S4E05: Turning Obstacles into Opportunities: A Conversation with Dr. Steven Crane

Service, sacrifice, and a relentless pursuit of self-improvement might sound like the makings of a superhero origin story, but for Dr. Steven Crane, they're just part of his everyday life. From his early days in the Marines, to his journey in education and entrepreneurship, Steven's story is a masterclass on transforming obstacles into opportunities. Not only did he rise from a medical discharge from the Marines to build successful businesses, he also earned multiple degrees, proving that ambition, resilience and continuous learning can indeed open doors.

Steven's story takes us through the winding path of his life, revealing the deep sense of purpose that fuels his success. His time in military administration allowed him to nurture his leadership skills, underlining the importance of mentorship and effective communication in both corporate and military settings. Hear how he navigated Imposter Syndrome, transitioned to corporate leadership, and the pivotal role mentorship played in his journey. Steven's expertise lies in his ability to connect, lead, and inspire - traits that have seen him take on the mantle of Ohio leader of Network in Action, and become an unwavering advocate for his local veteran community.

Steven’s dedication isn’t confined to his own success - his commitment to helping vulnerable populations is just as compelling. His insights on the systemic structures that often hinder progress, and the significant role of leadership in bridging these gaps, is a must-listen for anyone seeking change. We also delve into his upcoming book and business, promising a glimpse into everything Steven stands for. Steven's story is one of strength, resilience, and dedication. 

Guest Bio: 

Dr. Steven Crane is a serial entrepreneur and United States Marine Corps veteran known for high-performance coaching and helping people break into the next level of their life. He has 125+ professional certifications and licenses, countless executive education programs under his belt, and multiple degrees. 

As a veteran who experienced homelessness while transitioning out of the military, Dr. Crane has a proven track record of successfully building and running companies focused on supporting and advancing people's professional careers. His overall mission is conquering limiting beliefs, introducing a world of possibilities, and ensuring no warrior is left behind. 

Dr. Crane is a highly-respected advocate of the veteran community, dedicating 2,500+ hours of mentorship and volunteer work and delivering over $2.5B in benefits to veterans around the world. His work has been featured at NBC, FOX, ABC, CBS, MarketWatch, Digital Journal, Daily Herald, USA Today, and Bezinga.

Connect with Dr. Crane on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/steven-b-crane/

Transcript

Speaker 2: 0:06

Hi and welcome to the Becoming Trauma-Informed podcast where we help you understand how your past painful experiences are affecting your current reality and how you can shift those so you can create your desired future. I'm Dr Lee, and both myself and our team at the Institute for Trauma and Psychological Safety are excited to support you on your journey. We talk about all the things on this podcast. No topic gets left uncovered. So extending a content warning to you before we get started if you notice yourself getting activated while listening, invitation to take care of yourself and to pause, skip ahead a bit or just check out another episode. Let's dive in. Hello everybody, welcome to this week's episode.

Speaker 2: 0:50

I have the honor of just an absolutely phenomenal guest this week, dr Steven Crane, and we actually got connected in an interesting way through mutual friend, bethany George, who's also been on the podcast, plugged for that episode a few back and initially I think we bonded over our mutual love of getting degrees and had a conversation and I got to learn a lot more about Steven's story. And for this season of the podcast I was like oh my gosh, please can I have you on, because, steven, your story has so many pearls of wisdom in it around leadership, and you've got a great book coming out that I definitely want to talk about. And before we get into all of that, can you tell us who you are, what you love, why you do what you do, what lights you up?

Speaker 1: 1:41

Absolutely. I will try my best. So my name is Steven Crane. My story really starts back in 2017. I always start off with the past and kind of bring people to the present.

Speaker 1: 1:52

In 2017, I was getting out of the Marine Corps completely unexpectedly for medical reasons, became a stereotypical homeless veteran. Lost everything, didn't have any where to go, worked to do. Fast forward over a couple of years, from 2017 to 2020, started a couple of businesses, climbed the corporate ladder, got some degrees, got my feet underneath me. Basically, 2020, finally got my benefits from the VA, became disabled, got all my benefits, got my feet underneath of me. And then from there, I immediately started 360Vetrem, which is a veteran company focusing on helping veterans increase their disability rating. From there, continued on for another year in corporate for as long as I could stomach corporate and I was able to retire myself and my wife August of 21, from corporate, never to go back.

Speaker 1: 2:45

And then, right after that, it's funny when one door shuts and another door opens. Immediately after that I was approached by Network in Action to open up Ohio, to open up a bunch of different cities here, because of my network and because of my background, my story and everything. So I open up Network in Action, and then from there the story just continues to go and go and go, fast forward. A couple of months later and we get connected. So here we are today, and what lights me up more in anything hands down is hearing people's stories connecting with people and building actual relationships, not a transactional 30 second elevator pitch. That means nothing to me. It's a waste of my time. I could care less about what you do. I want to know who you are and then there I'm able to really, really figure out how we can help each other.

Speaker 2: 3:39

That is why I joined NIA, honestly, from a networking perspective. So Network in Action or Networking in Action, now that I'm thinking about it, I've just always said NIA, so Network in Action.

Speaker 2: 3:53

Network in Action and it's so funny. I joined and I'm like, yeah, nia and I don't know Network Networking Walking into that room because Bethany invited me. It was a completely different experience from any other networking event that I had ever been to and it actually really reignited my passion. It reminded me how much I love connecting with people, when it's not about what can you do for me, it's about how can we get to know each other, decide if we like each other, decide you know, figure out if there's a way for us to, for this relationship to be mutually beneficial, which is such a huge, such a huge tenet of the work that we do at the Institute. And so it felt so aligned, and so I'm just going to start off by like shamelessly plugging NIA. If you are somebody who would benefit from networking, it's a phenomenal group and I can totally see why they approached you to do it, because you're really good at it.

Speaker 1: 4:55

Appreciate it for sure. I just consider myself good at just talking to people. I'm not a super extroverted person. I'm not someone that will walk into every networking event and just be the spotlight of attention. I'm the quiet person in the corner that just wants to meet one person and then from there I'm going to spend the next seven days taking them out to lunch, inspecting them, figuring out who they are, learning their life story, and from there a lot of magic seems to happen. Yeah, very little that you can do in about an hour's worth of a networking event. When you're exchanging an elevator pitch. There's very little you can do with that. But if I take you out to dinner and I actually learn hey, who's Lee, where did this person come from Then you find out oh, it's much more than just this trauma institute. There's a whole plethora of things behind you that you can help me out with and there's so many people you know and there's so much more value to that than just one little thing that you do.

Speaker 2: 6:00

I think that this is such an important part of the leadership conversation because so many of us are taught to really lead with that elevator pitch, and it's honestly, number one why I have people introduce themselves and I don't read your bio, because your bio is, yes, it's interesting, and to me your bio is often the least interesting part about you, or not the most interesting part about you would probably be a better way to say that. I want to know who is the person behind that bio and what led this to be your bio, because that story is typically so much richer and more fascinating and there's emotional connection that can happen in there and resonance, and that is such a core part of the human experience. And when we just start with, this is what I do and we start immediately thinking about OK, how can this person help me? That's not resonance, that's extraction, which I don't want to shame or degrade anyone that uses those.

Speaker 2: 7:03

I know that a lot of networking groups is like, ok, here's your business card off the bat, like, what do you do, who do you serve, how can this connection benefit me? And it really does make a difference if those relationships are there, because there's a human in NIA with us that when I went to the first meeting, my initial reaction was like, oh, I'm not going to like that person, like we have nothing to talk about. He's in an industry that's like not something that I have anything to do with. You know, I'm not going to trade business cards with this person. And then when we started talking, I was like, oh my gosh, we have so much in common and I love his perspective on things. And so then we went on a coffee chat and then, like, we're having lunch in two weeks and I'm like I don't think we've actually talked about business in the times that we've connected and yet I've learned so much from him 100% agree, 100%.

Speaker 1: 7:56

It's the stories behind everything because, like you know, I can read off my bio on the back of the book and you know you hear about 125 professional certifications. You hear seven degrees. You hear all this and you're like, okay, cool, the person's educated, right, awesome, why, like that's the first question people ask why are we not talking about that Right? And they're like, why don't you get seven degrees and you do what? You're an entrepreneur? How are you using the degrees?

Speaker 2: 8:26

Right, you have your seat, you have all this stuff.

Speaker 1: 8:29

Why are you not doing this? Why are you not doing this? Ask me the reason why I have that stuff in the first place and I'll answer every question you could have. Because for me, I'll quickly tell that story, because that's a huge part of it. It goes back to a lot of our trauma. It goes back to a lot of stuff we deal with growing up and for a lot of us it's a journey to uncover why we are the way we are. And to me, I think that's one of the coolest things about life is figuring out, going back in your past, coming up with a story on why you are the way you are and how science and psychology kind of fits into that, the neuroscience of it. I know we talked about that, but all that is so fascinating for myself. Up next, a story based on the research provided by the three world exchange professor게요.

Speaker 1: 9:16

Growing up, I was super high IQ, super ADHD kid. I was reading dentistry books. In kindergarten, I kid you not, I was reading biology books. I was reading just anything that could. I was super fascinated with astronomy. I was just weird, right, it was just a weird, curious kid, but I loved it. I loved learning.

Speaker 1: 9:38

Got into school, teachers made fun of me, kids made fun of me, horribly bullied. I'm a short, you know me, I'm super short. I'm a little dude. You know big dude but little dude. But I'm just awkward, right. So people bullying me and that made me in my mind okay, if I go to school, school equals hard, school equals bad. People hurting me. I don't like school, I don't like learning. No more books, no more reading.

Speaker 1: 10:08

By the time I got to middle school, my curiosity, my enthusiasm for learning, I was gone. I could care less about it, especially going into high school. I wanted nothing to do with education, nothing to do with learning. All my dreams of, you know, becoming an astronaut, all these things like that you have as a kid squished You're gonna be a friggin, you know truck driver, or you know you're gonna do this, you're gonna do this. You can only do this because this is what society says you can do, or you can only do this because this is what your friends and your teachers told you can do. I'm gonna stop you here, when all of us has the potential to do so much more. I hated learning. That made me in school not want to attend, not wanted to listen, not wanted to achieve my full potential. The only thing I wanted, the only thing that I needed in my Maslow's hierarchy, was security. So I did anything I could to just fit in, make a friend, and I could care less about anything else.

Speaker 1: 11:11

At that point, going into high school, especially growing up without really a father figure in my life for the most part because he was always working and really never had that I wanted to reclaim that masculine energy in my life and I wanted to prove to myself that one. Yeah, I am a whatever we as society determined as a man, you know, I'm one of those. And then also, on top of that, I am smart, I do like learning, and why should I have to succumb to other people's opinions about me? So I wanted to reclaim that, but I couldn't. I didn't have that energy. I didn't have that drive, that masculine. I am the macho man, yeah. So that led me to join the Marine Corps, because I wanted to reclaim that energy and say you know what? What's the hardest? Branch out there, let's go and do that. I could care less about serving in the military. I could care less about the benefits that it provided. I could care less about any of that.

Speaker 1: 12:12

For me, it was just a personal journey of proving to myself that I am worthy, I am strong enough, I am hard enough, I am whatever society wants to label it. I am that. And through that process after graduating, boot camp and after graduating school of infantry, all this stuff, like all the trainings, after going through everything that's when I felt like you know what I made it, I'm good enough, and that reignited my passion for learning. That's why, from that point forward what was that? 2014? Yeah, 2014 and on, I started doing bachelors, I started doing master's certifications, learning, getting anything and everything that I ever wanted, because I love that, at the root of it, that's who I am. I love learning, I love educating other people, I love helping other people. So that was kind of the journey. On dissecting the bio, why do you have all these degrees and certifications? That's so much more interesting than just I'm more educated than you, right?

Speaker 2: 13:22

I am. I got chills as you were telling that story and thank you for being vulnerable and sharing that story, because I think that resonates with a lot of leaders and this is why it's so important to ask that. Why, like pulling in the trauma piece is because some people, the education is the aligned response, it's the okay. I went through this really traumatic event and this is how I'm going to really show up like unmask, as myself, and then for others like me, the education was actually the trauma response, right. So this is the only place that I feel good at things, that I feel like I'm not questioning myself. So I'm going to just stay here and keep getting degrees and keep going this direction, because that is the definition of success generationally in my family and this is the place where I get.

Speaker 2: 14:21

I feel like I belong the most. So for you it was a place of not belonging. School I didn't really. I'm not going to say I belonged, but I felt like I belonged from an academic perspective, like I could excel and get recognition and appreciation that way, and so that's why I'm always so fascinated when it's not underlying. Why are the degrees here? Because sometimes it's because that's who I am and sometimes it's because that's who I was taught to be or conditioned to be, and that is right. It's just so much more interesting than like okay, yep, they're both doctors right, they both have doctorates. Here's my other question. I'm pulling this from the previous conversation we had. You talked about the role that you held in the military, in the Marine Corps, and you actually expanded my mind around this, because I was like, wait, you did what? And you did all of those things at the same time and why and how. So I would love for you to share about what your role was and how that played out for you and how it affects how you show up now.

Speaker 1: 15:28

Well, for sure. So in the military, and everyone's military careers and experiences are different, but it really does depend on the branch that you go into and then the time that you served. For me, I served between 2012 and 2017, which was peacetime. There's nothing going on, kind of, but not really.

Speaker 2: 15:50

Yeah, relatively nothing, it was 2004,.

Speaker 1: 15:54

It was peacetime, yeah. So for that, for those that don't know the military you go down the skeleton cruise. You go down to bare bones, essential people. Many people get relieved of duty, many people retire out, they leave. They're like, well, there's no war, I'm out Like I joined for war. Why am I here? And then they leave. So during peacetime it's kind of a weird. It's a weird lull, if you will. The people that are there typically are a lot of support roles and of course you do have your combat roles and everything, and they're able to go and get time off with their family. They're able to do things training, catch up on academia, stuff like that. But for support roles it becomes very, very harsh during peacetime because you have no one to help. It's you because why am I gonna invest money into this when I need to save money for the next war and build up our infrastructure and so on? So if you're not supporting a war as a support element, then you get a skeleton crew. That was me.

Speaker 1: 17:05

So I went into the Marine Corps as administration. It's called admin 0111s and in that there's a lot of fields within administration. You have the HR piece, you have the retirement piece, you have the personnel management piece, you have the postal service, you have the legal side. You have so many elements and a lot of times when you're new you kind of go into one field and then from there you may bounce around to a different one and a different one, depending on the unit that you're assigned to, depending on the time of war. For me, I started off with admin, quickly moved over into postal, quickly moved over into personnel management, quickly moved into legal, and that's where my kind of realm was shaped from. So when people say, what did you do in the military? I did literally all things administration.

Speaker 1: 18:05

Some people have the opportunity, some people don't. For myself, it was based on achievement, going back to proving yourself. It was like, okay, what do I need to do to max out here so I can go and do this? Gotta fill my ADHD bubble. And then, once I hyper fixate on this, I'm gonna bounce over to this, and once I become the best here, I'm gonna bounce over this. That was it for me. It was like Pokemon right, I wanted to collect them, I wanted to get them all and just be done with it. So I did that and I was very good, so good that I was hand selected by our commanding officer to come in to serve as his assistant and to be his right hand. That's a huge honor and privilege and really I mean think about it from like a corporate standpoint. Yeah, if that happens, any opportunity you want it's in front of you.

Speaker 2: 18:58

Right, you got tapped right.

Speaker 1: 19:00

You're done. Anything you want, it's yours. So for me it was the validation I was looking for, but, more importantly, it placed me in a position at a skeleton crew as an E4. I was placed in a position of an E8. So that's the equivalent of being like a supervisor at a job, and then the next day you're promoted to a senior director or junior VP role.

Speaker 2: 19:31

Wow.

Speaker 1: 19:32

That's a big jump, Huge jump. You don't know what you're doing exactly.

Speaker 2: 19:36

Yeah, and how old are you?

Speaker 1: 19:38

At this point I'm 20, 21.

Speaker 2: 19:40

Yeah, you're a baby. What am I?

Speaker 1: 19:42

doing.

Speaker 2: 19:43

You're a brand new adult, yeah.

Speaker 1: 19:44

But the CEO saw something in me, my peer saw something in me. They saw, ok, this kid actually knows what he's doing. He's very mature, he has a very good executive presence, he knows how to speak, he's very polite, respectful, everything. This guy is actually pretty good at him.

Speaker 1: 20:02

We're going to go ahead and tap him for, like mass sordid, we're going to tap him for something later on in life. I was like this is a huge blessing. I'm going to do my job and I'm going to be the best. I did that. But you got to remember, in the military, different roles, different billets, as they call them, different positions carry with them different responsibilities. I'm site 2020, there's a reason why these responsibilities lie with certain people. I in my position. Think of it again from a company standpoint. You have a 25-year-old hotshot Harvard law graduate that's now telling 40 and 50-year-olds exactly what to do in their job and the 40 and 50-year-old have to comply, If not, they're fired, they're kicked out. That creates tension. That's bad, because I feel like an imposter first off, like listen, I know you know way more than I do in this subject. I'm just telling you legally, you have to do this, don't shoot the messenger. So you feel like an imposter.

Speaker 2: 21:11

And then they feel like who are you Right Get out of here stop.

Speaker 1: 21:16

No, I'll do what I want and you'll respect me. So it's a weird dichotomy, balance and power struggle that you have For me. I like that challenge because it forced me to level up my game. I was no longer allowed to be an E4 and E5. I was no longer to be this.

Speaker 1: 21:39

I had to perform at an E8, e9 level, with my presence, my leadership, who I commanded, how I influenced them, the way I approached situations and the way I commanded a room, because there were also programs that again, hindsight 2020, I really shouldn't have been part of for my age, because I was dealing with the psychiatrist on the base. I was dealing with the doctors, I was dealing with the attorneys, I was dealing with other generals and I was the person briefing these people on how these people are doing medically, mentally, physically. There are suicidal ideations, there are rapes and murders and everything else that were going on. I was the one briefing these top people on what was happening to my co-workers who I was in charge of at 20 years old. That's weird. That's traumatic too.

Speaker 1: 22:35

That's the thing that I'm trying to get to is the traumatic portion, because when you're in that room and you're dealing with that, you as a VP, let's say you know what's going on in the company and you've had the time to mature and learn that. Listen, not everyone needs to know everything. This is who I am. This is the position. I understand this person's dealing with this, but I can't let that interfere with this. I had to learn this trial by fire. I had to learn this within like three, six months and then be able to perform at that level. When I was learning and I was reading these rapes and I was watching the child abuse cases, child pornography and everything that was going on inside the base that my co-workers were part of. That I had to then separate and say listen, more friends here, legally I'm going to have to put you in the break because of XY and Zeno.

Speaker 2: 23:29

Oh my gosh.

Speaker 1: 23:31

It's harsh for a 20, 21 year old to deal with. That. People don't realize the severity of what I've dealt with in my life at that short amount of time. People don't fathom the responsibilities that we put on our Marines, airmen, soldiers, everything like that. But that's reality and, trust me, I'm not the one-off case, I'm not the majority, but I'm certainly not a one-off case. There were many of my peers who were also tapped at different bases across the country to do similar things. But now here we are, 22 years old, getting out of the military.

Speaker 1: 24:09

You can't even talk about what you've done. One, because it's classified at super high level, you can't do it. But then, two, when you try to explain this to people, you won't talk about imposter syndrome. I'm talking to an HR manager. No disrespect to the HR manager. I have way more experience in real life life or death situations than you could even fathom. So, respectfully, I don't want to talk about my degree that I got. I want to talk about how I can make sure that people aren't committing suicide here. That's the reality and for that to take place, that is that I mean. That's not. The core of leadership is being able to understand people and understand how influence works and understand how your own self-awareness impacts your situations.

Speaker 2: 25:02

My, the squirrels in my brain are going in six different directions of what I want to say, because there was so much goodness and just so much in that, everything you just shared. So the first thing that popped up that I want to pick out here is that you were placed in a position of leadership where people were following you because they had to, not because they wanted to, and what is so fascinating is that, as entrepreneurs, that's not typically the scenario, right, people only pay you if they want to pay you. People only hire you if they want to hire you, and it's two very different types of leadership. Am I leading people who have chosen me as their leader versus am I leading people who I've been placed in position as their leader, and how you approach that. Like you said, you very quickly learn that there's a delicate balance in how you approach that, and you actually reminded me of when I became a professor at the age of gosh.

Speaker 2: 26:14

How old was I? 26, 27, right, really young and I was teaching people that had a decade, two decades, of nursing experience over me, who I was their kid's age and I'm teaching them and they're like why would I listen to you? Like I'm listening to you because I have to Like I'm not going to. That doesn't mean I'll like it, that doesn't mean I'm going to make this easy for you, and that was a huge learning lesson, and you're right.

Speaker 2: 26:45

The imposter syndrome of that is like am I really going to teach somebody who has kids that are older than me? Am I really going to teach somebody who has 10 to 20 years of experience in this field? And I've got two? What I'm curious about around that is what kind of support did they give you? Like, was their support around? Okay, yeah, I was thinking it was probably similar to what I got, because and this is something I think from the systemic level, we've really got to start looking at is we want to make sure that the young humans who are hungry for leadership, that, yes, we put them in positions where they can quench that thirst and also make sure that they have mentorship and they have support, like not just from a this is how you do your job, also from a. This is how you hold your role. Do you feel like that would have made a difference for you if there had been someone for you to just kind of like? You know, talk about the weight of all of this.

Speaker 1: 27:56

For sure I mean for myself. During that transitionary period I would say I was definitely seeing counselors, therapists and everything like that. Talk about what I was seeing at work. I mean it cops, police, law enforcement, it doesn't matter.

Speaker 1: 28:15

They see some really. They see the evil of the world that most of us never see, Right, they see things that no other human should see and it's not natural to see, so they have to talk to someone about it and that's why a lot of law enforcement snap. A lot of law enforcement have issues because they've been to the side of the world where no one should be and if they don't have proper support systems in place to help them, bring them back into the light, you become literally entrenched in that darkness and it's impossible to get out yeah, unless you have some sort of support, unless you have some people there to help kind of continuously bring you back to life. For me, I had a really good mentor. I really did. He unfortunately left before I assumed a lot of these positions, but I had a good mentor leading up to these things, yeah, and the, the commanding officer was good. I had a good executive team, but at the same time, that was the executive team.

Speaker 1: 29:23

Yeah, it wasn't up here, a third party, it wasn't someone else that I could actually lean on for that mentorship and say, listen, I don't need advice necessarily. I don't need you to say it's OK, sweetie, everything's going to be OK, I don't need this. I don't need this. I need a sounding board to make sure. Am I going insane or is this normal to deal with? I think that's so critical, not only for leaders and companies, but also in the military, of course, because there are hungry people. There are hungry individuals that are more than worthy, more than ready to step into those roles, but they don't need to be thrown into that role. Yeah, they can be slowly dipped into the pool. They're ready.

Speaker 2: 30:16

Like we can wade into the pool.

Speaker 1: 30:18

That you need to pull them out. You still have the hook on them and you can move them and put them on safety and then continue to dip them until they get comfortable. If that was in place in companies and in different roles across the country, I think you would see a lot of young people be able to rise up to positions quicker but, more importantly, be able to do it more effectively. Yeah, Okay.

Speaker 2: 30:43

So two thoughts went through my head as you were talking. The first one is is you know, when I started the Institute, I actually hired someone that her name's Sarah Chiswick and she was a coach around, like swapping and feeling your feelings, like pro emotionally processing and and connecting back with like who you were. And I went to her and I said hey, I know this isn't what you typically do. I need a composter. She was like tell me more. And I said I know that what I am going to hear from people in this role, if I do not move it through my body, it's going to take me out.

Speaker 2: 31:24

I'm not going to be able to continue doing this, so I need a space where I can dump all of the shit and then we can compost it so that then it can serve as fertilizer for the continued growth of our organization and for my growth. Because she was like done. So I said I just need an hour a week, an hour every other week where I come in and I share all the stuff with you, and I'm like I need to know that you can hold that. And she's like well, yeah, I can hold that because I have my own places to go compost and I was like great Okay.

Speaker 1: 31:56

That's such a great analogy.

Speaker 2: 31:58

It made all the difference because I knew that. You know, as a nurse practitioner and as a nurse I was in critical care for over a decade the things I have seen with the human body I don't talk about because I'm like, trust me, if you knew, if you knew the things that could happen with your body, like they would keep you up at night. They kept me up at night and I know that it's. It's harmful for me to talk about those things in spaces where people aren't prepped for the capacity or don't have the capacity to hold that. It's still really important that I have that space. So that was the first thing.

Speaker 2: 32:38

Is, I think, so many leaders think that they have to do this alone or they have to use their, their, the resources that work provides, and I'm like I, from a psychological safety perspective, talking about wanting to belong employee assistance programs and the internal program that we have set up for people. There's a reason people don't use those a lot of times and it's because okay, well, I know you're saying you're not going to tell anybody this and also, am I going to see you on the base in two weeks? Am I going to run into you in the hallway and know that you know all these things about me. That can feel really dangerous for people. And so having that external source and that's something that we really love to do at the institute is provide that external source of like, bring that stuff to us, we won't tell your boss, like we don't even know your boss, it's okay, right.

Speaker 2: 33:25

And the other thing that came through is thinking about your mentors are also going through this stuff and so leaning on mentorship, when a lot of times your mentors, or the people like you said that executive team, they don't have the capacity, and so it's not like they don't want to mentor you or they don't want to support you or they don't want like it's not that they want to throw you in the deep end, they don't oftentimes have the choice.

Speaker 2: 33:56

It's I need somebody in there now because I'm drowning and I'm going to help them as much as I can, but like also, if, if, if, I try to save you, we're both going down. You talked in the beginning, when you were sharing the first part of your story, about being homeless and about really that transition out of the military, and I actually have a slight bit of insight into this because my mother worked at the VA and worked with homeless veterans and helped with temporary housing, and watching the process from her side was so frustrating because of how many places and spaces her hands were tied and helping people and I'm curious about your perspective going through that.

Speaker 1: 34:49

So first off I can say most veterans have no idea the services that are out there. They just don't. Had I known about that, that would have been cool.

Speaker 2: 35:03

Right, yeah, right Right.

Speaker 1: 35:06

Don't even know about it. On top of that, you also need to factor in the human element of trauma, and when you're going through it, you're not thinking clearly at all. You're in survival mode. You immediately drop down to your lowest level, and for me it was just security, it was just safe. Where's my water, where's my food, where's my shelter? It's all I cared about. And so when you're going through that, you're not thinking about oh, I remember once upon a time someone told me this resource and let me, let me figure out a way to get a phone so I can call this resource and make the has happened. Oh yeah, I just happened to have this handy dandy thing on me Like no no nothing.

Speaker 1: 35:45

You're in survival mode. You're scraping and clawing around to figure out what can I do, and that makes you do a lot of dumb decisions. It makes you do a lot of things that you look back, hindsight and you're like should I really do that? I'm sorry, right, but you're in trauma response mode. You're in flight or flight and you're just trying to survive that. For me, that's where it came from. It was just a matter of survival.

Speaker 1: 36:12

So, any job I could get, any money I could scrounge, anything that I could do, doesn't matter how low it was, how high it was, I could care less. I just wanted money. I just wanted to provide for my life. I just wanted to get something underneath of me so I could have some security. So, to your point with all these resources that are out there, that's awesome. But what I found and now that I've actually worked in the space too, what I found is the people that need it the most. How do I say this? The services that you provide are amazing. The problem is you're not getting to the person that needs it the most. You're typically dealing with the middle of the road, people where, yeah, they could use it, but they don't need it, or you're dealing with partners that maybe through them and through this person, through this person, you can actually reach this person. But it's not the same, for example, as a business owner.

Speaker 1: 37:17

This is where my mind goes. If my job is to clean up the homelessness on the streets for veterans, why would I sit in an office without calling? They don't have a phone. Why would I be sitting around the office? Why would I be going to networking events? They're like you're a homeless veteran. Why would I be doing that? Go live under an overpass, just go on the street, have a freaking van, coordinate with the local law departments and stuff, sit in your van, buy highways and stuff and just look and if you see someone just walking around, be like hey, are you a veteran? Hey, hop in my van and I'm gonna take you over here. Yeah, hop in my van, yeah.

Speaker 2: 38:01

Hop in my van.

Speaker 1: 38:02

Yeah, that's what it is, that's a need, here's the intervention and now we're able to solve them. Same with, like drug addicts they sit behind their desks and they wait for like a phone call from health and human services and stuff and say like, oh, you have someone, okay, let's process the paperwork Right. They're on the freaking street. They're behind the alley. Go to them, yeah. Or they're inside a trap house, they're inside an apartment that's run down. That's where your service needs to be, not in some office building over here, where you're safe and away from the problem. Your problem is here. Why are you not where the problem is? I don't get it.

Speaker 2: 38:43

I feel so grateful you are talking about this for two reasons. One, this actually ties back to what we were talking about of like there are professions where we see things that no human should ever see, or like the way we witness things that no human should ever experience, but our brains really try to pretend that those things don't exist. And so if I can sit in an office and say that I'm doing something to help people and I don't have to actually go see it and experience it and feel it, that feels way better for my nervous system, right, and so I can remove myself from the emotional part of this. And so if people then don't utilize the services, I can say oh well, we tried. And I want to be really clear, because I feel like most people who are in those office settings or who are in those more systemic or organizational roles where they are trying to help people, they really want to help people. If you were like, hey, you can go out on the street tomorrow, they'd be like cool, like where's my van? Like, like most people who go into these, these professions to help, they're down for that kind of work. It's that, from a systemic perspective, we've set it up in a way where we're like okay, well, what's the legal liability, what's the financial, what's this, what's that? And we start looking at it from this how do we protect ourselves as the organization versus how do we actually make an impact with these people who need it the most? And so I want to be really clear that I am not talking about the individuals when I say people don't want to go out there. I'm talking about the system sets it up so that it is hard for us as individuals to go. Do that work and this is a place from a leadership perspective too.

Speaker 2: 40:46

That I think is so fundamentally important is, oftentimes, as we move I guess there's a pun intended here as we move up the ranks, we get removed from the front line, so to speak. We get removed from, like, where these things are happening, and so we're making decisions about what's happening at the front line when we have we haven't stepped foot out there in a really long time, so we don't actually know the landscape, we don't know what people are going through, we don't know how the decisions we're making are impacting people. So I just really appreciate you bringing this up, because it's also about, like you said this was the second piece, the physical safety. So often we judge people without permanent residence, people with substance use disorders, people who are frequently in and out of the prison system, people who are in like sex work, all of these I'm thinking about people who are oftentimes like quote unquote on the street and what we say is is like well, we've offered them help and they're not taking it, so it's their fault. Or like why are they holding up a cardboard sign on the side of the road when they could go get a job?

Speaker 2: 42:02

And I think that you're highlighting the neuroscience and the nervous system piece of this, which is getting a job takes planning. There are 37 steps in the process of getting a job. There's one step in me holding up a cardboard sign. And if my nervous system is focused on getting money and getting food and getting shelter resources right now, that job doesn't make sense because it's gonna take me six weeks to get a paycheck. It's gonna I'm gonna have to get all of these things or have all these resources to get the job. Versus, I can ask for money right now. I can go break into a store that is abandoned right now. I can go turn a trick right now.

Speaker 1: 42:49

Yep.

Speaker 2: 42:50

So those of us who are in this position where we already have security, we're thinking about it. We're, from the perspective of future, planning going well, that's gonna hurt you in the future. The future doesn't matter if you don't survive the now. And so many people in corporate right now this is. I was actually talking with someone yesterday and she's like how many people do you think are walking around traumatized? And I was like everyone. She's like, really. I said yeah, there's. So we just went through this massive collective trauma and the pandemic and there's all this uncertainty and all these things. And so this isn't just people who are homeless, this isn't just people who are in these vulnerable positions around their security and their needs. This is also those of us in these leadership positions where we're like we don't know what we're doing or like I don't have the resources I need to help the people I'm here to help. So we make decisions out of urgency that negatively affect us in the future because we're like I gotta focus on right now.

Speaker 1: 43:48

I think you touched on coaching. That's me at the core of it, because when you look at we look at researching, you look at people and you just think about it critically for a second. Either you make the assertion that there are people that are better than you and they will always be better and you will always be subservient to them because you're less intelligent, your IQ is not this, you don't go to Harvard, whatever Either you accept that reality or you accept the reality that there's another possibility here, and the possibility with coaching is those that receive coaching and for those that know what coaching is, it's just holding a safe space and asking questions, allowing people to process things. People that receive coaching turn out to be more successful. Why is that? Is it because the coaching instilled some awesome enlightenment and career coach, career counseling and consultants?

Speaker 1: 44:49

No, coaching is simply just holding a space to process, compost the shit. That's all it is. So you need to tell me if I hire someone to coach me and to compost the shit, I magically become more successful? Yes, because you are able to process things in a more clear, concise manner, which allows you to make more intelligent decisions. Again, this person's not more intelligent than you. I mean technically may have a hierarchy, but it doesn't matter.

Speaker 1: 45:23

They were able to make decisions because they have a safety net underneath of them that allows them to not focus on Maslow's hierarchy down here. They're focused on enlightenment. They're focused on that final element. Because they have that net, they're not worried about where their meals come from. They've got it. They're not worried about their car payment. They already made it. They're not worried about where their next paycheck's come from. They already know, they already have this, you don't. That's the only thing that separates the two of you. Once you realize that, and you realize that holding a space for someone to compost the shit is the real differentiator between success and failure and being able to just process things from a real intellectual standpoint, you're able to make better decisions. That will compress time frames and exponentially grow you as a person. You can talk about spiral dynamics, a few development whatever. You will exponentially rank up. The more time you have to meditate, read books, get your mindset right and everything like that. Who the hell has that time if you're?

Speaker 2: 46:35

a little bit surpassed. Yeah, that's what you just like to take that, if I am resourced, that opens up mental real estate for me to be able to actually be curious and to ask questions and to process and to evaluate and to make decisions that my future self and the people that I'm leading are grateful for and like. Thank you for just touching on the absolute core of what we are talking about at our leadership conference in November, because this is it, because we're talking right now about humans that are under resourced and at a very significant level, and I think a lot of times people don't think of leaders or like C-suite execs or VPs of companies or successful entrepreneurs as under resourced. They are very under resourced right now psychologically. I don't have what I need.

Speaker 2: 47:32

I'm so focused on putting out fires all the time and protecting everyone's resources that we have. That I can't think at a higher level, and I think that's where the work that you do comes in. That's what the work that we do comes in. And so, yes, we're gonna talk about how you lead people and how you help other people be resourced and help them thrive, and that really hinges on your thriving and your ability as a leader, to think and to have that space to process, because without that, you're gonna make some really stupid decisions.

Speaker 2: 48:09

I've made really stupid decisions from places of being under resourced and, yes, it's judgmental. And also I don't say that with any shame or blame towards myself I can look back and go yeah, you were really under resourced, so the decision you made wasn't one that really served you in the future because you were thinking about the now. So thank you for helping tie that up in a very pretty bow. Getting down to the core of that, you know, as the last thing, you have this book coming out that I absolutely cannot wait to read. Tell us a little bit about that.

Speaker 1: 48:44

So flush the BS. I love it. Key word right B-S. A lot of people think bullshit immediately. Right, it's BS. Belief system, which I love Belief system. Flush your belief system, reframe your life and transform your truth.

Speaker 1: 48:56

The entire book is not only kind of a mini biography of the five years that you've been in, the five years from homeless to retired that I experienced, but it really talks about how you have the choice in every situation. And it's funny. People are like, oh well, it's a mindset book. That's cool, yeah, but it's a little bit more in that, because when you think of a mindset book, you think of this toxic positivity where all you gotta do is make lemonade out of lemons, right, well, chapter one the world is out to get you.

Speaker 1: 49:29

Chapter two life can really suck. Chapter three you are in control. Yeah, the first two chapters and actually chapter four, embrace the suck, right, it specifically says you are in control even when life kicks you in the teeth. My first four chapters of the book is nothing but truly trauma. Bonding and walking you through my story of life does suck. Things will happen. It's not pretty, it's harsh, there's dark, everything, and I agree with you. But I also agree with you that you have the choice to either stay there and accept that reality and for a lot of people that is reality and you can't tell them that that's not reality. That is reality.

Speaker 2: 50:13

That's true. They're reality. They're not. They are committed to that version of reality.

Speaker 1: 50:17

Yes, it's true, and you can give me a thousand examples of why that's true. Yeah, but I can also, on the other hand, give you the exact same perspective from a world of opportunities and a world of hope and chance and faith and everything like that, and I can give you a thousand examples of why this reality is true. And that's the coolest thing. And, to wrap everything up, it's about choice. It's that simple. You get to choose your outcome and how you write your story the way that I interpreted and I talked about gales, gremlins, interpretations, assumptions, limiting beliefs, the way that you interpret why I got seven degrees and 125 professional certifications, or whatever. I could have interpreted that thousand different ways. I get to choose how I reframe my life and transform that truth in my life.

Speaker 1: 51:16

The truth is I'm highly educated. The way I see that education is either one from well, my parents told me I had to succeed. That's why I did this, and I don't like my parents anymore. That is reality. They did tell me to excel and do this. Another reality, though, is I was bullying. I always liked learning. It was sheltered because of trauma. I reclaimed it, and now I'm back to where I initially was born to be so. It's up to you to decide what you want out of life, and that's the entire purpose of the book.

Speaker 2: 51:53

And I think that's one of the things that I think is important, and I think that's one of the things that I think is important. Your book is based on one of my absolute favorite quotes. I don't know if I made it up, somebody else said it, I don't know, but it's. Whatever you decide is the truth is the truth and that has been a fundamental thing for myself is is to ask, is to get resource enough to be able to ask the question what am I choosing as my truth right now and do I want that to be my truth? Absolutely is gonna hand you shit, and we're not bypassing that, and you still get to choose. You still get to choose.

Speaker 2: 52:29

Okay, well, we can talk, probably for three hours. We both got to go, so we'll make sure that we drop the link for your book In the show notes and also for people to be able to get in contact with you If they'd like to learn more about you and your business Plugging network in action. I'm also going to drop the link for that. If y'all are local, you can come see me at a meeting. That would be phenomenal, and if not, they're all over. So, yeah, thank you for being on here with me, steven. I really appreciate it.

Speaker 1: 52:56

My pleasure, thank you.

Speaker 2: 52:58

See you next week, y'all. Thank you so much for listening to today's episode. Invitations to head to our show notes to check out the offers and connections we mentioned, or you can just head straight over to InstituteforTraumacom and hop in our email list so that you never miss any of the cool things that we're doing over at the Institute. Invitations to be well and to take care of yourself this week, and we'll see you next time.