**SPECIAL REPEAT ** The Truman Show - with Special Guests Jeremy Aspen and Tom Becka

The Truman Show (Re-Release) — Fear, Truth, and the World We Think We’re Living In

What if the world you’re living in… isn’t as real as you think?

In this re-release of one of the most thought-provoking conversations we’ve had on Cowboys Not Eggheads, we use The Truman Show as a jumping-off point to wrestle with something much bigger: fear, truth, media, and the uncomfortable question of whether we’re actually seeking reality—or just comfort.

This wasn’t a scripted episode. No outline. No guardrails. Just three guys—Sam, Jeremy Aspen, and Tom Becka—pushing on ideas, challenging each other, and following the conversation wherever it led. And that’s exactly what makes it worth revisiting.

We get into:

•  Why fear can both protect you and control you 
•  Whether “your truth” is real—or just your perspective 
•  How media and culture shape what we believe is reality 
•  The difference between cowboys and eggheads—and why you might need both 
•  And ultimately… who you trust when it actually matters 

This episode didn’t blow up the first time around—but not every conversation is built for the masses. Some are built for people willing to think a little deeper.

So here it is again.

At some point, like Truman, you have to decide:
Are you staying where it’s comfortable… or stepping into the unknown?

Hope isn't a strategy! 

Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:00

Let me ask you something. What if the world you're living in isn't actually real? What if you've been shaped, filtered, maybe even manipulated, and you didn't even know it? That's the idea behind the Truman Show. But the more I've thought about it, the more I've realized the movie might not be as far off as we'd like to believe. This episode is one of those conversations that just happened. No script, no agenda, just three very different guys sitting down and trying to make sense of things. Fear, truth, media, trust, and whether we're actually searching for what's real or just what makes us comfortable. Now I'll be honest with you, this wasn't one of our biggest episodes when it first came out almost four years ago. But I've gone back and listened to it again, and I think there's something here that deserves another shot. Because at some point every one of us has to face the same question Truman did. Are we willing to step outside the world we know, even if it scares the hell out of us? So I'm bringing this one back. This is the Truman Show. Let's see what you hear this time.

SPEAKER_00 1:11

Welcome to Cowboys, not Eggheads. Home of the brave, not home of the fearful. The world needs more cowboys and fewer eggheads. We're everywhere podcasts are found. So tell your fellow cowboys. And let's keep the conversation alive on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter. Remember to subscribe, rate, review, and share. And now, Cowboys Not Eggheads with Sam Fisher.

SPEAKER_04 1:43

Well, here we are, 18 months later, after the first episode of Cowboys Not Eggheads, and I am honestly I'm grateful. I'm grateful and I'm excited and I'm privileged to welcome my friend Jeremy Aspen back to the program. 18 months. I uh I'm glad you said that. I did not know it had been that long. That's crazy. And we brought along uh Tom Becca. Now, Tom Becca probably doesn't need an introduction, but we do have listeners in all 50 states and 35 countries now. Very cool. So Tom Becca is uh a local Omaha Purse TV and radio personality for what, 30 years? About 30 years, yeah. 30 years. So if you don't know who Tom Becca is, you can catch him on Fox Fox 42. Fox 42 KPTM.

SPEAKER_01 2:27

And I do a thing called Becca's Beat. It's on Fox42Kptm.com.

SPEAKER_04 2:32

And you're on Facebook too. You're pretty active on Facebook. Facebook, Twitter. So during the pandemic, I I I had to de-friend Tom Becca because he was driving me f crazy. Um he viewed the pandemic a little differently than I did. So but we uh I think we all respect each other. We I don't think there's one guy in this room that's gonna agree with everything that anybody says today. Maybe we will, maybe we won't, but we are gonna have a good conversation. So thanks guys for being here. I appreciate it. Thank you for having me. Yeah, that's really good. It's gonna be fun. So the first thing I want to get uh uh one of the things that Tom Becca that the like the only redeeming quality of Becca in my my in my opinion is that he used to used to be a stand-up comedian, and Tom has been very supportive in my uh quest to be a stand-up comedian, which I will do it, I promise. I've spated it more than once on this podcast that I will go up there and and take the run at it.

SPEAKER_01 3:27

But your opening joke.

SPEAKER_04 3:30

Oh, it has to do with CrossFit and cowboys.

SPEAKER_01 3:33

So um Say something funny. Say something intelligent, quick, you know. If you're gonna do just out of the thing that they'll say, well, you're a comedian? Well, say something funny.

SPEAKER_02 3:44

Well shit, it's uh it's not the right premise. Um yeah, it's like saying to a singer, Oh, sing me something.

SPEAKER_04 3:51

Can I sing you shit? But uh so Tom was actually you actually did it for a living for what how long? Five, six years? About five years ago. Five years. So you were on the road, on the rugged road opening up for lots of famous comedians. One of them was my hero, Sam Kennison.

SPEAKER_03 4:07

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 4:08

Um, and so will you tell my so so my listeners know Sam Kinnison uh since I was in high school has been I I think I lived my my entire life is based on something Kennison said. I can quote him chapter verse uh just everything. I just think he was he's the perfect consummate comedian, in my opinion. He had the physicality, he had the attitude, he had the content, he had the energy, he had the brains, and man was this guy uh unconventional. I mean, I and I'll I'll shut up here in a minute, I'll let Tom talk. But uh I I just remember seeing a documentary about him. The comp when he was at the comedy store in LA, all these people, we're talking guys like Jay Leno, we're talking about guys like um George Lopez, we're talking about guys like I don't, I don't know, Seinfeld, but uh uh these very Jerry Jim Carrey, Robin Williams, guys that all wanted to stay to watch Kinison, because I think he had the midnight spot or something at Mitzi's place, um, because he was going to talk about stuff that nobody had given he was going places no one had ever gone. I mean a real Lenny Bruce kind of a comedian. But tell me about your your time with Sam Kinison.

SPEAKER_01 5:21

My time with Sam Kinison was minimal, but I worked with a lot of other comics that worked with him a lot. Uh the first comic that ever brought me up on stage with Old Mike Knight was uh Mark Marin. Mark uh was a great comedy.

SPEAKER_04 5:36

And uh he does, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:38

And I'm not going to say that Mark and I are friends. I knew Mark when he was in the drug and alcohol days, and uh he was not he was not the nicest person, so we were not friends, but I knew him back then and he would tell stories about Sam. Uh one of the stories was how he was staying at the house, you know, the condo where uh right behind the comedy store where a lot of the comics stayed. And since Mark was a doorman there, Mitzi let him stay there. Sam also stayed there. There were nights that Mark would sleep in the closet so that Sam couldn't find him to party at like four or five in the morning, you know? He'd be waking up, come on, get up here, you know? Because he's tired of partying, just get her to sleep. Yeah, and you know, and he didn't want to tick off Sam because Sam had so much power with the club. So he would actually sleep in the sleep in the closet. Um, but um, yeah, no, Sam was I worked with Sam about uh maybe three, three, four weeks before he died. Uh he had just gotten married. He just got married. I was in Oklahoma, and he had stopped in, he's from Oklahoma, and he had stopped in with his new wife, and um he had uh uh was visiting family, and his brother was his manager and everything. And I was I'd been at the club. I was working in the club, and it was like, okay, uh, you know, Sam's Sam's working like you know, Monday, Tuesday night for the door, and I was in town, so there you go. Um and it was just a thing where it was like uh, you know, he was he was a very nice guy, very nice guy. Funny as hell, uh not every joke that he took that he was working on some of the material and not every joke that he did stuck, you know, because it was a thing where it's like, yeah. One of the things that made Sam great was that he was fearless. Yes. And when you're fearless, you're not taking the safe road. And if you're not taking the safe road, sometimes you're not gonna, you know, hit, right? Right. And so some of the best comics that I ever saw bombed miserably. Now, I saw a lot of crabby comics that bombed miserably too, but but some of the best comics I ever saw bombed miserably because they would try new things.

SPEAKER_04 7:26

Yeah, willing to roll the dice.

SPEAKER_01 7:27

Yeah, you know, uh the thing, I mean, Sam was his own demons, you know. I mean, Sam had his own demons. That was that was a thing. When I saw him, he was pretty uh pretty clean uh at the time that I saw him. He had he had uh gone through rehab and he was you know clean, but although uh uh when he died, uh the Torrenter found uh he he had a little cocaine in his system when he died. But um, you know, but he was he was not out of control. Uh he was very funny, the crowd loved him, and uh yeah, but yeah, but his his partying days were legendary, but so is it like you said, so are his routines.

SPEAKER_03 8:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:02

You know, I mean, uh the routines he did about, you know, about uh you know, Jesus' last words, the routines he did about his ex-wives, the routine that he did about, you know, uh the scene of the crucifixion is where I just got me is like uh unb I might repeat the joke, but I mean it was unbelievably it's so visceral and but funny. I mean and it's and it's funny because you know what? It very well could have been true.

SPEAKER_04 8:27

It very could have been it could have been. That's what makes things funny, is because they're true. Yeah. So there recently, and we'll get off this, but uh recently I can't remember the gentleman's name, I'll give you the YouTube clip, but he talked about uh oh, he was talking to Rogan about Kennison, and he said that um when Kennison was at the height, you know, I uh what the late 80s, he had, you know, the the videos, and I mean everybody knew who he was, all the rock he party with all the rock stars when he was at that height. Um, he had a gig, I think, in New York City. We'll just say New York City, and he he basically booked every ex-girlfriend he ever had and put them all on the same floor in this hotel. Just to have fun with it. Like they all knew each other, hated each other, but that's just Kinison.

SPEAKER_01 9:14

I'm gonna tell you what something else, something else about Sam, is that if you were one of Sam's guys, or if Sam liked your act, he would get you work.

SPEAKER_04 9:21

Yeah, but he was loyal.

SPEAKER_01 9:22

Yeah, he he was very loyal to his to his fan to his friends, and and that. So if you were one of his guys, and you know, I mean there was Carla Bove and some of the ones that were more noticeable, yeah, but uh other ones that were just you know guys that he saw and liked. Uh I I know of a comic um who uh wound up getting phone calls out of the blue from um clubs saying, yeah, Sam said I should book you. You know, and so yeah, you know, and that's so uh and and generous guy. Yeah, very very much so, yeah. So I you know, and that's the thing, and and and you and I were talking a little bit about this. Oh, hit the mic. I'm a professional.

SPEAKER_04 10:00

Um it's it's rigged just to mess with you there.

SPEAKER_01 10:04

Yeah. Um the uh you know, we talked about this a little bit before the the podcast is that you know, if all you you just label Sam as being that wild guy, right? That wild, that wild drug addicted, drunk, crazy womanizer.

SPEAKER_04 10:20

That's what we saw.

SPEAKER_01 10:21

Yeah, but that's not who he was. That's not all of who he was. That was who he was, but that's not all of who he was.

SPEAKER_03 10:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:27

And I think sometimes we miss a lot of the subtleties in life. You know, when we're talking about Dunga, what is a cowboy, what is an egghead, you know, and then you know you would say that Sam Kinison was a cowboy, right?

SPEAKER_04 10:39

Um Yes.

SPEAKER_02 10:41

Yes, I think every comedian is an egghead because you have to be brilliant.

SPEAKER_04 10:46

Well, you have to be courageous, you have to be fearless.

SPEAKER_01 10:50

No, no, but you have to be smart. I mean, you have to be smart to put the recommends a different way. I mean, I don't know, brilliant, but you at least have to be to be really good, you have to look at things.

SPEAKER_04 10:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:00

That's yeah, and and and you have to have to have some guts and maybe a little bit of stupidity to get up there in the first place. You know, I mean, you say you gotta be brilliant. You know, it's a pretty dumb idea to say touch is stupid. I'm gonna get on stage and think that all these people that have no idea who I am are gonna find me fascinating and make a career out of it.

SPEAKER_04 11:16

Yeah, that's stupid. Well, last thing about Kennison is I uh about uh three years ago before the pandemic, I was in Tulsa and uh he's buried in the memorial, uh I think it's called the Tulsa Memorial Cemetery. My uncle's actually buried there. It's one of the largest cemeteries in the country, it's huge. But we had to find his his grave is is is very um you would you it's it's it's it's a stone that's flat on the ground, and you had to there was like leaves and stuff, and we had to I had to literally I had to like you know clean his the the faceplate of this gravestone off and it was very simple, understated grave. And it said I think it said Sam Kinson, another life he would be a prophet. Um but it gives me chills is talking about it. But I mean, just just very unassume. Uh he's married next to his father. But uh anyway. I think it would have been more funny if it would have said still high. True. So today I wanted to talk about thank you for sharing that. I really appreciate that. Uh it's it's good stuff. Um what I wanted to talk about today, I we're gonna call this uh episode the Truman Show. And and uh for our listeners who haven't seen The Truman Show, go see The Truman Show, it's a fantastic film, and it's uh it was made in 1998, and the premise of the show is it's uh Jim Carrey stars as Truman Burbank. He's the unsuspecting star of his own show called The Truman Show. It's a reality television program filled 24-7 through thousands of hidden cameras and that broadcasts the world audio to a world audience. Christoph is the show's creator, he's played by Ed Harris, and he's the show's executive producer, and he seeks to capture Truman's authentic emotions and give audience a relatable everyman. And it it basically goes through the life of Truman, and everybody in the world is watching Truman, and Truman kind of suspects that something's a little bit off, everything's just a little bit too what's the word? Surreal or real sterile, sterile, and it's a fascinating movie, and uh it uh I watched it I don't know a couple months ago, and I thought, man, we should have a podcast about this because it seems I think there's a lot of topics there that we can maybe uh discuss today. Um, that maybe I I feel sort of the same thing is going on sometimes. And so it came out in '98, which I find to be fascinating because there was no reality TV in 1998. It really didn't start until the turn of the till 2000. Um was it do you guys think it was ahead of uh of of its time, the show?

SPEAKER_02 13:55

Um well, so these kinds of thought experiments, as far as movies go, I you know, I don't know because a lot of producers, directors, whatever they are that make movies, one thing a lot of times I find is that they really do fuel their artistic, their, their, their artisticness with philosophy. And this is no exception. I mean, this idea of us living in like an alternative universe uh universe or us um being like the matrix, like living in it in a in an alter uh in an alternate universe is is not new. Um, but what that movie did is it made it I don't know, it made it modern, it made it really entertaining, and it made you think, which is kind of the whole idea behind philosophy in these thought experiments, which that movie was. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 14:48

What did you think of the movie we first saw, Tom? Did you see it back in 98 or did you see it later on?

SPEAKER_01 14:51

And I saw it in the theaters when it first came out, and I haven't uh thought of it much really since then, uh, until you brought it up earlier today. Uh it it was fascinating, and it goes to the you know, the old Andy Warhol speech so that you know and it's what just come true. You know, and sometime everybody's gonna be famous for 15 minutes. Yeah, and and that's what it was. You know, Truman had gone through there, and and it was all just very, like you said, very surreal. Um another movie I put in that same category is Being There, which is another one. If you if you know that one with Peter Sellers, where he plays Chance the Gardner. And Chance the Gardner becomes like this expert, and he's the only this expert because he's just repeating things he heard. He has no thought process, but he's basically just if somebody says something, you know, um uh it's a lovely day today, chance would say, Yes, it's a lovely day today. And the guy would say, Yeah, okay, this guy thinks just like me. He's a good guy, you know. Oh, it was a very interesting thing.

SPEAKER_04 15:50

So so it's like life on flashcards or something.

SPEAKER_01 15:54

So movies like this.

SPEAKER_04 15:55

That's how I got through college, by the way, it's flashcards. Flashcards.

SPEAKER_01 15:58

So so that was a joke.

SPEAKER_04 16:00

So he laughed. That's good.

SPEAKER_01 16:01

Uh so so so movies like this I think are are interesting because it does give us sort of a look into ourselves in in a strange way. You know, I mean, if you look at the Truman show, yeah, it was about this guy being observed the whole time, but it really was us sort of like looking almost living vicariously through the character.

SPEAKER_04 16:19

Yeah, looking at ourselves. Yeah. I think the deeper meaning of the, and this this this will be a fun statement because you guys might uh pop it down. And um I think the deeper meaning of the Truman show, honestly for me, the way I see it is is it's facing the fear of uncertainty, um, and being brave in the face of uncertainty. Uh, and it's kind of our spiritual journey to seek the truth. So this ought to be a 10-minute segment. Go ahead. Oh wow. Go ahead, fellas. Well, I would have that when you when you said that you when you I had to write that down, listeners. I'm not that smart to actually remember all that.

SPEAKER_02 16:54

That's exactly what I would have said about it being more a search for the truth. Because to me, it really is like the the the entire journey, you know, in life is to have at the end of it a better understanding of how things actually are. Like I put a very high value on how understanding how things are. And this sort of uh But that's in your own relative terms. Uh no, I I I'm not a I'm not a relativist.

SPEAKER_04 17:24

Yeah, but you but you see it that way, I might see it this way. So are things really the what the way they see?

SPEAKER_01 17:30

Well, but okay, but that's that's what the problem that's what the problem with the the word truth is. Okay, yeah. Well, I mean if you if you've got if you've got things like two plus two is four, yeah, that's truth, okay? Yes, mathematics are true.

SPEAKER_04 17:40

Axiomatic. Axiomatic. Axiomatic.

SPEAKER_03 17:46

Last four.

SPEAKER_04 17:46

It was autodynatic last time. Now it's axiomatic. Go ahead and tell our listeners what that means.

SPEAKER_02 17:52

It's foundational. It is one of the very few basics from which we build everything else. So it so for like a statement like two plus one plus one equals two, we have to use that as an axiom. And then from there we can surmise that we can do we can understand that two plus one equals three.

SPEAKER_00 18:12

Attention. Egghead alert.

SPEAKER_04 18:14

Okay, so we all agree the mathematics are true, but everything else is is kind of we talked about it in the first part. You can shop for the truth. So, but everyone has their own truth. Yeah. And we're all seeking our own truth.

SPEAKER_02 18:24

I I don't think that's I disagree when I hear people say that uh we each have our own truth. We all have our own understanding of how things are, but especially since I ground myself mostly in physics, um I it it there is a way that things are, and our interpretation of it is is is inconsequential to how things are. Uh now is it's consequential to our lives, you know. We may react to how we interpret something um incorrectly or correctly, but the fact that something is moving at seven miles an hour over there is true, right? Well, I can get into the theory of relativity and all that stuff, but I don't think that anybody can when people use the phrase, my truth is it's not I I I try to correct him and just say your interpretation, your understanding of how things are is one thing. But but it leaves there is plenty of room for them to have a pair of I have a pair of sweatpants upstairs, I should go get them.

SPEAKER_04 19:27

But I swear on the Bible they're black. My wife says they're blue. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:33

Well, when I was doing talk radio, you know, I mean, my my my slogan was honesty, integrity, and a sense of humor. Because you're right. I a lot of talk radio hosts say, I've got the truth. Here's the truth. No, no, this is my honest opinion.

SPEAKER_04 19:46

Well, it's the truth for those that want to shop for your truth.

SPEAKER_01 19:48

Yeah, yeah, you know, but but but that's just it. But it's not. I'll be honest.

SPEAKER_04 19:52

Shots for your truth.

SPEAKER_01 19:53

This is what I believe. This is what I think.

SPEAKER_03 19:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:56

But yeah, but you know, but it's not that I don't know if it's the truth, you know, it's my views. You know, I mean, if if if you like like when you get into a into faith, if somebody says that, you know, they believe that their religion is the truth, the true religion. No, this is your belief. I'll I'll respect if it's your belief. If you tell me that it's the truth, I I I I can't respect that.

SPEAKER_02 20:16

And then uh to the point of black versus blue. Um okay, here we go. Just really quickly physics, man. Axiom axiomatic. Black is a it pure black is uh to absorb all light, right? That's how we would define the color black. So b so blue reflects certain a certain wavelength, which is in the blue spectrum. So But I see it as black. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 20:43

Yeah, but but I don't give a shit about your spectra thing or not. I wouldn't see it as black.

SPEAKER_02 20:49

But now what if you're colorblind? What if you're colorblind and you're looking and you're looking at something exactly.

SPEAKER_04 20:54

So not everybody has colored vision.

SPEAKER_02 20:56

No, no, that's right. But if you're looking at something that's blue, it's still blue, whether or not your brain interprets it that way. Okay, but now for instance. I'm gonna take you back to car.

SPEAKER_04 21:06

Me and Tom are gonna talk. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 21:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 21:15

No, you're you're right. No, but that's but that's it. Okay, so you're wearing a red a red uh sweatshirt. I would agree with it. I don't know what Jeremy thinks it is. He hasn't got a spectrum. Well, hold on a second, but hold on a second.

SPEAKER_01 21:26

But hold on a second, but how do I know? Okay, so this this is this is how I perceive red, all right? But to you, that may actually I mean you may call it red, because but it may actually be what I would call blue.

SPEAKER_02 21:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:37

Because I don't know what you're actually seeing.

unknown 21:39

No.

SPEAKER_02 21:40

There are there's actually even studies on that exact topic. Attention.

SPEAKER_00 21:44

Egghead alert.

SPEAKER_02 21:45

Like I might not believe that you've done I'm not gonna believe that you've done research on this topic. I've not done any research ever on anything. I do read it. I do read it. Do your lips get tired?

SPEAKER_01 22:00

Inner voice.

SPEAKER_02 22:00

Use the inner voice. Inner voice. That was fing. That's why I have no friends.

SPEAKER_04 22:05

Less inside voices. Alright. So wow. Relative truth. There's no such thing as relative truth. So you guys focus on the truth of that statement. I'm going to repeat the statement because that wasn't really, I mean, that was the end result. The statement was the deeper meaning of the Truman show for me was in the face or in the face of the fear of the uncertainty. We were on a spiritual uh journey to find the truth. To me, the word fear in that statement is the most important part of the movie. And that is that Truman is programmed to think that the waters will kill him. That they are they're the dangerous, dangerous. Remember? They they they his father died in a boat wreck, and he went everywhere on that island other than he couldn't get out on the ocean. He tried to get on the road, and all of a sudden they have these manufactured, you know, trees down, and the guy could never leave the island. But so his only way out was the water. And then the end of the day, he was willing to conquer his fear to see what was out there. So to me, that's what the deeper meaning. So we talked about the truth. Let's talk about the fear part of it.

SPEAKER_02 23:19

Well, for me, when when I interpret the way that I interpreted that in the movie was that um he was excited, and that that's what it took, like to have that kind of a why was there you know why he was excited?

SPEAKER_04 23:31

Because he was pursuing freedom.

SPEAKER_02 23:34

Yeah, I would say, or at least the prospect that there might be freedom. Yeah, which is even more exciting. Right. Right? Yeah. Tom.

SPEAKER_04 23:44

I'm really racking my brain because I haven't seen the movie in recently, but uh, you know, but uh what the Remember when he's out on the I mean when he's out on the ocean, Christoph is like, you know, like they're trying to, they are basically trying to kill him because they they are able to manipulate the waves and you know, and he's like, you can't kill him! And he's like, he's yelling at whoever, you can't kill him. It's they were really trying to manipulate him into like going back. They were trying to use the fear factor, but he escaped the fear factor. And to me, that was the biggest moment of the movie. It was huge, very impactful.

SPEAKER_01 24:18

Well, going back to the stand-up comedy thing, I mean, because we're talking about the concept of fear. Yeah. Um, having done stand-up comedy, very few things frighten me anymore. You know, I've I've I've told jokes to a bunch of drunch and you found Alabama, okay? Yeah, you know, where uh where you tell your first joke in the back of the room, some redneck yells, You're a fing Yankee. Well, I mean, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, so so so you know, when you conquer your fears, and and I did a uh a stunt one time when I repelled on the side of a uh uh skyscraper.

SPEAKER_04 24:55

I saw it was one of the funniest God bless you. I don't have the balls to do that. You do. I saw it, and it was one of the funniest things I ever saw because because I could identify like, oh shit, we're not doing this. We're not really gonna oh yes, you are doing it. You know. Well, that was it. That was it.

SPEAKER_01 25:09

The guy said something to me. The guy said something to me that has stuck with me because I'm on the top of the of the woodman tower, which is pretty f ⁇ ing up there. Yeah. 30 stories up, and um and they and I'm not afraid of heights.

SPEAKER_04 25:19

I'm scared to death of heights.

SPEAKER_01 25:20

But I'm afraid I'm afraid of falling, okay? Yes. Right, right. And I'd be I'll be in a white doesn't bother me.

SPEAKER_04 25:26

This maybe why explains why I can s ride an airplane, but if I'm like standing on a freaking skyscraper on the edge of it, I'm a little woozy.

SPEAKER_01 25:34

And what they do is they have you lean back. Yes. And I and I'm I'm I'm and I, by the way, I thought I was this is all broadcast. People that don't know, this is all gonna be broadcast. Yeah. I saw it. It was all broadcast. Is this still out there? It's on YouTube, yeah. Is it all right? Yeah, Tom Bigger is good. And and the thing about it is it was all broadcast. We had I had a microphone on me and they were broadcasting the thing. And prior to this, I had all these witty things I was going to say, right? But then I got to the top of the roof, and all uh all people heard was me going, I mean, seriously, I was I was like, oh.

SPEAKER_04 26:06

Oh no, you were you were like, you I fell for you. I did. And it was funny though, but it was funny because it was true. Oh, it was, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:14

But the guy said to me, the guy said to me, he said, he said that uh I promise you, I promise you two things. He says, I promise you, A, you won't get hurt, and B, if you don't do it, you'll regret it the rest of your life. And that's you know, that that is that is stuck with me. So when you talk, and you could say, you know, the same thing about you know what he's facing is fear to go through the water. If he hadn't done it, regret it the rest of his life. Right. I mean, fear is a great motivator. Yeah, fear is a wonderful motivator.

SPEAKER_04 26:44

It's the only thing that's motivated me in this life episode Killer Kane. But yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:49

And I will say this about you doing the stand-up, because I I've been talking to you now how many years about doing stand-up? Chicken shit, son, bitch.

SPEAKER_04 26:55

When you gonna do it.

SPEAKER_01 26:56

If you don't do it, you're gonna regret it the rest of your life.

SPEAKER_04 26:59

I've heard that number how many years? I'm gonna play guitar on stage someday, too. So I'm I'm gonna do it by the time I'm going to do it.

SPEAKER_01 27:04

And one of these days I'm gonna sleep with Jennifer Anderson, okay? No, but come on, we can make these problems. Do it! Set a timetable, make it happen. And by the way, Jennifer, if you're listening, my telephone number is 867530. So, but um, you know, so so fear is such a great motivator. And that's the thing about it, is that you gotta have fear, and you have to overcome that fear to accomplish anything.

SPEAKER_02 27:27

Yeah, uh, except like even getting involved in some political stuff that I've been involved in and going into biz big business adventures. I don't think I actually experience fear in in in those instances. Like that's not whatever drives me. I really kind of I mean, if I get up on stage and give a speech, you know, you're nervous a little bit, but I find that very uh motivating.

SPEAKER_04 27:53

Like, and and I think usually I do better and that's so I think I actually think I'm gonna kill a comedy because I usually excel when I'm like a little anxious. Yeah, yeah. Um have you ever been fear? Have you ever experienced fear in your entire life?

SPEAKER_02 28:08

Yeah, but the way I guess I reserve it is I remember one time I was crossing a street and uh uh I was running and there was gravel. This was Dodge Street. I ran, slipped, and then went right in front of a truck. My dad pulled me back, like just in a nick of time. And I remember my heart really racing. But um and and but I've never really had any existential threats that put me in a like a true fight or flight kind of like I'm gonna die, fear. Right. But I mean, unless you want to interpret it like, well, the first time I took a flight I I flew an airplane alone. That was you know, that was a very exciting moment of my life that I'll never forget, but I can't say that it was fear. I d I guess I'm not fear-driven, I don't think.

SPEAKER_04 28:53

I I have it's more excitement. I'm not fear-driven, but fear definitely motivates me. I think that's what you said. Yeah, yeah. It definitely, I don't know. It's a sink or swim thing. And some people will just will sink.

SPEAKER_01 29:08

But and again, maybe you're getting into almost somatics, you know, because probably what your excitement uh was what? I mean, there was there was something there, right? So um you you overcame that.

SPEAKER_02 29:24

Uh because you you have to you you have to. I mean, and well, and but I so what I would say is that those are the kinds of experiences that end up defining my last day on the way that I will look back at my life when I'm going to die. And so I always want to have those those spiked, those elevated emotions because they're the ones that stick with me. They're the ones that make me understand that this life is fun and cool and worth living. And that's why so I like take those challenges on just for that reason. Well, like the the the mayor's the recall, right? That we had no business doing that. But they they came up to me and they said, Hey, do you want to do this? It was this is a political campaign years ago, and and I had been doing a radio show.

SPEAKER_04 30:18

I thought, who the hell is Jeremy Asset?

SPEAKER_02 30:20

Right, everybody in Omaha. And that was exactly what it was that drove us, me and my wife's decision. It was that, what the hell do we have to lose? Let's do this thing and let's have fun. And it's one of the best things I've ever done in terms of being able to get involved, and and and and it was driven by more of an excitement. I got up and did my first press conference in that one where I'd there must have been 40 cameras and you're nervous, but I wouldn't ever refer to it as fear. So maybe it is semantics.

SPEAKER_01 30:51

I think so to some extent. I mean, because I always wanted to do stand-up comedy. All right. Um, but um, and actually I got into a uh interesting discussion on Facebook on this today, because I think that um the uh uh being uh sworn in, not sworn in today, but being uh voted in today uh to Tanji uh Brown Jackson is a very important thing. Not not because of her judicial th um uh policies and that, but because it's an image for young black women that look what you can do. You know, you talked about the comedy thing. I remember I distinctly remember being a y a little kid, little kid watching the Ed Sullivan show and seeing the comics. I love the comics, but they were, you know, uh, you know, they were like Jackie Mason, New York Jews, they were Joan Rivers, uh Toadie Fields, they were Bill Cosby, right? There were there were they were, you know, Jewish black women. There were no white Catholic kids from Cleveland, you know, doing comedy. So I I distinctly remember as a young kid thinking, well, that's something I'd love to do, but I I can't do that because I'm not one of them. And I and I I really think that um this is where the Republicans, I think, really dropped the ball on this. Because they were not going to change the makeup of the court. You know, she was gonna get she was going to get the nomination. They were not gonna change the makeup of the court. They should have voted for it to show instead of all the all the partisanship. You know, you can't just bitch about partisanship if you're not willing to make an effort to try to bring somebody in. Um and so I think the Republicans dropped the ball on this because they could have shown her as a role model for young black women. And so I was fearful of doing comedy until I was in my 30s. I didn't start, I do didn't do comedy until I was I was over 30. It's the first time I did it. You know, and I quit the day job. I quit the you by the way, you tell your mom that you're quitting a day job of benefits to go tell jokes for a hundred dollars a week for some drunks and uh eat it in Oklahoma. Yeah, she doesn't care for that too much. Yeah. Uh it was a stress, strange relationship.

SPEAKER_04 32:50

Control your passion. Yeah, that's a good thing.

SPEAKER_01 32:52

But but I did, I finally overcame that fear. And and at a point, I'm not fearful now if I get in front of a crowd. Matter of fact, in many ways, it's easier for me to talk in front of 500 people than it is to talk in front of one or two people. Um so I'm not afraid of that.

SPEAKER_02 33:06

Yeah, I've seen you do it, and and that is true. You get up there and you start talking to them like they're your nephew.

SPEAKER_04 33:13

Yeah, you know, but yeah, a little higher than that. Well, it's it's it's interesting trying to come back to Truman Show a little bit, but uh what I heard here is passion overcomes fear. And that's what happened to Truman, that he was after the the girl that he saw that one time and he was looking for. And so the passion overcame the fear.

SPEAKER_01 33:32

And and and we we use fear like in politics, you know, we we use the fear as like, oh, you you know, if you vote for them, bad things are going to happen. And we have to overcome that fear and understand, okay, these people are different than me.

SPEAKER_04 33:43

We just said we're not, yeah. No, no, no, no, no. No, no, no, but I'm not talking about it. Fear is a great motivator. It is a great motivator, and that's why it is used in politics.

SPEAKER_01 33:51

But I know, and but that's what I'm saying here is that and you have to overcome that because once you get to meet somebody that is different than you, and I don't care what that difference is, I don't care if it's a liberal looking at a Republican, Republican looking at a Democrat, whatever, whatever that difference is. You know, once you get to know these people, understand there's a lot more in common, you overcome that fear of otherwise it's just that, oh, you're voting for them, oh, they're going to hurt you. And that's not necessarily the case. You know, we have to be more willing to overcome the fears, whatever these fears might be, uh, more willing to overcome them to find uh to find happiness. Quite honestly, uh, Truman, you know, when he overcame his fear, he found happiness, right?

SPEAKER_04 34:30

That's what we all know. We don't actually know, and I'm gonna conclude our discussion with that because it's I have a I found a funny article about that. We don't know actually. Um, okay. Now, Tom, we're gonna try and stay out of politics as much again.

SPEAKER_01 34:46

I'm not using it as a uh I'm using it as a more of a life thing. Let's let's even take it out of um just not not even politics. Let's say that it's um, you know, a uh uh uh you know gay people across the street or uh uh a um you know a a minority neighbor and it's like ooh, I don't know, they're they're different than me. I don't know that I like them, or they're a different religion or something like that. And we have people that put these these um artificial barriers between ourselves. They use fear as an artificial barrier between ourselves. And I I think that's I think that's a very dangerous thing. I don't I'm not I'm not even talking about this in the political aspect as much as just the human issue.

SPEAKER_04 35:22

Fear can be taught, they can be taught.

SPEAKER_02 35:24

Yes, like stay away from that guy because Well, so um I I actually so when it comes to we're born xenophobic. And I think it's actually important that we all understand that because when you're born, one of the easiest things.

SPEAKER_04 35:37

I actually have listeners that don't know what xenophobic is.

SPEAKER_02 35:40

Xenophobia is it's really the fear of other people, people that aren't like you. Okay. So um so if uh it when you're when we're born, we all kind of want to stay in our tribe, right? One of the easiest ways to identify that somebody is not like me is their skin color. So there's those memes that show like a young, a little white boy and a little black boy hugging, and it says something to the tune of fear is taught uh I'm sorry, uh racism is taught. You're not born with it. It's exactly the opposite. We are born with a xenophobia and we kind of have to cure it out of our system. I I bring that up just because I mean it's yeah, it's oh boy, we're born not just white people, I don't know, all of us. And now that's psychology.

SPEAKER_04 36:25

We're about to get into critical race theory, and all I just do is. Oh, critical race theory. That's I don't want to go there. I don't want to go there. I brought that up. I disagree, listeners, but I'm gonna let him talk. Go ahead.

SPEAKER_02 36:34

No, no, no, that's it. I I just I think it's important that people understand um that we actually do have an inherent fear and of other people.

SPEAKER_04 36:43

Well, I mean, I think it's a very analymal, I mean, you know, uh uh look at the animal kingdom. Are they uh are our are are mice scared of birds? I mean, or whatever. I mean it so uh uh I suppose there's a natural animal instinct there somewhere that I can kind of identify as well.

SPEAKER_02 37:01

Well, especially tribal animals.

SPEAKER_04 37:04

Yeah, I mean I'm yeah I mean if a tiger came crashing through this window right now, I'd be a I'd be a bit concerned. There'd be a problem. Uh and but I'm uh thank God that I was born with that kind of uh fear. Like that tiger's not like me. So Well, let me ask you this, okay?

SPEAKER_01 37:19

Is fear a good thing or a bad thing? Because fear can hold you back from accomplishing things, but it can also keep you safe.

SPEAKER_04 37:25

True. Absolutely true. Um I think that that fear is um it's an outstanding question. I think it is. One of the best questions a guest has asked me on a podcast. Is fear a good or bad thing? I think it's good from what we just described because it can keep you safe. I mean, you should be fearful of touching a hot stove. You should you should be fearful of you know falling on the street and hitting. Or well, you my wife is fearful of me hitting is falling down the street and hitting my head. She's fearful about everything. But um uh but on the other hand, I think fear can be manufactured by politicos. By politicos and the media companies and the media and companies. Yeah. So fear can be used manufactured to be a crisis, it can be manufactured to manipulate, and that is not a good thing at all. Uh we all agree on that.

SPEAKER_01 38:34

But it's all but it's all okay, now but it's also how people respond to it. No, no, because everybody responds to it differently. So, so whereas somebody um I mean, since you you brought up the media, uh, you know, somebody might defend the media, you know. But I I also hate the term the media. Because this is the media.

SPEAKER_04 38:52

Well, hell, I'm the media. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was I was told that I compete with iHeartRadio. I'm like, holy shit, I do.

SPEAKER_01 38:59

Yeah, you know, and and so yeah, you're talking about, you know, you know, I mean, uh MSNBC and Fox are both the media, you know. So this is the media. Yeah, so I hate that term. I hate that term. But the thing of it is it's also the consumers of the media. Because you can put something out there and say, okay, um uh, you know, uh if you put something out there where um let's take it even taking out a political realm, a commercial that says, hey, you know, you don't want to smell bad, so buy this deodorant. Well, for one person, that's gonna be like, oh my God, yeah, I don't want to smell bad, I better buy the deodorant. And somebody else would say that and say, I don't care how I smell. So it's it's also how the people respond to it. So they they can try to use fear as a motivator, but not everybody's gonna react the same way.

SPEAKER_02 39:43

Yeah, for the other people that don't react to it, you would say something, hey, use this, it'll get you laid. Like that's a motivator for other people. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 39:50

If you don't use it, if you don't use this, you're not gonna get laid. Hey, yeah, right.

SPEAKER_03 39:55

Yeah, well, that's why you bought a nice car. Uh but yeah.

SPEAKER_04 40:02

Well, the media manipulates because people shop for the truth. So I like that phrase. The media manipulates because consumers shop for the truth. So I uh we had this discussion on the first podcast, but I think it's bears worth repeating. If I Google Tom Beck, if I Google climate change in Valentine, Nebraska, and then I call my friend who's sitting in Los Angeles and tell them to Google climate change, boy, different things pop up, don't they?

SPEAKER_01 40:32

Uh well, I would assume it depends on it.

SPEAKER_04 40:33

And Valentine is gonna say it's probably gonna say something effect of scam, hoax, bullshit. In Los Angeles, like we must get a hold of this or the earth will end. I mean, you know, I mean being extreme. Yeah. But you know, social media is manipulative, Google is manipulative, the media is manipulative. Why? Because we're all trying to find our little spiritual journey of our own truth. So they're manipulating their consumers or they're trying to find consumers that share that value.

SPEAKER_01 41:02

So it's not I I I I'm gonna disagree with you a little bit here.

SPEAKER_04 41:05

I hope you do. That's why you're on.

SPEAKER_01 41:07

In that I don't know that people are looking to find their own truth. I think they're looking to basically find something that agrees with what they already think is true. Right.

SPEAKER_04 41:16

It's just it's always funner to have some people surround you that agree with you on that particular point.

SPEAKER_01 41:22

If they were actually looking to find their truth, I respect that a lot more than people just looking to find stuff that already, you know, just reinforces what they already believe, what they already think to be true.

SPEAKER_02 41:32

I'm just gonna say that there's no such thing as any one particular person's own truth. I gotta throw that back out there, because I'm a firm believer that that is not true.

SPEAKER_00 41:42

Attention. Egghead alert.

SPEAKER_02 41:44

If you want to find your own truth, you can find it. The problem is it might not be the same as the way things are. Hey, Jeremy, I think your wife is ugly.

SPEAKER_04 41:51

Yeah, well, that's just flat out wrong. But I mean, that's my point.

unknown 41:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 41:56

That's my point. Well no. I mean, you can I mean that I mean, she's not ugly, listener. She's very attractive. I'm just wondering. Did you say that because your wife listens to this podcast? Is that what I'm using? No, no, no, and I'm not trying to be fit. But I mean, but but maybe I don't think she's so attractive as you do. So is which who's wrong? So I think my who's what's true? So well it's subjective.

SPEAKER_02 42:18

Well, no, I I don't think that truth is necessarily subjective. I do think people have opinions about truths. So my wife does look this way, and to you, she would be, honey, this isn't actually true. Um she would actually not look be an attractive.

SPEAKER_04 42:36

Well, we're just we're all get thrown out of here. So come running down. Um Gwen, I'm sorry, we're just having this for intellectual.

SPEAKER_01 42:44

I've never been very good. I think all women are hot. Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_02 42:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 42:50

He's Jennifer Anison, if you're listening. Jennifer Anniston.

SPEAKER_02 42:55

Yeah, so I I do think that truth has to be a word that's respected in for what it is. The truth is the something is more true the more accurately it reflects the way the material world is. That's what I would say the truth is.

SPEAKER_04 43:09

One more time, Mr. Eggett.

SPEAKER_02 43:11

The the truth, uh, something is more true the more accurately it reflects the way things actually are in the material world. Right? So you can have your own truth, but that's also known as an opinion. I don't know what you mean by the way. Well, there's dualism and there's materialism. There's dualism. Well, materialism. Cowboy talk for what's in your life. This is the egg-to-head part of the portion. Please translate. I don't know. Oh, materialism is. I just smile and nod.

SPEAKER_01 43:37

I just, oh, it's very interesting.

SPEAKER_02 43:39

And then just very wrapped up in his brain. Well, so dualism is well, it it's hard. Materialism is the way to do it.

SPEAKER_04 43:48

They got peasants listening. No, no, no.

SPEAKER_02 43:53

Wait a minute, piss off the audience. It's really just um like the the way that uh to be able to the way that things actually are in the material world. And I I I'm not prepared to get into a more a better definition of it, but it's how things actually are. You know, like it like there's no inter there's no other way to interpret something because it is this way. And there's no other way to interpret it unless you're wrong.

SPEAKER_04 44:20

Are you saying there's no shades of gray at any time?

SPEAKER_02 44:24

Uh no no no I mean I there's shades of gray. Okay. I think that's what we say.

SPEAKER_01 44:29

I would say almost everything is shades of gray. Right.

SPEAKER_04 44:31

Yeah everything what I'm hearing you're saying is that there's no shades. That's not what you're saying.

SPEAKER_02 44:35

No mine is mine is more that the square is a square is a square. No mine's more that the truth has to be a word that's maybe used less often as like for instance everyone has their own truth. Because there is a truth and then the the next layer above that is people's opinions about the truth or about the way things are. Okay. You know it's it I can live with that. Yeah it's somewhat nuanced but if we don't if if we can't all agree that that things are a certain way and that the activities of man and science and politics everything is to best understand the way things are, then we don't have the tools we won't have a foundation from which to make things better. So I just don't I have this this respect for the word truth in that it really is the only way we can I think make things better in in understanding it.

SPEAKER_04 45:31

You know I'm I'm not if you ever ask her I want you when you get home I want your your ask Gwen honey am I too good to be true?

SPEAKER_02 45:40

She would say Joke number two.

SPEAKER_01 45:43

She'd say yes she'd say yes she'd have to well well she does yeah now if I if I asked her the question is Jeremy too good to be true I'd probably get a different answer.

SPEAKER_04 45:56

So there are voices what is the truth? I call bullshit on your premise. I'm sorry. I mean I tried to give you a chance there I just don't see it that way.

SPEAKER_02 46:08

Well but but here's the thing though I think I think that the problem is that we did say there's shades of gray and that's an example of shade plenty of shades of gray and opinion is a huge spectrum a huge spectrum but whether or not something is true I I'm right about this things are more true the more accurately they reflect reality the way the more accurate they reflect the way things are.

SPEAKER_04 46:29

Well yeah I mean if you're talking about things like water is wet or you know or a mathematical equation or something along those lines but yeah I mean or the you know the gravity gravity is true but we can you can also uh overcome gravity uh you know so uh so I mean so so there's always you know uh yeah you can overcome gravity yeah but with anything that's more than nine point eight meters per second squared the opposite direction dude your your physic your physics I just saw an Instagram video of a jetpack a military F jetpack is wicked cool it is you see that yes I have so it defied your nine point eight you shoved that right up your ass yeah nine point eight meters so gravity is so the number the number was a value that defied that number it was at least 9.81 meters per second who gives a shit so so you talk about reality so uh one of the things at the Truman show again back to the Truman show um hyper reality it's the assimilation of the world that is seemingly real but does not exist do we live in a hyper reality environment today wait can you read through that again hyper reality simulation of the world that is seemingly real but does not exist that sounds like a conversation I would have in college uh one second yeah yeah I mean really yeah what yeah maybe maybe we are all just living on a on a giant's thumbnail you know I mean what the thing are yeah I mean who knows I mean um oh there is a there is a yeah that's there there's a very uh there's a very fun answer to that question well hyper reality have you ever seen the movie Wag the Dog?

SPEAKER_01 48:18

Yes okay oh you haven't I don't think so oh tell him about it well I thought we'd think we're for politics oh yeah exactly it's about it's basically about a manipulated crisis yeah uh a campaign yeah to uh it's like De Niro's in it and uh right who's in that um oh John Travolta yeah John Travolta's in it yeah yeah it's it came out based on Clinton isn't it well it there was a there were pair there were um similarities perhaps I don't know if it was based on it but it was I mean inspired by Bill Clinton and his minions of yeah that's one to write down right the dog oh yeah I think you'd love it oh yeah it it is it is but um and I forget where we were going with this conversation hyper reality and manufactured crises and um you know but again it's like it is again it's like climate change is it is it gonna kill the world is that is that a truth I mean but but again okay it all again it depends on who is absorbing this information right now border are this this that's a liberal issue what about a conservative issue like uh Mexicans uh you know our borders is it really is that really a crisis right both of those are great examples well okay is are they manufactured by the media are they manufactured by politicians are they really crises what's the truth depends on I mean if you're uh if you're a farmer who needs ranch help uh maybe the truth is that it is a crisis if they can't get the help that they need they might be able to get if they were allowed to come across the border in the other in the first place. Um most ranchers don't want them but most ranchers don't want them well they do they they they do need the help and then especially nowadays yeah yeah you know I mean the you know um well there's ranchers on the border that are fearful fearful of their lives so yeah but but I I just came down from the border I mean I was well not really on the border I was in Las Cruces I was in Las Cruces yeah it's very close to the border very close to the border and I spent I spent uh uh two weeks in February in New Mexico I used to live in New Mexico and and the reality is is that yeah you know I never felt fearful of my of my time down there I never felt like oh I had a you know um I had to go and uh hide because they're illegal immigrants I'm talking about uh something I read or heard the other day I mean it's a guy that lives 10 miles from the border and they they have illegals are coming across all the time and they're they'll they'll break into their house or whatever and so they you know it's a different perspective. Hey what are we doing for that person it probably it may be a crisis okay right that person may be a crisis but for you know everybody else is it is it a crisis I I don't know you know I mean um uh I don't I'm not I'm not proposing open borders by any stretch of the imagination no but I I but I think but again I I guess my point my question is are these manufactured crises?

SPEAKER_02 51:04

I the answer is almost certainly yes I mean or especially like with the border patrol thing or both of them um there's an answer there is an answer as to whether or not climate change is existential there is an answer as to whether or not our current border policy is a is going to kill people and the what happens in our politics today is that um you know we we our politics today is designed to make sure that we can separate ourselves into the right and to the left and and so whatever we do or on this on this podcast you're a cowboy you're an egghead right or cowboys and eggheads um but it is we need both we need both we need both and we need both Republicans and Democrats too um but there is an answer this this this bifurcated um politics that we're operating in right now bifurcated I don't know what that means I'm sorry to separate do you know what that means Tom uh yeah basically two yes I understand what bias so just throw on a long word yeah forcated for cool for just that'll be disappointed anyway um so yeah um I mean uh it our political system is driven by the arguments between the parties they have to distinguish themselves from each other and so that they peel away from the center or from reality in order to build that fake universe that you're talking about is what our political system is designed to do and it's why it's not working. I would argue our political system is not working because of that point.

SPEAKER_04 52:46

Well I think it's working great because of the swings that happen I mean we swing to the left we swing to the right you guys kind of want to you don't want this pendulum but I think it it's working it's it's working I I I think our our system of government is working the founders of this country were unbelievable the checks and balances and so forth if it's respected if it's respected and I'm not sure that it's being respected by uh everybody I don't think politics has ever been respected well I that might be I think our system I think our system's been respected they used to cane each other in the United States Senate that's a fact but but but our system I think has been respected.

SPEAKER_01 53:24

You know maybe not the politicians themselves but the system and I'm not even sure the system is being respected the way it should be now and then and that and that bothers me. You know the way that the way that we have demonized our courts our elections the way that we have demonized you know yeah I mean the institutions and Dwight Eisenhower well I'll tell you what happened um our primary system our current or our modern primary system destroyed it.

SPEAKER_02 53:47

Like our founding fathers would not have endorsed this primary system. We have a protectionist system in each of the 50 almost all of the 50 states that makes it so that Republicans and Democrats are really the only two parties that can have any power at all. And then they then you they run so far to the right or the left during their primaries that they they alienate anybody that's even halfway smart or not crazy, not radicalized and then we're left in a general election of making a choice between two the you know the better of two evils. It's the problem.

SPEAKER_01 54:24

I mean our Constitution was a compromise and and we've lost we've lost the idea of compromise you know it's it's it's gotta be you know uh scorched earth uh win at all costs you know why I believe that is Rush Limbaugh uh well no well sure media certainly 24-7 news cycle in 1980 yeah C SPAN I mean you know CNN headline news every 30 minutes you can I mean we watched it religiously we sat there watching the news all damn day every 30 minutes you get a new report well you have to fill that time you have to fill that air and so I mean that's when it went down so I blame the media uh I don't certainly part of the whole mess yeah no okay no and I'm look I'm not saying that you're necessarily wrong but I'm also gonna blame the consumers of the media because if if there's not a if there's not a uh there's not an audience for that they wouldn't be doing it but much of the same thing you talk about the illegal the illegal immigration okay uh one of the reasons why they're coming here two reasons number one is because where they live right now is is so crappy but the other reason is because okay if they're bringing drugs across it's because the market for the drugs is here all right and or if if they're coming across it's because we need the employees. So it's also you know we talk about the prices at the border it's not just you know them it's also us.

SPEAKER_04 55:44

It's also us as Americans that are causing problems I'm a law and order guy so I I I don't care where the drugs are at if it's against the law I don't care if it's our problem they people need to go to jail. If it's their problem Wait then how do you explain the weed you're smoking I don't he's a he's an edible guy.

SPEAKER_01 56:01

He's an edible I have not ever I've I've never done marijuana I know it's hard to believe but I never have but but my but my point is this is that yeah I mean you want to blame the media and it's really easy to blame the media whatever the media is okay but the reality is that the consumers blame is not a word I I I I take that word back.

SPEAKER_04 56:18

But they contribute they have contributed to the whole mess. And because we the consumers of the media yes it's a it's a symbiotic relationship symbiotic we feed off of each other Jeremy Aspen. That's right people right now are googling while they're listening to podcast what the hell does that word mean yes all right uh one more topic question I want to go into and I I don't know it's just it's just something I thought of today so it's kind of random but the American Cancer Society, what is their mission? Their mission is to eliminate cancer, right? To eradicate it. I guess well what happens if cancer goes away? What are they gonna do?

SPEAKER_02 56:59

So have you ever thought about stuff like that? Yeah the same question can be asked about any of these um um political activist groups because like for instance uh uh gay rights like there there were originally very uh important conversations and very important endeavors to make it so that uh people that are homosexual inkling feel comfortable and whatnot but it really it it these organizations have a tendency to just swing too far they they kind of achieve their objectives to a large extent but then they have to still live they still have to live and breathe and then what? That's right they've got it's an organization I think that's part of the problem too I don't know how this relates to the Truman show but I mean uh uh I think that's part of the problem too yeah um that you know it's like saying will there be no republic I mean yeah I I I don't know I don't know it's impossible so you you know trust trust is a word so it's who can you trust Tom Becca who can you trust that's a question well that's Jennifer Aniston that's yeah really yeah she has good judgment she's staying away from me and trust that uh no I mean yeah uh who you know who do you trust that that's uh that's another one of those words it's like yeah Walter Cronkite has passed away and you know we don't trust him anymore he's gone what do we do uh I mean that's one of those things here's what I do I do not watch news I do not watch any cable news since I retired I watch very little news oh it's wonderful right I mean even your anxiety level just it's so much smoother and oh yeah like you brought up the every 30 minutes and and now we have a 24 hour news cycle it really keeps us primed with these like hormones and we're we're anxious all the fing time because we actually think the world is gonna end whereas if you don't watch it I wrote a column about this if you don't watch cable news for a week your heart HRV will go down you guys ever seen uh mountain men on the history channel or swamp people on the history channel no I don't even have a TV guys are eggheads you should you should but I mean do you do you think these guys freaking killing alligators in the Louisiana swamps give two shits about coronavirus or uh uh Ukraine or any of that stuff you know and there's something to it like it's one thing to be informed like I do pride myself in being informed I take it I take the information a little bit differently um but we'll all admit that when we get away and we don't have to actually pay attention to what's going on in the news and stuff bliss it it feels good.

SPEAKER_01 59:36

I have that's right I've gotten off um the Facebook on my uh on my phone uh I'm still on it but it's only on my my on my word computer and uh so I I'm on it maybe a little bit now and then you know that'd be a tremendous difference for me if I took that thing off my phone. Yeah and and I have found I have found that my attention has gone down substantially um and and uh and it is better. I do think that you know what you know again I'm going back to what truth is and all of that you know and who do you trust and all of this. I think the thing is that if I can maybe try to you know capsulize all of this we're all different in our own way. We all have our own truth we all have our own who do we trust but I think we all have to also understand that there are other people that just maybe don't think the same way that we are that doesn't make them a bad person.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:25

Well so I agree that was a thing people have told me that's a very cowboy thing actually.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:30

Yeah well unless unless unless you're a uh a Yankee telling jokes and you found Alabama.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:38

So I would just say Tom there So what's your who do we trust? Well there's no such thing as your own truth I'll just say that again because you just said there was you know and then uh the this is the answer to who you trust experts. And there is a place for that. Attention egghead alert there is a place for experts like for instance science who do you listen to the coronavirus who do you listen to? Who's best positioned to actually understand I sure as shit don't listen to Andy Fauci.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:11

I don't because well changed his fing tune 500 times I don't trust him period but that's the one of the best things about science is that it's when this piece of shit is testifying in front of Congress and he says you know can people in these these these riots over George Floyd get coronavirus the won't answer it. Tom I don't trust him.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:34

But I mean experts you are fing no experts are the only the whole purpose we can't go with our gut we can't go with our gut Tom go ahead okay so let me ask you something Tom's interrupting as a right okay so you're not gonna you're not gonna you're not gonna trust you're not gonna trust the experts okay so I didn't say that necessarily but go ahead you said I would say you in the rely I'm not gonna rely solely on experts how's that well that might be different but I think if you're gonna err either way you'd rather err on the side of noise versus no that's that's precisely whose podcast was started okay so okay so if so um uh if I tell you if I tell you that mole on your neck eh it's no big deal don't worry about it are you gonna believe me or are you gonna believe the uh uh the dermatologist that says no I think that's a cancer well I'm gonna I'm going to make the decision the dermatologist is not gonna make the decision yeah but you're gonna make the decision based on on on the on on the facts from the expert and not off of what I say.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:36

Well let's talk about corona this whole this whole we'll end this but this whole podcast was started because I had a friend in Australia who was on lockdowns and he's telling us I'm crazy that Americans are crazy we need to lock down for the next nine months and you know what they did in Australia I mean they literally you you could only go out oh yeah one hour a day you couldn't for God's sake and fly over border and and this is a very dear friend of mine he's a high school roommate of mine and he defriended me on Facebook and I just I was I was stunned I couldn't believe it and so he's he's he he would he would agree with everything you guys say everything and I thought I thought why in the world did that happen and I go why is he such an egghead? Why am I such a cowboy this whole podcast and we'll end with this this whole podcast was started on the premise that I would rather I grew up around cowboys okay I would rather trust the cowboy the guy that's out on I this guy right there my dad he's on that horse he's got a cool picture is on a tall hill in the sand hills he's got a 360 degree view of the world versus the scientist who's gonna tell this guy he's got to wear a mask and so nobody was telling a guy on a horse in the sand hills by himself to wear a mask you're not listening to me you're not listening to me I who am I gonna trust in the foxhole when the shit hits the fan and you yourself even said you're on record that you're gonna trust the cow if you're in a foxhole and you're taking the heat who in the hell are you gonna actually like who are going to who are you going to want to be with the egghead or the cowboy? The egghead clearly brings lots of value. I mean he can operate the radio and he can fix you if you get shot but who do you really want to like who's gonna who's gonna win this thing who's gonna who have whose perspective do I relate more to it's the cowboy end of story.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:30

Yeah uh boy how do you tell him he's wrong um how do you tell him he's wrong it's his own back on the way home all right we're gonna wrap this up and I I do it I I do a thing it's this this this uh this season is kind of fun so um it's a it's called rapid fire which this would be easy for you guys so it's here we go ready uh favorite ice cream Jeremy Aspen chocolate malt oh the rocky road all right favorite cowboy Lone Ranger Roy Rogers favorite egghead Tom Becca nice Tom Becca favorite quote uh mine oh boy best quote mine would be um that reason this is Michael Shermer I was interviewing him on the radio and he said uh re we use reason to lawyer on the behalf of our already existing beliefs excellent Tom Albert Einstein imagination is more important than knowledge indeed all right well Sam Fisher's favorite quote is the one that this comes from Sam Fisher Hope is not a strategy thank you gentlemen that's a good one thanks for having us