2:00:00

I will say that takes me real quick to Ultraman, the man who, uh, from the crime syndicate, whose entire gimmick is he snorts kryptonite and that gives him superpowers. Oh damn, when he, when he, when he shows up, he collects all the kryptonite on earth and he's just like he's walking around, just like crushing it and like snorting it.

Overlap 2:00:44

Just doing bumps of fucking sidewalk.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:00:47

Damn, you look old. I'm going to crush this up real quick, Damn bitch, you got old Again.

Donte 2:00:59

We drift back to DC, because DC is more interesting, more better.

John Paul 2:01:02

Well, I mean, if you want to talk Marvel I can, but we're already at four hours, Right.

Donte 2:01:09

We're listeners right now.

John Paul 2:01:13

I could talk for hours on Venom and how Venom's character is so complex, or Deadpool actually being a really deep character, as opposed to the lighthearted nonsense people think.

Overlap 2:01:25

He really is.

Donte 2:01:27

Yeah, coming. Deadpool is awesome, or how.

John Paul 2:01:30

Spider-Man gave Mary Jane cancer because of them having sex.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:01:35

Because he was giving her the blue rabbit indigo wing. And next thing, you know Next.

John Paul 2:01:40

thing you know, or how Rocket Raccoon doesn't know what raccoons are. What the hell is a raccoon. I do love that fact.

Jay 2:01:49

That tickles me pink.

John Paul 2:01:51

He's an alien, he's not a raccoon.

Jay 2:01:55

He is a raccoon.

John Paul 2:01:56

He's not a raccoon, he's an alien.

Jay 2:02:00

If not raccoon, then why raccoon shaped?

John Paul 2:02:04

I don't know Venom's an alien. If not human, then why raccoon-shaped? I don't know Venom's an alien. If not human, why human-shape?

Donte 2:02:10

I mean.

Jay 2:02:14

Fair, he takes shape of what he's covered.

John Paul 2:02:17

Yeah, I mean Venom really Groot is a tree. Why not tree-shape? He is tree-shape, no he's not. What tree has legs, arms and a head and eyes? The?

Jay 2:02:30

trees along the rivers here in Florida.

Donte 2:02:32

That in.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:02:34

I think you're on the wrong side of the neighborhood, sir, yeah.

John Paul 2:02:37

Do trees have eyes? Trees have eyes. That's the new horror movie.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:02:43

Not going there.

Jay 2:02:44

Do all the trees, not have eyes.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:02:46

Sir.

Jay 2:02:47

I new horror movie.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:02:47

And Shrek, I'm not going there. Are y'all's trees not? Have eyes, sir. I think those are coyotes.

Donte 2:02:51

The hills have eyes.

John Paul 2:02:52

The trees are talking to me.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:02:54

I don't go there either.

Jay 2:02:57

No, we're not doing that joke.

Overlap 2:02:58

No.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:03:03

We'll leave that right there. Yeah, don't they have?

Donte 2:03:06

I mean, no, we'll leave that right there. Yeah, like, don't they have like walking talking trees in like the talking verse? Yeah, called Ents. See, there's your talking trees Walking talking trees.

Overlap 2:03:19

Yeah, that was.

John Paul 2:03:20

Lord of the Rings. That was like what 1905?

Jay 2:03:23

Right First off. There's only one trilogy and it's not of the Rings. That was like what 1905? Right First off. There's only one trilogy, and it's not of the ring, it's fucking Star Wars.

Donte 2:03:34

Batman series.

John Paul 2:03:35

There's only one return, and it's not of the king, it's of the Jedi.

Donte 2:03:39

It's of the Batman. Thank you.

Jay 2:03:41

Thank you very much. I completely fucked that line all to hell, and I appreciate you going ahead and saving that I was going to mess with you about it later.

John Paul 2:03:47

Oh, come on, that was three movies about fucking walking.

Overlap 2:03:52

Here's the first movie.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:03:56

Here's the second movie and here's the third movie you guys like to walk too. I like putting on my hokas and going along with this.

John Paul 2:04:04

I made a nerd vomit.

Donte 2:04:07

I have never watched the Halo Lord of the Rings movie and I was on a ship in the middle of the ocean with nowhere to go. And I still didn't watch that shit because I fell asleep every time that shit was on so I tried to.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:04:20

I've watched like two of them and, to be honest with you, I was drunk both times.

Donte 2:04:23

What's up?

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:04:23

I've watched like two of them and, to be honest with you, I was drawn to both times.

Donte 2:04:25

What's up? That might be the sign for us to wrap this shit up.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:04:28

Yep Might be right on that one. All right, john, I want to thank you for being on the show tonight.

Jay 2:04:35

Do you want to plug anything? Your Instagram, your SoundCloud, anything?

John Paul 2:04:41

Not particularly. I don't have music anywhere anymore.

Donte 2:04:46

Uh, eventually I probably will uh twitch your subreddit follow me on things at king static og say it one more time for the kids in the back king static og there you go. Hey, look for that name, tim. You got any last words for us?

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:05:08

uh. Thank you once again for having me on the show. Guys appreciate you. Also, if you've known me by my handle, I'm big king kuma. You catch me on twitch, uh, and it's all the same title twitch, tiktok, so on, so forth. I have video games that I like to do. Also, I'm a up-and-coming voice actor. If you got some scripts you need to hear, bring your character's life, let me me know. Once again, I'm here, baby, check me out.

Donte 2:05:26

Jay any last words.

Jay 2:05:28

Hey, I'm a guy who talks about dumb shit on a podcast. Reach for the clicker.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:05:37

He streams too.

Jay 2:05:39

On occasion. It's very rare that I stream. If I do stream, you can either catch me oh damn, I can't remember my fucking twitch name, damn.

John Paul 2:05:48

Come on, you got it. His twitch name is also KingStaticOG.

Donte 2:05:55

Oh you fucking bastard Got him.

Overlap 2:06:00

Got him.

Donte 2:06:02

Oh shit, oh man. And I am your host, dante, with the final words here. You got him. Oh shit, oh man. And I am your host, dante, with the final words here. And I want to thank everybody for staying here as long as you can, to the end of this DC Glaze Fest, because, you know, dc just shows that they're better in everything but movies.

John Paul 2:06:21

Well, I disagree. Some of the comics are good, like DC, just ah, I remember my twitches, everything but movies.

Jay 2:06:26

I disagree Some of the comics are good. Ah, I remember my Twitch is sfsarge21.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:06:32

I literally just looked it up and was about to say it. If you didn't Say it one more time, I would not let you do this.

Jay 2:06:38

You can follow me on Twitch at sfsarge21. That's Sierra Foxtrot, sierra, alpha Romeo Golf Echo 21. I'm Sierra Foxtrot, sierra, alpha Romeo Golf Echo 21. I'm off in advance.

John Paul 2:06:50

In post. You can put King Statico G there, right? Yeah, we got you, or me.

Tim "Big King Kuma" 2:06:55

King Kuma.

Jay 2:06:59

You can also follow our joint Twitch DFYS Media Official.

Donte 2:07:05

Yep and with that being said, I'm Dante, your host. Catch us again on the regular Reach for the Clicker episodes, where we talk about all the great movies and TV shows that we've been watching and also look at another actor's legacy, and we continue on and try to figure out if Jennifer Lopez is a Meryl Streep type.

Jay 2:07:23

God damn it.

Donte 2:07:24

No, the fuck she isn't, and I'd like to remind everyone that Squirrel Girl has defeated Thanos. That's it, Thank you everybody. Have a good night.

Overlap 2:07:36

Now I'm not the one who says no.