Another Mans Shoes
Interviews with fellow military veterans and adventurers about their experiences of war, the lows and times of hardship, joining them on their journey and how this has shaped their lives in the most extraordinary way. Comedy moments, dark humour and witty banter.
Another Mans Shoes
Pushing Boundaries: The Unstoppable Dean Stott. SBS, Commando, Record Breaker. S1E13
What drives someone to turn their life around and achieve extraordinary feats? Join us as we sit down with Dean Stott, a former British Army member and Special Boat Service operative, who takes us from a challenging childhood on an RAF base and the tough streets of Moss Side, Manchester, to a stellar military career. Dean shares how his father’s military background influenced his decision to join the Royal Engineers, despite his childhood dream of being a fireman. From facing physical and mental hurdles during training at Basingbourne to witnessing his father's evolving support, Dean's story is a testament to resilience and determination.
Prepare to be captivated as Dean reflects on his illustrious military career, including his time as a PTI in Germany, transitioning to an instructor role, and completing the all-arms commando course. He gives us an inside look at the camaraderie among troops, the deployment to Kosovo, and later, his specialized training at the Defence Diving School, where he became a senior diving instructor. Dean’s tales of selection for the Special Boat Service, along with the unique challenges of military diving and special forces selection, offer valuable insights into the grit and adaptability required to succeed in such high-pressure environments.
As Dean transitions from military to civilian life, he discusses the hurdles military personnel face when adapting to the corporate world. From working in private security during the Arab Spring in Libya to embarking on a world-record cycling adventure, Dean's story is filled with lessons on overcoming adversity and pushing boundaries. His newly released book, "Relentless," and upcoming challenge of kayaking the Nile from source to sea further exemplify his relentless spirit. Tune in to hear Dean's remarkable journey, filled with moments of courage, resilience, and a relentless drive to make a significant impact.
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Welcome to this episode of Another Man's Shoes. It's the final episode in our season one and we are delighted to have on with us a great guest to take us to the end Dean Stock. Dean is a former member of the British Army, having been one of the first guys to pass selection and serve with the Special Boat Service. Since leaving the SBS, dean has been on a number of groundbreaking challenges across the world, which culminated in the record-breaking cycling adventure which he's going to tell us more about shortly. He's also going to talk about his new book, relentless, which has now been released and is a great read. Having read it last weekend, I can thoroughly recommend it. So, dean, thank you very much. We welcome you onto the show.
Speaker 2:How are you mate? The weather's a bit different back home.
Speaker 1:So I think we're at about 5 degrees Celsius over here, freezing our nuts off. What about you?
Speaker 2:We're expecting 27 degrees. It's a bit too warm for this time of the year on Thursdays. So yeah, remember shorts and t-shirt.
Speaker 1:Let's crank up the air con mate.
Speaker 2:Just open the doors.
Speaker 1:That's what the wife does, you know. She puts the heating on, it gets too hot, opens the doors, loses it all. That's the mentality. So the way we sort of usually run these sort of podcasts is we sort of like to sort of understand where you've come from, you know, find out about young dean and obviously what's made you and taking you where you are today. So can you sort of give us a bit of a background on where you're born and what your upbringing was like?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I was born in. I was actually born in an RAF base, raf Rawton, which is just outside Swindon, and the reason for that was my old man was in the military. He was based in Tidworth in the Royal Engineers, and so that was the local hospital to us. Being a pads brat, you know you get used to moving quite often. So every three years, you know, by the time you're just about settling down, you're packing up again and you're moving. So very much used to that sort of that lifestyle of you know living out of bags, settling down and then moving off again. My parents actually split up when I was about eight years old and my mum was from Manchester, so myself and my sisters went with her back to Manchester. In the days of old, you know, to get a house, get into the council, you had to be on the list. So I ended up in a homeless home in Moss Side in Manchester, which back in the 80s was probably the roughest state in the UK. So it wasn't long before I was using my fists in the playground and sort of toughening up myself. My dad got custody of myself and my sisters about two years later and we moved back down to Aldershot which at the time you know, late 80s was the home of the British Army, which, at the time you know, late 80s was the home of the British Army when I went to school in Wavell in Northam was where the balloon is, where the paras jump out. You've got the Red Devils taking off from the playing field. You're very immersed in that environment. Everyone was walking around in green kit, but it wasn't.
Speaker 2:You know something I aspired to be. You know I didn't really look at the military as a career for myself. I actually always wanted to be a fireman, but when I left school in 93, again, there was a big recession. Back then there was a lot of job applications for the one role. So I approached my father and I thought well, why not join the military, get some experience and discipline? That will help boost up the CV and then apply in three years time? And um, so I told my dad my intentions, but you know rubbing those, you know warm, comforting words yeah, I'll help you. And you know he told me I'd last two minutes.
Speaker 2:Um, you know, I was about nine and a half stone and five foot seven at the time, so, um, I could probably see where he was coming from. But for me, you know, I didn't see that as a hurdle, I just saw that as a challenge. And, yeah, I went to the careers office, signed up for the Royal Engineers and then, obviously, as I was then going through the process, went through training, I could see my father's attitude changing. You know, he almost did a 180. You know, you could see it wasn't a throwaway comment from me and it was actually something I wanted to pursue. Um, like I said, I thought, well, I'll do three years, get a trade from the royal engineers and then leave. But that that wasn't the case. I actually, when I joined the military, it was, I felt very comfortable in that environment, I felt like I had a new family and and it just went on year after year after year well, that's quite neat because I was reading your book, great book, relentless, and we're going to chuck on um talk about that a bit later.
Speaker 1:So you joined the army. You wanted to become a paratrooper, which is kind of understandable, because everyone wants to become a para. As a kid you've been brought up an older shot and so you've sort of seen all of that. You've had the moss side, so you've got the fighting in your, in your spirit. I suppose at that point you've gone to older shot and probably honed your skills in the pegasus or whatever pub you were going into underage and uh, um. Then you join the engineers, um, and you start. Where'd you do your training? Was that basim born?
Speaker 2:it was basim born back in them days, yeah yeah, so what year was that so? So that was 95. Okay, february 95. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Out of interest. What troop you don't suppose you remember what troop you were in, do you?
Speaker 2:I don't know? No, I don't remember what troop actually. No, I don't, I don't. But going back to your comment about the paras, you know've just spoken to um, but obviously in older shop back in them days I'd never even heard the rural marines or the sbs. There was no way there was going to be a rural marines careers office in the center of older shop. So I did, I, I came out and I'd signed up for the paris and my father's office was only about 200 meters from the careers office at the time. So I walked in. I said yeah, I've signed up for the army. So what are you joining? I said the paras? I said you're bloody not. And he marched me straight back in.
Speaker 2:But my old man at the time he was um, he was a sergeant major at gibarex, which is a training establishment around the corner, but he was also the army football manager, player and coach. So his career was very much focused around his sporting abilities. So I didn't really know about five, nine commando, nine, para squadron, all these other options. So my father signed, you know, made sure I signed up for the royal engineers, you know men sat me down and explained about these other units. I then went back in a couple weeks late and had to do like a touch screen test you know, your mental ability.
Speaker 2:And then I passed all that and I got told I could choose any trade I want. So you know, I was thinking more between what was hanging between my legs than in my head and I thought well, bomb disposal sounds sexy. So I signed up for. Eod and my dad again marched me straight back in. So he was almost like he was very much, you know, steering the direction where I should go. You know he was looking more long term rather than short term.
Speaker 1:It's good advice you got yeah, when I joined um I went straight down I was like I'm gonna become raw marines commando. And they says, yeah, you can become a commando, but there's like a six-month waiting list to go to limston and do your potential recruits course, whatever they called it back in the day. And I've got six months and I want to be like you know, running around and putting the green kit on. So I went down I said I'll join the engineers. They're like, yeah, that's like a four month wait, four months I'll join the infantry. And they said, mate, don't join the infantry, get, get.
Speaker 1:Like a second sort of career in. You need a skill set when you get out, because when you, the first thing you can do the minute you join, think about what you can do when you leave. Don't think about that, that journey in between. So I think to anyone who is joining, just get, just get a trade. Or it's the most important advice I could give um. But then you've gone on like a really strange journey. So you're going from bazinborn and um. For anyone who wants to know what that place like, watch, uh, full metal jacket, because that's where they filmed that back in whenever it was late 80s great film. But then you decided you'd gone 5'9 commando right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, prior to that, actually, my first posting was 2A Engineer Regiment. Because of my dad's reputation within the army football, they were like you're Stotz lad, so they flew me. I went straight out to Germany because they were the army football champions themselves. So as soon as I landed, my staff sergeants like I'm never going to see you again, you're a kiss baller, so you go work in the gym. So I ended up being a PTI. And you know, for me, young 18 year old lad in Germany, I'm glad I actually went over there to to experience it. But after a few months you can almost see that my career was mirroring my father's. Yeah, you know, and I didn't want that. I wanted to carve my own path. So I applied for, yeah, the all-arms commando course and then, yes, went back to North Devon and did the beat up there and the all-arms.
Speaker 1:So what was that? Like the commando course.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I ended up. You know from my commando course. You know, about three and a half years later I was an instructor on the commanding course. But when you're a young lad at 18, you still haven't fully developed, your body's still growing. So I remember, like some of the hardest people say, well, the hardest thing you've done in military, some of the weight it carries on the all-arms commanding course I really found difficult. But that's just because I hadn't developed as an individual. So you know, the all-arms commander course is tested. But then you know, you then join your unit, join 5.9, and then you learn those other skill sets. I mean, three years later you're a fully developed man. You go back and you're like I don't know what the problem was, but you know I mean. But everyone's at different stages in their careers. On that course You've got everything from senior NCOs officers to young guys that have just come straight out of basic training. It's a great course.
Speaker 2:The difference from when I did my course to when I went back as an instructor was night and day. When I did my course I could quite happily say I didn't learn anything. It was just about how fit you are. You know they wouldn't even let us wear our Gore-Tex. It wasn't a course that I learned anything on. You know, I learned all that when I joined the unit, but when I went back, it was all about. You know, yes, you still got to reach those commando tests physical bits but you know, you need to teach and they need to learn, yeah, so that was quite good to see yeah, I was talking to a guy the other day and he he'd done the commander course, I'd done p company.
Speaker 1:We were having this whole debate about what's harder. You know the typical, he's got a bigger cock and um, I think what we came out of it is that the, the better looking blokes and the soldiers go commando. Uh, and the guys you just basically want to scrap and they're absolutely like speed demons and just want to sort of get thrashed, go P company. But you learn a lot more soldiering on the commando course. But that's probably because it is also a lot longer course compared to the four weeks of Paris.
Speaker 2:It is yeah, I remember going on the recruitment team for 5.9. We used to go to like to Gibraltar he's training establishments and it was a bloody nightmare when you compete with P Company. Because you're basically there to the potential students you say, right, you come to us, you've got a four-week beat-up. That's hard enough in itself. The beat-ups are pre-course, before the all-arms commander course. That gets you into a good position for the course. You've got four weeks there, you've course. You know that gets you into a good position for the course. So you've got four weeks there. You've then got a 10-week commander course. You're going to be operating in the field, you're going to be soldiering, you're going to be cold, you're going to be wet and you don't get any additional pay at the end of it.
Speaker 2:And then p company lads would come in and be like right, four-week course, get thrashed around, that's it. And you get para pay at the end. You're like how do you compete with that? So it's a lot of us, our students. It was either they something they wanted or always aspired to be. Um, but if you were a neutral, you didn't know where you're going. You could quite easily see why everyone went.
Speaker 1:Yeah had a nine squadron way four weeks of hard work and money exactly in weeks, and nothing you know, get cold or wet and get nothing but that took you sort of, then did you go, then you came back and reading your book, you sort of did Five Nine, then you went on to Cosvo. You did Op Acro Cola.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, yeah, that was it. Yeah. So I went Five Nine and then I was I wasn't long then selected to join Recce Troop within Five Nine. So Five Nine Recce Troop, recce troop within 5.9. So 5.9 recce troop. We're part of the brigade recce force, the free commandant brigades who work alongside brigade patrol troop from the Royal Marines, which is your mountain leaders and your snipers, and 148 forward operating battery from the artillery. So it's almost like their own unique troop. So we're very much separate from the rest of the squadron. So the five nine had got. We're on tour in Bosnia and brigade recce we went to to Kosovo and at the time it was the first operational tour for recce troops since the Falklands. So that whole period there, you know, is quite a big time, 18 years it was at 99, was it?
Speaker 2:It was 99.
Speaker 1:time for 18 years. It was that 99, was it? It was 99. Yeah, yeah, I remember blokes. We were on p company at times, april, and guys were getting pulled off to get taken out as costco and uh, yeah, talking to a few of them. Unfortunately I want one of them because I'd much rather have been there than getting thrashed. But um, the blokes were saying it was, it was a hell of a tour when they went in some of the stuff they were seeing and it was like nothing they'd done previous to that.
Speaker 2:It was great, it was a great tour, but also, you know, up until then, you know, the last sort of operationals that I think the Green Army would have seen would have been the Gulf War in 91. You know there was that lull, you know we had Norman Island and things like that. So for UK forces, everyone was so excited. They're like right. So for UK forces, everyone was so excited. We're actually putting our training into action here and yeah, so Cosmo was great and for us as well, being Arctic trained, we were there over the winter as well, so working in the snow, in OPs as well, so literally putting everything that we trained to do into practice.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and that's probably one of the only countries in recent years with all these conflicts we've gone on. That's turned into a bit of a success story. You know, Croatia and all the surrounding countries now are beautiful places.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, beautiful places, and everyone you know we talk to the likes of Afghanistan and Iraq. They're all beautiful places. It's just what you see on the TV. You don't see what we're seeing on the ground as well.
Speaker 1:So true? Well, yeah, this is that little sort of snapshot that the media want to proceed and give us. So you came back from there and you did a few other things and then, I suppose, was this a bit of a turning point in your career, because originally you only wanted to do three years and then by this point you've been in for longer than that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think the commando course itself was my turning point quite early, you know I although I did have a little glitch before that between Germany and uh, 5-9.
Speaker 2:I spent a period of time, 56 days in Her Majesty's Colchester prison, um, so I mean, you know I remember my father saying that's it, your career's, you know career's all messed up. You know I did it when I was young. You know I learned from it, um, just got into trouble fighting and um, but from when I came out of there, learned from it, just got into trouble fighting. But from when I came out of there and went to 5.9, I remember seeing the admin officer and he just ripped up my report from Colchester Prison, said new start. So that for me was my start point, my baseline for my career in the Army. But I was very fortunate At 5.9, normally you do a tour there, but going from 5.9 to recce troop was actually classed as a posting.
Speaker 2:So I've almost. Then started my time at 5.9 again. And then we used to always send an instructor on the all arms course, which was also classed as a posting, although you're still attached to unit. So I did a year there and then came back to 5.9, recce. So in the end I did eight years. I went from sacker to sergeant in recce troop, which was unheard of and yeah, it was unheard of, and I remember my sergeant major said right, you need to leave, you know, to be able to progress in your career. And that afternoon actually, I then got a phone call from the from Glasgow Manning Records saying you're going down to the defence diving school as a senior diving instructor. Um, so that was the end of my time in five nine and then went to the dive school and you're into that.
Speaker 1:Sorry, and diving was your thing. You're into that, or was it something they sort of sprung on?
Speaker 2:you. Again, it was something I'd never done before I joined the military. Um, you know, like skiing, I've never done skiing before. I went to norway, did my, my Arctic warfare training. A year later I'm out in Rukin doing a military ski instructor's course and it was a bit like the diving. The diving was classed as an additional qualification so you can get a little bit of extra money. So again, I've never dived pre-military. I then did my dive course, did my basic course, my advanced course and then did my diving supervisor's course and that's a course which is very much underestimated. You know, we know about the all-arms commander course. We know about P company, we know about selection.
Speaker 2:Probably one of my hardest courses was my army diving course. You know there's been issues with. You know guys that have died. Yeah, you know, doing phys on that course it's um, but it's a. It's a great course and you know it's not for everyone. You know it's an alien environment being underwater, you know, especially if you've got nil visibility. Um, but that then put me in good stead going forward to to the sbs, because that was where I was. I was most comfortable. As a young child I enjoyed surfing, I enjoyed diving. You know I'm very comfortable in that environment, whereas others may find it a bit difficult.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think it takes a certain man, doesn't it, who's comfortable in the water. I mean speaking to the guy we were talking about just now, when he said some of the stories about these rebreathers and all that sort of stuff he used. I mean it just talking about just now, you know, when he said some of the stories about these rebreathers and that sort of stuff you used. I mean, just gives you claustrophobia. Think about that, you know much. Rather than jumping out of a plane or running through the desert, than, uh, sitting under the water well diving.
Speaker 2:When I did my dive course and I speak to some of the guys now at a dive school, so because health and safety is now taken over when I did my basic dive course back in the day, there was um, you, the only way of communication. You had a lifeline, which is a bit of rope cordage around your chest with a bow line, and then that was to the guy on the top. I mean, you would do what's pools and bells, which is like succession of pools, or and and and bells, and that's how you communicate. But when you're in the water you're like that because of the tide you want to.
Speaker 1:It was that.
Speaker 2:Oh, you spent half your time doing your pools and bells where and that was your old school, you know nil-vis, and you just basically got told on surface what to do and you went down and did it. Nowadays, because of obviously there have been a few deaths and things like that you can't go in the water unless you've got two-way voice communications and you've got, you know, cameras. You know it's very much gone. Health and safety-wise.
Speaker 1:It has. But I was talking to um somebody a while back and he said it's great having all this technology and all this health safety everything in place, but the problem is that we're losing that, that skill set where we're learning the basic skills. So when something goes wrong, we haven't got that reliance and that ability just to go back to the old.
Speaker 2:You know what you talk about then, about ropes or what's your fallback option there, because you think, oh, two-way radio is gone and I suppose you just have to surface and that's the problem when you've got too much kit, the potential to have too many problems, and if you can't dive because you haven't got voice and you know I mean what yeah, what is the fallback, and there should be a bit of common sense in there as well it should be.
Speaker 1:And so at this point, I suppose that I mean, you've really set yourself up, haven't you sort of ticked off all the boxes and you think, I suppose going SF is the natural next thing to do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, that was it. And obviously when I was at the dive school, you know I put in for selection, you know. Prior to that, you know the normal transition for Army was the SAS. But the SBS had now opened the doors, tried service and they were losing Marines to the SAS because some of the marines didn't like diving, as we just touched on, so they didn't want to do the diving, so they went SAS. So the SBS had to look at the in front of them and say, right, well, we need to be pulling in potential recruits from from other units.
Speaker 2:So they opened up tri-service and, as I said, with my background, you know, my mindset was actually well, because I'm, because my diving, if I go SAS I'm going to end up in boat troop, um, but if I go SBS, they're all divers, you know, I mean, and I'll fit, you know I, you know we're all at a level playing field.
Speaker 2:Um, so that was where my mindset was at the time. Um, so much to the disgust that my friends up the road at Hereford I put in for SBS and six months later was successful on that course, me and one of my other friends and we became one of the first army guys to go SBS, not SES, which then sort of changed a little bit of a shift, especially where we'd come from. It's pretty like five nine record. We had 100% pass rate on on selection. So if one of the key guys was going sbs, you know the alarm bells were ringing at hereford and I think now you know 15 percent of the sbs come from the army. Um, so it's almost opened those floodgates. Um, so yeah, it was good.
Speaker 1:Now did you find the course in general?
Speaker 2:yeah, the course, of course. Of course. I went on selection in 2003 and I got injured on uh on the hills. So obviously from that I had a knee operation. So I made sure my training, my training, was different. I was at the dive school, I was running courses, so I didn't get an opportunity to go out on the hills, so all my training consisted of I was two hours on a spin bike in the evening, bergen on the back, but strangely enough, that spin bike, six weeks of that, I did my fastest BFT at the age of 28. I mean, I was sort of developing, yeah, which caught me out.
Speaker 2:But you know, you know stories of selection from your friends that have been before. You have an idea of what it's about. But going pool and not Hereford, you know they say, be the grey man. I was the grey man for about 10 minutes. As soon as I got there, the lads stopped. They just shouted my name out and I was like why are you going? You know, why are you going to Hereford and not pool? And I was like you know, because I like diving. And they were like shit, answer, you know, grab a rock. So on the hills phase, I remember going up and there was a couple of ds um, I won't give out any names, but they're they're x59 and one is also x9 squadron and they're like you know why are you going? Paul gave him that answer now pick up a rock. So I had to pick up an additional rock, throw it in the bergen and then, you know, take a photo of it. They'd take a photo at the end to make sure they weigh the bergen, make sure it was all in.
Speaker 1:so this went on for about two weeks every time I got to their checkpoint I picked up a weight so I was like I'm not having this.
Speaker 2:So I went away that weekend, the other weekend off, and then I just went online, google and bournemouth beach heat wave and there's like double page spread from the sun newspaper like topless women. So I just printed that off, laminated it and stuck it in the other map pocket. So then on the Monday I got up to the checkpoint same procedure, ds, not Hereford and I put the weapon on my feet and I kept it dry and I pulled this out and I said because that's not in Hereford? And they both laughed. They said yeah, good answer. And I didn't have to pick up a rock from then on. But what I made sure is that every time, even through the jungle, I had that in my pocket, just in case.
Speaker 1:And that's what they're doing.
Speaker 2:They're looking for characters as well. You know you need to have a sense of humour as well. Don't take things too personally. Exactly.
Speaker 1:Yeah, very true. So you had that rock up and down Vidal Valley a few times oh yeah, fun and games. What did you? How long so you finish. Because I suppose the traditional uh route that most people know about you finish a selection, you become a badge member of two, two. But that's not really where the journey ends when you go in sb because you've got to go off and play on your boats and and do the continuation yeah, that's it.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So you think you know six months and you go join your unit. That's it all. Singing and dancing is that? That there's a blue track suit and you've got another three mums training. So you do your SF boat course and then your dive course as well. So that's another three mums training before you then finally go join your sabre squadrons.
Speaker 1:So if you had failed the boat course, I suppose you revert to being a badge member of Tutu, I think that's what the school was in days of old, but I didn't really know anyone who failed their boat course.
Speaker 2:I think it was more the dive course. But I think sort of the approach had changed when I got there, Cause there was actually some guys who couldn't dive anyway, and it was again not to give it names. A friend of mine had a had a head injury through playing rugby, so he can't dive. So there's no point in sending him to Hereford because he's still a great operator. He just can't do that one insertion skill, you know. So he will then do something else. So yeah, they're a bit more grown up about it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we're not going to touch too much more on the SF side because of the usual sort of restrictions, but got some good ops in a bit of door kicking.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was very fortunate. I was lucky that we joined in the height of the war on terror. You know I was very fortunate to do the first ever operational jump, for Paul did numerous operational jumps, you know dives, you know I was literally ticking all the boxes, and so for me it was a great time to join. You know, even speaking to some of my friends who are still in now, they still reflect on that era. You know it's changed a lot since then and so I'm very fortunate that I you know I had experienced that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, a lot of the guys that you speak to now are in. I mean, they're going out to have a few jollies still and everything. But I think now, oh, probably oh five, oh six, when the real shooting sort of all started in Afghan, through to probably what? 2012. I mean that what? What a period.
Speaker 2:There was some, some great ops on there yeah, it was a great, those great ops, yeah, and then obviously, unfortunately, I got injured in 10 was that the parachuting incident?
Speaker 2:that's the parachuting incident, yeah, so we're on the pre-deployment training. We'll do this. We'll go back out Afghan in two weeks time. We're out in Oman doing PDT and you know we'd already, we're already hey ho jumped. We're already hey-ho jumped anyway and trained anyway from the previous tours. And some, well, just go up, do some fun jumps. There's no such thing as fun jumps in the military.
Speaker 2:So I think it was like third or fourth jump of the day, you know, just a routine jump exit the aircraft. Normally I like to be number one and I like to frog it and I remember my TSN. Right, you get in the middle.
Speaker 2:So I got in the middle of the stick and as I exit the aircraft, my leg got caught up in the line above my head and, um, unlike halo, where you're free falling, you're clear of lines this is static line still attached to the aircraft. So my leg got caught up in the line. So I'm trying to kick it out in time before the parachute opens. Um, couldn't kick it out in time leg gets pulled up over my head to the right and straight away thankfully my leg did release, but straight away, that instant pain, that sick feeling. I knew I'd done some serious damage. So I was throwing up because of the pain.
Speaker 2:And at 15,000 feet on a hayhoe, you know you're on the limits of oxygen at that point as you're descending. So I'm drifting in and out of consciousness, trying to stay with the rest of the team who are unaware that there's actually a situation here. So my first concern was how was I going to land it? Because you've got, you've got one in one bad leg and you've got one good leg. If you mess up the landing you, there's risk of damaging the good leg. But so I just you know just hovered around the um the D, saw the approaches of the other parachutes, see who did well and who didn't, and then just followed that same line. I landed it one-legged. It was a great landing but unfortunately the damage sustained it ended short in my career. So I tore my ACL, my MCL, my lateral meniscus, my hamstring, my calf and my quad as well, if you're going to do it well, so if you're gonna do it.
Speaker 2:Hey, if you're gonna do it, oh yeah, do it in style. You're going go in style what?
Speaker 1:were you jumping squares or rounds on that? Yeah, no squares, yeah, yeah now that's horrendous and I suppose, because what's it? You're doing a minute of free fall and then you probably got another two, three minutes under the canopy. So it must have been agonizing when you're sort of.
Speaker 2:Well, no, on the Hayhoe. So on the Hayhoe. So as soon as you exit it opens. So you can have up to 30 minutes under the canopy because you're traveling up to 50 kilometers. So it's a method of insurgent. So, yeah, we had even longer in the air, which gave me time to sort of analyze everything really.
Speaker 1:You know, I really you know, I knew, I knew that I wasn't going on that tour.
Speaker 2:I knew before it even landed yeah, what was the recovery period like for that? So the issue I had was it was the same time as the icelandic volcano, which had grounded all the aircraft, so to get an aeromed. I couldn't get an aeromed for about four or five weeks so I was basically thrown into a hotel in Muscat with painkillers and just told to wait. That was the crucial recovery period. Finally got an aromatic back to cellio, got back to cellio, told to go home for six weeks, went home for six weeks, came back. They'd lost all my paperwork, my MRI scans, a lot, and it was just a spiral of typical military medical issues and so I'd missed that initial rehab period. And, yeah, it took me 44 weeks before I got an operation.
Speaker 1:Wow. And your body's recovering at this point, so it's pulling itself back together, but probably the wrong way, because you've got all these injuries doing their thing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's it I just did it all completely wrong. So you know and the MOD didn't see it as that you know when I left I wasn't even paid out on the right scale. You know they had me one lower medical, a decent medical pension. So it took me five years after that and I won a tribunal hearing against the military and then got paid out on the correct level. That should have been, and you know, rectified. All those issues well, fair play.
Speaker 1:Nothing to anyone that's listening to this. Who's been in that position? They should. They should always argue their corner, because I think too many people get md'd on and they get get.
Speaker 2:Yeah, someone said to me I won't give names and there's something quite high up in the in the industry, and they they said look, keep going for it. You know people don't. Apparently the military, I've giving away too many secrets. The military won't even look at your case. So you go to, you appeal it. It gets refused. You can then appeal it again. Gets refused a second time, A lot 80% of people will be like you know, I'm just going to give up on it. It's not until the third one that they actually open your case up and majority of people would have dropped off at that stage.
Speaker 2:Yeah, just trying to sift you out, yeah, and for me it was that I've got nothing to lose. You know, I'm still quite young, I'm talking about later on from a pension, so, and that's what I did. And then the third one they then opened up, you've got a tribunal hearing, you know, and I was supposed to be paid out and the level that they, they said I was fixed within 16, 20 weeks.
Speaker 2:Well, I had evidence that my operation wasn't for 44 weeks, so that. So it's just putting it and that. And one thing I'd say to any listeners still in the military and someone my doc told me to do this get a copy of all your med docs, because it's it's amazing how many med docs disappear.
Speaker 2:Yeah funny that you know. So, um, so that's what I did, and I you know what I just and I just presented everything in front of me, the tribunal hearing, and, yeah, they paid, um, they, they pay me now a monthly pension and they backdated as well six years brilliant, no, well done, that's.
Speaker 1:That's the main thing is fight your corner, don't let anyone mug you off. And so I suppose, before we sort of transition out of this I mean, everyone's got a great story have you got a little story of a bit of dark humor or anything you can share with us?
Speaker 2:dark humor. Um, I'm trying to think you caught me out there I'll have to think.
Speaker 1:I know I didn't think about that. I think we'll come back and we'll edit one in. There's loads of dark humour, it just depends how dark it goes. No, I don't know, I know, mate, that's the problem. Yeah, a couple of guys come on and told a few I'm going to have to edit that out.
Speaker 2:People just will not get. That of the special forces is humor. But you know, I sometimes say, especially when guys and girls are transitioning, that you know that humor belongs in a certain environment. You know, don't take it into the corporate world because they just won't, they just won't get it they don't understand it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, a lot of guys get caught out with that and then they don't understand. But you, when you, when you're out, you're out, that's it.
Speaker 2:You can't take that mentality one thing I noticed as well is that a lot of I know the military, as you touched on before. You know you're already thinking about your exit. So everything you learn in the military gets you into that starting point for when you leave. And there's so many, you know a lot of people underestimate their abilities. Well, I haven't got a degree, I haven't got this, I haven't got that. There's so many skill sets you learn. You know I've touched on ski instructor, dive instructor, being able to talk in a large audience. You know these sort of skill sets, you know, have a positive mindset.
Speaker 2:There's all this, but a lot of people, when they get out, you know they'll blame and I was guilty of this myself. You know I was blaming everyone else but me. I was that. You know civvies, they don't understand, they're always late, all this lot when in fact there's actually nothing wrong with this community. That's normal. It's us that are unique and we need to fit into that world and that's where some people struggle. You know humour and things like that. You can't say that. As soon as you understand that, you know we're unique and that belongs in it.
Speaker 1:In a certain place, keep it in the other room yeah, yeah, keep it the other room.
Speaker 2:But don't know, they don't need to fit in our world. We need to try and fit into their world, um, as well no, that's true.
Speaker 1:So when you left um going through the book, you obviously um. At this point you start to have you having a young family. Now you have your first child around this point.
Speaker 2:Yeah, my wife was eight months pregnant when I stepped out of the camp gates, so I hadn't done any sort of resettlement because it had just been rushed. So sort of natural progression, without sounding like Liam Neeson is the private security industry and you know, for me I wanted to find a niche within the industry. You know we talked about some mutual friends we have. You know they had their maritime security companies. Um, I didn't want, you know, I didn't want to start be competing with that, my wife's from aberdeen. So I moved back to scotland but thankfully, within 48 hours of leaving the camp gates I got a phone call to help set up the diffid project department for institute development, uh, which is part of the british embassy.
Speaker 2:During the arab spring and I was out, was out in Libya. Gaddafi was still in control of Tripoli. Everyone was like forming up in Benghazi, Soon identified. You know that the Libyans didn't want to be another Afghan in Iraq. You know Westerns coming in taking over and just leaving a mess. They didn't want private security companies all walking around with weapons. So I flew home. Two weeks later my wife gave birth to our daughter and I flew back in. And that was a big eye-opener for me, because normally in the military you wouldn't be flown home. You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:I thought, well, when they say they're flying you home, they're flying you home Came back in and a lot of these large security companies these big, you know. We were charging six-figure sums for crisis management and evacuation plans and actually, when you scrape the surface, there was nothing in place. So I thought I took it upon myself to. There was a huge proliferation of weapons at the time in Libya and I thought this isn't going to be. They're not going to be here forever. So I bought 30 weapons on the black market and I buried them between tuners in Egypt, bought comms kits, had some extra money and I just did my own case reports, spent a month in the deserts, you know, just writing plans from sea, from air, from road, all the potential options, and that's what I did. I then delivered my plans to some of the oil and gas sector, which they bought and just sat on them, and that was it. So that was my niche within the industry.
Speaker 2:2012,. When the American ambassador got killed in Benghazi, they made a film 13 Hours. I was there. That evening. I got a phone call from a German oil company Can I get them out of Benghazi back to Tripoli? So I did. I got them back through safe houses I had. I had a DA corridor all the way back to Tripoli. Because of the success of that, two years later I was out in Brazil covering the World Cup. So in the security sector, you know, I also decided to work ad hoc. I didn't want to work solely for a company and do rotations and things like that, I wanted to broaden my opportunities and literally learn as much as I could about the sector. So I was on ad hoc. So one day you get a phone call take the UA Royal Family Superyacht from Barcelona and Maldives. Next phone call you're in Yemen. Next phone call call you're in in Brazil covering the World Cup.
Speaker 2:so that's very much how I was operating and I got the phone call when I was in Brazil saying that the Canadian embassy was stuck in Libya. It's now the Tripoli war Brits, italians and American embassies all shut and gone, but the Canadians were stuck behind. So they rang me up and said your name has come up, any chance you can assist. So I flew back in, sat down with their military team. They had 18 military guys and girls and four diplomats and I, yeah, single-handedly evacuated them. Me and my fixer got them safely from Tripoli to Tunis.
Speaker 2:It sounds very, you know, sexy, sounds very Hollywood, but in fact, you know, the success of this was understanding the demographics, the tribal influences within the country. As you know, everyone has their sets on an SF being offensive action. You know abseiling down the side of buildings. You know red dots everywhere you-falling into countries. Well, in fact, that's only 25% of what we do. 50% of what we do is hearts and minds, support and influence, and that's what it was here. It was just understanding the actual picture on the ground.
Speaker 2:So the Brits had got engaged at every checkpoint the week before, which was obviously worrying to the Canadians and they're like well, that happens to us. So myself and my fixer went out and we didn't speak to the guys with the guns. You know, we went up the chain to the tribal elders and it was actually, you know, sat down with them, you know, shared bread and coffee, and it was just showing them respect, you know, communicating, letting them know that we were no threat, what our intentions were, and actually then, when we came in a few days later, they escorted us through, um, so yeah, so it sounds all all sexy. We did have a uav coverage, uh, just in case, but you know, thankfully, no, no, no issues I mean that's a successful mission, the one that you come out.
Speaker 1:You strike yourself like that. Now I had to go noisy. But so when, when you sort of speak to people, they think oh it is also you know, sexy bombs, bullets, whatever you know people want to get into that industry. But I suppose there is the downside on sort of getting paid and a lot of people get seen off or there's not the right money, companies go bust. You had that chenay six, whatever. Those guys on the boats that got caught and sent to prison?
Speaker 1:did you ever have any issues in in that respect in the industry?
Speaker 2:no, no, yeah, you know you do hear horror stories, uh, from it. You know I I didn't. You know I, actually, for the canadian embassy, I did it for free, I didn't, I didn't charge at all, it wasn't because it was more. You know, when you read the book there was, there was a story before that where I'm with the Prime Minister of Libya pulling in 150 guys to sort out militias, and it was soon, although it was sanctioned from above, we were soon stereotyped or tarnished for being almost like mercenaries, which we weren't. So from then on I really struggled getting some of the big contracts. I was getting work, but I wasn't getting the big ones the NGOs and the oil and gas. So when it came to the Canadian Embassy, I did it for free and everyone was like what? You could have made a fortune, but for me it wasn't. That, it was to actually say, well, look, no, I am the number one in the industry, we're not mercenaries and we don't just do it for money.
Speaker 1:Yeah, a bit of a loss leader, almost yeah. So at this point did you decide you were going to start trying to become the fittest, craziest man in the world with the cycling exploit, or did this come a bit later?
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I came back from that trip. My wife had soon highlighted I'd only been home 21 days in a whole year, in 365 days. So you know the pin then dropped. I was actually trying to match the adrenaline rush I had when I was still in in the special forces, without coming to terms with the fact that I'd left, so decided to hang up my security boots. My wife's a property developer, you know helped her.
Speaker 2:But during this whole period of leaving the military to now, my injured leg was two kilos lighter than my good leg and I'd neglected my own physical, mental wellbeing. I'd just been fixated on on work. So I bought a bush bike. Just bought a bush bike off Amazon some Batman lycra thinking that was cool and it wasn't. And I just cycled to and from the office only about eight miles there and eight miles back, but straight away, being physically active again, I felt a lot better. So you know you can imagine my backstory. I wasn't really interested in property developing and you know I was sat there and I'm missing to see that glaze over the eyes and it's about a month before my 40th birthday and I said, look, I've always fancied doing a world record. And yeah, and that was it. So she said well in I said well, cycling doesn't seem to be hampering my injury, why not?
Speaker 2:Why not do cycling? So I knew mentally, I I had it. I just needed to sort of transfer that knowledge and experience I had before into cycling. So, having only cycled 20 miles, at this point I apply for the world record for the world's longest road, which is 14 000 miles. So it's the equivalent of cycling from. So it's from the southern point of argentina to northern alaska, but for your listeners, because of the curvature of the earth, it's equivalent to cycling from London to Sydney and then 4,000 miles. You know, it's that far.
Speaker 1:Fucking hell. I mean that's not a short journey. I was watching the TV series Wild Back long way up, I think Ian McGregor on the motorbikes and they do from the furthest point south, wherever that is somewhere deep stuff, the furthest point south, wherever that is, uh, somewhere deep stuff is coldest. I've seen it up to los angeles and that looked bad enough doing on a motorbike and they were hanging out so doing that on a push bike and then carrying on even further, yeah, no.
Speaker 2:So for me, I, you know I wasn't a cyclist, but I knew I knew like in the military, military are very good at planning. You know that intricate planning and detail, meticulous planning that's gone into it. I just did that. I just took a military set of orders, put it on the project and just crossed out ammunition. As I evolved as a cyclist, I introduced that into the plan.
Speaker 2:For me it was great, because you know you're going into the arctic, you're going into the desert, you know I've been in those environments before, but I've never done it on a bike, you know. I mean so, um, and I knew mentally I was strong enough. But you know, to give it that extra motivation, we also then did it for a, a charity which was focused on mental health, cool heads together, um. So obviously harry, harry and his brother, uh, william and kate were, no, the brains behind that, and him and I met each other on an fac course. So he was the first person I called when I, uh, when I had applied for the world record, and he said would I do it for this campaign? So, so that was it.
Speaker 2:So we had the challenge and we had the campaign message, my message I was trying to promote was you know it's quite relevant now with people in lockdown is that physical activity helps your mental state. You know there's a lot of focus on communication. You know talking to people, which is good, but for me it's just being physically active. You know I'm a grumpy sod unless I start training.
Speaker 1:Get them endorphins going.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that was it, and that's all I was trying to promote. This is no physical activity. I'm not saying go cycle 14 000 miles. That's ludicrous, but you know, you know, do that. And then also, it's never too late to start sport. I started cycling at 40. I broke my first world record at 41 um. So yeah, there's also that message.
Speaker 1:It's a hell of a message to put out there, isn't it that if anyone in terms of us says, oh, I can't do that, or that's too hard, I'm too old, I mean, you've just dispelled that myth in like one easy shot or not so easy maybe, but anyone can achieve something. You know, those small goals. It's great for mental health and the nhs come out of the uh, the five steps to mental health, about, you know, getting off the computer and facebook and all this social media and actually talk to people. You know, get out there and do some exercise, get outside. You know, hit the hills, go for a run, go for a walk and learn the new skill, all these different things which is so easy for anyone to do, and it changes your whole mindset.
Speaker 2:And I mean, I think you're hitting there on air. People see social media, they see people and I think, oh, I can't do that, you know. So there's a lot of them. Are they even set off? You know? And that's what it is. It's almost like you know, people will tell you why they can't do it and almost I block the outs. I'll tell you you know why I can and I get it. You know, my sponsorship marketing team did a SWOT analysis and the only weakness that came back was my arrogance towards the cycling community, which I just took as a strength. But it's true, you know, you see it all down. It's just an individual and it's almost dispelling that myth as well. You know, these people aren't superhuman, they're just normal human beings, just kitted up.
Speaker 1:Exactly. Well, they got all the money. I did a little ride a while back and we were going to cycle from the south of South Island of New Zealand all the way to North Island a couple of years ago. So we sort of went out and did that and, similar to you, I'd never really been on the bike, don't really enjoy it, and I look crap in Lycra. So I went to the local bike shop and, um, I said to the guy look, you know, I need a decent bike. I'm not very fit or reasonably fit. Do you know what? The best thing you can do for this bike to make it as light as possible would be amazing. I said no, no, it goes. Lose weight, you fat bastard, and so that's probably the best tip is just lose a bit of weight, don't go and spend five grand on a expensive bike. And, um, so you do 14 000 miles and so what, what? How do you break that down? You've got, you've got a record, you've got a break. So what was that?
Speaker 2:yeah, so the world record was 117 days. You know, know, I was aiming for 110 days. It wasn't because I wanted to smash it by a week. You know when I was doing the planning on paper, you know you look at all the potential scenarios. I mean, you know, look at contingencies. There is no contingency, you have to cycle it.
Speaker 2:But there, are things that are out of my control, be it natural disasters, coups, you know, things that are a third-party influence. So I thought, well, let's aim for 110, a bit like the fudge recall in the military. So if we encounter any of those issues along the way, it's not eating into my record time, it's eating into that fudge, and so that was my target. Then you look at always compare it with selection Day one of selection. You're not thinking about badging day. Yes, you are in the back of your mind, but you know you've got what's in front of you for that day to get over first. And that's what. That's what I did with this.
Speaker 2:I didn't look at the 14 000 miles. I broke it into countries, broke it into days. I broke the days into four stages. So nutrition and hydration were going to be key on this challenge. Um, it was almost like a polar expedition.
Speaker 2:You're going to be losing weight from day one, so I needed to stay on top of my food and water. So I would just cycle as fast as I could after breakfast for two to two and a half hours and we'd get off the bike. 30 minutes, food and water, but then quite disciplined in my timings, it was 30 minutes and I was back on the bike. I wasn't having a selfie with a llama or chatting to the documentary team, and then I would just look at the next two hours in front of me. I wouldn't look at the afternoon, I wouldn't look at the next day and before you know it, you've done a day. You know, you've done a week, you've done a country, you've done a world record. So for me, mentally, I was just doing four Fizz sessions a day. I wasn't doing a world record attempt, and that's how I managed it mentally managed it mentally.
Speaker 2:And that was every day, any days off. Yeah, so we had. So I actually finished it in 99 days. You know it wasn't the plan. You know I was very fortunate going. I decided to go from South North rather than North South, and that's because I'd spoken to the previous record holders and all their issues were in South and Central America. They started in Alaska and finished down. So the military man in me was like, well, why take a gamble the second half. So I came up the other way. So I got beautiful tailwind all the way through Peru. So I took 10 days off the South America world record did it 48 days. I got to North America on day 70 and I was 14 days ahead. I was like, perfect, now I can take a day's rest if I want.
Speaker 2:Wife then rang me and you know my wife was campaign director and she's very good in keeping all distractions away from me, and so I had about five missed calls when I got to America and I thought there was something wrong with my children and she said, oh, we've been invited to Harry and Meghan's wedding, which just changed the dynamics completely of this challenge. So so for me to get back in time, the last flight out of Prudhoe Bay. So Prudhoe Bay is in the Arctic Ocean, it's an oil field right at the top. You know not many flights at all, but the last flight out was day 102, which was 15 days ahead of the world record. So going into that phone call, I was 14 days ahead. 10 minutes later I'm now a day behind. So you know the target had changed, you know the objective had changed, and so you know south america. I was cycling from first light to last light because my support team and the documentary team a bit more risk averse than myself. They didn't want to be out at night, so we made sure last light we're in the hotel or in the in the rb. Uh, north america is a lot more safer. So I had the opportunity to cycle at night and that's what I did. I just made up my time through north america, cycling through the night, finding gaps in the winds as well. So I had 17 days planned for north america. I did it 11 and a half. So I was now head of this new target and I got to a week outside and this professional cyclist who's already got three other endurance world records sponsored by Red Bull.
Speaker 2:All the big brands come out on social media and said that he was going to cycle the Pan American Highway in August and be the first man to do it under 100 days. Was that great? So my objective had now changed again. So I cycled for 22 hours in the last 30 hours in minus 18 to come in under that 100 days. So we did 99 days. We had five days off. You talked about days off. We had three days off due to weather and two days off due to logistics, but for me I wasn't too worried because I was well ahead of my target. I always say, if I'd known about the wedding or this guy from day one, mentally it might have been, you know too much. You may have been pushing through those days off as well, but thankfully for me, you know I was in a position by the time I got to north america. You know mentally, physically, you know I was.
Speaker 1:I was banging out the big miles you can see the end at that point, I suppose, so it doesn't feel like such a drag no, no, not at all.
Speaker 2:And and getting into america, I didn't know whether I don't know what the you know the emotions getting into america. It was so high between me and the documentary. I don't know if it's because everyone spoke the language. You know, we've been on Google Translate for the last two and a half months. You know everyone spoke the language. The culinary options were better. Also, the fact that the previous record holders have never had issues in North American Canada, so that was almost a bit of a comfort as well. So it wasn't the original plan. You know, I always say to people you know, the success of projects is the planning, but actually the success of this project, yes, have a plan, and it's a bit like what we have in the Special Forces. It's very expeditionary, it's being reactive to the situation in front of you. Yes, have a plan, but don't worry, things never go to plan anyway. Normally it's just being able to react to what's in front of you, and that's what I did with this that's right and did you have any issue?
Speaker 1:but you know sort of south and central america, was there anything there that sort of held you up, was it, or any worrying times?
Speaker 2:no, not really at all. You know everyone talks about colombia. Colombians love cycling. Actually, amount of people that came out and did that. You know, same in mexico cycling through there. There's no issues. I saw a couple of fatalities, as in other cyclists, but um, no, no, nothing, no real threat. You know, by the time I was used to joke, you know, by the time someone clocked me and take a double look, no, he's gone you know, you know was that was that a gringo on a bike?
Speaker 2:you know I mean a lot of people thought generally, thought I was chris brim. You know there's oh yeah, there's a guy, a cameraman, and you know, with this, with this guy, but uh, no, I didn't see it. You know, and I think you know my knowledge of working in the security industry, you know I wasn't naive to it. I knew there was potential threats but I didn't let that get in the way of what we were doing. You know I do think people worry about other things. You know that would be maybe one of some people's.
Speaker 2:Tell you the reason why they can't do it because there's a security issue you know, it's not, it just just showing respect and we looked at that, we looked at the century and we came off the road at night that's brilliant.
Speaker 1:I mean a fantastic achievement there. Well done for for doing that beating the record. Is that record still stand or has anyone had a pop at it since?
Speaker 2:no, yeah, so, no, yeah. So the guy did beat my world record. I did meet him, however, in Austria. He's an Austrian guy and you know I cycled with him and his fiancee and he did say, you know, he was under so much pressure because his sponsors Red Bull, all these, you know, I think it's Austrian triathlon team and I said, well, you better do it, because this 41 year old guy who's never cycled before, he's just smashed it on the 100 day.
Speaker 2:But you know what the comfort was for me. You know records are there for people to to try and break. You know, what was comforting to me is actually, he watched my route and followed it exactly. He did north, south. You know, for him he could get a vehicle all the way, from top to bottom. We had to change vehicles the other way, other way, but you know, if I was to do it again now, there'd be different scenarios, different weathers, you know. I mean. So it's glad that it was a comfort to know that he, he chose my route and you know, but yeah, I think for him really put him under pressure. Um, but it's for me. You know, I'm not a cyclist, I've enjoyed it, I've dipped my toe in it and I'll do something else.
Speaker 1:That's brilliant. Yeah, I mean I think that light griffon scene. You know it's not for everyone.
Speaker 2:My wife didn't marry me because I look like Chris Froome. That's what I always say. You know, I need to get the upper body up again.
Speaker 1:So you did it for charity. You said that you raised an astronomical amount of money for them yeah, raised over 900.
Speaker 2:Uh, just about short, 930 grand. Uh, we raised for them, which was, which is amazing that was probably more. That was the proudest moment really is seeing where that money was going as well. Yeah, something that was military charities as well.
Speaker 1:So it's a broad spectrum, from post-natal depression, young children, teenagers, all the way through and you've raised a huge amount of money, you've been in the Special Forces, you've just gone and smashed world records, you've done a multitude of other things, and then you think I'm not going to sit down, I'm probably a bit bored. I'm going to smash out a book, so you become an author.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I didn't see it. I did this so I wasn't burying weapons in the middle of desert and smuggling people across borders. I didn't see it as an opportunity in guest speaking or a book or even future challenges. It was just so I wasn't doing taking those risks. So we weren't really ready when we came back we had no website. We didn't have anything like that. So, um, so yeah, I think I introduced to a publisher and they just loved the story. They're like what. You know what a great story it should be a book. It's been pushed in front of a few people about. Maybe is it a movie.
Speaker 1:It's one of them ones If you didn't realise it was non-fiction.
Speaker 2:It just doesn't make sense what this guy's done, this, this. Then he decided to. You know what I mean. So, yeah, very fortunate, the book and please, something, something a bit of a legacy. You know, people can hear the story, but then ever you know the first question, you know. And probably a question you ask you know what's next? Everyone says what is next and it's like well, you know, I've cycled the world's longest road. But you know what's unique to me, to other challengers out there, you know, I'm not a cyclist, I'm not a rock climber, you know a mountaineer, you know.
Speaker 1:So I'll take a sport or discipline.
Speaker 2:I've never really done before and find the biggest challenge so. So the plan is to kayak the river now, which has never been done before, from source to sea. That's the. That's the next challenge, you know I've spent a bit of time in a clepper you know my boat course, just to show you how annoying and frustrating it is.
Speaker 1:But I've never done it, sport wise well, at least the sports ones will be a bit lighter than those, lighter than those Kleppers. They're not the greatest things to be paddling around in.
Speaker 2:Exactly, yeah, but it has its own issues and you know, you've got the Crocs, the Hippos, the civil war in South Sudan. It's going to be a great challenge and, unlike the other challenge, there is no target.
Speaker 1:No one's ever done it before. So you know, you're setting records, setting records yourself, yeah, yeah, and you've got crocs and hippos to look after. I mean the hippo, what is that?
Speaker 2:the most dangerous animal in africa yeah, well, they always say don't get in between the mother and the baby, that's all, is that? Well, how do you know which one the mother and baby is? We've just seen ears sticking out the water. So but for me, on that challenge, you know, that's where? Again, that local intelligence? You know local fishermen, they'll know where, where they tend to bathe and lay up you know exactly.
Speaker 1:I think that's the biggest thing, isn't it? Use local intelligence, use the guys that are on the ground there. They know the stuff, they know where to take you, where to leave. You tell you not to go. So so going back. So your book relentless. It's coming out next month in the states. It's available in the uk now on. I bought it this weekend on amazon. There's a hardback and a soft uh copy. I bought the soft one because it's cheaper, but the hardback one would look better on the bookshelf. I've read it over the weekend great read, really enjoyed it, and it's actually one of the first podcasts I've prepared for um and I really enjoyed that. I'm actually going to uh properly read it again and then take it all on board rather than trying to smash it out in 24 hours. You said you might have a film or there was talk about it, so we don't know if that's going to happen. But for the vanity side of it, who would play you if you had the?
Speaker 2:choice, I don't know. I think Jason Statham would need to go in the gym if he wanted to sort of play me. It'd have to be some sort Bold and individual.
Speaker 1:yeah, he's quite short though, isn't he Jason Statham? He's like 5'6 or something.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Vin Diesel needed to go and start pumping up some weights.
Speaker 1:Yeah, maybe not Brad Pitt, Too old these days. So you're in the States. Is there any way you're trying to sort of push the book out there? Is there a particular target audience?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so we came out here. You know, obviously the Nile was the next project. The world's paused because of COVID, so you know we like to keep pushing forward. Just saw an opportunity to come over now get set up. You know, one of the feedbacks on the book is you are one of the security experts in the world, so why not? Why are you still not in the industry? So yeah, I'll be doing both. You know the book's going to be launched here in USA and Canada. So Amazon, barnes, noble Target, all the big areas Got a few big podcasts coming up, a few big media PR coming to promote that book and then obviously focus on the Nile Challenge as well.
Speaker 2:You know the guest speaking, that's all still going and obviously there's a couple of other media projects I can't really allude to at the moment, but in the background very much, you know, working with some of the big ultra high network families. You know, just keeping an eye on them, protecting them during these times. So yeah, juggling a few things at the moment, but for me it was the key one was that yin and yang, that balance between work and lifestyle. My daughter's nine and my son's four, so they're at a good age that we could come over now, uh, and get themselves set up, so yeah, what a great place to to grow up yeah, oh, there's worse places.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you grow up an older shot, they got.
Speaker 1:They got america not bad. No disney for the weekend, kids yeah, no yeah.
Speaker 2:Disneyland's only 15 minutes away. It's just shut, that's all gosh, same bloody COVID.
Speaker 1:Eh, and so, as we finish off, it's obviously been great having you on the show. Really enjoyed listening to your journey. If people want to listen more, where can they go and find out about Dean's Stock?
Speaker 2:yeah, so just designed a new website. Actually it's wwwdeanstockcom. Obviously, a lot of stuff will be updated on there as and when I'm on Instagram and Facebook and Twitter at deanssbs.
Speaker 1:Fantastic and obviously you mentioned the documentary. Is that something that people can watch on your ride?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so we've got all the footage now from the documentary. It was one of them ones. It was almost like what was the story you were trying to tell. So now it's marinated a bit and there's a little bit more we can add to the story, since obviously finishing, then we'll look at pushing that out. We're in a great position at the moment in the fact that broadcasters are short of material. We've now got some material for them, so we're just looking at that now, how that will align with the book launch here and then with the nile as well.
Speaker 1:Great stuff, and I mean best of luck with all of that. I think, watching that documentary using the great, there's obviously going to be a part two with the nile and how to avoid the hippos and that's not a nightclub for the blokes out there listening and uh, you know and hopefully they'll be sort of like stage three, stage four and plenty other challenges.
Speaker 2:You know, you're young, you've got the time on your hands, though yeah, everest, yeah, see what, see what's next after that, and always, you know, we always have to have a purpose or something to to aim for anyway fantastic.
Speaker 1:Well appreciate your time coming on today onto another man's shoes. Been great listening to your journey, thank you very much having me no appreciate well, what a great episode that was to finish the end of season one.
Speaker 1:Really enjoyed recording it. And a fantastic journey. I mean, I don't think I can say much other than what a life he's led. And he's only halfway around it, so I can't wait to see what he gets up to in the future. And if anyone else wants to follow dean and see where he goes or make contact with him, why don't you head over to instagram? He's on there. His username is dean stott. You can find him a little blue tick next to his name or over to his website at DeanStottcom. So that was Dean.
Speaker 1:That was the end of season one of Another Man's Shoes, but what I can say is we're coming back for season two shortly. We're lining up the guests. We've got a great theme going on. We're going on for explorers and adventurers for season two, and we've got some brilliant guys lined up to tell us about where they've been. So keep following us. Head over to facebook, join the facebook group of another man's shoes. Search for us. We'll let you in. On instagram, we're obviously on another man's shoes. If you're listening to us on itunes, please press, like you know. Give us a star rating, a bit of feedback. It all helps, but for now that's the end of another episode of another man's shoes. See you, season two.