Get Uncomfortable - with Special Guest Shae McMaster

In the Season 3 finale Sam welcomes Shae McMaster to the podcast.  Shae is gym owner in Hastings, Nebraska and the host of "Get Uncomfortable", a podcast dedicated to conversations and interviews with people who overcame obstacles in life.  Shae teaches and coaches how to welcome adversity into your life and use it to your advantage.   

Sam and Shae discuss Shae's most recent experience of getting uncomfortable, the difference between pain and discomfort, survival mode in traumatic situation, grief, crying, breathe work, self anger, EMDR technique, wellness with fitness, and cold showers.

Follow Shae: 

Instagram @enlightenedathlete 

Business Website: https://enlightenedathlete.com/

Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/podcast/id1557553154. 

Transcript

SUMMARY KEYWORDS
uncomfortable, people, shit, pain, day, che, cold showers, sauna, life, head, feel, called, listeners, talk, emotions, bad, wife, mom, podcast, therapist
SPEAKERS
Intro, Sam Fischer, Shea McMaster

Intro  00:00
Welcome to cowboys, not eggheads; home of the brave, not home of the fearful. The world needs more cowboys and fewer eggheads. We're everywhere podcasts are found. So tell your fellow cowboys, and let's keep the conversation alive on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter. Remember to subscribe, rate, review and share. And now cowboys not Eggheads with Sam Fischer

Sam Fischer  00:32
get uncomfortable. Today we're gonna get uncomfortable with my friend Shay. McMaster. Che, surprise, surprise is another one of those little people in my life from the CrossFit world. She used to be a coach of mine, CrossFit Kinesis. And I don't know how long ago that was che How long ago was that? Five years, six years, four years? Five years. So Shane McMaster is owner of enlightened athlete in Hastings, Nebraska. And we do have listeners in the tri City area. So go check out my friend Shay. Right there in downtown Hastings. He has a gym that is set up for one on one training for nutrition counseling for overall wellness training for jujitsu. And Shea has a podcast called get uncomfortable. And it is an excellent podcast. Congratulations on the on the pod che i think you're 58 episodes right? You're about 20 ahead of me, I think is that right? Yeah. Yeah. And so I wanted to talk about getting uncomfortable today. And who better to talk about that. Then with my friend che so che my challenge to you today is for you to put me and my listeners in an uncomfortable position. Go for it. It's gonna be fun. Okay, I'll lead you down the path, don't worry. So, one of the things one of the most intriguing things that I think about getting uncomfortable is now I picked this up, you did a podcast with somebody I did a podcast with recently Brees secret. And it was an outstanding cast it was kind of went down a different road than mine did. But you're talking about being getting uncomfortable now. Now Bree was someone that was had an addiction problem you've had I don't know if you've had addiction problems, per se, but you've had some tragic events in your life that set you on the wrong path. And you you Embree were both in an uncomfortable place back then. And I think it's interesting that you're now in the you switch gears into the good uncomfortable, there's a bad uncomfortable and a good uncomfortable, right? So but but what's the difference between the good and the bad are uncomfortable. I mean, the bad uncomfortable is I'm addicted to drugs, I can't get out of it. The good uncomfortable is, in order to grow as a anything as a business person, as a CrossFit athlete as in order to have growth, you've got to get uncomfortable. So that's the good uncomfortable. So I thought we'd start our chat off by just talking about the dichotomy between those two things. What's the difference? Yeah, I

Shea McMaster  03:25
think the bad uncomfortable is when you think there's no end to it, you think there's no way out of it. And you feel like you're a victim, when it makes you feel like you're victimized and you think you can do nothing to change it. That's bad, uncomfortable. And that's just I think a faulty mindset versus the good uncomfortable is actively seeking out challenges or having the mindset of, hey, if something comes up, and it really throws me off track, and it beats the shit out of me, I understand that there is a seed of opportunity in this challenge. I think that's the difference between good and bad, uncomfortable.

Sam Fischer  04:00
Oh, that's excellent answer. So a victim mentality is like you're blaming everybody, but you. And the non victim mentality is, hey, the only one accountable here is the mirror. I mean, the guy that's in the mirror, is that what you're trying to say?

04:19
Yes, absolutely. It's like, taking full responsibility for whatever happens, even if it is out of your control. You know, like, you don't have to just get kicked around. By life, you get to pick how you respond to things.

Sam Fischer  04:36
So what is the most recent thing that you've done Shane McMaster to get uncomfortable?

04:40
Well, just the other day, my buddy built a sauna, like a woodfired sauna out of a horse trailer, and it gets up to like, well over 220 degrees. I mean, it's so hot in there. So we do boy for 4 11 minute rounds of sauna until I feel like I'm gonna pass out so

Sam Fischer  04:58
4 11 minute rounds and how much rest you have in between those 11 minute rounds.

05:05
Usually just a couple of minutes you go outside it was on Monday when it was really cold here. So you only need probably five to seven minutes outside of it and then you hop back in.

Sam Fischer  05:15
Oh, boy, to what's the normal global gym? Sauna? Heat is what 150? I don't know,

05:22
probably somewhere around 150 to 180. The Infrared Saunas don't get as hot as the, like a traditional type sauna.

Sam Fischer  05:29
So So explain to my listeners, Shay McMaster. Why on earth you would jump into it? Was it? Did you jump into a 220 degree sauna? Because you wanted to prove yourself? You could do it? It was a mental challenge, or did you jump into 220 degree sauna because you were trying to restore some kind of tissue repair or something? Or for physical health? Why in God's earth? Why on God's green earth? Would you do that?

06:00
Yeah, both actually. So I've done I do a lot of ice baths. And then I do, I have an infrared sauna at my gym that I use. But it only gets up to like around 145 250 degrees. I read a bunch of research on the longevity, the anti aging, just the reparative processes of using a sauna. And my buddies like yeah, we get mine up to well over 220 And I was like that. I don't know if I can do that. Like I've never done anything that hot. So the first time I did it was to see if I could do it and how long I could do it for

Sam Fischer  06:33
sure. Make it the 11 minutes the first time. Yep, yep,

06:36
I was gonna die before I got out. I was not gonna get out. But it wasn't that bad.

Sam Fischer  06:40
You're gonna that was your last day and it was gonna be right there in that sauna. You were gonna you're being cooked. Because that's what it's doing is cooking you.

Shea McMaster  06:47
Yeah, that's like what I smoke a brisket out is like 220 So

Sam Fischer  06:50
why how is it good for you if you get cooked? Dude, how's that work?

Shea McMaster  06:54
You don't want to get cooked? You don't want to do it that okay? You want

Sam Fischer  06:57
to be medium rare. You don't want to be in your media. You want to be rare?

07:00
Yeah. Rare, ideally is salty. There is this. There's like a world championship of sauna. And people have died doing that before they like fall asleep or pass out in there. And that gets whoever can go the longest. I think they outlawed it now. But people have died in the sauna like they died. I was yeah, they're gonna die.

Sam Fischer  07:17
It's you actually. Yeah. I mean, do you lice? are you monitoring your pulse when you're in there? And those kinds of things are you know, now? Did you have a bottle of water when you were in there?

07:29
No, that's outside. I leave that outside. It gets so hot. You can't take anything. You don't want to take anything in there. Like I had a I had a necklace on. And I left it on one time when I went in there. And within 15 seconds like it touched my skin and it burned me. I didn't think it would get that hot. This branded yourself get your necklace. Yeah, basically. Yeah, yeah. So when your head starts to pound, like if I'm dehydrated, I'll notice my I'll start to get a little headache, my head will pound and I get out and cool down and get a little lightheaded. And that's when I get out. So So what

Sam Fischer  07:57
does one think about we had a previous podcast was Sheila Barton. You know, Sheila, I asked her, you know, what goes through your head in a typical day? And she said, it's like a hoarders house up there. So does that kind of what goes through your head when you're sitting there and a 200 degree? 220 degree sauna? What's what is going through your head? Like, I'm gonna make it 11 minutes if I die on this hill, so be it or are you thinking like, gosh, I need to pick ups, you know, such and such at the grocery store? What What in the hell is going through your head?

08:27
The first time I did it, it was the like, I'm not gonna get out like, I'm not gonna be a bitch. I'm gonna get through this and kill my inner bitch. I'm not gonna let him take over. Now, though, we actually get it. It's nice. My buddy who does it is named Andrew. He's like a very introspective guy. And we have a lot of like deep talks. And you can really get into like a nice meditative state where I'm just focusing on my breath, and it's very relaxing. That's what goes through my head now like nothing.

Sam Fischer  08:55
So you can actually talk to somebody while you're 220 degrees in.

09:01
Yep, we often bring, like the price of admission is an interesting fact. Like a random interesting fact about something like how Blue Jays are the main source of provocation for oak trees. Like I didn't know that but like we've learned a lot of cool shit in the sauna.

Sam Fischer  09:19
And is it hallucinogenic type talk? Or is it is clear talk? Clear talk, clear talk?

09:26
Yeah, yeah, it's not like I mean, you're very lucid while you're in it. It's, it's if you've ever been in like even just an infrared sauna. It's a similar experience. But at the end of the 11 minutes, depending on how hot it is. The alarm bells do start to go off in your head like cheese. I want to get out of here.

Sam Fischer  09:41
Yeah. Well, that's fascinating to me. So it's not really uncomfortable anymore for you. You're gonna have to ratchet it up how

Shea McMaster  09:51
to take it to 270

Sam Fischer  09:54
But I mean, seriously, you It started as uncomfortable where you're like, I'm gonna sit here I'm gonna sit here that's all you can think. up to like, we're gonna discuss, you know, we're gonna discuss the philosophy of fly fishing today or something.

Shea McMaster  10:06
Yeah. Yeah, for real. And that's the

Sam Fischer  10:10
trouble that's comfortable. Us. It's nice. So it's not acceptable anymore. So

Shea McMaster  10:15
not everything has to be uncomfortable. Oh,

Sam Fischer  10:17
okay. Well, but, but today does I mean, I think most of my listeners, myself included, I don't know. I mean, I I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I try it. I would try it. But I, I'd have to feel like safe and like, nobody's gonna like bar me from getting out of the door. Otherwise, you're getting a black guy. I mean,

Shea McMaster  10:39
that would be bad.

Sam Fischer  10:43
Yeah, that'd be awful. So how do you you're uncomfortable? Why? How is it that people grow when they're uncomfortable? And we're talking the good uncomfortable, by the way here? The Accountability, uncomfortable? How to how does one grow by being uncomfortable?

11:01
Yeah, you don't learn anything new by never failing. And when I say get uncomfortable, it's not necessarily just physical discomfort. It's sometimes you have to have a very uncomfortable conversation with somebody something you don't want to talk about them. Or some you gotta call them on their shit, or you're getting called on your shit. It could be looking at, you know, for some people, that's finances. For some people. That's a nutrition for some people, that's their behaviors on the weekend. In any way, I don't think somebody can grow if they're not failing. Like, if you're not actively seeking out new things to expand your horizons, new skill sets. tackling your inner work, like knowing your shadow. I don't think you're gonna grow unless you're getting outside of your comfort zone. If you just stay with everything that you know, and nothing ever changes. You don't do anything new. You're I mean, you're literally not growing, you're staying the same or reverting getting worse, right? Well,

Sam Fischer  11:56
you're you're swimming with the demons. I, I refer to it as demons we all have our demons is one of my little mantras. And it's hard. I mean, it's hard to address the demons. It is hard. But one of the things that you do is you certainly focus on the mental health side. Quite a bit. Your wife is a as a mental counselor, she's a therapist in the mental health field. So how does how is this is a question submitted by Bruce eager, by the way. So how is it being married to a therapist?

12:37
Yeah, it can be challenging at times, because she wants to talk about everything all the time and my, like, immediate reaction to certain things that like trigger me, from my childhood or from what happened with my mom, I want to shut down and I just don't want to talk like Just leave me alone. And let me process it for a while. But she kind of like makes me talk about everything. But it's been very useful, right? Like doing that uncomfortable. thing has been very, very helpful for me. It's made our relationship stronger. I always joke like I was her project in the beginning because I was such a mess in high school when we met, that she put so much work into me that she had to marry me because she couldn't let all this work go to waste. So she's

Sam Fischer  13:19
known youth. Since you were in the bad uncomfortable part.

13:23
Yeah, since I was 15. Wow. Wow. Yeah.

Sam Fischer  13:29
Well, my wife's my therapist. I mean, she's not registered, but I'm, I'm sure she could give, you know, I've had similar experiences to you. It's just it's just, it's for so many questions. You know, I just like, I get impatient. I get really impatient with all the questions because I think guys are generally built different than women. Well, obviously, we are but I you know, it's the old adage of if dropping a boulder sounds like a boulder to a woman, but a guy just might hear a pebble and that's, that's just you have to deal with it. You know? So, yes, strange sidebar, we're going down there. But anyway. So my dad said, when my dad was really sick with cancer, you know, he's a tough old cowboy. And I think people in rural America are this way. He was challenged to describe the doctor what the difference between pain and discomfort was. What is your definition because you talk about pain a lot on your podcasts and embracing pain. So what is what is I'll give you my definition a little bit but what what is your what's your deficit? What's the difference between pain and discomfort? Now this obviously, my dad was talking about physical or the doctors talking about physical but what's, what's the difference between pain and discomfort? Or is there a difference in your mind?

14:58
It's a good question. I I would look at pain as something that's impeding either your mental processes, the way you're operating in life, or the way that you move like in your physical body, like you literally can't do it without pain. discomfort, is something that's kind of annoying, it might suck a little bit. But it's not going to throw off your daily routine, right? And pain is more intense.

Sam Fischer  15:23
So if someone is starting in whatever it is, you know, I mean, obviously, you counsel people in the physical fitness world. But to get to counsel them on their mental mindset, do you should people? Should they start with discomfort? Or should they, you know, go right to pain?

Shea McMaster  15:45
Yeah. Go ahead.

Sam Fischer  15:49
I was gonna say they probably think it's pain at first, but then they learn it's really not.

15:54
That's it. That's it, you need to redefine you need to recalibrate your levels, like most people are, in the majority of the population that I've met, of course, there's always outliers. But the majority of people that I've met have not experienced real pain. They haven't suffered for an extended period of time, they think that they're going through something that's painful. When you compare it to something like maybe what a Navy SEAL has gone through, it's not pain, you know what I mean? You have to calibrate by pushing your limits, like that's the whole thing. So if something scares you, that's great. You know what I mean? It maybe that is painful for you to do. And I don't think pain is the same for everybody. Like, I have no problem, telling somebody about my nutrition, diving into it, thinking about it, telling somebody, Hey, I'm not going to eat that today, because it doesn't work with my plan. But when I sit down to talk to people about nutrition, sometimes they like that is something that is almost off limits for them. And I can see them physically get uncomfortable. They have a lot of deep seated emotions associated with what they eat, how they eat, they don't want people to find out about it. That's painful for them. That is actually painful. And there's emotional pain, there's physical pain, but going there is important. You know, I don't I don't ever make too big of a distinction between like discomfort and pain, because it's such a subjective thing. You know, I can't tell somebody that they're not feeling pain. But I could maybe show them through a really hard workout, that this is what pain is, like, you thought going on the elliptical for 45 minutes sucked, like, I'm going to show you what the sled can do to you and your legs are going to explode that pain. Now, you know, you have a new reference point. Yeah.

Sam Fischer  17:35
Well, so much so so so you know, my listeners know, I've defined pain as something. And I suppose this is more in the physical context, but, and I told my dad this, I go, Well, Dad, I got, I used to be a police officer, and I got tased once. That was painful, like I wanted that shit to stop right. Now, that was pain. And discomfort, as you said, to me, it's just it. It's like a nagging kind of a thing. It just it's just a nagging kind of thing. But you can you can live with discomfort you can get through it. And so that's what I told my dad, like, you know, if you feel something you want to stop right now, that's, to me, that's pain. That's the ultimate. Yeah, it is. But as you say, I mean, different people have different thresholds for pain. Now, United's favorite author, David Goggins, you know, he could probably sit there and get tased. And so, you know, he'd probably say, you know, is that all you got? I mean, it's just, yes. It's different for everybody.

18:44
It is, man. It's so different for everybody. And some people can take it and some people can't. I really liked that definition of if you want it to stop right now. That's pain. Like, I I thought I broke my ribs in jujitsu one day. I actually tore a bunch of cartilage in my ribs and strained and add muscle really bad. And it felt like my ribs like, popped and broke loose. And I was like, Oh, I felt like that was pain.

Sam Fischer  19:11
Pain. Yeah. Oh, that's like that. I would like that to stop right now. Thank you. One of the things that you have talked about with your past and we I mean, you had a tragic incident in your childhood, your mother committed suicide from what I understand, which had been very difficult. You're at a young age or 16. I think you said or how old was Jay I

Shea McMaster  19:38
think I was 1515.

Sam Fischer  19:42
pretty pivotal moment. anyone's life. Don't care how old you are. But one of the things that you said that for years, you're in a survival mode. Do you recall that? And I've pretty much always lived my life. in survival mode, at least I feel that way. I've used that survival instinct to move forward. You know, and for me, it's it probably started when I was younger, getting shipped off to a boarding school when I was 14 350 miles away from home and being on my own and all these things. And so I was, I was surviving this boarding school and come to turnout, all my classmates, anybody that ever went to the school said the same thing for two years. But we were all surviving, but I've always, anytime I've ever had a challenge in life, whether it be you know, we got married, Heather and I got married. And we immediately had an opportunity to move to another state, we, you know, we moved 1000 miles away to Pennsylvania, and it was a it was a bigger job, it was a more pressure job, more money, etc. But I, I survived through some very difficult times with that job and everything in my life, there seems like there's a chapter CrossFit. I think you probably knew me my early days of CrossFit, I don't, I don't see where you enter 2015 Were you there at the beginning? Sort of? Yeah, I was. I've still to this day, I'm surviving the thing, but it was an absolute survival thing for me or I looked at it that way, in the sense that I just, I just wanted to get through the workout. I you know, that was that was like, you know, I just want to get through this our survival. So talking to me about survival mode, you, you, you talked about survival in the sense of that affected you mentally? Is that, is that accurate? Or tell? Tell us about that?

21:41
Yeah, it was my survival mode. It was a trauma response. Now, my wife has told me that, obviously. But in the trauma response, I shut down my emotional processes. I never really grieved the loss of my mother. I never allowed myself to feel sorry for myself. I never felt sorrow for my actual self. I'd never. I couldn't feel empathy for other people. For a long time. I was just going it was literally day by day. I didn't, I couldn't plan ahead. I noticed when I got out in into the real world after, you know, in college, and after college, like, I couldn't figure out how to plan shit, like a trip, like a simple trip, like a vacation. I didn't know how to do it. Because I had never looked ahead. In my life. I was literally like, I'm gonna make it through tomorrow, maybe. And at the end of that day, I don't give a shit. If I wake up tomorrow or not. I don't know if I'm going so what was

Sam Fischer  22:40
your hope for life? I mean, did you think think like, 30 years old was like, you know, Bree is said that she, at some point that she didn't think she's gonna make it to 30. I mean, there's it was that your mindset, I mean, that's just awful.

22:53
I was fully ready to like, I was like, I'm probably gonna die. By the time I'm 2024. Like, that's like, literally what I thought I had, I didn't care. I didn't care at all about anything. And that's not a good place to come from. But it's how I survived because my dad, we had a really rough relationship. And it was just, it was chaos. My life was pure chaos 100% of the time. And looking back now it feels like somebody else's life. Like, it's hard to remember that I just was watching the show the other day, where the guy had, it was a dramatized show, but he had a he had a split personality. He created this alternate personality to shield himself from trauma that he was having in his life is like mom was beating him or something. This one personality, the fake one that he made up thought that his mom was still alive. And the other guy obviously knew that his mom had died. And it was so crazy, because I just watched this the other day. So April 26. Is the anniversary of my mom passing. Sorry, and it's fine. It's been a long time. But this is every April

Sam Fischer  24:02
26 is not you don't just you don't just cruise through the day. I mean, it's it's

24:08
no, no. This is this is what I'm gonna get to because it's it was it's still interesting to me it just sorry, listeners,

Sam Fischer  24:15
I told myself I wasn't gonna interrupt podcast guests this season. Sorry, che Go ahead.

24:19
It's fine. It's fine. It makes for good conversation. So they said, like this therapist trying to work with him. And he said, he's like, Well, your mom has passed, Stephen. That was the guy's name. And he's like, no, no, don't say that. You can't say that. My mom's still alive. He's like, No, we'll call her it's okay. We'll call her. He's like, No, my mom doesn't want to be bothered, don't call her Don't call her Don't call her. The therapist called his mom handed him the phone. And in the show, it was him looking at the phone and it cuts back to his face, and he's just bawling. And he was like, my mom's dead. Like this alternate personality just recognize that his mom had died. And obviously that hits very close to home for me, but when I watched that, I have removed that from my son So far, and I've shut off those emotions so deeply that I didn't even think about my situation. I don't put myself in his shoes. I didn't think I was like, Man, that's crazy. It's a good show. But later that night, and it was actually on April 26, that I watched this show, it was very strange. And I don't I forget, every year, I forget every year that this is coming up, and it's going to happen to me, and my body is going to feel this way. And I'm going to have this trauma response. And I was sweating, I was laying in bed, the TV was up, I'm sweating, my heart rates through the roof, I have a lump in my throat. I'm like, What is going on? And then I was sitting there, and I was thinking, and I asked my wife, I got what is today, like on the 26th. And I was like, You're shitting me, like, I'm having the response again, and I don't think about it. And I had a really strong realization just just the other day, I never grieved the death of my mother. And I never grieved the I never felt sorry for myself and the pain that I went through. Like, I thought about my 15 year old self, the younger me, and like how sad I would feel like I think of my little brother and I like if he had to know that how, how sad I would be for him the pain that I would feel for him. I never allowed myself to feel that for myself. And I actually never grieved the loss of my mother. And I'm starting to do that now.

Sam Fischer  26:24
Um, it's a very profound thing to lose a parent. I've lost both of mine to natural causes, but it is it's a crazy thing, man. There's not a day that goes by where I don't think about my parents multiple times a day more. I mean, just they're they're always they're here. I mean when they're not here but they're there they're always with me and so it is it grieving is a weird ass thing. I you know, I lost my dad, both my parents to like one in 2 million health, health. infirmities or whatever you want to call it, my mother died of something called mom died of multiple system atrophy which is basically a combination of Parkinson's disease, Parkinson's disease plus Lou Gehrig's disease, everything is shut down. And it just was very quick. It was like you know, two years out you're done. I mean, you know, going from one day of being able to to be able to talk the next day you couldn't talk to being able to hold a fork and spoon just not to be let me just do it since this a terrible cruel disease. And then my my dad died. See nine years after that with a dude had a tumor inside his heart. I mean, it's just a one in a million thing like a tumor inside his heart and and then for that tumor to be cancerous is even more rare. And so it was a cancerous tumor inside his heart. So that was another deal where it was just like, you know, I got to say goodbye to both of them, thankfully. But it was you know, he was diagnosed in August and he was gone in April. And you know, they both passed away and I you know, handled it okay. I think it's still handled okay. But I I'll be honest, che I grieve every day. I mean, it's just not something you get over with and somebody. I went to Texas funeral once and the guy said, here's a good cowboy saying. It was a friend of mine whose father passed away and somebody told my friend, he said, he said, he goes, you're never gonna get over it. Che you're never gonna get over it, but you will get through it. And so, you know, I just, I've always held on to that. So grieve away my friend. It's never going to end. It's never going to end. So I figured

28:50
that kind of figured that out over the long haul. But it was just a realization.

Sam Fischer  28:57
Yeah, yeah. And I don't I'm not sad about it. I mean, it's not sad. It just missed them, you know, soldiers. That's,

Shea McMaster  29:06
that's the truth, man. It's like, it's uncomfortable.

Sam Fischer  29:09
It's uncomfortable. That's right. That's right, my friend. Well, since we kind of touched on that topic, I do have an interesting question. And that is where you you've talked about, you know, having incidents and you know, since you've grown up just opening up and crying about something or whatever. I'm not a crier. You're not going to probably not going to see. See me cry. I think my wife see me cry. And when I say cry, maybe a tear came out my eyes it. I'm just not not a crier. Is that a bad thing? I mean, what would your wife say about that? Should I should I unleash the fury?

29:52
Yeah, sometimes probably. I think we need to sometimes really, but it doesn't have to be crying. In my opinion. This is my opinion. Obviously. Not me. My wife's but yeah, I don't I don't like to hold those emotions in when I'm feeling them. I like to let it out. But sometimes it comes out as rage. Sometimes it comes out as like, I'm smashing shit around the gym, like, I'll throw weights around or scream or turn on some really loud death metal music and like, just scream and shake and like, let that shit out, you know, like metal feel better? Maybe? Could be, could be. But yeah, I think it's good to let it out. I just went through a breathwork course. It's called somatic breathwork release. And you do this pretty crazy intense breathing for like,

Sam Fischer  30:35
Now is this for stress? Or is it for physical stuff?

30:39
Both really, I think it's for anything, the way he was explaining it was that the body holds on to stuff there's this book called The Body Keeps the Score. I can't remember who the author is. But it talks about how when traumatic events happen, a lot of times those emotions will be stored, like, the common phrase is like, where do you keep your stress? Like a lot of people keep their stress on their shoulders, right? That saying has some truth to it, right? Like, yeah, that saying has truth to it, the body holds on to emotions, and there's ways to release those. But this breathwork pattern does that. And when I was doing it, you it's like five minutes of very intense breathing. And then you do a big breath hold to let all the air out and you hold your breath at the bottom. And then you just hold your breath as long as you can. And you get what's called, I think it's called tetani. It's like you get like these T Rex hands like they get really tight, and your muscles will tingle. It's just like a natural effect of having a lot of like oxygen in your body because you're over breathing. They call it and the guy's guiding you through it as you're doing it. He's like, Where have you been feeling stressed what's stuck in your body. And I just this was recently after the April 26th thing this year, and I just got this crazy urge to cry. Like I don't normally cry either. I don't like to. I don't typically do it. For myself, I don't like to feel it for myself. I will cry for other people. I feel sad for other people. I can empathize with other people really well now, but I still don't like to empathize with myself for my younger self for things that happened to me. I don't get the luxury of that is like what I the lie. I tell myself. And I just got this crazy urge to cry and I just cried. I just like let it out. And I felt 100 pounds lighter. It felt like a huge weight was off of my chest. You know, and I don't even know exactly what it was formed through. It was just an amalgamation of things. But I felt way better after I did it. So I think sometimes letting it out is necessary.

Sam Fischer  32:34
Yeah, well, yeah, I just don't know where that valve is on me someday I'll find it. But I

32:39
it's it's hard. Again, it's different for everybody. Right? Like this shit is not very uniform across the board for humans.

Sam Fischer  32:46
No, it's not. It's not but it is. It's a very human. I mean, animals cry. I mean, I think I mean, so it's not it's, it's, it's an animal, animalistic instinct. Oh, another thing that you've talked about in your past, and it's something that I'm probably guilty of, and I really want to have a chat with you about is that you've said in the past that you are like, you really are. Get angry with yourself. You demand a lot of yourself or that you? You know, there have been many times in my life and I'll say it out ly loud. My wife, my wife will will admonish me. But I'll say, you know, you stupid son of a bitch Sam. I mean, I will say that is I, I I believe I held hold myself to a very, very high standard of whatever it is I'm doing and there there are certain things in the world that I I'm, I'm miles away from that. CrossFit is one of those things. But yeah, that was also kind of a detrimental thing to your health. So I'm learning through you like maybe I need to get some help here. But I mean, I don't I don't hate on myself every day. But I'm very, very hard on myself. I'm I'm definitely very, very hard on myself. How did you deal so give us the background of that. And how did you How have you ultimately resolved that?

34:17
Yeah, I was my own worst enemy. By far. I could do nothing, right. If you asked me and every, like the replay record in my mind was you're a loser. You're a piece of shit. You're a failure. You're never gonna amount to anything. See, that's

Sam Fischer  34:33
different, though than what I don't have those feelings. That's so that's interesting. Okay, go ahead. Yeah, sorry. No, you're fine. And not to interrupt my guests this year.

34:45
We all got to learn something new. Right. That's getting uncomfortable. That's right. Yeah, it was. It was just on repeat. And I think a lot of it was instilled in me by my dad. I don't think he was doing it consciously. But he would say that shit to me. a lot. And I still get into these, like cycles of saying that shit to myself. But it was so bad. It was so bad that I realized that when I started the business, like I learned a lot about myself starting a business, the amount of stress that that is. I burned the boats, man, like when I started my business, I quit my full time job, I had nothing else lined up, I said, I'm literally going all in on this business, I want to help people, I want to do something that I find meaningful that provides value to society. I do not want to be a lazy piece of shit. That's what I'm terrified of. And I'm still terrified of being a lazy piece of shit. I hate that. And when I see laziness in people, I immediately resent them. But now I understand that it's I'm scared that I could be lazy, because there was a point in my life where I think I was, you know, I didn't think about it. But it's, it's, that's terrifying to me to be like being lazy is terrifying to me. But it got to the point where I couldn't function anymore. Like, I'd be on these, this roller coaster of emotions, I'd be super high one day, and I'd be so down in the dumps the other day that I like, I'm gonna burn the whole gym down. I don't give a shit anymore. I can't do anything, right. It's all useless. It was affecting my marriage, my friendships. And I just recognized like, if I want to take this thing to a higher level, if I want to do more things or accomplish more things, which is important to me, as a person, like achievement, I placed a lot of value on me getting shit done and doing things which there's probably something around that I need to work on to, but I'm not going to get into that yet. Because I like getting shit done. It's fun.

Sam Fischer  36:30
Well, activity is good. That's a good yes.

36:33
Right. And that's, that's part of the get uncomfortable thing is like, I like to get shit done. I like to do things I like to get a lot of stuff done in a day, that is uncomfortable have to wake up really early. Sometimes you have to work really late. But that's great. Like, I think I want to squeeze all the juice out of life. But the way I ended up dealing with it was I went to a therapist, and I did what's called EMDR. They're

Sam Fischer  36:56
glad you're talking about this, because that's fascinating. And please yeah, please listen.

37:00
This is very, very, it's very powerful shit. Like, I

Sam Fischer  37:05
really listen, this is really interesting. Go ahead.

37:08
This is really important. For me, it was I didn't I actually had one of my clients tell me about it that they went and did it at one point. And the I don't remember, I think it's like Eye Movement Desensitization and repolarization is what it stands for, it's EMDR, you'd want to find a therapist who's certified in it, because it's a very specific technique. But what it does is it links both hemispheres of the brain together to process a certain emotion or an event or a trauma or a thought that you're having. So what she said was, when I went in, I sat down, we had an initial session, and she just like explained what was going to happen. And she said, Okay, so the way that this works is you have to bring up the emotions, the thoughts, the feelings, see the visual, whatever story is going on in your head, the words that you hear, you know, when you're associated with these, this crazy trauma or whatever you're beating yourself up about, you get all worked up into like a frenzied state emotionally and psychologically. And it can crack some shit open, because you're going back into things that you don't really want to dive into. Right? It's very, very uncomfortable. And so the first session was that, and then she said, Okay, you're gonna come back to the next one, and then we're going to do it, but I needed to get you ready and do an evaluation and make sure that you're like, sane enough to do this, you won't go drive your car off a cliff after you do it. And those were my words, not hers. And she, so we went in the next time, and she said, Okay, this is the part where you bring up the thoughts, the feelings, you see the person's face, who says that shit to you. And I always thought it was my dad, like, I always thought because my dad would say that shit to me all the time, he would always say, you're never gonna amount to anything, you know, you're a loser, you're gonna be a failure for the rest of your life. So I was trying to see that in my mind's eye. And I told her, I'm like, It's not working. Like, and I just said the words like, it doesn't feel the same as when I see him saying is when I think it to myself, and she was like, Oh, shit, you have internalized those thoughts and those feelings so much that it's part of your core belief system of who you are. You truly believe that you're a loser. You truly believe that you're a failure? And I was like, oh, yeah, okay, now we're getting somewhere like, I can agree with you on that. Like, she was like, Yeah, because that's what you think. It? Yeah, I mean, and I didn't even know how bad it was, you know, like, it was just normal. So I live my life. And so I thought that I heard myself thinking things myself, and I kept saying, and I really got, like, hateful. I started sending, like, just terrible shit to myself, like the shit that I would say every day and got so worked up, ready to cry. I was just squeezing screaming, I was so mad. And then she does the thing to like, they take their fingers back and forth and you follow their fingers with your eyes. And that links both hemispheres of the brain together. Apparently, this is what she said. And it's supposed to help you process the trauma. And I did that. She did it one Time, literally one time. And I stopped. And I was like, I don't feel worked up anymore. And I was like, I messed it up. I clearly I failed. I messed it up. I fucked that up. Like, that's my fault. Let me try to get, let me try to get worked up again. I like took a couple of breaths and I was sitting up and I was like, Okay, here we go, I can do this. And I could not I could not do it again. Like, I would think the same words. I would say the same things to myself. But it literally felt like I was reading a newspaper in a different language. It meant nothing to me. And she was sitting here like this with her hands over her face. Like she was like try not to laugh because she knew it worked right away. She was like she you were so dialed in on what was messing you up what you were so caught on that you were able to work right through it on the first one. And I was like, I remember I said, I'm like you're a wizard like you're a witch. What did you just do to me? That's like magic. Wicked. It's pretty wicked. Dude, it was the craziest trick. Yeah,

Sam Fischer  40:53
I'd be scared to death to try something like that. Oh, man. So it's really just the cowboy in the egg head baby. The two sides that Yeah, true. But it's kind of funny. That's a fantastic story. What worked? And that's what's that's what's beautiful about it. I mean, it worked. So you obviously in your, in your practices and stuff you you encourage people to get right mentally. I mean, when people come to the gym, sometimes I mean, there's no perfect quarter on how to get this all done, you know, first get yourself mentally squared away. Secondly, do this. No, you just got to frickin do it all. But you do place a heavy emphasis on on mental well being in your business, do you not?

41:41
Yes, yes. That's something I talk about with all my clients. Eventually, some people aren't ready for it right away. But like the other day, I have this guy who runs a financial advisory firm. And he is super stressed out all the time. Like he comes in. Sometimes he'll say, like, oh, stress just gets me I think I got a cold or something he like has a hard time breathing. And he's short of breath. And it's because he's so stressed out. Like, it's clearly that he's so stressed out. It's like you're not sick, you don't have a cold, like, you're so stressed, bro, you need to like take a breath. So I got him on. Starting to do meditation guided meditation. Like that's a big thing I have a lot of people do. But yeah, I place a big emphasis on that. Because they go hand in hand, the mind and the body are not separate. We like to in Western society, we'd like to make them separate. And we'd like to say that one is fine without the other. And really, they're so closely tied. And a lot of times the the I guess the gateway to somebody being okay with talking about their mental health or improving their mental health is by improving their physical health, doing something they didn't think they could do you see this at CrossFit all the time. That's why I love CrossFit people would do shit that they were like, I never thought I'd be able to do that. And they gain a little bit of self confidence, right? They stack another chip in the basket of self confidence instead of I'm a loser, and I can't do anything. They're taking chips out of the loser want to put it in the self-confidence one,

Sam Fischer  43:03
I think and Oregon schools, that's a pretty jar, doesn't he? He draws from that. So yeah, in the jar,

43:09
exactly. That's what it is. And that's how a lot of people, for me, that's how I can open up a lot of people to it. They think they're coming in for personal training sessions. And then I've had so many people will be like, I come back for the conversations, like, because it's like a therapy session sometimes. And I like that I like connecting to people. I really enjoy that. That's why I like doing the podcast. So I like doing stuff like this because I enjoy learning about people and talking to them. And like, I went through a lot of shit. And I hope that maybe some of the tools that I've used can help you to and I can You can see them change, they get in better shape, they start to talk about themselves better, they have more self respect. So then they start eating better. And then they go to bed on time. And maybe they cut back their alcohol intake and it's like, damn, we're just making the world a better place one person at a time. And that's the goal, right?

Sam Fischer  43:56
Yep. That's absolutely it's a process or it's a journey, and it's not perfect, and it's not linear. It's all over the place. Right. Great stuff. So che i would like you would you before we we kind of closes out what would you give my listeners and I attach a challenge. Can you think of a challenge you'd like to give us to get uncomfortable? I mean, maybe, you know it could be something like Be careful what you wish for Fisher but you know, go tell your wife something that she doesn't know about you? That's yeah, that's that's uncomfortable, isn't it? You have something like that.

44:34
Yeah, I'm gonna start I'm gonna start at a different a different spot because that might open a can of worms for somebody that they might need a therapist to help put the lid back on. It

Sam Fischer  44:46
could be good or bad but yeah, okay. You weren't too bad. But yeah,

44:50
yeah, I always immediately like what's the worst case scenario? That's what's gonna happen Hey,

Sam Fischer  44:54
honey, did you know I could sing it? No, I'm just kidding.

44:58
Here's gonna be my challenge because This is gonna help the mental and the physical. This is why I like this one is a good place to start for everybody start taking cold showers. Okay, so

Sam Fischer  45:08
yes. And I'm sorry, I'm going to interrupt because I'm trying this and it clears your head. But go ahead. Sorry, I did it. But no, sorry to say it's a great, go ahead.

Shea McMaster  45:20
I'm glad you're excited about it. Because it's so I haven't,

Sam Fischer  45:23
I haven't been too much of a dipshit to get it all done. But go ahead, sorry,

45:27
taking cold showers. Starting with cold starts, here's how you start. Here's why you should do it first, though. One, there's a lot of research on it that shows that it's very powerful anti inflammatory, so it can help mitigate and manage pain, if you have a lot of pain and inflammation in your body can help reduce that which is very, a very strong driver for a lot of people's anxiety, depression, feeling stuck or stagnant in life, because they feel like they can't do something because they're in constant pain. So the physical side, it really is powerful there. But the mental side, too is it teaches you to persist, it teaches you to go through something that's difficult and recognize after you did it, like damn, I did that. And I can get through hard shit on a small scale, right. And then you can take that out to a bigger scale. But also it has powerful effects for anxiety and depression, reducing symptoms of anxiety and depression. There's so much we're in a large mental health crisis right now. And that's tied to poor physical health. And that's tied to people not having a purpose or feeling valued or whatever it is, but it's, it's a double edged sword, it improves on both things. So you just take your normal shower, you start with a normal shower. And then for the first like three or four days, you finish with a cold shower, turn that knob and it's, you're gonna want to not do it, your brain, your body, everything's gonna scream, don't do it. The first thing your minds gonna say is that I'm not going to do that today. Like, I don't feel like doing it today. That's when you have to do it. And you only have to do it for like 30 seconds to start. Right. And you just do that consistently for a week.

Sam Fischer  46:56
It is called neural plasticity. Che Have you ever heard of that word? Yep. That's one of my favorite terms. Really? neuroplasticity? So might stay tuned listeners. Well, wait, nevermind there. They will have heard a podcast from my, from my cousin. She used that word like what does that mean? But neuroplasticity means ability to change your mind. So basically. And so it it's it's fascinating, because ultimately, it's just cold. We've all been cold. For God's sakes, we all been cold for an extended amount of time. But it's it's such an emblematic way of getting uncomfortable. I mean, just literally getting uncomfortable. But you can live through it, you're gonna die. And and you'll probably find that you do it more than once after you've done it once. I mean, do you do it quite often then shade? You do it every time you take a shower? Or how do you how do you implement it into your daily routine?

47:44
Yeah, almost almost every time I take a shower, but the one the one thing you need to be careful about with doing these cold showers is if you do have a heart condition, you should definitely talk to your doctor before you do this. Because it can be kind of a shock to the body. And I just like to if I ever recommended in a public place. I like to just say check with your doctor before.

Sam Fischer  48:03
But that's right. We're not trying to kill people out there, folks. But yeah, I don't want you to do it or any of those things. Yes, but But it is. It's a fantastic. It's a fantastic piece of advice. Thank you. It's yeah, listeners try it. It is it is wicked cool. I mean, literally cool. But here's what

48:23
I did. I actually took I bought an old chest freezer from somebody on like Facebook marketplace, and I put a bunch of like marine sealant on the inside of it, filled it up with water, and then I just plug it into the wall on an electrical timer. My tick tock actually, we have a tick tock get uncomfortable pod on tick tock, you can go see one of my ice bath videos, but I just hop I unplug it obviously, before you do it, you unplug it. And I hop into that and I keep it at a consistent temperature. I have a like a thermometer in there. And I keep it around like 37 to 33 degrees somewhere in there. And I just literally hop into my ice bath in my garage, like in the summertime almost every single day. And then in the wintertime I'll usually do cold showers. And I never want to do it. It's the same every day. Like I know how good I'm gonna feel after I never want to do it and then I go nope, we have to do it now because you had a little bitch as voice in your head saying don't do it.

Sam Fischer  49:14
Yeah, Goggins talks about sometimes he'll just look at his running shoes for half hour just staring at him. Friggin do it. You know, even God. So great stuff. Man. This has been a great pod. I really appreciate it. This year, I've done something different at the end. And that was five quick questions. But for you, I'm going to mix it up a little bit. What I'm going to do is I'm just going to say something and I want you to have like two or three words for word association. So you know, the psychological kind of thing. So yeah, be fun. These are great things. Ready? Okay, I'm ready. Here we go. 2000 meter row pain, chocolate chip cookie dough. Evil boo pepperoni pizza.

Shea McMaster  50:08
Love it love.

Sam Fischer  50:11
Good boy 100 burpees for time

Shea McMaster  50:18
positive challenge

Sam Fischer  50:19
you're so full of shit. I love it I

50:22
do it every time I move somewhere I do all the time I swear to god.

Sam Fischer  50:27
Oh my god. Okay, I

Shea McMaster  50:29
break into new space

Sam Fischer  50:32
corn syrup.

Shea McMaster  50:36
Bad poor health.

Sam Fischer  50:38
That's actually evil. Yeah, yeah. Barbell thrusters. Awful. That's my word for that text test in your honesty here foul. See, how about another one? barbus lips.

Shea McMaster  50:57
Fun. I love him. For Canadians.

Sam Fischer  51:00
Che Thanks. Thanks a lot. It's a great pod. If we if our listeners want to get a hold of you, they can go to you're on Instagram. pretty active there. Enlightened athlete on Instagram, right. And you've always got really good stuff up there. And again, just appreciate the friendship and appreciate the pod man.

Shea McMaster  51:27
Yeah, dude, thank you so much for having me on. This is a blast. I really appreciate it.