FRACTION| How a bank teller became a 25-year Reuters veteran and what she learned about asking for help

In this episode, corporate veteran and fractional executive Daniella De Grandee shares how she went from being the first in her family to graduate high school to spending 25 years at Reuters and building a career across tech and global business. We explore what fractional leadership actually means, why vulnerability and authenticity are the most underrated tools in any executive's arsenal, and how asking for help is the move that separates good leaders from transformative ones.

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Transcript

Speaker 0:00

Welcome to this episode of How Do You Divine, and on this conversation, we are gonna explore the word fraction with Daniella de Grande. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you for having

Speaker 2 0:14

me.

Speaker 0:14

My pleasure. You're my honor. Listen, when I say you're awesome, I just want you to know how awesome you are. Thank you. Truly. Thank you. And I think the word fraction really kept coming up in a lot of our conversations, because I think your expertise. Second to none. Thank you. Right. And I think your brain works very differently than many people. Yes. I've been told, and they, it worked. I take it as a positive, but I've been told Yes. It's, it's, it's your superpower. It is your superpower. So I would love for you to tell the audience a little bit about who is in yellow. Tell us all things. Obviously we're gonna talk about your amazing, um, tenure in corporate, but tell us who we are as outside of professional. Yeah.

Speaker 2 0:52

So, uh, Daniela de Grande, nice to meet you, everyone. Um, I've had a very long history through corporate, um, first person in my family to essentially graduate high school, go to college. Had to figure that all out. Um, you know, my parents were supportive, but with limitations. Yeah. And, and what they knew and, you know, factory workers, hospital workers, uh, just laborers if, if you will. So I was on my own to try to figure it all out. And I. Learned very quickly that in order to do that, I had to network and reach out to my community and, you know, people in the industries that I wanted to be in and make contacts. And so I made my way to college and through that endeavor, I had somebody reach out to me and say, Hey, you know, um, I, I got a job as a bank, at a bank as a teller because I needed a full-time job to pay for college. Yeah. Uh, so one of the managers there reached out and said, Hey, you know, would you be interested in a job at a systems integrator?

Speaker 4 1:56

Mm-hmm.

Speaker 2 1:57

And it's full-time, blah, blah, blah. Uh, so I said Sure. And so that started my career in tech. Um, I was very early on, very early on, I started out at the reception desk, quickly went to administrative assistant for the CTO, which led me to, you know, Lotus Notes administrator Cisco. It was CC mail administrator at the time. Um, and so I learned, I learned tech and, and I fell in love with it, and I fell in love with the people and just the camaraderie within tech at the time. Yes. Uh, and, and I, I worked very closely with the CTO and, and the other, um, C-level executives. It was a smallish firm at the time. Yeah. And I'd occasionally go substitute out for, you know, help desk people at customers or whatever it was. Yeah. And so I was at a customer site, um, helping the CTO with a. Presentation he had to do? Yeah. They had, uh, they were revamping their call center. Mm. And we were integral into the call center. Yeah. So he asked me, um, to help him with his PowerPoint, PowerPoint presentation and the whole, the whole bit. So I worked with him very closely for probably about a month to get this presentation done because it was a big meeting with the board. It was a whole change program. Revamp, right. Yeah. Those board meeting decks decks are very serious. It was, it was very big. And, um, he got food poisoning the morning before, the night before, and I got a frantic call at 6:45 AM while I was on my way to the office that said I can't do the meeting. I have food poisoning like in the hospital, food poisoning. Oh my gosh. And I said, no problem. I got you. Oh girl. And I turned around and I drove to the customer site. And when it was his turn to present, I and my 20-year-old self got up there with all of the confidence of the world and presented to this room full of people. And there's probably 30 people in there. Um, people from Deloitte and to at the time,

Speaker 3 4:14

yes.

Speaker 2 4:15

And the board members were there, senior managers. It was a lot. Yes. Um, and I gave the presentation as we had written it, as we had rehearsed it. And after the presentation, one of the partners from Deloitte came out to me and said, I'd like to offer you a job. And I said, I haven't even graduated college yet. Oh, come on girl. He said, oh my God. He said, when do you graduate? So this was like March. Mm-hmm. I said, I graduate in May actually. And he said, give me a call day after graduation. And I called him the day after graduation and I started a job at Deloitte and to at the time, and I worked there for a little bit. Um, and then I moved to Long Island and I was here alone, so I had to make friends. Yeah. So I got a job on the island, um, and I made some really great friends. Nice. And then from there I went to work for Reuters, and I was at Reuters for 25 years. Uh, I just left there in December. Mm-hmm. Um, and that gave me a wealth of global experience. Right. Nice. So Reuters is so global, a number one news agency. It's really a beautiful company to work for. And it gave me such experience with dealing with different types of people and cultures and Yes, really allowing me the space to connect, which is really what I'm all about. Um, I'm all about the connection. So, um, that's exactly how I've gotten to where I've gotten. Um, and so now. I'm on this quest to do things that speak to my soul, which is really about, you know, helping others and helping others through things that maybe I wish I would've had help with when I was having issues or, you know, trying to figure it out. And, um, I'm part of a really nice, large network of people who do that for each other. We do a lot of brainstorming and, and feedback sharing and, um, really in celebration of helping bring people along. Um, because each one of our successes as humans is really built on helping elevate others, right? Yes. And really,

Speaker 6:24

I always say that's the true form of service.

Speaker 2 6:26

Yes, yes. Is how you

Speaker 6:27

treat and, and care for others. That is, I feel like everyone's innate desire and should be to treat one another, not only like we wanna be treated, but how we would want to be treated in that season of our life.

Speaker 2 6:41

Yeah, absolutely. It's really. I'm working really hard to try to change the narrative and that feeling that's out there around, you know, you gotta step on everybody's head to get to the top kind of a thing. Right. Which is

Speaker 6:53

absolutely bizarre in, in its function. Right. Because if you actually do step on people's head and cut, you know what I mean? Yeah. Do shady deals. Yeah. I always say the same people, you pass on your way up, guess what? Yeah. You're passing them on your way down as well. That's that's right. I've seen seen it and, and it's a guaranteed descend. Yeah. If you win that way. Right. It's a guar it, you'll win for a time, but it will only be for a time. Right.

Speaker 2 7:19

Yes. It will all catch up with you and I've seen it. I've seen it happen time and time again. But you know, it's who I am as a human. I'm, I'm really all about helping people just be better and continue to grow and succeed in, in what they want to do. Um, those are the things that feed my soul and make me happy. Um, and when I work for a business, I am all about helping that business succeed and grow and, and watching, you know, all of their goals either get met or surpassed. Yeah. Um, and, and

Speaker 7:55

helping them identify what those goals should be. Yeah. Right. Absolutely. It's, and I think that that's like the starting point, right? But when I think of fractions, right, the portion of who we are, a fractional resource. Right. How, I wanna take you back a little bit like, how were you a fraction of, like you said, the, the first generation, um, student going to college. How were you able to leave a fraction of you at home? The fraction that showed up in the office every single day, that you work closely with the CTO that you can deliver that kind of speech, right? Yeah. So what, what elements of you, what fraction did you leave behind and what fraction lived and breathe powerfully in those, in those spaces?

Speaker 2 8:36

So I learned early on that the only way to succeed is to not be a control freak and to know where your weaknesses are and to get others bought in to help and, and be part of something. Yeah. Um, and, and that may be why I'm so passionate about this space. Yeah. You know, if you think about it, you know, in every part of your life, whether it be at home, with the kids, with work, there's always a need for extra help. Yes. And not trying to conquer the world and do it all yourself. Not saying that you can't, but you can do so much more if you bring in somebody that you trust and you open yourself up a little bit. Yes. You may learn new things. You will build a network of people where you're very collaborative. Yes. And then together jointly. Right. I

Speaker 9:37

mean, I just talked about this. There's so much happiness in collaboration. Yes. But there's also so much power in collaboration. Right. Like and how did you learn that level of collaboration? Like you said, your parents were labor workers. They did their very, very best. How did you see that? Their ability to say, well, I need help here. I can only take you. But so far, um, give us some insight in there. I

Speaker 2 9:58

don't know that there was an I need help here and I need help There it was. This needs to get done. Figure it out. Amen. Yeah, figure it out.

Speaker 10:08

Oh my gosh. My daughter jokes that. I love that saying to figure it out. 'cause I genuinely tell her all the time. Figure it out. You got two, you got, you got a brain. I, I believe you can figure it out. Figure

Speaker 2 10:16

it out. And, um, I, I ask a lot of questions and I've always asked a lot of questions just because I'm such a curious mind. So I used to get, um, go look it up in the encyclopedia a lot.

Speaker 3 10:29

Oh,

Speaker 2 10:30

so I spent a lot of time in the library. Me too. You know, this is too before Google, obviously. Me too. I know. And listen,

Speaker 10:36

me too. I spent a lot of time in the library. The library. Right on. I think it's still there on Utica and Tilden in Brooklyn. Like I lived in that library. But it also taught you a good way to seek out knowledge. Yes. Right. And, and what parts to keep and what parts not to keep. And why's it's important to kind of know enough to take you to the next step versus knowing the entirety of the solution.

Speaker 2 11:01

Yeah, and I mean, you know, I, I, I, I, I coach a lot of people and a lot of them are what I would deem to be control freaks. And it is only because the view is by the time I teach somebody else, I could have done it myself. And yes, that's true to a certain degree, but what that does is hamper your growth. So it's important to bring people in as partners, not to take away from you, but to help augment you

Speaker 3 11:31

and what

Speaker 2 11:32

you're doing.

Speaker 3 11:32

Yeah.

Speaker 2 11:33

Um, you know, whether you're a working mom and you have a person that comes and cleans your house or a cleaning crew, or you drop your laundry off at the laundromat and have a laundry service, or you're going to the dry cleaner because you're not ironing everything or you're a founder and you

Speaker 11:48

need an, you needed a, a, a fractional CMO or a cm. Exactly. Everyone needs someone who's an expert to help them bring that in. And I think you hit it right on the head that a lot of people are control freaks, right? Yeah. And I see that that deep level of control as a fracture in their own trust. Yes, yes. With themselves, there was some pain, something didn't go right somewhere along their journey. And instead of isolating that situation, learning from that situation. They just took on. I can be, I can fix this. This could never happen again. 'cause I am gonna be the one that touches it from the beginning to the end. But I always think that the, the big disconnect with control freaks is you need to own all of it. Oh, absolutely. You know what I mean? Absolutely. You own all of it. That means you own the weight, you own the wins, and you own the losses. Right.

Speaker 2 12:46

And a lot of, a lot of, um, people that struggle with control issues, some of it's rooted in insecurity, some of it's rooted, um, and pain and trust. A lot of it's rooted in fear. Mm-hmm. Right. Fear of failure. And a lot of, a lot of the time when I tell my clients is. We can't be afraid to fail, right? We have to fit. What we have to do is realize that maybe the vision or the decision that we made at the time was the right decision or felt like the right decision. But now that we're down this path a little bit, something's changed and it is no longer the right decision. So we need to to, to pivot. I'm gonna use the word pivot, right? Yeah. And every time I use that word, I think of friends. Yes. Um, but you know, we need to pivot. And sometimes that means fail fast. Yeah. Right. Whatever, whatever path we are on is not the right path for whatever reason. Tech changes so quickly. It could be a technical change, it could be a regulation change. A compliance change. It could change.

Speaker 13:50

Exactly. It could be so many changes in the ecosystem that has absolutely nothing to do with your business and you have no control with it. Exactly. And you like your competitors like everyone else around. You have to pivot and adapt and be so quick with it. But I like what you said in terms of. Being afraid to fail. Right. Right. And I personally feel that any leader who's afraid to fail is also afraid to, to, to learn. Yeah. Uh, there's, you can't. Yes. How I see it is you can't, regardless of how successful your business is, software technology in any industry, you have to be willing to learn and every single day, because your ecosystem changes actively all the time. Everything is not exactly how it was yesterday. Like we were talking about some of those, some of those systems, those, you know, all of those systems, they're gone. Are gone. Yeah. They're, they're gone. And, and you've adapted to all the new software that's out there and new ways to be more efficient and adapt and grow your business at a global scale. Right, right. But if, let's just say you sat back and you said, you know what? I don't wanna move off. And we're talking technology here, people, but if, let's just say from data ecosystems, I don't wanna move off-prem. I don't wanna go on cloud. I don't trust the cloud. Okay. You know, like we know that that's fear based. Right. Right. And to certain extent, there are things that could stay OnPrem. There's things that should go on the cloud. Right. But you also have to understand that you are limiting your own success based on your fear. And that's, to me, the part of the conversation that never surfaces in that room. Right.

Speaker 2 15:28

It's the fear. It is. It is the fear of the unknown. Yes. Um, and it may not necessarily be that they're afraid to learn, but it's uncomfortable. It's very uncomfortable for, you know, founders, uh, entrepreneurs, even big executives. You know what, you know, and that's where you, that's how you got to where you got.

Speaker 5 15:53

Yeah.

Speaker 2 15:53

Um, and. You need to continue to evolve along that path, which means that in order to do that, you have to get uncomfortable.

Speaker 3 16:03

Yeah.

Speaker 2 16:04

So that way you can continue to learn. And their fear, I think is, is just the unknown and the uncomfortable space.

Speaker 16:14

But don't you think, to me, I always feel like this is just I, because as a human being, I feel like what took you to level one is not gonna take you to level two. What took you to level two is not gonna take you to level three. So I think there are executives that have accomplished major things, brought their company from A to B. Right. But everyone has a goal of scalability and growth. Right? Right. Maintaining your market share. Right? Right. Like these are real goals. And if it worked yesterday and maybe the month before and the year before, at what point do you feel like it's okay to say, now I have to go in uncharted territory?

Speaker 2 16:52

Yeah. So that's, that's where it all starts to crumble, right? Um, you know, you look at the demographic of leaders and where they are and where they've come from, and you look at society mm-hmm. And you look at culture and you start to realize there's such a distinct, it. It's the people are so about what defines them mm-hmm. Of their past accomplishments that it really. Holds them back.

Speaker 17:40

It, it, they, from, it puts them in a pretty prison as I call it. Yes, it does. It, it puts it in a pretty prison. You're right. 'cause then you just stand there and you're in these meetings and you're at these networking events and you're talking about the accomplishments you made two years ago. Right. In an ecosystem that no longer exists.

Speaker 2 17:56

That's right. And so they identify with what those accomplishments were and they forget to reset the vision for themselves. Right. We're so, we're really good about setting the vision for our companies and our businesses and our KPIs and our goals for our people. We never really take the time to do that for ourselves. And anybody who's been through a performance appraisal process can, can be honest with themselves in the mirror. Yeah. And say, this is the part that I struggle with. I mean, I struggle with it. Right. Yeah. And I, and I am a person who is his. Always looking to learn and grow because it feeds me.

Speaker 3 18:40

Yeah.

Speaker 2 18:40

Uh, so when I know I struggle with, okay, what are my goals? What do I wanna achieve? How am I gonna do that? Sometimes you get a little bit of fear that, you know, crops up and it's like, well, can I achieve that? Can I do that? And, and that's where fraction comes in, right? So, how do I do that? It's not about can or can't, 'cause it can be done. It can be done. It just doesn't mean, but do you think

Speaker 19:05

it's, it's the, the, the real hill is, do you want it to be done?

Speaker 2 19:08

Right? That's the hill. And if you want it to be done, how do you get it done? Right then? Then going back to my parents of go figure it out.

Speaker 3 19:16

Yeah.

Speaker 2 19:17

Figuring it out often meant, you know, three phone calls to this person, two phone calls to that person, this person dropping that off, that person dropping that off, and then pulling it all together. Um, you know, sometimes you can't make a bake without bake a cake without sugar. So sometimes if you're outta sugar, you knock on a neighbor's door, right? Yep. Can I borrow some of your sugar? Yes. Or do you get in the car and drive all the way to, you know, you're gonna drive to the supermarket? Are you gonna go to Walmart? So is that, is that, and at 45 minute escapade of your time, now your cake is dead.

Speaker 19:49

You actually just hit a really good nerve because do you think it's the fear of the amount of effort to pursue a solution?

Speaker 2 20:00

Sometimes it's the fear of rejection. So if I go over and I knock on my neighbor's door and they say no, or if, or is it, sometimes it's the fear of, okay, my neighbor will lend me sugar, but then I have to pay them bad, then I owe them one. I don't wanna somebody one, but, so

Speaker 20:17

what that, but, but see, to me that's, that's the, that's to me the fractions of a real leader in an executive. That's exactly right. Because you can't, you can't. Be afraid of owing someone or being a rejection to me, like a no is a no, is a delayed. Yes. It's that a no is just onto the next. Like it shouldn't phase you. I know for me it doesn't phase me. Right. It shouldn't phase you. And then ultimately, if you are more fearful of what happens when you say, I need help, that means you're comfortable in your pri pretty prison, right?

Speaker 2 20:48

Yeah, yeah. Oh, absolutely. If, if it's all about self-serve, I'll self-serve, I'll self-serve, okay, you'll get the cake baked, but now it costs you more money because everything you know that you put through do, do you have to redo the batter? Do you not have to redo the batter? There is so much dollars wasted, whatever it is. So is it wasted work? Is it wasted effort? It's wasted time when you could have just knocked on the neighbors next door and guess what, if the neighbor next door didn't have it, there's another 2, 3, 4, 5 doors down, down the way. Right? So, so it also has to do with grit. Yeah. The grit to accomplish and figure it out. Um, and want to do that and want, but this,

Speaker 21:30

this leads me to so many questions because then who holds the executive accountable to wanting to figure it out? Because sometimes, like you said, like I think often that grit is very personality driven, right? It's if you're, if you're genuinely not a go-getter personality, which everyone doesn't need to be to be like a good executive or a founder, an entrepreneur, you don't have to be, let's just say you're the visionary, but you're not the one that has the grit to power through funding and power through the pitches and the change in the ecosystem and the market is change. Like you might not be that person, right? And in order for you to go pursue who that person can be to help you succeed, you're afraid of rejection of the, I don't wanna owe anybody, right? So then now you've now put yourself in a box based on your own personality and your own desires, who holds them? Accountable that this is an organization you're building, this is a movement you're building. Well, you can't, it can't just be about your thoughts and your

Speaker 2 22:31

That's right. That's right. Absolutely. So I really believe executives bring vision. Yes. But they also bring the team. Right. And it's important to build that relationship with your team. So the, how do we get this done is how do we get this done? Mm-hmm. Not directive. I'm the executive, I want this done and this is how I want it done.

Speaker 3 22:59

Yeah.

Speaker 2 23:00

Unless you are bound by some compliance rules, some legal,

Speaker 3 23:04

yeah.

Speaker 2 23:05

Ethical something hard. Really there's no gray matter in it. Yeah. Everything should be collaborative because then collaboration is where we succeed. Absolutely. Absolutely. That team of people that you have, have thought of things and been exposed to experiences and things that you may not have and likely have not. Yeah. Right. And when you engage your team in the thought process of how do we do this? This is what I want to accomplish. Yes. And then the team rallies together, how are

Speaker 23:40

we going to accomplish it and how do we execute? Right. Absolutely. And I think that's, I, I think you, you, you articulated that immaculately because I think, like you said, executives, we are supposed to sit at the table and have a discussion. I think we should move. Right. I think I should move left. Maybe we should go down the middle and then have like a strategic discussion about the how. Right. And every, and keeping so many people in that discussion is so valuable because some per one person can point out, Hey, actually we're going the long way that's gonna cost us more resources than we're winning. The next person would be like, actually, I have a resource that can help us move from A to B. We don't need to go the long ride. But I just, but going back to what you're saying about the fracture in the individuals, right, right. That limits them from being more collaborative, I think is something that is not often discussed.

Speaker 2 24:33

Right? It it, it is not. Um, because leaders don't want to show weakness. Right. Uh, I work with a lot of C-suite customers. A lot of my customers are C-Suite and ICI come in and help them on projects or pieces of work. Bodies of work. And I help support. Their weakness. Right? So they have a weakness. They call, call me in, and I help them with a fraction, a piece of their work. Yeah. And that helps to support them. It helps to support their team. Sometimes it's helping them, coaching them through having a hard conversation with their staff, or they're finding that their staff isn't motivated or accountable. And so I'll work with them on that. Identifying where you need the help and not being afraid to bring in somebody to help you with that. Um, so it's more, I have some coaching that I do with, with different people, but on a, on a fractional level, when I'm working with the C-level executives and the startups and the founders, what I'm doing is I am understanding what they want. Yeah. I am questioning them. Yes. I am brainstorming with them. I am helping to evolve. Their thought process, their, you know, the, the thought process around what it is that they wanna achieve, identify whatever pitfalls may be Yeah. Out there. Uh, so that way we can be as proactive against those as possible. Some people identify pitfalls and say, oh, this will never happen. So they just close the book and, and don't keep writing.

Speaker 26:14

Must be nice, right? To just be delusional. Um, it, it's,

Speaker 2 26:17

it's, but everything, you know, you, I always say, yeah, you know, you walk into a room, you always have to have an escape plan. And I don't know if that's my operational nature, just, just as a human, as a human being, know where all the exits are. I have done that since I was a child, so it may have been some crazy trauma from when I sat in a classroom and had to jump under a desk for Fear Bomb would hit us. Um, or it just may be. Who I am. Yeah. But you know, I don't walk into a restaurant without knowing where the exits are. I don't, and I'm very discreet about it. I mean, it's just, yes. Listen, my husband does it too. It's just, it just every

Speaker 26:56

exit everyone who looks suspicious. Yes. And listen, we've been in there less than two minutes. Okay. Right, exactly. I think it's a good muscle to have. And I think you use that muscle pretty well in the boardroom as well. Yes. Yeah. Right. And, but I love how you have such a approachable, comforting, but accountable way Yes. Of getting things done. Yes. You, you have an art, it's, it's kind of like weaving in, I don't crochet because, you know, I, I, I could never, but it's very crochet. Like there is such, there's such delicacy, but precision in the way in which you operate. Yeah.

Speaker 2 27:33

I, I think that, and, and I appreciate that. Thank you very much. Thank you for that comment. I think that, that, the reason that that comes across is because I authentically am very genuinely. Want nothing out of the engagement for myself other than to see you happy and succeeding, because that's what fuels me.

Speaker 3 27:54

Yes. A

Speaker 2 27:54

lot of people go into things, well, what's in it for me? Yeah. Right. Um, from a tangible perspective, you know, yes, there jobs and we make money and we get paid, all of that stuff. Mm-hmm. But, but truly all of that aside, I really authentically am so driven by other people's successes. I just wanna see people smile and be happy and, and be accomplished.

Speaker 28:20

Yes. And hit their, and hit their goals. Right? Yes. Because I think often, like executives, founders, entrepreneurs, there are, there are, I call it the base level goals, right? The goals that I know everyone knows I need to make and I wanna hit. Then there are the dreams.

Speaker 4 28:34

Yeah.

Speaker 28:35

That you whisper to yourself in your head Yeah. To unicorns. Yes. The, the things that you're just like, oh, only God knows. Right. Only God knows that magical thing. But the way in which you operate with some of your clients, I think is, is majestic in that way because you remove the complexity of their goals.

Speaker 2 28:56

Absolutely. So anybody that's worked with me, uh, will tell you that I start every conversation with, let's build your unicorn. Yes. Tell me what your unicorn is. Yes. I need to know what you're thinking. If you can have the most magical system, if you could have the most magical tool, if you could have the most magical numbers. Yeah. What are they? And then, and then back into that, how do we get there? Yeah. And having that, you know, and the unicorn may change over time. Exactly. And maybe spotted now and maybe striped later. Uh, but it really, you have to have a vision and, and a goal. But you also have to have the ability to be comfortable with that vision and goal adjusting as necessary.

Speaker 29:43

Hmm. I'm adjusting based on this your ecosystem. I keep using the word ecosystem because I think every industry has changed, right? It's like, in my mind it's like the sun. It is slowly moving. Some of them are moving faster than others, but each and every industry, from tech to marketing, to finance, to all of the link, everything. Everything is changing. And it's not, I think before long gone are the days when it moved to like the sun. Right? Right. More slowly and no one felt it. I think now the trajectory a little bit more swift, right? Like everyone's getting whiplash

Speaker 2 30:14

every now and then. I mean, look at ai, right? Yes. We're all nervous about ai. So yesterday I was having a conversation with my children around the table and my son, uh, is a freshman and he wants to be a psychiatrist. Um. My daughter's gonna be a freshman in, in high school next year, and my other son is a current freshman. So the three of us are sitting, or the four of us are sitting around the table and we're having conversations about what do we wanna be when we grow up? Yes. Where do we wanna go? And I've shifted the narrative, right? And, and to teenagers that I coach and I talk to. Yes. I sh I've shifted the narrative from what do you wanna be when you grow up, to what do you want your lifestyle to look like? Ah, and then what are you passionate about? Because that's how you back into that, right? Mm-hmm. Um, it, the world in that so is changing. You can't say today, right? So I said last night at the table, I don't know, maybe one of you should be a mortician because I don't know, is ai. And my son and my daughter said, AI's gonna take over that too. And I said, how? And they very quickly laid out. Robots. Robots can prep a body, robots can do analysis, robots can do, so you're gonna, and I said, okay, so what happens when the bot goes sideways? Mm-hmm. You know, power blip, I don't know. Um, and my son said, well, you know, there'll be a, there'll be a clause in the contract.

Speaker 31:37

Not so, but I always, I think AI crazy is amazing and I think we, we fair, right? 'cause human beings, we are fair driven. Like we have to move away from the fair based conversation around ai. Yeah. AI is e evolving as we are evolving as people. Right. AI is only as good as it's operator. Right. Full stop. Right. Like AI essentially. I, I was talking to my 16-year-old about this 'cause she is a wiz, a scholar in her own right. I tell her every day you have more credentials than adults than I know. But I always have to flatten things for them and simplify. The AI is like a small ball that you get. Out of the, you know, carnival, right? It's a small ball. The ball is only as useful based on who's operating the ball. The ball can only bounce. If you prompt the ball, you teach the ball, then the ball gets bigger. As you evolve the ball, the ball becomes more valuable as you bring the leval ball around in your ecosystem and you show the ball how it could be an assistant, right? AI can never lead past a human being. It can gather information, it will do research. It can be more efficient in task and things like that. But AI can't, critically can't be a critical thinker, right? Like AI cannot evaluate what a solution can provide to one brand and not the other based on cultural sensitivities, right? Right. AI cannot negotiate the probability of a deal for you. People will always want to do business with people. Humans would need to trust other humans. AI is just your wonderful assistant that sits next to you. It can never supersede you. Right?

Speaker 2 33:22

And I think that y you know, it's just, it's the industrial revolution of today, right? Mm-hmm. So back, you know, when factories were kicking up and did the jobs were going away from factory workers because these new machines were invented and new farm machines and things like that. It's, it's the industrial revolution of today. And it, a little bit of it is a little scary and, and unnerving and you know, there's some things that will normalize, right? Yeah. Um. As we've

Speaker 33:51

normalized ATM machines, right? Yes. We have exactly the same way. The same way how I, again, we, we talked about how we both lived in a library. Like now I go to the library as a museum. Exactly. Like, you know, in a way I bring my kids every once a month just to like be there to read together. But it's more of an activity versus what it was to me in my younger years where it was my escape. That's where I sat and lived in books. And to me it was like, oh, I can only get these books here. And it was so wonderful. Now it has just evolved to a different thing, right? And I think, yes, be fearful, but be mindful that you can't sit there. Right? And it goes back to what I was saying about executives. You cannot be so comfortable in any state that you forget that you're supposed to be evolving.

Speaker 2 34:37

Right? And that's, and that's really it, right? I mean, I think that people hit a wall where they stop continuing to evolve past. Where they got from a knowledge perspective. And then it becomes so, you know, I've acquired all of this knowledge and I've gotten to this level and I'm here now. I'm just gonna lead these people behind me. But you can't lead the group underneath you, right? You can't lead across the organization. You can't lead underneath you, you, you can't lead effectively if you are not yourself continuing to grow. Yes. You may be able, able, able to take information that's fed to you and manage upward, yes, deliver the message. You may be a master engager and a uhhuh, you know, communicating communicator. You can break through all

Speaker 35:33

of the red tapes that you probably put in. Place yourself exactly yourself. So you can run the politics and you can

Speaker 2 35:38

communicate and that's great. Yes. But you don't, you're just regurgitating so you don't really understand. Mm-hmm. So how do you represent, how do you defend? How do you engage that conversation further? If you put something in front of a board for approval and it does, it is not going the right way. If you're not thoroughly engaged in the how, what, when, why, wheres of what it is you're presenting and you're just regurgitating information that your team's compiled for you, you really may not be successful in getting that approved because there's not all of the other avenues that you can explore and ex identify and explain, et cetera. I think a lot of the, just going back to my, what happened, how did I get into this, this corporate world kind of thing, the reason that I was successful at 20 years old in delivering that massive presentation into, in that room of very high level executives, that was because I was so. Close to the information. I was a true partner in creating that deck. It wasn't just me inputting data entry into a PowerPoint to make. Yeah, you didn't do the fancy

Speaker 36:55

Canva.

Speaker 2 36:56

You were an intricate Yeah. Canva. I wish we had Canva back then. Good lord. And we had that little, it was just the, the click art. The click art, click art, if you were lucky. Um, and then you had to buy the upgrade. So if you wanted something else, but yeah. So I, your

Speaker 37:12

intellectual property built that deck alongside with that executive. Yes. And it's about

Speaker 2 37:17

partnering, right? Yes. And so we were partners in getting that done. He was leading in saying, these are points we need to touch on.

Speaker 3 37:27

Yeah.

Speaker 2 37:27

And then I'd say to him, what about this? What about that? Mm-hmm. And he'd say, well, I didn't see that. Right. A lot of FARs through the trees stuff too. Yes, yes. So. It, it's collaboration at all levels is, is super huge. You know, just back to your word fraction.

Speaker 5 37:43

Yeah.

Speaker 2 37:44

Not being afraid to ask for help, because a fraction of you helping someone else or a fraction of someone else help you can be so rewarding. Yeah. And can be. So it could be the, the, the one thing that defines true success, that ability to give and receive Yes. Of assistance where needed. Yes. To help better or deliver on something. Right. Um, and fulfill those entrepreneurs that I'm working with, that are open and honest and say, I need help in this space. Yeah. They're entrepreneurs. They don't have a lot of money to spend, but they, they know that they need help. So we, we time box it,

Speaker 4 38:30

create a

Speaker 2 38:30

project. 90 days, this is gonna happen. Yes. It's happening in 90 days and they're happy and it love it. You know, it, it's, it's kind of like putting roller skates on them. Yes. It's your skates, right? Yes. And you can, you can propel yourself forward quickly. Yes. By doing that, by asking for the help. Right. And there's not wasted time, wasted effort. Throw away work. You know? And I

Speaker 38:56

also think the beauty of a fractional resource, right. And just the fractionally of who we are as individuals is that, that piece, that honesty pieces. Let's just say I once was the founder, I was the CMO and I love doing the creative, but there's a fraction of me now that don't wanna do that anymore. Yeah, absolutely. And I, I, I actually want to move closer into being more of the chief technology officer, and I'm more interested in the software of things or the operational management of everything. And I think not only being. True to yourself to understand that there has been a fracture in you. Having a partner and collaborating with someone helps you be honest about what would your day, what would your ideal day be like? Right. Right. If, if all of the employees, the millions of dollars on the line was put to the side, what would your ideal day be like and how can I help that ideal day meet your current state to a place of, I always say the utopia of it all. Yeah. But I, I always, I, I hate using that word because I think regardless of if you've net hundreds of billions of dollars and you, you're an entrepreneur or you're an executive at an IPO, like a publicly driven company, every executive, every leader should always be sitting in their success, but have their eye on where they need to grow.

Speaker 3 40:22

Oh yeah,

Speaker 40:23

absolutely.

Speaker 2 40:24

And I, fractional is really, and you hit it on the head, was. It's a partner. It's a personal partner. Yeah. It doesn't have to be a, you know, somebody taking over your job or somebody making you look like you can't do your job. Yeah. CTOs are perfect example. Yeah. A lot of CTOs are in the spots they're in because they came up as sy, you know, they started coding and programming and systems engineers, systems architects, and now they're CTOs. Those people are fabulous. Technically, what they're not fabulous at, AT usually is socially, right? Yes. They don't, they are not comfortable. They do not want to go engage with people. They don't want play the politics, but they have to in those roles. So if you're a CTO in that space where you're growing into this

Speaker 5 41:11

Yes,

Speaker 2 41:11

and I have a few of them, yes. I help them with, okay, how do we do this? How do you get comfortable in this zone where you're uncomfortable? Yes, I will help you prepare that pitch deck. I will coach you through it, and then you go off and do it. Yes. I am your personal assistant in that, in, in fixing these

Speaker 41:31

things. Yes. These areas. Right. And it's that are hindering your business. Right. And I think that's part of, again, going back to like that functionality of everything. Yeah. It's being honest that as a leader, as an entrepreneur, as a founder, the areas in where you're weak is the areas in where we, I'm gonna use the word we need to address in order to get to the next level. Oh yeah,

Speaker 2 41:54

absolutely. And, and being open and honest with ourselves as individuals about our weaknesses is important. And it shouldn't be something that we shy away from or keep hidden. It should be something that says, Hey, I'm really not great at this. I am not a great photographer. Anybody out there, any of my friends out there will tell you, do not let her take the selfie. Do not let her take the picture.

Speaker 42:20

Oh, that's me in directions. It is bad. Everyone knows this about me. I will get us lost on one street. Okay? I am horrible with directions. Horrible. At this point in stage of my life, I've given up. I know that's not, it's never gonna be my thing. I've gotten lost in almost every country I visited, and that's why my phone always have to be charged. I can relate. I had like,

Speaker 2 42:41

I can relate. I laugh because I can relate.

Speaker 42:43

Listen, I'm not good to re direction, but it, I think it also goes back to what you said earlier about as a leader, you have to be presented Yes, as strong and unbothered. And I know what I know and I am like top of the class, but I think that only gets you but so far,

Speaker 2 43:01

right? I, I mean if, if, and if you have that. That is the persona that you need to own when you're s in the boardroom presenting, when you're dealing in the senior management level meetings, that is the persona that you need to have. And absolutely 1000% confidence when you're dealing with your team on the day to day, when you're dealing with customers and vendors and just people, you don't wanna see that. Yeah. They don't wanna see that because they themselves know that they're not perfect.

Speaker 4 43:30

Mm-hmm.

Speaker 2 43:31

And so when you, when you engage with people that feel like they need to know everything about everything, um, and they're not honest and vulnerable and about what it is that they don't know or they don't bring their team in. Yep. Right. I'm a, uh, I like to call myself a servant leader. Um, I'm a realist leader. I meet everybody where they're at. Um, and, and I coach them from where they're at. Every, everyone on the team and. I'm here to support your successes. Right. Your successes make my successes.

Speaker 5 44:08

Yeah.

Speaker 2 44:09

And in order to do that, I have to be very open and honest about what I'm good at, what I'm not good at. I'm thinking about this and this is the vision I have. Help me put meat on the bones. Yeah. Right? Yep. And, and that works really well because it becomes a collaborative joint effort. Yes. Not everything sits in my head. And if you work on my team and you've done something, guess what? If I'm going to the meeting and I can bring you along, you're gonna come and present that work. Yes. And we're gonna applaud you and we're gonna celebrate you Nice. For the work that you've done. Because you're the expert in that little fraction of the pie

Speaker 44:48

yet. But I think it's, I think you said it perfectly, and also helping them understand that, like you said, when you're in that boardroom, you need to be confident, you need to present yourself. Right. And I always say there's this thin line between delusion and reality. Yeah. You know what I mean? There's, there's a set always, there's a thin line. Because I also feel like it's that, it's that honesty piece of it, right? That yes, I'm doing great, my company is doing great, or I'm still building. Right. We have our audience goes across the gambit. And who are you having, you, who is holding, holding you accountable? Right.

Speaker 2 45:25

Um, I would say that to both

Speaker 45:27

parts, the

Speaker 2 45:27

delusion and

Speaker 45:28

the

Speaker 2 45:28

reality. I would say that you're, you're always still building when you, when you feel like you're ready to stop building, close your doors, cash out, sell your business. You. If you are a business owner, if you are a corporation, if you have lost the will to live, so to say yes, uh, then then sell it. Sell it, cash out. Go do something else. Go retire. Whatever it is you need to be continuing to grow for yourself, for your team, for your business. That is a bomb drop. I just

Speaker 46:01

want you to know

Speaker 2 46:02

it.

Speaker 46:02

Just ruptured in here.

Speaker 2 46:04

Yeah. You have to, if you stop, if you stop swimming, like Dory and Nemo, right? Let's keep swimming. Just keep swimming. Yes. If you stop swimming, you're done. You're done. So, so pass the baton. Right? And I would say that to leaders. Yes. If you're in roles where you've stopped caring or stopped pushing or stopped challenging, ask the questions. Challenge, challenge directives because. Directives come from other people. They're just people. They may not have the full picture.

Speaker 4 46:42

Mm-hmm. And often

Speaker 2 46:44

they don't. And often they do not. And if you cannot have a conversation, an open conversation and say, I understand you want me to do these things, but if we did these three other things and instead of these two, this would happen. That is a conversation that would be welcomed. Right. And so as a leader, you really have to have this relationship with your team where they don't feel scared of you. Yeah. Right. Um, that power of authority thing.

Speaker 47:13

Yes. As and, but I also think like, fear begins fear, right? Yeah. Yeah. When people are fearful, they try to fear monger, like, yeah, yeah. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But then I, I always say like, motions separate, right? The emotions of it all apart, they're still a growing entity. That you are responsible for, that you have, your vision has established and grown. So at some point as a human being, you have to say, I need help, or I'm not doing what I need to do. Usually

Speaker 2 47:50

what happens is you, you wait too long. Mm. Right. You wait too long. Yeah. I've seen startups that have waited too long to bring in the help. Um, and no too, and, you know, and the funding is gone or, or they're going to ask for funding and they're not getting it, uh, because they're not as far along as they should be or whatever the case is. But asking for help as soon as possible, right. You don't have to do everything yourself to be the successful leader that leads. The tribe, right? Yes. That leads to success. You don't have to do it all yourself. Um, just pick on different types of people in your, within your network with, you know, reach out to. I have a whole business that is dedicated to fractional executives and fractional support. Yes. Just this little bits. It's, it's a different way of thinking.

Speaker 5 48:55

Yes.

Speaker 2 48:56

From I'm gonna go get a contractor. We're not contractors.

Speaker 5 48:59

Yeah.

Speaker 2 48:59

We're not contractors, we're not consultants. Yeah. Right. We are fractional support people who, fractional executives will come in and they, they, they are at your level. Yep. Right? So you can't just,

Speaker 49:12

you can't just say, I need you to do X, Y, and Z. They're asking their, why are you doing X, Y, and Z? It is

Speaker 2 49:18

like a little, another little part of your brain. Mm-hmm. Like the people that I work with. Why are you doing that? How, how are you doing that? What, what reason and how, what is the reason? Where, was it important? Important? How are you

Speaker 49:30

measuring that? Yes,

Speaker 2 49:31

yes. How do you measure success? Yes. How are you measuring that? What does it cost to optimize? Mm-hmm. And to operationalize and, you know, um, so many clients, what are your operational costs? Uh, no idea. No idea. They just, you know, order things, buy things. This on a subscription, who knows what that means on a Right. Exactly. Thiss on a knows what that number subscription. And

Speaker 49:54

like, there are contracts, like, and we talking about larger organizations, that there are just contracts that's been in place for as long as, you know, forever. And every time the renewal come up, it's like, let's just make sure we get a percentage down, a percentage over it. But you don't realize you're in contract with a solution that is dated. Oh,

Speaker 2 50:11

absolutely.

Speaker 50:11

That is actually holding you back from your goal that you had two years

Speaker 2 50:15

ago. Right? Or are you looking to engage with a company to get a service from them who is on the market, be sold. Right. So there is a lot of thinking that needs to go in that people normally just don't think about.

Speaker 3 50:29

Yeah.

Speaker 2 50:30

Um, so as, so that's what we do. We help you, we help you think completely. Yeah. Right. And not everybody can do that alone in a vacuum. Yeah. There's always something that gets missed. Right. We're always leaving home, forgetting something behind. Yes.

Speaker 50:46

And also having that subjective eye on things. Right. That subjective opinion, objective opinion, I should say, of where you are now and where you wanna go. Right. Because sometimes it's not realistic. Sometimes, like you said, you've waited too late and now what you think would've been a 90 day engagement would've been a one. You know, a six month engagement needs to be a year to even take you to

Speaker 2 51:09

halfway to go one, and all of the wasted money. Right. Oh, oh, I don't have money to pay for that and I don't have it in my budget. All of the money that you spent going down the wrong path, that's now just. Wasted gone. It's the money is gone. What? You know, and then your people have gone, you know, your employees have gone through change, you know, new software. I see this with software programs all of the time. Oh, we bought this software program. Oh, it's best in class. It's best in class. That's great. Best in class is great for a certain business. If you're a smaller business, best in class, you don't eat best in class, best in class for you is not what's best in class for Microsoft or for a large

Speaker 51:51

corporation. Yes. I always use the Ferrari and the bicycle analogy. Yes. Not every company needs a Ferrari. Yes. Yes, you can do. You can go very far on a bicycle. That's right. And from a bicycle, guess what? That Honda can take you where you need to go. And really and truthfully does the Ferrari still. Serve the needs when you become a multimillion dollar cus um, company. And we could evolve to the Ferrari. Yes. Right. And sometimes

Speaker 2 52:18

the Ferrari is not even a Ferrari. Exactly, exactly. It's a Ferrari with the Honda engine. Um, but yeah, it's, it, it there. I see a lot of that. And those are the pitfalls. Yeah. Not thinking that you first, first it's the personal piece. Getting good with being willing to ask for the help and knowing that you need help and trusting because when you, like, when you work with me, you have to be very trusting. 'cause I'm a little hard. I ask some hard questions and make people very uncomfortable. But I do that because that's how we grow.

Speaker 3 52:54

Yeah.

Speaker 2 52:55

Right. That's why I am here. I am here to help you grow and flourish like a beautiful flower. Yes. And in order to do that, I have to. Sometimes repo you and sometimes I have to put a different soil in or add a little additive, whatever it is, and you will bloom beautifully. But sometimes all of that's a little uncomfortable.

Speaker 53:18

Yeah. And also understanding that while it's uncomfortable for you as an individual, I don't know why I'm always, I've, because maybe 'cause I've always been like that, that I can separate Ikas desires to the needs of the business. I can separate Ika from the roles I acquire. Like I can separate those two things. 'cause to me those are two big entities. You know, they, they don't, they're not one in the same. And I love the way you go about it because you remind them that while you are the leader, while you are the executive, while you are the one with this responsibility, you aside, there is a responsibility to this organization that you've built. Yes, there is a responsibility to this business. So if you don't feel like you want to build, like you said, hand off the baton, right? Yeah. There's, are you willing to see it die because of your personal, emotional state? Yeah.

Speaker 2 54:15

And the beauty is that when you do that, you give your team an opportunity for career development. Mm-hmm. You do. You give your team an opportunity for them to build their skillset Yes. For them to shine, for them to be feel good about the work they're doing. And a lot of people say, then they get their skill sets and they'll leave and go find another job. That's why I don't do it. But that's what you want. You want them to feel like. They could do that if they wanted to, but they're not going to, but they're not go because you make them feel so empowered.

Speaker 54:50

But that's, but that's the, to me, the personality part of it, right? Yes. Because if you're more fear driven, of course you're not going to give personal development. You're not gonna give people opportunities to grow because you are afraid, oh my God, you're gonna take my spot. Are you coming from my spot? Is that my spot you're coming for? And then you're gonna leave my company. And then if you leave my company it, and it's just like you are now as a leader, you've spiraled in the individual and forgot the needs of the business because. The total opposite could happen. You can invest and lean into these individuals and give them personal development and show them a path that, listen, as a leader, I feel like I made this wrong decision, but I'm going this route. I'm working with this person, and this is the trajectory I see for our organization. Absolutely. And this is how I'm gonna get there. And that could empower the entire workforce. Yeah. To then multiply the workforce with people who are dedicated Yes. To now your vision. And not even the salary. Right. Not even the role. They're in it. They're so,

Speaker 2 55:47

they're

Speaker 55:47

in it. They're in it.

Speaker 2 55:48

I'm in it with you, buddy. Yes. Let's go. Let's get this done. Yes. And they feel empowered and they feel accountable and they feel fulfilled. Yeah. Which is the biggest part, right? Yeah. Um, it's so important. It's so important. That's the number one thing that I talk about with leaders when I'm doing coaching. Is their relationship with their subordinates and, and across and across their peers. Mm-hmm. And their peers, subordinates. Right? So when you look at the org chart, how do you look across and how do you look down, um, on that org chart? What are those relationships like and what do you do to build those and build that camaraderie and that sense of teamwork? And we're all in it. And

Speaker 56:34

I love this. I love this conversation. 'cause it also speaks to the importance of functionality in our overall. Capitalistic society, right? Right. We're talking to the entrepreneur who is building a small business, and we're also speaking to the larger corporations that are, that, you know, are public or about to go IPO or have millions dollars in funding the systems and the way in which to operate are very much the same. I, right. You know how I am about simplicity, right? Yeah. We, they add all these level of complexities and layers of leadership, which is fine, and if you feel that you need it to be an efficient business, but know that the methodologies are all the same, right? The rules are all the same. You know what I mean? That the, the path to success is going to be different, but the core elements of always being a learner.

Speaker 4 57:24

Yeah,

Speaker 57:24

no, absolutely, absolutely. Always being willing to build like these things are. Are so critical to the overall success in life. Yeah. Much less your business.

Speaker 2 57:35

Yeah. And, and it is also in life, right? Yeah. Show me, show me your home and how does that look different from your corporate life? I, you know, um, but yeah, it, it is, it is all of those things and talking to, um, you know, hedge funds and how do, how do they fund and, you know, wanting the adult in the room, right? Yes. So we do a little bit of that too, right? Where a hedge fund says, I'm going to fund startup X, Y, Z, or I'm gonna invest here. Uh, and then they send in a representative. So, you know, if you're a hedge fund, you can send in a fractional representative

Speaker 5 58:15

Yes.

Speaker 2 58:16

To work with you and, you know, to, to,

Speaker 58:21

to be, be the person in the room, to be the eyes, to be there. Yes. To be the

Speaker 2 58:24

eyes, yes. For you. Mm-hmm. On your investment. Um, sometimes startups and entrepreneurs and the people that are getting the money, uh, are a little nervous and hesitant, which is natural and normal, except that when you're working in authenticity, that um, when you're working in authenticity, that really shifts quickly.

Speaker 3 58:51

Yes, it

Speaker 2 58:52

is a natural reaction. So I would say that, you know, really working in authenticity is huge. Yes. Just bringing your authentic self, real raw, you know, um, I've had people have very nice conversations with me and I've had people have full en rages, and I'll meet you where you're at. Yeah. It's okay. I have pretty thick skin. Um, sometimes I hide, but it, it really, it really is about. Being truly honest with yourself and who it is that you look at in the mirror every day. Yeah. About where you bring strength to the table and where you bring weakness, and then finding a counterpart and a trusted partner that it's not gonna berate you Yeah. For where your weaknesses are. But they're gonna say, I got your back. I got your back. Your back. And I,

Speaker 59:45

I got your back. And I also know where you need to go. Yeah. I got your back. Let's do this. And I know where you need to go. Yeah. Yeah. And it's just, it's that level of trust. Right. And I think sometimes as individuals, you don't have that trust in yourself. Yeah. Right. You don't trust your own intuition and where you need to be. But what's most important is that you have to trust the market in which you sit in.

Speaker 2 1:00:05

Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 1:00:06

Right. I think everyone needs a gut check. Yeah. 'cause as a visionary, as a creative, right, sometimes you can get in your own rabbit hole, right. Of. No, everything's going great. We're just having a moment and everything is going great. And then everyone comes to the table with their own perspectives of where that business is right now and what we should do tomorrow. And how do I just get it from point A to point B, right? Just speaking to the entire gat, how do I move from ideation to actual a tangible thing. Step one is move. That's it.

Speaker 2 1:00:38

One foot in front of the other. And you have put your feet on the ground to move. Yes, you

Speaker 1:00:42

have to move. And I think as we wrap this discussion, I think thinking about the need for fractional, fractional support and what it means to be a fractional human being, step one is moving. Yeah. Moving, right? Yeah. You have to be able to move. And some like, you know, not all movement is progress, but you have to start making moves in order to move towards progress, right? And sometimes that is getting support of someone who's going to hold you accountable. To not just be, oh yeah. The business has been in this state for X amount of days. No, no, no, no, no. Right. Give yourself timelines. I'm gonna try to fix it up until this time, and don't be generous because remember, you're the person who put yourself in this.

Speaker 2 1:01:29

That's exactly right. Sometimes you shouldn't be the one giving yourself the timelines. Exactly. This is conversation that should, that would be conversation number one. What's realistic? Yes. How do we do it? You know, you can't give yourself a realistic timeline if you don't even know how to get out of it. Right? Yeah. Um, so depending on what the situation is, but it is about holding yourself accountable. Yeah. And, and, you know, making sure that you do some reach outs and things like that. And you're right, it's about movement, right? You're, you're lost in the forest and you can't see your way out. You can see right in front of you. Right? So just take each step where you can see that there is land to step on, uh, and keep moving until you find your way out. Or your way to safety, you'll find your way somewhere.

Speaker 5 1:02:14

Yes.

Speaker 2 1:02:14

But if you stay in one place and just, you know, run really fast in that one place, you're not gonna move forward. So it is, it is about moving forward and, and trusting the process and building relationships and showing up very authentically.

Speaker 5 1:02:30

Yes.

Speaker 2 1:02:31

Not being afraid to ask for help, not feeling like it is, um, a bad

Speaker 1:02:38

look.

Speaker 2 1:02:38

Yeah.

Speaker 1:02:39

Right. And don't worry about what it looks like. No. Don't worry about it. What it looks like. No, absolutely not. Because success, I feel like you can, you can touch success being comfortable, but you can never sustain success and comfort.

Speaker 2 1:02:53

No, no, no. The most successful people will tell you stories exactly about how uncomfortable they were, how many times they've been bankrupt, how many wrong moves they made. So

Speaker 1:03:02

that, but I, I think it's important to like articulate that, right? So people hear it and you know that if success in whatever way they define it. It can be touched in their comfort, right? No, it will never be

Speaker 2 1:03:14

sustained there. Right. There's no shame in asking for help. Yeah. There's no shame in asking for help. Yeah. I can't say that enough. Whether it be mental help work, help, home help. There's no shame in saying, Hey friend, I could use a hand or have this dilemma. Can I just bounce a few ideas off of you?

Speaker 3 1:03:35

Yeah.

Speaker 2 1:03:36

Um, there's no shame in that. And I think that we put a lot of shame into, you know, into ourselves and most confident people. Um, it's fantastic to have confidence and it's a skill, but really what we want is to be comfortable with not having shame and asking for help where we need it, and whatever it is.

Speaker 1:04:00

Getting out there, right? Yeah. Get out there, have the conversations, enter the space, get in the rooms, be in the conferences, and really find other experts in the space. Whatever you think you may need, get the same way we would look for a restaurant. Get online, start looking and get in the room. Get in the room and have the conversation. Absolutely. Thank you so much for this amazing con discussion. Thank you. Seriously, I love how we have literally touched the entire corporate gambit. We talked about entrepreneurship from ideation to getting it to the market, to publicly shared companies, and I love this discussion because it just shows that through all iterations of organizations, you need to be an authentic human being. Yeah. In order for you to sit at an executive seat, C-suite of a multi-billion dollar company and for you to even create your own entity, you have to know who you are and be willing to say, mm. There's parts of it that needs some assistance. It is absolutely. Where is the fractional expertise in the room? Absolutely. You know what I mean? Absolutely. So thank you so much for joining us on this episode. Thank you. Thank you for having me. Thank you. And this is how do you divine fraction.