You Don't Know What You Don't Know: The Missing Language of Real Momentum

Your business can be getting massive attention and still be leaking absolute opportunity.

We’re living proof: people Google us, click our site, love our energy, and then leave without taking a single real next step. That devastating disconnect finally pushed us into a raw, unfiltered conversation about what’s actually happening when a beautiful, inspiring website completely fails to convert—and why strategic clarity matters infinitely more than another round of fonts, colors, and vibes.

In this episode of the Living Lucky® Podcast, we pull back the curtain on the frustrating backstage reality of our seventh website rebuild. We expose the painful pattern of the blind spot: when you don’t know what you don’t know, you cannot ask for what your business actually needs. Without technical language like conversion rate, customer journey, and backend systems, creative partners will simply mirror your storytelling back to you—leaving your brand fluffy instead of functional.

What you’ll discover when you hit play:

• The "Pretty Car" Fallacy: Why your aesthetic choices are actively masking a dead-end customer experience.
• The Vocabulary Glass Ceiling: How a lack of strategic business language keeps heart-centered brands completely broke.
• The Throwing Markers Lesson: Why trying to serve everybody ensures you are successfully converting nobody.
• Owning Your Value Out Loud: How to break the limiting belief that makes you hide behind "inspiration" instead of pitching your real expertise, courses, and products.
• The 4-Minute Question Practice: How pairing targeted pressure-testing questions with radical gratitude accelerates business decisions and eliminates second-guessing. (Click Here for The Formula)

Stop forcing curious visitors into high-friction steps. If you are rebuilding a website, refining your marketing, or trying to create a business that actually converts traffic into revenue, this backstage pass is your wake-up call.

👉 Listen now, subscribe, and start asking the high-value questions that turn traffic into transactions.

KEY NUGGETS

• Inspiration doesn't automatically create sales. If your digital presence ends at a vague "contact us" button, you are forcing interested leads into high-friction work instead of guiding them down a clear path.
• If you can't name your problem, you will keep buying the wrong solution. When you don't speak the language of conversion, designers will keep selling you prettier versions of the fluff that is already failing.
• When you attempt to serve everybody, you end up serving nobody. Throwing every single offer at your audience at once ensures they won't catch any of them. Focus your offer to anchor your authority.
• Hiding behind being "the inspiring choice" is often a limiting belief. It feels safer to be vague and beautiful than to state directly: Here is what we sell, here is exactly how it helps you, and here is how to buy it right now.
• Gratitude is the high-octane fuel for business systems, not an alternative to them. True momentum requires pairing deep energetic alignment with ruthless operational clarity.

FEATURED SNIPPET ANSWERS 

Why does a beautiful website fail to convert traffic into sales? A beautiful website fails to convert traffic when it relies entirely on aesthetic storytelling and inspiration instead of a structured customer journey. Without clear pathways, minimized friction, and explicit calls to action for products or services, visitors will engage with the content but exit the site without purchasing.

How do limiting beliefs impact a small business owner's marketing strategy? Limiting beliefs often manifest as a hesitation to claim expertise directly, causing business owners to hide behind safe labels like "inspiring" or "impactful." This discomfort with selling prevents them from clearly stating their offers, pricing, and value propositions, which dilutes their marketing message and lowers conversions.

What is the difference between a surface problem and a root problem in business coaching? A surface problem is the immediate symptom an entrepreneur complains about, such as low website conversions or an unsupportive network. The root problem is typically an underlying strategic or psychological issue, such as a lack of specific operational vocabulary, unfocused target offers, or an energetic misalignment regarding self-worth

why my website is not converting, heart centered business marketing strategies, how to optimize customer journey, heart-centered brand strategy, converting website traffic into sales, business growth coaching podcast, why pretty websites fail to convert traffic, distinguishing surface problems from root business issues, how to own your value as a coach or speaker, overcoming the fear of selling in small business, changing business questions to get better results, marketing strategy for inspirational brands, moving from a hobby to a profitable business

Transcript

Creating A Life You Crave

Jana Shelfer 0:00

Are you ready to create a life you crave? Let's spin that doom loop of negativity into an upward success cycle and start Living Lucky®. Good morning. I'm Jana and we are Living Lucky®. You are too. You don't know what you don't know, and what you don't know is holding you back.

Jason Shelfer 0:23

That's right. It's keeping you stuck, it's keeping you broke, keeping you fat.

Jana Shelfer 0:27

We have said this sentence for the last six years at different times in different areas of our lives. It's weird.

Jason Shelfer 0:34

Yeah, and it hits me different all the time.

Jana Shelfer 0:37

So

The Website Spiral And Business Growing Pains

Jana Shelfer 0:38

if you've been following us, you know that Jason and I have been building this business. Now, it's taken a while for it to actually get off the ground. Most people would call it a hobby.

Jason Shelfer 0:51

Yeah. And there's always different level levels of what you consider successful in a business, right? Yes.

Jana Shelfer 1:00

Yes, that is true. It's so fun because it's and as we evolve, our expectations and our standards raise expand as well.

Jason Shelfer 1:09

That's true. And then that there's a new door of what I don't know here.

Jana Shelfer 1:15

Okay, so I'm just gonna be very transparent. And you can sit and listen to this and laugh at me. Judge. Or you can also say, you know what, I totally understand what they're doing.

Jason Shelfer 1:28

I recognize this in myself in a specific area of my life.

Jana Shelfer 1:31

Jason and I have had so many websites. And depending on who you go to, they kind of say, Well, I think you need this, or I think you need to have a house on what we've spent on websites.

unknown 1:45

We could have.

Jana Shelfer 1:46

We could have been bought it, but uh maybe maybe a lower income investment property. Yes, absolutely. Here's the thing though, we're at that juncture again, because the universe continues to give you the challenges you need in order for you to learn, expand, evolve, and grow. That's the formula, right?

Jason Shelfer 2:09

And I know we're gonna get a lot of people emailing about I can build you a website. That's not what we're looking for.

Jana Shelfer 2:15

Which we've gone that route before, too. And we know, okay, there are specific things. Here's the thing: the more that we learn about our website and e-commerce and what we're actually selling, like there's been there's been levels of all of this.

Jason Shelfer 2:32

The more we learn about it, the more we know what we actually want. And we also know what questions to ask and how to explain what we're looking for.

Jana Shelfer 2:41

And what's so funny is whenever we reach out to anyone, including Chat GPT or AI, they always reflect back to us. You are a heart-centered company, and you need a website that makes people feel good and that inspires people, and that's all about storytelling.

Jason Shelfer 3:04

They mirror back what we get.

Jana Shelfer 3:07

And and I'm like, well, that's why I'm going to someone to build my website because you don't know what you don't know. And what we have realized is in running a business, there are systems and processes that need to be on the backside.

Jason Shelfer 3:27

Right.

Jana Shelfer 3:27

And we haven't known how to convey that. And here's the thing is we have, this isn't our first website. This is our first rodeo. It's not our second, it's not our third. In fact, we've been thinking about it. I think we've had at least this will be number six or seven. I think it's six or seven in lucky number seven. Hello. Lucky number seven. Living lucky, baby. And it's so crazy because it's our website curriculum. Finally, yesterday, I had what in my mind I consider a little bit of a tantrum because I was speaking in all caps, and I was saying, you know what?

Jason Shelfer 4:12

Like, what are these word bubbles over my head look like?

Jana Shelfer 4:14

I'm not gonna be nice about this. I'm not going to be nice. I'm going to be direct. And this is what I want. This is what we need. And this is how it's going to be this time. We're not going to go the nice fluffy route, which we always come out with. This people go, Oh my gosh, your website is so like it's fun and beautiful, but it doesn't do it.

Jason Shelfer 4:39

It doesn't convert.

Jana Shelfer 4:40

It's like it doesn't do any people leave there going, I don't know what you do.

Jason Shelfer 4:45

Yeah. It's it's I don't know who you are. I like you guys, it's fun.

Jana Shelfer 4:50

I want to be around you guys.

Jason Shelfer 4:51

The fun thing is, is like people just go to our website and they'll call us and say, We want you to come MC an event. We want you to come. We just want you to come. Yeah.

Jana Shelfer 4:58

We'll give you tickets if you just come to our event because you guys have this energy that is so great. And I'm like, yeah, we need to monetize that energy, is what needs to happen. And then they say, Oh, but you know, inspiration isn't sell. And I'm like, baloney, that's why we buy tickets to concerts. That's why we go to plays, that's why we go to art galleries. That's why all of the legends that we talk about in the world, they were artists of some sort. They were innovators of some sort, they were trailblazers. That's what Jason and I are. And I'm sorry if you don't see the path to monetization.

Jason Shelfer 5:42

I do. Well, and that's the thing is when we have to go places and do things, and then so that it's basically saying, come be part of our our our event or things like that. And that leads to things. And I'm like, okay, that's great. But we don't, I I can't travel around the globe all the time as your ambassador just to go and then get some clients and then go to get the next speaking gig.

Jana Shelfer 6:08

It it needs to be and and for the price of we'll pay for your plane ticket. Okay.

Jason Shelfer 6:13

We'll give you your plane ticket hotel.

Jana Shelfer 6:15

That's fun and all, but I do have food and bills to pay.

Jason Shelfer 6:17

Yeah, we've got a mortgage, we've got all the other, and we've got a dog to put in a house set or so and we want to travel with the dog. So there's there's other things that, and we also have amazing courses, all these things that we can offer that need to have a fluid path for people to get to. And that's what's not been been very transparent and and clear on a website.

Jana Shelfer 6:42

Which it's so funny because we have literally reached out to how many people to build our website this time around. And I also think to rebrand and to help us build this bridge, and they reflect back to us exactly what they see in us, exactly what we are. And I finally yesterday I had it was a mini table.

Jason Shelfer 7:07

It was a moment, but I think also part of that is is that we've we've talked to a lot of people that have known us and that have been around us, and they are wanting to show what they love about us, and what they love about us is being around us and in our presence.

Speaker 7:24

Yes.

Jason Shelfer 7:25

And so they want other people to experience having us in their events and around them. So that's that's one of the things. And so so they they know us personally.

Jana Shelfer 7:37

Okay, so you're you're still rationalizing it. I'm rationalizing. But what I'm saying in this podcast is you don't know what you don't know. And what we didn't know is how to speak the language of what we're actually looking for, and what we need. And the

Asking Better Questions To Get Results

Jana Shelfer 7:54

reason that I am talking about this today is because how many times do we do this in our life? How many times do we go to someone and we try to say, you know what, this is what I am thinking. Well, what you say is the surface level. When you really start, like when when clients come to Jason for life coaching, they'll often say, Yeah, it'll be on the it'll be very top level, but that's not what their need is. They often say, you know, my family doesn't want to spend time with me. I don't, well, actually, it'll be more like And and so then you spend 20 minutes talking about what they think the problem is, when really the problem deep down is that they don't feel passion purpose, uh, they don't know how to spend time with themselves.

Jason Shelfer 8:45

Yeah, they're not fulfilled with their life and their work. So they're they're like a cloud walking around. And once they get passion, purpose, and fulfillment, the world wants to be around them.

Jana Shelfer 8:55

And the thing is, they think they're coming to Jason to uh make people spend time with them. And the the real problem underneath it all is once you get on a on your North Star path, everyone's gonna want to spend time with you. Right. That that's not the problem.

Jason Shelfer 9:14

What are you doing? Like, what's what's changed because you're you have an energy that I want to be around.

Jana Shelfer 9:19

And it's the same with our website. We're like, how are we? I mean, we're getting clicks on our website by just being us, by just going out, going to ski events, going to speak, going to MC. People are like, oh my God, what do they do? What who are these people? What's their story? I have to know about them. So they come to our website, and then our website literally says, contact us. I mean, it's just a blanket of, hey, you know, we can fill your need. It's nice and inspiring, yes, but it doesn't work for us.

Jason Shelfer 9:56

Right.

Jana Shelfer 9:56

And I think we didn't know how to communicate it. Because we've been saying, well, we want to change our website. Well, people are like, what do you like about your website? What do you want to change? And it's about asking better questions. What I didn't realize is I needed words like conversion.

Jason Shelfer 10:15

Yeah, conversion. Conversion rate.

Jana Shelfer 10:17

I need processes to simplify uploading and customer journey. It is it is technical jargon.

Jason Shelfer 10:27

You're right.

Jana Shelfer 10:28

And because I wasn't saying the right lingo, people thought we just wanted a great storytelling, artsy website. Right. Just what's what's a good, what's the Jason and Jana story? Well, people know the Jason and Janaa story. They want to know what is it, what's in it for me. How can I work? How can I how can I be in their presence?

Jason Shelfer 10:49

Right.

Jana Shelfer 10:49

That's the question.

Jason Shelfer 10:50

Like, how do I do what they did?

Jana Shelfer 10:52

Yes. How do I learn this?

Jason Shelfer 10:54

How do I do what Jason and Jana are doing? And I think part of that is is you started asking better questions, which said, okay, well, this is how, if I know the question to ask and I know what I want, now I know how to get what I want from them.

Jana Shelfer 11:10

And this shows everyone that we are all just humans constantly learning and growing. Because Jason and I talk constantly. In fact, if you get any of my journals, you will see in there, in the front page, it says, when we ask better questions, our life starts going in a different direction.

Jason Shelfer 11:35

100%.

Jana Shelfer 11:36

And yet, this was a lesson. We're on our seventh website that Jason and I, we didn't ask better questions. We kept asking the same questions. And the way the universe works is it will continue to give you the same challenge over and over because it it thinks this is what you want.

Jason Shelfer 11:57

Well, uh also one of the things is we will only ask the questions we know, and we'll only ask the questions we know how to ask.

Jana Shelfer 12:05

There's another level to all of this because there is if you really, really uncover it, what was really hard for me to say yesterday in all caps, like I did, is I am not just an inspiration. Right. I have knowledge, I have products, I have classes, I have courses, I have speaking abilities. This I have value to give and to offer to you.

Jason Shelfer 12:42

Look under the hood. I'm not just a pretty car.

Jana Shelfer 12:45

And why was there's an engine under? There was a limiting belief in me, in me to say this website, it doesn't matter what it looks like at this point. And that was so hard because everything the way things look matter to me. It does matter to me. Like you look at our house, you look at a look at your husband. Even my text messages.

Jason Shelfer 13:07

I'm like, the way it looks, the way it Oh, I gotta make sure there's a period here, I gotta make sure there's an emoji here.

Jana Shelfer 13:13

And yesterday, I'm like, it doesn't matter what it looks like. People that's right, we're focused on the wrong thing. No, no, I'm not saying that. Let me let me reframe.

Jason Shelfer 13:26

I want to be in the healthiest version of myself just because I want to go on forever.

Customer Journey Over Fonts And Colors

Jana Shelfer 13:30

We are spending so much time on font and colors and all of the surface stuff. Let's get the people what the language that I need is how do customers experience this and how do they reach out to the city?

Jason Shelfer 13:47

How do they know what is available? How do they know what can happen? And then how do they get it? So that's what we want people to be able to understand through the website because people are. I look at the Google rate on Jason and Jana Shelfer.

Jana Shelfer 14:01

And we're off the chart.

Jason Shelfer 14:02

And I'm like, holy crap!

Jana Shelfer 14:04

If we're if we're our podcast is winning all sorts of awards.

Jason Shelfer 14:08

Yeah, if people are Googling us that much and they're going to our website that much, and there's the click-through rate is just nothing's happening.

Jana Shelfer 14:18

They come to our website and then it's like a dead customer journey. Like, I don't, and maybe it's the fact that we are too well-rounded in some ways. You know, Jason showed me this meme that this woman literally stood on stage and offered someone to come up and said, In my hand, I have markers that represent everything I offer in a business. She threw them up in here. Immediately threw the markers at the guy she brought up from the state from the audience. And he didn't catch any. So when we're serving everybody, we're serving nobody.

Jason Shelfer 15:26

And you just tell people this is what's important. And I think what we're saying here today is sometimes you don't know what you don't know, and it keeps you at the level you are. And when you tell yourself, I know, that limits where you're gonna go.

Jana Shelfer 15:43

And I'm gonna be in the same situation, we're gonna go through the same cycle again, unless we speak up and break through some of our own limitations to say, no, no, no, no, no, no. You guys are getting it. It maybe we're getting, we're explaining it incorrectly.

Jason Shelfer 16:03

And I think that's one of the things that I love about the four-minute process, the four-minute manifestation journal, uh-huh, is it opens up just a small crack in that doorway of what do I want to experience here? So it says, okay, what is it that I want?

Jana Shelfer 16:17

Yes.

Jason Shelfer 16:18

And it lets you pinpoint it. Okay, this is what I want for my new website.

Jana Shelfer 16:22

Yes.

Jason Shelfer 16:23

You know? And then we're able to say, okay, we're able to ask better questions around where do I want to go with this? You know, and then what how do I want to grow here? What's the what's the world that I want for the Living Lucky® ecosystem to look like within this website?

Speaker 16:40

Yes.

Jason Shelfer 16:41

Then how do we want to be able to contribute in that? How do I want to contribute to the website designers? How do I want to contribute to our our customer base and our our our the people in that ecosystem? So all these questions, and then how lucky am I?

Jana Shelfer 16:54

How lucky am I? How lucky am I? Because once you put gratitude on anything, there's an energy around it. There's a fuel. There's a fuel.

Jason Shelfer 17:02

And then how lucky are our customers? We we get to we get to put these this process works in every situation that I've ever applied it to. And I got I apply it everywhere.

Jana Shelfer 17:13

So it's it's beautiful and it and it's opened up this new pathway. We are still growing, learning, evolving, and expanding daily. And it it's crazy at like the aha moment that I had yesterday. I'm like, we need to ask better questions. Like, this is our fundamental lesson that we teach on a weekly basis. Ask better questions.

Jason Shelfer 17:39

And every time our coach comes over, she asks a coat a question in a different way or the same question, we just hear it differently.

Jana Shelfer 17:46

Oh, I'm sorry. I'm just like this is one of our bottle ups. Oh, yeah. And and just because I'm venting and y'all can get the insight, it's almost like we're we're opening the curtain so you can see the backside of everything.

Jason Shelfer 18:01

Backstage passes here.

Jana Shelfer 18:03

Whenever I have breakthroughs in my personal life, it's a funny pattern that I have recognized where it feels I almost have to have some sort of tantrum. And I use the word tantrum, it which is this is not a positive pattern of mine. However, if I reframe that tantrum into asking better questions and being more direct with my communication, my breakthroughs are just gonna start happening on an accelerated pace.

Jason Shelfer 18:42

It just brings the dots closer together.

Jana Shelfer 18:44

Oh

Gratitude Fuel And Next Steps

Jana Shelfer 18:45

my gosh. You don't know what you don't know. What you don't know is holding you back. Come to us because we can help you learn to ask yourself better questions. We've been trained in this area. Ask yourself better questions. Lucky questions starts with our drum. Thanks for joining us.

Jason Shelfer 19:04

Keep Living Lucky®.

Speaker 19:05

Bye-bye. If the idea of Living Lucky® appeals to you, visit us at LivingLucky.com.